High Notes

Can AI narrate a book? And should it?

Dan Jones spent 22 years at Hachette UK, seven of them as Head of Audio Services, and is now Senior Manager at Glassboxx. In this episode he takes us inside audiobook production at scale: how budgets are set, how narrators are cast across different tiers, and how authors sign off on the voice of their book.

Melissa and Dan also listen to an AI-replica narration of The Odyssey. Dan calls it a “rendering”: the sound design hides some of the flaws, but it lacks the dynamic range, intonation and emotional connection a human narrator brings.

Dan explains that trade publishers are largely not using AI narration, and that most of the uptake is in self-publishing and tech-led ecosystems. AI is already improving production behind the scenes, though, in editing, proofing and audio repair. They also talk about the training, stamina and preparation long-form narration demands, and why human performance still delivers something AI can’t: connection and lived experience.

What we cover

• How audiobooks are produced at scale: budgeting, casting tiers and author sign-off
• Dan’s verdict on an AI-replica narration of The Odyssey, and why it’s a “rendering” rather than a performance
• Which books need a human narrator
• Why trade publishers are largely steering clear of AI narration, and where it is being used
• How AI tools are already helping with editing, proofing and audio repair
• Directing authors and celebrities in the booth
• The stamina, training and preparation long-form narration demands
• Why connection and lived experience keep the human voice ahead, and where the industry goes next

Explore the companion notes here...

Chapters

00:00 Season Four Kickoff

01:22 Meet Dan Jones

02:23 Casting and Budgets

04:53 AI Odyssey Review

07:26 Which Books Need Humans

09:24 Where AI Is Used

12:33 BRAVA Sponsor Break

13:41 AI Tools in Production

16:00 Why Humans Still Win

18:04 Directing Authors and Celebs

20:23 Narrator Stamina and Craft

24:29 Connection and Lived Experience

27:04 Industry Outlook and Future

29:03 Wrap Up and Next Episode

Links & Resources

Dan Jones

• Dan Jones: linkedin.com/in/danjonesaudio

The Odyssey

• ElevenLabs, The Odyssey audiobook announcement: ElevenLabs' The Odyssey audiobook by Michael Caine's AI voice
• Variety, Michael Caine’s AI-generated voice to narrate The Odyssey: Michael Caine’s AI-Generated Voice to Narrate ‘The Odyssey’ Audiobook Ahead of Christopher Nolan’s Movie

Where AI narration is being used

• TechCrunch, Audible is expanding its AI-narrated audiobook library: Audible is expanding its AI-narrated audiobook library | TechCrunch
• TechCrunch, Spotify launches an ElevenLabs-powered audiobook creation tool: Spotify launches an ElevenLabs-powered audiobook creation tool | TechCrunch

AI tools in production

• Pozotron: Audiobook Proofing Service by Pozotron

The audiobook market

• Publishers Association, Publishing reaches highest ever revenue in 2025: Publishing reaches highest ever revenue in 2025
• Audio Publishers Association, sales and consumer surveys: Research Surveys Press Release — Homepage

Previous episode

• Episode 5, [title], with [guest]: [link]

BRAVA

• BRAVA - Voice Acting Training
• Sign up to the BRAVA newsletter
• Subscribe | BRAVA

‌

This is Season 4 of HIGH NOTES. Where every conversation is a performance.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

AI isn’t hitting every corner of the voice industry in the same way, or at the same speed.

David Menkin is a London-based actor and voiceover artist whose credits include Lego Star Wars, Final Fantasy XVI and Pragmata. In this episode he takes us sector by sector through commercials, dubbing and localisation, animation and games, and explains where synthetic voices are already replacing human performers and why.

David shares his view on how corporate and medical voiceover have been hit hardest, on how short-form ads are the easiest to replace with synthetic speech, and how dubbing is under pressure from the sheer volume of content being produced. He also looks at how Italy has used contracts and transparency measures to limit AI training.

David considers the real harm caused when voices are gathered and cloned without permission, and talks us through his advocacy for UK protections that go beyond the 1988 copyright law, including a “transformative right” over your voice and likeness. He discusses the red flags he spotted in an AI games casting call and shares what he’s learned about due diligence, agents and contract negotiation. He closes with his three Cs: consent, control and compensation.

