Hybrid Ministry

By Nick ClasonBusiness Religion & Spirituality Christianity Technology Marketing

Hybrid Ministry episodes

June 08, 2023 Episode 048: My Newly Revised Church Social Media Planning and Posting Strategy for the rest of 2023
In this Episode Nick revises and takes another look at his 2023 posting strategy, and he explains the shifts and tweaks he is going to be making moving forward for the second half of 2023. Dive in and take a look at what you can learn and adapt into your church's social media strategy for 2023 and beyond to maximize your reach of Millennials, Generation Z and the future of Generation Alpha.
Follow Along on YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9pjecCnd8FVFCenWharf2g
Come Hang with Nick on TikTok:
https://www.tiktok.com/@clasonnick?lang=en
Shownotes & Transcripts for this Episode:
http://www.hybridministry.xyz/048
SHOWNOTES
The Original 2023 Posting Strategy:
https://www.hybridministry.xyz/025
FREE E-Book on Posting to TikTok in 2023:
https://www.hybridministry.xyz/articles/ebook
To see Nick's Church's Social Media in Action:
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/crosscreekstudents/
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC4f4bABQ6RgYF8CHY9G4HKw
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@crosscreekstudents?lang=en
TIMECODES
00:00-04:37 Intro
04:37-06:55 Why I'm shifting from posting less content on social media in 2023
06:55-15:30 Reason #1: Quantity to Quality
15:30-18:59 Reason #2: Margin for more variety of Social Media posts
18:59-23:03 In Conclusion
TRANSCRIPT
Nick Clason (00:02):
Hey, what is up everybody? Welcome back to another episode of the Hybrid Ministry Show. I am with you as always as your host, Nick Clason. Excited and thrilled to be with you on this episode. And in this episode, I want to give you my updated church social media posting strategy for 2023. Uh, I will link in the show notes if you've been around any length of time, my ultimate, uh, church social media posting strategy. Um, and I, I gave that back, I believe, around Christmas time, um, in 2022. And so here we are. It's May or June, depending on when you're catching this, or maybe even later if you're watching back through the archives, um, or listening back to the archives. Um, but now I want to just give an update and, uh, say, Hey, here's what I have been doing. Here's where I have been, and here's what I now know and here's the direction that I am now gonna go.
Nick Clason (01:06):
So tune in for that. But before we do, uh, if you haven't already figured out, we are on YouTube. So join us over there. Give us a, like a subscribe, all that stuff. Super duper helps with the algorithm. Um, and we would super appreciate it if any of those things, uh, were available or a thing that you could do for us. Uh, if you're in a podcast catcher, uh, subscribe so that you get this episode for free. It will automatically, uh, download, automatically show up in your feed every single Thursday morning at 4:00 AM when these things drop. And a rating or a review, either on Apple Podcast, on the YouTube podcast, any of those places, Spotify, we are all those places. So we would welcome a rating or a review. Um, it really helps with the algorithm. And, um, I believe in this message. I hope that if you're listening, that you two also believe in this message.
Nick Clason (01:57):
And if you are finding it helpful, um, getting that word out there in some way, just by helping us give it a rating that helps other people find their show, that helps other people attach to the mission message, um, of what hybrid ministry is all about. If, if you're new, you know, what we're essentially saying is, uh, this is not a all about digital ministry, though. There is a lot of elements of digital ministry in here. Um, and this is not all about in-person ministry. What this really is, is this is a melding of the two, and it's helping kind of fuse where, where the road meets between, um, just in person or just on online or just in digital. And so that's why we're calling it hybrid. It's a both and sort of experience. That being said, most churches are really good with their in-person experiences, um, and they may not be as good with some of their hybrid experiences, and it could be streaming your service.
Nick Clason (02:57):
That could be what a hybrid experience is. That's what most churches, uh, do. That's, that's what most of their online or digital strategy is, is like, well, we streamed the service, COVID forced us to buy a camera, stick it in the back of the room and stream the service. And that's all well and good. And if you're doing that, I'd recommend continue doing it. But there are many more ways, I think, to enter into that space, uh, and to offer more than just your Sunday morning experience to your church members, your church attenders, and your perspective people. So again, thank you for joining us. One of the major players right now in 2023. Um, and this will still bear itself out and you're about to see and hear in my updated church, uh, media posting strategy in 2023 is short form, vertical based video. And I have created for you a 100% free ebook.
Nick Clason (03:49):
I would love for you to click the link in the show notes and head there and download your very own copy of it. Uh, it's just a way for you or a church social media manager or an intern or a college student to grab a phone and start creating tos completely free and from scratch. It is an ebook that we created step by step, walking you through. It's titled, have I Already Ruined My Church TikTok account? And we would just love for you to check that out and use it, and hopefully that will be to your benefit and your advantage as you're trying to lean into more and more of the hybrid space here in 2023 in an effort to reach Gen Z and millennials and beyond. So again, without any further ado, glad you're here. Thanks for joining us. Let's dive in to my updated church social media posting strategy in 2023.
Nick Clason (04:38):
The day was May 7th, 2023. That's the day I finally shifted my strategy from before. So a little bit of historical context so that you understand. Like I said, if you wanna go back and listen, drop the link to that in the show notes, check that out. But I have been posting three short form vertical video based content pieces every single day for five days a week. The reason I choose the five days a week thing is because I'm attempting to have rhythm and rest in a Sabbath and a weekend. And so I don't post on Friday and Saturday as a a member of church staff. Sun Sunday is for sure a working day, right? Um, and so therefore I just, I choose Friday and Saturday as my two days off. It works pretty well. So I post Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday. That's why really, that's really the rhyme or reason works well with my schedule.
Nick Clason (05:32):
Um, and I would recommend that, like, I would recommend not overdoing it on your days off, because the, the reality is social media is relentless. It is a never ending beast, and it is always hungry. And so the more that you give to it, the more it's gonna want and the more it's gonna need. And so unless you have boundaries, there is really no, uh, stopping to it. And so it's up to you to create the boundaries to stay healthy, to stay in a spot that is gonna keep you mentally strong and all those types of things. So anyway, I've been posting three times a day, five days a week, and I just now shifted down and this is my new strategy. It's not earth shattering, and it's not a big shift. Okay? I've shifted down from three a day to two a day. So let's talk about what caused and what brought me to that shift.
Nick Clason (06:19):
It's multifaceted. There are two main points, and in the next couple sections, I'm gonna break down point number one, I'm gonna break down point number two. Um, but all of this is, while it's not monumental, it is a slight shift. And so if you have been following my recommended strategy, I will explain why I still think that there is benefit and merit to the three posts a day versus maybe the two posts a day. That is honestly ultimately gonna be up to you and up to your call. But before we do that, let me dive into my two-pronged reason for shifting from three a day to two a day. Let's go. Reason number one, why I am making this shift is I am hoping that shifting from posting three day to two a day, it's gonna take my weekly from 15 down to 10. Um, and there's already a rhythm baked in what I'm doing.
Nick Clason (07:12):
Like, for example, we're pre-filing all of our message content on video. And so out of that, I pull three, uh, shorts, three tos every single week, um, that are short message clips, um, Brady Shearer and the, and the people at Nucleus call it social sermons. Um, but essentially we're clipping a, a message with hopefully what I would consider to be a good hook, whether it is or not, I don't know. I'm still growing in that skill, I would say. And then at the end, we're pushing them to go consume longer sections of our YouTube, um, or podcast content. Uh, and so hopefully they find it and then they go, they go discover and, and become, you know, more engaged, more entrenched in what we're doing on social media. Anyway, all that to be said, right? Like, I am trying to, so, so there's three right there.
Nick Clason (08:02):
Okay, so outta my 10. Now I already have three. I only have to come up with seven more. And so ultimately I'm trying to shift, uh, creating quantity content to quality content. Now, I, I have not been trying to produce crap. Like, that's not been my goal, right? By any means. Like, I'm trying to do good work. I'm trying to be thoughtful, I'm trying to be creative, but there's just something about three a day that just feels relentless. And yesterday, May 7th was actually the very, and that May 7th, as of this recording, this will drop multiple weeks later. But, um, May 7th, when I first posted this, like, that was my very first day of posting only two a day. And it, it felt different. Like, I don't know it, you know, you might think like, what are you talking about? Like, it's only one different, like, I know, but it just, it, there's something about it, it just did.
Nick Clason (08:48):
And, uh, the illustration that I would make is I'm trying to produce really good quality content now, like part of the quantity, um, has been a little bit of an antiquated, I think, algorithm thing. And by antiquated, I mean, like a couple months ago, in social media land that's antiquated. You had to show up a lot and you had to show up frequently. You had to show up often. And if you can do three a day, if you can do quality content multiple times a day, you should. And I would still a hundred percent recommend it, but I just know my personal margin, like was not really allowing that anymore. Um, I was ha I was struggling with coming up with good ideas. And in like one of my original iterations of our plan, I've told you before, I work as a youth pastor.
Nick Clason (09:30):
I'm on a team. I'm one of three on our team. I have a director. There's me, I'm like the, the social media guru. And then we have, uh, another associate on our team. And, and she's a female. And so like the two of them, like I I, I dished out some social media stuff early on, like, Hey, you take three and you take three and I'll take the remainder. And they each both struggled with it for different reasons. Um, and, and so I pulled us back together and I said, what if we filmed some stuff together? We got all of us on camera at the same time. Instead of it just being like my talking head than your talking head, than your turn for your talking head. And they loved that idea. It was easier for them, but that dumped a lot more of the editing load back on my plate.
Nick Clason (10:12):
And so as a result of that, that's why I'm making this shift. The other thing is, you, you're in grow mode. I think when you're starting from scratch and you're doing a lot a day, we've, we've grown a lot. Go back to the last episode, I'll link it in the show notes. I give you my progress support. We have a fair bit of followers, we have a fair bit of subscribers in all four of the places. And so I think we've established ourselves. So now I wanna start creating really good content because that is the other thing that the recent TikTok algorithm has made very clear, is that like they are now going for good solid quality content. It's not just about hopping on a trend or a sound. And if you're on that sound, you can ride that wave to a lot of views, a lot of subscribers like that just doesn't work anymore.
Nick Clason (10:56):
I mean, and you saw that born out in some of my most recent like deep dives into analytics, is that like, we're not catching those waves the way that we were hoping that we would. And so therefore we have to not just try to rely on good cap cut templates or good trending sounds and funny dances. We have to actually create quality content that people are going to want to see, watch and consume. That's gonna be the path forward. And so to do that, I'm trying to pull back the number of, of posts I do a day so that I can spend more time on quality content. Right now, I am doing a series, you can check it out. It's at Cross Creek Church right now. I'm hoping it'll change to at Cross Creek students, but TikTok and name changes. So, um, but I'm doing a series, um, on all of our, our short form video platforms called Grow.
