Hi, I am here with Eric Dagati. HE is the Founder and Director of ONE Human Performance. Eric has spent the past 20 years in the fitness industry as a coach, trainer and instructor, pioneering his unique approach to client assessment, performance enhancement and injury prevention. Eric studied Exercise Physiology at William Paterson University and, in addition, has had the good fortune over the years of learning directly from some of the greatest minds in the industry, including Gray Cook, Charles Poliquin, Mike Clark and Paul Chek.

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Ari Gronich 0:00  

I'm Ari Gronich, and this is create a new tomorrow podcast.

Welcome back to another episode of create a new tomorrow I am your host, Ari Gronich. And I have with me Eric Dagati. And Eric is a performance trainer. He's physical athletic performance, injury prevention, management and rehab, systematic approach to health and wellness. He's spent the last 20 years in the industry training, and pioneering his unique approach to assessment, performance enhancement, injury prevention, etc. Each year, he travels the world teaching and speaking trainers, coaches, therapists, as well as training clients that include Olympic gold medalists, Gatorade, and energy players of the year all Americans, national champions, World Series champions and Pro Bowl athletes. It's quite a resume you have very, very astute kind of resume, why don't you tell the audience a little bit about yourself how you got to this place where you are the man behind the men and women

Eric Dagati 1:25  

got it? Oh, thank you for having me here. So like you said a little over 20 years ago got involved in in helping people get better on the initially just on the physical side, and then realizing there's a lot more to it than that. And that's kind of what started my journey of kind of finding a system that works to getting people to be their best. And along that way, I've gotten to do some pretty cool things like you mentioned. And, and with that, to this day, still accumulating more and more information that can kind of make that system work a little bit better. And, and having this growth mindset of saying okay, well, if there's something that can allow one of my clients, one of my teams to be able to be better tomorrow from this, or even if it's a better way of delivering that information. That's kind of what I've been gaining over the over the last 20 plus years of doing that. And that's kind of what gets me to where I am now.

Ari Gronich 2:26  

Awesome. So what do you think, is the biggest deficiencies that you've seen in, you know, the training, the teaching the educational side? That that's kind of given you an opportunity to have a career because you're filling a gap. Right? So what's that gap that you're filling? And why do you think that the industry hasn't kind of, let's say, made it with the times, come up with, you know, the present moment? Why do you think it's taken them so long?

Eric Dagati 3:03  

I think a lot of the dogmatic way in which we're taught on whether it's on the, the clinical side of rehab, or whether it's on the training side of performance is it's a lot of this for that mentality, right? So if it's someone on the rehab side that okay, well, if, if they can't perform this movement, this is tight, and this is weak. On the performance side, well, if they can't do this, well, then you got to do these exercises. And I wish it was that simple. And early on, it was a lot of that it was it was fine, a problem prescribe, you know, something specific for it. And that works to a certain extent. But unless you really get a full grasp on the whole picture, you end up missing out on a lot of things. And so you can get down into some deep rabbit holes, whether it's, I'm getting wrapped up in, you know, when I initially started, I had these hour and a half evaluations, and I chase everything that I found that was off. And if you didn't have exactly how many degrees of external rotation in your shoulder, I was going to fix that. And then I realized that you know what, that didn't matter if this person couldn't even touch your toes, right? If there was bigger things that I needed to do in terms of a checklist in terms of checking boxes to make sure, where do I even start and I was missing, I was missing big stuff to chase after little stuff. And we can get down that road. Because Listen, I you know, I've gotten to work with some of the best in the world. And none of them are perfect. But we sometimes let perfect get in the way of good. And so being able to know how to have that checklist and have that systematic way to look at say, Okay, I got to start here first before I worry about that. And then I may never need to worry about that. And so I think getting away from that disk for that and having looking at the individual in front of you, and going through a checklist of some big things first, and say Can they do these things and then I'll worry about if those little things That I that are deep in the textbooks have to even be worried about right now.

Ari Gronich 5:06  

Again, I get that, you know, here's a question that I have. And it's something that I see in the industry quite a bit. And that is a failure to diagnose meaning the assessment system that were trained in, originally, and what is used mostly, are things like visual assessments, very brief, conversational moments, especially if you're a trainer, you're literally, you know, do a 1015 minute conversation and then try to sell a package, right? Instead of doing a deep diagnostic. And so, the question becomes, as you just started, you know, saying, you had to explore things further. So what are the assessments that you have chosen to do the way that you choose to do diagnostics so that you can get a better starting place?

