Tom Gober is President of Thomas Gober Forensic Accounting Services and specializes in forensic accounting and fraud investigations, primarily in the insurance and reinsurance industries. Since the 2008 financial crisis, his work has focused on the financial condition of the U.S. life and annuity sector, particularly captive reinsurance structures used to offload liabilities and inflate liquidity, surplus, and RBC ratios, resulting in referrals to federal law enforcement and engagement with regulators on systemic risk concerns. Tom has conducted Medicare fraud examinations for hospitals, consulted with the FBI and U.S. Attorney’s Office on criminal insurance investigations, provided expert testimony in federal courts on fraud, money laundering, and asset forfeiture, advised plaintiffs and defendants in insurance litigation, and led comprehensive statutory insurance audits, including serving as a state Examiner-in-Charge.

You can contact Tom via his website at www.DeepDiveAnalytics.biz

For the Supplemental Deck, go to the episode page on https://debtserious.substack.com

Contact: [email protected]

For informational purposes only. Not investment advice or an offer to buy or sell any securities. Conduct your own due diligence.

Leyla Kunimoto is an investor and editor of Accredited Investor Insights, a newsletter that helps investors navigate private markets. She writes about private equity, private credit, and real estate, focusing on the practical realities of evaluating alternative investments from the limited partner perspective. Leyla began investing in public markets in 2001 and expanded into private markets in 2020, with current holdings spanning public equities, real estate, and alternatives.

Jim Grant is the founder and editor of Grant’s Interest Rate Observer and one of the most respected voices in financial markets.

Grant is the author of ten books on finance and history. His most recent book is Friends Until the End: Edmund Burke and Charles Fox in the Age of Revolution. His other works include Money of the Mind, a history of borrowing and lending in America; a life of John Adams, the second president of the United States; and a biography of the great Victorian financial journalist and central bankers’ muse, Walter Bagehot.

Michael Kao has been in the investment business for 30+ years, with extensive experience analyzing and investing across a wide range of markets and asset classes — from commodities and credit to convertible arbitrage, capital structure and event-driven strategies, and distressed debt and equity.

He began his career in the early 1990s in the commodities unit at Goldman Sachs in New York. After Goldman, he joined Canyon Capital Advisors, where he was a partner and co-founder of the Canyon Arbitrage Fund. In 2002, he founded Akanthos Capital Management, a long/short value fund focused on opportunities driven by volatility, equity, and credit structure dynamics, with an emphasis on convertible and capital structure arbitrage, as well as event-driven investing.

Mike stopped actively managing external capital in 2019 and now invests primarily through his family office while writing about markets and the economy on his Substack Kaoboy Musings.

FOLLOW THE LINK to read Michael’s detailed write-up, examples, and his full thoughts on what we discussed in this episode (MUST-SEE).

Disclaimer: This interview talks about some Idiosyncratic positions that Michael currently holds and actively trades. He uses the examples to illustrate his broader points about CLO structural resilience. This is NOT investment advice, and people are reminded to do their own homework.

Joe Sarachek is one of the most seasoned voices in distressed debt. He is the Managing Partner at Sarachek Law and has spent three decades working on hundreds of bankruptcy cases.

Joe also runs Strategic Liquidity Fund, teaches bankruptcy investing at NYU Stern, and published The Distressed Investing Playbook—a book that combines case studies, strategy, and legal insight for anyone serious about distressed investing.