Nick Clason (11:47):
And i, I want to give bible and Bible study hack ideas. And so I'm opening with a hook with, it's all gonna be like bot ai voice, uh, filtered. And so it says like, this Bible study hack is an absolute game changer. That's how it starts. And then I post screenshots from the Bible app, or I post, uh, screenshots or downloaded images from other things. Uh, like the one today is gonna be about the, uh, printing press and how we now have access to the Bible everywhere. The early church didn't have that, right? We have it now in our pockets on our devices. Um, I also post one about like second Timothy three 16, how God's word is, uh, God breathe and useful for teaching, re repeating, correcting and training and righteousness and how that's gonna benefit to us. And so break down some of those verses give them hacks in the you version Bible app.
Nick Clason (12:42):
So that's gonna require some more effort on the prep side before I just get out there and start farting out, right? Some, like, some some TikTok. So I'm trying to put in some good thoughtful preparation, and then once I do the prep, then I have to turn around and edit it. So I'm, I'm really seeing a lot of these things from start to finish. In a lot of cases, if you're like a church social media manager, you might just be on the editing portion of it. And so you have the time and the bandwidth. Um, if you have content creators, pastors, whatever you're gonna call them on the backend doing the work, great. Like keep, keep letting them pump that stuff out. And the more you can produce, the better. If you have a good strategy and can post more than five times a day and you're handing it off some people on their days off and whatever, like yes, yes to all of that, right?
Nick Clason (13:29):
But at the end of the day, like, I am making this move to just try and build in a little bit more, uh, margin for me. And so, um, like I said, I'm, I'm trying to, um, in addition to creating good content, I'm trying to become a little bit more aggressive on my edits too. Um, spending more time on my edits, edits that are gonna be, um, good and stop the scroll and grab people's attention and all those types of things. So all of that just takes more time. And the more time I have, uh, is gonna be used to create 10 really good pieces of content every single week that I may have to edit every single one of them in like Adobe Premier Pro or my video editing software of choice. Um, as opposed to just pulling some random quick ones out off my phone, which is what I, I have been doing for some of the filler pieces.
Nick Clason (14:18):
There's nothing wrong with it. I mean, quite honestly, on my personal YouTube shorts, I posted, uh, one of those Jonas Brothers filters a couple weeks ago. Like, don't get stressed, we're gonna get figured out. Oh, deep conversations at the Waffle House. You might have seen it if you've been on TikTok, if not, you're welcome for that glorious singing in your ear holes. But I posted that and it's got like 53,800 views on YouTube and it helped drive my subscribers up over like 30 overnight. So you never know when one of those is just gonna like catch. And quite honestly, I posted it a week and a half ago and yesterday was when I saw my subscribers just freaking skyrocket, like outta nowhere. And so those still play a part. Those still work and those still happen, you know, every now and then. And so, um, leave space for some of those good cap cut templates, I would say for some of those good training audios, um, so that you can ride some of those waves cuz that that stuff does still happen.
Nick Clason (15:19):
So that's reason number one. I'm, I'm hoping to, uh, shift from quantity to quality. I'm hoping to buy back some, some time and some margin just in my working flow and schedule. Reason number two is I would like to create additional quality content that's not just video based. Now, hear me right when I say that you're gonna be, like you said, video was king and it is, and it, it a hundred percent still is. Everything we've posted on social media since I've been at my church has essentially been video based and I love it. Um, but I , i I will liken it to my current rhythm with video is, uh, one day, there was a day when I was working a couple years ago and I had to have a really tough conversation with a resident of mine. We ended up, I believe this day, or maybe it was a couple days later, uh, letting him go and, um, I needed to sit down and create for him what we call in our organization, a p I p a performance improvement plan.
Nick Clason (16:19):
He needed to sign off on that p i p and if he didn't like see it through to the end, we had, we had to and were going to let him go. Um, but my schedule that day was stacked. I had like two liter lunches, um, or a liter coffee and a liter lunch. I had several other meetings filtered in there. And so my boss at the beginning of the day sent me, um, his like templatized, p i p and maybe one that he'd used for someone else before. And by the time I got to that meeting, I literally swapped out the name that he sent me on his, with my, my residence's name and flew into the meeting five minutes late, slapped it down and had the conversation. And, uh, I told my boss about it later and he's like, that's not the way to have that conversation.
Nick Clason (17:03):
And I knew that, right? I just didn't have the margin in my schedule that was necessary that day. There was no other gaps, there was no other breaks to make that happen. And in a lot of the same way, the three a day is very aggressive. It's an aggressive growth strategy and it's caused me to not have any additional margin because I do want to lean into some carousel posts on Instagram that are more like learning based. Um, and that's gonna just take some time with me sitting down in Photoshop, building some of those out, thinking through them. And so all of this really, I would say at the end of the day is, is to build out a more robust social media strategy. One that is including good, strong and frequent quality content, short form video based things, but also has some supplemental content happening like on our Instagram feeds and stuff like that.
Nick Clason (17:54):
And so this isn't because Instagram, uh, is not working on reels anymore, it very much still is, we're still catching fire on there. Um, you know, I I just have a bigger vision and more things I want to do. So more feed posts more, I would like to do more longer form YouTube videos that aren't just messages. Like I would like to start creating some classes and, and fun things like that. But like, I don't have the margin for it. Some podcasts that are more regular, like I would like to do some of those. I don't have the margin for those. And so the, the more things, more a more fleshed out parent Facebook strategy, like, uh, any of that stuff I don't have the time for right now because of what I'm doing with, with Rios. And so this is hopefully gonna help me take a step back on the video slightly.
Nick Clason (18:39):
I, I'm, I'm, I, it's still king and so I don't want to abandon it at all, but I just wanna take a slight step back, focus on my editing and my content and then focus on my additional pieces of content, additional avenues of social media, um, as we trudge forward. So that is why I am shifting here in 2023. So ultimately, in conclusion, this is a margin move for me. I gave it a fair shake, an eight to nine month runway. We evaluated it, we've done that in recent episodes. Um, we took a couple accounts from zero and, and complete scratch to where they are today. And that the, the aggressive three times a day vertical video posting strategy helped get us there. Um, and frankly, I am in a church that, you know, when I, when I dropped my strategy for you, I was taking it from a multi-site megachurch with people from all over the Chicagoland area that called our church home and was still very much in the midst Andros of C O V I D or at least like living in the wake of that to a church that is in Texas in the conservative Bible belt, where they very much live out an in-person experience.
Nick Clason (19:49):
And so those were not apples to apples by any means. And so I was in a church, has a very in-person, um, environment and strategy. And so leaning into a hybrid ministry in there, still necessary for generation Z, not necessarily because it's like a Bible belt, you know, thing. But Gen Z still appreciates and uses hybrid ministry. We've even seen it here. People have appreciated it and liked it, but it's been a shift and it's, it's not the norm for what you would normally see in Texas. And so, uh, I, I say all of this to say like, I only wanna point out how big and how long and how far that hill was that we have been taking. And now as we step back, as we do deep dive into some analytics, it is causing us to shift ever so slightly. And that is why.
Nick Clason (20:38):
And so I hope that you, um, you know, I hope that you can take my context and compare it to yours and like, is this true for us as well or do we have the margin to continue to keep going with what we've been doing? Like I just want to let y'all know and be honest with you, like, this is where I am, this is where I'm coming from and I, um, always just wanna shoot it straight with you. Like here's where I am, here's where I'm coming from and here's how it's going. And uh, I will always do that and I will never fabricate or lie or say one thing's going better than another. Like this is just what it is and how it is. And, and this is where we are today as it stands. And so when I make another shift, you guys will be the first to hear about it.
Nick Clason (21:24):
Cuz I love to workshop it. And, and part of the reason why is y'all help give me a community, uh, for me to like, filter out some of my thoughts. I'll make shifts. But like sitting down to prep this podcast helped me figure out the, these are my two main reasons why I'm making this shift and that makes me more articulate in my job or with my boss or whatever the case might be. So I appreciate it, it's cathartic for me. I hope it's helpful for you. If it is, please drop us a rating, a review, all those things. Grab the free ebook, that will subscribe you to our email newsletter list. And it'll also give you a freebie on your own that you can use and help. Um, moving forward for a social media posting guide and strategy. Um, as always, we are appreciative of you. If you found this episode helpful, please consider sharing it with a friend, a family member, a coworker, a grandparent, your cat. I don't care. But sharing really helps. So if that's something that you have the margin or are able to do, please consider sharing it. We love you guys. Thanks for sticking around until the end and until always, that's not how I do it. Let's, I butchered it.
Nick Clason (22:35):
How do I say it? as always. No, don't forget, this is it. This is it. That was the worst ending in the history of mankind. And you know what, I'm keeping it in there. I face planted in front of you. Not everything's perfect. That's okay. We're gonna show the realness. Don't forget. And as always, stay hybrid.
24 min
June 01, 2023 Episode 047: The Stats: Progress Report, 2023, How Am I Actually Doing?
The Stats: Progress Report, 2023, How Am I Actually Doing? In this episode Nick dives into and shares the stats from his recent results of running social media, a new website and everything he's helped implement in his new job and student ministry. How is it actually going? What's going well? What needs tweaked? And what have we learned?
See Nick Sip his Coffee, don't just hear it: https://www.youtube.com/@clasonnick
Daily TikTok Clips: https://www.tiktok.com/@Clasonnick
Shownotes & Transcripts for this Episode: https://www.hybridministry.xyz/047
SHOWNOTES
Building a Digital Strategy from Scratch
https://www.hybridministry.xyz/011
The Results PDF
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1vNimYieoP8N8gbDX-cxQssRrez5Lmo-f/view?usp=share_link
6 Part Social FRAMEWORK
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLngXlSr64YaIbzg_DNJrTrCtBHQnxcOVo
My Student Ministry's Website/Hub
crosscreekchurch.com/students
Q&A Link
Brady Response to Theology in the Raw Podcast
https://podtail.com/podcast/pro-church-tools-with-brady-shearer/christian-author-urges-churches-to-not-use-tiktok-/
Can you Be Discipled Completely Online?
VIDEO: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1-U_mfQEoI&t=7s
AUDIO: https://www.hybridministry.xyz/042
TIMECODES
00:00-04:03 Intro
04:03-13:37 What is the Current State of our Current Social Media and Generation Z Demographics?
13:37-17:20 How are we doing on TikTok?
17:20-19:18 How are we doing on YouTube?
19:18-21:20 How are we doing on Instagram?
21:20-22:33 How are we doing on Facebook?
22:33-26:05 What this means for my social media moving forward?
