Created for This with Danielle Roberts

Today's guest is Avery Forrest. Avery lives near the Gulf Coast of Alabama. She and her husband planted a church 11 years ago and they have to wild boys. Avery has been an entrepreneur for 10 years and ran a successful wedding photography business. At the end of 2019 Avery felt God leading her to something new so she trusted and followed. Avery has a business where she equips female Christian entrepreneurs for their mission in the marketplace. Clarity to Courage offers in-person retreats and conference to equip these women. The first conference is October 25-27th, 2021.

She shares her wisdom with us about seeking clarity from God as you look for direction.

- Pray intentionally with specific targets - knowing the questions you're asking God.

• One of those questions can be "what's the next step."
• There are more prayer prompts in Avery's Praying for Your Business linked below.

- Listen to what God's telling you.

- One of the things Avery did was to list out what you're good at and sought wisdom weeding out what things were right for the current season.

- She said, "sometimes you have to step out and try it. Clarity comes as you step out and try something."

- "God cannot steer you when you're sitting still. You have to move" - shared in a Lisa Brevere book.

- "There's no compartmentalizing our lives - our spiritual life, business life, and our home life, it's all mixed together." They all have to be addressed together.

- Pray for your business prompts can be found here.

- Clarity doesn't mean you get the whole picture.

- Clarity comes from time and communication with God.

- There are people who need what you have.

- Clarity comes from knowing God's promises for you.

- Psalm 139

- You have to be okay to pivot and shift to the next right spot.

- Do the things God asks out of obedience.

- God wants us to trust him with the things he's telling us to do.

- Where haven't you trusted him or done what he's asked you to do? It's possible this is keeping you from clarity or the next step forward.

The Clarity to Courage Conference is October 25-27, 2021 in Alabama. You can find out more about this great conference on Avery's website. To get $50 off the price of the conference use the code EARLYBIRD.

Avery's heart and vision for her ministry is on her website. You can also join in the Facebook group "Christian Women Entrepreneurs: Growth Through Community" using the link.

Activities I'm doing in my own business to make it function better:

- Updating my Niche and the words that describe my business.

- Looking at my goals and asking:

• Are they still working?
• What's been accomplished?
• Do I still want to do _____________?
• Examining business finances with my accountability partner.
• Analyzing systems to find out what's lacking and adding or improving what needs to be changed.

- Looking at what in my business is working or not working.

- How to find time to do this:

• Think about it while you're doing other things.
• Add it to your calendar then stick to it. My favorite planner is my Faith and Focus Planner.
• Make a date with your friends or accountability partners.

Inspiration comes for this comes from Abbey Cappa's She's Here for It podcast episode #66 5 Keys to a Side Hustle Reset

I'm jumping in and telling you my money story. A few weeks ago I posted an episode with Melissa Whaley and her money story. We talked about how she's worked hard to share her money thoughts and attitude. Today I'm going to share my story as we're in the middle of the open cart for my new class series Renew Your Money Mindset.

There's been so much that's gone into this class series. I've loved talking and learning about money mindset in the last 3 or 4 years. My first abundance challenge was in 2018.

It's so cool to see God bring up the same topics repeatedly. In 2016, I wrote in my devotional, Created for This, and day 5 is called Money Matters. In this devotional, I read through the devotional and share the Bible passage Romans 12:13 which says, "Contribute to the needs of the saints and seek to show hospitality."

Additionally, Matthew 6:20-24 says, "but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also. "The eye is the lamp of the body. So, if your eye is healthy, your whole body will be full of light, but if your eye is bad, your whole body will be full of darkness. If then the light in you is darkness, how great is the darkness! "No one can serve two masters, for either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and money."

In this episode, you'll here:

My own relationship with money has taken a lot of work to rewrite my thoughts on money. For me, it has been studying God's word and principles about money. Anxiety and fear over money and what would happen are still things I think about, but not to the same degree.

My childhood money story has impacted my current money thoughts.

My husband and I started our marriage with very little money and we have struggled a lot over the last 10 years.

I share about how I've used money emotionally, resulting in debt and bad spending habits.

How my viewpoint on money has changed as a result of my own need to turn around my spending habits - seeing myself as a steward of the money we've been given.

Combating scarcity mindset with Bible verses. Specifically Philippians 4:19, "And my God will supply every need of yours according to his riches in glory in Christ Jesus."

Affirmations have been so helpful when facing struggles with money. Meditating on the scripture verses has helped those biblical truths to take root in my heart.

In order to get our money back under order, it's been hard. It's included arguments and frustrations in our marriage because of difficult money conversations. It's still a very emotional part of our lives for me.

My own personal struggle to cut down on my spending.

Following The Budget Mom and using her Budget by Paycheck method to help with overspending and saving money.

Creating a mindset that focuses on generosity.

The focus has been on stewardship which is something I'll be talking more about in the Renew Your Money Mindset classes.

My whole outlook on money has changed. But it's been a heart change.

I don't think it's wrong to desire more money when our focus is to bless others through generosity of sharing what God's given.

I'm inviting you to step in and discover what God has for you, so you can have joy and freedom in an area God desperately wants to capture your heart. Renew Your Money Mindset is for you if you're wanting to learn money mindset from a Christian, biblically-based program.

The live round closes on June 18. If you have questions, email [email protected].

Money book I recommend:

(Amazon affiliate links which means I earn a commission from your purchases at no cost to you.)