What we cover

• How AI disruption differs across commercials, dubbing and localisation, animation and games
• Why corporate and medical voiceover have been hit hardest, and why short-form ads are easiest to replace
• The volume pressures driving AI in dubbing, and how Italy is using contracts and transparency to limit AI training
• The harm caused by unauthorised voice aggregation and cloning
• Why UK protections need updating beyond the 1988 copyright law, and the case for a “transformative right” over voice and likeness
• Red flags in an AI games casting call, plus due diligence, working with agents and negotiating contracts
• Why this matters beyond performers, and David’s three Cs: consent, control and compensation

Chapters

00:00 Season Four Kickoff

01:21 Meet David Menkin

01:43 From Stage to VO

02:54 Pragmata and Activism

04:00 Which Sectors Got Hit

06:24 Dubbing and Localisation

08:20 Commercials Under Pressure

10:58 Why He Became an Advocate

14:25 BRAVA Sponsor Break

15:26 AI Casting Call Red Flags

19:00 Due Diligence and Agents

21:56 Contract Negotiation Lessons

24:59 Beyond Performers to Everyone

30:59 Hope and the Three Cs

35:41 Wrap Up and Next Episode

Explore the companion notes here...

Links & Resources

David Menkin

• David Menkin:
• https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0579696/
• David Menkin - Hatch

Unions, associations and campaigns

• Equity AI toolkit and template contract: Understanding AI | Equity (see also Episode 2, Cloned Without Consent, with voice actor Faye Dicker and Equity’s Shannon Sailing: https://www.brava.uk.com/podcast/episode/1bb455dd/cloned-without-consent-with-voice-actor-faye-dicker-and-equitys-shannon-sailing)

Previous episode

• Episode 3, UK AI Law and How to Protect Your Voice, with Dr Mathilde Pavis:
• https://www.brava.uk.com/podcast/episode/2415dd5e/uk-ai-law-and-how-to-protect-your-voice-with-dr-mathilde-pavis

BRAVA

• https://www.brava.uk.com/

Sign up to the BRAVA newsletter

• https://www.brava.uk.com/subscribe

This is Season 4 of HIGH NOTES. Where every conversation is a performance.

**This episode is for general information and isn’t legal advice. For your own situation, speak to a lawyer, your agent or your union.**

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this episode Melissa talks to Dr Mathilde Pavis, an expert in intellectual property law, ethics and new technologies, who helped build Equity’s AI toolkit and has worked directly with AI platforms including ElevenLabs. Melissa asks her why the UK currently has no personality right for voice, how that compares to other countries, and whether the law is catching up in time. The real value here is practical: exactly what to check, ask and do to protect your own voice, as things stand today. The landscape is changing fast, so staying informed matters more than ever.

What we cover

• Why recorded voices are suddenly so valuable, and why that leaves performers and workers exposed
• The UK’s patchwork of protections, and how buyout contracts and platform terms can waive them
• How to protect yourself now: read contracts and terms, search them for “rights”, “waive” and “AI”, ask for carve-outs against cloning and AI training, and opt out of platform data-use settings (or contact support)
• Digital twin dealbreakers: ask early whether AI will be used, and make sure any replica is project-specific, time-bound and agreed in writing. Know who builds it, who uses it and who can access it, prevent it being sold on, and secure the right to have it deleted
• How the UK compares with the US, the EU and Denmark, and why UK policy keeps stalling

Chapters

00:00 Welcome and Guest Intro

01:06 Mathilde’s Background

01:53 Why Voice Is Valuable Now

03:40 Workplace Voice Protection

07:00 AI Clauses and Transparency

08:07 Performers and UK Patchwork Rights

11:22 Contracts and Consent Basics

12:48 Pay-to-Play Platform Risks

17:35 Opting Out and Taking Action

19:29 Why UK Law Falls Short

24:21 Digital Replica vs Personality Rights

29:17 UK vs US and EU Protections

31:22 EU Transparency Rules

33:37 Denmark Leads on Likeness

36:14 Contracts Need Safeguards

37:47 Why UK Policy Stalls

40:02 Consent and Data Rights

42:13 Is It Too Late?

