Good Ideas + Bad Decisions

In this episode of "Good Ideas + Bad Decisions," hosts Kat and Ellen talk to Brittany Martin Déjean, a speaker and coach who helps people break free from FOMU, the fear of messing up, which shows up as perfectionism, overthinking, self-punishment, and "superficial confidence." Brittany explains how she helps clients map their unique "FOMU fingerprint" and interrupt the cycle through awareness, body-based noticing, and accepting outcomes as they come. She also shares her coaching offerings, including a reported 73% reduction in time lost to FOMU within one group, and talks about her "Intentional Joy Club," which is hosting a throwback '90s karaoke Zoom dance party on September 30.

Brittany Martin Déjean is a keynote speaker and coach who helps high achievers interrupt FOMU (Fear Of Messing Up), the cycle of overthinking, self-criticism, and shame around mistakes. Her work grew from 6.5 years at Airbnb, where she trained over 1,000 employees and hosts in disability inclusion and coined the term FOMU. A recovering perfectionist and Harvard alum, Brittany now helps clients reclaim their time, energy, and peace, with clients reducing time lost to FOMU by an average of 73%. She has spoken for organizations including Andersen, NBC Universal, and Deutsche Bank.

Check out Brittany's Spotify playlist!

Kat is the Founder of kat&co, helping interior designers create streamlined, sustainable businesses. She is also the Founder of Back Office Design Support, providing flexible, behind-the-scenes operational support to interior design studios, and the Co-Owner and Director of Operations at Benchwork Fabrication, a custom furniture and millwork company serving the design industry. With a background in psychology and deep experience in creative business operations, Kat is known for navigating the intersection of creativity and systems with both strategy and empathy. Join her newsletter, The kat&co Download. 

Ellen Hockley is a three-time entrepreneur, small business consultant, community builder, and the founder of Ellen Hockley Consulting and SAGE Women. She guides female founders to build intuitive, values-driven businesses aligned with the life they want for themselves and their families. Join her Substack newsletter, ⁠The Quiet Wins⁠.

00:00 Podcast Welcome

00:54 Ghost in the Computer

02:46 Meet Brittany Martin Déjean

03:59 Fear of Messing Up

06:11 Superficial Confidence Explained

10:40 White Knuckling and Body Stress

14:49 Breaking the Spiral Cycle

19:51 Rewriting What Mistakes Mean

21:05 Who Brittany Helps and How

25:16 Proof FOMU Works

26:14 Joy Through Line

28:13 Backstreet Boys Breakthrough

30:15 Karaoke Zoom Party Plan

31:09 Nostalgia Mini Experiments

33:36 Joy Club Invitation

34:45 Being Yourself Publicly

39:04 Make Joy Nonperformative

42:15 Parting Wisdom

43:41 Where To Find Brittany

45:06 Podcast Sign Off

In this mini episode of “Good Ideas + Bad Decisions,” Kat and Ellen ease into mid-September, comparing fall routines, back-to-school chaos, and their opposite work rhythms. Kat shares how business cards left at a coffee shop turned into a local Napa magazine feature. They get honest about the awkward side of business development, such as cold outreach, follow-ups, unsubscribes, and Ellen's small-steps approach to getting back into it. 

Don't forget to⁠ submit your business questions⁠ for future episodes! 

Kat is the Founder of kat&co, helping interior designers create streamlined, sustainable businesses. She is also the Founder of Back Office Design Support, providing flexible, behind-the-scenes operational support to interior design studios, and the Co-Owner and Director of Operations at Benchwork Fabrication, a custom furniture and millwork company serving the design industry. With a background in psychology and deep experience in creative business operations, Kat is known for navigating the intersection of creativity and systems with both strategy and empathy. Join her newsletter, The kat&co Download. 

Ellen Hockley is a three-time entrepreneur, small business consultant, community builder, and the founder of Ellen Hockley Consulting and SAGE Women. She guides female founders to build intuitive, values-driven businesses aligned with the life they want for themselves and their families. Join her Substack newsletter, ⁠The Quiet Wins⁠.

This week on “Good Ideas + Bad Decisions,” Kat and Ellen talk to Frenchie Ferenczi, a business strategist who's built a career out of doing a little bit of everything from hospitality, startups, consulting, and fractional work. She breaks down how she splits her time between fractional roles with Series A/B women's healthcare startups and advisory work for solo founders who need a real thought partner, not just another consultant. They also get into how Frenchie markets herself (hint: it's relationships first, social media second), and how a comedy class turned into performing stand-up weekly, working through sets on marriage, midlife, and motherhood. Plus, she offers her hard-earned advice on spotting "too good to be true" business promises before you fall for them.

Frenchie Ferenczi is a small business strategist, fractional executive, and growth advisor. Frenchie has worked with 1000s of independent entrepreneurs and brands like The Wing, Origin, Oula, NeueHouse, and more. 