Your New Money Mindset

Money Possessions and Eternity

Neither Riches Nor Poverty

How Should I Think About Money?

To join the email waitlist for Renew Your Money Mindset when it launches on June 14, click here.

podcastrecording

Danielle: [00:00:00] Hey guys. I am here with one of my BFFs, Melissa Whaley. We are going to chat about a recent life experience and change that she has gone through. But first, if you don't know her, you need to know her. So Melissa, can you tell us more about you? And then we will dive into life. Yes, ma'am well, hi, I'm Melissa.

Melissa: [00:00:30] Once upon a time, I would introduce myself as a tax advisor, but that's not who I am anymore, but I am a wife to RJ and a mom of five, and soon to be six kids. And I live in Southern California where it's hot and dry, not by the beach and starting over a whole new, exciting journey of business stuff that we're going to talk about today.

Danielle: [00:01:00] Yay. So let's dive right in. You said he used to Introduce yourself as a tax advisor, you were my tax advisor and I love you for it. You've saved me lots and lots of money. You still have videos that people can go watch and learn all about business stuff and taxes. So tell us what happened, how, what, what's the change?

Melissa: [00:01:26] So I have my tax business for, I want to say six or seven years. I was in the tax industry for about a decade and change. And that whole, the fact that I had that job was like, Totally God slash accident because I didn't go to college to become an accountant that was not on my trajectory at all. But right after my oldest daughter was born, I desperately needed a job and H and R block was hiring.

So that's how I got into taxes. I mean, I'd always helped my parents with bookkeeping in their business, so it wasn't foreign to me. But I fell into that business, ended up starting my own business when I wanted to have more kids and work from home. And so I ran my company from home for about six years and it was awesome.

We moved three times during that, and that is the beauty of online and virtual business is that you can take it with you wherever you go. So it was a big blessing during that season of life. But. In, well, really, it started in 2019. So most people didn't know. Cause obviously when you're going to shut down your business, you have to kind of keep it quiet for a while.

But I actually began and the process and thought pattern of shutting down my business in 2019 I had just had number five kid and was like, This is insane. And part of this was like, I think a funny God joke. Okay. Because I had had four kids and I was like, okay, I'm content. We're good. Like, we're done.

I can handle four kids and homeschool and run my business, which was a total lie in my head. But in my head I was convinced I could do all these things. And then I joked. Oh, if I get pregnant with number five, I'm going to have to shut down the business because there's no way I could do this. And then I got pregnant with number five.

So it was a lot of discussion with my Bible study girls, a lot of prayer, but I was like, okay, God, like, I'm not going to rescind on this. If I said I would quit after five, then I better do this. So I did my last tax season in 2020. It was the most insane year of doing taxes in the 10 plus years, I had done taxes and I started doing taxes in 2000, well, 2009 tax year, 2010 spring.

And so that was with all the brand new Obama tax changes and things. So I was used to new presidents and tax changes, but. All of the COVID tax changes were insane. Absolutely insane. Like worse than when any president got into office tax changes so that I was losing my mind in many arenas and decided to shut it down at the end of tax season, except they extended tax season all the way to July of last year.

So it didn't actually shut down my business until July of 2020. And now here I am trying to reinvent myself a little bit with other businesses because I'm still an entrepreneur. I can't just like, not have something going on. That's it's in my blood. It's in my brain.

Danielle: [00:04:56] Yeah, isn't it funny how it you're just like, I gotta do something and I'm like, I'm sitting over here. I'm like, okay. So I went to this really awesome nail salon in, in Denver. I like big, still look beautiful a week later we can have later. And I was like, yeah. And I wonder if she wants to like, franchise. And I would like own a salon here in Wisconsin business, coach brain. This is how our brains work. I know.

And I was like, Hmm. So I haven't reached out to her yet because I'm like, realistically, Danielle, you can't handle running a salon. You hate driving up there anyway, like the town that I would put it in is, you know, it's 15 minutes, which 15 minutes to like Texans is like, That's next door. So then California, that's like normal.

Like we can't get anywhere in less than 15 minutes. I'm kind of spoiled, but so anyways, but yeah. So there was more that went into shutting down your business than just, just having a baby. Like, tell me more about the backstory of that and kind of how you've seen God change your heart or over the last year.

Melissa: [00:06:13] So one of the big things that I think was I had a huge shift in my theology over probably the last. Three four years. And so part of that, I mean like really cliff notes version here, I grew up in a Pentecostal denomination. So I grew up in a denomination where women could be pastors, women were pastors and my goal, and I went to college to study ministry to be a pastor.

So I was like, Yay, feminist Christian. But over time and like leaving that denomination for a lot of different reasons and not all of them, like negative, just it not being the right fit anymore. Listening to a more varied. Like amount of theology and influence, because I think my understanding was very narrow.

And so I expanded my horizons and learned from all kinds of different places. And I wouldn't place myself in any denomination or a specific place anymore. But I've been positively influenced by both ends of the spectrum of like the hyper Pentecostal and the super reformed. And I'm thankful for all ends of flavors of Christianity, but it definitely, I had a shift in my theology where I realized like that's probably not the most biblical model, true biblical model of like yay women in that sense.

But I was also being fed that same feminism. Stuff in the business world, especially in this like bossy mommy, like you can do anything. You can be a CEO of a six-figure business and be a stay at home mom and not sacrifice anything. And your kids will be happy and your husband will be happy and you'll be happy and you'll still have all this money.

