Of all the education legislation passed this session, HB 1, the Universal Voucher bill, is likely to have the greatest long-term impact.

In this episode of Educating from the Heart, we are joined by Norin Dollard, PhD, of the Florida Policy Institute and Rev. Dr. Russel Meyer, Executive Director of the Florida Council of Churches.

Together, we discuss both the financial and the moral implications of Florida becoming the latest state to offer universal vouchers.

Episode 23 Show Notes:

Guests

Show Resources

Transcript

Guests

Norín Dollard, PhD, Florida Policy Institute, Senior Policy Analyst

Rev. Dr. Russell Meyer, Executive Director Florida Council of Churches 

Resources

Educating from the Heart Episode 7: Vouchers for All, Buyer Beware--In this episode you'll hear why some Florida parents regret pulling their child out of public schools for a chance to grab a private school voucher.

Universal Vouchers in the News

Florida Won't Tell you What's Wrong at its Voucher Schools -- Unless we Pay $10,413 (April 26, 2023)

Arkansas Becomes Fifth State with Universal Education Opportunity. Which State Will be Next? (March 8, 2023):

Arizona: Half of Arizona Empowerment Scholarship Account students left public schools, latest data show (Feb 13, 2023)

What Sweden's Teacher Shortage Says About Privatizing Education. (Dec. 19, 2022)

Sweden: Is Sweden proof that school choice doesn’t improve education? (Feb 28, 2018)

Billionaires v Teachers: the Koch Brothers’ plan to starve public education (Sept. 07, 2018)

Milton Friedman on Vouchers (2003)

Transcript

Andrew Spar, FEA President: Hi, this is FEA President Andrew Spar. To stay on top of all the latest news and issues impacting our public schools, be sure to follow FEA on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram. For more information on this podcast, visit www.feaweb.org/podcast.

Announcer: Sharon: You're listening to Educating from the Heart. Thank you for joining our lively conversations with teachers, support professionals, parents, and students as they share issues that matter most in our public schools. Here are your hosts, Tina Dunbar and Luke Flint.

Tina, Host: Welcome back to another episode of Educating from the Heart. I'd like to open up with a quote from Mark Twain. No man's life, liberty, or property are safe while the legislature is in session. I don't know if you've noticed it in the news, but Florida lawmakers have been busy at the state capitol because the legislative session is in full swing and public education has taken center stage. We are moving into the second half of session and look, I bet the majority of the proposals under consideration are related to education. I don't know if you've seen the press or heard people talking about that massive Ed bill that state leaders are calling transformational. So, in this episode we’re talking about Education Savings Accounts or ESAs.

State leaders have renamed them now calling them Empowerment Savings Accounts available to all Florida K through 12 students eligible to attend public schools. But some parents are now asking, where is the promise of education freedom for their child?

Luke, Host: You know, Tina, if it walks like a voucher and talks like a voucher and quacks like a voucher, it's a voucher.

I don't care what the state of Florida calls it. Here's the thing. Every child in the state of Florida deserves to have an education that challenges them to grow and learn beyond their wildest dreams. Right now, 70% of children are already eligible for vouchers, and they reject them because they know the best place to live their dream is in Florida's public schools. What this bill does is it gives an $8,000 coupon to the folk who are already sending their children to the elite private schools where tuition is $25-$30,000 a year. So, taxpayers will now be funding for Tiger Woods children, and Donald Trump's children and all the other children of multi-millionaires and billionaires to get a private education, but it's the kids who are going to neighborhood public schools that will be left behind.

Tina, Host: Yeah, and that's a good point and a serious concern for many public school supporters. That didn't stop Governor DeSantis from signing this measure into law at a school in Miami. So, the ESA allows a parent to personalize their child's learning. It is going to be available to close to 3 million students. They'll be eligible to receive this voucher, and that will potentially shift some funds from public school students.

Now, I understand the state's need to expand choice, but this might not be the best time. But you know what Luke? It is the right time for a lesson on Milton Friedman.

Luke, Host: I would love to give a history lesson on Milton Friedman, who is known as the father of vouchers. Back when Florida passed its first major voucher expansion in the 1990s, Milton Friedman was interviewed on NBC, and you can find the full text of this interview in our show notes, and among the things that he said was very explicitly that he wants every school to be a voucher school. Meaning that even those who choose to go to public school would have to use a government voucher in order to do so.

So, we often get accused of hyperbole at FEA when we say that universal vouchers will be the end of public education. But you don't have to take it from us. Take it from Milton Friedman, the father of vouchers. That was very much his idea to end public education as we know it.

Tina, Host: Government funded school vouchers, hmm, I thought choice supporters oppose big government reaching into their lives and educating their kids.

Luke, Host: You know Tina, and that is why it is so important to not just listen to what people say, but pay attention to what they do. Because these same people who claim not to like government when it helps normal everyday working people will absolutely be the first people to sign up for government assistance when it comes to getting an $8,000 coupon for their child's private school education.

As much as this issue is about funding, there is a moral component to this as well, and that's the conversation that we have with some public school advocates, both about the funding and the morality of vouchers.

NORIN DOLLARD, Florida Policy Institute: I'm Norin Dollard. I'm with the Florida Policy Institute. I am the Senior Policy Analyst for education, and I am also the Director of Kids Count, charged with providing reliable data to people who make decisions about kids in the hopes they'll make good and informed decisions. And those two roles frequently intersect; they do today. I am the product of public schools. My doctoral work, my son, same. His graduate work, you know, he went to UF, he went to public schools, the high school and all that and it was a very good experience. And I believe in public schools fundamentally in that they are, you know, really the bedrock of our democracy. I feel like they're very threatened by the current environment. HB 1, in particular I think threatens to just destroy public schools as we know them. So, I feel deeply about that. Oh, and I should say Florida Policy Institute is a nonpartisan research, policy, organization, and we work towards the goal of ensuring opportunity for all Floridians, using an economic lens.

RUSSELL MEYER, Reverend/Lutheran pastor: Yes, I'm Russell Meyer, Reverend Dr. Russell Meyer. I'm a Lutheran pastor. I pastor a small, inner city church in Jacksonville that is 145 years old. That's one of the older congregations. It's always been in The City Center, the core of Jacksonville, and I'm very proud of that.

It's seen its up and downs over the years. I'm also the Executive Director of the Florida Council of Churches, which engages the historic Protestant in black churches in Florida in common prayer and public witness. What we see in the state of Florida, in the intersection between politics and religion, those who have a religious affiliation and are receiving, on a regular basis, a message that overlies into politics, have a more present influence in policy conversations than the unaffiliated have. Because they don't have any place, they don't have a center of gravity that focuses their voice and their intentions in a way that can make it into the political process. So, when people talk about faith, in public life, they often don't really understand how that maps out.

There are very active religions in Florida. They may never, in politics, they may never actually show up at the capitol, but the place where they weigh their influence is, is really in the ballot box. Right?

Host, Tina: Yeah.

RUSSELL: So that's just sort of a lead in to say, I come to this conversation, around public schools as, Dr. Dollard said, as the bedrock of democracy. And when I talk about democracy, I define that as the will of the people. And the real question then is who are the people? Who gets to count as the people whose will gets enacted? Right? And our work in the Florida Council of Churches really strives to make every person in the state of Florida part of that people whose will gets enacted.

And what we see in our political process is really trying to limit who qualifies as the people whose will is getting enacted. Public schools are the place where people cross, you know, cultural and life experience boundaries. They cross heritage boundaries, and they learn how to interact, retaining their own identity, but living in the world with peace and love and hope and respect and dignity for others.

And no other educational system in the state of Florida, other than public schools, actually prepare all of the people in the state of Florida to be active in a way in which the will of the people could be enacted.

Tina, Host: So there's a belief among some parents and legislators that school choice is good for Florida public schools,

A growing number of Florida parents are expressing their opposition and concerns over the increasing list of books that are being removed from Florida public school classroom and district libraries. They say it’s another attack on education that could impede student success and push more educators out of the classroom.In this episode, you'll hear how these parents are mobilizing support and fighting back within their local communities. And you'll learn what you can do to become an education activist and join the movement to regain safe schools and the freedom for students to read, learn, and thrive.

