Registered Nurse, veteran, wellness coach, author, and public speaker (phew!), Kori Rae Kovacs BSN RN joins me in conversation today. She shares wisdom from her personal and professional experience, actionable suggestions for how to move past shame to dress authentically, and a new question to help us all figure out how we want to dress.

Episode Transcript

This transcript has been edited for clarity.

Maureen: As a life and wellness coach, you specialize in inspiring others to embrace unique strengths, essentially matching our outsides to our insides. I love this concept. Can you share a little bit of a glimpse into your approach?Kori: Yeah, absolutely. I came up with this phrase about, you know, bringing your insides outsides, or bringing this like matching component of what you feel who you are on the inside, who you are at a soul level, and really getting the opportunity to share that out in the world. I feel like I came across this concept. I'm not really sure where, but I developed it kind of became a mantra for me when I realized that I have this beautiful being inside of me that is just wanting to come out. I had really gone through a really challenging time in my life, and I felt like. I was kind of hiding myself, and when I started reconnecting with this person that I am, you know, this person who has grown through resiliency through things that have been challenging. Then suddenly I realized, Wow, she's a really cool person. I want to bring her out into the world. And so I started matching my outsides to the person that I was feeling and getting to know on the inside. And when that happened I just feel like I was like coming out of a cage. Suddenly my wings, just like burst out, and I was able to really show up in the world as the person that I believe that I am.Maureen: That's incredible. And you talk about this idea of, you know, you've been through these difficult situations, and it almost sounds to me like that inner confidence came first, and then the outside happened second, do you have a perspective on, you know which need? If you can, fake it till you make it? Or does the inner confidence come first? Does it kind of depend? Or at least just speak from your perspective.Kori: Yeah, that's such a great question, because I think we live in a day and age where they talk about, you know, faking it till you making it or putting this front on the outside, but really not feeling confident on the inside. I know I share that story a lot with my audience is that I believe that confidence comes from your self-trust within yourself. It's not something that you can just snap and say, Oh, I feel confident today I'm going to go out and do this thing. I think that feels really forced. And so to me, it's about building trust with yourself getting to know who you are, and then expressing and taking action from that step that truly brings the confidence out in you, because you can feel confident, maybe in in some things, you know, but not in other areas. And I truly believe that you know, if you look up confidence in the, in the etymology. I'm a huge etymology nerd. So if you look at confidence, what that means, it really means a reliance or deep trust in something or someone, and when we talk about confidence about you having a deep trust and reliance in yourself, to be able to go out and be this person that you know that you can be so when you start building that self trust. Then that's really where the confidence starts to grow.Maureen: How have you built self trust, personally?Kori: That's such a great question. I you know a lot of it had to come from a place of compassion. Like, of being human. And I had gone through a really hard time in my life. I became a single mom, and my career took a shift. I was going to school to become a nurse during the pandemic, and things just really fell apart in my life. Trajectory as I was approaching, and I felt a lot of shame and a lot of guilt about the direction of where I was going, and in addition to that, I had gained like pounds. And so there was all these things that had happened, and I really lost my confidence and my faith in myself to be able to go out into the world and show the world who I was. So I feel like the moment that I decided to offer compassion for this place, and in the survival mode that I had been in and what had happened to me in my life. Suddenly it opened up space for me to actually get to know who I was, and when that happened, I started taking steps by journaling and meditating and moving my body in a way that felt genuine to me and that consistency of really finding out who this person was. Suddenly. Now I was like, oh, you're actually a pretty cool kid. I really kind of like you. And so like, day by day, that trust just started to build. And then I was able to go back out into the world and show, you know, come out in my style and come out, you know, and start a business, and and all of these things that honestly, a couple of years ago I wouldn't have had the courage to do.Maureen: I mean, it makes me feel somewhat emotional, you know, talking about that thick layer of shame that just can sit, sit on us, and make it so difficult to like crack through into the person that we actually are. And just I so relate to that. I want to talk more about this idea of self-compassion, and maybe you can talk about that with, sharing a little bit about more about how your relationship with your body has changed, you know, being a veteran, being a registered nurse, a parent life coach, you know, and then also that that kind of weight gain that you experience. Can you tell us a little bit more about? You know your relationship to your body, and how that's changed over time.Kori: Oof! That has been a challenge. I feel like my whole life. You know I was a dancer. I was a dancer when I was growing up, and I just loved moving my body. But as I went through puberty suddenly I became a very curvy girl. I had, I mean, overnight, you know, by the time my freshman year I was a double d, and I had big hips and big thighs. I kind of have a you know, curvy but athletic, muscular body, and it didn't fit the mold of being a dancer. As a matter of fact, my my junior year of high school. I was not. I was not allowed to join the pom squad, because they literally told me I my body was distracting like that. My boobs were too bouncy that it was. It was too sexy like you think about that. And I'm like, Oh, my God!Right, and that there's these messages that just kept telling me that my body was wrong. The very first night I was in Boot camp you brought up being a veteran. The very first night I went to. They made me stand at attention for 45 minutes because they didn't know what to do with me, because I had. I had scored a perfect score on the Asvab, which means I could basically do whatever job in the military I wanted, but I was 2 pounds under their weight limit, and they were like.The first words that were told to me is like Skaggs. That was my maiden name with Skaggs. They're like “Skaggs. You are lazy. That's your problem.”Maureen: Oh!Kori: So, yeah, so there was this and that carried with me. Lazy. You're lazy because they looked at my body, and they said, You know they looked at my weight. They looked at my body, even though I was. Oh, my gosh! I was 146 pounds, by the way, like, really, this is ridiculous here. But they said that I just I didn't care about my body, and that I was lazy, and that message was carried around for a decade, and I internalized all of these messages that my body was wrong, that I was. You know I was also hyper sexualized in in the military. And you know, experienced a lot of things that I shouldn't have had to go through because of that. And you know, after I got out suddenly, I realized I had a lot of feelings about my body, and they were not. They weren't good. They weren't good.