And it was just like, I was totally buying that lie. I was buying that lie that I could somehow. Like be a faithful wife and like actually serve my husband well and take care of my kids and steward my home and run this business and have all this money and I would be completely satisfied. And that would be like the thing that made me happy.

And it was not, I was burning out hard core, so just like all are really bad. Business advice in lies that is totally a worldly advice, totally worldly wisdom. And it was just kind of slowly crushing my soul, trying to do all the things because I realized that I personally was not built to do all those things in the way that I was doing them.

Danielle: [00:09:09] So explain to us more about what you believe the Bible has for us as women. I mean, I, we still agree that women can teach women. Like that's the thing. We still agree that women can run businesses. That's the thing. So explain to us more, just do more clarification about what you, what you mean.

Melissa: [00:09:33] I did not like turn into some like Prairie wife dress and go start up like homestead and hide and the world would take granny chic is a deal like, right. It's true. I do still want a homestead, but that's for completely different reasons. And I did grow up with animals and stuff, but no, I I'm not like. Anti women doing their thing.

I am not like go be little miss submissive housewife at home, which that's a whole nother episode discussing the word submission and the negative side of submissive. We're not going there. We think submission is a positive thing the right way. Yes. So it's actually a mid list of things to talk about.

So, hi. Okay. Coming soon. Nice. See preview, but yeah, so I think really what it was is that I was one idolizing my business and idolizing the business world. And this idea that that more money was going to make me happy. I mean, my husband and I got married literally a week after graduating college. So straight out of college.

Got pregnant. Four months later, ended up living in my parents' house for a year with a newborn, not the most ideal situation. So we were broke as broke can get. And so like, and we were broke for a really good chunk of our marriage. I mean, even up until a couple years ago, we just never had enough income.

So. My brain was like, you have to find ways to supplement the income. And I had worked regular jobs outside of the house, and that was okay for that season. And like, it worked for us, but I thought like this business is my ticket. Like, this is a way to, you know, I can save our family and fix our finances and all of these things.

And. The reality was, is that I wasn't being a good steward of our home. I wasn't like being a good wife to my husband. I was ignoring him a lot to run the business, do business stuff. I wasn't even being good with our money, which was the whole point. It was so dumb that you guys, I mean, I literally wouldn't make all this money. And then I am totally like, if you listen to Dave Ramsey at all, I am the spender of our marriage. Like I spend, I love spending, gifts are my love language. So I just, I have, I've been, I've definitely, the alert has been growing me in self-control over the last decade, but I would, you know, get money from the business and then be like, okay, well, we can use like this much for.

The our family, and I'm just going to blow the rest on Starbucks and this pretty microphone and all this stuff, because it was like, oh, I need these business things to grow my business. And I just got so caught up in so much of the FOMO fear of missing out in the business world and thought like I had to do things I have to buy these courses.

I have to spend all this money. And so I wasn't even contributing to our family's finances in the way that I should have been. And I was ignoring my husband and I got to the point because of the type of business I had. And this was another like big shift is that I had a very service-based business. So even though it was virtual, I didn't have to show up in person with people 90% of the time.

I still had to lock myself away in this office and tell my kids don't bother me. Don't bother me because I had all these meetings. And then like, I personally have an add type burning and I cannot focus very well if there's any distractions. So obviously doing taxes and bookkeeping, it's a very like focused, required job, which I can hyper-focus.

That's a benefit of how my brain works. But that was usually between the hours of 9:00 PM and 2:00 AM. And that worked really great. When I had one, two, three kids. Once I hit four, my brain started to be like, you can't do this anymore. And then I hit five kids and I'm like, what's up? My name part of is just sleep. You don't sleep a lot, but yeah. So. I was just, I, the whole, my whole like point when I started my business was, Hey, I want to stay home with my kids. I want to be more available. I want to have flexibility. I want to, you know, not have to put my kids in daycare if I don't want to, you know, like having the choice.

Right. Cause it's not about that. It's a good or a bad choice to put your kids in daycare or childcare or school, public school or private school or whatever. It's just, I want it to have the choice for myself. Rather than feeling forced into one decision. So yeah, just all that stuff that just like blurted out a ton of stuff, but I wasn't, I wasn't taking care of my family.

I was not basically like when I, when I actually was looking at scripture about marriage and about motherhood, I realized that. Our first calling is to our spouses and our kids. And if we're not serving them well first then whatever, it doesn't matter how much we're succeeding in other areas, whether it's a business or volunteering or ministry. Cause I. Done that too, where I over commit myself in ministry and burnt out there, like all the places. If you're not serving your family first, then you're out of alignment with what God has called you to ultimately.

Danielle: [00:15:27] Yes. And from somebody that's done that as well. It's it's not good. So no condemnation for anybody who's in that place right now. That's not what we want you to take from this. We want you to take the reprioritization and I think that's something that I talk about a lot is like the family, the stewarding, the home. And then business, whenever you see my priorities, it's always going to be family and then home and then business.

So what led you to reprioritize and how was that something that you are working on now worked on? Did? It feel like it's constantly something we have to realign.

Melissa: [00:16:11] Oh, yeah, for sure. Definitely still working on no means perfection or even close to it yet. I think what's interesting is what really sparked a lot of, it was some like really deep struggles that my husband and I were having in our marriage. So even though like having a lot more kids was a big contributing factor. Just like the big struggles we were having in our marriage, realizing that our marriage was not. We were not operating biblical our marriage at all.