TRANSCRIPT
Nick Clason (00:01):
Well, hello everybody. Welcome back to another episode of the Hybrid and Ministry podcast. I, as always am your host, Nick Clason, sip my coffee. If you're on the YouTube stream, you get to see here and listen to this beauty rest of y'all said to be with you. Sorry that you had to endure that, uh, coffee pause, but thrilled to be with you. And in today's episode we have, um, a little bit of a recap. And so I, I linked a couple of things down in the show notes, but you'll notice, um, and if you were around, um, or have been around for a minute, you'll know that, well, I just recently started a new job and I say recently, um, within the last, you know, 11 months or nine months or so, started in September. So whenever this is airing, you can do the math on that, right?
Nick Clason (00:53):
And, um, I dropped an episode, episode 11, um, a little bit, just honestly a little bit of a filler episode. I was trying to limp myself through, uh, thinking I was gonna get a co-host back. Never did. May he rest in peace. He's not actually dead, but, um, he's dead to this podcast and I miss him. But, um, we have moved on and, and gone on to greater things. Anyway, um, the episode was flushing out a digital strategy. And so in that episode, I spent a lot of time talking about website, email, seo. And then in, um, our, one of our more recent runs of episodes, we dropped the complete six part social media framework, seven episodes with an intro. And so I have linked that playlist on YouTube, uh, that playlist to YouTube. It's also on our podcast catcher, just, um, you know, in order for seven weeks in a row.
Nick Clason (01:44):
So you can go back and listen to 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6. You can see them in your feed here either way. Um, but I wanted to drop both of those because basically, um, that's what I have been on this podcast saying, you should do this, you should do that. Here's why. Here's the strategy behind those things. And now I am going to take those things and I am going to report them to you how they're going. So the first part, um, of that was, you know, website and email. I'll just be very clear, I don't have any analytics to go off of that. We use Church Community Builder and we send all of our emails through that and for two reasons. Number one, I don't care enough. And number two, um, someone has told us that we are unable to track open and click rates. I don't know that that's entirely true, but again, I don't care enough and I haven't dove into that, just being completely frank.
Nick Clason (02:30):
Um, I know I should, but I haven't, haven't really had time. So I don't have any analytics on that. The other thing is our website. I can show you what we came up with. I'm not, uh, personally a huge fan of it. Um, there are limitations and constraints, um, both by our website builder and by the way that our website is built and fleshed out to the rest of the church that make ours, um, less than what we would hoped and less than optimal. Um, but you know, if you've ever worked in church any bit of time, you know that there's a just a game to play with getting along with the other people. So, um, I can, I'll link our website to, in the show notes. You can check it out and see, um, if you know what I said in episode 11 matches what we have now, I don't think it does.
Nick Clason (03:13):
Um, so I'm just gonna give that full disclosure. You can look at and like, this stinks and I can be like, yeah, I know. Um, but anyway, uh, all that to be said, I am gonna dive into our stats on YouTube, Facebook, Instagram, and TikTok. But before I do, like I said, so thrilled to have you, if you wouldn't mind dropping a rating or a review or a like, or a subscribe on YouTube, that would be incredible. We're also trying to start gathering some questions for a couple coup a couple future q and a episodes. So if you don't mind, head to our website, link to that in the show notes as well, um, with just some, uh, questions and things that you have about regarding social media, running, social media, digital ministry, any of those types of things we would love to answer them.
Nick Clason (03:53):
But without any further ado, let's dive into this episode called Progress Report 2023. How am I actually doing? Let's go. What is the current state of our social media and our Generation Z demographics? First of all, let's look at some overall social media data. So what we know is that we have 4.7 billion people that are using social media worldwide. That is 59% of the population. And when you look at that through the lens of the Great Commission, go therefore and preach the gospel to the entire world, making disciples of all nations baptized them, the name of the father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Like you see that, that social media is actually an opportunity to preach the gospel to all nations, at least 59% of the population. In addition to that two hours and 29 minutes is the average daily time spent using social media.
Nick Clason (04:51):
And 73% of customers, according to a, um, a company called Wise Owl prefer to watch a video than they do prefer to read a text-based post. This is like marketing. So this is like a company saying like they'd rather watch a text ad than l read a, uh, or they'd rather watch a video ad than read a text ad. And then, um, 96% of people in the world have ever watched an explainer type of video. And finally, people are two times more likely to share video content than other content. So that's social media worldwide. Here's what we have about Gen Z. And if you've been on this podcast or listened to us any length of time, you've heard these before, but Generation Z is the first generation in history to use their mobile device more than any other device. So more than any other device, I should say combined.
Nick Clason (05:44):
Okay? So Gen Z is using their mobile device at a alarmingly high rate. They are not just digital natives, like they are becoming digitally dependent. And, um, I shared this I think on a recent episode as well, but Jen Alpha behind them is going to be even more digitally dependent. The mobile device is the key to all of this, and I know if you're listening, you're thinking that's bad. We need to get them away from it and uh, it might be bad. Um, I don't know that we're getting anybody away from it. So I think the question needs to shift to be like instead of how do we get people away from it? Because let's be honest right now, if you're listening to this, you're using your mobile device right now, if you're on a road trip, let's be honest, you're probably using your mobile device as your GPS today.
Nick Clason (06:27):
You're probably looking at your calendar on your mobile device. And are all of those things possible? Can you buy an old school GPS and um, use a paper daytimer and listen to a podcast just on your computer while you're sitting in the office? Technically, yes, but it's not very convenient, right? Your mobile device is your one stop shop, your hub for almost everything in your life. And so it's not just about social media, it is the fact that it is a lifeline. It is a lifeblood. It is everything that you do and that you use. And so the problem with that is a lot of times we try to disciple teens, gen Z, young people away from their phones when what we need to be doing is help produce within them good digital hygiene and good coping mechanisms and good, uh, skills with interacting with their phone and using, learning how to grow in their faith while having a phone as a part of their life as opposed to just discarding it and getting away from it.
Nick Clason (07:25):
Because yeah, we can, you know, just scale back and go to, uh, flip phones. But two things. One, probably most people are not going to opt into that. And two, it's actually more expensive and more inconvenient to do that through the cell phone companies. So how do we help move people through and, and help them grow in discipleship? I just think, I honestly think that is a sign of a time, a thing that any of us in church ministry leadership, youth ministry, whatever your role is in church staff, that's something that we're going to have to be prepared to do. That's a conversation that we need to be willing to have. And I just think that pulling back and just saying no thanks to it is not very, um, it is just, is not good stewardship of what God has given us. In fact, what I'll do is I'll link, uh, an episode to, um, one of the pro church tool shows that Brady Shearer, he actually did a response episode to, uh, a guy who was on Preston Sprinkles podcast talking about the dangers of technology.
Nick Clason (08:24):
And I thought that him and his co-host Alexander Mills had really, really great thoughts and responses to it, and it lines up a lot with what I think. So I'll link that episode in the show notes, if you're interested in that, go check them out. They're amazing. Love everything that they do. But go check that out. Okay. Um, further data on Gen Z, millennials and subsequently Gen Z I should say, have said that a hybrid version of church will suit their needs going forward in a post pandemic world. That comes from Bara's recent study came out about a year or so ago on Bara's six findings of the hybrid and future of the church that, um, I was already thinking about doing this podcast, but I hadn't launched it yet. So that came out right around when I launched this podcast. And, and I love that word hybrid.
Nick Clason (09:06):
Um, and, and Barna used that word hybrid and it's just, it's, I've, I've latched onto a lot of the data out of that thing. And so, uh, hybrid is one of the means and measures going forward that Gen Z and millennials prefer. Um, I just think we have to do that in such a way that we don't lose the good elements of in-person ministry or in-person community, um, and give them, you know, like a framework to help them grow in their faith but not become too dependent upon technology. And I just think that's a tricky balance to walk and I think that you and I are the leaders that God has chosen to help navigate that. Finally, greater than 80% of 18 to 29 year olds, which is the youngest age data available legally, cuz you can't survey anyone under the age of 18. Um, greater than 80% use at least one social media app regularly, which is the highest of all the age breakdowns between 18 29, 30 to, you know, 39, whatever the breakdowns are.
Nick Clason (10:01):
Um, and we can just assume that it's gonna be higher in generations younger than the age of 18. Um, and moving forward. So all that being said, social media, cell phone usage, and hybrid ministry, not really going anywhere. That's a backdrop basis for why we do this. Why I'm so passionate about hybrid ministry. If you go back and listen to the intro of episode 11, I say I'm in the buckle of the Bible Belt, Dallas, Texas, I'm at a church that barely shut down for covid and I'm in a ministry that is thriving with an in-person moment. They're not clamoring, begging, or looking for hybrid. So why did we lean into it? This is the reason why, right? Like this is why we went for some of these things. We pushed the chips in on the middle because, well, right now it may not be a priority, it may not be on the forefront of people's minds.
Nick Clason (10:50):
It is the currency, it is the, the native tongue of generation Z and subsequently soon to be generation alpha. And so we wanna at least be out there doing some stuff, trying some stuff. Listen, I'll be the first to say, and this is the report is gonna yield this a little bit. I don't know for sure if what I'm doing is the best way to reach disciple, preach the gospel to generation Z and generation alpha. However, the fact that we're doing things makes whatever potential future shift, um, possible, makes us be able to adapt quicker because we have cameras, we have infrastructure, we have someone thinking about it. We have, we're posting regularly, we can watch some of those trends. So rather than just sit back and wait for the picture, perfect thing, we're gonna go out there and we're gonna try some stuff and we're gonna tweak and adapt along the way.
Nick Clason (11:43):
And we are like, I have some shifts coming and I'm gonna let you know about those at the end of the episode or in a future episode. So all that to be said, like this is why we're doing it in person is important, it matters, it's meaningful. But episode, I believe it's 42. Uh, can you be discipled exclusively online? I don't think the answer is an either or a both. And my my conclusion is that if someone really wants to learn and hone in on some of their skills, they can do that. And I gave several examples of things that I have learned without ever having any sort of in-person experience or moment. Um, my wife included, like, there are a lot of ways that you can learn and you can dive deep in all sorts of topics. And the Bible should not, does not have to be excluded from that.
Nick Clason (12:30):
Like, that is very much a, a possibility, um, of things that we can do. And the beautiful thing is, as a church, if we offer some of those moments and some of those learnings, we have to go with that. We compare with online stuff, we compare in-person moments, we compare authentic community, family feelings, and we confuse those two things together. That's where hybrid really has its opportunity to, to make its most like impact. I think you don't have to be either or both. And like the reason in episode 42, can you be discipled exclusively online? The reason that I don't have a relationship with any of the people from the Oklahoma City Thunder podcast, it's because I don't live in Oklahoma City. I've never had an opportunity to get to know them. I'm three hours away now in Dallas, but before that I've been like 12 hours or 15 hours away from Oklahoma City.
