Carolina Allen, founder and director of Big Ocean Women, and Shelli Spotts introduce our new monthly podcast series that applies the group’s tenets to current issues, beginning with “working side by side in the global sisterhood." They also celebrate our Big Ocean Women CSW team’s successful, safe return from sharing our maternal feminist message at the United Nations Commission on the Status of Women. They describe a “maternal economy” that decommodifies relationships and draws on abundance, creativity, and generational impact, contrasting it with hustle culture and profit-driven models. Carolina announces a May 9 summit (with more to follow) where Big Ocean will share lessons from years of attending UN forums and help mothers and families understand complex agendas, language, and how to respond with clarity, education, self-reliance, and safety.

Dana is joined by Fatima as they discuss the violence that has been plaguing Nigeria for over 20 years. As Dana said, “Our purpose today is not to sensationalize the suffering or assign political blame or leave us feeling overwhelmed, but we want to listen, understand, and know how as an interfaith community, we can come together and support the Nigerians in this suffering.”

“We just have to be as close to God as we can.” - Fatima Njoku

“There’s no limit to what is possible, and so every day we just keep praying that we are able to stay faithful.” - Fatima Njoku

“There has to be a real awakening of patriotism, of human rights, values of respect and dignity of life, of human life, that people should be able to see one another as humans and not as competitors or rivals or any enemies because we’re not.” - Fatia Njoku

“So there's hope. It's just for us to reinforce the right values. The bad people are not as many as good people. It's just because what bad people are doing is so loud that it makes it look like the world is so evil. No, there are a lot of good people, it’s just that they have refused to do anything good or they've been quiet. But if we pray for one another, if we help each other, do inter-religious workshops where we help to see that we have similarities, give each other hope and a reason to believe in one another.

I think there's a lot of hope.” - Fatima Njoku

“If every good person decides to stand up and, and to do something good and to be led by God, to know how to fill in that space. Then so much good will happen.” - Dana Robb

“I love the catchphrase… ‘All evil needs to triumph is for good men to do nothing.’ So if you want to be a force for good in the world, don’t do nothing. Do something.” - Fatima Njoku

“That's perfect. Yep, exactly. Do something. And each of us has that capability to do something good in our homes, our communities, and it will branch out and affect the world.” - Dana Robb

Fatima Njoku is a lawyer working in Nigeria and currently a doctorate candidate at the University of Jos. She has been a human rights advocate for over 11 years, in the course of her advocacy, she has been to the United Nations headquarters in New York and Geneva, she had meetings at Capitol Hill, House of Lords, Swiss Press Club and the like. She has been serving her community through Big Ocean Women in Nigeria where more than 50 women meet regularly for encouragement around the importance of faith, family, and motherhood. This group also carries out community development projects that have touched many lives.

Whenever presented with the opportunity for adventure, Dana Robb is all in. Currently, this includes riding the local mountain biking trails with her husband, canyoneering, and climbing the hills of southern Utah. She loves to learn and explore with her six kids. She is drawn to the opportunities being involved with Big Ocean Women provides. Dana loves connecting to a global sisterhood where women’s issues are being addressed through reframing and an abundance mindset.

Your Internal Compass: A Beacon for Faith and Action

Shannon and Dana are joined by Shandra Madson to discuss following our Internal Compass which is our ability to hear from God and be inspired and directed in our lives.

Shandra Madson started a campus of the Columbus Adult Education Center in her community which teaches English to refugees and immigrants. Shandra had become aware that about one in every five people in their community did not speak English because of a large influx of refugees. She said, “They were new to our city, new to our country, and it created a lot of different dynamics and concerns and ways that these people needed to feel loved and just helped along their path. So the Columbus Center is basically there to teach English, but really it's just a beautiful place where people were able to come and feel God's love for them. And I think that was kind of our main goal. English obviously was important, but they needed somewhere that they could come just to feel safe and feel loved, and just have that humanity where they weren't feeling it otherwise in their lives.”

