Joe and Emily sit down with Lithium Americas geologist and volcanologist Tom Benson to learn about the origin of lithium. Tom also shares his origin story, passing through Harvard, MIT, Stanford, and Colombia to the fateful article in Nature magazine on the volcanic origins of lithium that landed him his role at Lithium Americas. 

Tom shares his passion for energy elements associated with volcanos because of the impact these minerals have on the world. Joe and Emily learn about super volcanos’ role in the formation of brine and pegmatite lithium deposits, and that lithium, like joe’s pizza preferences, can be found in areas with a thick crust – and unfortunately for Tom’s vacation preferences, not in Hawaii. Joe picks Tom’s brain on how the lithium leaches from volcanic material into brines and what patterns volcanic eruptions follow.

Tom shares his thoughts on the differences between industry and academia, and the lack of interest and resources in basic geological research in the United States among the younger generations. Joe brings up the topic of where the next wave of lithium projects are coming from, and the reality that an abundance of projects will never come on line because of where they are.

Joe and Tom share their discovery of the magic of coffee in recent years, and as always, the episode closes with rapid fire questions.

Throwback to one year ago today when I had the privilege of ringing the closing bell on Wall St. with my company @LithiumAmericas. I’m excited for the next year as we work hard to advance our projects at #ThackerPass and #CauchariOlaroz! pic.twitter.com/TpdUqdYZqp— Tom Benson (@thomasrbenson) June 21, 2019

Sounds like the #lithium world these days. From a rainy & windy Hyde Park pic.twitter.com/pZE4FqtNAq— Joe Lowry (@globallithium) July 30, 2019

On a soggy morning in Santiago Chile, Joe and Emily sit down with Daniel Jimenez, a lithium industry veteran since 1999 to discuss his life spent in lithium. Joe recalls how difficult SQM made his life in sales by bringing the lithium price down.  The three get into the context of the high-profile feud between Corfo and lithium companies regarding moving up the value chain in Chile, and the lost opportunity for the country as a result of not solving the problem quickly. Joe and Danile discuss the potential disconnect between lithium production volume permitted on the Salar de Atacama vs. what is technically feasible, but concur that hydroxide and carbonate prices will converge. Nevertheless, Daniel believes large producers like SQM will keep a foot in both the carbonate and hydroxide worlds to hedge their business and provide battery use for off-spec carbonate.

When talking about the lithium and EV markets, Daniel shares his view that demand is linked to when price parity for electric vehicles will be reached, but that while demand could turn quickly, supply forecasts are too optimistic due to investment delays and challenges scaling up. The trio get into the qualification process and time, to which Daniel aptly comments that qualification time is proportional to the availability of lithium, and buyers show flexibility in times of high demand.

Daniel and Joe share stories and highlights of the cultural differences between the big battery countries, and what Daniel has observed in his career as a movement towards a more open and warm reception of different cultures and people worldwide.

As usual, Emily and Joe close out the episode with some rapid fire questions.

Price evolution of Li2CO3 and LiOH confirm two things: 1. Price Gap between LC and LH is becomeing and will eventually be zero.2. CIF NE Asia prices will/are equivalent to domestic prices in China. No price difference between Jap/Kor and China. pic.twitter.com/cbf4HpAkzw— Daniel Jimenez Sch (@D_Jimenez_Sch) July 1, 2019

During the past two weeks in #ARG & #Chile the #GlobalLithiumPodcast team recorded 6 episodes to be released over the next few weeks. Pictured are 4 of the 6 guests. @jdevans4005 #DrYuanGao @thomasrbenson @ChloeHolzinger Not pictured @D_Jimenez_Sch & #AlisonDai @LithiumPodcast pic.twitter.com/LpqVNREARK— Joe Lowry (@globallithium) June 21, 2019

This episode is a combination of a college reunion and adult summer camp. Recorded in Jujuy, Argentina, during the Panorama Minero Lithium South America event with returning guest Jon Evans the CEO of Lithium Americas. It was a great opportunity for both Jon and Joe to catch up with many of their ex-FMC Lithium (Argentina) colleagues who also attended the event. Joe was in the midst of a two week, two conference trip to South America that his wife, Connie, likes to call “adult summer camp.” Using her camper skills, Emily assembled a makeshift studio in her room. The well attended conference created a bit of a housing shortage and Emily generously shared her room with former podcast guest Ines Ulla who makes a cameo appearance.