Eric Dagati 6:12  

Okay, so the, the initial starting place is that is just that conversation and the art of that conversation. And you can and how do you do that? Right? And, and if your motive is selling a training package, then you're already off base. But but the asking some Kiko, I've asked like the same six key questions for 20 years, but where it's taken, the journey for each individual that's come in the door has been completely unique. And the first question is something as simple as like, why are you here? What is your primary goal? Instead of me trying to sell you on what I do? Why are you even here? and figure out okay, and then keep asking why, like a three year old is okay, well, I'm here because I want to I want to be faster, faster for what? Who's chasing you? Right? And so okay, well, faster, because I'm a football player. Okay, well, what position do you play in? Okay, well, what do you think's holding you back from that speed? And keep asking those questions? And then And then from there, we can start to open up some doors or conversation to say, Okay, well, now I got to look at to see are those really the reasons? Meaning that first I'm going to look at is how do you move on a fundamental level with something as basic as a functional movement screen to say, Do you at least cover your basis as a human being as a, as someone that needs to be able to do some basic things in terms of move from your hips move from your upper body, to be able to step to be able to lunge to be able to squat? And and if you can cover those fundamentals? Okay, well, that box is checked, I don't need to get your perfect, but that's probably not your issue. And do you have at least you know, movement competency? And then from there, then we can start looking at some, some other factors, whether it's performance factors, and looking at your your power and your motor control and your ability to have lasticity and impact control and work capacity, or is it a body composition issue, right. And if you want to get faster, well, that doesn't move all that fast up. If we can get you leaner, you might get faster, and you never end up doing a single speed drill. And then we like to look at and open up the doors at a conversation to the the next question that I asked to say, Okay, well, we train do we build up or break down and I literally had a high school quarterback. And last night, for the first time asked this question nine times out of 10, they say, Well, I build up and I said, try again, the whole reason this works is you challenge yourself, your body goes, Oh my gosh, I don't know what I just did. But you're going to have to get better for it. Now, it's my job to figure out what those things are and how much of that we give to you. But that's the magic is not happening here. We're just kind of planting seeds. It's the other 23 hours a day that that magic happens. And that comes down to recovery. And so I could give you the greatest program in the world. But if you're up all night playing fortnight or eating Twizzlers, and drinking Red Bull, we pretty much wasted our time. So we have to make sure that we support that with the right recovery. And then getting them to understand that this is this is on them. And the analogy that I use, okay, we're going to, I'm going to show you, I'm going to give you the right seats and tell you where to plant them. But you're the farmer from here on it, it's on you to plant those to harvest those seeds. I can't go home and do your exercises for you. I can't tell you when to go to bed or I'm not going to, you know be in your kitchen serving your meals and getting the onus on the individual. And making them part of that journey, I think is an empowering thing I want to do early on. And so when they can see that and then having the assessment to tie into it is to say okay, well, you couldn't touch your toes when you came in. We just did these three drills with you and now you can, okay, so we know these work. So if you do those every day, imagine how much better you're going to move. Alright, so you're going to do those every day till the next time I see you and then when you come in as long as you touch your toes. Now we've checked that box and now we're gonna move on to the next thing. So that'd be assessment. Men, as well as the conversation all lead to this empowerment of getting them to take personal responsibility for their own performance and well being.

Ari Gronich 10:11  

Awesome, you know, I have things like client contracts and obligations that they have to meet when I'm working with them. So sounds to me like, you're definitely doing things to get people on board with their own healing. I guess my my questions are a little more systematic versus, you know, your particular system, like the systems that we experience on a day to day basis. Now, why? Why do you have a job as a specialist training, the people who are really the day to day people that are working with these elite athletes? And I asked this actually have a couple of my Olympic clients, when I interviewed them as well on on the podcast, like, why did you need me? Why was why was I, somebody you couldn't get in all of the, with all the people that are there specifically for you.

Eric Dagati 11:23  

I think a lot of that comes back to a first it was about them. Right? I had two pro baseball players in this morning. And they said they went to another facility last year for training. And they say they were told that this was going to be a completely individualized program. And it was all based exactly on what they needed. And then they realized about a week or two, when that they were doing the same program as every other high school kid in the place. And that every time that we're doing something, they can make a connection to something that they've that either we discovered in the assessment or that they've even told me, and that it's making that connection. So there's that realization that this is not training to get good at training, this is training to get good. And this is good specifically for what you need. And that's really where they're getting that that attention that some people may not have, if you don't have that skill set, then they're just going to go in and get another, you know, rote training program. And that I have, I've kind of challenged myself to say, I want to, I want to make sure that there's never going to be an individual that I ever see that I can't make better in some way, shape, or form. And so because of that, I always want to be able to give you something that you didn't have yesterday. And so when athletes see that they can say okay, I can see where this is going, I can see that this is a journey, this isn't a workout, this is a journey. And they can see that this leads to this leads to this. And it's based on this, and this is going to be our checks and balances. And that's where they're they're, they're getting something that they're not getting elsewhere, because it's not about a workout.

Ari Gronich 13:00  

That's awesome. You know, I believe that program design and development is probably the number one biggest thing that helps a trainer and athlete, a patient and any of any kind, and that it is probably the least done in the industry, the least thing done, it will help it would help the most. And it's the least thing done. Like I can remember, just in my own personal experiences going after car accidents, or after injuries to therapists, chiropractors, pts, etc. And no one spoke to each other. No one had conversations about care, nobody actually created a plan of care. It was it's always just been a come in, we'll see what we can do today. And then come in tomorrow we'll Oh, well, you know, we'll we'll just do what we can. And it's never been a here's where we're going. This is the plan. This is why and now we're off on this adventure together of fulfilling the plan, right?

Eric Dagati 14:22  

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I used to have a criteria when I, I own my own multi disciplinary facility for 12 years. And then I got kind of too busy with consulting and doing that kind of stuff. So I moved on, but when I did, I had a staff of eight trainers. And so to make sure that we kept the brand true and that the level of care up. You know, one of the things I always say is that you are not here to show exercises. I said you can get that for free at YouTube. No one needs to pay for that. And that if at any point, your client should ask you why are we doing this and you can't give them a Clear, cogent solid reason that ties specifically do their goal, then they should be able to walk out the door and get their money back. And so you have to really know in your heart that everything you're doing has purpose. And you can stand on the table and defend that purpose. Now, what I did five years ago, this goes probably for all of us. And this is what I did five years ago, certainly not what I would do today, what I did probably five months ago, wouldn't be what I would do today. But what I'm going to give you today is the best of my, of my knowledge for where you're at, and where you want to get to. And I can stand behind that wholeheartedly. And so if you don't have that, and you're just showing exercises, and you're kind of throwing that this for that against the wall, it's really doing an injustice to your clients and patients.

Ari Gronich 15:44  

Yeah, you know, not only to them, but to yourself, you're you're doing an injustice to yourself, because if you're settling for less than what you're capable of, then you're basically allowing yourself to have stunted growth.