So then, you know, I really did have to come face the music a little bit about that relationship with my body, because it really was hurting me, and I didn't realize it. So when I came to that point of compassion. Suddenly I realized that relationship was so severely damaged. and I remember crying one day when I had this insight that my body was my soul's mate. I just had this beautiful concept that my soul came here to earth to express itself, to do its mission to, you know, whatever my soul came here to do, and that my body was here to support that. And so they literally are a team together. And I had been hating this other part of me, and it like I was almost crushing when I have remember, I remember just bawling my eyes out when I realized that. And so I decided from that day on that I was going to get to know who this souls mate was, who my souls may, who my body was, and that changed everything. That was years ago when that happened. And it just, everything changed after that.Maureen: Good for you, and I mean, I want to acknowledge to the trauma that led to the shame around your body right? Because it's not just that people were making these comments about your body. It was what they, what these comments meant about who you are as a person. This idea of laziness based on your physical appearance, which is, you know, so much driven by genetics, to begin with. [Editor’s note: and zip-code]Kori: Right.

Maureen: And then. But really like it wasn't just that they're commenting on your body. They're they're making it mean something about you. And that's how we get to this idea of shame, which is basically I always want to clarify. Shame and guilt are different. Shame is, I am bad, and guilt is, I did something bad and. Really getting to to see that difference. And self-compassion is when we can look at ourselves and say, at the core, we are okay. We are good, we have good intentions, we do our best, and sometimes we will make actions that are not in alignment with our own values.

For so many reasons that happens and be able to say, and I love myself anyway, and that could also be, I'm neutral about my body, anyway. It doesn't to me. It doesn't have to be that I love my body every day or every single way. I try to have more of a body neutrality perspective personally, but you can still have self compassion, even when you are still struggling with your body. And I would say that they're they're very related. I just really wanted to to talk about that more. That idea of of shame and self-compassion is the only way through really.Kori: It really is. There's this saying, I like to say is that curiosity is the cure for judgment. When we when we bring curiosity to any situation, whether it's about our bodies or in relationships or anything right, we suddenly step into a vibration of like that's outside of judgment. You cannot be curious about something, and judge at the same time, it's impossible. Yeah, and so, I think when it came to my body like, that's where the the compassion was able to come in is like, I started to get curious about this, this, this thing right, this this you know, part of me that has always been here. And curious about how I relate to that part of myself. And suddenly I wasn't criticizing myself as much. I stopped walking by the mirror and saying, You're disgusting, like I right those things that we do, I mean. Oh, my gosh, we all do, and it's very relatable. And I remember feeling how hard like, how hard that was, and how damaging that was now that I look back on it.