Last #ARG “camp” meal. #CampPicturesForHome pic.twitter.com/AHZKWAE1L1— Joe Lowry (@globallithium) June 20, 2019

Once the logistics were out of the way, Jon gave Joe and Emily an update on the progress at Minera Exar, the LAC – Ganfeng JV, that is rapidly advancing the Cauchari brine project in Jujuy. Listeners to episode 45 will also get an update of LAC’s wholly owned Thacker Pass clay (aka “soft rock”) project in Nevada.

Jon speaks about the changing attitude in the United States with respect to critical raw materials for the battery industry which includes lithium deposits. The group discusses resource nationalism in the light of the developing US – China trade war. They also shed some light on why the US is behind in the minerals space despite being rich in natural resources. The negative sentiment toward China has not impacted LAC’s relationship with partner Ganfeng but it has created a need to take of broader view or partnerships when considering how to develop Thacker Pass.

Jon discusses LAC’s engineering heavy, get it done, no BS approach to project development in both Argentina and the US including a discussion of how mining licenses work in the US. Joe and Emily then move on to corporate culture and ask what lessons from his time at FMC Lithium will help Jon run LAC? Jon makes it clear that developing greenfield lithium projects isn’t easy and that unexpected issues “always” happen. Jon gives his vision of where he sees LAC a few years down the road and wonders aloud about the current negativity on pricing when today’s price is more than double what it was when he left FMC Lithium just a few years ago. As is the custom, the podcast closes with rapid questions. Keep your ears open, Joe and Emily have a few new questions for their guest.

Live from #LithiumInSouthAmerica2019 end of the day, @LithiumPodcast tries to generate some lively discussion from a panel of five including three former podcast guests @minesulla @D_Jimenez_Sch & #CarlosGalli pic.twitter.com/iidj5qlSg7— Joe Lowry (@globallithium) June 18, 2019

Joe and Emily sit down with Chloe Holzinger of LUX Research in Santiago, Chile, on the first day of her 28th year on this earth to chat everything batteries. 

Chloe describes how a love of sailing and desire to be outdoors propelled her to study marine chemistry, and the impact of the BP oil spill on her choices to receive a Masters of Engineering from Duke and return to Boston, the cleantech hub of the USA. Chloe explains the east coast/west coast divide in developing hardware vs. digital solutions, and her first experience with the battery space developing aluminum water batteries for Open Water Power. 

At LUX, rather than look at pricing, Chloe looks at the supply chain from the standpoint of auto companies, cell manufacturers, and material suppliers, and explains the role of corporate venture capital in cleantech. Chloe points out the need for ecosystems for tech and the rise of innovation in Asia, and Joe airs his grievances against “Tax-echusetts.” Joe and Chloe agree on the challenge faced by US and Canadian players, given the fact that the battery market is in Asia.

The three pivot to the future of mobility and the prospect of players like Amazon providing transportation as a service, and discuss how that would change the number of cars on the road and requirements of that vehicle, as well as the rise of vehicle autonomy and applications that need solutions like battery switching.

They then move on to the need for vertical integration between the upstream and downstream, Chloe shares the reasons why a circular economy will necessitate a more vertically integrated ecosystem, and why she believes large cathode makers should lead. Joe wonders aloud about the likelihood that automakers will bear legal responsibility for cradle to grave requirements in the EU, and channels his inner Elon Musk by commenting that jiffy lube is the blockbuster of the EV revolution.

Their last hard topic is the rise of solid state batteries and the lithium metal anode, specifically what that means for the lithium world, including how lithium metal would be transported and used in the manufacturing process. We also discuss the advantage current manufacturers or aligned battery companies have in the race to implement solid state, and the first places we expect to see solid state batteries. Chloe predicts Emily will have a battery-powered solid state battery powered blow dryer by 2025. 

As usual, Emily and Joe end with some rapid fire questions.

Shout out to @greentownlabs @amazon, @BASF, @toyota 

Lithium Fires:

In the first of a series of Global Lithium Podcast episodes recorded in the “bohemian” heart of Santiago, Chile, Joe and Emily sit down with Dr. Yuan Gao, CEO of Pulead Technology. 

