Game Shape

Buyers forget the pitch, they only remember how the booth made them feel.

Josh Rasmussen and Eric Salvo sit down live from HubSpot’s UNBOUND, one of the biggest marketing events of the year. After a morning of street interviews and booth conversations, they share what buyers keep telling them. Plenty of teams tried to build their own AI tools and hit a wall. Now they are deciding whether to buy, with budget season only a few months out.

They also get into what it takes to stop a stranger in a hall of 13,000 people. Josh shares what his first tool purchase taught him about how buyers decide, and Eric explains why timing matters more than most reps admit. The episode wraps with a clear case for sending your most fun people to every event.

Key takeaways:

1. Build the brand before the need. Pain creates demand, but a buyer with no memory of you won’t call when that pain shows up. A memorable activation today is what puts your name on the shortlist months later.
2. Treat executives like regular people. A CRO title on LinkedIn feels intimidating. Face to face, it’s someone with a coffee, a dog, and kids at home, and that same mindset makes the next cold call easier to dial.
3. Put BDRs in live conversations. Early career reps get real-time feedback at a booth that a cold call rarely gives them. Stumbles turn into on-the-spot coaching moments, and confidence builds fast.

Jump to the conversation:

(00:00) What sales reps learned at a marketing conference

(01:06) Why buyers are torn between building and buying AI tools

(02:29) The AI fluency gap between small and large companies

(03:38) How budget season shapes the build versus buy decision

(04:32) What buying a tool taught a seller about closing deals

(05:15) The three Ts that decide whether you hit quota

(05:49) How to grab attention on a crowded expo floor

(07:23) Why buyers remember the experience more than the product

(08:09) Pain creates demand, but brand has to come first

(10:19) Throwing early career BDRs into live booth conversations

(11:35) Why a CRO feels less intimidating face to face

(14:41) The 3 reasons people actually attend events

Most discovery calls end with a full page of notes and a deal that never closes.

Alex Kabat, commercial Account Executive at Brex, joins Josh Rasmussen and Eric Salvo for the first guest episode of Game Shape. Alex started as an intern on Josh's team, moved from SDR to AE at Highspot, and now sells into finance teams. 

Alex walks through how he builds a 30 minute call from rapport to next steps. He shares the language he uses to soften the budget and authority questions most reps dread asking. The calls he feels best about barely mention the product at all, and he explains why that is the point.

Key takeaways:

1. Watch recorded calls before writing questions. Pull up recordings from the reps hitting quota and listen for the reasoning behind each question, not just the question itself.
2. Use the judgment-free window early. Every new role or promotion comes with three or four months where asking basic questions costs nothing. Spend it asking top performers about deals they closed and why the customer actually moved.
3. Swap yes or no for comparisons. Instead of asking about the timeline directly, mention what other customers are working against and ask how that compares. The prospect gets room to tell a story rather than a one word answer.

Jump to the conversation:

(00:00) How to run better discovery calls

(00:52) From a college internship to selling into finance teams

(02:19) What a good discovery call actually accomplishes

(04:21) What changes when you sell to finance instead of sales leaders

(06:58) How to learn discovery from the reps who are already winning

(11:18) The red flags that show up in a bad discovery call

(13:52) Why the deal that closes fastest often disappears first

(16:14) A minute by minute breakdown of a 30 minute discovery call

(22:01) Where sales methodologies help and where they fall short

(26:30) Close, stall, kill: rating 3 discovery call tactics

(31:26) Flag on the play: is BANT enough to qualify a deal?

(36:26) The one question to bring into your next discovery call

Some sales habits build trust, others burn it down in one call.

Josh Rasmussen and Eric Salvo turn this episode into a draft, picking the worst habits they have seen in sales and the best ones they try to live by. They call out objections that get pushed too hard after a prospect already said no, demos that end in a no show with zero explanation, and discovery calls that open with a question about the weather.

Then they flip it. Josh and Eric break down what earns trust instead, like doing the research before you dial and treating the buyer like a person before you treat them like a lead. The takeaway across both lists is simple. People buy from people they like, and that starts long before the deal does.

Key takeaways:

1. Forecast the deal honestly, not the deal you wish you had. Reps who keep the same deal on the board every week without real progress are not managing a pipeline, they are stalling one. If it is not moving, name it and move on so the real opportunities get the attention.
2. Talk to your AE or BDR daily, not weekly. Meeting once a week is the standard, not the goal. The reps who move fastest are trading notes most days, flagging new intel on an account before it goes cold.
3. Book the next meeting before you hang up the first one. Getting a meeting on the calendar over email is hard. Getting one moved once it is already booked is easy. Ask for the next meeting while you are still live on the call.