But but when I was in the thick of it. The curiosity is what allowed that compassion to come in, because suddenly it I looked at it through new eyes, instead of saying, You know, oh, my stomach is, you know, fat and ugly. I actually got curious about why my stomach, I had gained weight in my stomach turns out that my body was actually trying to save my life because I was insulin resistant. So like, when I started getting curious about what actually had happened to my body. Suddenly I no longer felt that anger and resentment, and carried that shame. I was able to let some of that go because of that curiosity.Maureen: I'm curious what you think about this: we we still, even when we bring ourselves that compassion and that curiosity, we can still struggle with negative self-talk. I mean, I certainly deal with this all the time. I've made huge strides towards being more positive about my body and feeling more comfortable, and dressing the way that I want to not just based on what I think I should be wearing. But you know there are moments where I still look in the mirror I feel in my body, and I'm like, Oh, that's I still struggle with that. I'm curious. If you relate to that at all, and how you how you handle that, you know, knowing that we're not always going to have positive thoughts about our body, just because in general we're feeling better about it.Kori: Yeah, absolutely. I, it's, you know, I would be remiss to say, that, oh, yeah, I, every single day, I'm like, oh, my gosh, Buddy, you're amazing. But what I do is, I build things into my schedule that actually make me feel good about my body, and I do that consistently so.

For example, one of the things I do is I set aside time every single day, and have built my business around, making sure that I take care of myself in the morning, and that means I'm getting, you know, if I'm breaking my fast, you know, at that particular time I have nutrition that supports my body in that way, so, you know, supports my gut or supports my health. I'm making sure that I'm doing movement that brings me joy, and that does not come from a place of abuse. Right? Because I did that for a decade, where I abused my body and was told to abuse my body, and that I that was horrible. Now that's not the place that I come from. I come from a place of love and joy generation rather than I have to be thinner or be, you know, change my body because I don't like the way it looks. It's more like, I get to come back to a place of self-love in that in that space. And so by those consistent actions. Suddenly, now that negative self-talk, it becomes less and less because I'm intentionally building in things that that makes me feel strong. That reminds me that I'm capable reminds me that my body is capable. And when I do those things. Suddenly the self-talk, it gets a lot smaller. The negative stuff talk, I mean, yeah.Maureen: And maybe this is a tricky question. But can you think of how the experience of moving your body today feels different in comparison to when you were abusing your body?Kori: Oh, my gosh! So last year I had started doing a program on Beachbody called Fire and Flow, and I remember this moment where I had just finished a workout, and , who's of the trainers in this program. She she I don't even remember what she said exactly, but there was this feeling I had that I was actually nourishing myself, and that the movement that I was doing was loving me, not hating me, and this moment that I had. I start, I'm sweating, and I'm bawling. overwhelms me with emotion, because suddenly I was like realized I was doing something that was caring for me, and not making me feel like a piece of crap, you know, and and I had been in that space, and really had begun to resent movement. And you know, like I had a lot of unpack a lot of that, because I resented moving my body because I was forced to do it so for so long. And told that my body was wrong and forced to make it smaller. And then suddenly, I needed to get back into a space where I realized movement actually is more than that, it's about loving my mind and helping me relieve my anxiety and helping me feel stronger and more flexible, and like all these things. And so now I was able to see that movement was not about shrinking myself. Movement was actually about loving myself.Maureen: Oh, man, that's so powerful, I think. I don't know if you're very familiar with positive psychology.

Kori: Absolutely.Maureen: Yeah, I just hear this overlap with moving towards good rather than trying to avoid bad right? And when you're in that kind of abusive state you're trying. You're you're afraid of your body. You're afraid of being fat. You're afraid of getting fat. You're afraid of what people will say about you, or you're afraid ofwhat barriers your body might create, or society will create around your body. Right. And then the positive psychology of you know moving towards positive is, you know, when I do, Yoga, I feel more relaxed. I feel more able to go back to my work day. Through the rest of the day I feel more able to show up for my family. I feel more strong, It just seems like you're really encompassing those positive psychology practices.Kori: Oh, my gosh, you I mean, like I'm sitting here. I'm like pointing on my nose. I was like you hit the nail on the head in terms of my personal philosophy. You know this is what I teach my clients in in wellness or in, you know, if they're trying to make moves in their career or improve their relationships. The thing is is that the more that we focus on the negative pieces, then the more the energy that we're feeding it.