Episode 22 Show Notes:

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GuestsRaegan Miller: Public School Advocate and Parent Activistemail RaeganFollow Raegan on TwitterRead Raegan's column, Stand up for Our Public Schools, Don't be Distracted by Fake OutrageJabari Hosey: Parent & President of Families for Safe Schools-Brevard Countyemail JabariRead Jabari's column, Gov. DeSantis talks of freedom while Florida's schools and children sufferJen Cousins: Parent & Education Activist, Co-Founder of Florida Freedom to Read Project Watch Jen's testimony about academic censorship in Florida to the House Oversight and Reform Subcommittee on Civil Rights Watch Florida Mom is on a Mission to end Book Banning 

ResourcesPEN America report shows Florida has 2nd highest number of school-related book bansFlorida Library Association (FLA) press statement in support of the freedom to read and the right to free speech. FL Freedom to Read Project on Youtube Public Voices for Public Schools

TranscriptAndrew Spar, FEA President: Hi, this is FEA President Andrew Spar. To stay on top of all the latest news and issues impacting our public schools. Be sure to follow FEA on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram. For more information on this podcast, visit www.feaweb.org/podcast.Announcer: Sharon: You're listening to Educating from the Heart. Thank you for joining our lively conversations with. Support professionals, parents, and students as they share issues that matter most in our public schools. Here are your hosts, Tina Dunbar and Luke Flynt.Luke, Host: Hello and welcome to another episode of Educating From the Heart. This is Luke. I'm here along with my co-host. And I'm just wondering, Tina, for your children, was there ever a time as a parent that you wish they had fewer books available to them in the classroom?Tina, Host: No. (laughter) Most parents recognize that reading is important to learning.In fact, most parents would make sure that they, their child has every book possible. Because one of the most important things about, uh, student development or, or learning is exposure. And exposing your children to as many things as possible and sitting down and talking with them about these. That's, that's how you help children mature and grow and develop.Luke, Host: So along those lines, as a parent, did you ever wish that the governor came in and told your child that he could not take an AP class? In whatever it is that he wanted to take.Tina, Host: No. No. Especially if it's an elective class. No, no. That's not right. How I, I don't under, as a parent, I do not understand how an elected official can dictate what my child can take and not take what, what courses?I don't understand what he's attempting to accomplish here. He, he is stifling education in Florida. Basically, he is hurting children's future by doing this, and, uh, I, I'm not really sure why this is happening. We know that there are thousands and thousands of students throughout the state that don't have books to read in their classrooms. Now teachers are being told to remove books out of their classrooms. That's crazy. Who has ever heard of a classroom without books in it and resources to help students?Luke, Host: You know, I don't fully understand it either, but what I do know is that the majority of parents, Tina, agree with you.They want their children to have access to books. They want their children to have to be in a classroom with a classroom library, and they want their children to learn the full history of the United States, the good, the bad, and the ugly.Because the only way that we can fix our mistakes as a nation is if we are able to fully reckon with them. Recently we sat down with three parents to talk about what they want for their children and how it is quite different from the agenda that Governor DeSantis is pushing.RAEGAN MILLER, Parent Advocate: I'm Raegan Miller. I'm a parent. I have two kids. I have a middle schooler and an elementary schooler, and I am a parent advocate. I was involved, honestly, I got recruited to join the PTA at parent orientation before my child even joined kindergarten. I jumped in full force. And then I started working, you know, on the recess movement several years ago and really got to know the process of advocacy and got to know our legislators, and I got more involved in PTA and the advocacy piece of pta. And then I've, you know, continued.I see the amazing things that I've always been involved in the classroom. I see the amazing things being done in our public schools, and my dream is that, you know, everybody can see our public schools the way that I see them, and that I think the way most parents who are in the public school systems is that we have amazing teachers, and we have amazing students, and the sky is the limit for what we can do here in Florida. And I think what we want to see is we want to hold our legislators, our governor to the fire and say that we want that high quality, safe education that's guaranteed in our constitution.JABARI HOLSEY, President of Families for Safe Schools: Hi, I'm Jabari Holsey, parent of three elementary students. I never thought I would ever be needed or would be in a situation where I had to be a parent activist outside of an activist for my children in supporting our schools. But I'm currently president of Families for Safe Schools.One of the founders for that organization realized there was a need during this climate that has kind of overtaken our public schools as long as well as our legislation all the way up the chain, and so we're basically here. I'm here as a parent and as a leader of this organization to make sure that our public schools stay strong, keep progressing because we have a lot of room, and we've always had a lot of room, for growth in our public schools to be inclusive, to have accurate history, to make sure that we have equity in our schools. And I'm here to continue that progress and not let that get stifled with political agendas.JEN COUSINS, CO-FOUNDER OF FREEDOM TO READ PROJECT:  Hi, I'm Jen Cousins, and I am a parent advocate. I have four kids in the OCPS system: two in elementary, one in middle, and one in high school. And I am one of the co-founders of the Florida Freedom to Read Project, which we formed last year. Oh gosh, no, I guess now it's officially almost two years ago.In reaction to the book bans that we saw coming once Moms for Liberty had backed off of the mask mandates when DeSantis made them illegal, their next step was going after books. And we saw it happen in our community, and we weren't going to allow them to continue on with it. So, we're holding our school boards accountable.Our organization is tracking what books get challenged because we know that there are very specific themes that are being challenged, specifically LGBTQ and BIPOC titles. And you know, we want to make sure that the kids in Florida who attend public schools get the right education, get to learn the right kind of history, get to learn about marginalized communities. We don't want them to learn what DeSantis has on his agenda for stifling our education. And so my goal ultimately is to make sure that my youngest, who is in first grade, is able to graduate public school in Florida and have a quality education.TINA DUNBAR, HOST: During the past election, the Parent Bill of Rights was a major theme in the primary as well as the general election. You are standing up for public schools and you're standing up for parents who want their children to attend public education. As a parent, do you feel that this law stands up for you, support your goals?JABARI: I think it was something that was unnecessary. I think parent involvement is, we know it's key. It's key to the success of our students. And parents, in my history of working with my schools and, and being in public schools, parents have always had that opportunity to be involved. They always had a voice, they always had an opportunity to work with their teachers, their principals, administrators attend school board meetings, all of the above.And I think that Parent Bill of Rights was to double down on a political agenda to create what one of these boogeyman where it's like, “Hey, you know, parents are being blocked from being involved.” And it's not true. So, it's difficult for me to take a deep dive into it because I really believe it was an unnecessary thing that has now created more problems than what was already there from the beginning. So that, that's my take.JEN: I think what people need to realize is that parents always had rights in Florida schools, you know, well before this, you always had the right to say, “I don't want my kid to check this book out of the library.”You always had the right to go to your teacher and say, “I don't want my kid to read this book as part of an assignment.” And your teacher would give you a different book that your kid could do an assignment on. Parents have never been kept out of schools. This was completely unnecessary, and it was 100% a targeted attack on our marginalized communities.And we're trying to stifle our children's learning, and we're trying to not only stifle their learning,

Megan Betche has been teaching since 2004. Much has changed during that time; she notes that it is now harder than ever before to strike a work-life balance. The need to see a positive change led Betche to step outside her comfort zone and run for political office.In this episode of Educating from the Heart, we talk with Betche about her successes, her challenges, and her view of what public service should be about. 

Episode 21 Show Notes:

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GuestMegan Betche, Seminole County ESE teacher

ResourcesSee Educators Run Candidate Training, NEAHundreds of Teachers Ran for Office, Education WeekMegan Betche Candidate Profile, Orlando Sentinel Seminole Soil and Water Conservation District  