Nick Clason (13:20):
Online was the only way, it was the only path forward for learning the only path forward for education. And, and so I took it, okay? But now as a church, we can offer these things online that also supplement and go right along with what we're doing in person. All right, so how are we doing on TikTok In just 11 years, from 2011 to 2022, TikTok grew from estimated zero users to around 1 billion estimated users. That is the fastest, most skyrocketed, um, growth. It's behind Facebook at 2.9 billion. YouTube at 2.2 billion, Instagram at 1.4 billion. And then TikTok is at 1 billion. Obviously we're assuming that that's going to continue to move and grow. And so I wanna share some of our individual personalized data. And I'll be honest, TikTok has adjusted some of their algorithm. There's a lot of people even on the TikTok four U page lamenting that shift in talking and chatting through why people's views are stuck at two 300.
Nick Clason (14:20):
And we're squarely there. I'm just gonna lay it out for you fully, you know, completely, honestly. Um, but, but all that being said, okay, um, we started at our TikTok account in mid-September, maybe October. Um, so somewhere around there. And whenever you're listening to it, I'm recording this on May the third. And so I have the most up-to-date data based on May the third. I also shifted our TikTok account, um, the second day of March, I believe. So we, uh, right around two now at this point, um, shifted it to a business profile account, okay? And so we have the ability to have some creator tools and some deeper analytics that only really date back to March. And so we have, um, lifetime data, which we have, we are following 18 accounts. We have 236 followers, and we have 7,473 likes. Not amazing, honestly, it's not, um, most I will say though of our followers are completely organic.
Nick Clason (15:18):
And so you gotta think in, uh, a church that runs its student ministry, about 200 people. Um, we have reached basically 200 and, uh, 36 completely random people. Um, and TikTok followers are not the same as YouTube followers. They don't, they, they don't respond the same. Um, I've heard that from other like creators and stuff like that. All that being said, you just gotta think like 10 years ago, 20 years ago, would you as a pastor or would you as a social ministry or social media manager want the desire to have an audience, 236 people, um, that, that commit to follow you? That doesn't even include views and likes and those types of things, right? Just followers. Would you want that? And most of us would, would say yes. And so well, I might be like, man, that's not amazing. I know I'm aware of it, right?
Nick Clason (16:06):
Like I'm running it actively. Um, it's, it's still also not nothing, right? Okay, so what about since we converted to a business profile. So here's some of the stuff that we have. Video views 34,184, we have 308 profile views. We have 2,827 likes, we have 84 comments and we have 118 shares. Furthermore, if you dive into just specifically last week's content and analytics, um, here's what I'll do. I will link this report. I won't bore you with this, but I'll, I'll just pull out, um, at a quick glance. I haven't even like really dove into it deeply. Yeah, I think the highest view that we had was just like 269, um, with a couple of comments and the like, and you know, like 22 or something like that likes, and, and that was me filming a game of some of our students playing a game called App Store Showdown.
Nick Clason (16:57):
So you can see that, like, it doesn't require you being all up on trends. Like, I recorded a game, I did some edit, some brief editing, and I made, you know, I had 10 questions on it or whatever, and I made 10 slides and then I'm just sprinkling 'em out, scheduling 'em out throughout the month. So not super difficult. That is our most recent up to date TikTok Analytics. All right, so let's talk about YouTube. What is it go looking like on YouTube? You'll know that I'm a big proponent of YouTube. I think that shorts are much more advantageous to use right now. And I also think that if you post, um, messages or any sort of like spiritual content than all of your short form content, because by the way I should have said this earlier, everything we're doing is short form content on all of these platforms.
Nick Clason (17:46):
Like, there's barely any other strategy around anything else. And so if you have those, having something longer on YouTube allows you to push your content, um, and push your people or anyone that stumbles across any of your videos to follow you for longer form stuff. YouTube is the second or third, depending on who you talk to, largest search engine in the world. And if it's considered third, it's only behind Google Images. So it's Google, Google images, and then YouTube. If Google, if you consider Google images a part of Google, then it's the second, right? Because Google and Google images are the same. And then YouTube is the second. So our analytics, we have 126 current subscribers in the year 2023, which is our YouTube channel's only been around since January of, uh, first of 2023. We have gotten, um, 52,432 views in our videos. We've had 291 hours of watch time and our subscribers are up to, uh, up by 125, cuz I think I subscribed before it launched in in January.
Nick Clason (18:50):
Um, so 126 subscribers. Um, our top performing long form video has gotten 56 views, four hours of watch time, um, I think 18 subscribes. And then our, our analytics, our channel analytics is that we have 32,000 unique viewers, 42, um, returning viewers, and then, uh, plus 80 on subscribers from people who have, uh, come across our stuff on you. All right, so what about Instagram? While Instagram is skewing older and older being used primarily by millennials, there's still 62% of us teens that claim to be users of Instagram. Our Instagram, like most of you, you probably have had an Instagram account for a while, and that's the same with us. We inherited an Instagram account of all the things. TikTok was new, YouTube was new, and our Facebook page is uh, also a retread. But the main thing we're doing on Facebook is our parent group, which is also new.
Nick Clason (19:49):
So Facebook, Instagram, something that has already existed. Everything else completely brand new. So all the data I have been, I have been sharing with you is from things that, um, are completely brand new. So we inherited an Instagram account, so these stats are gonna be a little more leveled off. Two reasons. One, we already had a pretty big following on there, so we're not gonna see some of that skyrocketed type growth. And secondly, um, it's, it's skewing older and it's being used less and less by current Gen Z teenagers. So we've had 1,829 profile visits. Um, in the year 2023, we have 785 Instagram followers. Um, I have age demographic breakdown, but the highest, honestly 20% is 35 to 44 year old women. So we just got a all moms on there, right? Um, we do have 18 to 24 year olds and it doesn't go younger than that.
Nick Clason (20:40):
Um, as a high, that just might be also cuz teenagers have to lie about their age to get on there. Um, and then Instagram reach is 122,872. Um, they say that that's a 0% change though, so we're pretty much holding steady. Uh, that being said, we have reached, since January 31st to April 30th, we have reached 40,900. We have, uh, 576 accounts engaged and we have 785 total followers. So I say all that to say like, while Instagram is slower and whatever, there are still valuable data happening here on Instagram. 32% of users on Facebook are teenagers. That's not a lot. Is it worth doing? It's not a lot. It's also not nothing. And, um, you can very seamlessly link your Instagram and Facebook. And so I don't even go to Facebook. I literally post on Instagram and also double post on Facebook. And so, like I shared a couple episodes ago, um, the lottery ticket vibes, um, of just posting it in four places, sometimes some's gonna hit and sometimes it's gonna hit over on Facebook.
Nick Clason (21:49):
And so our page and profile data, which are the things that have existed, but we've, um, recently revitalized a little bit. We've had 656 page visits, that's up 283.6%. We have, uh, reached 26, um, on our post reach tw uh, I'm not, I'm not, I'm sorry, not 26. 23,000. Um, our Facebook page reach is 37,803. Um, but probably the best thing I think that we have going on in the last 60 days, we've added 80 total members to our parent Facebook page and none of that, zero of that is from organic growth. That is all from like people in our church. We send out an email, they click, they join our Facebook group. All right, so in conclusion, uh, I'm not stopping, right? Like we're gonna keep barreling forward. I've been posting three times a day, um, five days a week on all of these platforms.
Nick Clason (22:45):
I do think one of the things I want to do is I have been focusing a little bit more just, you know, full disclosure on quantity, uh, as opposed to quality now that I'm trying to put crappy stuff out there, but by posting three times a day, 15 different posts a week, like that just becomes a lot. And it's hard for every single one of those to be really good and really meaningful. And so I wanna start spending a little bit more time on the edit, um, which is just going to have to ultimately reduce the number I'm doing. Uh, that being said, I don't know that I'm gonna see much of a depreciable drop off from three to two. And so really like I'm trying to do like one spiritual post a day and one fun or interesting post a day. Like I said, I'm not just like some consultant out there trying to like get rich tell you a bunch of stuff and not care about the results.
Nick Clason (23:32):
Like I am a youth pastor. I am trying to live into these hybrid moments. And so I just wanted to share with you, I pulled some of these results for the first time, uh, for a work thing and I wanted to share with y'all. I mean, here's the thing, right? Like none of these numbers are outlandish. And the reality is like, I, I don't think they are. Maybe you heard them and you're like, wow, that sounds crazy. Like I'd love that. Let me just encourage you, lean in, like you can do this. Like nothing I've done in my personal opinion is that insane, that difficult, that crazy, that hard to, to come by. So just wanna encourage you, uh, you can get these same results cuz we have been very much middle of the road with our results. Nothing viral, nothing crazy. So just go for it, lean in, make it happen.
Nick Clason (24:14):
You can do it. Hey, as always, so excited to have y'all with us for this episode. If you're not subscribed to the YouTube channel or us on podcast, please do that or consider a rating or a review share with a friend. Help us get the word out. That would be phenomenal. We would love it. Um, we also wanna let you know about our 100% completely free ebook. Um, there are also some free downloads in this episode, the report, the analytics, um, other episodes and show notes and things that we've talked through. And go check all of those things out. That's at hybridministry.xyz/047 And until next time, and as always, don't forget, stay hybrid.
25 min
May 25, 2023 Episode 046: How to be Present with your Social Media Presence
What is Incarnational Ministry? It's Jesus' involvement in our life. How do we embrace the same philosophy of Jesus' ministry in our own ministry contexts? And how do we do so in a hybrid and digital way to show up where our church people, members and congregants and spending their time?
Follow Us on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@clasonnick
Subscribe to our YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9pjecCnd8FVFCenWharf2g
Show Notes & Transcripts: http://www.hybridministry.xyz/046
FREE E-Book: https://www.hybridministry.xyz/articles/ebook
SHOWNOTES
THE ARTICLE BEING READ & REFERENCED:
https://youthministry360.com/blogs/all/how-to-be-present-with-your-social-media-presence
MY STUDENT SOCIAL MEDIA:
https://www.tiktok.com/@crosscreekchurch?lang=en
10 FREE SPIRITUAL PRACTICE TIKTOKS:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/e4n40o5080lblih/Spiritual%20Practice%20TikToks%20-%20Nick%20Clason%20and%20Bailey%20Fore.zip?dl=0
TIMECODES
00:00-02:18 Intro
02:18-07:24 How to be Present with your Social Media Presence
07:24-12:19 How do we Show Up Where our People are Spending their Time?