I mean, you had said something about that fear of being judged for our bodies, or negative consequences for our bodies being the way it was, and I literally lived with that for a decade, because I was always under threat of getting kicked out like if you were not making weight. You were losing your job, and that was, I mean, the stress that came from that which also raised my cortisol was which meant I was not losing weight like, and like. I realize that mental, that mentality, and how much I would love to go back to that Kori and say, sister, like here, you know, come back to love and come back to like you said, using that positive psychology mindset of, you know, moving towards what you want instead of away from what you don't like when you start focusing. You know. I think you know says that, like what you you know, where where attention goes, energy flows. And and that is so true because the more you focus on that care, that self-care that I'm moving for care. I'm moving because it makes me joyful because it connects me to myself because it, you know it feels good. The more you focus on that, the easier it becomes.Maureen: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Well, I suppose we should talk about clothing.Kori: Maybe we should get to that point.Maureen: We talked a little bit at the beginning about making your “outsides match your insides, and I would just love to hear, how do you decide what to buy or wear today? How do you decide what not to buy or wear?Kori: Yeah, I love that. I love these questions. They're so amazing. So how do I decide what to buy or what to wear. I had this amazing exercise that I got inspired by one day. I don't even remember where it came from, but I asked myself in my journal, I said, how would I dress if I didn't think I was fat?

Maureen: Yeah!Kori: And then suddenly, I was just like I would dress. I would wear my ties again, and I would put on lace and my leather pants and pencil, you know, just like I would wear my, you know, I just wrote out this whole thing. I was like, Oh, my gosh! That's how I actually want to dress. And I realized that. And so I made a commitment to myself that day. And I said, Okay, I'm not going to buy anything else unless it fits inside this kind of style value like that's what I called it like. It's like my values about my style. And unless it's very intentional, like, Okay, I'm not going out in my corset to go feed the chickens, guys. Okay.

But I mean, you know, I am wearing a T-shirt that feels, you know, good to me in terms of my color or expression. So even in that space, like my workout clothes or things like that, I'm very intentional about what I buy and does it fit within my personal style value. And, you know, on a daily basis, like what I choose. Why, you know how I choose what I want to wear daily. Well, that's like a fun little game I like to do. I go into my closet, and I ask myself, you know, kind of ask my inner self, or even my inner child and say, What would you like to wear today? And she's like, Oh, pick this and pick this. And so I just do that. And you know I have some freedom in that. I work from home, and I, you know, get to kind of play with my style a little bit. But even when I'm going for a speaking engagement, or or, you know, out to a workshop like I still play that game, because that's how I bring the curiosity, the play the part of me that wants to express herself, and it gets me out of my head. And I'm able to fully show up as myself, and in authenticity that way.