TranscriptAndrew Spar, FEA President: Hi, this is FEA president Andrew Spar. To stay on top of all the latest news and issues impacting our public schools, be sure to follow FEA on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram. For more information on this podcast, visit feaweb.org/podcast Sharon Nesvig: You're listening to Educating from the Heart. Thank you for joining our lively conversations with teachers, support professionals, parents, and students, as they share issues that matter most in our public schools. Here are your hosts, Tina Dunbar and Luke Flynt. Tina Dunbar, Host: Welcome back to another edition of Educating from the Heart. Thanks for listening. Luke, I have a puzzling question, which I believe you'd be able to provide some clarity. We've recently completed local, state and congressional elections, where we asked educators to identify and select candidates who support students and public education. We urged them to talk with their family and friends to choose the best candidates for their schools for teachers and for support staff, and to talk with those who have some knowledge of the ongoing issues and concerns that educators face. Well, to my surprise, I received pushback from some who stated that school employees should not be actively involved in politics.Well, Luke, that doesn't make sense, especially when you consider every decision made in public education begins with an elected official. I just don't get it. Everyone employed in public service, especially education need to be engaged in the political process to actively advocate for themselves, for their profession and their livelihood.Luke Flynt, Host: You know, Tina, when I started my teaching career, I didn't see myself as a very political person, but what happened is I realized that the over-testing that my students were facing was a policy choice, that my low pay was a policy choice, that Florida being last in the nation and student funding is a policy choice.And when we look at today's current environment, from book banning to the attacks on LGBTQ students and staff, those are policy decisions. And whenever there is a policy decision that negatively impacts you, you really have three choices: number one, continue to support the people who are making those policy choices.And for me, that was untenable. Number two, just go in the classroom and teach, and this is what a lot of teachers like to do, and ignore the policy choices. But that was untenable too, because it matters to me more than just what happens in my classroom, in a state where all children can thrive, we really have to make choice number three, which is to actively, consistently, year-round, oppose any policy that hurts children and lift up policies that support every child in Florida.Tina: Yeah, that's it. It's those decisions and policy choices directed by politicians that have left many teachers and support staff feeling ignored, undervalued, and unsupported.Many of our past guests have mentioned this as a major concern for all educators. You know, teachers enjoy working with their students. They look forward to it daily, but navigating the classroom has become a real challenge for them and wrestling the politics of education.  I understand teachers wanna just teach, but all school employees must understand they've got to get politically involved because these decisions spill over into the rest of our lives.Luke: I think you were spot on, Tina. In order to keep experienced teachers in the profession, they absolutely must feel like they have a voice. Unfortunately, right now, too many teachers feel that politicians aren't listening to them. Or even worse, that certain politicians are actively trying to undermine them.Tina: And that leads us to our guest, an educator from Seminole County who has spent the last two decades instructing students. She'll share her experiences in the classroom and explain why it's time to move on with the second career in politics.Megan Betche, Seminole County Teacher: My name is Megan Betche. I'm a teacher in Seminole County, and I'm considered a transition resource teacher. So, I work with our 18 to 21 year-olds on job skills in the community. I always say we don't graduate to the couch, we graduate to our community.So, I started teaching in 2004 in Volusia County, started at elementary. Left Volusia County to go to Seminole County in 2010 and taught middle school there until 2016. So, 2016 until now is this transition program. All of it has been in special education. So, I've taught elementary, middle, and technically high school now for special ed.Why I still do it is because of the kids. That's where my passion is. I think I learn more from them every day than I can actually teach them. So, every day is, you don't know what you may go into, because it's special education. They're nine times out of 10 they're happy, they want to be there, they're motivated, they want to learn. And so, it makes me want to do my job better.We're all used to working above and beyond or doing more with less. But this doing more with less and working shorthanded has taken away some of my, I don't want to  say livelihood, but you know, those extracurriculars and the fun and all of those things. Because now instead of working a 10-hour day, it might be a 12, 13 hour day to get done what I need to get done.And it's easy for somebody else to say, “Oh, just turn that off and do it the next day.” Well, if grades are. Or an IEP is due, or, “Oh, I gotta get back to that parent. Let me make a phone call, send another email.” You don't just not do that. I think that's what's made it really hard there is that short-staffed, having more students, more responsibilities with less and just trying to help each other.Tina: How has that impacted your personal life?Megan: So, that's interesting. But I don't go visit my family as much. I don't go and do everything I want to go do. I'm a scuba diver. It's one of my, it's my favorite hobby. Even during Covid and before Covid, I could at least die once or twice a month. But now, because there's so much going on, taking that time away from trying to get work done and making sure I'm doing the job I should be, I can't go and do that like I used to.Tina: There's no balance.Megan: The balance is gone. The balance is definitely gone, and I think that's what some of those new teachers are starting to see. They're starting to see the burnout happening. For those of us who, although I'm considered a veteran teacher, I've been teaching 18 years, I'm still pretty young. I still enjoy going out and doing things, but I'm exhausted.I do enjoy having a day of where, you know, you can stay in your jammies all day, hang out at home, not have to worry about anything. And those are few and far between now because of it. I would also say those new teachers getting into the profession, they're trying to balance it all as well. They're just getting used to having a job, having these personal life things, whether it's family, spouse, children, all of those things.And some of them are leaving the profession because they don't have that balance. They don't have the support. Some of those new teachers weren't reappointed because they're not able to get their work done. You know, they could have, if they didn't have the 17 other things that we have to do. It's hard.Tina: You mentioned being able to help your colleagues.Megan: Yes.Tina: Tell me what that's like. It's gotta be tough to even do that because everybody's struggling.Megan: Oh it is. Um, hoping colleagues is just,  sometimes you have that kiddo in your classroom that might be misbehaving and you send them out with that little post-it note that has something like, “Hey, go do this errand.” Because you know they need to get their wiggles out and things like that. And yes, that's more elementary way, sometimes it's the same people do those extracurricular activities, so you're like, “Oh, I'll do afternoon pickup so you can actually get grades done.” It's just helping each other out because that's what you want done for you.It's helping that new teacher that is like, “What do I need to do with this lesson plan?” These lesson plans are crazy. They drive some bus nuts sometimes. Um, being in Seminole County, I do work closely with some of our bus drivers and support staff, and to do my job, I have to have my job coaches, my paraprofessionals, those things.And what's really hard there is that sometimes like yes, you can pull them, put them in a classroom for the day, but then that means I'm on my own all day. So, sometimes helping out is making yourself shorthanded.Tina: Where do you get support from? You support colleagues, but you need support also.Megan: Yeah. Um, I, and that's been interesting. I think I've, this year I've really had to learn how to ask for help. Before sometimes people just jump in and help you, and other times they're already there. You know, they know that, look, they know that, um, expression because we have had teacher shortages,

Like most Floridians, Charlie Crist and Karla Hernandez believe every child in Florida should have the freedom to learn and to thrive. Together, they have a plan to improve the lives of Florida's students and educators alike. In this month’s episode of Educating from the Heart, we talk with them about how they will increase educators’ pay and retirement benefits and lower healthcare costs while also making sure educators have the time, resources and freedom they need to do their jobs.

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Guests Congressman Charlie Crist, candidate for governor United Teachers of Dade President Karla Hernandez, candidate for lieutenant governor  

Resources Crist/Hernandez Freedom to Learn plan'Parental Rights' movement leaves out these Florida parents  (USA Today)Ron DeSantis targets teachers with demagoguing and fear-mongering (Florida Politics) Gov. Ron DeSantis leads a nationwide shift to politicize school board races (Georgia Public Broadcasting)Protecting Public Education in the 2022 Election (NEA)

Transcript Andrew Spar, FEA President: Hi, this is FEA president Andrew Spar. To stay on top of all the latest news and issues impacting our public schools, be sure to follow FEA on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram. For more information on this podcast, visit FEAweb.org/podcast. Sharon Nesvig: You're listening to Educating from the Heart. Thank you for joining our lively conversations with support professionals, parents and students as they share issues that matter most in our public schools. Here are your hosts, Tina Dunbar and Luke Flynt. Tina Dunbar, Host: Welcome back to Educating from the Heart. I'm Tina here with Luke, and we've been spending a lot of time thinking about voting, and we're watching for our vote by mail ballots. Luke, have you received your mail ballot?Luke Flynt, Host: I am so excited, Tina, because not only have I received my vote by mail ballot, on my ballot are two people at the top of the ticket who we know will support students, educators, and public education. We sat down with them recently for episode 20 of our podcast with Charlie Crist and Karla Hernandez.  Tina: FEA President Andrew Spar kicks off our podcast conversation.Andrew Spar, FEA President: So, it is so exciting today to have the next governor of the state of Florida join us, Charlie Crist. And as an educator what we know about Charlie Crist is when he was governor, he chose to stand on the side of teachers, staff, and students in the state of Florida at a really crucial point in public education in the state of Florida. He understands the importance of pay, being able to pay your rent, pay for your bills. He understands the importance of making sure you have the right to do your job in the classroom.He's someone who wants to stop the teacher and staff bashing and lift up those of us who work in our public schools. And so much so that he put a teacher on the ticket. So, Congressman Crist, why'd you put a teacher on the ticket?Congressman, Charlie Crist: Because I'm smart. No, seriously, Andrew, thank you so much. It's great to be with you and your membership and teachers all across the state and, you know, people that help out in so many other ways in the cafeteria and helping get our kids to school safely.You know, we have a shortage right now, 9,000 when you couple teachers and support staff together. And that's just a crying shame to me. And by picking Karla to be the lieutenant governor, the next lieutenant governor of Florida, I wanted to make a statement about how important teachers are, the difference they make in our lives and the lives of our children is significant, to say the least.And so, I thought that by picking somebody of her caliber with the great experience and breadth and depth of her experience that she has. Being a teacher, yes, but being a special ed teacher, as well really hit my heart, and you and I have talked about that, and it shows me the goodness of Karla Hernandez.And that representation on this ticket, I'm enormously proud of. Of course, Val Demings, our nominee for the United States Senate. I think we have a great opportunity this year to do what's right for Florida, to do what's right for teachers, to do what's right for public education.I'm a public school kid. I graduated from St. Pete High. I graduated from one of our great state universities, Florida State. And I just think we need to reinvest in the foundation of equal opportunity in America, and that to me is public education.Tina: Okay. Thank you very much. There have been a lot of changes in education policy over the past four years. Please assess Governor DeSantis’s leadership in education, and what makes your plan the right plan right now for students and educator?Charlie: Well, first and foremost, he's been a disaster. You know, I don't think he, uh, cares about education. I don't think he care specifically about public education. And that's heartbreaking to me. As I said, you know, I'm a public school kid myself, but more than that, you know, I had three sisters growing up, and two of my three sisters were public school teachers in Pinellas County.My father, although a family physician, served on the Pinellas County School Board and was chairman of the board. I minored in education at FSU. I mean, it's in my DNA. I can't help it. And so I am drawn to making sure that we're doing what's right for our kids and our teachers support staff throughout the state of Florida.I mean, you have a great president, Andrew's an amazing man, and, you know, the membership, you all deserve to be treated with respect, with decency. So that's my plan is to do exactly that, to make sure that we raise your salary. You know, we're the third largest state in America, and we're paying our teachers 48th or 49th out of 50 states. That's embarrassing. And it's gotta stop. And with the Crist Administration, Crist-Hernandez administration, it will stop and working with FEA and your membership, I mean, everybody get out and vote. It is so critically important.And to women: he's trying to take away your right to choose. In fact, he's already done it. He signed a bill that was horrific. Horrific. And doesn't even have exceptions for rape or incest. I mean, that's barbaric. So, I know the women vote's gonna be huge this year. It already has been in Kansas and in Sarah Palin's race in Alaska. I mean, you know, two very red states. And yet the women vote turned them both blue. It's remarkable. It's gonna happen here in Florida in 2022.Luke: All right. So for those of us who have been around for a while, I started teaching in the early two thousands, and I remember your tenure as education commissioner, so appreciate that. And I was still teaching in the classroom when you vetoed Senate Bill six, which was just a, a wonderful way of showing that you understood what teachers and support staff needed. Looking forward, what will your first official action be as governor when it comes to education?Charlie: Well, when it comes to education is returning respect to educators, because that doesn't exist right now. I mean, we're at such a low point, and I can only imagine the frustration you experienced, Andrew. But you know, just by showing the proper respect. I mean, when I was a Republican governor, right after I got inaugurated, where'd I go? FEA, you know and had the opportunity to sit down with some great people at the time. And they're like, “Wow, you know, what's the Republican doing here?”Well, like I said, I'm a public-school kid. You know, it didn't matter what my party was, what mattered is where my heart was, and it's always been with educators and it always will be. I have committed in this campaign that on day one of the Crist administration, I'm gonna sign an executive order to protect a woman's right to choose in all 67 counties in Florida. It's that important; it's that critical. I think it's very important for that to be the first act that I take as your next governor.Luke: Our current governor seems to have outsourced a lot of his education policy. You know, whether it is the civics curriculum to Hillsdale College and Michigan, or, you know, to the Heritage Foundation or these other right wing think tanks.  When you are governor, who will you listen to and why?Charlie: Educators, I'll listen to. I'll listen to Karla, I'll listen to you and Tina, and we'll get it right, you know, because we know what's right, what needs to be done. You apply common sense to a problem that we've been facing now for the past 12 years, frankly. And reverse it as quickly as we can rewrite the budget.You know, this was the highest budget in the history of Florida this past year, a hundred and ten billion dollars, and he still couldn't get education funding any higher than 48th or 49th in the country. So, we got a lot to do. It's gonna be a heck of a lot of fun doing it. It's always fun doing the right thing, and that's what this campaign's all about: Do the right thing.Tina: I'm sure you've heard from many teachers who have expressed concerns over learning loss. How would your plan help students and teachers rebound from the past several years of chaos?Charlie: It'll start with not banning books. How's, how's that for a beginning start then? I mean, you can't make this stuff up. It's incredible. What are they gonna do? Burn 'em next? You know, I mean, I sit back and I see my opponent, and I can't believe the crazy stuff he does. You know, not only in education, but, but let's say immigration.I mean, just recently we saw where he chartered two jets, took them to San Antonio, Texas.