12:19-12:58 Don't post Announcements on Social Media
12:58-14:01 Outro
TRANSCRIPT
Nick Clason (00:01):
Well, hey there everybody. Welcome back to another episode of the Hybrid Ministry Show. I, as always, am your host, Nick Clason. Thrilled to be here again with you. And just let me let you know little bit of a shorter podcast today I'm actually gonna do something a little different, a little unique. I recently wrote an article for YM Short for Youth Ministry 360, um, titled How to Be Present With Your Social Media Presence. So what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna drop the link to that here in the show notes, but I'm actually just gonna read it for you, um, and also give you some author commentary as I, uh, am reading it through. So expect like a 10, 12 something minute pod. You probably already saw that. If you already downloaded this, if you're on YouTube, welcome in. Glad to have you. Excited to be with you.
Nick Clason (00:48):
And here's why. Honestly, um, this may release the week before, week after, not sure yet in the order. I'm doing a little bit of some batch pre-recording because my family and I are getting ready to go to Disney and I'm looking to just completely unplug from work, from this, from podcast side hustles, all the things I'm doing. Uh, so excited about unplugging, excited about getting ready to send and go and be with my family in Disney. Um, that being said, I, the, the craziest thing about this article is I wrote it, I can't even remember how long in advance, and then it dropped months later. Like I, I wrote it, I know when I lived in Chicago and it dropped just a couple weeks ago now when I'm living here in Dallas. And so my life has changed immensely. And when I heard it, there were elements of it that I was like, oh, that's interesting.
Nick Clason (01:34):
Oh, I don't know if I would've said it that way. And then there are other things I was like, yeah, I definitely still agree with that, you know, so I thought it'd be fun to bring to you all because I wrote it before, I think I wrote it before we even had a podcast going. So these thoughts, like, just think about that. If you've been on this journey with me listening to, to me in your ear ball holes for a while, think about this. These, these thoughts that have been ruminating inside of me and brewing inside of me. Uh, anyway, all that to be said, show notes, hybridministry.xyz. Subscribe to us on YouTube, follow me on TikTok Act place. And Nick also five star review if you would be so inclined. And without any further ado, let's dive into how to be present with your social media presence.
Nick Clason (02:19):
All right, here we go. How to be present with your social media presence. Read by the author himself, Nick Clayson. Here we go. Incarnational ministry. Did I lose anybody yet? Now before you go dust off your lexicon, you probably already know and embrace this as a characteristic in your life and in your ministry, right? Here's the thing. And I said this cuz I knew that, that pastors, youth pastors, who's ever gonna be reading it, primarily, this is a youth pastor. This isn't aside by the way, in case you didn't know primarily youth pastors reading this. They embrace and embody this, this characteristic, this idea of incarnation ministry just may not use it. You know, super frequently in our vocabulary anyway, in the gospels, we see Jesus going to be with his people that he encounters. So if our ministries are going to be a mirror of Christ's incarnation life and incarnation ministry, we are required to go and be with the people that we're ministering to.
Nick Clason (03:16):
And if you and I were youth pastors in the nineties, well we'd probably be found at the mall sitting next to a Chinese restaurant that's handing out free samples of their bourbon chicken and browsing hot topic on our way out the store. You know, you remember, however, if your towns anything like mine, well, the mall I just described as a of it, former of its former self. So where are all the teenagers hanging out? According to some statistics, 45% of Generation Z report that they're online, as they describe it as almost constantly, 45%, 24% of teams report feelings of discomfort if they go more than just one hour without access to the internet. And finally, on average, generation Z allocates two hours and 55 minutes per day on average to social media. So let's just be honest for a minute. The mall has gone to there, and let's be honest and frank, our pockets, it lives on our phones and the students that we're trying to reach and spend their time, they're online.
Nick Clason (04:26):
Regardless of your opinion of whether or not you believe that this amount of screen time is healthy, advantageous, it's probably not. It is where our students are spending the majority of their time. Let's pause for a minute. Um, a quick aside from this, I was in a recent Barna CoLab group on how to disciple Gen Z and their, they're sharing some recent findings, super interesting, super fascinating stuff. One of the things that they shared, um, actually it was a guy that they interviewed from a church and he said, uh, if Generation Z is the first digitally native generation, then generation alpha right behind them. By the way, if you're youth pastor, that is fifth and sixth, seventh, eighth grade, maybe not as high as seventh and eighth grade, but definitely like sixth, fifth, and on down. So they are the youth ministry of the future.
Nick Clason (05:13):
So if generation Z is the first digitally native generation, then that means that generation Alpha is the first digitally dependent generation. Crazy to think about. And so a lot of times, let's be honest with our generational age gap and difference, even as I'm a millennial, even as some fellow millennials, Xers, boomers on up, what is our constant, like, what are we constantly asking generation Z and younger to do? We're asking them to get rid of their phones. We're asking them to disconnect and unplug from technology. And while I think that there's advantages to that and it's advantageous for people to learn the disciplines of being able to break away, find some silence, find some solace and solitude, um, away from social media culture, away from online culture, I think all of that is well and good. I just think that you have a generation that is dependent on it.
Nick Clason (06:06):
It is literally their alarm clock. It's their calendar, it's their actual phone. It's where they communicate with all their friends, whether it be text message, Snapchat, be real, but it's, it's their their map, it's their navigation system. It's the way that they check their grades. It's how they pay for their school lunches. Like it's everything. It's not like, I'll give you this example. I am recording this podcast when I'm recording it in preparation for my trip to Disney World. Everything at Disney World is now online. It's in the my Disney Experience app Genie Plus, which is the replacement of Fast Passes, lightning Lanes, um, checking into my resort, making mobile food orders, like everything is on my phone. And you are at an amusement park with your family trying to unplug, trying to disconnect Bif, do you have to be on your phone? And there are people who are like, I'm done.
Nick Clason (06:56):
I'm not gonna do that. And that's fine. But the reality is we are moving more and more towards that than we are away from that. And so if this generation is dependent upon it, what we have to do is stop villainizing the phone and we have to start looking at it as an opportunity to teach them and disciple them through how to have faith with a phone through that lens. And I think that's my heart in this article, and that's what's coming through. Let's read the next section. So here's a question for you. If in the nineties you would've gone hung out at the mall to connect with students and teenagers, how in 2023, which is one of the articles written, how in 2023 are you showing up where your students are? See, I'm not necessarily proposing that the digital church replaces the in-person experience hybrid far from it.
Nick Clason (07:47):
But if your students go home after school and spend almost three hours on their phones, which is what the statistics told us, then couldn't you make an impact with your students or your people online? All right, so here's some ideas how to do that. If you've been listening to this podcast any length of time you've heard it, I'm gonna say it in idea and then I'm gonna riff on it. So I'm gonna say idea number one, idea number two, so that you're clear, okay, idea number one, share a devotional thought. Guys, you can hold your phone out in front of you and you can give either a recap of, or you can give a completely new and different from, not different cuz come, gonna come from the Bible, hopefully, but different from your sermon or from the lesson that week or whatever the case might be.
Nick Clason (08:29):
You can give just a devotional thought, boom. Hey guys wanna give you quick encouragement, 60 seconds or less. People don't want longer than that. Anyway, you can do a deep dive into an encouraging, um, or challenging passage of scripture. Again, 60 seconds or less. I, I think maybe it was Mark Twain, I'm not sure, but it was him who said, Hey, I wanted to write a short letter but I didn't have time. So I wrote a long letter. See, it takes more time to make something quick, concise, and short. Idea number three, have fun, create fun and funny posts. Hey, if you're not following us on TikTok on our student ministry, I would encourage you to, you can go check it out. We are Cross Creek students. Um, hopefully now we are at Cross Creek students. If not, I may still have it set as at Cross Creek Church cuz TikTok won't let me switch my name over to Cross Creek students, but that's ultimately the goal.
Nick Clason (09:18):
I've had a hard time switching it over. But we do fun and funny posts. I literally, right as I was walking into this spare bedroom of my house to record this podcast, I was literally posting a video of a girl drinking ranch dressing flavored soda and trying to guess the flavor of it. Like it's just fun. And honestly, what I do is I toss out the invite on a youth ministry night. Hey, you wanna be on TikTok tonight? Sure. They all come into the room. I have six bottles of soda with weird flavors. I have a game cud up on my laptop. And another thing with the filter on on TikTok, it gets me like 20 pieces of video content that I just store, bank and pull back out later when I need it in my calendar. Idea number four, film answers to theological questions, right?
Nick Clason (10:02):
People are inspired by answers to deep things that maybe you don't wanna put online, but things that students are dealing with. Like, why do bad things happen? How do I develop a habit? Why, how do I spend time with God even if I don't want to? Why would I go on obeying him and living a life of sinlessness or the goal of that if he's always just gonna forgive my sins? Anyway? You talk about that every week. What's the point of it? What does God think about gay people? Does God require me to be a democrat? Does God require me to be a Republican? What would Jesus think of our current political landscape? You get the idea. Idea number five, encourage spiritual practices and disciplines. I don't know if it's gonna get accepted or if it's out yet, but I recently submitted, if it is, I'll drop a link to it in the show notes.
Nick Clason (10:48):
I recently submitted 10 TikTok videos. Actually, you know what I'm gonna do? It's on ym, um, or I submitted it to d y m I don't know if they took it or not. What I'm gonna do is I'm gonna drop a link, uh, to that resource, the Dropbox resource in the show notes here, completely free charge. Just go grab it and use it. It's, uh, memorize scripture with me. Practice meditation, sit in silence, have a praise break, all kinds of different things. 10 different spiritual practices that that students or people or adults can use. It's not branded. So you can use it. Just download it and post it wherever you, uh, manage social media free for you. Uh, let's see. Are we on six idea number six, you can do recap posts or videos. Just take, literally you only need 3, 4, 5 seconds worth of of videos and you get like 10 of those real fast at the beginning of the night, um, or during your program.
Nick Clason (11:40):
And then you just put 'em into TikTok. Auto cut. Boom. You got a less than 22nd recap video. Phenomenal way to do that. Idea number 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, less idea Number seven, give shout outs to leaders and volunteers. Figure out how to do that on social, whether it's static graphics, whether it's motion graphics, whether it's you talking graphics, whether it's voiceovers, give shout outs to leaders and volunteers. Finally, you can quiz students on their Bible knowledge. Uh, one of my favorite ways to do this is on the Instagram story editor with the story sticker, uh, uh, multiple choice story sticker. You can put it in there and you can ask them bible questions and test their Bible knowledge. Super fun way to go about doing that. Those are just some ideas to name a few. I don't know your context, but here's one thing that I do know, we're back to the article, is that I want you to notice that not one single idea that I mentioned above was an advertisement for an event.