Jump to the conversation:

(00:00) Why people buy from people they like

(00:43) Drafting sales pet peeves, starting with the fumbled handoff

(01:36) When being rude to an SDR is a red flag

(03:02) Pushing an objection instead of accepting it

(06:09) No show demos and the one line that would fix it

(09:41) The discovery call question that kills rapport before it starts

(12:16) Reaching out with zero research on the other person

(13:36) Complaining about leads without picking up the phone yourself

(16:06) Forecasting the same deal every week with nothing moving

(19:00) Why AI SDRs are not fixing the problem they claim to

(24:22) The green flags worth stealing for your own calls

(35:27) Booking the next meeting before this one ends

Not interested rarely means what it says.

Josh Rasmussen and Eric Salvo take on the objection every rep dreads. They break down why it shows up differently on a cold call than it does over email or LinkedIn, and why hearing it in the first minute means something different than hearing it in the fifth.

They run three real responses through their close, stall, kill format and review a sales trainer's take on pushing through the first no. The result is a clear way to read what a prospect actually means, and a plan for what to say next instead of hanging up.

Key takeaways:

1. Push for the meeting anyway. Even after a soft no, reps have booked meetings just by asking if the prospect wants to see more. It costs nothing to ask, and sometimes the answer is yes.
2. Bad meetings start before the call. If not interested shows up mid discovery call, the problem happened earlier. A missing agenda or a badly qualified lead is usually the real cause, not the pitch itself.
3. Ten minutes is the ceiling. A cold call that runs past ten minutes without a clear agenda is a sign you have lost control of the conversation, not a sign you are building rapport.

Jump to the conversation:

(00:00) Introduction

(00:49) What does “not interested” really mean?

(01:52) How to decode what a prospect actually means

(02:50) Why not interested over email or LinkedIn usually means refine your message

(04:20) Reading the difference between minute one and minute five on a call

(06:38) Why chasing the meeting can still work after a soft no

(08:05) The real story behind most not interested objections

(10:35) What it means if the objection shows up in a discovery call

(13:34) Close, stall, kill: grading three real responses to not interested

(17:19) Flag on the play: should you ever accept a first no

(19:15) The playbook recap and what is coming next week

The channels that build the pipeline in 2026 look nothing like the playbook from five years ago.

Josh Rasmussen and Eric Salvo have each spent five years building pipelines by hand. This week they explain why cold email has lost its grip and why so many sales leaders are quietly rebuilding the human SDR teams they replaced with AI agents two years ago. The reps getting real replies right now are doing something different than everyone else in the inbox.

They walk through the three touch sequence that gets a cold prospect to finally pick up, the exact structure behind a prospecting video, and how many weekly dials actually counts as enough. They also shared two live experiments, one that built a real pipeline and one that fell completely flat.

Key takeaways:

1. Lead with a real trigger, not a template. A new hire, a role change, or a hiring notification earns attention in the first ten seconds. A generic value statement doesn't, no matter how well it's written.
2. 200 dials a week is the floor, not the ceiling. Below that number, there isn't enough activity happening to know what's actually working. Above it, the tools matter more than the raw count.
3. Read your outreach like a stranger would. Pull up your current sequence without your own context. If the relevance isn't obvious in ten seconds, it needs a rewrite before it goes out again.

Jump to the conversation:

(00:00) Introduction

(00:43) Two 5-year lead gen veterans on what actually works in 2026

(02:04) Why sales leaders are quietly bringing back the SDRs they replaced with AI

(06:34) Building an outbound playbook that actually stands out

(09:26) A 3-touch multichannel approach built on quality over volume

(12:06) Inside the structure of a high reply rate LinkedIn video

(18:20) The dial volume floor every cold calling program needs

(20:31) Is a 4th prospecting channel coming after email, LinkedIn, and the phone

(24:19) Outbound horror stories

(29:07) Close, Stall, Kill: Lead lists, personal branding, and referral asks

(35:22) Flag on the Play: grading 3 viral sales takes

(40:00) This week's action item

If you aren’t a little bit nervous before a big call, you probably aren’t paying attention. 