Maureen: I've done some inner child therapy. So I'm very familiar with that concept. But for anyone who's listening, who, you know, maybe isn't as familiar with inner child. How well, besides, what it is, maybe. Can you talk about how you you know when you are getting dressed? How do you tap into that inner child. I want to be really practical.Kori: Yeah, really practical. Honestly, I would say that music helps me do that honestly.Maureen: Oh!Kori: We were kind of talking about this before we started talking. But I have like curated playlists that I have on my phone. That's very specific. That gets me into a certain mood. So if I want to tap into my inner child, I'll listen to music that feels uplifting that I used to love as a kid. Typically things like you know, I was. I was a teenager during the boy band, so I'll put on ‘Nysnc and dance around my room for a minute. So you know, getting tapping into this inner child, part of you requires, like a little bit of movement and kind of that shift, you know. Nostalgia kind of helps a lot as well gets you into that space and and smiling just even doing that can help you connect with a little bit more playfulness and a little bit more authenticity. And so I literally do that before I go into my closet I find a way totap in, and it's almost I had to think about it for a minute, because it's almost just like automatic. Because I get into that state. And but when I do, I feel like I feel so much better, because there's also times where I'm not wanting to be super vibrant. And that changes, you know, throughout my cycle, wherever I'm at in my cycle, you know. Sometimes I want to dress up like a villain right? Which is also kind of fun, you know, like, sometimes I want to dress up like a bad guy, and I'm like, how would I dress if I was a bad guy today. And then I put on my jean jacket, and you know, like my spiky earrings and things like that. So that's a it's really just kind of tuning in like, how am I feeling today? Who do? I want to express myself today?And you know that getting into that vibe is, you know, that's kind of a part of that self trust of like getting to know who you are and knowing who you are throughout. You know your cycle or throughout your kind of emotional patterns. And it's it's a lot of fun when you do that.Maureen: I've been thinking a lot about dressing as my inner child and and someone on Substack, Lindsay Sword, had posted this this thing about styling sweater vests, and when I was in like elementary school, I had multiple sweater vests from the gap that I wore on like repeat. I just got a new sweater vest, and I was like absolutely like obsessed with it. I'm just curious, you know. Are there any things that you wore as a kid, that you are literally like kind of thinking about today, or even colors, or what did little Kori wear?Kori: Oh, my! Gosh, have a picture of me sitting over here on on one of my where I'm like sitting on a merry-go-round, and I'm wearing this bright teal sweater with like all kinds of stuff on it, and teals teals like one of my favorite colors. So I remember just loving wearing bright things, and you know, we you know, grew up shopping secondhand, you know. And and so I remember always going to the goodwill and and finding the most colorful things that I could. And so I think, as I've gotten older, been able to play with color and find the ways that I want to express myself has been really fun to see. You know, this kind of idea of what I thought was cool, or what I thought I was fun, you know, especially growing up in the late eighties early nineties like there was color everywhere. So, and then, having the tease. Bangs, I mean, Jeez, I've already got, you know, teasing my bags so like I mean, because my bangs literally stood straight up as a kid. They called me Porcupine, because my literally stood straight up, and I'm like, Oh, look well, I guess this works now, because my hair naturally wants to do this swoosh. So yeah, like, really bringing that those kinds of things in and just not taking myself so seriously. Yeah. And I love this like idea of what you said with the sweater vest. I'm like, oh, what did like? I have to think about that, because I love that idea that is so great bringing that in. And it sounds like it makes you happy too.Maureen: For whatever reason, when I was a kid I just thought they were the absolute, coolest thing, and no one was wearing them, no one. Just me. So that's how I know it's authentic.Kori: There you go exactly, and you get to do that. And the thing is is like people might look at you like funny, like I know when I show up in my bright as pink, you know, jacket and pants and all these things like, sometimes people are like, Whoa, okay, but I realized, too, when I stopped when I stopped dressing for other people's approval and started dressing for my own approval. I just got so much freer and so much happier, and you know it. Really, it really makes a difference.Maureen: I love that. Let's talk a little bit about body awareness. We've talked about how you bring yourself into that kind of childlike wonder space when you're getting dressed. But when you are picking out what to to wear, do you pay attention to texture, fit, or style that feel physically comfortable on your body or on the other side of that. Do you ever wear something that's intentionally uncomfortable because it puts you into a certain headspace. I'm curious about that, too.Kori: I love this because I realized being, you know. So, being a professional speaker and a person who's out in the, you know, kind of out there on stages and doing things. I had started looking at different women and what they were doing kind of in my industry. And I realized a lot of them wear heels. And I, when I first started speaking, I had this like choice point where I realized I was like, Well, I get to choose how I want to show up. And I realized, I jump around on stage. I move around an awful lot, and I was like, I don't. I do not want to do that in heels, and so I made a choice. I was like, I'm not going to speak in heels. I'm going to speak in my chucks, because that's what I love to wear, and they're comfortable, and that gives me the freedom to move around and to not like worry about my feet because I don't want to be worrying about my feet when I've been standing on stage for an hour and a half, like I want to be serving the people that I came there. I want to be, you know, in flow. I don't want to be worrying about my feet. So yeah, I made a choice like right then and there. I was like, I'm not going to wear heels to speak, even though heels, I mean aesthetically.