Nick Clason (12:32):
We've gone into this, if you've listened to me for a while, you've heard this before. But what if we could use social media to encourage students to actually take the next step in their faith to engage with you or with your ministry, to challenge them to deeper more meaningful ways and a more meaningful walk with Jesus. It's not just another communication platform, which is what we often default social media into being. It's a means to help accomplish a more incarnation form of ministry. So that's it, that's the article. Love to know how you are using social media in your ministry context for more than just announcements to encourage people in their faith to show up where they are. But the bottom line is we are rooting for you. We are cheering you on. So glad you're in here. Hey, listen, if you didn't know this, 2023 is the year of short form video content, vertical video, short form content, less than 60 seconds. If you're like, man, I don't even know how to get this word out there, we got you right here. Link the description. If you're watching on YouTube or go grab our 100% completely free e-book titled, have I already ruined my Church's TikTok account? No. But this book will help teach you how to post one from start to finish all the way through doing it all on the phone in your pocket. So we're here for you, rooting you on. Thanks for being here. Thanks for being a loyal listener. And as always, we never forget.
15 min
May 18, 2023 Episode 045: 9 Church Marketing Tips to Best Serve Your Members and Reach Others Not Yet Apart of Your Church
In this episode, Nick will give you 9 Church Marketing Tips.
5 Tips for those who are members or who consider themselves a regular part of your church
4 Tips for reaching people who are not a part of your church yet, and how best to reach them
Follow Along on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9pjecCnd8FVFCenWharf2g
Show Notes & Transcripts: http://www.hybridministry.xyz/045
Follow me on TikTok: http://www.tiktok.com/@clasonnick
FREE E-Book: https://www.hybridministry.xyz/articles/ebook
SHOWNOTES
Plain Text vs. HTML
https://www.mailmunch.com/blog/html-vs-plain-text-email
Singular Calls to Action:
https://unlayer.com/blog/call-to-action-in-emails
Central Hub:
[Nucleus.Church](nucleus.church)
[LHC.life](LHC.life)
Posting Content Online or to YouTube:
http://www.hybridministry.xyz/042
Running Ads:
https://www.hybridministry.xyz/009
TIMECODES
00:00-04:19 Intro
04:19-07:26 What is Marketing? And Should Churches even be focused on it?
07:26-09:14 Church Marketing Tip #1: Plain-Text Emails
09:14-11:12 Church Marketing Tip #2: Send From Your Pastor
12:12-15:23 Church Marketing Tip #3: Single CTA
15:23-15:52 Church Marketing Tip #3a: Include a PS Section in Email
15:52-18:00 Church Marketing Tip #4: Create a Central Hub Style Website
18:00-20:00 Church Marketing Tip #5: Put your messaging and sermon content online
20:00-20:48 Marketing Your Church to Those not a part of your church
20:48-21:53 Church Marketing Tip #6: Consider Running an Ad
21:53-22:58 Church Marketing Tip #7: Use Short-Form Video Content
22:58-26:19 Church Marketing Tip #8: Create an e-book for your community
26:19-28:28 Church Marketing Tip #9: Captialize on Word of Mouth
28:28- Outro
TRANSCRIPT
Nick Clason (00:00):
Well, hey there everybody. Welcome back to another episode of the Hybrid Ministry Show. In this episode, I am going to give you nine church marketing tips. We're just gonna fire through them one by one. However, we're gonna break them up into two different sections. Section number one is marketing tips for people who already considered themselves a part of your church and a part of your congregation. And then the back half. So those are gonna be the first five. The back four are going to be church marketing tips for people who are not yet a part of your church congregation. So, so excited to have you with us. Hey, if this is your first time ever, welcome to the show. Excited to have you. If you don't know, we stream and film every single one of these episodes out to our YouTube channel. So you can grab the link to that in the show notes.
Nick Clason (00:48):
If you're on YouTube and you're like, wait, this is the podcast, yes it is. Hit the link in the show notes and that will take you to hybridministry.xyz. And there will be a specific link that will take you directly to this episode number and will give you completely free access to our transcripts, which is a free resource that we offer for each and every single episode. So make sure that you go and take advantage of that because listen, if you're anything like me, you're on a run, you're cooking dinner, you're walking your dog, and you might hear a thing that you're like, that's interesting. I want to dive deeper into that. And if that is the case, it's often hard and and difficult to do that, you know, when you are on that run, when you're walking that dog, when you're doing those dishes.
Nick Clason (01:29):
So you just make a quick earmark and like, I'm gonna go back, I'm gonna download those transcripts, I can see a little bit more. So that is an opportunity and definitely an option for you. So make sure that you take a look into that and take advantage of that. We're so excited to have you with us. Hey, listen, if you are excited to be here, if you're excited to be listening, it would mean the absolute world to us. If you would share this episode with a friend, it would mean the absolute world with us. If you are going to, if you help us by making a rating or a review, we would be thrilled with those things. Um, it just helps us get the word out. It helps us get indexed and ranked and search. Um, not because we're trying to go big, go viral or go famous, but man, we just, we're passionate about this message and we just really want to get the word out there.
Nick Clason (02:18):
You know what's interesting, before we dive into the church marketing tips, I was at a Bible study last night. Um, if you don't know me, my story, my name's Nick Clason, I'm your host, uh, here every single week with y'all. Um, new episodes drop every single Thursday at four o'clock in the morning. But I'm a youth pastor. I'm a youth pastor in the Dallas Fort Worth metroplex area, um, at a big church for most, but in Dallas it's not super big, uh, cuz everyone goes to church here. But I was at a, a bible study that we do, it's a yearlong bible study on Sunday night, which is not a normal ministry night, and it's for seniors only. So it's creative name called fso. So it's that fso and they're talking about finding a church when you go off to college. And um, it was just interesting cuz like the hybridness of ministry really reared its head in those moments, uh, because they're talking about visiting a church, how often you should visit a church, uh, what if you go in the main pastors, isn't there preaching like how many more times you need to give that church a shot?
Nick Clason (03:20):
And I just was like, guys, um, I was nice, right? But I was like, guys, you don't have to just only attend in person. Like if what you're looking for is the pastor's message and the content. I said Covid has forced just about every single church in America online. So check out their services, check out his preaching, uh, check those things out online, gather some of those data points. And then when, you know, based on what I've heard so far, this church, this church and this church are all options for me, then go visit them in person. So I just wanna say like even in my own life, even in my own realm, even in my own world, hybrid ministry is rearing its head. So encourage you, stick with it, it's important, it matters. There's a world out there of people that are trying to grasp and grab a hold of this message and you just might be the key for some of those people.
Nick Clason (04:09):
So what you do is worth it. What you do matters. And so without any further ado, let's dive in to nine different church marketing tips before we give you marketing tip number one, I just wanna do a quick like 10, 30 seconds, something like that. Little primer on what is marketing. If you Google search, what is marketing? This is a response you're gonna get. It says this, it's the activity or uh, the activity of business, sorry, the activity or business of promoting and selling products or services including market research and advertising. So you might be sitting here thinking like that. Yeah, great, but that's not what the church is supposed to do. And I agree with you mostly, uh, in the traditional sense, like you might think of marketing as a way to make money for a business, and that's true. Um, however, that is not necessarily the church's goal.
Nick Clason (05:03):
Our goal though is to bring about brand awareness and not cause we're a brand, but because we want people to know about our church. So what is your church about? Does your church even exist? Um, and then beyond that, once they do know that you exist, how do you help add value to their lives? And not because we're trying to get their tithe money, though, maybe we are at some point. That's part of the thing. You gotta make money. You know, you gotta, you know, you gotta take people's ties and use that for the overall betterment of the church. And if you don't, the crass reality is that your church that's gonna have to shut their doors. And so at some level you are gonna want that, but that's not the main reason. And you know that, and that's honestly not why you're in this.
Nick Clason (05:48):
Okay? You're in this so that people know about you, know about your church and then make a decision to commit and connect to your church. And with that commitment and connection, especially if that person is far from God and doesn't know Jesus, that's not only gonna come with a decision to join a social gathering and entity, but that's also gonna come with a major crisis of faith and a major faith hurdle decision that they're gonna have to make. So this isn't just, you're like, Hey, do you want to come shop at Walmart? This is, do you wanna give your life to Jesus radically and and forever change everything about that. And then do you want to commit to our social gathering where we help equip you and encourage you in that? And if you've grown up a Christian your whole life, you're like, yeah, that's exactly what this is.
Nick Clason (06:37):
But if this is completely new to you of faith, you're like, that is a lot and it is right? You gotta just keep that in mind like that. There are about 37 things that go into that. And so while our logo and our color scheme matter, we are asking people to do major things in their life. And so what is marketing? It's bringing about awareness of your church. It's adding value to people's lives. It's helping them commit and connect to you and your uh, organization. And then finally it's helping create, um, fans out of them disciples, super fans, people who will give their lives to the mission of Jesus and the mission of your church. So that's just a quick primer on marketing, specifically what is church marketing? But let's dive in now to nine different church marketing tips. Here we go. Church marketing. Tip number one is send emails and send plain text emails to your church.
Nick Clason (07:36):
Now what am I talking about? There's a difference between uh, plain text email, which is just white background, black text. Just like you would send an email to a friend, a coworker or your son or daughter's elementary school teacher, right? And then there are graphically designed newsletters that look amazing. It's what you'd get from Bath and Body Works or Target or Old Navy, right? And they're trying to sell you something. And a lot of times, especially foreign in church communications or foreign church marketing, we have a graphic design skill and we like to use that and show that off. We can make that newsletter if we're honest, look incredibly sexy and sleek and amazing. However, there's been a lot and considerable amounts of research shown. And it goes to show that email marketing is done best in plain text. I have a quote here from a male Munch article is from a blog, it's HTML versus plain text email and they dive deep into it.
Nick Clason (08:30):
I'll add that link there in the show notes if that's something that you're interested in. But their conclusion said this, it can be a pickle to choose one type of email, but here's the secret that no one lets you onto in email. Less is always more so less is more. And I just wanna encourage you don't lose sight of that fact. Less is more. And if less is more, you may get your message across more clearly, more concisely. Two more people. You may get more clicks, you make it more opens. And so I'll just encourage you in your email marketing, if you are doing a graphically designed thing, consider trying and beta testing and AB testing if you will. Send some graphically designed ones and then send some plain text ones and see which perform better. Church marketing tip number two, when sending emails, edit your from section and send the emails from your pastor's name.
