Today is a very special episode because, for the first time, we have two brilliant guests answering this question not just one - both of them specialise in the legal industry, which is a hot bed for this scenario where managers are under pressure to perform and so, at times, deprioritise people and, even, can lack humanity as well as endangering their own wellbeing.

One is Sam Jardine, Partner at Fieldfisher LLP and LawCare Chamption, and the other is Elizabeth Rimmer, CEO of LawCare, which promotes and supports good mental health in the legal industry across the UK and has just launched its latest report, Life in Law 2025.

This is a fascinating wide ranging conversation, with loads of practical ideas and tips, as well as a bit of philosophy, AI predictions and even poetry. Check out the conversation breakdown below to see just how much ground is covered!

00:00 Introduction to the Leaders Podcast

00:35 This Week's Challenge: Prioritizing People in High-Pressure Environments

01:29 Expert Insights: Sam Jardine and Elizabeth Rimmer

02:10 The Legal Industry's Pressure Cooker Environment

05:31 The Impact of Empathy and Humanity in Management

07:43 Positive Management Stories and Their Impact

08:34 Valuing People Management in the Legal Sector

09.35 Results of the recent LawCare study

12.04 How could line managers be encouraged to focus on better people management

17.25 The challenge hybrid working brings

20:35 The Role of Self-Awareness in Effective Management

26:27 The Importance of Human Skills in the Age of AI

29.00 Measuring Kindness

30.00 The Alien Question, and wrap up