There are people who argue that real reforms can only happen in a crisis. A crisis is a terrible thing to waste, they say.

They are wrong.

Welcome to Episode 123 of Everything is Everything, a weekly podcast hosted by Amit Varma and Ajay Shah.

In this episode, Ajay explains how crises, most of the time, lead to terrible outcomes. Chaos is a ladder. And to actually do reforms during a crisis, you need not just the circumstance but also a scaffolding of factors in policy and politics and culture that need to be in place already.

TABLE OF CONTENTS: 00:00 Packaging00:13 Intro: Is a Crisis a Good Thing?01:21 Chapter 1: Steelmanning the Position07:44 Chapter 2: The Prerequisites18:54 Chapter 3: Chaos is a Ladder29:03 Chapter 4: Weak States and Crises35:11 Chapter 5: Progress Comes From Incrementalism40:24 Chapter 6: The Lessons to Learn