We kick off this year in conversation with Alex McKean, an art teacher from St. Johns County. As you’ll hear her explain, even pre-kindergarten art class is not immune from the culture wars certain politicians are waging on public education.Nonetheless, she has a hopeful vision for the future and works to make sure her art classroom is a place where all students have fun while learning new skills and gain confidence in themselves.

Episode 19 Show Notes:

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GuestAlex McKean, Art teacher, St. Johns County

ResourcesArts Curriculum – St. Johns County School District (stjohns.k12.fl.us)Visual Arts Resources (fldoe.org)Arts in Education - Division of Arts and Culture - Florida Department of State (myflorida.com)Arts Education Matters: We Know, We Measured It (Opinion) (edweek.org)The Arts and Achievement in At-Risk Youth: Findings from Four Longitudinal StudiesNew evidence of the benefits of arts education (brookings.edu)

TranscriptAndrew Spar, FEA President: Hi, this is FEA president Andrew Spar. To stay on top of all the latest news and issues impacting our public schools, be sure to follow FEA on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram. For more information on this podcast, visit feaweb.org/podcast  Sharon Nesvig: You're listening to Educating from the Heart. Thank you for joining our lively conversations with teachers, support professionals, parents, and students, as they share issues that matter most in our public schools. Here are your hosts, Tina Dunbar and Luke Flynt.  Tina Dunbar: Welcome back to another new season of Educating from the Heart. I'm Tina, here with my cohost, Luke. And we’re kicking off the start of a brand-new school year, as close to 3 million Florida students head back to their classrooms. And I bet you can relate to this, Luke. This is an exciting and busy time of the year for parents, students, and for teachers too.Luke Flynt: You are absolutely right, Tina. As a teacher, there was nothing more exciting to me than the start of a new school year. the first day of school was one of my favorite days of the entire calendar year. It was actually my favorite time of the entire calendar year. There was just no other time where you have that sense of joy and hope and optimism of what a new year can bring. I also really looked forward to the start of a new school year as a student.In particular, I looked forward to my band class with Mr. Sammons. He did such a great job of creating a sense of community, a sense of camaraderie that we all wanted to be back together at the start of a new school year.Tina: That sounds like a really wonderful experience, you know, as a parent, it's all about preparing your child for school and completing all the paperwork at the beginning of the school year. And with the recent changes to the law, I anticipate parents will face numerous permission slips this year to allow use of a Band-Aid to lunch selections, even nicknames a student may share with their classmates.Times have really changed, Luke, but my best memories date back to when I was a student. Back to school was filled with so much anticipation. You wanted to check out the new students, the changes in the school building, and the teachers leading your classes. My art teacher Marilyn Price still stands out. She taught me to spend time in reflection and how to process events in the world around me. You know, back then teachers were free to openly talk with their students and answer questions that made you think and expand your curiosity.I truly believe her influence helped me to excel in school. You know, these days, Luke, we really downplay the importance of art and music to student learning and achievement. They weren't afraid to answer questions. I truly believe that sense of freedom and security helped her to help me excel in school.Luke: Oh, it absolutely does. Again, speaking as a former teacher, many of the best lessons that I ever taught came from students’ natural curiosity. And if I had said, “No, I'm sorry. We have to stick to this script or to this page. I can't answer your question.” Just the number of learning opportunities my students would've missed out on are countless. When you talk about the importance of building relationships with students, right? We know that students don't learn from people that they don't like.It is so vitally important that we have that relationship building. And that is, you know, one of the things that all this legislation is intentionally trying to harm, the relationship between the student and the teacher.Tina: And that's why we sat down with an art teacher from St. John's County named Alex McKean. We spoke with her over the summer about her experience over the past school year and her hopes for this upcoming year in light of some of the new restrictions educators are facing.Luke: And, you know, Tina, I don't think it's just a coincidence that when you and I look back on our schooling, we fondly remember an art teacher. Just like Ms. Price that you mentioned and Mr. Salmons for me, Alex really tries to make sure that her students learn art, of course, but not just art. That art is a vehicle for her students to better understand themselves, better understand the world and their role in it.Alex McKean, Art Teacher, St. Johns County: Hi, I'm Alex McKean. I'm from St. Augustine, Florida. I teach elementary school art. I've been doing that for one year. Before that, I taught four years of high school art. This next year will be my sixth year, but I went from high school to elementary, which is a big difference. So, I really feel like this past year was my first year all over again.Tina: You're starting all over again. Wow.  Alex: Yes. I mean worth it. I love them, but definitely… I teach pre-K pre-pre-K through fifth grade. They call them PPEs. I don't know why, but, three-year-olds-Luke: I think I have a good idea.Alex: Three-year-olds to twelve-year-olds. And I used to teach 14 to 19 year olds. And just developmentally the difference is exponential, and they put these three-year-olds and four-year-olds together in this classroom, and they can't do the same things. So, really I spent this year trying to figure out what they can do, because I didn't know. I was like, okay: you can't read, you don't know your shapes, you can't spell your name, you don't really know what a line is. Trying to explain what a line is, is harder than it sounds. Because it's just one of those things that you forget how you learned it. So how do you teach that? How do you teach what a color is?Tina: Well, I would think it would be particularly more difficult now to teach a three year old because, if my math is correct, their first year of life was during 2020.Alex: Yep. So they're very different children,Tina: Right? Because they were not exposed to a lot of things that normal child would be exposed to just going out.Alex: Yeah.Tina: Just experiencing the world. It’s gonna make it difficult.Alex: It, it was challenging. And even for the rest of the grades, like second graders. They hadn't really had a real school year before. So, like getting in line, you know, you can't mute them in real life. So, like getting used to those routines of school that you just sort of assume they know inherently, but that's not how that works. You know, behaviors aren't always kids acting out it's them not knowing how to, I don't want to say behave, but like how to do it the right way. And so you have to teach them how you want them to be. Because otherwise they're not being bad. They just don't know how to be.Tina: It's interesting you mentioned that because one of the things you hear from many teachers is behavior is a real problem across the board, and you approach it from, it's not that they're being bad, they just, you need to set the expectations.Alex: You need to teach them how to be good.Tina: No matter what age then.Alex: Exactly. And you know, at the end of the day, they're children, and we are teachers and we are there to teach them, whether it's art, whether it's how to tie their shoes, you know, whether it's what a cloud is. You know, you're there to teach them not only about your subject matter but about life. And I know that's a bit of a sticky situation in today's day and age, but, you know, that's our job is to prepare them for the world. And that's all we try to do, that and love them.Tina: Do you feel today's sticky situation gets in the way of what you need to do?Alex: I, I do. Um, and I hate to say that, because I love teaching so much, but I do feel that a lot of the issues with teaching now are because we feel these pressures from society. It's not even society. It's people that don't know our profession. We're the teachers. We went to college for this, we know what we're doing in our classroom, and we want to do what's best for kids. And so, they don't understand how these laws and these different regulations and rules affect or how they are going to be enacted in the classroom.Like they look all well and good on paper, but the actual ramifications of them. don't work in the classroom. It shouldn't be all about politics. You know, you shouldn't be making these decisions about an entire profession based on a feeling or something you heard from your cousin's friend.Tina: Do you feel the state has overreached into curriculum?Alex: Yes. I mean, it's so crazy because teachers read these things and we're like, who told them this was a good idea? No teacher told them this was a good idea, for a fact. No one in the classroom was like, yeah, yeah, yeah that's, that's what we should do. Because we know that's not going to be positive in practice. It's just not. And it hasn't been,Luke: So, I could very clearly imagine,

As the third Covid-impacted school year draws to a close, we sat down with two experienced teachers to get their take on this school year and the importance of cultivating positive relationships with parents and students.It's a heartwarming discussion that highlights the passion and dedication of Florida's teachers and shines a light on the value of experience. 