Nick Clason (09:25):
There's a very big difference psychologically when you're getting an email from Pastor Todd as opposed to getting an email from Crossroads Church. You see what I'm saying? You're getting an email in one case from a friend, from a person, from a human being, somebody who you know, who you connect with, who you love, and then you're getting an email from an entity or, or an organization and he doesn't have to actually be from Pastor Todd. If Pastor Todd's worried about putting his name on something, then ghost write it for him and then just send it over to him to get a stamp of approval and let him make the final edits and tweaks before you send that out. But you are gonna, you are going to see your email open rates skyrocket when you're doing both plain texts and when you're sending it from Pastor Todd, because think about it, people open their emails and I don't know if you're anything like me.
Nick Clason (10:12):
I open my emails and I see junk, junk, junk, junk, junk. And then there's like one or two things that I'm like, oh, this is from a person, let me read it. And when there's something from a person that's personal, that's different, that's not the same, it's going to peak my interest differently because I actually want an email. Like if I get an email from my grandma or my grandpa, they're checking in on my life. They're trying to see how things are going. Like I don't delete that email, but I delete the Old Navy email. I delete the emails from my kid's school. I delete the emails from frankly my church because they come from not anybody, right? And all I know they are is they're just lists and bullets of announcements. Announcement, announcement, announcement. There's nothing personal in there. And here's the reality, when you are sending an email from a church, it is going to have an announcement flare to it.
Nick Clason (10:59):
So if you can personalize it a little bit more in these two ways by making it plain text, cause that's how you would send an email to a friend and by sending it from your pastor, that's gonna help your open rates skyrocket. Church marketing tip number three, give yourself one singular call to action. Call to action is just a marketing word for what are you trying to get the people that you're communicating with to do what is the one call to action or the one thing, the one action step that you're hoping that they take. Now here's the thing, we will put together a full on smorgasboard of a church newsletter, basically a bulletin board of church email stuff all in one email. And that's why we do these html amazing graphically designed newsletters cuz we can include everything and the kids ministry and the women's ministry and the senior adult ministry in the youth ministry in college of ministry.
Nick Clason (11:56):
And everyone gets their announcement in the church newsletter. And so nobody's left out and nobody has to worry it. But you will see a dramatic rise in calls to action if you give one singular call to action. Now, you might be thinking, wait a minute, you just named like five ministries just off the top of your head, that doesn't even include some of the real ones that I have in my church. How in the heck am I supposed to get all of these things communicated if I'm also only, maybe you're maybe only sending an email newsletter one time a week. Well, we fear this, right? We fear because we are afraid that some people might not know all that's going on. We also are afraid that some people won't get the info that they need. And also for just honest, we live and work in an office culture.
Nick Clason (12:42):
And so there's gonna be awkward vibes if you pick the Kids ministries announcement over the youth ministries announcement and the kids pastor loves you, but the youth pastor now hates you, right? And, and so you got that pressing on you too, and you shouldn't let that be a reason why you do it, but it is, if we're honest, we're all human, right? And so I wanna, um, link, uh, an article for you. Um, I'm gonna read a little excerpt for you, but it's from unlayer.com. It's a blog called Call to Actions and Email. And here's what it says, just a reminder of this, when you are sending to somebody, you're saying, Hey, it's a selfish world out there. And the question that they're asking is, what's in it for me? So here's what it says, what's in it for me? Selfish world out there? Why expect your audience to listen to you, right?
Nick Clason (13:25):
For them to perform your desired action, you need to highlight what's in it for them. So let's take the example of an e-book of reducing debt you're offering as a reward for subscribing to your mail list. Which call to action sounds better, download now or give me financial freedom. So as you're writing these things out, be thinking about how can you offer and provide value to these people's lives? That's what they're saying, right? Like this give me financial freedom button is gonna be a lot more appealing than simply download now because in the back of people's minds, they're thinking, what is in this for me? Now the tricky thing is you're gonna have to get really vigilant with which announcements get promoted where, especially if you're only doing one email a week and one singular call to action. But what I would do is I would choose one thing every single week, the number one thing, and send that out.
Nick Clason (14:17):
And if the entire email is focus on signing up for kids vbs and nothing else is vying for his attention, for people's attention in the email, because it's a plain text email, it's from Pastor Todd and Pastor Todd's inviting you to VBS because he's sharing a story of life change and life transformation that happened at last year's vbs. You can't help but be compelled to be like, give me that same experience and I want to invite my friends, I wanna invite my neighbors into it. And that's the email. But then next week, maybe it's not about kids, maybe it's about youth camp. The next weekend Pastor Todd's doing the same thing in a plain text email because it feels like he's emailing a friend. Narrow your emails down to one singular call to action and then you are as a, this is why you get paid to big bucks as a church communications, a church marketing manager, church, you know, marketing director, whatever your title is, to figure out how to communicate the other elements, the other announcements without just cramming more and more and more and more and more into an email.
Nick Clason (15:24):
Let me give you church marketing tip, bonus tip four or three a, um, in your emails include a PS section. A lot of times we as as, uh, humans, we just skim our emails and we, we skim, skim and then we see a PS boom. Give the same message in the body of your email as you do in the PS of an email. One singular call to action all the way down. Boom. PS don't forget it sounded from vbs. Church marketing tip number four, create for yourself a one-stop shop centralized hub. Uh, this has made famous and I have been on record on here promoting the mess out of them from the guys up at Proach Church Tools in Canada, Brady Shear. Um, and all those guys, they have made famous the idea of a central hub. They call it Nucleus. So you can go ahead to nucleus.church and make that your website's one stop shop.
Nick Clason (16:20):
So every single next step lies on your website. That's gonna help, especially if we are doing these one singular call to action emails where not everything is on your, um, not everything is on your email, but everything is on your website. And so if they go there, it's a full service bar. A lot of times we make it where it's like, Hey, if you wanna send up for vbs, go to the children's lobby and if you wanna sign up for youth camp, go talk to Pastor Doug. And if you wanna sign up for the women's brunch, you need to email Kathy. And if you're interested in the senior adult ministry, make sure that you email Harry. Um, but Harry's not here this week, so email his wife Sue today to make sure that you get, you see what I'm saying? Like we have all these different scattering spots.
Nick Clason (17:05):
The human brain is not wired and frankly not interested in remembering all those specific intricacies. But if you beat it weekly into their head, central hub, central hub, central hub. And listen, don't call it that. One church I worked at was called Liberty Heights Church. And so short lhc, right? And the centralized hub was lhc.life. In fact, we outfitted a whole section in the lobby, um, as like a next steps hub in the lobby, but we called it lhc.life. So both the web URL and the in-person room were all called the same thing. And that was it. We ingrained it from the stage, we ingrained it in our emails, we ingrained it online. lhc.life, lhc.life lhc.life eventually becomes a part of the vernacular. Um, and people know where to go when they're looking for things. Number five, I just wanna remind you, create and put your message content out there somehow.
Nick Clason (18:07):
You may or may not have the live streaming capabilities. Odds are in your church, you're at least using a soundboard. And if you're using a soundboard, you have the ability in most cases, if not with a couple of adapters, you're gonna have the ability to record your sermon audio at a minimum starting there. You can record the sermon audio, you can take that and you can put that on a podcast. Um, and you can be on Spotify, you can be on Apple Music, you can be, um, apple Podcast, all the places that you are gonna want to be on a podcast. If you do have video capabilities, I would recommend posting those to YouTube. And I also, honestly, I recommend doing a direct to camera message anyway. So if you're not pre-filing in some sort of way or, or filming your message content in like a studio type of form, pre-fill it, even if it's just on a phone or whatever, have someone edit that down and post those to YouTube and then leave your live streams as a completely different entity.
Nick Clason (19:04):
So yeah, you may have duplicate content out there, but one's gonna be aimed towards your YouTube audience and one's gonna be aimed towards just your people that are in person, right? And finally, uh, if you have the bandwidth ability margin, brain power, come up with some additional forms of content to supplement your weekend weekly messages. But put your content out there, like I said at the top right, the seniors in FSO trying to figure out where to go. This is going to be a goal mine for people as they're trying to discover your church. And it's also gonna be a goal mine for the people that can't make it every single week or don't make it every single week or aren't in the discipline yet of attending church on a Sunday morning every single week for whatever reason. They're a new believer. They're out late on a Saturday night, they just had a new baby.
Nick Clason (19:51):
So getting up early is hard and getting the baby there. Maybe you don't feel comfortable bringing the baby to the nursery, but let them still feel part of what your church has going on. All right, so what do we do when we are looking to reach people who are not yet considered a part of your church? Let me give this caveat that these are all gonna be digital marketing ideas only, not because your in-person experience doesn't matter. Your in-person experience matters greatly. I'm gonna just give the caveat that you have to crush your in-person experience. And so I'm going to carry in two assumptions with this. Number one that you are doing that, that you are attempting with all your might to make your in-person experience as rock solid as possible. But number two, this is a hybrid ministry podcast. And so I wanna focus on the areas in hybrid space, in digital space to help reach some of the people that are gonna be out there that you want to be bringing into your church.
Nick Clason (20:49):
So with that being said, maybe consider, if you really wanna market to people that are unaware of your church, really maybe consider running an ad. If you go to hybrid ministry.xyz sa slash 0 0 9, episode nine, I talk to Matt who I consider a marketing genius and guru about the step-by-step process of running an ad. Now granted, that was in 2022, and so we may need to revisit that and look at that maybe one day I'll see if I can get him back on the podcast. For those of you who don't know, he was our um, co-host on this show for like the first 12 or so episodes. And then him and I both made cross country moves and, uh, for a lot of different reasons, he did not make that jump back into podcast co-host dumb. Uh, and so maybe one day I'll bring him back on as a special guest to help us walk back through that.
Nick Clason (21:37):
Definitely not my forte. Maybe you personally have some experience doing it, so that'd be great. But if not, if you have no idea what you're doing, head there. Hybrid ministry.xyz/ 0 0 9 for a free look into that. Um, and check out how to run an ad. Number seven, uh, church marketing tip is use short form video content. Short form video content is still king. We talk about it weekly. YouTube shorts, Instagram and Facebook reels and TikTok. All four blowing up right now, all four asking for the same types of content. So create quality content in short form video versions. Post it, put it on your social media channels. And here's the other good news about it, right? Like once you've done one that does well, you can boost that or turn that into an ad. And so that will help also bring about awareness. But just in your general area, TikTok specifically shares geographically in your area first.
Nick Clason (22:34):
And so post in your area, geotag it. And then as people are experiencing and spending time on TikTok, just consuming things for themselves, they may run across on therefore you page something about your church, a video, whether it's spiritual content, fun content, marketing type content, but create some of those short form video pieces for the chance and for the opportunity to go viral. Church marketing idea number eight, this one is next level in my personal opinion. We were doing it at the church. I was at both Matt and I, the co-host I had, like I had just mentioned, um, create an ebook for your community. So one of the things that we started doing was we were creating, uh, a seasonal e-book. And so the first one we did was leading into summer and I think we titled 101 things to do in this area, like South Chicago land in this area for the summer.