We were treating each other like crap and both of us realized, like we need something we need to change. And we started listening to a lot of biblical marriage podcasts. We did a course, I think it was through deal and Veronica Partridge. I don't know if they still have it up. I think it's called ultimate marriage, but We did. We went through that course because it just like, again, it's not like an elaborate thing, but it just breaks down like, Hey, have you actually looked at the scriptures? And what they say about what a wife is supposed to, how the wife is supposed to treat her husband, how a husband is supposed to treat his wife.

So this isn't, this wasn't a one-sided thing, right? Like we both recognize that each of us. We're not doing things well, and we needed to change that. And then I looked at our, this is how our house was running. And I mean, my husband and I are, have very equitable distribution of like household chores and that kind of thing and that's never been a problem. Like my husband doesn't feel like I'm dumping stuff on him. He likes to cook. He likes to do stuff. But also like he got to a point where he was so discouraged. In the point of his career, he was like, well, I'll just be a stay-at-home dad and you can run your business.

And I was like, whoa, that is not what I want at all. Like, and I'm not saying that may not be the right thing for some people. But when I look at scripture, it's like, no, the husband is supposed to be the provider, the primary provider in many ways, not just financially. And I'm supposed to be primarily discipling my kids and stewarding my home. Those are our domains. And then we figure out how to collaborate together and making it all work. Right. So that was eye-opening for me, that he was so discouraged and feeling like. That he had no confidence and all my confidence was fake confidence because it was like, well, I got more clients, but now I'm crying myself to sleep at night because like I said, yes, though, horrible clients and they're super mean, and you know, it was bad.

So yeah, like reprioritizing our marriage. Was a huge factor. And then like in that really studying the scriptures of like, okay, what is my role first? What should I be doing? Like, yeah, I was barely managing the house at all. I mean, like at all, and I realized like, this is not good that I'm just kind of either. Like shoving this off on my husband and my kids, but not even giving them clear direction, you know? So I wasn't managing, there's a difference between just like, Dumping responsibilities off and being the manager like you can manage and delegate versus dump. So I was dumping, I was not delegating. And the other thing was that we homeschool our kids and we started homeschooling when my oldest was in, started second grade.

And so, you know, like I was kind of like, I will say doing a half-ass job with my daughter the whole time. Like we leaned a lot on our co-op and a lot of things, and she entered junior high this year and I was like, oh, dang, I need to step up my game. And then my younger kids are now there's a big age gap between my oldest and then the next one is five years.

So my son started his school. And now I'm like, I have to actually homeschool him. Like I can't just have him do random things and watch TV all day. Yeah. And my kids were like watching TV all the time. And so there was just a lot of things where, when I stopped and looked at the whole situation in my life, I was like, this is not good. Things are, these things are out of control. Nobody's happy. Like we just, something's got to change.

Danielle: [00:20:56] So you realistically took it from like chaos to calm or calmer or, cause if I have kids it's never calm

Melissa: [00:21:08] no, unless there was, there was no structure. Like there really wasn't a lot of structure. It was mom works these days from the so live realistically, even though I was working from home. I was the same as if I was going to an office and working for someone else's business, because I had to lock the door at a hire babysitters.

I had to tell them not to bother me. And then I would not go to bed with my husband and work for four hours at night and just constantly be behind and stress and angry and grumpy. And. It was not pretty, so it was a lot of chaos. And so we've been implementing structure in our lives, which is good thing.

Danielle: [00:21:52] That's a good thing. And having walked beside you, the whole last four or five, whatever years it is now, it's, it's way better. And you're so much happier doing it.

Melissa: [00:22:06] It's true. I was not happy for a while. I was just like, Always upset about stuff.

Danielle: [00:22:13] No. I want to shift our conversation to talk about money because for one of the things that you had said, it sounded like you were in kind of a scarcity money mindset.

And with the mindset class series that I have coming out in June I want to talk about money, mindset and kind of the shifts that you've had, how your business has impacted that and where you are right now. And kind of how you see that as a biblical shift in your mindset.

Melissa: [00:22:52] Yeah, I definitely had we, my husband and I both had scarcity mindset for a long time and some of that is a product of, you know, childhood. He grew up with very little money. I grew up with the appearance of having money and being quote unquote, rich, not really, but you know, in his mind it looked like my family was rich because we had property and horses and computers and things, and he's like, I grew up on WIC and food stamps.

Danielle: [00:23:24] Yes. Before we move on, can you just describe scarcity mindset for me please?

Melissa: [00:23:29] Yes, absolutely. So the way that I've. Kind of unpacked. The idea of the scarcity mindset is that too it's core there's not enough, there's not going to be enough. Like you're always afraid that there's not going to be enough.

And from a Christian perspective, it's really that God's not going to provide and that I have to pick up the slack and like, I can't trust God to meet our needs because on paper or whatever, when I look at the money or when I look at our life, right. It doesn't feel like he's providing and I'm not seeing where he's providing, so I'm just going to have to bootstrap it and, you know, get to work and figure it out myself.

And so it really is it's a, it's a lack of trust. Of the Lord and a lot of ways, which is like harsh. It feels like, oh, that doesn't feel good. But that is where I had to realize, like you're not trusting the Lord to provide. And if you, if I, like there were those moments where I would look back and be like, wow, God has done so much.

Like, look what he did here. Look what he did here. Look how he provided for us. You know, he like made it so that we could move. You always provided a job. And there was even a season where my business was buying groceries. I mean, we were living off of whatever my business made and credit cards for like a year in this transition time.