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GuestsMorgan Mousley, English teacher, Creekside High School, St. Augustine Megan Young, English teacher, Tocio Creek High School, St. AugustineResourcesJoin your local union Future Educators of AmericaFEA's 2022 Legislative Session Report 

TranscriptAndrew Spar, FEA President: Hi, this is FEA President, Andrew Spar. To stay on top of all the latest news and issues impacting our public schools, be sure to follow FEA on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram. For more information on this podcast, visit FEAweb.org/podcast.Sharon Nesvig: You're listening to Educating from the Heart. Thank you for joining our lively conversations with support professionals, parents and students as they share issues that matter most in our public schools. Here are your hosts, Tina Dunbar and Luke Flynt.Tina Dunbar, Host: Hello, and welcome back to Educating from the Heart. I'm Tina here with my co-host, Luke.Luke Flynt, Host: Hey, Tina.  Tina: Well, Luke, you know, May is a very special month for teachers, and I'm not referring to the end of the school year or summer vacation. I'm talking about a special event that encourages us to pause for a moment and reflect on the people who work in our schools and contribute so much to our children's lives.And while that moment is only a week showing teachers and all educators that we appreciate their work is an act that needs to occur throughout the school year. Of course, Luke, we all know that showing a little gratitude and appreciation really goes a long way.Luke: It really does. And showing that appreciation is important, perhaps now more than ever because when you talk with teachers, you will hear that so many of them, especially experienced educators, feel that this year has been the most difficult of their careers. Between the stress of teaching during a global pandemic, the seemingly endless attacks from certain politicians, outrageous testing policies that negatively impact teaching and outside groups trying to form a wedge between parents and teachers, I can certainly understand why this year has been so hard.Tina: And to complicate the situation, some parents who homeschooled their children during the pandemic now believe they know the teaching experience and understand the pressure points and frustrations that classroom teachers face.  Yet during many of our podcasts, Luke, you know our listeners heard from teachers who shared their feelings of being misunderstood, unheard and above all disrespected. Teachers have told us one of the main reasons they walk away is poor working conditions, unreasonable demands, and an unrealistic expectation that they face each and every day. You know, if we really care about our educators, then we ought to recognize working under these conditions could make the job unbearable for even the best teachers.Luke: Oh, absolutely. It is important to remember though, despite all of the loud voices screaming at school board meetings, the rhetoric coming from the governor's office, parents still rate their public schools very highly, and they have respect and admiration for their children's teachers.Tina: And that is so true. As we move through the waning weeks of the school year, we figured this would be the perfect time for our listeners to meet a couple of exceptional educators from St. John’s County. And they are on a mission to help their students and parents. Morgan Mousley and Megan Young share their recipe for building positive relationships with parents and the impact that's having on their classrooms.Morgan Mousley, St. Johns English Teacher: I'm Morgan Mousley. I work at Creekside High School. I am on the bargaining team, and I teach ninth and twelfth grade English.Luke: All right. How many years you've been teaching?Morgan: I have been teaching for 12 years.Tina: What inspires you to continue teaching?Morgan: I think it's like that moment that you get to that the light bulb comes for the kid. Right? And they've learned something new, and you know, you don't get it every day, but when it does come, you're like, okay, this is it.In addition, the connection that you make with certain kids, right? Like, and you can always tell it's the kid that maybe doesn't have a connection outside of school that like that connection has, you know, made their year. Again, it's not every kid and it's not every day and it's not every year, but like when it does happen, it's enough to like make up for all of the other stuff that we have to deal with as a teacher.Megan Young, St. Johns English Teacher: My name is Megan Young. I teach English at, Tocoi Creek High School in St. Augustine, Florida. And I've also been teaching for 12 years. I would say that the reason I became a teacher is because when I was growing up I definitely felt like I benefited from the consistency, the love and the support of all my educators when I was growing up, and I wanted to give back to that system that supported me so much.Luke: So, you had mentioned what keeps you going is those light bulb moments, share one or two examples, specific examples of when either that light bulb has gone off and you were like really proud of a student or a connection that you've made that's meaningful.Morgan: This year I've had one. I have a 12th grade girl who an IEP [Individualized Education Program], and it's for a really like extreme anxiety. And so, at the very beginning of the year, I read her IEP and I was like, “Oh God, this girl sounds like she's going to be a nightmare in class,” because it was like, “she may, you know, have like complete meltdowns in class. You may need to like, leave the classroom. You just need to let her go.” And I'm like, “oh God,” like, I dunno, like I'm just preparing myself mentally. She was the most delightful, like sweet young lady that I could just tell, you know, suffered from extreme anxiety.And one of the first, it was like the first couple of weeks of school, I had an ESL [English as a Second Language] girl in that class who barely spoke any English, like, and I could tell every time she's very good at reading and, you know, she can process and it takes her a while, but like conversational English, she doesn't know what's going on in class, and I always feel so bad. So, you know, after I'm giving directions, I'll always try and go over and explain, but the girl with extreme anxiety sat next to the girl with ESL. And so, she would notice like when I didn't, you know, I was going to another student and didn't have time to explain, she would take the ESL girl and like very slowly explain to her and make sure she knew what was going on.I was like, “wow this girl, I just love her.” And then the next day, another girl had a complete meltdown in class, something, I don't know, some sort of drama. So, I let her go to the bathroom and take care of her stuff. And I was walking around, passing by the girl with anxiety, and she had left a note on the girl who had to leave’s desk and was just like, “I hope you have a better day. I'm so sad that these things are going on.”And at Creekside we have a character counts program where like, we're supposed to give them little notes that say “Character Counts” and they get to turn it in for a piece of candy. And then there's like a drawing at the end of the month for like a bigger prize. Sometimes it's like tickets to the football game or, you know, some sort of gift card places around town have donated. And so, I just knelt down by her desk and I was like, “I've just noticed that your character is amazing,” you know? And I told her about the ESL girl, and then I noticed her note.  And she went home that day, and apparently she was having the worst day ever, and I made her day. And her mom sent me this really long email that was like, you know, “Teachers so often don't understand my daughter, and you seem to understand her and I appreciate it. And like, you're amazing. And I just love your teaching style. And she talks about you all the time.”And I was like, well, this is why I do it. Right? And to me that was like not a big thing, but to that girl, it was, you know, it just made her year, and we've had a great year together this year because of it. So. Yeah, that's what, that's what keeps me going.Luke:  I taught middle school for 12 years, and sometimes I wondered like how different are my kids from high schoolers? And it sounds like not at all, very similar issues.Morgan: Yes. There's still the drama in high school. There's still all of that. I think they handled it a little bit better than they did in junior high, but yeah, it's still very much.And yeah, it's weird. I'm like that “Character Counts” sounds so ridiculous for these seniors in high school. They love it. I gave another girl “Character Counts” because she was telling me about this drama she was having with her friends, and she was telling me how she was sticking up for her friend and telling her to like stick up for herself and in these wonderful ways. And I was like, “I just think that that's so mature of you. I'm giving you this “Character Counts” card. And she was like, oh, and then like months later she opens her folder and her “Character Counts” card is still in her folder. And I was like, “you were supposed to turn that in for candy.

While education should not be partisan, it is most definitely political. From dictating what can, and cannot, be taught to developing laws that constrain pay raises for experienced teachers, politicians have inserted themselves into every aspect of public education in Florida.For the past few legislative sessions, members of FEA’s Republican Cadre have been working to build relationships with their legislators in the hopes of influencing legislation in a positive way.On this episode of Educating from the Heart, we sit down with three members of the cadre to discuss their challenges and successes and the importance of every educator joining in union to advocate for what is best for students.