00:00 Introduction and Welcome

00:39 Meet Shandra Madson

03:23 The Columbus Center: A Beacon of Hope

07:07 Trusting in the Lord: Shandra's Journey

09:30 Success Stories and Impact

19:06 Encouragement and Final Thoughts

“God doesn't care where we live. He doesn't care what our address is. He wants people to feel loved no matter where they are.” - Shandra Madson

“We don’t have to know everything to be able to contribute and support.” - Dana Robb

“I think it's a beautiful thing that all of God's children are born with that light, and I think it's just a matter of are we willing to flame that light and just help grow it. and I think every little choice we make, every way we help God's children, that light just grows brighter and brighter. . . .It takes effort to recognize and effort to follow.” - Shandra Madson 

“Another thing that's been really interesting is that some maybe came in with different biases or prejudices against another nation. And because we serve so many nations, and they're learning together and have become united through that, I've seen some of those guards that they came with be let down, and actually become friends with [eachother] and realize that they have more in common than they thought at first, and that some of these prejudices that they had in the beginning were really unfounded. . . . That's been such a beautiful, one of my favorite parts to witness, that happening at the center.” - Shannon Russell

“I think anytime we just reach out a hand of love and fellowship and kindness, it doesn’t go unnoticed. People notice and feel that love of God as they serve.” - Shandra Madson

“One thing I love is just that we all came here with different talents, and it's so easy to compare with somebody else of like, “Wow, they've done this thing,” or “They have this ability or this talent,” but it's neat to see how God can use all of our talents differently, and it can help grow to be something beautiful for all of us.” - Shandra Madson

“I love that you said be still, you know, let's quiet yourself down. We live in such a rushed world, but really in order to connect to that internal compass, we have to take moments of stillness every day and quiet our minds and, and listen in.” - Dana Robb

Shannon Russell treasures her roles as a wife and mother, finding that the journey of learning and growing alongside her family is the most rewarding experience of her life. At her core, Shannon is passionate about helping others. Whether it be as a real estate agent guiding her clients to one of their most significant investments – their homes, or volunteering at the Columbus Center supporting refugees in learning English and become assimilated in the United States, or creating nonprofits focused on educating youth, she loves serving those around her and is committed to making a positive impact in her community. Shannon loves connecting with women from diverse backgrounds and perspectives through Big Ocean Women where women are empowered to generate solutions that enable them to live a life of joy and abundance. Her favorite pastimes are playing pickleball, board games, hiking, anything that puts her in nature, and being a beach bum.

Whenever presented with the opportunity for adventure, Dana Robb is all in. Currently, this includes riding the local mountain biking trails with her husband, canyoneering, and climbing the hills of southern Utah. She loves to learn and explore with her six kids. She is drawn to the opportunities being involved with Big Ocean Women provides. Dana loves connecting to a global sisterhood where women’s issues are being addressed through reframing and an abundance mindset.

Shandra Madsen is an entrepreneur at heart and has owned several businesses over the past couple decades.. Shandra and Todd have been married for 26 years and have 5 beautiful children, one son-in-law and two grandchildren. Being parents and grandparents is her ultimate joy. She enjoys spending time with their large extended family, camping, vacationing, playing games and enjoying the outdoors. Her love for Jesus Christ is foundational to who she is and serving her community and neighbors. She has loved serving as the Director with her husband of the Herriman Columbus Adult Education Center that helps hundreds of immigrants learn English. She is currently serving as the Chair over Humanitarian Aid with the Kamas Valley Community Foundation and excited to continue to serve in new and exciting ways.

Following the tragic shooting of Charlie Kirk at Utah Valley University, Shannon Russell, who was at the event, Natalie Perry, Grace Raje, a student at UVU, and Kimball Call discuss the effects of the internet and polarization, how we can help each other and our families, and how we deal with these issues we’re facing by recognizing and following our internal compass.

00:00 Introduction and Host's Welcome

00:44 Panel Introductions

01:21 Grace's Perspective on the Assassination

02:13 Natalie's Experience at the Event

08:07 Discussion on Social Media and Misinformation

19:23 Generational Differences and Digital Natives

27:15 Impact of Internet on Young Men

30:27 The Impact of Internet Rabbit Holes on Young Men

31:06 Promoting Positive Masculinity in Education

31:55 Escapism and Its Role in Extremism

32:54 The Importance of Connection Over Avoidance

33:26 Maternal Feminism vs. Modern Feminism

35:27 Fostering Critical Thinking in the Digital Age

37:30 The Dangers of Overstimulation and Dopamine Addiction

41:13 Challenging the Untruths of Fragility, Emotional Reasoning, and Us vs. Them