Frenchie’s work has been featured in the Financial Times, Forbes, Fast Company, PIX11, and more. She lives in in New York City with her husband and their two young sons. 

Kat is the Founder of kat&co, helping interior designers create streamlined, sustainable businesses. She is also the Founder of Back Office Design Support, providing flexible, behind-the-scenes operational support to interior design studios, and the Co-Owner and Director of Operations at Benchwork Fabrication, a custom furniture and millwork company serving the design industry. With a background in psychology and deep experience in creative business operations, Kat is known for navigating the intersection of creativity and systems with both strategy and empathy. Join her newsletter, The kat&co Download. 

Ellen Hockley is a three-time entrepreneur, small business consultant, community builder, and the founder of Ellen Hockley Consulting and SAGE Women. She guides female founders to build intuitive, values-driven businesses aligned with the life they want for themselves and their families. Join her Substack newsletter, ⁠The Quiet Wins⁠.

00:00 Podcast Welcome

01:08 Meet Today’s Guest

02:37 Frenchie’s Career Path

03:40 Who Frenchie Works With

06:27 Explaining Value and Gender

08:42 Marketing Through Relationships

10:48 Getting Into Stand Up

12:40 Writing and Structuring Sets

17:05 Comedy Money and Perks

18:49 Comedy Scene and Persona

24:40 Integrity in Business

28:31 Stage Nerves and Warmups

31:29 Comedy Ambitions

32:35 Weekly Work Split

35:05 Delegation and VAs

39:55 Long Term Goals

42:09 Too Good To Be True

45:00 How to Connect

45:37 Coffee Chats Return

51:23 New Brand Logistics

57:53 Planning and Check Ins

01:08:13 Episode Wrap Up

In this mini-episode of 'Good Ideas + Bad Decisions,' hosts Kat and Ellen dive into the whirlwind of packed schedules, from squeezing in workouts to balancing parenting demands between meetings. Kat shares exciting updates, including a new client kickoff, a studio tour, and the launch of her Back Office Design Support brand, plus some quarterly filing logistics. The heart of the episode is their contrasting approaches to year-end planning, with Ellen favoring structured quarterly reviews and Kat leaning into flexible, monthly gut checks. 

Don't forget to⁠ submit your business questions⁠ for future episodes! 

Kat is the Founder of kat&co, helping interior designers create streamlined, sustainable businesses. She is also the Founder of Back Office Design Support, providing flexible, behind-the-scenes operational support to interior design studios, and the Co-Owner and Director of Operations at Benchwork Fabrication, a custom furniture and millwork company serving the design industry. With a background in psychology and deep experience in creative business operations, Kat is known for navigating the intersection of creativity and systems with both strategy and empathy. Join her newsletter, The kat&co Download.

Ellen Hockley is a three-time entrepreneur, small business consultant, community builder, and the founder of Ellen Hockley Consulting and SAGE Women. She guides female founders to build intuitive, values-driven businesses aligned with the life they want for themselves and their families. Join her Substack newsletter, ⁠The Quiet Wins⁠.

In this episode of "Good Ideas + Bad Decisions," hosts Kat and Ellen celebrate Ellen's birthday with a special guest: her dad, Cliff Hockley! Cliff is a 40+ year entrepreneur who co-owned a Portland, Oregon property management company founded in 1972 and sold about five years ago and now runs a real estate consulting firm. He walks through his early career, from lobbying to taking over a family business. He discusses scaling up to 100 employees, diversifying into residential, commercial, and a highly profitable condo division, and the operational risks and SOPs he built after early failures. He also covers staffing strategies, negotiating, and his advice to founders.

Cliff Hockley is Principal Broker at SVN | Bluestone and managing member of Cliff Hockley Real Estate Consulting, LLC, bringing 43 years of experience in real estate brokerage and management, including growing Bluestone and Hockley Real Estate Services into a 100-employee firm managing over $2 billion in assets before selling it in 2021. He has authored the book "Successful Real Estate Investing," publishes the QuickFacts newsletter to over 2,300 subscribers, and has coached real estate investors and CEOs nationwide since 2015. His civic contributions include board service with IREM Portland and the Rental Housing Alliance of Oregon, along with multiple industry honors such as IREM's Certified Property Manager of the Year and SVN International's brokerage achievement award. 

Kat is the Founder of kat&co, helping interior designers create streamlined, sustainable businesses. She is also the Founder of Back Office Design Support, providing flexible, behind-the-scenes operational support to interior design studios, and the Co-Owner and Director of Operations at Benchwork Fabrication, a custom furniture and millwork company serving the design industry. With a background in psychology and deep experience in creative business operations, Kat is known for navigating the intersection of creativity and systems with both strategy and empathy. Join her newsletter, The kat&co Download. 