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GuestsMary Rivera, Marion County Middle School ELA teacher Shiela Watson, Suwannee County PreK-MTSS Coordinator Patrick Strong, President Okaloosa Education Staff Professionals 

ResourcesFEA's 2022 Voter ToolkitLearn more about the 2022 legislative session by read FEA's 2022 End of Session ReportLook up your elected officials hereFEA's 2022 Legislative Agenda

Transcript Andrew Spar, FEA President: Hi, this is FEA president Andrew Spar. To stay on top of all the latest news and issues impacting our public schools, be sure to follow FEA on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram. For more information on this podcast, visit  feaweb.org/podcastSharon Nesvig: You're listening to Educating from the Heart. Thank you for joining our lively conversations with teachers, support professionals, parents, and students, as they share issues that matter most in our public schools. Here are your hosts, Tina Dunbar and Luke Flynt.Tina Dunbar, Host: Welcome back! I’m Tina here with Luke. So good to be with you again.Luke Flynt, Host: Always great to be with you, Tina. We have made it through another legislative session. Again, this year education was a focus of the governor and of lawmakers and the partisan divide was quite evident, especially when it comes to issues dealing with race, gender, and sexual orientation.Tina: Yes. This session was a bit unusual, especially being a year in which many of these legislators, including the governor, are up for reelection. Normally, it's business as usual: legislators, rush in, quickly move through session and head straight to the campaign trail, but it was quite different this year.I'm telling you, Luke, Florida is caught up in this nationwide trend of public education attacks. And parents are being used as a tool to create a major divide between educators and the communities where they work and live. Even worse, the result could have a negative impact on students, teachers and the entire school community.It's why it's so important for all school employees to feel empowered, to speak up and advocate for themselves throughout the school year, talking about what's going on in their schools and what's happening with their students. It doesn't matter if you’re new to the job or you’re experienced, if you're a teacher, a custodian, or if you're a Democrat or Republican.Luke: Absolutely. It is so important that every educator speak up, but they should not do it alone. It is so helpful to have a strong group of supporters or an organization like the FEA and its local affiliates standing beside them. On this episode we'll talk with a group of Republican educators who chose to join their union and work with other like-minded colleagues to raise awareness and redirect education policy.Mary Rivera, Patrick Strong, and Sheila Watson are all educators and members of FEA's Republican cadre. The three of them are focused on influencing legislation as they advocate for a pro public school agenda, one that will benefit all children in Florida. We start the conversation with Mary Rivera talking about the inception of the Republican cadre at the FEA statewide meeting in 2018 where she worked to pass a new business item, or an NBI, to create the cadre.Mary Rivera: I was part of the committee that composed the NBI (new business item) in 2018. I think it's important for educators to be activists for public education because god knows that the public is not advocating for us. So, I thought it was an important venture to get Republican members specifically involved in the political process because we're so Republican heavy in Tallahassee, and who best to communicate with these Republican leaders than Republican members of their delegations?And so, we wrote the NBI specifically to get Republican educators in Tallahassee to speak to their local representatives on behalf of public education and on behalf of labor unions across the nation.Tina, Host: You've been a key member of the cadre for several years now and had multiple opportunities to talk with your legislators on education issues that are important to you and your colleagues. What has surprised you the most about your conversations?Mary Rivera: They have deaf ears to educators in general. And we thought it was important that members of their kind communicate with them the fact that Republicans are teachers. There are teachers who are Republicans; it's not just a Democratic population of the workforce in the state. It's a group of people who care about kids and who care about teaching and our society and that we have needs, we have desires. And we're part of them. We're part of that organization, the Republican party, and that we want to be represented equally, as well as the Democratic Delegation, and we're not being heard.So, through the Cadre our voice has been loud and clear and has really opened doors for us as an educated community, as well as a union. Our voice just gets more loud and more powerful. And our mission is being heard and shared throughout the state.Tina: I'm sure that you are aware of this perception that the union is the right arm of the Democratic party, and there's no place in any union for Republican members. Sheila, how would you respond to that?Sheila Watson: I think that's what, um, propelled me to make the step to represent on the cadre was just that idea that when we sat at the table and had those conversations, we are Republicans, however, we are a part of our union and do support the work that's being done there to advocate for us. And to see the look and the response that we got to that oftentimes was “no way that doesn't happen.”Well, yes it does. And, and we feel like this is the way that we can make our voice heard through conversations with like-minded individuals. And I think that's sitting at the table sometimes when they would hear those first few words of, “well, I'm a Republican union member.” Maybe they listened a little more carefully to what I had to say, because they automatically recognize that some of our standpoints and foundational issues were similar and that we looked at things with the like mindset.And so maybe we did have more in common than they thought. So, they were willing to listen to what we had to say without tuning it out automatically because we represented a different party than they belong to. We were able to bridge that gap in a way that I think was different than had we sat at the table automatically with a defense mechanism in place had we been from an opposing party.  Luke: So, I asked Patrick a similar question to what Sheila just answered, but with a slightly different spin on it. Sheila talked about how the cadre has engaged with Republican lawmakers and how that has opened up some avenues, but I'm wondering about the membership and in a place, especially like Okaloosa that we know is very red.And do members sometimes say, “oh, well, you know, I'm a Republican,” or I should say potential members, give a reason that they don't want to join, “Well, I'm a Republican and I don't want to be a part of this Democratic organization.” Do you hear that objection, and if so, how do you respond to it when you're trying to get someone to join with us to advocate for public education.Patrick Strong: So, you must have read my mind because as Sheila was talking, I was thinking that we have kind of an idea that unions are always, uh, Democrat, and, you know, in Okaloosa we have about as many Republicans as we do Democrats in our local union. And then there's the rest of the registered members are independent. So, I always try to express that when you approach somebody if they've heard that over and over and over that union support things that, you know, they might not support you usually get a very strong negative, initial response from them. What I've done in the past to just show them over a period of time that the majority of the things that we stand for we can agree on. And when it comes to students and how we treat them in the classroom and how we teach them and how we take care of the facilities that they use and how we feed them at lunch and how we get them to school on buses, that's all common interest for all of us. So, when we talk about those issues, we all want the same thing.Tina: Yes, there are many issues that we share in common, but there are also a few foundational issues that we have vast disagreement on. For example, privatization, when you talk with your members or even legislators about privatization, which some would say is being advanced to hurt the union, I mean, have you talked with your legislators about this or even vouchers? What does that conversation sound like?Sheila: Even in a party amongst ourselves that we can agree on some things and disagree on some other major things. And one of those things is that, you know, we brought to the table as far as, you know,

Our conversation about testing was so robust that we broke it into two parts. Did you miss the first part of "Assess the Test"? Listen to it here.The impact standardized testing has on students, educators and school communities extends long beyond test day.In Part II of Assess the Test, we move beyond talking about the tests themselves and discuss the overall accountability system.Join us for this exploration of how 20 years of "accountability" in Florida have drained the joy out of teaching and learning.

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GuestsAnthony Colucci, President Brevard Federation of TeachersVicki Kidwell, President Clay County Education Association Bethany Koch, High school English teacher from Clay CountyMatt Yount, Teacher from Brevard County

ResourcesMore information on the legislation that will create the new testsBeyond the Bubble: Americans Want Change on High Stakes Assessments Moving Beyond the Failure of Test-Based AccountabilityFlorida Department of Education: Florida Assessment of Student Thinking (note: many of the promises made on this webpage about the new test are not included in the proposed legislation)

