Following on from the last episode Jamie and Gill chat a bit more about EV's and the problems they've come across in last couple of weeks. Jamie had an incicent with a student and when Gill was in Lyme Regis with Clive she saw an 'exchange' between 2 car owners - one in the charging space and one waiting to charge. It did raise more questions about owning an EV car.

Gill's husband had suggested they treat themselves to an ice cream. When they saw the rpices they realised how long ago they must have last bought an ice cream whilst out and about. It leads Jamie and Gill to chat not jsut about ice cream prices but about prices in general and how much they have increased. They both agree that in no way do they blame the business owner - but ultimately Gill only got her ice cream when they got home and she made them!

Jamie has been busy dismantling his tree house that he built for a TV show and says how he wished he hadn't bothered building it as it was so much hassle! He has got of bits of video he took whilst taking it down that he could edit to put on YouTube.

They discuss the effort and time it takes to make and post videos, how it has to be portrait for one platform and landscape for another. Gill says she will be posting a lot more in landscape now as she's working on a series for her YouTube channel which is best in lanscape. Jamie warns her about copyright music and some issues he has had in the past using 'free from copyright' music.

They talk about how people think it's quick and easy to make money either posting videos or working on collaborations with businesses - it isn't! It take a lot of time, andi n the case of YouTube can be a long time before you earn a penny let alone get paid. They both agree it can bring in an income but you have no idea why one month you get lots of views on a video and the next not alot!

In this episode Jamie and Gill are joined by a guest Andy Leech, founder of Fleet Evolution (EV cars).

Andy is a horse lover and somehow very early on in the podcast they start talking about horse s**t and the furore it can cause in a community. There are people who think owners and riders should clear up their horses mess the same as dog owners are meant to, Jamie of course is a dog owner. They chat about the diffiulties that would cause ot just out on the road with traffic but for the rider too having to climb back on - as Andy says at his age he'd need a step!

With Andy owning a company both Jamie and Gill are interested to kow more about his apprenticeship scheme and how it works compared now to many years ago. Jamie didn't do an aprenticeship but worked and learnt under a skilled / master craftsman. They chat about the benefits to doing an apprenticeship rather than everyone going to university and all agree about the huge positives of 'learning on the job'.

Not only does a young person learn the role but also what it feels like to go to work, be part of a team, earn while you learn and about how to communicate and take feedback.

Andy set up Fleet Evolution back in 2010 as a salary sacrifice scheme for companies. Neither Jamie nor Gill are fond of EV cars for a variety of reasons but Andy does a good job in convincing them of the positives, how it really is about adapting, planning in advance and a shift in mindset! Part of the planning is looking for places you are going to stop and charge which leads them to talk about the best Motorway services. Gill and Andy agree there really aer only 2 in England for them - the Gloucester Services on the M5 and Tebay on the M6 n Cumbria.

However Andy does admit that if you can't charge it at home, and there are plenty of people who can't, then it is more of an issue. He does say to Jamie that if you own your own car outright (both Jamie and Gill do) had it for several years and it's going OK with general servicing then that is the best form of sustainability.

Of course with the recent heat wave Jamier and Gill have to talk about the weather!

Jamie says that somehow he has been very productive doing little jobs on his list including lots of sewing. With the hot weather Gill's been busy washing everything like the sofa cushion covers, the mattress topper and getting them all dry in the sun. Letting nature do its work rather than dry cleaning!

Jamie confesses to turning on his air con in his workshop for the first time in over 13 years. His workshop is like a little tin box and he wasn't sure it would work but with students coming in he needed to have it on. It worked! He compares the cost of running it to impact on the amount of work he can actually get done when it's cool.

Gill mentions their solar panels would be perfect for running AC as basically wouldn't cost us anything but luckily living in a bungalow with loads of insulation she and Clive stay cool! She chats about how people tend to do the opposite of what they should to keep their homes and cars cool. It leads on to them talking about EV cars and sitting in traffic jams, more about that next episode of they ever manage to get their guest on!

Jamie tells Gill about the drinks he has been making using broccoli water with nettles and other ingredients to keep hydrated. Rather than just drinking water it means he also gets lots of minerals and electrolytes which are so important in the hot weather.