Eric Dagati 16:04  

Yeah, well, and then not only that, you're not really distinguishing yourself. And like, like you said about, you know, why does that certain client look, you know, seek me out, they drive past a lot of gyms and trainers to get to me that are a lot easier, you know, made cheaper and more, you know, more local to where they are, but they're not going to get that. And so unless you're willing to distinguish yourself. And that also means you're putting yourself out there a little bit. And that's the same thing goes with the assessment is to say, if I'm going to tell you, we're doing this to improve this, and it doesn't, well, that's me putting it out there, that's where I want to have the confidence that I can get you there. And if I also don't have the ego to say, well, we tried this and it didn't work. That's not the path, let's quickly scrap that and let's go to something else. And that's okay. Right. And sometimes in our industry, we have too much of an ego to say that I did something that didn't work, I'm I'm okay with that. And that we learn from making mistakes, and we just have to make sure we don't stay on that mistake for too long.

Ari Gronich 17:06  

Yeah, you know, the way that we distinguish ourselves from being a commodity that is traded based on, you know, the cheapest cost, we want to be known as the results, the people who get those results, the people in the community who actually care about the people that are paying us and coming to see us. And in our industry, we've gotten to this place, it seems where it's kind of like an assembly line, you know, you have a time limit on the amount of time that you get to train with somebody, and even if you're not done, being fixed or bettered or whatever, it's okay, we're time's up, we're done for now. And so you have to come back and have to come back more, you know, it's like this assembly line has really affected our bottom line as far as results. So what do you think the future entails for, you know, for our industry, having, you know, in one that created such abysmal results, you know, in the in the recent past?

Eric Dagati 18:29  

So, I think, I think the more that you can show the art of what you do, as opposed to just the assembly line, as you said, is that, you know, I have a personal speaking with yesterday, he was interested in training, and they said, Well, you know, how many months and how many sessions I said, Well, here's how it works, is that I don't know what I'm gonna do with you, I have no idea. You can tell me what your goal is, but I don't know what it is that you need. And then the only way to figure that out is through the assessment. So the only thing you're committed to is the assessment. And then I'm going to teach you your program. And then from there, it's up to you how much you need me to execute that program. I know that program will get you to where you need to go. But how much you need me that's that's really up to you. I don't know that. So some people see me five days a week, some people see me once a month. I'm not here to do it, where you're here, I'm here for only what you need before. And in the end. Now I use tons of analogies. And I say if your goal would be like of what you want to accomplish would be like building a dream house, you're coming to me as the architect to say this is all the things I want in that dream house. I'm gonna put together the plan. But I don't have to hang every I don't have to I don't have the ego that I have to hang every wall up or run every wire or every pipe that if you have someone that can do that, or you can do it on your own even better. But I'm going to be here and if you need me to teach you the first time around, I can do that. And then from there, eventually I want to build that independence to where I'm here. Just here. For that, I'm telling you where to plant the seeds in which sees us, you have to learn to be that farmer and you have to learn to kind of grow with that. And so that that right there is a is a thing that that a lot of trainers and therapists are afraid of, because they said, Well, how do you get repeat business? Because you're good, and people talk about it and they come back, if you're locked into the only way I'll get them to come back is I kind of block them in for 1030 sessions, then that's, that's a very short sighted way of looking at things.

Ari Gronich 20:30  

Yeah. I'll just tell a quick little story, I had a client who had come to me after three years of going to a local chiropractor, who was, you know, in the area considered to be the the top notch chiropractor. And after three years of going to him, getting no benefit for massive sciatica pain. And in three sessions, I had him back to no pain. So we took three years, condensed it into three sessions. And then I started asking him questions, because as you said, questions are King. And the question was, okay, now that you're not in pain anymore, what would you like to accomplish? And this question that I asked kinda in my world has always taking care of the fear that you just stated, which is the fear of Where are you going to get new clients from or how they're going to come back to you? Well, I basically asked him the question, what what do you want to accomplish next? What's your what's the thing that if you could do this would make your life amazing, and he had been an extreme athlete when he was younger. And so, you know, he didn't want to do you know, jumps off a second storey balconies and things like that on his rollerblades, but he wanted to train for American Ninja Warrior. So okay, great. We created the plan, we started, the program dropped 50 pounds off his body in like no time. And all of a sudden, everybody was saying to him, Wow, you look different. Where did what happened with you? And then he would say, well, I've been working with this guy. Right? So that's how you get new business is being good at what you do, not just bringing in new leads. So one of the things I've actually said to marketing companies that that are promoting, we get you leads we get you leads is that do? Do the people you're getting leads? Do they deserve them? Are they going to give the people that are coming to them the benefit and the results that they want? Because otherwise, you should probably have me work with them first, so I can make sure they get top notch results. Now we can have add you to that list as well. Right.

Eric Dagati 23:14  

So they I think part of the problem is that the expectations of the person that walks in a PT clinic or walks into a gym are so low, that that I think a lot of the industry is has dropped down to that level as opposed to risen above it. And so when people walk into a gym, and I'll say, you know, one of the questions, I'll ask you those questions up front, and I'll say, How do you know you get a good workout? And the two answers I'll get 99% of the time is I sweat a lot, it was really hard. And so if that's your only criteria, anybody could do that, you know, can I tell you what come to my house this afternoon, you can shovel my driveway, you'll sweat a lot, it'll be really hard. So that's where the criteria is. And then the same price on the flip side on the on the clinical side, is that people, you know, go in and when they don't feel better. It's like, Oh, it's probably something I did. Or it's probably, you know, I have, you know, one of these labels that was slapped on him, I have a herniated disc, or I have whatever. And then you do a little education saying, Well, you know, like, 95% of the people have a disc herniation why is it that you her? And then why is that other people are getting better? And you're not? And they don't think to ask that question. The bar has been set so low and, you know, always, you know, set it say to my clients, when they're like, wow, that feels a lot better. I was like, well, that's what it's supposed to do. You know, and I joke I said, don't get don't get surprised when it works. I said be upset when it doesn't. I said we need to set the bar a little bit higher as far as what your expectation is, you came in to me to get better. And we need to agree on what that means. And then every time you walk in, you should get better. And so if we're not doing that, then we need to change The plan, but the the bar has been set so low and a lot of the industry sees that and they say, Well, I can crank out more sessions or more more patient visits or, or more classes because they don't expect much I can bring them in, put a whitener your workout up on the whiteboard, beat the crap out of them, send them on their way and let the next group come in. And, you know, and that's going to end up leading to a lot of volume initially, but there's nothing really special that you're not that you're giving that anybody else isn't giving. But you've you've raised your quality level down to what the expectations are, as opposed the other way around.

