Episode Transcript

This transcript has been edited for clarity.

You're listening to Intuitive Style, where we believe that everyone has style. In conversation with fantastic guests, we explore how to tap into our style intuition so that we can dress authentically and live fully. Today's guest is Tina from Semi-Sustainable. Tina is a fashion industry veteran who is about to graduate with her MBA. You know her from her nuanced takes on what it means to shop and dress sustainably and her gorgeous fashion week roundups. Tina, welcome to the show.

Tina

I am so excited to be here. Thank you so much for having me. And can I say I have loved all of your past episodes. You've made my Fridays so much more exciting.

Maureen

Oh, I'm so happy to hear that. It's been so fun to make and just a quick shout out to all the guests who have made it possible!

I'm so happy to talk today. I know we've had a chance to connect a little bit beforehand, so I'm just happy to hear even more from you about your personal style. For anyone who hasn't had a chance to read your column yet, can you describe what Semi-Sustainable is all about and how you got into the sustainable fashion world, specifically?

Tina

Totally. You know, I'll even work my way backwards to that question. So I have always worked in traditional fashion. I started as an omni-channel jewelry and accessories buyer, which is where my heart loves is categories to buy. And then I moved into apparel. And as e-commerce was heating up, I was given this opportunity to work in buying and site merchandising on the online side of the business. And I really loved that. But during that time, I never quite absorbed fashion's impact on the planet.

So when I was starting out, the emphasis was on high-low dressing and being a smart shopper meant you bought from fast fashion. You bought something from a designer and you had this well-rounded wardrobe. And it was in 2018 that I went to a panel talk given by Mara Hoffman's team, and they talked about how they really transform their supply chain to be more sustainable. And they went into great detail about how fashion harms the planet and what they were doing to really take away some of that impact. It was so eye-opening for me.

And after that, I kind of started down this pathway of making changes in my fashion consumption. So it was not overnight by any means, but you know, at the time I was a big Zara shopper and I really worked to slow that down and put more thought into how much I was buying. And for me, what worked in my favor, I was on the earlier side of shopping the RealReal. I've been shopping there for eleven years now. You know, first because, and then I could afford all the designer pieces that I would have loved to have in my budget. And then over time it, because it was more circular and I've shifted a lot of my purchasing to secondhand. Over the last five or six years.

I was on the earlier side of shopping the RealReal. I've been shopping there for eleven years now. I could afford all the designer pieces that I would have loved to have in my budget.

Then for Semi-Sustainable, I started it last fall as my innovation project. For my MBA program and we were able to get approval to work on anything that would really help grow or advance our careers. And I know I would love to work and some kind of sustainable arm of the fashion industry, especially if there's a tech component in there. So, you know, as far as Substack, I had subscribed to newsletters here and there over the last few years, but I really thought they were more of the silo of newsletters and I didn't realize there was this whole fashion Substack universe. And when I got into it, I was hooked. So I started Semi Sustainable as a way to talk about a subject that I love, but also ways we can be more responsible in our consumption. So for me, that's mostly buying secondhand and not new or what I like to call firsthand. And, you know, I don't think fashion and sustainability are these mutually exclusive concepts. You look at brands like Ganni, for example, and you can see it's possible to do or be both.

Maureen

Yeah, I love that. Can you speak a little bit more about, you know, why semi-sustainable rather than fully sustainable, for example?

Tina

I love to say that I could never call this like fully sustainable because it's almost impossible in today's world. If you buy something new, you're manufacturing a new product made out of new materials. It's impacting the planet. So. You can take ways to make it a little more sustainable in your life, whether it's buying secondhand, reducing your consumption, or even outside of fashion. I try to think of ways I can try to reduce my consumption.

What kills me is plastic. I have done a lot of research into plastic for my MBA program. So I'm always the person trying to. Find ways to actually recycle my beauty empties through Sephora or take my plastic packaging back to the grocery store in the hopes that it might be made more circular. So just trying to take those steps, knowing that unless you probably never buy anything again, you'll never be a very fully sustainable person.

Maureen

I love that nuance. I mean, yeah, I think just bringing that nuance and that understanding that full sustainability isn't really even realistic. I resonate with that so much, and Intuitive Style is about is letting go of perfectionism and just seeing those places where perfectionism isn't even possible.

I did want to go back a little bit to that talk by Mara Hoffman. I know that was a while ago, but is there anything that comes to mind that like you remember from that talk that just like really struck you as, ‘sustainability is important and it's possible?’