Sure. I mean. You know they make you taller. I'm kind of short. I'm a Shorty girl. I'm about , so you know it. Would it make my legs look longer and kind of things, sure. But bro, I'm like I. And so, you know, I'm sure there's other things, too. But I feel like that particular point is like you making the choice about how you want to show up and realizing that actually comfort in that regards actually does matter because it it is distracting. If you're not feeling comfortable. The textures of the clothes you're wearing, or things are too tight or or just, you know, for the sake of again, kind of like this external approval. And if you do make that choice to wear something, then be intentional with it. Don't just be like, Oh, I'm going to wear these heels because they expect me to. It's like, Oh, I'm going to wear these heels because I feel like today. I want to be in that space. Maybe I want to feel extra sexy. Or maybe there's something you know, particularly like you said a feeling I want to come into. But you best believe I'm gonna have a pair of sneakers in my bag.

Maureen: I love that clarity. And you know I asked that question about purposefully wearing something uncomfortable right? Because, you know, for example, the comedian . You know I don't necessarily agree with everything that she says or does, but I've been watching a lot of her interviews, and she talks about how she wears these like sky high heels to perform in, and she's in such a flow state with her comedy, anyway, that when she's on stage she like puts them on. And then it's like, Okay, it's go time. She's totally fine wearing them for the whole performance, and only when she's done with the performance do her feet hurt, and she wants to take them off.

But I thought that was like so fascinating. It's almost like this, yeah, to what you're saying, like changing from like normal Nikki to stage Nikki, or whatever you know. And I think that's really interesting. But you know, going back to to your performance like you want to be yourself all the time, maybe, and and just really kind of have let your shoes not be the focus.Kori: Yeah, I feel like it's, you know, and I can definitely see what she's kind of saying in that space of like stepping into that person that's on stage. And and it's almost like kind of turning up the volume a little bit, because that does help you get into flow. And you know. I know that there's, you know, there's kind of certain variations of things, you know, days when I'll maybe not turn my volume all the way up when I'm choosing my clothes, or things like that, you know, wanting to be a little bit more casual, but I do know that there is that like I have this hot pink blazer that I wear, and every time I put that thing on man I just feel like a million bucks.

And so I reserve that jacket for when I need that space, because it does help me get into that space. Now, granted, it's fitted for me, and it feels good and everything like that, too. But there is. There is definitely something to be said about that about having something that helps you click, into flow, and like a trigger, so to speak, and so I feel like clothes can do that. Certainly they can be something that can amplify you, if you need some confidence, to go in and talk to your boss about a raise, or, if you need to, you know, have a conversation with somebody that might be difficult. Then yeah, find the thing in your closet that makes you feel great and put that on because it does help a lot.Maureen: I love that like making space for the multiplicity of of human experience, like, we don't have to elevate comfort exclusively. There are other ways. But personally I love being comfortable. So, I always try to balance my own kind of preferences.

We're recording this towards the start of , I guess we're we're months in now, but it feels like it's still just beginning. Do you have any style or personal goals you're excited to work towards this year?Kori: Well, I feel like I've really got a good handle on my, on my wardrobe and where it's going. But I need to start this like, I wrote this down. I love this question because I need to get my stuff tailored like I realized. And I remember that you know, in my image back when I was a image consultant like. I would tell my clients that all the time get your stuff tailored, because clothes right off the rack are not meant for your body. And now that I have this like expanded view of what my body is now, I'm like even more so like I need to step back into a space of like making things fit me, instead of expecting that my body fits everything else, and I feel like that is just such the narrative of my life like there was always this expect expectation that my body fit every external viewpoint, regulation, you know, standard of image or whatever. And I'm at this point now where I'm like, I'm going to make my clothes fit my body, and you know I'm kind of going through some changes in my health, and you know I've been on weight loss journey, and and, you know, getting myself back to health and reclaiming myself after after the challenges I went through. And so tailoring is absolutely becoming more and more necessary, as my body is kind of changing in that way. So I have made that commitment, you know. Thanks to you asking that question. I'm like, What's my goal this year? Yeah, get my stuff tailored so that way I feel. I'm getting the most out of my wardrobe, and it really, truly does fit me and my body.

Maureen: Good for you, good for you.