Lastly they talk about bird poo! Jamie has been scraping it off their cars whereas Clive and Gill were scraping it off themselves whilst on their normal Saturday morning walk in Budleigh Salterton. How one seagull could have such an impact and make such a mess literally from top to toe on both of them was beyond Gill! She smugly tells Jamie how she got everything clean without any chemicals being used.

Eleven days after an insect / spider bite Jamie has been to A & E as his ankle kept swelling. He was recommended to take some antihistamine tablets and went off to buy some. He was given a choice between a branded one tablet or a supermarkets own brand at a much cheaper price. Jamie of course took the cheaper one and no real differnce according to the person serving him.

It leads to a chat about the difference in cost between branded and non branded items. Gill says she has 2 friends who know a lot about plants and there medicinal properties. She wishes she could plug her brain into theirs to download the information as she knows she must have a lot in her garden that she could use. She tells Jamie about how, when she worked as sales admin in a cardboard box factory and had to deliver some samples to a customer, she was shown around the factory and saw various brands being made next to each other. The only thing that needed to change between them was one ingredient!

Jamie has also been carving a little mouse, copying it from a carver, Robert Thompson, well known for his mice. Jamie explains how apprentices are often told to copy something from a Master in that field as it puts you into the same frame of mind and makes you think about how to acheive the same result.

Gill jokes about how in a 100 years someone will appear on the Antiques Roadshow with Jamie' mouse thinnking they have a Robert Thompson mouse worth a fortune and be disappointed. Jamie explains that he will burn his own mark into it so that there is no mistake and when an apprentice copies a Master's piece of work it is not allowed to leave the workshop but is destroyed.

This leads them to talk about 'biting off more than you can chew' when learning a skill. Gill talks about a new willow weave she has been learning and it's defintiely not perfect but has helped her learn what she needs to do / change much earlier on in the process next time to make it better.

They both agree that it is good to remind students / newly qualified people watching or wondering how they came to certain decisions that they have years of experience of doing their jobs.

With AI and so little face to face communication these days Gill tells Jamie how a simple act of taking a photo of a flower high up on a wall became, what she's now calling, a 'touch point of human contact' and how she is looking to have more of them. Another one occurred when she wnet to pick up a pizza from the van that comes to their village and how it became moch more than collecting a pizza.

Having a dog Jamie says he gets plenty of these moments chatting to other dog owners and with his workshop in the Ruskin centre next to the cafe people tend to drop in to his workshop to have a look. They chat more about human contact and how important it is to us as humans. Jamie says he is now doing less videos for YouTube and as a result getting more done in the workshop and in future will only do videos of the things he enjoys making.

As a result of his shift in thnking about his work and making more of the things he wants to make he's decided to change his workshop around a little remvogn some things adding chairs. These changes in what he wants to do has also had a positve effect on the rate he charges for any work he does.

Jamie has also been busy in his garden removing ivy that was choking an old cherry tree and how having removed it the tree has already got new little shoots coming from the branches.

Gill and Jamie have something new for their next podcast a guest! They can't wait to see how that goes.

Jamie had seen some posts on Gill's Instagram accoutn about their cat Silvio and asked what had happened. Gill tells Jamie the sorry story. Silvio has been in a fight with another cat and had a badly injured, ripped open cheek which needed sititches. He is an outdoor cat and after 4 visits to the vet was still not allowed out! She said that right now she wasn't sure who's was more stressed him or her and Clive!

Jamie has a bit of a story of his own about his leaking water bed having woken up in the early hours to feel a damp patch on the side. Gill was surprised that he had a water bed and said not for her she'd rather sleep on the floor! Jamie said they had to drain it straight away and for a few nights sleep on a blow up mattress whilst they decided which bed to have next. His wife doesn't really like the water bed so he thoguht he'd give her the option to choose a new bed. He started to do some research into various beds but after a few nights not sleeping on the warmth of the water bed his joints started to complain.

Gill and Jamie chat about beds and consequently that leads onto discussing bedding as well and how they can impact your sleep to such a large degree and yet it is often one of the items we rarely think about spending a lot of money on. They discuss the toxic effects of beds and the more natural ones now being made.