Ari Gronich 25:34  

Yeah, you know, I could go on about our educational system in general that has done that with our kids. And, you know, like, just industry after industry after industry that I see, that seems to have lowered the bar and the expectations and then lower the bar, and then expectations and then lower the bar and then expectations to the point where we really don't care so much about the results. Because I think that there's a sense that of hopelessness, that it's never going to get better and that this is just the way it is. And that goes along with people experiencing cancer, heart disease, diabetes, obesity, etc. And just assuming that this is the way it's always got to be. And we do nothing about fixing the systems that get us there.

Eric Dagati 26:39  

And that's really your that's the paradigm in which in which you see if there is a professional and you know, there's an old fable two salesmen that go out and they go out in the middle of a tribal area, and they, they're selling shoes, and they call back to the office. And the first guy says, This is terrible. These tribes, they don't wear any shoes, we're not gonna make any money here. And the second salesman calls back says, this is a goldmine, no one has shoes, we're gonna make a killing here, right? So if you can be that, that that trainer, that therapist, that coach that can distinguish yourself, there is so much out there, alright to be had. Because what you have is you have a, you have this perfect storm of people who are more and more sedentary however more and more lifestyle diseases they have, but they have more and more disposable income. And there are more discerning client than the guys I was walking into a gym with the first time I walked into a gym, you know, 3540 years ago, is that you have clients who are who are sharp enough that are business people that are that are savvy people and experienced people that know the difference that if you can show them that difference, that they will be loyal to you forever. And if you can be the person that can have the gym where people doesn't, people don't get hurt, right? Where you can be that, that that clinician that, hey, not only did they get me out of pain, but he actually got me back on my skis, he actually got me back to, to where I can play with my grandkids again, and actually made it about me and got me to another place beyond just the lowest common denominator, there is so much out there for you that you should never have to even worry about a lead generation.

Ari Gronich 28:31  

That that is that is true. I agree. There's plenty to be had. If, if you know how to get the job done and get that word out about it. I believe that the industry needs a little bit of a revolution. And one of my feelings is that there's a set of of modalities in the industry that need to combine. And if I'm going to be honest about it, I think that chiropractors physical therapists, massage therapists, deos and athletic trainers and personal trainers need to actually be taught all the same stuff and combined into one cohesive industry or modality or profession. Because the body is not separated into joints, muscles, nerves, bones, it's all one unit and we treat the body currently with the separation. So you have a chiropractor who will adjust you and then you know you go and you sit in your car and you twist and 10 minutes later you're out of place. So you go to the massage therapist who starts working on the muscles right By then your bones are already back out of place, then you got to go to the PT to do the joint work. And then you got to find the personal trainer. So you could actually train to get stronger. And I just it's, it seems to me kind of asinine that you'd have to do all of this separate work, go to four or five different offices, fill out four or five different kinds of forms, take four or five different tests with doctors and practitioners who are not talking to each other, right? And then assume that you're going to get the results that you want to get, and that we're going to give the results that they that people deserve. So what do you think of that theory of mine?

Eric Dagati 30:45  

So 18 years ago, is when I opened up my facility, and my vision was that under the same roof, we would have chiropractors, physical therapists, nutrition, yoga. And we did we had, as well as personal trainers, strength and conditioning coaches. And that was my vision. And when I started it, it was, you know, unheard of like, nobody was really thinking of that in the early 2000s. And then what's happened is, you've seen now where you have these multidisciplinary centers, but like you said, it is more of a farmers market of Okay, there's the butcher there, there's the fish market here, there's the vegetables here, but nobody is telling me, Hey, here's how you make the meal. Here's what you need from this, here's we need from that and not not having that communication. That was something I was very big on. And that's why I think there definitely needs to be a lot more cross communication, a lot more cross cross breeding of the education between there. And the the, the fear that that I think a lot of people have initially is to say, Oh, well, that's going to, that's going to infringe on my turf, or it's going to think it's going to make trainers think and this happened when I was taking all PT when I was taking PT courses, and I'm learning surely Sargon and Vladimir yonder, and I'm learning this stuff. And people are saying, well, you're a trainer while you're doing that, and you want to be a physical therapist, I said, No, I want to know what I need. Or I don't want to know when it when it gets to the edge of my, my scope? And then what then what do i do and who do I call. And so that's why I want to know enough to know when I need someone for this and that it's out of my scope. So if anything, it keeps me inside my guard rails more than anything else. So having that mutual respect to say, Look, I've gotten to the point where I have a stuck SI joint, I can't move that thing. That's not for me to do. So if you could do that, I can do some stuff. Once it's moving, that that'll kind of keep it from going back there. And we can meet back in the middle and talk shop on that. So I am I am of wholehearted belief that we definitely need to drop down those those boundaries a whole lot more. And we can get a lot more done. And if the initial fear again is, Hey, I'm going to lose business from this. But yeah, I've never worked with a another referral source if I'm referring to a PT Cairo, whoever it may be, that when we've had conversations, and we've done this type of no look pass through each other. That wasn't I didn't get more referrals from that then then the other way around.