And I was just like, but God always provided, we were never homeless. We were never without food. We were never without clothes, you know, just so it was the perspective shift of things. So we were, yeah, we were just, I was stuck in this, like I have to work because if I don't work there won't be money for the things that I want.

That was the other thing. It was like, well, I don't want to have to sacrifice my coffee and my target runs and having a second car and, you know, buying new clothes instead of clothes at the thrift store, you know, just like. Ridiculous stuff in my mind, sometimes

Danielle: [00:25:32] the lies that we've been told as well, like this is, this is what you need, like instant gratification. You want to go get something log on to Amazon and buy it like it's right there.

Melissa: [00:25:46] . And that's the thing. Like I had an expectation of what my life and lifestyle should be based on how I was raised. And even now, like I'm 36 and I'm having my sixth kid and my mom had me, her first kid at 36. So now looking at going. I've been married 13 years and I got married young and we had no money. And now in our thirties we're more established. Like my husband has a good career. Like he has his paycheck, pays all the bills and buys all the clothes and the groceries and nobody's suffering. Not that we were suffering before, but you know, like there is, we're totally solid, good on his income.

And so to think that like, I had this expectation of like a thirties lifestyle when I was 24. And I thought like, well, when I was growing up, my mom could take me to fast food every day after school. And when I was growing up, like, I always got the toys that I wanted and we could eat this food and not that food, . Also you remember, you look back at a lot of your childhood with rose colored glasses because my parents worked and my mom worked and I'm like, Hey, a lot of frozen dinners when I was like this age to this.

Danielle: [00:27:07] Yeah. You're like, oh wait, that's true. It's not that good for you.

Melissa: [00:27:11] Yeah. I'm like, oh, I spent a lot of time at my grandma's before I started school because my mom was trying to run a business. I wasn't thinking practically of, of where my life stage was and just where we were at. And then, so because of that, we weren't stewarding our finance as well. We, we were always freaking out or I was always putting stuff on a credit card because I thought I needed it. And instead of finding a way to save and budget, like we were horrible at budgeting and it was bad. And the other thing that was a huge shift for us, and this is, you know, our marriage is, I had always been in charge of the finances because my husband didn't want to.

And I think he was kind of afraid of telling me, no he was afraid of telling me no, like he just, he did not want to make me angry. He did not want to disappoint me. So he would never tell me no. So I would just buy whatever I felt like I wanted or we could maybe afford, but I've included running up credit cards all the time.

When I was in charge of the finances and that was a long time. I was like 10 years. It was not good. Like, and he just, he like, it wasn't, we weren't a partnership in that. We were not, again, operating biblically. We weren't like working together. And so a couple, three years ago I told him I was like, I'm done. You have to take over the finances. Like. I can't do this anymore. There's too many things on my plate. And so that was a big and hard shift for him as he knew he needed to do it. He knew he needed to take that leadership over in our, our marriage, but it wasn't easy and it, you know, caused a lot of fights and a lot of things, but it's also been growing for him in that, now he feels like he has a good grasp of the finances. So there's less fights because he's not like, what are you spending money on? And I have a better understanding of how much money can I spend without us, screwing everything over and getting in trouble. And. You know, I can't go by fast food if we're not going to have enough for groceries by the end of the month, you know, that kind of stuff.

Just learning how to work together and not fight and communicate well has been a huge step both of us doing a lot of personal work on ourselves and a lot of prayer, just to understand that Money isn't bad. The Lord gave us money to manage our home and take care of our family.

So I think we both had this money is just so messy. It's like that there's so much you can do bad. And then the scarcity and never feeling like there's enough. So we've had a lot of huge shifts in our mindset together. That have helped us feel like we can communicate about money, better. We can steward our finances better and not feel like we're always playing catch up and always behind. And you know, so now we're not in that we have goals and we've set them and we're like working towards that and we're actually budgeting and actually saving money. So that's been huge for us.

Danielle: [00:30:40] That's awesome. I think it's so important when we start realizing the fact that money's not bad, like. There's, you know, the money is the root of all evil Bible verse that just gets thrown out there,

Melissa: [00:30:54] which is misquoted it's the love.

Danielle: [00:30:57] Exactly. But people don't want to take that personal responsibility. And I think that's so much, at least in my own money story. Taking that responsibility, as you said, I'm the spender. Like he was the spender. When we got married, it totally flipped and was like, I'm the spender now? Like I am the one that's spending money. And part of it is I am. My parents raised us really well. Like we learned how to save money. We gave tide, we did all this stuff. We had like this amount of money, but. I got used to spending the extra money that we had. And then he got out of the Navy and we lost his income. We lost like all the other stuff and we lost, you know, and then we moved to Hawaii and it was, I was like, I'm so depressed.

It's so expensive there. I was so depressed. I was so like, just not in a good head space. And so spending money was like, oh, at least I can do something. Right. Like I can at least. Make my house, like pretty like for the time that we were there, we were there a year and I'm like, oh my gosh, I spent so much money.

And now like the extra shower curtain is down at a box. They'll really pretty, but in a box. And so having to shift my mindset and being like, okay, like, this is ultimately what you said about the scarcity mindset, like trusting God to provide. And that's. Something that's so important. And that's one of the affirmations that I use is like, my God will provide, like he provides, he has provided in the past.