Ellen Hockley is a three-time entrepreneur, small business consultant, community builder, and the founder of Ellen Hockley Consulting and SAGE Women. She guides female founders to build intuitive, values-driven businesses aligned with the life they want for themselves and their families. Join her Substack newsletter, ⁠The Quiet Wins⁠.

00:00 Podcast Intro

00:52 Birthday Banter

01:48 Meet Ellen’s Dad

03:10 Family Business Origins

04:38 Early Career Hustle

08:31 Buying the Company

11:55 Money Mindset Shift

13:56 Scaling Staff and Space

17:53 Diversifying the Portfolio

20:44 High Rise Operations

22:59 Condo vs Residential Profits

23:52 Offshoring Customer Service

26:43 Recruiting and Negotiation

28:33 Ethics and Internal Theft

30:13 SOPs and Fraud Controls

34:10 Anchoring in Negotiations

40:55 One Page Business Plan

43:34 Moderation and Overnight Rule

45:08 Closing and Podcast Outro

In this mini-episode of "Good Ideas + Bad Decisions," hosts Kat and Ellen celebrate Ellen’s birthday as Ellen shares stories from her 10-year anniversary trip to Italy with Danny. They talk gelato, Italian dining culture, and navigating food sensitivities while traveling. Kat also recounts a weekend concert experience, complete with live music and familiar faces.

Don't forget to⁠ submit your business questions⁠ for future episodes! 

Kat is the Founder of kat&co, a Creative Operations Consultant, and the Co-Owner and Director of Operations at Benchwork Fabrication. She helps interior designers and creatives turn ideas into streamlined, sustainable businesses. With a background in psychology and deep experience in creative business operations, she’s known for navigating the intersection of creativity and systems with both strategy and empathy. Join her newsletter, The kat&co Download.

Ellen Hockley is a three-time entrepreneur, small business consultant, community builder, and the founder of Ellen Hockley Consulting and SAGE Women. She guides female founders to build intuitive, values-driven businesses aligned with the life they want for themselves and their families. Join her Substack newsletter, ⁠The Quiet Wins⁠.

In this episode of "Good Ideas + Bad Decisions," Kat and Ellen talk with Milly Skiles, founder of Milly Skiles Studio, a content marketing strategy studio for health and wellness brands. Milly shares her path from journalism into marketing after stepping away to raise her kids, and how storytelling shapes her approach to helping clients, especially mental health providers, differentiate themselves. The conversation covers the value of niching down, building genuine connection beyond online metrics, and using AI thoughtfully as an editorial tool. Milly also talks about her growth plans, from sharpening her sales approach to going hyper-local in the Bay Area. 

Milly Skiles is a content marketing strategist with over 20+ years of experience in journalism, marketing, and communications. She helps founders and marketing directors build trust-led marketing that earns the right reputation before the first click. With an editorial understanding of how writing, design, and user experience work together, Milly builds and executes strategies grounded in real-world constraints. Her approach turns scattered ideas into content that compounds over time. She uses AI practically and efficiently while protecting originality, credibility, and voice. Milly currently specializes in health and wellness brands, helping them sharpen their messaging, identify the channels worth their time, and fill them with rich content that converts.

Kat is the Founder of kat&co, a Creative Operations Consultant, and the Co-Owner and Director of Operations at Benchwork Fabrication. She helps interior designers and creatives turn ideas into streamlined, sustainable businesses. With a background in psychology and deep experience in creative business operations, she’s known for navigating the intersection of creativity and systems with both strategy and empathy. Join her newsletter, The kat&co Download.

Ellen Hockley is a three-time entrepreneur, small business consultant, community builder, and the founder of Ellen Hockley Consulting and SAGE Women. She guides female founders to build intuitive, values-driven businesses aligned with the life they want for themselves and their families. Join her Substack newsletter, ⁠The Quiet Wins⁠.

00:00 Podcast Welcome

01:15 Meet Milly Skiles

02:13 From Journalism to Marketing

05:16 Storytelling as Strategy

08:38 Niching Down Debate

13:12 Brand Refresh Real Talk

14:09 Building Personal Brand Offline

18:41 AI Tools and Ethics

22:29 Client Acquisition Shift

23:14 Inbound vs Outbound Sales

24:10 Retainers and Niche Focus

25:04 Hyperlocal Bay Area Targeting

27:06 Coaching and Pricing Frameworks

29:31 Cold Outreach and Phone Calls

32:59 Community Networking in Cafes

35:45 Content Strategy Deliverables

38:16 SEO and Annual Content Planning

39:38 Buyers Journey Wayfinding

42:30 Final Wisdom and Where to Find Her

45:44 Episode Wrap and Outro

In this mini-episode of "Good Ideas + Bad Decisions," Kat and Ellen catch up after a chaotic stretch for both of them. Ellen has been managing family illness, the loss of a pet, and travel prep, while Kat is also dealing with difficult family health news, an exciting but stressful shop project, and pet health scares. Kat and Ellen trade thoughts on AI, weighing concerns about its environmental and cognitive costs against how genuinely useful it's been for their small businesses, from troubleshooting and proofreading to organizing scattered ideas.