Ari Gronich 33:25  

Yeah, you know, I was known as, I guess the chiropractor's chiropractor in LA, I had, I think somewhere close to 5060 chiropractors, that all would come to me. And I'm not a chiropractor. And that was really fascinating. And then the next part that was fascinating is maybe two or three of them ever sent me clientele. They all wanted me to work on them, but send me clientele, ah, because of this fear. And I just I think frankly, the fear is silly because you can have 10 chiropractors on the same street in LA and you're still not going to even come close to matching, you know, population density here, or you know what you need to I there's just I don't have any clients available. There's none available. Now. There's plenty of them available, whether it's the main streets of LA or the main streets of you know, Salem, Oregon, doesn't really matter, middle of nowhere, everywhere. There's plenty of clients for people you know, to get. But do you deserve them? Are you going to be good enough? And I guess the place where integrated clinics to me are necessary, but have fallen short is in their communication. Because you could go to an interdisciplinary clinic that nobody talks to each other. So the chiropractor says, Go see my massage therapist. Okay? But what is that massage therapist going to do to specifically help the chiropractor with what he needs to do or she needs to do in order to affect the results of that patient and the injury that they may have? That's the question. And so, but nobody's talking to each other. And so you go into these places, and you go to the the therapist, the chiropractor, the PT, but nobody's having, there's no cohesive plan of action that they're doing. And I think that that is because people don't speak the same language. One speaks the nerve language, one speaks the muscle language, one speaks to joint language. And if we were to bring our professions together more, then we might get better outcomes from them. And that doesn't mean like you said, that you have to be the jack of all trades, it means you need to know enough about the body that you're affecting, to know if what you're affecting, is going to negatively affect something else.

Unknown Speaker 36:25  

Right.

Eric Dagati 36:26  

So to steal from Kelly Starrett, he calls, he calls it being a savage generalist of what he sees really being the, the the leader of the future in our field and being able to, to not just be a mile deep, but also be a mile wide. And you know, David Epstein's book range, he talks about this and you can have, you know, if you have that multidisciplinary center where nobody's communicating, it's like, five, six people digging these parallel tunnels, but they never poke their head up to see where the the person next so they can, if they just were to join forces, they wouldn't have to, they can get a lot more done in less time. So having that ability to, to know a little bit outside of where you're at. And not this is where I was talking about where we can get so deep down a rabbit hole of talking about and I deal a lot with, with baseball athletes, and we get into the, into the minutiae, sometimes about pitchers exact degrees of hip rotation, when they when we're missing a bigger picture that this Okay, this person is, this guy's, you know, 25% body fat and, and has breathing issues and doesn't sleep and has other issues that are much bigger problems. That's not to say that, that hip rotation is not important. It's just not our primary thing right now. And so if I can get a more global approach first, sometimes a lot of those local things clean up. And that's what we kind of started as people when we do like some movement, work with them. And and we'll say, Okay, I could find 20 things wrong with you on an evaluation. But we can maybe do one toe touch drill, one breathing drill, and five of those things clear up without even directly working on that any of those things. And that's what kind of gets people to see if there's a global system that kind of overrides all of this. And like you said, it, we're not just a bunch of wires and parts, it would make our lives a lot easier, quite frankly, if you could. But this is a human dynamic that we're dealing with. It's that there's a that there's a, you know, there's a structural side, too, but there's also a physiological chemical side to and there's a mental spiritual side to that. And all those things interact. And you can't necessarily undo some of those things with structural approaches. So we have to kind of appreciate that. There's the big picture, the holistic view of it.

Ari Gronich 38:57  

Yeah, absolutely. I appreciate that. And so here's my, my question. This is, this is a game we're gonna play for the next few minutes. Okay. It's the game of solving the world problem. Amen. So, we have this problem where obesity, disease, inflammation, health has gone out of control. This is, this is a scenario that I'm going to call a false scenario, even though it's true. Okay, so we have this scenario. And all of the people have been brainwashed to think that the thing that's going to solve their issue is the thing that is going to hurt them and the thing that's going to hurt them is the thing that's going to solve their issue. For example, sugar versus fat, right? That bad sugar good. This is what people have been told for, you know, lots of years. So we're gonna just kind of name that. So somebody comes into you into see you that has this array of issues. Okay? In five minutes, let's solve their this person's issue. So I'm going to pretend like I'm him, and I want you to pretend like you're you. And you're gonna start as I

Unknown Speaker 40:37  

do every day,

Ari Gronich 40:39  

right? You're gonna start this process because I want I want people to kind of get an idea of what they're missing when they go to people who aren't qualified.

Unknown Speaker 40:50  

Okay, let's have some fun. Right?

Unknown Speaker 40:53  

So

Ari Gronich 41:01  

I just knocked. Okay, I came, I came in your office. So you're starting with me?

Eric Dagati 41:10  

Okay, so the first question I asked every single time is what brings you here? Why are you here?

Ari Gronich 41:17  

Yeah, you know, I just, I've got so many things happening. I'm so stressed. And I just want to function at my peak so I can feel good.

Eric Dagati 41:30  

Okay, so explain what your peak is. Because a lot of people, you're going to come in today, tomorrow and yesterday with different ideas what that peak is, what does that look like for you?

Ari Gronich 41:41  

Yeah, you know, I don't know, I've never really been at a peak. So I'm looking forward to experiencing what a peak might look like.

Eric Dagati 41:49  

Okay. So So that being said, So why aren't you there now? Like, what what's the biggest thing hold you back?

Ari Gronich 41:56  

Well, you know, I've got this massive inflammation. I've been told I'm insulin resistance. I eat what I feel is pretty, pretty healthy and pretty good. But, you know, I don't know cuz I'm just eating what I get. But um, you know, I'm just feeling kind of foggy. Mostly.

Eric Dagati 42:20  

Okay. Tell me tell me Have you? You haven't really felt that peak? Have you? Have you felt anywhere closer? Anything that you felt like you're on the on the right path at any point? Like, have you done anything? That's work?

Ari Gronich 42:33  

No, I just always kind of have felt this low level of energy.