And seeing that, and I talk about this along with rest, because I think it goes so much in like breastfeeding or kind of woven together because. We look at it. And we're like, you, as you said, that hustle mindset, like I have to work, I have to get this, I have to do it. And we just put ourselves in a tailspin because we're like working so hard to make all the money and eventually it just, you have to face facts.

So it's been, it's, it's, it's been a really interesting, like you've done it, I'm working through that as well and trying to figure it out, like, okay, God, how do I budget this? Like, how do I. What does that even look like for my family and where is my self control? And I'm not going to lie. My $25 at Starbucks every month does not go very far

Melissa: [00:33:34] Amen sister! BecauseI'm pregnant right now. I don't know what it is about being pregnant, but I swear, I go to Starbucks 10 times more when I'm pregnant, even though I own an espresso machine in my house, like I literally have no excuse. I just like driving through and getting pretty drinks

Danielle: [00:33:58] well that, and it's like, I'm not having to put forth effort except I have to drive. Granted the closest Starbucks is 15 minutes away and I'm like, oh, I just don't feel like driving there today.

Melissa: [00:34:09] Mine is five.

Danielle: [00:34:11] my Podunk town doesn't have a drive-through coffee shop. One of the biggest gripes I have with this town.

Okay. What pieces of advice do you have for somebody who either feels like they're in the same spot as you, as far as their house and their wifely duties, like being a homemaker, all that stuff. Or they're in the same place with their money mindset.

Melissa: [00:34:38] So first I would just say like, this is a process, right? So you don't instantly go from like, Chaos and feeling out of control too I'm calm and I've got it all together now. Like, absolutely. Yeah. It's been a process of, of years for me. Okay. So just start with small steps.

I think it honestly starts with a lot of prayer, a lot of prayer, and really just like. Laying your life back down to the Lord and saying, okay, God, what do you want for my life? Because obviously what I want isn't working right now. You know, like then that was, that was a huge thing, is what I want or what I thought I wanted or what the world was telling me that I wanted and I needed is not working.

And this is, you know, it's, it's killing me and I need a shift. So. Has really committed to the Lord in prayer and lean on his strength to be brave, to do the hard things, because I literally shut down my business and its most profitable year Mike and that was six, seven years in. It was finally becoming super profitable, but it was also literally killing me.

So it's, you've got to just make the hard decisions and trust that the Lord will reward those hard decisions. If you're staying faithful to where he's calling you, you know, so, and just being. Open and honest with your spouse to have the hard conversations too, because that's, oh, it's not pretty, it's not fun at first.

But again, just like starting that process and also just like leaning on the church around you, whether that's, you know, the actual church you attend or just other believers and friends who were going to support you in prayer and not like. Just be the like yeah, whatever you say, you know, like the people like Danielle, we're going to call you out and be like, no, Melissa, I don't think you should be doing that.

Or like, that's not a good direction for you to go. And I'm like, oh, you're right. Oh, crap. So, yeah. And just really dive into the scriptures. I think like we lean too heavily on everything outside of scripture. Sometimes it's just easier to be like, well, I'm doing my devotion or I'm listening to this podcast. Or like, I'm watching this teacher on YouTube and we're not actually just going to the scriptures ourselves

Danielle: [00:37:13] or like scrolling Instagram and being like, oh, that's a nice verse that doesn't cut it.

Melissa: [00:37:19] Yeah. I mean, like I literally went to college. And was taught hermeneutics and how an exegesis is like how to study the Bible. But did I start applying that? Not till 10 years later? No. So take, take the time. You know, and it may just be small pockets of time in the beginning, but the Lord will provide it really does. I mean, we do, we have to lay down or cross and trust Lord that he is going to provide, and he's going to do the things cause you kind of just have those like moments where you have to call yourself to the mat and say, do I trust the Lord or not? And you have to determine that answer for yourself. Like we can't tell you, like, yeah, I can see you trust. Like, no, you can't just have a bunch of cheerleaders be like you, like, you just got to lean in and do the hard work. That's the thing. You just gotta do the hard work. So that's. Kind of the, the overarching advice for both like money stuff and business stuff and marriage stuff, like do the hard work because honestly it's worth it.

One of our friends when we were like, Married a couple years. He was a pastor of a different church that shared the building. So it was a little bit older than us. And he was talking to my husband one day, cause we were still in our twenties and he was in his thirties and he said, the thirties are for shoveling poop.

He's like, you're in your thirties. That's when you shovel all the poop and you deal with your crap. And we were kinda like, okay, like, and now we're in our mid thirties and we're like, yup. This is we're shoveling the poop. Like we are doing the hard things because we, you realize like, I don't want to beat 50 and all of a sudden wake up one day and go, I have a horrible marriage.

I treated my kids like crap. We still have no money and I'm not any happier than I was 20 years ago. Like I would rather do the hard work now and really like lean in and be faithful to the Lord so that I can like actually have the life that he has said he wants to give us abundant life. Right. Like he doesn't want us to be miserable our whole life and like our happiness and our joy.

Doesn't need to be tied to how much money is in our bank account or how many cars are in our driver or what, how big our houses. And that's been a huge shift to just like being content in all circumstances. Like how the heck did Paul sit there in prison and say, I am content in all circumstances, like, I want that, how do I, how do I do that?

Danielle: [00:40:05] Right. Well, and the thing is statistically, the people who have more are not happy. No, they never learn contentment because it's always trying to hit that next wicket. Not saying that having more as a bad thing, like, I would love a Jeep Wrangler in my, my yard right now. Like that would be awesome.