Tina

You know, I think where they were talking a lot is some things that I knew a little bit more because of my fashion background. So they talked about how they changed their printing processes to use less water or how they'd work with their manufacturing teams to. Have less fabric wasted wastage and that really resonated with me since as a buyer I was working a lot with production team or factories and it makes you realize how much all the things you make as decisions as a buyer add up. to impact the planet. So, I think for me, like having both the fashion background and then being a little interested in sustainability at the time really worked together to make me realize, whoa, there's, there's so much that I can do to pull back my own consumption. And hopefully, you know, one day getting into this career where I can work in a more sustainable way, you know, hopefully for a secondhand brand or a fashion tech brand that's really helping to make fashion more circular.

Maureen

Yeah, super cool. I know that you also worked for a trend forecaster, uh, in the past, sometimes a hidden part of the fashion industry. Can you think of any ways that experience has influenced your perspective on the fashion community at large?

Tina

Yes. So as you said, I worked at a leading global trend forecasting agency and I was a brand consultant there and the trend forecasters were incredible. They did so much deep dive research. And what people sometimes think of trend forecasting is very different from what it is. So trend forecasting is this really complex and nuanced topic. Not just what's going down the runway, but there's these cultural forces that are constantly shaping fashion and what we wear. Um, you know, one of the things we're all familiar with is Y2K dressing. I think especially amongst Gen Z. And it really stems from this phenomenon called anemoia, which is nostalgia for a time you've never experienced. So you see Gen Z growing up during a period of extreme change and upheaval, and they were able to find comfort in this nostalgic clothing that maybe their parents wore or they'd look back in movies and it would just be this really comforting kind of way to express themselves through style.

Maureen

That's really interesting. Like, and I think it's so, so important to always think about that cultural aspect of how we get dressed because, I would never say that the choices that I make for what I wear are in a vacuum, right? Like, I can't really distill down my choices and be like, yeah, that's a hundred percent me, babe. Like, you know, there's going to be things that I choose that are because there's a social or cultural context. And that's fine. I don't have to be 100% individual in every choice that I make because, again, it's not realistic. I appreciate that social component there because we are social creatures and we also are emotional. So the idea that we would want to create I think you said, um, like comfort or that feeling of nostalgia through our clothes. That makes a lot of sense.

What was your favorite thing about working for the trend forecaster?

Tina

It definitely made me think about fashion much more. Probably a deeper level than I had before, just understanding, you know, what is actually driving the trend. Or in a fun way, you can see what's bubbling up. With the Barbie movie, you could kind of see pink just reach the zenith within the fashion industry. And then kind of fall its way back down. So there's definitely that very Um, emotional connection to fashion that you just touched on societal connection to fashion, political connection to fashion that you can really see clothing evolving as well as just how we're interacting with it in social media, which is. Absolutely fascinating as we've seen micro trends peak over the last few years. Now we're coming back to personal style, which I absolutely love. I love seeing how people decide to get dressed. So. Just having both of those aspects is fascinating within trend forecasting.

Maureen

Yeah, I hadn't even thought about trend forecasters mining social media. That makes sense. Wow. Wow.

Tina

Yeah, it's definitely, it's definitely the time capsule, I would say, of the 2000s through now. It's a way to really track trends and understand what's going on in the cultural zeitgeist. So I can find a lot of really interesting shifts in social media.

Maureen

Right, right. Yeah, I feel like in the past so much of, well, I would think that so much of trends in the past were driven by brands and now with social media, maybe more of the trends are driven by individuals, but maybe individuals have always been driving trends and we just overemphasized the impact of brands. I'm thinking, of course, of that, uh, iconic moment [belt monologue'] from The Devil Wears Prada.

Maureen

But, anyway. let's talk a little bit about your personal style. so I'm starting to become more interested in why behind what people are wearing rather than just what we're wearing. So can you share with us how do you decide what to personally buy or wear?

Tina

Yes, I love that question. So I have talked about on Semi-Sustainable how I've been this total maximalist dresser for most of my adult life. I had never been a print or pattern I didn't want to mix together or, you know, wear everything at the same time. But during the pandemic, I think just staying at home, I went through a period where like a lot of us, I wasn't getting dressed up for work. I was wearing sweatpants every day and minimalism and quiet luxury were just beginning to kind of take off. And I was doing a lot of research on that for work. And at the same time for work, I was doing research into next gym fabrics and consumer attitudes on sustainability and the climate crisis. As well as like helping brands learn how they can become more sustainable.