Eric Dagati 42:37  

Okay, and then have you have you done a bunch of things that haven't worked? Meaning like, if you're burying the person kind of bounces diet to diet or workout to work out? Like, tell me a little bit about the history with that?

Ari Gronich 42:48  

Oh, yeah. So you know, weightwatchers when I was 14, you know, I, let's see, I did the subway diet for a little bit. Tried to Atkins. I did the Paleo for a little bit. I did some intermittent fasting. I know this is not in the right order. But you know, it's just things that I tried. Definitely, definitely. I tried to be a vegan for a little while vegetarian for a while. Didn't didn't really help.

Eric Dagati 43:20  

Okay. Any reason why you think any of those failed, was it you think it was like a time thing? Was it discipline? Was it? What was about those things that you think didn't work?

Ari Gronich 43:30  

I really don't know. Okay, that's why I tried them. And when they didn't work, I stopped trying them.

Eric Dagati 43:38  

Got it. Alright, so and then tell me about your your history with exercise. What have you done? Anything that's worked and work things you like things you didn't like?

Ari Gronich 43:46  

Yeah. So I've been an athlete my whole life, but I can't really do much anymore because the injuries what kind of injuries? Yeah, shoulder injuries, back injuries, neck injuries, knee injuries, ankle injury?

Eric Dagati 43:58  

Do I still bother you now? Oh, yeah. And what kind of stuff makes what would make that worse?

Ari Gronich 44:07  

It really just depends on the minute and the motion in that minute. Or the second, you know, really, it's like the second so I could walk and be walking and be perfectly fine. And then all of a sudden I'm step and my back goes out or you know, I could be playing tennis and be perfectly fine. And then all of a sudden, I can't move.

Eric Dagati 44:32  

Got it. So it's it's kind of life with the fingers crossed. Sounds like pretty much Yeah, kinda want to go out and do you want to go out and exercise and do the stuff but not sure if today is going to be the day that your body will allow you to do it. Yeah, right.

Ari Gronich 44:45  

Exactly.

Unknown Speaker 44:46  

Okay, so that being said, as the first thing I want to be able to figure out is is not to tell you what to do. I want to be able to tell you what not to do. All right. And and the the first words you've ever heard of the Hippocratic Oath are do no harm. All right, and So, unfortunately, where we got into the place with with exercise is that we're getting people hurt in the gym, right? And so I want to make sure the first thing I'm able to do is get you to move without hurting, and how am I going to know how to do that, I got to figure out which movements work and which ones don't, everything you do in the life comes down to a subset of about six to eight basic movements, I want to be able to look at those movements objectively. So we put you through a quick movement screen. And then from there, I can tell which movements Do we need to either do one of three things do we need to avoid them altogether, and maybe even get them checked out, maybe this is something I can't handle, maybe it's something that we need a chiropractor or physical therapist for, or to maybe there's something that's not optimal, but I think we can make them better in terms of doing some exercises that might clean up some of those movement flaws that you may have. But at the same time, I want to see which ones are most importantly, which ones you don't have an issue with, because those are the ones we're going to train. Alright, and those are the ones we're going to actually exercise so you can come back more resilient and stronger the next time, so but I need to know what not to do in the first place. Because if you get the you know, we could have a great workout today. But if you're hurting tomorrow, you're not coming back. So that's the first thing we're gonna do. And then the second thing is we're going to look at your nutrition, the same way we look at that your movement is to say, I don't know which ones are good or bad from you, I want to look at what is what I want to look at your habits of how you're reading now. So what I'm going to do is write down everything he drank for the next three days. And then you're going to give that to me, and we'll just kind of sit down. And we're not going to fix everything and it doesn't mean you're going to eat, you know, steamed broccoli for the rest of your life, it means we're going to look at this and say, Okay, well, where's your weakest link, it may be when you eat, it may be what you eat, it may be how you combine the foods that you eat. But most of it, what we found is about habits. And so the last piece of this is that we were not going to look at this in terms of workouts, we're not going to look at this in terms of diets, right? We didn't have a lot of these things that you're talking about 1000 years ago, right, we didn't have a lot of the low back pain, we didn't have a lot of the the weight issues that we have now. But we also didn't have workouts either, right. And so we just had good habits, and whether it was movement habits, or whether it was or feeding habits, or whether it was what I call reset habits, right because there's kind of three buckets that we have to look at here. We need you to move and move well. Alright, and then once you can move well, then you can move off and which means you can go play tennis, you can go play golf everywhere, then we need to look at your fuel, right, and that's fuel that you're going to talk about that you know obviously what you're putting in your body, what you drink, what you eat the fuel, which put in your head, you know if and that's that's kind of the the mental side of things. And we're gonna affect that by the books, you read the TV, we watch the people we hang around with the things you tell yourself, you know, those are the things that are going to talk about the fuel that's going in. So we're going to look at that. And then the last piece is the reset, is that I can only push you as far as you can recover, because we already discussed before that that building doesn't happen here. The we challenge you here, you the building happens the other 23 hours I set you out on the day. So we need to make sure you get the right reset in there. And whether that's breathing, whether that's sleeping correctly, all those things are things we need to consider as well. But we're to look at, that's gonna sound overwhelming. Initially, I need to kind of get a picture of where you're at from a movement standpoint, where you're at from a fuel standpoint, and you know, the questionnaire or what have you fill out, it's gonna tell me a little about your reset standpoint. And then we're gonna see where the biggest issue is, and the big issue, then we start from there. And then we're gonna say, here's your habit for this week that you got to work on. From a movement standpoint, here's your habit, from a fuel standpoint, here's your habit from a reset standpoint. And then once you can check that box and you've you've kind of passed that lesson, then I'm going to give you another one, and I got plenty of you're never gonna run out of lessons. So we're gonna take this as far as you're willing to go. But you can't get to lesson two and two, you've passed lesson one, and that's going to be our process.