43:57 Workplace Voice Precautions

45:08 Performer Contract Basics

47:39 Digital Twin Dealbreakers

53:05 AI Riders and Agents

55:40 Final Takeaways and the Future

Explore the episode companion notes here...

Links & Resources

Dr Mathilde Pavis

• Dr Mathilde Pavis, Legal Counsel & Policy Adviser on AI: https://www.mathildepavis.com/
• Agents Counsel: https://www.agentscounsel.com
• Free resources for agents: https://www.agentscounsel.com/resources

Policy

• UK Government Report on Copyright and AI (18 March 2026), Impact Assessment: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/report-and-impact-assessment-on-copyright-and-artificial-intelligence/copyright-and-artificial-intelligence-impact-assessment

Unions, associations and campaigns

• Equity AI toolkit and template contract: https://www.equity.org.uk/advice-and-support/know-your-rights/ai-toolkit/understanding-ai (see also Episode 2, Cloned Without Consent, with voice actor Faye Dicker and Equity’s Shannon Sailing: https://www.brava.uk.com/podcast/episode/1bb455dd/cloned-without-consent-with-voice-actor-faye-dicker-and-equitys-shannon-sailing )
• NAVA (US), National Association of Voice Actors: https://navavoices.org/
• Save Our Voices Now: https://saveourvoicesnow.com/

‌

BRAVA

• https://www.brava.uk.com/

Sign up to the BRAVA newsletter

• https://www.brava.uk.com/subscribe

This is Season 4 of HIGH NOTES. Where every conversation is a performance.

‌

**This episode is for general information and isn’t legal advice. For your own situation, speak to a lawyer, your agent or your union.**

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Last week, Mark Graeme (OCX UK) and Mark Eaves (Gravity Road) took us inside the decision brands now face every day: AI voice earns its place for content at scale, while a human voice wins when a brand wants to connect with its audience through trust.

This week, we hear from the other side of that decision: what it’s like to be on the wrong end of AI. Voice actor Faye Dicker discovered her voice had been cloned and sold via a US platform without her consent. It was downloaded more than 900 times before it was taken down. Faye tells us how she found out, what it felt like to hear her voice saying things she never agreed to, and the steps she took to get it removed.

Then we ask what can be done about it. Shannon Sailing, Industrial Official for Audio and Games at Equity, the UK’s trade union for performers, dealt with Faye’s case and is now handling a wave of similar claims. Shannon explains who to contact if it happens to you, what Equity can do, and why the union pushes for the same four things every time: consent, control, compensation and transparency.

Next week, we turn to the law, with intellectual property lawyer Dr Mathilde Pavis on what current UK law says about your voice, and what you can do to protect it today.

Explore the companion notes to this episode here...

Faye Dicker

Faye Dicker Voiceover Artist | Presenter, Host & Public Speaker | Bristol

Equity

Equity – the UK’s trade union for performers

Audio Committee | Equity

Save Our Voices Now

Save Our Voices Now

Sign the petition – UK Parliament

Nicola Coughlan and Matt Lucas among stars backing AI voice cloning campaign – ITV News

Sign up to the BRAVA newsletter

https://www.brava.uk.com/subscribe

00:00 Season Intro and Stakes

01:13 Meet Faye Dicker

01:25 Career Highlights

03:15 Discovering the Clone

04:33 Testing the AI Voice

06:52 First Steps and Evidence

09:43 Equity Support and Aftermath

12:38 Takedown Speed Debate

14:13 BRAVA Sponsor Break

15:12 How Faye Feels Now

16:47 Human Voice and Advocacy

18:02 Meet Shannon from Equity

19:38 Patterns in Voice Theft

21:37 What Equity Can Do

24:18 UK Law Gaps and Fixes

27:24 Defining Success Outcomes

28:59 Advice if It Happens

33:32 Campaigns and Pressure

38:01 Future of Human Voice

40:50 Wrap Up and Next Episode

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This episode explores when and why a creative studio chooses AI over a human voice, and when it doesn't, from two vantage points in the advertising industry. Mark Graeme is Head of Studio at OCX UK (Omnicom Production, part of Omnicom Group, the world's leading marketing and sales company). Mark and his team produce work for creative agencies such as Adam & Eve/TBWA, AMVBBDO, and McCann, plus work directly with a mix of local and global brands.