So call it looking at minimalist images every day, wanting to make my own wardrobe more sustainable by being timeless or just making this change in my life to mark coming out of the pandemic period, but I started feeling off in my maximalist clothing. So over the last year I've transitioned to this more timeless wardrobe. I'm not buying prints or the bold colors or these really sculptural shapes that might date themselves quickly or be difficult to style in my wardrobe. I'm definitely avoiding fast fashion and I'm proud to say I've never bought anything from Shein, but I absolutely understand if, if somebody has, sometimes it's, it's the most successful option. And 95% of my purchases are probably secondhand from the RealReal or thread up today. So that's really what guides my wardrobe is just looking for timeless style, something I can look at and say, I'm pretty sure I'll still be wearing this in five years and secondhand first always.

Maureen

Yeah, when you're making kind of a big shift from one end of the spectrum being more maximal to more minimal, how do you, how do you approach that without being too overwhelmed by the scale of, of the transition? Was it more of an organic process? Like, how did you handle that?

Tina

For me, I just, I started feeling uncomfortable in what I was wearing when I was wearing my really bold pieces. And I don't know about you, but I feel like fashion just is such a form of like self-expression and self-care. And if I don't like what I'm wearing. I don't always feel my most confident for the day. So I dig out like the few minimal pieces I had in my wardrobe and I'm like, okay, I'm feeling better in this. And then I slowly started supplementing my wardrobe with more of those pieces. It is a good thing I am an outfit repeater and I feel wery comfortable repeating outfits because I did that quite a bit as I was slowly building up my wardrobe because I didn't want to just go on this big spree and buy a lot of things and then not really wear them.

So it's definitely taken me like about a year or so, but I think I'm in a better place. I'm more thoughtful with what I'm buying. And I feel better about what I'm wearing every time I get dressed, which is a huge one for me.

Maureen

That's awesome. How about body awareness? So what I mean by this is, when you put on clothing, are there specific textures, fits, or styles that, you gravitate towards because of how they make you feel in your body?

Tina

Oh my gosh, when I think of this question, I think of the shift that I made from the 2010s era where everything was so tight and restrictive and skinny jeans and fitted tops and high heels. And today there's definitely a sense of comfort first in your dressing where silhouettes are looser and people wear sneakers more often and that's really where I'm falling. When I see skinny jeans come back, I still can't believe that I wore them almost every day for, you know, ten plus years. I felt so uncomfortable most of the time because they're so restrictive. So really having like the ease and the looseness of something that's a little more oversized as is influencing the way I've dressed over the last few years.

Maureen

Yeah, I'm personally very grateful that we as a fashion community have become open to the idea of oversized and comfort. Prioritizing that over just aesthetics, but almost seeing the, the oversized as the ideal aesthetic. I mean, personally, I'm just overjoyed. I never thought that that's what I would want, but now that we're here, I'm so pleased.

Tina

I know. I know.

Maureen

I hope we don't go back, you know, and maybe I feel like there's a lot of people that won't go back even if the trend changes back in that direction. I think a lot of people would be like, nah, I'm good. I've seen the other side.

Tina

Oh my gosh, I agree. I actually wore skinny jeans for my Halloween costume and I just felt so uncomfortable the whole night. So it was nice to get back into my looser clothing the next day and just feel more relaxed and what I was wearing in my body.

Maureen

What was the costume?

Tina

It was Indie Sleaze, um, Ashley Olson.

Maureen

Oh my gosh, you're such a fashion girl and I mean that in the best way.

Tina

I don't think anybody but me understood my outfit, but I enjoyed it.

Maureen

That's so fun, that's so fun. So we've talked a little bit about the kind of transition from maximal to more minimal, but are there any other style evolutions or memorable phases that you can think of from your dressing history?

Tina

Oh my gosh, outside of maximalism, I would say I look back at the low rise jeans mania of like the 2000s era. Which was not quite right for my body shape since I'm a long wasted person. And I just remember this as it was a time when you could not find anything but low rise jeans anywhere. And yeah, and it was also the height of these expensive jeans is social currency so you'd always want to have that brand logo on your denim pocket and I cringe today that I would save up my money to buy these. Insanely expensive jeans that I felt so uncomfortable. And every time I wore them, I always felt like they were falling down too low. So definitely memorable. I do have a couple of pairs that I am. Not ready to part with because the denim is so amazing. I'm like, maybe I can find a way to like sew five inches of denim on here to make the waist really high waisted, but an upcycling project for one day.

Maureen

Wow. That sounds cool. If you could add five inches of denim onto the waistband of a pair of pants, I think that you would be an absolute magician. I can't even imagine. But I mean, what you're saying speaks to the fact that fashion isn't just self-expression, it's also fitting in. And I think it's totally reasonable as difficult as it can be to understand, like, we, what do you think about this idea of like, uh, Why is it that our clothing allows us to fit in with groups of people or not fit in if we don't wear what they're wearing like why is that such a big part of our. Our culture. I mean.