Ari Gronich 49:07  

Awesome. So the only thing I think that I would like to add to that, and I you know, I did this so that the audience can hear what they're missing from the people that they're going to because this is the way to do a proper assessment is take the the time and this is obviously condensed greatly, but take the time to ask these questions to provide this kind of a proper plan and explanation of the plan. But the one thing that I would add is, I always ask the questions about the person's family and the person's history emotionally with food mentally, and with with, you know, what is stopping them. I'll ask them about their family if and their friends are Their family and friends, like into barbecues every week. Are they you know, going out and drinking all the time? are they telling you? And are they, you know, basically pushing you to do and participate with them in behaviors that may not be good for you specifically. So I'll get into all of that as well. But But yeah, this is this is very good. Thank you for, for doing that and playing that game with me.

Eric Dagati 50:31  

Absolutely. And then and then letting them know, along that so if we look at that triad of health of chemical, mental, structural, there's things we can control. And there's things we can't structurally I'd love to be taller, it's not happening, right? But there's things we can control. And what we want to look at is what are the factors you can control? And then from there, how willing are you to establish what I call non negotiable habits to say, okay, you he that part of what my days that you're going to do this breathing exercise for 10 minutes every single day, and no, no matter it's snow, hail, sleet, rain, sun, whatever, you're going to get that 10 minutes, and then that just becomes part of what you do. And that's so different than, you know, nobody goes around complaining all day saying, brushing my teeth is killing me morning night, brushing my teeth, it just became part of an accepted non negotiable habit that you don't think of not brushing your teeth, it's just part of what you do. And then we're gonna establish habits like that for you, I don't know what the non negotiables are going to be for you. But you're going to have to decide on those and you can't let outside influences steer you off that course.

Ari Gronich 51:35  

Right? Well, for me non negotiable. You know, I only brush my teeth once every two months.

Eric Dagati 51:45  

And if that works, it's hard for me to argue with you. Yeah.

Ari Gronich 51:51  

So we've kind of gone through some of how an audience member might choose differently when they're choosing their therapists or trainers or people. What's the number one thing that you might say to a trainer, therapist person, if they're operating under the standards of care. And they are afraid of moving away from that in order to actually get results because of being investigated or having licenses looked at? I know a lot of chiropractors have moved under that functional medicine by taking away their DC and and joining organizations like the pastoral Medical Association, for instance, in order to basically shift their liabilities. But what would you say to somebody who is looking at the system and going, this is not working. And I'd really like to see it change, because I do like activists.

Unknown Speaker 53:06  

So

Eric Dagati 53:07  

I think the more you can prove that you can get to this same point faster, it's going to leave you time to do those types of things that you want. And not so much to your point in the scope of practice. But But let's say if you get really good at at your assessment piece, and the ability to kind of ascertain what someone needs, you can sharp shoot much more what it is that you want to do in terms of treatment. So, you know, it goes back to you know, Abraham Lincoln said, if he gave me, you know, five hours to cut down the tree, I'm gonna spend the first four and a half sharpening the blade. And so if you can really dial in your assessment, while the the therapist at the table next to me or the trainer on the floor next to me is spending three weeks trying to figure out how to address this issue, I get it done in in three days. Because I took more time off, I invested the time up front, and I was able to sharp shoot as opposed to taking the shotgun approach to everything. Now what that does is the other 27 days or that I have that you don't have that you were kind of fumbling in doing trial and error. It gives me the freedom to do a lot more things. Okay, and it gives me a freedom to do a lot more things in that. Were the biggest constraint for a lot of people is especially therapists is time will say, Well, now Yeah, I just opened up some more time for you here. Just you got to make the deal to you know, if it's the head of the clinic to say I tell you what if I can get this done and get them to where I need to, in less time, just don't shove more clients in I make more patients in my schedule more clients on my schedule. Let me use that time to do more things with them. And that's going to allow me to get them back on the skis. Get them to be able to do the things that they ultimately came here for not just to be void of their their knee pain. And the same thing goes on on the training side to say, I want to be able to say I can do a whole lot more for you than you even expected. But to do that, I have to make sure I'm really dialed in and efficient with my time. And that's meaning, I need to know how to sharp shoot this thing, and not just take the shotgun approach of this for that, and I'm gonna try out 90 different exercises today, where if I can really dial it down to the one or two that you need, that gives me the rest of the time to really to, to grow and do more different things.

Ari Gronich 55:32  

Yeah, test test, test, test, test, test, test, test. And then fire.

Unknown Speaker 55:41  

Yes. So yeah, measure to

Ari Gronich 55:43  

measure twice, cut once, right? In our profession, it can be really devastating, to not measure first, and just fire. Right? I mean, we can cause a lot of damage. And that's, that's kind of the the last thing like, we tend to cause a lot of damage these days where, you know, you you mentioned this a little bit earlier, but we tend to cause injuries quite a bit because of our lack of ability to individualize treatments. And you know, that that's a big problem in that we're having, I mean, I know, CrossFit is getting a lot of slack for being the number one most sued system in history for injuries, but that's just one of them. I mean, we do it a lot. So how do we how do you think that we can, as an industry avoid, causing more damage than then we're solving

