In this episode the writer and academic Kimberly Mack joins us from Cleveland's Rock and Roll Hall of Fame to discuss the subject of "Black rock" in the context of her 33 1/3 study of Living Colour's Time's Up.

We start by asking our guest about her childhood as the daughter of a rock-obsessed Black mother – and her experience of seeing Cheap Trick when theirs were the only Black faces in the Radio City Music Hall audience. She then discusses the "fictional categories (with real-world consequences)" of (white) rock and (Black) funk and R&B, from the earliest marketing of "race records" to the continuing genre segregation of the present day.

We trace the line from Jimi Hendrix to Bad Brains – and the racist barriers they encountered. This culminates in Kimberly's recollection of seeing Living Colour on Showtime at the Apollo in 1988 – and how itled eventually to the writing of last year's book about Time's Up.

Mark introduces clips from a 1988 audio interview with Living Colour's Vernon Reid. These lead in turn to a conversation about the late Greg Tate, mentor and inspiration to Kimberly and so many others – and the writer who co-founded the Black Rock Coalition with Reid. After namechecks for female rock icons from Labelle to Tracy Chapman, Kimberly talks about the "untold history" of marginalised American rock critics, a book about which she is currently researching.

After tributes to MC5 guitarist Wayne Kramer, Can frontman Damo Suzuki and Melody Maker/Quietus scribe Neil Kulkarni, Mark quotes from newly-added RBP library articles about David Bowie (1967), Bill Withers (1972), Alice Cooper (1975) and Porter Wagoner (1978). Jasper then wraps matters up with his thoughts about Frank Owen's 2003 report on the slaying of Run-DMC DJ Jam Master Jay and – from last year – Steve Pafford's account of the making of Gloria Gaynor's immortal disco anthem 'I Will Survive'.

Many thanks to special guest Kimberly Mack. Living Colour's Time's Up is published by Bloomsbury and available now. Visit Kimberly's website at kimberlymack.com.

Pieces discussed: Johnny Rotten, My Mom and Me, Living Colour's Time's Up (excerpt), Q&A with Jack White, David Toop on Black Rock, RJ Smith on Black Rock & Roll, Michael A. Gonzales' Tribute to Black Rock Coalition, Vernon Reid audio