Tina

I know, and you know, you think back to your teens and your 20s where wearing the right thing and fitting in felt so important, where if you didn't have the Expensive low rise jeans. And were you really stylish? I mean, I look back at the pictures and I'm like, no, that was not very stylish, but just having this social identity through fashion, I think, especially because it's a way you can visually signal. Kind of, I don't want to say status in the world, but your self-expression in the world maybe is a better way to say that. And I have, what I've enjoyed about getting older is that I don't feel that need to fit in as much through fashion, I wear what I enjoy wearing and I'm not really a part of the micro trend ecosystem that some people might be in either because they really enjoy it or sometimes it feels like you are kind of fitting in through fashion. So yeah, that's a tough one feeling that that pull to be included through fashion in ways that might not feel authentic to you.

Maureen

Yeah, I think there's an age component too, right?

Tina

Totally.

Maureen

When we are younger and we're less secure in our identity generally because, we're maybe trying to separate ourselves from our family identity, but we haven't figured out who we are, um, outside of our family. I think that's why maybe we lean into these trends as a way to create a new persona and make sure that we are, we're fitting in somewhere, um, especially like as we are developmentally separating from our family. I mean, it makes sense, especially at that age.

Even now, like, I think about how, you know, speaking from my personal experience, I don't really have a desire to stand out with my clothes. I like my clothing to be, you know, conversational in the way that it's Interesting. I don't want my clothing to be boring. I also don't really love the idea of like being stopped on the street Because of what I'm wearing, you know, that makes me really uncomfortable to be observed in that way. So even today I think about, yes, I'm dressing for comfort, but thankfully also my, what is, what is in style right now are the things that are comfortable for me personally. And so I'm. I don't know that there's work that needs to be done there, but it is interesting this idea that uh, even now, where I think still a lot of people are still dressing for social acceptance in this quieter, more laid back, sneakers forward kind of way. It's just maybe less obvious because we're all so comfortable in these things.

Tina

Mm-hmm.

Maureen

I don't know what you think about that. Is it just repeating the same thing just in more comfortable clothes or? How do, how do we find agency in that anyway?

Tina

That is so interesting. And you know, I think we've all done it. Like we've all dressed to fit in at every stage of our lives. And I think where you're talking about, too, you are trying to break away from your family and form your own identity as a teenager. That totally makes sense. But I do think now, because the clothing has gotten a little more universal and more comfortable, it might not seem like you are dressing in a certain way for social acceptance or social identity. But maybe you are just a little bit.

I know when I was younger, what drove my interest in fashion is I was so shy and clothing was my way of expressing my personality. So I would get dressed in these maximalist outfits. And when people would get to know me, they'd be like, wow, like you are shy, but your clothing is not shy. So that helped me step out in the world because I'd feel more confident when I was wearing and maybe I'd be more comfortable talking more. And, you know, today it's definitely something where I'm grateful that I was interested in fashion because in a way it helped pull me out of my shell.

When I was younger, what drove my interest in fashion is I was so shy and clothing was my way of expressing my personality. And when people would get to know me, they'd be like, wow, like you are shy, but your clothing is not shy. So that helped me step out in the world because I'd feel more confident when I was wearing.

Maureen

Mmm, that's beautiful! Are there any memorable outfits that you, like, you've loved at a particular moment in time?

Tina

Oh my gosh, I think in high school I loved wearing knee socks and jelly shoes. I thought it was the height of chic. I don't know why. But I wore them all the time and I look back at that, you know, maybe now jolly shoes are having a small moment from last year, but I look back and I'm like, whoa. It makes me laugh a little bit to see that I thought that was such an amazing outfit at the time as a high schooler. And then today, yeah, today it's not something I would necessarily wear as an adult.

Maureen

That's fair. Do you have any personal or style goals that you're working towards this year?

Tina

I love that question. So I actually started using Indyx App on January 1st. It was kind of like this new year's resolution of sorts for fashion and I haven't missed a day yet. My goal is to try to wear everything in my closet this year, so especially those more maximalist pieces that have kind of been stagnating in the back of my wardrobe. And then I'm going to decide if I want to sell something or not. I definitely can see that I've got my cost per wear out of my minimalist items. And I can look back at my Indyx, my calendar, and I love a ‘grout fit’, a gray outfit. I definitely outfit repeat quite a bit. And as we are talking about, I've had this kind of staunch minimalist or bust mentality. But I just wrapped up this series on Fashion Week street style, and it did turn my head a little bit back towards maximalism. So it doesn't have to be so black or white. And in the last month or so, I've gotten better about Incorporating my more over the top pieces back into my rotation, not necessarily having everything over the top, but, you know, wearing a couple of pieces a week just to make sure. Do I really want to part with this? Is this just a phase of my life or am I really going to regret selling my I don't know, animal print Proenza Schouler skirt that I got for an amazing deal on the RealReal after wanting it so badly in the late 2010s.