TranscriptAndrew Spar, FEA President: Hi, this is FEA president Andrew Spar. To stay on top of all the latest news and issues impacting our public schools, be sure to follow FEA on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram. For more information on this podcast, visit FEAweb.org/podcast.Sharon Nesvig: You're listening to Educating from the Heart. Thank you for joining our lively conversations with support professionals, parents and students as they share issues that matter most in our public schools. Here are your hosts, Tina Dunbar and Luke Flynt.Luke Flynt, Host: Welcome to another episode of Educating from the Heart. I am Luke Flynt, along with my cohost, Tina Dunbar. And Tina, you know, schools are the place where a childhood happens, where students get to explore their creativity, learn to think critically and develop the skills they will need to succeed in life and in the workplace. Or at least that's what they should be.Tina Dunbar, Host: You're so right, Luke. And in our last episode, we chatted with four educators about Florida's transition away from the FSA to a new testing system. While many educators are excited about the shift, many also shared their concern that this might be more of the same, a new name without major changes to the test itself.In the second part of our conversation, we'll focus less on the tests themselves and more on the overall accountability system. Our educators even address how testing has transformed our schools from places of joy and creativity to a place filled with anxiety due to the intense focus on standardized assessments.You know, Luke, you are so right. Life is so much more than knowing the right answers to a series of multiple-choice questions.Luke: It absolutely is. There is so much about our students that cannot be measured but is still very important to know. Part two of Assessing the Test begins with Bethany Koch sharing her love for English and how it can enrich the lives of all students. But she also shares the reality that Florida's fixation on testing has had in her classroom, as well as the classroom of many of her colleagues, where the love for teaching and learning has been replaced with dread.Bethany Koch, HS English teacher: I think one of the most heartbreaking, and someone that loves English, right? Like I went into this because I love English. I love books. But one of the most heartbreaking consequences of the FSA is that it is effectively killing some of the things that students and teachers love about our subject. We’ve seen the loss of fiction and poetry. And now our new standards are a little bit better on that, but, we focus more heavily upon non-fiction texts. We focus heavily on civics texts, which should be covered in history. And ultimately English is not something that can be distilled down to right and wrong like math. It's not one right answer. So, we have sucked creativity dry out of this subject because we want, and what English teachers have been doing to, in order to succeed on these tests is asking kids to only focus on the standards where you can have these right and wrong answers, and to think about English and writing and reading in very black and white terms. And it's painful. It is painful every year to, you know, to do that.Matt Yount, Brevard Teacher: I think to Bethany's point, I think a dangerous, subtext that we're sending is that if a subject is not tested, it's therefore not as valuable. And I think that's a dangerous precedent to kind of imply. That's what causes the arts to evaporate. That's what causes certain electives to cease to exist when funding decisions are having to be made. And so while I love ELA [English Language Arts] as much as Bethany, I also recognize there are students that will barely read on grade level, but their creativity is not limited to their words.I think the elephant in the room is that we only have a finite amount of time in any given day, right? So, one thing that's always been daunting to me as a teacher, the standards are sometimes so ambitious that they're actually not serving the purpose that they were originally intended to serve because they can't really guide instruction. If you've given me four hours of instructional goals, and I've got a two-hour block. So, I think we're going to still have to rectify every special interest group can't get what they want. I can't teach these kids every single thing they're supposed to know about ancient history in a 25-minute block, four times a week. It's just not reality. So, I think we need to have deeper conversations about are the standards really expected to be taught in a 180-day school year that's interrupted 20% of the time by testing (and then who knows how many percent of the time by all the other minutia that we deal with on a daily basis inside public schools)?Bethany Koch: And they know they aren’t because they're not tested. Right. We talked about research, right? Research is a standard that we do. And as a teacher, I could progress, monitor that, right? I could give my lessons and build in checkpoints and summative and formative assessments to determine whether I'm effectively teaching research. But do I value research then over a skill that I know is going to be on that test over a skill that I know is going to reflect on my performance it's going to reflect on my possible pay for the next year?  I mean, Matt is absolutely right, and this is not like his confessional moment, this is a confessional moment for profession. We do not teach the skills that aren't going to be tested because those are not the ones that are going to be reflected on us.Luke: This discussion of how the testing has narrowed the curriculum, I think is a really important one. And candidly, one of my major concerns when I first heard about the proposal for this state-based progress monitoring is that the curriculum would be narrowed even more.And so when, when I taught, I had a phenomenal administrator, so shout out to Dave Kramek. He treated his educators like we were professionals, and I was allowed to go in that classroom and teach. I know that was almost, you know, six, seven years ago. I know that increasingly educators are told that they all have to be on the same page on the same day, and if the state is now going to test and test and test, it seems like the pressure from up high for everybody to be rigid is going to increase that much more. And I see some nodding of heads, so I think you agree, so I'll stop talking and just maybe if you can expound a little more on, on the head nodding,Anthony Colucci, BTF President: What I'm hearing from our teachers is the pressure to be on the same page is preventing them from differentiating instruction properly, which goes against what you should be doing for progress monitoring. So, do you all want us on the same page or do you want us tailoring instruction based on progress monitoring? So, we have a bunch of different goals going on simultaneously that do not work well together. So, I totally agree that may become a problem.Matt Yount: I think something that's compounding that problem too, Anthony, is that we're seeing a, a veteran teacher core leaving in droves, and it's being replaced, if it's being replaced at all, it's being replaced by out of area teachers, which are some of the best teachers I've ever worked with, but don't have the traditional educational pedagogy or brand-new teachers. And so, I think districts are trying to like bridge that gap if you will by having these cookie cutter lessons made, but all that's really doing is hamstringing the veteran teachers that are able to work within their experience and their bag of tricks, so to speak, to reach those students and meet those standards. And at the same time, ironically, providing undue stress to those young teachers that haven't quite figured out that you're allowed to go off the page if it's a good learning opportunity for students.I work with a confidence that, you know, I don't think most have of “I'm going to do what's best for my kids every day.” And if that's what's on the page, then it's, what's on the page. If that's a deeper discussion that we're diving into, then I'm taking that and that timestamp can go somewhere else and I'm going to have that deep discussion. But I think a lot of teachers are working with a fear mentality in a pressurized situation where they think that at any moment, if they're caught teaching anything outside of the plan,

Don't miss part 2 of "Assess The Test": Our conversation about testing was so robust that we decided to continue it to a second episode. Listen to the 2nd part of here.Change is coming to Florida's system of standardized testing. Parents, students and educators alike are wondering if we will see the significant changes that are needed to create a system that actually works towards improving teaching and learning or if this will be just the same old testing regime with a new name.  Join us for part one of a two part series where we Assess the Test.

Episode 15 Show Notes:

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GuestsAnthony Colucci, President Brevard Federation of TeachersVicki Kidwell, President Clay County Education Association Bethany Koch, High school English teacher from Clay CountyMatt Yount, Teacher from Brevard County

ResourcesMore information on the legislation that will create the new testsBeyond the Bubble: Americans Want Change on High Stakes Assessments Moving Beyond the Failure of Test-Based AccountabilityFlorida Department of Education: Florida Assessment of Student Thinking (note: many of the promises made on this webpage about the new test are not included in the proposed legislation)

TranscriptAndrew Spar, FEA President: Hi, this is FEA President, Andrew Spar. To stay on top of all the latest news and issues impacting our public schools, be sure to follow FEA on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram. For more information on this podcast, visit FEAweb.org/podcast.Sharon Nesvig: You're listening to Educating from the Heart. Thank you for joining our lively conversations with teachers, support professionals, parents and students, as they share issues that matter most in our public schools. Here are your hosts, Tina Dunbar and Luke Flynt.Tina Dunbar, Host Welcome to another episode of Educating from the Heart. I'm Tina Dunbar with my cohost, Luke Flynt. So Luke, can you name your favorite educator, one who had a really big impact on you?Luke Flynt, Host: Oh, absolutely. Mr. Powell was my fifth grade teacher at Glendale Elementary, and he's actually the reason I became a teacher. I wanted to be just like him when I grew up. How about you?Tina: Well, several come to mind, but Señor Milliones, he was my Spanish teacher. He really stands out. He was the best, no matter what was going on with the students, he was always there to inspire you and push you forward. So, can you remember your favorite class?Luke: Favorite class? That's a little tougher, you know, I'm a bit of a nerd. I enjoyed almost all of my classes. If I had to choose one, I would probably be History of the English language. I actually loved it so much, I took it as an undergrad and then again at the graduate level.Tina: Wow, that sounds interesting. I might have to get a lesson from you on that. So, one more question: Can you remember your favorite standardized test? I'm sure you've got a few to choose from.Luke: No, no, absolutely not. “Favorite” and “standardized tests” don't really belong in the same sentence. You know, Tina, I was really fortunate that I graduated from public school in Florida before the current testing craze. The FCAT didn't come around until the year I graduated, and seniors didn't have to take it. As a teacher though, I did administer the FCAT, the FCAT 2.0 and the Florida Standards Assessment. And I can tell you, even though the test had three different names, nothing else really changed about them.Tina: I hear what you're saying. And once again, Florida is preparing to administer a revamped assessment system. That includes progress monitoring and a new end of the year tests called F.A.S.T. Or the Florida Assessment of Student Thinking. And while Governor DeSantis has made some really big promises about these new tests, the current proposed legislation doesn't seem to really make those changes. So, Luke, we're hearing from educators that they're worried that this new assessment will essentially be FCAT 4.0 .Luke: And, you know, Tina, I think those fears are probably well-founded. To delve a little bit deeper into this issue, we sat down with four educators. First, you’re going to hear from Anthony Colucci, from Brevard, along with Vicki Kidwell and Bethany Koch from Clay County, and Matt Yount, also a Brevard County teacher.We talked with them about the current system of standardized tests, what they hope to see with a new testing routine, and what they fear will happen if educator's voices are ignored. We begin by talking about progress monitoring,  since that seems to be a big focus of the proposed legislation.Tina: What is the goal of progress monitoring for educators?Anthony Colucci, BTF President: When you're teaching in the classroom, it's important that you make sure the students are learning and you're not just teaching, right? So, you want to constantly be aware of where your students are at and that they are growing from where they're currently at. And that is our primary job as educators is to see growth. Progress monitoring is a system to ensure that you are tracking students’ growth, or sometimes lack of growth, and tailoring your instruction to get that growth from students.Vicki Kidwell, CEA, President: Progress monitoring, from my primary experiences, is very targeted to standards or a skill or a concept that you're trying to get your students to understand. And it's the growth of the students towards your goals, against where they were to where you want them to be. It's not Billy against Bobby; it’s Billy advancing more and more and more on the continuum to where he is competent in the skills and the concepts and the standards that he needs to be competent in. We wouldn't sit down and compare two kids. Progress monitoring is one student's growth. And I think student growth is, is the whole picture right there. That student's growth.Bethany Koch, HS English teacher: Progress monitoring is not something that you do once a year, right? Progress monitoring in a teacher world is something that we do every day. Sometimes multiple times during the lesson, you know, I teach high school, so I've got 50 minutes to teach my kids. And in high school, often in my classes it often looks like an exit ticket, right? So, at the end of the day, we'll have three short questions, and sometimes that's taken on a computer, sometimes it's raising paddles so that we can see who knows what, and then I can understand myself both, you know, how my students are doing, but also how is my teaching time coming across, like is my lesson effective? Do I need to clarify something? And in that way, progress monitoring, I think the most important part of it is that it's a tool to help us be more effective educators. And that can't be done with one big, scary, standardized test at the end of the year.Matt Yount, Brevard Teacher: I would add to that, that progress monitoring should be formative, not punitive. And I think a lot of times what we do with that data is really the kind of thing that gets lost in the shuffle is, are we using that data to assign grades? Are we using that data to assign district grades and assign money? Are we using that data to punish students or teachers? Or are we using that to inform our instruction and to better our instruction?And I think, another key point is that progress monitoring might look different across different subjects and grades and even student groups. Obviously, my kindergarten counterparts, their progress monitoring is going to look a little different than what I might do in a sixth-grade classroom.Tina: So, are you saying that the previous testing system did not give you that kind of information?Matt Yount: Absolutely not. I've been I've likened it to an autopsy when the checkup was needed. At least in Brevard County, we would sit in meetings at pre-planning of a school year dissecting data from April or May of the previous school year. I was always frustrated, and still remain frustrated, that I could not celebrate the wins with my students, and I couldn't affect any change in what those things were now, because they were often off to another grade level with another teacher. And I just got handed a bunch of new names, and they were just names and numbers on a page to me, but I'm supposed to do something with that data. So I always found it very frustrating to have to deal with that, you know, from a data desegregation point of view,Tina: The students have already left, yes. That was one of the things as a parent that I never understood in terms of how that would help a child getting the information afterwards. Go ahead, Bethany.Bethany Koch: In addition to that, the FSA’s data is kind of masked it's hard to tell. We don't get to look at the test, so we don't get to say like, “oh, this is what, where this question went wrong.” We don't get to look at the standards that were affected. We don't know how the scores are calculated; it’s kind of a mystery. In Clay County,  and in my school, we prepare our…we do quarterly checkpoints, and we perform a pair of tests as a cohort with our PLC, according to the standards that are aligned with our curriculum map, put out by the county. And we check on our students' progress, and then when the test is over, we strategize on how we can, you know, move our kids forward and you know, where we need to improve any weak spots.Everything that we prepare for never lines up with the FSA, because we don't have the resources. We don't know what’s on the FSA exactly. We don't know what the inside looks like. We don't have any feedback. So it really is kind of is, it's like preparing to do a long distance run and then being told you're going to actually have to swim.Luke: What I've heard already is that during this transition,