Kori: It makes a difference. It really does. I, you know I tell people that like it makes a difference, especially with things like that are a little bit more structured. You know, blazers and and jackets, or even but even pair of jeans like getting a pair of jeans tailored. Wow! You can take a pair of jeans from target and elevate those to make them look like they're from Vonmar, okay? Or or Nordstrom like you really can, with a bit of tailoring. And it's definitely not you know, in terms of an investment, a cost investment. It's pennies on the dollar to those kind of other things, so.Maureen: Before we wrap up. I really wanted to go back to this idea of you said it so well, it was like dressing for other people's approval versus your approval. And I was just really hoping you could expand on that a little bit, because I think that's the core of what intuitive style is. And it's not to me not necessarily negating the fact that we're social people, and we care about other people's opinions. But this notion of approval, and how, we decide what we approve or not approve. Can you share a little bit more about that? That concept?Kori: Yeah, I I love this idea of what you're encapsulating here with the approval aspect like, who's approval? Whose approval are we seeking? Is it other people? Or is it ours and understanding that feel like the bridge? There is really about intention.

I like to think about the intentional energy I'm bringing to the space right when I when I dress to go out on a date with my with my partner, like, I want to feel sexy. And yeah, I want, you know, there's an extra action there. So there is thought here that I bring like, what does you know he find attractive. You know he really likes my butt, so I like to wear. You know I have these pair of like Spanx, like leather pleather leggings that I wear, and you know, and I love wearing them, and he loves them. And so there's this part of me that's bringing this intentional energy that we're creating together during an experience through my wardrobe. And that, you know, am I dressing for his approval? Well, in a sense, maybe. But it's different. It's not like I'm only thinking about him. It's I'm thinking about him and me, and who I want to be in this space, and I do that for everything. If I'm doing a speaking engagement. If I have an interview with somebody, if I'm meeting friend for coffee, like, I really spend a lot of time thinking about who do I want to be in this space, and when I do that I find that I show up way more as an authentic person, and not just dressing, because I think that they're going to approve of me. It is considering them right different places, you know. I'm probably going to dress differently with my friend than I will with my, you know, with my partner like that's that naturally makes sense. But when I am more intentional about that.And choose outfits that reflect who I want to be that day. Then I find that that external approval, just like dissipates it goes away, and it really becomes a kind of a collaborative or a community, you know, kind of like you said, we're social creatures. So there is something that's kind of being formed together. But it'syou know it's definitely I'm bringing myself back into that conversation instead of just it just being about other people.Maureen: I love that and such great examples. Thank you for sharing. Kori, this has been incredible. I've learned so much. I love your question about you know. What would I wear if I didn't think I was fat? I love the suggestion of listening to nostalgic music when I get dressed, or when I play in my closet definitely haven't done that in a while. What other advice would you give to someone who's trying to build a wardrobe that feels intuitive to them?

Kori: Just really get to know who you are now. We are dynamic creatures, and we are always evolving. And I think sometimes we go through so much in our lives, you know, if we become moms, or maybe we have a weight change. Or you know, we go through these things, and sometimes we'll look back at pictures, and be like Gosh! I wish I was her again. Gosh! I wish I was back at that weight again. Gosh! I wish I was like right. We look backwards, and I think the more that we come back to this space now, and really get to know who we are now and then start expressing ourselves from that point forward. Now we feel aligned. Now we feel like we feel more genuine in this representation, and no longer are we feeling resentful, or even that shame of that change. Now we are really stepping into who this person is. Right here right now and then who she can come through and step out into the world without. You know that. like we said that external approval. So yeah, just get to know who you are, and that you'll find that when you start matching your matching your outsides with your insides suddenly you feel just much more. You every day.Maureen: I love that that's incredible. And I so relate to that idea I used to. Yeah, like, look longingly at pictures of myself when I was thinner, and I was like, if I just looked like that again. But I've put in so much work to like, be at peace with who I am, and how I want to dress that when I look back on those pictures now, I don't feel that anymore. I just feel like oh, she had no idea how like wrapped up in her body she was, and how obsessed with being thin she was. And now, when I look at those pictures, I don't want to go back there. I don't want to. I don't envy her.