46:20 The Pressure to Form Immediate Opinions

50:22 Encouraging Civil Discourse and Embracing Failure

55:33 Conclusion and Final Thoughts

“We recognize and follow our intuitive internal compass to speak and act with integrity. And so as we teach this tenet at an international level, we are so blessed to hear from mothers and women all over the globe who believe in following our internal compass. And that is something that every person on this earth has and needs to learn how to use and, and how do we tap into that internal compass? How do we speak, how do we act? Those are the issues I think that we need to address and are very relevant to what happened this week.” - Natalie Perry

“Personally, I think we're gonna look back at kids having social media the same way we look back on how prevalent smoking was in the seventies and eighties… We're gonna say, ‘What were we thinking? Giving kids access to that amount of information before they were trained or taught how to process it, how to filter it out, how to use it for good or use it for other uses.’ It's seriously doing some real damage to not just our kids, but to adults as well. I think there's a lot of interesting research coming out about that, but I don't think you need to be in the research to see the negative effects. I think you can just look at what's been happening over the last week.” - Kimball Call

“I think that the family unit is the best place and arguably the only place that's really suitable to hold space for our generation. As we process this disassociation, as we process this dystopian pit in our stomach and the expectation to speak articulately about our thoughts on social media, because that's what's expected of us, even though we're actually processing an emotional thing, and our hearts and brains aren't always communicating. So the family and mothers specifically have a very special and unique ability to hold space for my generation to not have to be articulate, to not have to post right away, to maybe even feel indifferent or to feel sick or to feel whatever they're feeling without criticism, because this is an emotional event.” - Grace Raje

“We need to get back to reality, and we need to help kids grow up in reality. So one of the best ways moms and parents can help their kids is to give them a childhood that resembles the childhood [they] probably experienced. . . .Before the internet was a thing, get kids off video games, get kids off. Don't let them have social media. Get them in touch with books. Help them fall in love with reading. Help them fall in love with nature, help them fall in love with sports and in-person social activities with friends.” - Kimball Call

“When you can stop seeing things as us versus them, you can think critically.” - Kimball Call

“There's this moral obligation to have opinions about everything. . . not that it's wrong to have an opinion, anybody who knows me knows I'm remarkably opinionated, but the problem is that we confuse our identity with our opinions, and then when you're wrong or you have new information, it's hard to admit that you're wrong because it feels like a compromisation of your worth. And the thing that I've learned in order to . . . interface with difficult concepts and be able to hear other people's opinions, is to remove my worth from my opinions, to remove my emotional response from my opinions, and then understand that my internal compass is the gift that I have to discern between the two, and that that takes practice. But as you continue to practice that, it'll be a lot easier, and all of a sudden I can just admit that I'm wrong about something, but I know who I am and I know the worth of the person I'm discussing this, too, and it's not so emotionally charged anymore. It can be about ideas and this sort of effortlessly starts to happen as we practice and as we recognize our own internal worth.” - Grace Raje

“Don't be afraid of failure. Don't be afraid of adversity. I think something that the Charlie Kirk assassination teaches us is that, I mean, here was a guy, whether or not you agree with his politics, here was a guy out there not afraid to be open with where he stood, and let people challenge him. He wasn't afraid of failure. He wasn't afraid of that, and I think in a lot of ways I've seen people on both sides of the aisle recently praising that behavior.” - Kimball Call

The Anxious Generation: How the Great Rewiring of Childhood Is Causing an Epidemic of Mental Illness by Jonathan Haidt

Kimball Call is an economics student at Brigham Young University and the lead editor of The Cougar Chronicle, an independent student newspaper. Kimball is passionate about issues and policies surrounding family, faith, and young men. He has been with Big Ocean Women for 5 months and is excited to continue contributing his insights on the rising generation. He can be found on instagram and X @kimballcall, where he shares insights on economics, family issues, and matters related to Gen-Z. 

Wife to Anthony for 28 wonderful years, Natalie Perry is a dedicated full-time mother of six children, proud grandmother of two (with two more on the way!), and a passionate advocate for marriage, fathers, and the vital role of motherhood. A natural gatherer, Natalie cherishes every opportunity to bring people together—whether it’s for dinners, birthdays, vacations, movie nights, or spontaneous game nights. She finds joy and purpose in creating meaningful connections with those around her. As a member of Big Ocean Women, Natalie uplifts and empowers women through faith, family, and community. Her life is a testament to the power of love, connection, and purposeful living as a disciple of Jesus Christ.