Melissa: [00:40:24] You don't want my 15 passenger van Danielle? It's so awesome.

Danielle: [00:40:29] But my husband wants your 15 passenger van. I don't, he's really shaking his head.

Melissa: [00:40:37] Big family problem.

Danielle: [00:40:42] You also wanted like six kids when we got married and I was like, Nope, sorry. Oh, he's saying five. Sorry.

Melissa: [00:40:49] Okay. One more. You're good.

Danielle: [00:40:56] Yeah. So I think because there's so much of that, that goes into the mindset and just, you know, finding your joy in the Lord. And that's another one of the verses that I use as an affirmation is like the joy of the Lord is my strength. All through a bootcamp 10 years ago or 12 years ago. Oh my gosh. 12 years ago. That was like the verse. I was like, the joy of the Lord is my strength. Every day as I was doing pushups, and red in the face and hating life. I actually really enjoyed boot camp in a lot of ways. . There was structure and I was where God wanted me.

Melissa: [00:41:32] Yes.

Danielle: [00:41:34] But anyways Anything else you wanted to add about money, money, mindset.

It's just, yeah, just what I've said. Basically it's hard work. It's not going to be easy, but, but making the shifts and leaning in is so rewarding. Like God has done so many good things. Like we, my husband and I, my kids and I we're in such a better place than we were even a couple of years ago.

Like way better place. And that's not financially per se. But more so what's important to me is relationally and spiritually, like we have better relationships in our family because I'm not seeking after other things. And we have, you know, just better stability, like, and better spiritual relationships, like, because I am trusting the Lord and I'm not trying to lean on my own strength and do it all myself.

And you know, all of this, you are enough on your own. Again, bad worldly advice like that's I was just leaning so much on this worldly business hustle stuff that it was totally crushing me.

Yeah. Awesome. Well, thank you for that. So just quick on your next business venture, tell us what you're doing and why you are excited about it.

Melissa: [00:43:11] It's funny. Cause I'm kind of doing two different things and one of them is that I am doing a business with my husband, which is like a huge thing. Cause we would have never been able to do that before. Ever he tried to help me with bookkeeping one time and it was a disaster. So he and I have started a podcast for homeschoolers because homeschooling is one of our passions and that's what he does for a living.

He's a teacher, he supports homeschoolers. So we have that, we have the trailblazing homeschool podcast. And so that's just been a fun thing right now. It's not like super monetized or anything, particularly. Amazing yet. But it's just like us learning to work together. And then the other thing that I shifted to is actually being part of a MLM network marketing company and doing young living with you, which has been super fun.

And I think it's funny cause you know, like I've been an entrepreneur for , 12 years. And I grew up in a family of entrepreneurs. My parents simultaneously ran three to four businesses at a time, so it's nothing new to me. And so a lot of people think that network marketing like it gets a bad rap and, or it's like, it's not a real business. And honestly, the amount of business experience I have, it is so refreshing to go back, like not go back as in it's backwards, but just go to something where I'm not the sole person trying to run a business by myself that like we have a team and it's really just like, I'm using products that I love and I'm sharing products that I love, and we're building a business based off of that. And it is way different in its demands and time for my family. So I can do the things from my phone half the time. And now my husband is so interested in business and he's like, so supportive of the young living business too, that he's like, oh, are you watching a training? Can I watch that with you? Like, Hey wonder are we signing up for convention? Are we like. Oh, okay. Let's do this together because he loves learning alongside me. So that's been just really fun and a lot less pressure and stress then running the business by myself

Danielle: [00:45:33] and you get to work with me, which is the best I know.

Melissa: [00:45:37] Cause like we're the best team ever.

Danielle: [00:45:40] No, really like having, like, being able to do business with your best friend or your husband is amazing like an, I, I think so much of the time, like as a business owner, like an entrepreneurial soul per Nuer, I'm the only one that I talk to about business. And so like having a core group of girls that I can talk to and be like, okay, this is what I'm doing. This is what I'm thinking. Am I crazy for thinking I can do all of this? And then by the way, did you try this oil? Because it's amazing. And these vitamins are keeping me running because vitamin B is like, Life right now.

Melissa: [00:46:22] It is the mom's best friend. Yes. Yes. So it's true. I have an awesome group of people and I think that was the other thing is I'm such an extrovert. And so while it was very like energizing for me, when I was working one-on-one with a client that was only a tiny part of when I was running my business as a solo preneur and towards the end, I had like a team member, but even then, like, it was so lonely. And so switching to a model of business where yes, you're responsible for your income. No, one's going to earn money for you, but you are part of this amazing team and they're all just supporting each other and encouraging each other. And like, you know, We've got leaders on our team that are teaching classes for us. And we've got like, and we're all messaging each other all day long and encouraging and answering questions. And so it's just night and day. It is night and day from going, being a solo preneur in a industry that is not terribly fun to now a bunch of awesome oil slinging moms

Danielle: [00:47:31] who just want to take care of other people.

Melissa: [00:47:33] Seriously, we just. We just want to have fun and give everyone in the world oils.

Danielle: [00:47:38] Yeah. Yup. Awesome. Well, thank you so much for this interview with me. And I'm, I hope that people have found nuggets of goodness. They can take away and just apply them. Because really we want you to apply these things. We don't want you to just listen, like take them and apply them. Even if it's just spend five minutes reading your Bible every day. And then if you really want to work on your money mindset, I'm going to plug up my money mindset class series. That's coming up cart opens in like about a week when this launches and when this podcast posts.