Mark Eaves is Founder of Gravity Road, part of The Brand Tech Group, working across brands including Unilever, Booking.com and TikTok. He led Gravity Road's build of 'Ode,' an AI poetry companion made in partnership with Microsoft AI and Poetry Pharmacy founder William Sieghart. 'Ode' is trained on Sieghart's own voice to listen and prescribe a poem. Every poem is read aloud by a real actor - Stephen Fry, Harriet Walter, Dominic West and Indira Varma among them - rather than a synthetic voice.

Between them, we get the industry-wide picture and one deeply considered case study, both circling the same question creative directors are still grappling with: AI or human voice?

Explore the conversation further in our companion article >

OCX UK (Omnicom Production)

Capability-production - Omnicom

Rennie Wind Relief Campaign

Rennie Wind Relief Calls Time on Britain’s Oldest Fart Cover-up | LBBOnline

Rennie Baxters Story Advert

TV ad: Rennie: Baxter's Story

Forrester’s 2026 Technology & Security Predictions

Forrester’s 2026 Technology & Security Predictions: As AI’s Hype Fades, Enterprises Will Defer 25% Of Planned AI Spend To 2027

MIT: The Gene Divide: State of AI in Business 2025

https://mlq.ai/media/quarterly_decks/v0.1_State_of_AI_in_Business_2025_Report.pdf

Adobe Express: Voices of AI: Music, Speech, and the new marketing soundscape

Voices of AI: Music, speech, and the new marketing soundscape | Adobe

Gravity Road

Gravity Road

Reuters Pure News from the Source Brand Campaign

https://www.reuters.com/media-center/reuters-expands-pure-news-straight-source-brand-campaign-with-two-new-video-2026-09-16/

Ode

Ode - Find the poem that finds you - odepoetry.ai

Bringing Ode Poetry to life with MAI’s audio models

Bringing Ode Poetry to life with MAI’s audio models | Microsoft AI

The Poetry Pharmacy Forever William Sieghart

Books – The Poetry Pharmacy Live

Sign up to the BRAVA newsletter: https://www.brava.uk.com/subscribe

00:00 Season Intro and Guests

01:58 Mark Graeme Background

02:54 Studio AI Tools

04:54 Voiceover Planning Process

06:36 Campaign Voice Wins

08:54 When AI Is a Mistake

10:19 Hype Versus ROI

12:46 Trust Gap Explained

15:30 BRAVA Sponsor Break

16:31 Consent and Corporate Use

18:31 Future of Human Voice

20:31 Mark Eaves and Gravity Road

23:07 Audio Culture Resurgence

27:13 Choosing AI Versus Human Voice

28:31 Reuters Authenticity Case

31:09 Ode Poetry Companion

36:11 Why Human Poem Readings

37:47 Wrap Up and Next Episode

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

High Notes returns for its fourth season with The AI Voice: a series about what happens to the human voice as AI gets good enough to replicate it.

It's a conversation that reaches further than most people think. It affects not just performers, but anyone who's ever recorded a voice note, sat on a Zoom call, or had their voice used by the business they work for. BRAVA founder, Melissa Thom, talks to leading figures on both sides of the AI debate: Mark Graeme, Mark Eaves, Faye Dicker, Shannon Sailing, Dr Mathilde Pavis, David Menkin, Dan Jones, Cissy Jones, and Bonnie Nordling.

Together, they explore when brands choose AI over a human voice, what happens when your voice is cloned without consent, how UK law is (and isn't) keeping up, and how performers can negotiate, license and protect their voices.

New episodes every Thursday from 8th October. Subscribe on your preferred podcast platform, or visit brava.uk.com/podcast for more.

