Gerton – in charge of cargo operations at Düsseldorf Airport – tells Chris about his early interest in the police or military, and how he ended up instead at KLM, which was “like a university,” such was the opportunity to learn.

The pair also discuss the importance of passing knowledge down to the younger generation of aviation workers, why companies should invest in recessions, and what he plans for post-work life.

DOWNLOAD: To get all the latest episodes, download Apple podcast, Spotify or your favourite podcast application and search for The EVA podcast or Chris Notter.

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Music used intro: Distant Lands-Hanu Dixit-Cinematic | Calm Music used: Scratch the Itch