I just feel like, Oh, wow! She needed some love, and you couldn't necessarily see that based on like what we think when we look at a thin person. But I see it. And yeah, I just, I think that's such an incredible incredible truth that you brought up there, which is just, you know, when you're actually living authentically, the the size or your weight. It's just really or whatever you're going through really becomes secondary.Kori: I love that! And I resonate with that so much? There were pictures I looked at, from before I went through all of my challenges you know, in the last decade. And and yeah, I remember looking at myself when I was 120 pounds and thinking, Gosh. You know, she was so awesome. She was so, you know, beautiful blah blah. And but you know, similarly, just like you came back to a space and said. Actually, you know, I don't want to go back to that person, because I now know how incredibly strong I am. I now know how incredibly resilient I am through all the things that I went through, and you know what my body was helping me the whole time. Take care of me. When I was really struggling to take care of myself, and for that I am so grateful. And now I get to bring that wisdom and share, you know, share my story and help others also feel like, Hey, it's okay that we aren't. You know that size that we used to be. And it's okay to focus on our health and our wellness, and, you know, come back to that space. But the more that we realize that, hey, I can be vibrant now, I can feel like myself now, and I don't have to criticize that part of me. Then then, the more that I feel like that compassion comes in, and we really truly feel more alive.Maureen: This has been so much fun and just so eye-opening. And I really hope that everybody gets to listen to listen to this and hear you speak about this topic. And so, speaking of which, where can listeners find you? How do they catch up with what Kori’s up to?Kori: Oh, my gosh, I love this so you can catch me on Instagram at Kori Rae Wellness, or find me on Facebook. I have an amazing group on Facebook called Lead like a Woman. And it is a place where we are ditching the hustle. And we're really stepping into this space of confidence, and leading with our heart and living vibrant lives through prioritization of self-care and building community and collaboration. Because I really feel like the more that women are lit up from within, the more that we can change the world. So you can find lead like a woman on Facebook. And I would be just truly honored for any of you that would like to join to get inside a sisterhood of space where we're talking about taking care of ourselves, you know, from a loving standpoint, and then taking our missions and our purposes out into the world, so we can truly make the changes that we desire to see in the world, and it starts with us.Maureen: Incredible, and for anyone who is maybe not identifying as a woman at this point in time is that a safe space for them as well?Kori: Absolutely. I feel like, I mean, we didn't really talk a whole lot about that particular subject. But there is, you know, I use a lot of divine feminine type of energy, and whether you identify as a woman or non-binary, or you know, whatever your identification is, you know, I'm also a member of the LGBTQ community, and I understand that there's, you know, a lot of challenges in those spaces. But I always create a space of safety, and you know how people want to express themselves. It really is about, you know, we talk a lot about cycles, and we talk about, you know, living through kind of this cyclical rhythm of self. And so there's there's certainly opportunity here. And I use this term woman as a kind of a reclamation of self. And and so, you know, I get it. It might not be for everybody, but absolutely inside that space is is a very, you know. I'm very, very conscious about creating safe space, and for people to, you know, use the pronouns and and have people use the pronouns that are appropriate for them and them to express themselves. But it really is truly about coming back to our personal values of who we are and leaning into, you know, feminine leadership rather than you know. Patriarchal type, type, leadership. There.Maureen: I just wanted to make sure that the right people were getting the message. Kori: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. No. It was a great question. Thank you.Maureen: Thank you so much. Well, I will let you get back to the rest of your day!Kori: Oh, thank you so much, Maureen. It's been truly a pleasure to be able to talk with you, and an honor to share with your community.

Outro

Thank you to our guest, Kori Rae Kovacs BSN RN for joining us today.

Intuitive Style is produced, edited and hosted by me, Maureen Welton.

In case you missed it, Intuitive Style, the podcast, is an offshoot of Intuitive Style, the Substack newsletter. Head on over to Substack, search Intuitive Style, to see the newsletter, which includes thoughtful reflections on what’s happening in the fashion world, guest features, and my encouragement that you can create a wardrobe that fits your life as it is now, no judgement, no rush.

Our theme music is by Noir et Blanc Vie. If you enjoyed this episode, please take a moment to rate and review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, or share this episode with someone you think might enjoy it. Don’t forget to subscribe, as new episodes drop weekly on Fridays and you can listen wherever podcasts are found.

Thanks and see you next week!

Get full access to Intuitive Style at maureenwelton.substack.com/subscribe