Eric Dagati 56:50  

the challenges, the damage that we're causing isn't always immediate, right? If every time you did an exercise that was inappropriate for you, you immediately need to go to the hospital, there'd be a running ambulance in front of every gym in America. But it's, it's it's not that it's, it's what happens is, is you do it, and it leaves a little bit of, you know, Chip, and then the next time it's a little bit of a chip, it's kind of like, you know, the Andy defraying, breaking out of the prison and Shawshank Redemption, it just puts a little bit takes a little bit away. And then what happens, that person goes to shovel snow, and they hurt their back and they say, Oh, I hurt my back shoveling snow, no, you hurt your back the last 20 years with your bad posture, bad habits and whatever it was. And that was the proverbial straw that broke it. And so there isn't this one to one aspect of always immediately seeing the result of our poor choices professionally, on our clients and patients. And so because of that, we assume sometimes we're doing better than we really are. And on the end user, they don't automatically make the assumption and our connection, that this is because I'm doing the wrong things in the gym, or I'm getting the wrong type of treatment. And so that's what's that's what makes it challenging is that it's not an absolute one to one immediacy of what you're seeing the results of what we're doing. And so that's where you may not even see the result of you know, it taking it to a philosophical level, that patient that you failed. Now, that is that case scenario we said before, that wants to play tennis that wants to be active. And now all of a sudden, because they failed, they take that burden on themselves, and now they become more sedentary. And that just compiles more and more different risk factors on top of that, and that, you know, I talked about that what we call a fork in the road where we get to see a lot of people. And if you can get someone like yourself from steers them on the right path, how life changing that can be. But if they go and I felt a little better, but it's not good. I just have this pinched nerve. And this is just me, this is my label, this is what I got. And then I'm just gonna let that happen to me. And then I'm going to gain 10 pounds, and that turns into 15. And then I have blood pressure medication and cholesterol medication. Allison, I'm this huge health risk. That's a hugely different different pathway that they went on. And all it needed was the right steering to get on that right road. And so that's what we're not seeing. We're not seeing that once one immediate. So you want to be able to see the client that you failed 10 years down the road, what effect of that half

Ari Gronich 59:32  

that's a that's profound. So I hope that for those trainers and people that are out there listening that are in the profession, I think, I hope that what he just said what Eric just said, really went through to your soul because you don't know what you can't see. And so I mean, I've gotten a lot of clients Coming in, who've been injured by trainers and therapists and people like that, and they'll never tell, they'll never tell the therapist or the trainer that they got hurt on their watch, they just won't show up again. And so all the trainer therapist knows as well, that person didn't show up, I need more leads, right. But they didn't show up because you hurt them. You know. And so sometimes it's like you said, over a long haul, 20 years of creating imbalanced movement and compensation patterns and things like that, and it could be an immediate, you know, I picked up that weight wrong, and, and twisted my back, you know, I mean, I've seen people herniated discs from sneezing and twisting at the same time. So, you know, I just, I want the profession I want the people in the profession, as is, obviously my desire, my selfishness, to really get an idea of the fact that they can either be a purveyor of hope, or they could be a purveyor of hopelessness and fear, you can either create a result that creates a, you know, optimism and high performance, or you can create a result that leads people to sedentary movement, and afraid to go work out. And that's a choice that we all have to make. Eric, you've been a tremendous guest. And I really appreciate you know, this information, I know, it's, I take things into places that are sometimes a little darker than then, you know, we would like because I'm definitely all about, let's expose, to the dark, you know, expose the darkness to the light, so to speak, let's let's take these hidden things that are in our professions and expose them for the world to see. So maybe we get some change in some difference. But anyway, I really appreciate you coming on helping helping to expose some of this stuff. You know, why don't you tell us a little bit about how people could get ahold of you if they'd like to. And any tips or tricks I know you've started, you know, stated a number of them, but any tips or tricks for helping create a new tomorrow today?

Eric Dagati 1:02:33  

Yeah. Well, in terms of finding, finding me could just the easiest place to just go to my website, which is Eric dagati.com. And then you have all my social media and so forth that you can find on there. And feel free to reach out with any questions directly through that. And then in terms of any tips is I go back to those, what I call the three big things of a move, fuel and reset, and don't lose sight of those. And if you're not where you want to be, there's there's something missing in one of those three buckets, if not all of them. And we can get away with having something missing in some of those buckets, if we're strong enough, and the other two to make up for. But you can't drain all three of those. And so looking at making sure do I move well, and if I do move, well, do I move enough? If or do I not move well, but I move too much, right? Any one of those combat combinations is not good. And then the second is fuel, what am I putting into my body, whether it's a, whether it's what I eat, what I drink, or what i what i think and listen to and experience and expose myself to because that all leaves an imprint, just like every cell in your body is made out of, of amino acids from the proteins and, and, and glycogen from from those sugars and fatty acids, a cholesterol from your fats, all your cells are a byproduct of what's your fuel is And the same thing goes for what's going on. On a larger scale. It's your spirit and that's fuel that you put in into your head. And then the last piece is you're giving yourself a chance to reset. And then with that reset that reset doesn't always have to be an external thing. It's meaning that reset doesn't mean that I go to a cryo tank every day or I got a couple $100 massage gun or both things not that that's necessarily a bad thing. But if you're constantly relying on those, you're probably you know, off somewhere else. That Am I sleeping right? And am I getting the right reset? Am I breathing right even those those simple things, if you can check those boxes, then a lot of the other stuff falls into place. So establishing the right habits and those three categories i think is the biggest thing to get started and then you want to get down into the weeds. We can certainly do that but not until you've checked those three boxes.

Unknown Speaker 1:05:01  

Awesome, thank

Ari Gronich 1:05:01  

you so much, Eric for coming on for providing the audience with your education, your wisdom, and, and I look forward to seeing what you create in in our industry and the movement that develops because you're teaching this kind of system and this kind of care to our industry. So thank you very much for that.

Unknown Speaker 1:05:27  

I appreciate the opportunity.

Ari Gronich 1:05:28  

Absolutely. Remember to like, subscribe, rate review, comment below so we can create conversations that matter and create a new tomorrow today activate our vision for a better world. I am your host, Ari Gronich, and this has been another episode. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you for listening to this podcast. I appreciate all you do to create a new tomorrow for yourself and those around you. If you'd like to take this information further and are interested in joining a community of like minded people who are all passionate about activating their vision for a better world. Go to the website, create a new tomorrow.com and find out how you can be part of making a bigger difference. I have a gift for you just for checking it out, and look forward to seeing you take the leap and joining our private paid mastermind community. Until then, see you on the next episode.