While some politicians have tried to limit what students can learn when it comes to America’s history, Rep. Geraldine Thompson (D-Orlando) has been advocating for a fuller teaching of Black history in Florida’s schools for years. We sat down with her recently to discuss why this issue is so important to her and why students need to be taught Black history year-round, not just on special occasions like Dr. King’s birthday or Black History Month.

Episode 14 Show Notes:

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GuestRep. Geraldine Thompson (D-Orlando) 

Resources HB 51 Required Instruction in the History of the Holocaust and the History of African AmericansSome schools may not be teaching African American history or other courses required by law but there’s no consequences (Florida Phoenix) Florida School District Curriculum Reports Show Gaps In Black History Education (2020) (WUFT) HB 233 Academic Freedom Survey 

Transcript[00:00:00]Andrew Spar, FEA President: Hi, this is FEA President Andrew Spar. To stay on top of all the latest news and issues impacting our public schools. Be sure to follow FEA on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram. For more information on this podcast, visit feaweb.org/podcast.[00:00:17]Sharon Nesvig, announcer: You're listening to Educating from the Heart. Thank you for joining our lively conversations with teachers, support professionals, parents and students, as they share issues that matter most in our public schools. Here are your hosts, Tina Dunbar and Luke Flynt.[00:00:43] Sen. James Hargett: One of the greatest privileges I've had as a state Senator in the state of Florida is to have a participated along with Representative Bradley in sponsoring the legislation to require the teaching of African-American history in the schools of Florida. I believe that it will help our young people in the state know their history. As I stated on the floor in the Senate, you can't know where you're going, unless you know where you're coming from. I also believe that you can't teach the history of America truly without teaching the history of African-Americans as a central part of it. And for that reason, I'm very proud to participate.[00:01:28] Tina Dunbar, Host: Those are the words of former state Senator James Hargett who sponsored the 1994 legislation requiring Florida schools to add African-American history to the curriculum. Welcome to Educating from the Heart I'm Tina Dunbar with my cohost Luke Flynt.So, Luke, we began the last episode with a history lesson. So let's start this one with a quick quiz. What do you think about that? Well, you know, you can't work in education without a few assessments here and there. What do you remember learning about African-American history in school? I grew up in another state. And when I think about it, most of my learning came from my family and from within my community. I don't remember learning a lot about African-American contributions to American history in school.I do remember learning a few names and a focus on Egypt and the pyramids. But there was no reference to the significance of Egypt being in the continent of Africa, which I see as a total disconnect because African-Americans have a significant past, and we continue to play an important role in shaping American history today. Wouldn’t you agree?[00:02:48] Luke Flynt, Host: You know, Tina, there is so much that I appreciate about the great public education I received in Indian River County. And I am proud to be a member of the Vero Beach High School Class of 1998. When I look back at my schooling, there is no doubt that I received a sanitized, you know, maybe even a whitewashed version of history.You know, I was taught for instance, the myth that Rosa Parks was just a lone actor who one day got tired and didn’t give up a seat on the bus. Not the reality that she was part of a larger anti segregation movement. And in fact, she was on the council of her local NAACP. That part of the history often gets left out for school children. And not just when I was a child, but that's still happening today.It doesn't have to be that way though. For several years now, Representative Geraldine Thompson has been trying to ensure that no longer will entire generations of Florida school children be able to graduate with only getting a little bit of African-American history. She wants to ensure they get the full story.[00:03:58] Tina: And you're correct. It's partly due to Representative Thompson that districts are now required to submit an annual required instruction report to the DOE. It details the courses being taught, who's teaching them and how the courses are being taught.According to the last report found on the DOE website during the 2019-2020 school year out of 73 school districts, there were only four districts that exceeded the basic rule requirements. 59 satisfied the reporting rule, and five districts provided incomplete information. Now that doesn't really provide a clear picture of what's going on here. But what we do know is depending upon the school district, students might get a thorough exposure to African-American history, or they might not.Some district offers standalone classes. Others offer the course as an elective, which means students are not required to take it. So, to ensure all students receive the quality education they deserve, Rep. Thompson tells us her bill would put teeth into the current law to make sure African-American history is taught with fidelity to all students across the state.You have been trying to promote African-American history studies through a number of attempts in terms of legislation, you and other legislators. Senator Bracy, who we also asked to join us today, and something came up at the last minute, he wasn't able to join us. He has a bill on the Ocoee Massacre, which actually passed.With the governor's point of view and the ruling in terms of how teachers, educators should talk about these culturally divisive issues, what does that mean for our teachers discussing African-American history and some of these really important issues connected to what we see going on politically right now?[00:06:01] Rep. Geraldine Thompson: Well, I think one of the things that members of the legislature have to be reminded of is that we have had in Florida law, Florida statute 1003 since 1994, over 27 years, that requires instruction on African-American history, starting with the culture of Africa, before slavery going through slavery, the civil rights movement, all of it.And it has not been uniformly enforced. And so, if you say that you have to follow the law regarding to the parents' bill of rights, why aren't we following this law that's been on the books for 27 years. And so that's what I have been advocating. And when I filed the legislation in 2019, it was to put some teeth in the law to say that there's some sanctions if this instruction is not being delivered. Well, the bill has yet to get a hearing. I have refiled it again this year, because I think you can't pick and choose which laws you're going to follow. And yes, we are in a climate and in an environment where the Department of Education, the board of education is prohibiting the discussion of race and racism in our classrooms, and that shortchanges students. That's the bottom line.I talked to a group of students a month, a couple months ago. And I asked them to name ten individuals who were important and significant during the Civil Rights Movement. And so, they named some people at the national level, Dr. King, Rosa Parks, Jesse Jackson, et cetera, the names that come to mind. Then I asked them to name ten who were from Florida or who worked in Florida; I got no response. And the reason that they did not respond is because they're not getting the instruction. It's not being taught in the classrooms. And so that's what we have to keep working toward and promoting. And that's why I'm saying. It's the students who are being short changed.[00:08:26] Tina: You will hear people from the DOE, the commissioner, and some folks will say, “well, we do teach this it's mentioned.” But isn't that the problem it's merely mentioned, they don't take the time to really dive in and understand the actions.[00:08:46] Rep. Thompson: That's exactly the problem because we're not talking about celebrating Dr. King's birthday. Some teachers have said to me, “well, we celebrate Dr. King's birthday,” and they believed that that fulfills the requirement to teach African-American history. A celebration is not instruction. And we are not looking for something that you set aside just for February. We're looking for something that's infused throughout the curriculum for 180 days, which is the length of the academic school year for schools here in Florida.[00:09:24] Tina: So, what’s the barrier? It’s in the law.[00:09:28] Rep. Thompson: Well, some of the teachers have said to me they don't have the content. And so I have been working with the African-American History Task Force that works directly with the Commissioner of Education to say, we need to make sure that all 67 counties have the content, not only African American history on a national level but Florida history in particular. And so, I think to answer your question, it is not being taught because people don't have the content. They have not been motivated to do the research themselves, and so here we are looking to engage the task force to make sure that they have the history.And then the second thing is that you need an advocate, and we've not had the advocate. And so when I came, returned to the legislature in 2018,