Don't forget to⁠ submit your business questions⁠ for future episodes! 

Kat is the Founder of kat&co, a Creative Operations Consultant, and the Co-Owner and Director of Operations at Benchwork Fabrication. She helps interior designers and creatives turn ideas into streamlined, sustainable businesses. With a background in psychology and deep experience in creative business operations, she’s known for navigating the intersection of creativity and systems with both strategy and empathy. Join her newsletter, The kat&co Download.

Ellen Hockley is a three-time entrepreneur, small business consultant, community builder, and the founder of Ellen Hockley Consulting and SAGE Women. She guides female founders to build intuitive, values-driven businesses aligned with the life they want for themselves and their families. Join her Substack newsletter, ⁠The Quiet Wins⁠.

In this episode of "Good Ideas + Bad Decisions," Kat hosts solo with Christina Hunt, founder of Haus von Albe and a brand/community strategist who also teaches yoga and human design. Christina shares her winding path from Germany, where she left a long-term relationship and pursued yoga training, to Texas, and eventually into a Meta role that built her paid media skills before she launched her own business. She discusses her evolution from Meta ads into broader marketing strategy and fractional CMO work, the exhaustion of chasing algorithms and inconsistent startup budgets, and her advice for founders: prioritize self-knowledge, set boundaries, and take time to recognize your own accomplishments.

With 15 years of experience at the intersection of brand strategy and community building, Christina Hunt believes the best marketing doesn't feel like marketing, it feels like belonging. She has built brand communities at Kit and Ace in London, grown boutique fitness brands in one of the world's most competitive markets, directed strategy for global festivals across four continents, and consulted for founders across the US and UK. She now brings her expertise in marketing strategy to brands through Haus von Albe.

Kat is the Founder of kat&co, a Creative Operations Consultant, and the Co-Owner and Director of Operations at Benchwork Fabrication. She helps interior designers and creatives turn ideas into streamlined, sustainable businesses. With a background in psychology and deep experience in creative business operations, she’s known for navigating the intersection of creativity and systems with both strategy and empathy. Join her newsletter, The kat&co Download.

Ellen Hockley is a three-time entrepreneur, small business consultant, community builder, and the founder of Ellen Hockley Consulting and SAGE Women. She guides female founders to build intuitive, values-driven businesses aligned with the life they want for themselves and their families. Join her Substack newsletter, ⁠The Quiet Wins⁠.

00:00 Podcast Intro

00:47 Guest Intro

01:28 Local Banter Catch Up

03:07 Mercury Direct Updates

04:27 Back To Full Time

05:00 How We Met

07:47 Origin Story Germany

10:38 Meta Job And Strategy

15:18 Business Evolution Burnout

20:29 Community Over Algorithms

23:57 Choosing Stability Now

25:41 Evolving Past Identity

26:43 Autonomy Over Micromanaging

28:59 Commute Reality Check

31:54 Office Life After COVID

33:50 Rethinking Career Loyalty

36:22 What’s Next Careerwise

38:42 Know Yourself First

40:54 Slow Down and Reflect

42:53 Where to Find Christina

44:15 Duchess Era Goodbye

45:30 Episode Wrap and Outro

In this mini-episode of “Good Ideas + Bad Decisions,” Kat and Ellen catch up on extreme summer weather and shifts in working life. Kat shares updates on Benchwork's shop build-out, including new equipment, improved organization, and the realities of investing in a permanent workspace. Ellen discusses summer childcare, basement renovation plans, and potential business changes to better align work with family life. They also answer a community question on marketing, sharing how referrals, LinkedIn, newsletters, Google Business updates, and a current website help support mostly word-of-mouth growth.

Don't forget to⁠ submit your business questions⁠ for future episodes! 

Kat is the Founder of kat&co, a Creative Operations Consultant, and the Co-Owner and Director of Operations at Benchwork Fabrication. She helps interior designers and creatives turn ideas into streamlined, sustainable businesses. With a background in psychology and deep experience in creative business operations, she’s known for navigating the intersection of creativity and systems with both strategy and empathy. Join her newsletter, The kat&co Download.

Ellen Hockley is a three-time entrepreneur, small business consultant, community builder, and the founder of Ellen Hockley Consulting and SAGE Women. She guides female founders to build intuitive, values-driven businesses aligned with the life they want for themselves and their families. Join her Substack newsletter, ⁠The Quiet Wins⁠.