In this episode, Josh Rasmussen and Eric Salvo get real about why C-suite titles on a calendar still spike your heart rate. They break down the physical routines that actually work (no fluff), why "prep" is better than "confidence," and why caring too much is actually your secret weapon.

They also cover the physical and mental routines that help, run three pre-call tactics through their Close, Stall, Kill, and take apart a sales coach's viral take on confidence that they both flag as wrong.

Key takeaways:

1. Nerves mean you still care. A rep who stops getting nervous before calls often stops preparing too. The anxiety before a high-stakes call is a signal that the outcome matters, and that matters more than most reps give it credit for.
2. Prep the night before, not the morning of. When your calendar runs back-to-back from 8 to 3, trying to prepare between meetings is already too late. The reps who consistently show up sharp do their research the evening before, so they sleep on it and walk in knowing exactly what the day holds.
3. Treat a C-suite title like any other dial. The mental gymnastics that happen when a rep sees CRO or CMO on the calendar are the biggest driver of fumbled calls at that level. Most senior buyers were in the rep's shoes not long ago. Simplifying the person behind the title drops the nerves faster than any other mindset shift.

Jump to the conversation:

(00:00) Introduction

(00:52) Why pre-call nerves never fully disappear, even for experienced reps

(02:30) Managing nerves when you start calling further up the food chain

(03:45) The athlete mentality and how it applies to pre-call prep

(05:30) Practicing like you play, structuring your calls before you get on them

(08:00) Cooper Kupp, Tom Brady, and why game-day performance starts before game day

(09:15) Positive self-talk and sticky note routines for getting out of a sales slump

(11:00) Breathing techniques that drop your heart rate before a cold call

(12:30) How to prep when your calendar is back-to-back from morning to afternoon

(13:45) Organization as a secret weapon for top-performing reps

(15:00) Nerves as a sign you care, not a sign something is wrong

(16:00) Blown call stories, Eric's first CRO meeting and Josh's first C-suite discovery

(20:30) Close, Stall, Kill: three pre-call tactics and which ones actually help

(24:00) Flag on the Play: a sales coach says the rep who cares least wins

(27:30) Why prep beats detachment every time

What do the best sellers do when a prospect asks a question that completely stumps them? How you handle that situation can make or break your deal. Josh Rasmussen and Eric Salvo tackle this tricky moment, explaining why rushing to answer is often more detrimental than your best guess.

Instead of making something up or freezing up, they guide you to pause and clarify before you dive in. They also introduce the BAMFAM concept and discuss the pros/cons of competitor bashing. Hint: blind overconfidence can bite you in the you-know-what. 

Key takeaways:

1. Push for the question behind the question. When a prospect asks a tough question, the reflex to respond fast is a trap. Asking a follow-up question to understand why they're asking gives you more information and buys you time to deliver an answer that actually lands.
2. Build your cheat sheet before the call. The top five question categories come up in almost every deal: product, security, legal, competitive, and implementation. Mapping out probable questions and rough answers in advance keeps you from ever having to wing it live.
3. Book a meeting from a meeting. If you leave a call without a next step on the calendar, the deal starts to cool the moment you hang up. Get the meeting booked before you end the call, then follow up fast with the answer you owe them.

Jump to the conversation:

(00:00) When prospects ask a question you don’t know the answer to

(00:28) Why this question stumps even experienced reps

(01:53) The right first move when you don't have the answer

(02:38) Why reps don't need to be the product expert

(03:18) How to get comfortable asking the second-layer question

(04:44) What happens when "let me get back to you" becomes a habit

(05:31) Owning it without losing the deal

(06:45) Building a pre-call cheat sheet that actually helps

(09:15) Using call recordings to load your answer bank

(11:00) BAMFAM and why booking the next meeting is non-negotiable

(13:17) What happens to a deal when follow-up is slow

(16:56) Blown call story: the meeting that started wrong before it even began

(21:17) The technical call that went sideways

(24:30) How to handle the prospect who opens with "what do you guys do?"

(26:34) Close Stall Kill: three ways to respond when you're stuck

(30:25) Flag on the Play: Why talking down your competitor always backfires

(33:26) The quick replay and key takeaways

Your energy, not your script, kills your cold calls. 

Josh Rasmussen and Eric Salvo break down one of the most common cold call mistakes reps make in 2026, sounding like they're reading from a teleprompter. They dig into when a script actually helps, how to move off of it before it starts working against you, and why your opener sets the entire tone for the conversation that follows.