Grace Raje is the Director of Global Strategy and has served various roles within Big Ocean Women, including WAVE leader, Digital Presence Manager, and Event Coordinator. She is currently pursuing a degree in Global Politics and is passionate about social change through the non-profit and government sectors. When she is not working, you can find Grace exploring national parks, rock climbing, or gardening with her husband.

Susan Roylance and Carolina Allen discuss what advocacy for family looks like at the UN. 

00:00 Introduction to Gender Issues

00:24 Welcome to Currents Podcast

01:01 Introducing Susan Roylance

02:08 Susan's Journey and Book

03:29 The Beijing Conference

04:56 Defining Gender and Family Advocacy

06:48 Challenges and Advocacy at the UN

11:35 The Importance of Maternal Feminism

18:50 Susan's Mentorship and Legacy

21:09 Reflections on Feminism and Family

30:49 The Importance of Relationships and Family

31:36 Motherhood and Workforce Policies in Europe

32:57 Generational Wisdom and Family Dynamics

33:43 Susan's Experience at the Geneva Conference

38:06 Cultural Solutions vs. Top-Down Policies

42:44 The Role of Family in Addressing Global Issues

50:31 Promoting Family Values to Younger Generations

57:34 The Economic Impact of Declining Birth Rates

58:50 The Power of Family in Society

58:56 Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Dana Robb is joined by Kawika Allen and Nathan Ormsby to dispute the notion that men are unnecessary and promote the truth that men are truly valuable and we need to build interdependent relationships to support one another.

“I think all men and husbands should strive to be more nurturing as well. I think it's just helpful for our children to see that modeling of a nurturing father.” - Kawika Allen

“Just showing that emotional support and care is not something that you do often enough, and especially in men. We should be okay to say we care for each other, we're looking out for you, and it's important.” - Nathan Ormsby

“When we're vulnerable with each other, we actually can feel closer and more connected.” - Dana Robb

“It is really helpful for me as a wife to know where he's at [emotionally] and I feel like I have a lot more compassion for him when he's open about what he's feeling or the stresses he's under, the things he is experiencing. I feel like I can then step in and know how to support him a little bit more.” - Dana Robb

“A good relationship is built on vulnerability. You need to have that, and talk about deep and meaningful things.” - Nathan Ormsby

“Men who are watching this, give yourself some grace. Give yourself some flexibility, opportunities to learn from mistakes and take those mistakes and improve on them and not let them control your lives, right?  And to stand back up and keep moving forward and trying and striving the best they can in all areas, right? Emotionally, spiritually, physically, mentally. Um, and so again, just give yourself some grace. You know, you're trying your best.” - Kawika Allen

“That's what we need more in our relationships is that recognition. We're doing our best and we're not gonna get it perfectly all the time, and that's okay. We just keep picking it up and we keep trying.” - Dana Robb

Whenever presented with the opportunity for adventure, Dana Robb is all in. Currently, this includes riding the local mountain biking trails with her husband, canyoneering, and climbing the hills of southern Utah. She loves to learn and explore with her six kids. She is drawn to the opportunities being involved with Big Ocean Women provides. Dana loves connecting to a global sisterhood where women’s issues are being addressed through reframing and an abundance mindset.

Nathan Ormsby brings a diverse and dynamic background to his role as Director of Student Wellness at Brigham Young University. Originally from New Zealand and Australia, Nathan’s early experiences in a non-traditional family, multi-faith family, and a First-Generation college student, laid the foundation for a lifelong commitment to service, resilience, and community engagement.

Nathan has cultivated a career that spans not-for-profit organizations, local government, professional sports, and resort management. His professional journey reflects a deep passion for wellness, creative problem-solving, and building inclusive, supportive environments.

For over 15 years at BYU, Nathan has led impactful initiatives—from developing family programs at Aspen Grove to advising multicultural students. Today, he serves in his role, guiding campus-wide wellness efforts and chairing the Wellness Wise Committee. His leadership is marked by a holistic approach to well-being, integrating physical, emotional, and social health to enrich the student experience.

Outside of work, Nathan is an avid weightlifter and adventure enthusiast. He and his wife, Jennifer, are proud parents of six children who enjoy swimming, playing pickleball, and sharing laughs over funny videos.