Maureen

Yeah, I love that idea so much of, okay, before I part with these things, we're gonna try to style them, make them work today, and see, uh, If, if there's a place for them, I think that's really, that sounds like really fun, actually. That sounds fun. Is it fun or is it overwhelming? I

Tina

It's fun. Yeah. Maybe next time we get together, I'll wear one of my maximalist pieces.

Maureen

I would love that!

Tina

I think it's, I think it's not as black and white as I had been making it. I can still feel minimalist, but over, you know, occasionally wear these over the top pieces and still feel good about my style.

Maureen

Yeah. Yeah. And they don't have to be worn the way that you did in the past, right? We can reinvent them and wear them in ways that maybe feel cooler today where I'm with a sneaker or something. Or, you know, instead of doing print on print, we can do, uh, you know, something else that really kind of takes it down a notch or something. I think there's a lot of ways to, to reinvent these pieces.

And, I'm really interested in how we move away from this quiet luxury. I know Kelly Williams from Midimalist has written a little bit and Sogole Kane as well have written about ‘where do we go from here?’ [referring to quiet luxury]. And I think you were just sharing in a post this week, too, about, you know, what you're seeing in Fashion Week. Being kind of a turn back towards 2006. And I saw that in the images too. And I was like, oh my gosh, this is like….We were in this place of everything with a white t-shirt but then like a crazy skirt and like crazy shoes and like a clutch bag that has like some fun detail. I don't know, is that where you feel like we're going? Is this more minimalist, a little bit of maximal, a little bit of quiet, all together, like as opposed to just full on maximal or full on minimal?

Tina

I definitely think there's a return to maximalism coming, but like you're saying, it will probably be tempered with we've been wearing really minimalist clothing for the last few years. Do we really want to give that up? So it'll probably be like Kelly's, I just love the name of her sub stack, Midimalist, like it will be in between, but there are people I see on social media or in fashion week who are wearing these very statement outfits and they look incredible and they kind of make me think, oh, maybe I should wear a statement outfit. But I do think we'll fall somewhere a little more in the middle. Just with economic forces kind of shaping what we might be buying or what we might not be able to invest in our wardrobes this year.

Maureen

Yeah, that's super, super fair point. I mean, I try not to talk about what's happening in the zeitgeist too much on this podcast so that we can be a little bit escapist. But yeah, I mean, I think that's very fair, like with the price of eggs high. You know, it can be kind of hard to justify making a more, you know, maximalist purchase, which are probably, if they're well done, they're very expensive. So I think that's a really good point is….How open are people to reinvesting in those kinds of pieces is we'll, we'll have to find out.

Tina

I know, and hopefully this will make people a little more who are curious about secondhand a little more. You know, ready to buy it this year. I think this could really be the year where secondhand starts to take off for people who have been a little unsure about how they can work that into their wardrobes.

Maureen

What advice would you give to someone who's trying to build a wardrobe that feels intuitive and authentic to them?

Tina

Oh, I would say because I have been guilty of this, try not to get sucked into trends. You know, I've done it and then I haven't felt great and what I've been wearing and it didn't feel intuitive to me. So I'd really say think of the outfit that you feel are best in your absolute best. And then ask yourself, what do you like about it? And then kind of work your way up from there. And I also really believe in finding inspiration in other people's style as a way to kind of help guide you and what you like and maybe even what you don't like. Really just finding your way through those, those few things can get you started down the path.

Maureen

Thank you so much. And where can listeners find you?

Tina

So you can find me at Semi-Sustainable on Substack and Tina Loup on Pinterest.

Maureen

Awesome, I'll make sure to include links to both of those in the show notes.

Tina

Thank you!

Outro

Thank you to our guest, Tina for joining us today!

Intuitive Style is produced, edited and hosted by me, Maureen Welton. Our theme music is by Noir et Blanc Vie.

In case you missed it, Intuitive Style, the podcast, is an offshoot of Intuitive Style, the Substack newsletter. Head on over to Substack, search Intuitive Style, to see the newsletter, which includes thoughtful reflections on what’s happening in the fashion world, guest features, and my encouragement that you can create a wardrobe that fits your life as it is now, no judgement, no rush.

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