Season 4 Guests

• Mark Graeme and Mark Eaves: Head of Studio at OCX UK (part of Omnicom Group) and Founder of Gravity Road, on AI or Human Voice? Why Brands Choose Both, and when big brands choose AI and when they don’t.
• Faye Dicker and Shannon Sailing: voice actor and Equity's Industrial Official for Audio and Games, on Cloned Without Consent, and what happened when Faye's voice was cloned and sold online.
• Dr Mathilde Pavis: intellectual property lawyer who helped build Equity's AI toolkit, on UK AI Law: Unfit for Purpose?, and what you can do to protect your voice today.
• David Menkin: actor and voiceover artist, on working across Games, Dubbing, Ads and Animation, and how AI risk differs in each sector.
• Dan Jones, former Head of Audio at Hachette UK, on The Audiobook Pipeline, and how AI narration is reshaping publishing.
• Cissy Jones: BAFTA award-winning actress and co-founder and CEO of Ethovox, on owning and protecting your voice, and what performers should check before licensing it.
• Bonnie Nordling: Managing Director of talent agency Nordlings, on Negotiating AI, and how agents are handling AI clauses in voiceover contracts.

High Notes - where every conversation is a performance.

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In this episode, Melissa sits down with professor, writer, and deep thinker, Dr. Margaret Heffernan, to explore creativity, uncertainty, and the power of authentic voice.

Together, they talk about how artists and leaders can not only survive but thrive in unpredictable times, the importance of cultivating a personal style, and the art of communicating with clarity and impact.

Margaret reflects on lessons from her childhood and career, shares insights from her latest book Embracing Uncertainty, and offers thoughtful guidance on building meaningful, creative lives.

Tune in for inspiration and practical wisdom on navigating change, fostering creativity, and finding your voice at work and beyond.

Links:

https://www.mheffernan.com/

https://www.goodreads.com/author/list/99633.Margaret_Heffernan

https://www.ted.com/speakers/margaret_heffernan

Ready to elevate your voice, confidence, and communication at work?

Contact us at BRAVA Business and start making every conversation count:

brava.uk.com/business

Stay connected with BRAVA

Subscribe to our newsletter for the latest news, training opportunities and insights connecting business, acting, and voice:

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00:00 Introduction to High Notes Podcast

01:19 Meet Margaret Heffernan: Early Life and Influences

05:54 Embracing Uncertainty: Insights from Margaret's Latest Book

09:28 The Importance of Creativity and Adaptability

16:49 The Power of Voice in Leadership

21:19 Effective Communication: Avoiding Jargon and Clichés

29:00 The Power of Storytelling in Business

30:23 The Craft of Effective Communication

35:32 Overcoming Imposter Syndrome

37:11 The Importance of Curiosity and Noticing

45:52 Creativity in Science and Engineering

46:38 The Value of Arts in Education

51:17 Building a Meaningful Creative Career

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In this episode of High Notes, we sit down with trailblazer Lynne Franks, a visionary in PR, fashion, and women’s empowerment. From shaping modern communications to founding movements that uplift and connect women, Lynne’s story is one of courage, creativity, and community.

Together, we explore her remarkable journey, from her early career breakthroughs to her transformative work with initiatives like the SEED community and the What Women Want campaign. Lynne opens up about the lessons learned along the way, the power of intergenerational wisdom, and why creating safe spaces for women’s stories is key to meaningful leadership.

Join us for a conversation on resilience, visibility, and purpose and discover how using your voice can spark real, lasting change.

Links:

https://lynnefranks.com/

TED Talk - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8Mi1YtGHwc

https://seednetwork.com/

https://www.whatwomenwantnow.co.uk/

Ready to elevate your voice, confidence, and communication at work?

Contact us at BRAVA Business and start making every conversation count:

brava.uk.com/business

Stay connected with BRAVA

Subscribe to our newsletter for the latest news, training opportunities and insights connecting business, acting, and voice:

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00:00 Introduction to High Notes Podcast

00:33 Meet Lynn Franks: A Journey of Resilience and Leadership

01:20 Early Influences and Career Beginnings

02:49 Pioneering in PR and Fashion

05:17 Empowering Women's Voices

07:18 Creating Safe Spaces for Women

11:30 The Seed Handbook and Sustainable Business

15:17 Wise Leadership and Community Change

23:27 What Women Want Campaign

31:45 Final Thoughts and Words of Wisdom

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In this episode of High Notes, we sit down with legendary broadcaster, author, and coach Janey Lee Grace. From her days  on BBC Radio 2 with Steve Wright to her work as a coach in heart-centred communication, Janey shares the pivotal moments that shaped her journey.

