For Seekers by Seekers

Manu

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2.47 - 

When we read only the first part, we miss the whole point.

We need to understand that inaction is NOT a choice.

We tend to live either in future or in the past - emotions are tied to future; we imagine things going wrong; causes lots of angst in present. Or we think of past good times and not enjoy the present. 

We are in a strange jacket.

Understanding the whole sloka is important: past is dead, future is not yet born and we are wasting our present by living in either.

Not expecting specific outcome does not mean not doing anything.

Actions cannot be tied to results. Breaking that connection makes us focus on the work.

And also taking the responsibility impacts the future.

Krishna

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When in doubt begin at the beginning.

2.11 - asochyan anvashochastvam - you are worrying about something not to worry about

but, pragyavaadamsha bhaashashe - but speaking like wise

panditah nanushochanti - but wise dont worry about.

gatasun agatasun - dead or living - wise don't worry

asu - prana

also, it means sense objects.

asusu ramyate iti asurah.

Gita saaram - remove ignorance; only knowledge can relieve ignorance.

KY - we should do.Incomplete without JY. JY impossible without KY.

Kishore

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Concept of samatvam or equanimity.

Equanimity is a state where mind is not agitated.Centered,calm composed.

Ask - what takes it away from the center?

For example:

Desires, expectations etc take it away and lead to 2KLM3.

Another area is work - stress anxieties

Decisions we need to take

Loss we deal with

If Samatvam were an anchor /higher level goals from where we launch into a new peak.

It is an important pre-requisite.

How to increase the time we are in equipoise?

Understand Self - the highest level of knowledge

Next lower level is karma yoga.

How KY helps in Samatvam?

- If we are able to convert our actions to desireless actions.

- If we were to transcend that all actions are for a higher goal, then attitude changes.

Desires - Slippery slope:

Attachment, desires...and how to be less bound.

No suppression, but let the desires fall off by itself.

convert binding -> non binding desires

Getting to base camp - samatvam is priority; understanding Self is next.

Body gives those indications of not being in equipoise.

Ashish

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2.45 sums up everything in Chapter 2.

Traigunya vishaya vedaah...nistraigunyo bhavorjuna.

In the real sense, we cannot go beyond.....we are kind of warriors like Arjuna

We have to understand the situation and play our roles beautifully & to the best of our abilities.

Nirdwandva - the world is full of pairs of opposites - they will come and go. Just understand we have to be equanimous.

Nityasatvasto - be established on the sattva side.....not possible unless we go to Himalayas?

Again it is a kind of understanding we need to develop.

Niryogakshema atmavaan - we don't have to go collecting things....no need for unnecessary desires. No need to go for the excesses; no need to preserve anything.

Whatever is mentioned will be possible when we are established in Self.

When we come into this world there is a "TO LET" board - Brahman wants to come in; THere is an 'I' who is squatting in the home

Alpana

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Stithapragya - manogathan - all the desires of the mind are renounced. Self does not have any desires.

No desires - no ambition? Not doing anything is an action!

Instinctive actions show that even without desires we act

Fear & attachment are also out of desires.

When people suffer with a pattern - we may want to help; not to get any particular outcome.

When this goes away, there are no dissipation of energies.

When one has given up desires, what is the purpose of life? Stitapragya is happy within self, by self.

One has realized their own swaroopa.

When happiness is from within, then nothing needs to be done to 'derive'happiness.

Ajay Gupta

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Shishyasteham shaadi mam tvam prapannam - Power of Guru

Ashcharyavat....:We are all that Witness consciousness; but we struggle to internalize it.

NSAA:Nityam, Nirvikara, Satyam,Sarvagata, Aprameya, Abokta

Nirdwandva, Nityasatva, niryogakshema

Stitapragya is like an ocean - purnatvam & samatvam - joyfully delightfully restless

Veetaraga bhaya krodha - shama, dama, dwelling on who am I?

In this GD we discuss the final few slokas and specifically talk of how to apply the learnings of karma yoga, jna-na yoga into our daily life.

Gita Study Group Aug 29, 2021: Slokas 2.62-2.67 (continuing)

State of calmness - Move from 'what' to 'so what?'

All ads appeal to emotions + senses, not intellect.

Raga - attachment for future

Bhaya - for future

krodha - for present.

VSN - Bhutha Bhavya Bhavat Prabhuh!

Desire is an outcome of attachment.

Dwelling & attachment - we need to work somewhere in between them to manage the 'ladder of downfall'.

Discernment is the power that would let us break the loop.

Langanam parama aushadam - at thought, speech and action levels.

Mind is your servant. Senses are the servants of the servant!

Shadrasa /navarasa to rama rasa.

3-kaama, 4 - krodha leading to jealousy or matsarya or lobha leading to arrogance and 5 - moha is delusion.

Cause & effect: thinking about objects -> attachment -> desires -> 2klm3 -> loss of mind /no knowledge acquisition.

In relationships - expectations not met gives rise to anger. This is also 'attachment'.

Discernment - violent thoughts, 

Sravana - manana - nidhidhyasanam needs shama, dama.

Nidhidhyasanam is digesting the food.

How should one think about rituals?

Modern psychology vs. Gita psychology.

Repression is bad - Freud.

Desire is the root of any ambition as well. Not bad to have ambition - but whose benefit it is for.

Difficult in current times to live a minimalistic life?

More choices means more conflicts.

Is having more choices, desires good or bad?

If we lose sight of the science of enlightenment - we will get involved in the movie!

Modern psychology revolves around the framework of the movie - misses the seer!

Anything that causes emotional turmoil is attachment. This attachment -desire-action creates an endless loop, unless we attach ourselves to a higher desire.

Dwelling results in attachment; distraction results in lower attachment.

Once we give in through the desire, we will be unable to make rational decisions.

Frameworks to improve psychologically: FIR, prarabdha, needs vs wants, higher ideal, pratipaksha bhavana, asking why, write on paper & tear it

Meaning of the word prasada:

Serenity - calmness with the worldly objects; joyfully, delightfully restless - not causing any unhappiness while wanting that higher state.

Repress, suppress or replace desires? 

Pratipaksha bhavana as a tool. 

Higher goal replaces lower goal. Takes time. 

Desires can’t be willed away but time and pratipakshabhavana will help. This change behaviors - roast the seeds so the sprouting does not happen. This approach works sometime and does not work at times. 

Conquest of senses - forcibly or naturally? 

Two ends of spectrum: Jain muni’s and Osho! Worst part is not knowing what is the right path to follow ! 

Are there five enlightened masters you can point me out to? Need for Guru to guide us. 

FIR is a good barometer of progress. Daily decision making is good (ROI) with the right knowledge backing us with certainty. Fear goes down. Kishore articulated his ‘basecamp’. 

Everyday we are enlightened - we don’t know it. Deep sleep experience is a revelation of enlightenment state. Enlightenment is not effort based, understanding based. 

Why did Arjuna not get enlightened? 

The person is never enlightened, but we will be free of the person.