Jamie and Gill start talking about technology and the reason Gill has never worn blue tooth headsets or i pods as she has had several friends who have had brain tumours - maybe a coincidence?? They discuss if the problem of now having to connect headsts etc by blue tooth or the 'old fashioned' wire ones via an adaptor could that be part of the reason so many people now have conversations and listen to things on loud speaker annoying everyone around them!

Jamie tells Gill he's made a change and wants to know how much mindset plays a role in the impact he's experiencing. He's changed his milk from semi-skimmed to organic whole milk and feels it is having an impact on what he now eats as well. He's using less sugar, wants to snack less and wonders if that's as a result of the change or that he believes it is making a difference.

They chat about beliefs and the placebo as well as the nocebo, effect and somemore about today's food in supermarkets. Gill talks about the chemicals in the things we now use everyday and the impact it has on our health and how difficult it is to know what's true even in the results of 'research'.

Jamie missed the time they were due to record this episode. He explained he had a lot going on in his head, not in a stressful way but in a good way, and had taken 5 minutes to sit in the garden and forgot they were due to record.

Gill and Jamie chat about how they approach tasks or chores in various ways that they don't want to do and 'future pace' the results like Jamie and tidying his woodstore to make things easier in the winter.

When it comes to work it's sometimes means saying 'no' to jobs even if you want to do them or putting in a your own 'end date' and taking control of your life rather than feeling pressurised.

They chat about how funny it is that the things they love to make are often the most popular items to sell as if they have a different energy in them. Gill tells Jamie about the TV show 'Take it to market' as a great example of that.

Jamie and Gill talk about how teaching is the best way to learn a subject and how important it is to learn how to do the job properly before learning the 'cheats' or 'shortcuts' as there will be times when a cheat won't work.

Gill brings up the subject of being adaptable and able to flex quite easily, like Jamie not turning up on line to record this episode and how you can respond to similar situations to avoid getting frustrated or angry.

How far would you travel to see a professional you trusted? Jamie has broken a tooth and doesn't trust the dentists local to him but has located his old dentist and is happy to travel to herknowing how skillful she is.

Jamie and Gill chat about skills and how good it is when someone you are teaching reaches a certain skill level or as a learner you feel you reach a certain level and ready to move on. Jamie is creating a 'pathway' for his students so that when they reach a certain level they can decide which direction they want to go in next. Gill talks about running her willow course and how when learning something new you really get to appreciate the skill involved and often that changes your view of what the price should be, which is usually higher! When you are buying something it isn't just that product or teaching hour you're paying for but all the hours of practice that were involved for the teacher / trainer to become so skilled.

Jamie has been asked to repair a writing box and made the customer fully aware of how he charges and potential time frame. The customer was fully onboard with the cost and adament he wanted Jamie to do it no mattter how long it took. Gill and Jamie chat about how, when a sole trader and in certain professions, there is a tendency to keep prices stable and not to increase fees in line with rising costs espeically for longstanding clients particularly if you know they are struggling to make ends meet already - but everyone has increased bills to pay. Jamie has decided to tell his students that there will be a yearly increase but if they can't afford it to talk to him.

Jamie and Gill talk chat about how they get ourselves into things without meaning to?!

Gill explains that she's found herself running a willow obelisk workshop for her village 'allotmenteers' having been asked by her neighbour but didn't think she'd actually said yes so not quite sure how it happened. Gill describes what is involved in preparing for the workshop especially when you don't have the right equipment to start with!

Jamie shares a similar type story involving a stair gate and his accountant. When peole ask for things they rarely take into account how much tiem is involved prior to actually starting the work if the client even agrees.

They chat about how people expect skilled people / speakers etc to do something for nothing, travel to the venue maybe accomodation required and offer very little in exchange without thinking they have bills to pay as well!

With everything going up in price since the start of the Iran war Jamie has been looking for new tyres for his car, as he works through the 'advisories' from his car's recent MOT. He describes how shopping around can save a lot of money. Gill comments how she has been mentally working out the cost of veg as she shops and thereforer how much growing her own food actually saves her even though she buys some compost each year.

On the same lines of saving money Jamie also mentions that he has noticed the views on his free fuel biquette videos have increased in recent weeks with people looking to save money especially on things like heating. The impact of more viewings means that the money Jamie earns from YouTube will increase slightly but it all helps.