She opens up about her memoir From Wham to Woo, her path to sobriety, and the transformative power of living, and communicating, with authenticity.

Together, we explore the art of meaningful connection: how preparation, presence, and joy can elevate your message and your work. Janey also reflects on the life-changing decision to quit alcohol, and how helping others discover their true voice has become her greatest passion.

Tune in for a conversation full of warmth, wisdom, and inspiration.

Links mentioned in the show:

https://janeyleegrace.com/

Janey’s books - https://www.goodreads.com/author/list/432760.Janey_Lee_Grace

The Sober Club Podcast - https://www.thesoberclub.com/podcast/

The Sober Diaries book by Clare Pooley https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/36301974-the-sober-diaries

What Women Want - https://www.whatwomenwantnow.co.uk/ Find out more about this campaign in the next episode!

Ready to elevate your voice, confidence, and communication at work?

Contact us at BRAVA Business and start making every conversation count:

brava.uk.com/business

Stay connected with BRAVA

Subscribe to our newsletter for the latest news, training opportunities and insights connecting business, acting, and voice:

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00:00 Introduction to High Notes Podcast

00:33 Meet Janie Lee Grace: Broadcaster, Author, and Coach

01:38 Janie's Early Years and Path to Radio

03:10 Lessons from BBC Radio with Steve Wright

05:29 The Art of Connection and Presence

06:53 Navigating Challenges and Finding Resilience

11:28 Writing a Memoir: From Wham to Woo

16:07 Empowering Others to Find Their Voice

19:58 Heart-Centred Communication in Business

23:23 The Power of Nonverbal Cues

24:15 Balancing Acting in Corporate Settings

24:42 Finding Your Authentic Business Voice

27:57 The Journey to Sobriety

36:09 Advice for Aspiring Public Speakers

38:50 Emerging Voices in Broadcasting and Coaching

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

In this episode of High Notes, Melissa chats with Dr Rockford “Rocky” Sansom, a renowned voice coach and author, about the power and presence of the human voice. Together, they unpack how to manage nerves, why simplicity can transform communication, and how to make your voice truly resonate.

Rocky shares practical, down-to-earth strategies for building vocal confidence, connecting with your audience, and thriving in high-pressure situations. The conversation also touches on being authentically yourself, understanding what matters to your listeners, and using effective vocal tools to enhance impact.

They round out the discussion exploring cultural differences in communication, the evolution of voice science, and how emotion shapes the way we sound and connect.

Links:

https://www.rockfordsansom.com/

https://www.brava.uk.com/post/internationally-acclaimed-voice-coach-dr-rockford-sansom-joins-brava

Why Should Anyone Be Led by You?: What It Takes To Be An Authentic Leader - https://www.amazon.co.uk/Why-Should-Anyone-Led-You/dp/1578519713

https://historyofenglishpodcast.com/

Ready to elevate your voice, confidence, and communication at work?

Contact us at BRAVA Business and start making every conversation count:

brava.uk.com/business

Stay connected with BRAVA

Subscribe to our newsletter for the latest news, training opportunities and insights connecting business, acting, and voice:

brava.uk.com/subscribe

00:00 Introduction to High Notes Podcast

00:33 Meet Dr Rockford Sansom: Voice Coach Extraordinaire

01:29 The Essence of Presence and Overcoming Nerves

03:29 Finding Your True Voice

06:48 Impact and Influence in Business Communication

07:12 The Power of Breath and Storytelling

09:59 Comfort in Being Seen: Lessons from Leaders

14:52 Voice Actors in Professional Settings

17:10 Dispelling Myths About Public Speaking

23:55 Voice Pedagogy: Teaching and Techniques

27:27 The Wine Cork Technique

28:39 Voice Science in Coaching

31:06 Voice Analysis and Training

34:24 Changing Voices and Science

37:36 Voice in the Boardroom

43:02 Cultural Differences in Voice

46:55 Joining BRAVA as a Master Coach

48:25 Improving Vocal Presence

50:16 A Transformative Coaching Story

53:36 The Dynamic Nature of Voice Work

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