Professor Allen received his bachelor’s degree in speech/organizational communication, his master’s degree in counseling psychology at the University of Utah, his PhD in counseling psychology from the University of Missouri-Columbia and his predoctoral clinical internship at Duke University. His research areas involve spiritual, cultural, and indigenous ways of healing in psychotherapy, including culturally appropriate psychotherapies and interventions for various populations. Professor Allen also conducts research related to religiosity, perfectionism, scrupulosity, and psychological wellbeing among many populations. In addition, Professor Allen has focused much of his research on culture-specific counseling interventions and the relationships across religiosity/spirituality, coping/collectivistic coping, depression, anxiety, and psychological well-being/adjustment among Polynesians/Polynesian Americans. Professor Allen is the founder of and leads the Polynesian Psychology Education Research Team (The Poly Psi Team). He was recently awarded a Fulbright Specialist Scholarship teaching, providing training, and presenting and conducting research on religiosity, spirituality, culture, mental health, and psychotherapy in Brazil. Dr. Allen has numerous publications in top-tier scientific journals, over 4 million dollars in research grants, and multiple professional presentations at national and international conferences. Dr. Allen is an associate professor in the PhD program of counseling psychology at Brigham Young University. He and his wife, Carolina, have 7 children and they live in Provo, Utah.

Shelli Spotts, Carolina Allen, and Alma Olaveson discuss what it means to work in the advocacy space as mothers referencing Alice Walker’s book, We are the Ones We Have Been Waiting For: Light in a Time of Darkness and her daughter, Rebecca Walker’s book, Baby Love: Choosing Motherhood After a Lifetime of Ambivalence.

“Advocacy is such an innate maternal thing to do, to advocate for other people that are vulnerable and can’t help themselves… it just comes with the territory of being a mother.” - Carolina Allen

“The best advocacy, the best… changing of the world, the best community building happens as we do the things that we’re doing in our lives… It’s not stepping outside of ourselves, it’s just expanding our efforts within our own sphere.” - Shelli Spotts

“I think that we just need to live more mindfully; the minute we walk out the door, to just live, ... have more integrity with who we are in our cause. I think having integrity actually allows for connection.” - Carolina Allen

“I think one skill that we all need to learn is a deep awareness and then a deep love and compassion of whatever comes up.” - Alma Olaveson

“The best way to teach is by being.” - Alma Olaveson

“I think one of the quotes from Rebecca’s book, Baby Love, that I really loved is, ‘When it comes down to it, what life is about is showing up for the people you love again and again, and again and again.’ And I think that that’s a lot of what we’ve been talking about: that what we can do in the spaces we have and in the time we have is just [to] show up for those people again and again, and again and again.” - Shelli Spotts

Carolina Allen is the founder and leader of Big Ocean Women, the international maternal feminist organization representing perspectives of faith, family, and motherhood throughout civil society. Carolina holds a B.A. in philosophy from the University of Utah with an emphasis in cultural religions and philosophy of science. Her inspirational and philosophical work has been presented at various international U.N. conferences. She is a native of Brazil, and a fluent trilingual. She and her husband Kawika are parents to 7 children. She is an avid soccer fan and had a brief career as a semi-professional player.

Shell Spotts is an advocacy writer and creative writing teacher. She loves to spend time with her husband (usually in the garden) and their four almost adult children. She also loves to sew, to read, to write, and to drag her family outside to look at the sky. Shelli is passionate about poetry, Broadway show tunes, and telling stories—of ourselves, our families, and our communities.

Alma Olaveson is a dedicated advocate for women's empowerment and a passionate leader within Big Ocean Women. As a full-time mother, Alma is on a mission to create a paradigm shift in the collective consciousness of women by emphasizing one crucial element: reminding them of their innate worth, true identity, and the natural milestones in female development. Alma focuses her efforts on women who are considering pregnancy for the first time and preparing to welcome their first child. She is a firm believer that the most profound developmental milestone a woman can experience is becoming a mother for the first time. Alma is concerned that misinformation and beliefs that conflict with the natural progression of a woman's biology and feminine nature are adversely affecting the well-being of first-time mothers. Her passion lies in nurturing the spiritual, emotional, psychological, and social well-being of women as they transition from Maiden to Matrescence and ultimately to Motherhood. Alma graduated from BYUI with a degree in psychology and is currently a student at Peterson Academy. When she's not working, Alma enjoys exploring nature, hiking, chasing waterfalls, basking in the sun, and spending quality time with her kids and husband. She also loves reading, writing in her journal, and connecting with friends.