They walk through what permission-based openers get right, what kills calls before they start, and how to keep your energy dialed in when you're 47 dials deep. They also run three real openers through their close, stall, kill format and pick apart a live talk track a sales coach posted as a winner.

Key takeaways:

1. Multi-persona calling builds range. If every call targets the same title, you only know how to handle one kind of rejection. Calling across a full org, VP of Sales, RevOps, enablement, product marketing, forces you to think about multiple pain points and sharpens how you read different people in real time.
2. Set a finish line before you dial. Sitting down to make calls without a specific goal leads to burnout somewhere in the middle. Decide whether you are stopping at 50 dials or two booked meetings before you ever pick up the phone. The target changes how long you stay in the game.
3. Getting a laugh in the opener buys you a minute. It almost never hurts and usually helps. If a prospect chuckles in the first few seconds, the conversation shifts from a pitch to an exchange. Humor is not a trick, it's a signal that you are approaching them like a person.

Jump to the conversation:

(00:00) Introduction

(00:52) Scripts or no scripts: when to lean on one and when to let go

(04:40) Why treating cold calling like a game makes you better at it

(05:00) How calling multiple personas builds real range and adaptability

(06:27) Learning from top performers and the case for dialing with your team

(09:32) Why energy is the first thing a prospect responds to

(11:30) Should you lead with excitement or match the prospect's tone?

(13:21) Josh's permission-based opener and why it holds up after 6 years

(17:49) Same opener, two completely different outcomes five minutes apart

(22:41) How to set goals and stay focused across a long dial block

(25:24) Why standing up when you dial makes a measurable difference

(25:52) How to stay in a positive frame of mind after five straight rejections

(29:20) Close, Stall, Kill: rating three openers every rep has used

(32:20) Flag on the play: reviewing a real cold call talk track

Your first week as a BDR will humble you. Here's how to survive it.

Josh Rasmussen and Eric Salvo have been there, and they're breaking down everything nobody tells you before day one. From building confidence on cold calls to why you don't need to know your product to book meetings, this episode is your cheat code for hitting the ground running. Plus, they roast a real cold email that never should have been sent.

New BDR or not, this one's worth your 30 minutes.

Key takeaways:

1. Delusional confidence is key. You won't feel ready in your first week. Nobody does. The most successful  reps  pick up the phone before they feel confident enough to, smile through the uncertainty, and show up consistently every single day.
2. Talk to high-performing peers. Playbooks and managers will give you the framework, but the real edge comes from actively shadowing top performers and asking them the raw, unfiltered questions. That's where you learn what actually works.
3. Time to first fail matters more than time to first meeting. The sooner you get on the phones, make mistakes, and actively seek feedback, the faster you grow. Hiding in the background and waiting until you feel ready is the slowest path forward.

Jump to the conversation:

(00:00) The mindset that separates good BDRs from great ones 

(02:55) Why coming from an athletic background gives you an edge 

(04:22) The playbook won't save you, here's what will 

(06:00) The single most important thing a new BDR can do

(07:04) The three things new BDRs need to nail before anything else 

(07:52) Why AI role play is changing how reps build confidence 

(09:32) Why traditional role plays feel forced and what works better

(10:15) Cold call fear is real, even when reps say it isn't 

(11:02) Delusional confidence: what it is and why it works 

(12:05) Josh has spent 8 years managing BDR teams, here's his honest take 

(13:14) You're not selling a product, you're selling an idea for a better future 

(14:21) Why new BDRs don't need to know the product inside and out 

(16:04) What to say when a prospect asks something you can't answer 

(18:25) Froze in front of the CEO 20 seconds into his elevator pitch 

(20:13) Eric's first week: shaking on the phone, bombing every call

(21:09) The moment Eric realized cold email wasn't going to cut it

(22:45) Stop tracking time to first meeting, track time to first fail 

(23:15) Why Eric didn't ask for feedback early enough and what it cost him 

(23:52) Close, Stall, Kill: rating first-week BDR advice 

(28:00) Flag on the Play: reviewing a real cold email from the wild 

(30:36) What a good cold email actually looks like 

Nobody taught you what to do when your deal goes dark or your biggest call goes sideways.

That changes now.

Josh Rasmussen and Eric Salvo are two former athletes turned sales reps who learned the hard way so you don't have to. Every week on Game Shape, they break down the real plays, the embarrassing losses, and everything the sales world forgot to teach you before day one.

No suits, just straight to what it actually takes to compete in sales right now.

It's time to get game day ready. You in?