It is called renew your money mindset, a Christian woman's roadmap to becoming a joyful financial steward. So this is the only time I'm running it live. And then it will be just videos. So if you want in, on the live sign up, because Danielle is amazing and we aren't just friends, she has actually coached me many times in the past. And gosh, we've been talking about this money mindset stuff for years three years, crazy. Four years.

This is not our first podcast episode talking about money.

Nope. Obviously we like it. Yeah, but I'm so excited that you're doing this course, so people should do it. That's that's your plug. Don't just listen to Danielle.

Listen to Melissa. She says, sign up now.

Let's get that in writing. I mean that for my sales page, we'll transcribe that, throw that up. Awesome. Well, thanks, Melissa. , oh, tell people where they can find you. So with your trailblazer trailblazer, trailblazing.

Melissa: [00:49:20] Yeah. So our podcast is trailblazing homeschool. You can also find us on Instagram or trailblazing, homeschool.com. So if you want to learn about homeschooling, that's where you can find me. Right now, personally, I'm most active on Instagram and you can follow me at ohHeyMelissaWhaley on Instagram. I'm redoing my website. It probably won't be done until the end of summer. So don't worry about that. Just find me on.

Danielle: [00:49:48] Sounds good. Thank you.

Melissa: [00:49:50] All right. Thanks, Danielle.

Links

Join Melissa and I on our wellness journey and order your own oils today through Young Living. We LOVE the Basic Starter Bundle so you can order what you want, when you want. OR the Kidscents Premium Starter Bundle. Use this link or email [email protected] https://www.youngliving.com/vo/#/signup/new-start?sponsorid=27879591&enrollerid=10336789&isocountrycode=US&culture=en-US&type=member.

This show's sponsor is the devotional for Christian women business owners and entrepreneurs, Created for This. It's based on Proverbs 31 and has devotions relevant to business owning and life as a business owner. You can purchase the book at daniellemroberts.com/createdforthis.

Vanessa Ungvarsky of Taylor Made Cosmetics joined me for this podcast recorded for a class project. I have a deep admiration for this woman and I'm so thankful she agreed to interview with me about the backend of her product-based business.

There is so much to learn from her in how she sources her business supplies and delivers an astounding array of safe, ethically sourced and made products. Her business also values inclusivity, honesty, and women's empowerment.

Taylor Made Cosmetics sells small-batch, vegan and organic cosmetics that are handmade in our downtown Easton, PA studio. Our beauty culture is based on inclusivity, honesty and women empowerment. The Taylor Made Cosmetics mission is to strengthen the connection between consumers and their cosmetics through communication and hands-on experiences.

Notes coming.

For more on Jamie Russell and to learn more from her, follow her Instagram, YouTube or check out her website.

The lyrics for Be Thou My Vision by Audrey Assad

Stacy Tuschl is a Small Business Growth Coach, Best-Selling Author, and the creator of Foot Traffic Podcast & Community where she helps small business owners grow their local business Stacy started her first business at the age of 18 in her parents' backyard and turned that company into a seven-figure business she still runs today. She is a mom of 2 little girls and married to her husband Kent.

In this episode, Stacy talks about how her faith influences her company values and the way that she runs her businesses.

She's giving five actionable tips for growing your business from what she's learned as she's grown her dance studio, and her coaching and consulting businesses.

Stacy's five actionable tips are:

1. Build anticipation - something good is coming. Following the example of Amazon Prime Day and Nordstrom's Anniversary Sale and build that anticpation of the sale coming. We as small business owners don't follow the example of the big companies enough in this area. They have advertisements and buzz growing in advance.
2. Sense of urgency - a reason to buy right now. Have a cut off time to have someone buy for a short amount of time. People have a short attention span. Use something like today only. People will not come back to the email or to watch something else.
3. Scarcity - hurry before this runs out. You can do this with time or with the number of people who you will allow in at that price or offering. Give them a reason to buy right now so they don't forget about you.
4. Giving customers royal treatment - reward current clients. So many people will do a sale for new clients. How can you give a promotion for current clients and new clients. Figure out how you can love on your current clients. It increases their lifetime value and then they will also tell their friends. Starting out with lower expectations and then exceed those expectations. Don't put everything out there at the beginning so you can keep wowing them.
5. Name your promotion or event - give someone a name to share. It feels like it's another level or scale. If we want people to share, don't make them come up with something themselves, give them something to share. You can create a hashtag for this too.

• Make a typical, everyday name people can remember (simplicity is key). Look at the people who are crushing it and follow their example. Have them hear the name and want what that is. Don't lose people because they have no idea what it is you're talking about. Look at businesses outside of their industry.

Another way to grow your business is to add a team member and outsource. Adding someone to your team - give people an opportunity for growth. The more you allow others to take things on, the more you'll love what you're doing. At minimum, everyone needs to have one person on their team.

• If you don't have the money, you need to get smart from where the money will come, you might need to cut expenses, sell things around your house, or work extra.
• There's also a mindset of getting resourceful to either find extra money or extra time.

Money mindset has been the place where Stacy's grown the most. Others are dreaming a lot bigger and when she's around people who want to uplevel and have upleveled, and where she wants to grow more.

Biblical abundance - God is not a God of lack or scarcity. He's a God of abundance.

There's room for everyone in an area. When you look at successful people, they don't have a lack mindset, they see the abundance.

Follow along with Stacy and learn more from her Foot Traffic Formula website or Instagram.