Joe and Dr. Gao reminisce about their first meeting in Bessemer City, NC while they both were with FMC Lithium. They discuss traveling together through Asia, and Joe’s first experience eating Moon Cakes in China. After reminiscing over the caloric joy of these sugary treats, the three get down to business.

Dr. Yuan Gao is a preeminent member of the battery world, having learned from the best – such as Dr Jeff Dahn. Yuan discusses his transition from physics to battery.

The listener gets a great explanation of the different types of cathodes and how battery makers decide which cathode to use depending on the application. He provides the numbers for the lithium intensity of both the cathode and the battery, and excess lithium that is lost in the manufacturing process.

The three close out by talking about the impurity profile that makes a lithium chemical “battery quality,” the challenges and potential for solid state batteries, and the players in the China brine space in Qinghai.

All this plus rapid fire!

If you listen to one Global Lithium Podcast, it should be this one. 

mic drop

During the past two weeks in #ARG & #Chile the #GlobalLithiumPodcast team recorded 6 episodes to be released over the next few weeks. Pictured are 4 of the 6 guests. @jdevans4005 #DrYuanGao @thomasrbenson @ChloeHolzinger Not pictured @D_Jimenez_Sch & #AlisonDai @LithiumPodcast pic.twitter.com/LpqVNREARK— Joe Lowry (@globallithium) June 21, 2019

The #GlobalLithiumPodcast rocks again with #DrYuanGao CEO of #Pulead who discusses #cathode and #battery technology with us. @LithiumPodcast pic.twitter.com/P5izkc6Xw8— Joe Lowry (@globallithium) June 11, 2019

Welcome to the Lithium Valley! Will wonders never cease ?

While in Western Australia, Joe and Emily had the good fortune to meet Colleen Yates of the Regional Development Authority (RDA) Perth, one of the architects of the Lithium Valley.

Colleen shares how she learned about lithium as well as her motivations and goals in creating the concept of the Lithium Valley She tells us why she sees EVs as an important part of – but not the only “driver” of lithium’s future. Joe and Emily learn about her thoughts on the need for diversity in the battery cell supply chain, and also how she defines diversity. The three also cover the need for both Europe and the US to acknowledge that if they want to compete with Asia they need to play catch up and acknowledge the challenges involved.

Joe and Emily also learn of Colleen’s connection to the NBA (National Basketball Association!

Colleen talks about the physical logistics involved in realizing the goals of the Lithium Valley, and how actors such as Albemarle may be ignoring necessary competitive advantages such as port access or availability of chemicals. Your hosts close, as usual, with rapid fire questions, and leave Colleen Yates as the proud owner of a Global Lithium hat.

Wishing I were Australian so I could say "mate" all the time pic.twitter.com/rvsPRHiTFJ— Emily Hersh (@LithiumPodcast) May 21, 2019

On our third #GlobalLithiumPodcast episode in #Perth we will speak with Colleen Yates the woman behind the #LithiumValley report. @LithiumPodcast pic.twitter.com/aE5kR0HEKt— Joe Lowry (@globallithium) May 15, 2019

In a short and sweet episode for all you busy business people, Joe and Emily sit down for 24 minutes to recap the highlights of a busy trip to Australia. Joe reflects on why his efforts to dispel the lithium chemical oversupply myth are challenged by a desire for a simple, non-nuanced solution, and a desire especially from the Australian market to make lithium look like something familiar, such as iron ore.

Joe gives his take on the Wesfarmers/Kidman deal, and why he doesn’t think it’s very likely that any of the major Chinese players will come in “over the top” and outbid Wesfarmers. For the folks at Wesfarmers listening, Joe suggests you reach out to Livent to round out your lithium portfolio with a world class brine asset.

Emily wonders why the world outside of China continues to try to view the country as a single actor rather than unique companies, and Joe gets into the details on how he arrived at the much-quoted conclusion that the lithium market needs at least US $12 billion in investment before 2025. The team (hopefully) puts to rest the idea that there is a brine vs. hardrock debate by showing that all of the major players have investments in both assets, compares swag, and says adios until the Fastmarkets conference in Santiago.

Look for continued good news from $NNO @NanoOne_NNO pic.twitter.com/GK16oFD9FL— Joe Lowry (@globallithium) May 31, 2019

In a long overdue episode, Joe and Emily sit down with Cameron (aka Cam) Henry, the CEO and Founder of Primero Group, the upstart engineering firm taking the lithium world by storm.

Cam shares the story of Primero, from building a good team, winning the first big contract, and some challenges and successes along the way. He further discusses how developing a niche in the lithium space has allowed Primero the opportunity to grow the business and become the firm behind upskilling and training the next generation of lithium processing experts. Joe shares the story his first meeting with Cam and Emily tells an anecdote of an unusual encounter in a chandelier-shaped table in Las Vegas to highlight the challenges in running an international business.

Cam shares how he sees the future of the lithium industry, and how Primero plans to continue to differentiate itself from the typical engineering services firm. While Joe and Emily spar a bit more than is usual, all ends well as Cameron gifts the group some lovely Primero swag.

Episodes 39 to 42 of the #GlobalLithiumPodcast were recorded last week in Perth & Melbourne. We will be releasing them one by one after @elepiech finishes production work. Thanks to our guests from @PilbaraMinerals #Primero & @RDAPerth @LithiumPodcast pic.twitter.com/EtvIm5SnFQ— Joe Lowry (@globallithium) May 19, 2019

Leaving Australia behind – thank you for a wonderful week and a bit pic.twitter.com/klagWucaJm— Emily Hersh (@LithiumPodcast) May 18, 2019

Joe and Emily are back in Perth to catch up on the latest in WA.

The Global Lithium Podcast team sits down with repeat-guest Ken Brinsden and Dale Henderson from Pilbara Minerals.

The two begin with Dale’s origin story from New Zealand to lithium in Australia by way of the Middle East. Dale shares his experience starting up the Pilbara hard rock spodumene project, including the focus on accuracy. Ken weighs in on how a company declares to have reached commercial production, and how he views the potential for future vertical integration. Dale teaches Emily about the technical topic of fines separation by using analogies with common kitchen items as part of a broader discussion of how an ore extraction operation selects a processing strategy.

Ken shares the differences and similarities in working with Posco and Ganfeng as partners, and his view of the role of hydroxide and carbonate in the future. He also explains the impact of high profile project failures on raising capital and how Pilbara navigates these waters. Joe and Emily close as usual with some rapid fire questions, including book recommendations from Ken to Dale.

The Global Lithium Podcast supports Ken Brinsden’s participation in the Walk the Plank charity event to raise money for research for children’s brain cancer. Learn more and donate to Ken’s efforts here.

Disclaimer: A duck’s quack does echo. According to Mythbusters, when examined by an audio-expert, it was found that the echo was “swallowed” by the original quack, due to the very similar acoustic structure between the quack and the echo. Because of this, it may be difficult to tell where the quack ends and the echo begins.

Wishing I were Australian so I could say "mate" all the time pic.twitter.com/rvsPRHiTFJ— Emily Hersh (@LithiumPodcast) May 21, 2019

The next episode of the #GlobalLithiumPodcast features repeat guest @KenBPilbara & @PilbaraMinerals COO #DaleHenderson @LithiumPodcast $PLS pic.twitter.com/XAUzjB3iNg— Joe Lowry (@globallithium) May 14, 2019

The podcast continues their global efforts as Joe records from Charlotte, North Carolina, and Emily records in Sichuan Province, China. Their internet connection played a little havoc with the sound quality, but, as usual, Elena Piech did an excellent job with the editing. The two discuss Galaxy’s recent Sal de Vida announcement and the market reaction, Joe’s recent meeting with Livent’s CEO, and Emily’s meetings in China. The two also speak about the various levels of product quality in China and how that impacts the ongoing narrative on lithium prices.

Bashing China is a waste of time. The Middle Kingdom is yet to have a battery supplier in Tier 1. Lithium supply is hardly a China controlled oligopoly. There is no shortage of unfunded #lithium projects. The energy transition is in its infancy but you have to compete to win. pic.twitter.com/D4LLj8SWCe— Joe Lowry (@globallithium) April 22, 2019