Nick Clason (23:29):
And it was aimed at families with younger kids and it just gave them like park ideas, splash pad ideas. It gave them like movie night dates and places that they could go see movies under the stars or you know, whatever. Um, but then what you can do with that is if you're giving away your a right, you're adding value to people if you give some of those things away. The other thing is you can include your stuff in there. So you give them 95 ideas of things all around the community. Splash pads and parks and ice cream cone trails and all those types of things that you either borrow off of or just create, like we created our very own ice cream trail in the South Chicago suburbs area. There wasn't one in existence, but we just brain pooled our heads together, like this place, this place, this place.
Nick Clason (24:14):
It's make an ice cream trail. And then you give them like the family, like a one page tear out, you know, thing that they can use and put in their fridge and they can keep track of all the different ice cream places that they want to go throughout the summer. So you give 'em 95 ideas of just like places around. But then five ideas are your ideas and maybe you like make those colorful, you know, where you print the rest of the ebook and like black and white or whatever, but your pages are full page spreads color, whatever, and you're highlighting your church vbs, you're highlighting your own church movie nights, you're highlighting, you know, whatever stuff you are doing that would, that would be a great place for somebody not connected to your church to make an introductory connection step with your church, with your faith family and with your organization.
Nick Clason (25:03):
And then replicate that. Make a fall one winter one spring one. You see what I'm saying? Um, or it doesn't have to be that, but but think about ways in which you can add value. What you're looking to do in those is you're looking to capture people's emails, name and email. You could and should be able to do that through your church communications, um, or church marketing, uh, database. But those aren't always geared and built for marketing. So I do remember when Matt would work, um, at Parkview we used like the Rock as like a church management software, but Matt was like, I want to use HubSpot and you can do all the same stuff through HubSpot. I don't know if Matt knew all of the things that we needed, um, for like a pastoral side of things with like baptism dates, membership and whatever and whatnot.
Nick Clason (25:52):
But he knew that you could do a lot of stuff with like, um, an actual marketing tool like that. And so, um, you'll, you may have to figure out the best way to do that, to capture those names. Um, it is difficult to find a free email capture list out there, so you will more than likely have to pay for it, but it's worth it, especially if you're saying we wanna reach people who are far from God, who are not connected to our church and help get them connected to our church. The last idea, not necessarily a digital marketing idea, but word of mouth and, and you can take word of mouth and turn it into a digital marketing thing, right? Like when you're encouraging your church congregation to invite people to Easter, give them some shareable Easter graphics that they can download and share on their, their social media platforms.
Nick Clason (26:40):
You know, um, give them some of those tips and tools like, Hey, text us to a friend. Send this to a friend. Post this on your Instagram, post this on your Facebook, you know, whatever. Because that word of mouth, like while all the best ads, e-books, signs, website, like all those best things are valuable, the most valuable. It's when a friend says, Hey, you know what I've been doing recently, going to this church, going to this restaurant, reading this book. I mean, I'll say like, I was listening to a podcast the other day, we're gearing up to go on vacation here in just a couple short weeks. And I was like, I need a book. Like I need to read a book when I'm on vacation. I never do that. I always just read non-fiction books. Someone said, you know, I read such and such book and I'm not a non-fiction reader, but that book was phenomenal.
Nick Clason (27:25):
Or he's not a fiction reader, but that book was phenomenal. That's all I needed to hear. I'm also not a fiction reader. He's a pastor. I'm a pastor. That book's phenomenal. Boom, bought it. I literally got on Amazon and write that moment and bought it. Word of mouth. I have no clue who that author is. I'm sure they did all kinds of book tours, podcast marketing. I didn't listen to a single word of it, but someone else gave a word of mouth reference and boom, I bought it instantly. So think about that. Your people can become a raving fans of your church question, are they willing to be raving fans of your church or are they embarrassed by it? And if it's the latter, I would do some heavy introspection to figure out why that is. Because you want your people to be proud where they go to church so that they tell their friends, then they come, that could be digitally or that could just be very analog in a backyard barbecue scenario when they're at their kids', you know, sporting event, end of season recap or whatever, and they're just talking about stuff.
Nick Clason (28:23):
So those are some nine different church marketing ideas. Hey, hope you found them helpful. So thankful that you stuck around to the very end of this episode. If you did find it helpful, please consider shooting a rating or review alike, a subscribe, any of those things really help the algorithm and we will be forever in your debt as a token of our thanks to you for that, head to our website, hybridministry.xyz, click on blogs, click on the article that says ebook and grab your very own free copy of this e-book. TikTok. Have I already ruined my account? A complete guide, I'm posting your church's TikTok from start to finish. You're the church marketing manager, or you're the pastor and you know you need to make short form video content and you just don't know how to do it or where to turn. Take this e-book ZBook, hand it to a friend, hand it to a student, hand it to a trusted anybody who you're like, Hey, help me out with some of this stuff.
Nick Clason (29:19):
And if they don't know what they're doing, it will be their complete guide to starting from scratch, from start to finish. So hope that you find that helpful and with, again, as always, we're so grateful that you're here. Head to the episode, uh, show notes for all the links to articles and all the different things that we've referenced throughout this, this episode so far. But if you did find it helpful, please consider sharing it with a friend that would mean the absolute world to us. I'm so glad you're here. So glad you're along for the ride. This matters. What you do matters. So don't forget. And as always, stay hybrid.
30 min
May 11, 2023 Episode 044: Gen Z and the Generation Gaps that is keeping them out of your churches
In this episode, Nick talks about the lastest Generation Z findings, the cultural and generation gap that is growing in our churches. And answers the ultimate question, is Gen Z deconstructing their faith? And if so, what do we do about that?
Show Notes & Transcripts: http://www.hybridministry.xyz/044
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9pjecCnd8FVFCenWharf2g
TikTok: http://www.tiktok.com/@clasonnick
FREE E-Book: https://www.hybridministry.xyz/articles/ebook
RECENT GEN Z STATS
*GEN Z *
70% are spiritually open
TRAITS
Correct
6% Teens
8% All Gen Z
9% Young Adults
Knowledgeable
16% Teens
21% All Gen Z
24% Young Adults
Being Honest
41% Teens
32% All Gen Z
25% Young Adults
Being Open to New Ideas
29% Teens
28% All Gen Z
28% Young Adults
Being Curious
7% Teens
11% All Gen Z
13% Young Adults
51% HAPPINESS IS VERY IMPORTANT
Happiness Looks Like
43% Success
23% Education
20% Family
8% Spiritual
6% Health
TIMECODES
00:00-02:46 Intro
02:46-06:32 A BeReal Generation vs. an Instagram Generation
06:32-11:37 The Latest Gen Z Statistics
11:37-18:52 Church & Workplace Implications of these Cultural Trends and Shifts
18:52-21:49 Gen Z Still Likes Jesus, just not our Church
21:49-22:44 Outro
TRANSCRIPT
Nick Clason (00:00):
Hey, what is up everybody? Welcome back to another episode of the Hybrid Ministry Show. I am your host, Nick Clason, excited to be with you. And in this episode, we are going to talk about the workplace gap and generational gap between older generations and younger generations, specifically generation Z and those that have come before them. And also, I want to pull out some principles that I think might be true about what that means for you and your local church and how they're the, the gap is causing a riff in potentially church attendance. But before we do, I just want to say thanks for being here. If you're on YouTube, hit that subscribe and notification button, that like button. If you're on TikTok, give us a follow. And if you are just listening in your podcast catcher, I wanna let you know that you can head to hybridministry.xyz for all of your podcast needs, including show notes and transcripts.
Nick Clason (01:00):
We will link all of the notes to everything, uh, all the links, everything that we're talking about. And, uh, all of the, uh, transcript is there for you, 100% completely free of charge. We also wanna let you know that LinkedIn, the show notes, both on YouTube and in your podcast, our free ebook, have I already ruined my church's TikTok account. That will be available for you. Again, free of charge. Just hit that subscribe button and sign up for that email list. We'd love to give that to you as a free gift and our token of appreciation. Uh, and also, without any further ado, if you are able, willing, or, uh, have any sort of interest in letting us know, this would be great. We would love a five star rating or review that would really help us out, that would help us get index in the search for all these things on podcast.
Nick Clason (01:47):
All those things matter, and they're just, they would just be a small token of appreciation from you to us for all that we do. Um, but again, we are just thankful and thrilled to be here. So without any further ado, let's dive into the workplace generation gap conundrum. Hey, what's up, hybrid ministry fam, thanks for watching this or listening to this. Hey, I just wanna drop a quick note and let you know about halfway through, uh, the audio recording. Somehow my audio got corrupted. You'll notice a drastic drop off in quality some way through. Sorry about that. You're still gonna be able to hear it cuz I was recording it on my phone just like I'm doing this little announcement right here, right now. So this'll be able to hear it. It's just not the best, it's not our favorite quality level. We'll get it back, you know, we'll figured out the issue.
Nick Clason (02:40):
Um, but just wanna give you that quick disclaimer. Heads up. Hope you still enjoy the rest of the episode. So if you have been paying any bit of attention recently, you know that the social trends have been shifting. We all know that TikTok has grown in immense popularity. All of what Congress and the US is trying to do with it, it's grown in immense popularity. So much so that some of our more, um, legacy platforms like Facebook and Instagram have adopted many of the AI features that are available in TikTok. But another trend that I've noticed recently, uh, is the trend of the, the social media app. B real bre has been, uh, launched recently, um, within a year or so I would say. And Gen Z and current teenagers have gone crazy for it, at least in my anecdotal experience. And they're using it.
Nick Clason (03:37):
And if you don't know what B Real is, it's basically an app that one time a day says it's time to be real. But they, uh, you know, you can, you can, it has like dual meaning like cuz BRE is also another thing that you use in like film or whatever, but it says it's time to be real and they just take a picture of what you're doing wherever you are, right there in that moment. You have two minutes to post it, you can post late and that's what a lot of people do. But it's really just like a once daily posting app. It's not the curated feed and the beautiful like Brazilian vacation photo pictures that we would get in the old school, Instagram and Facebook, right? So that was a lot more curation and now Gen Z is leaning a lot more towards just like, this is how it is, this is what it is, take me for me, it is what it is, take it or leave it.
Nick Clason (04:29):
Like that's essentially right? Like that's essentially, uh, what they, uh, have kind of leaned into. And I think it's fascinating shift this like perfect polished, kind of curated down to this like little more nitty gritty just as I, as I am, take me or leave me for who I am. That's kind of what BeReal is. That's kind of why I think TikTok shifted too. And one of the things that's interesting is burial is where you follow friends, but they only post one time a day. There's like not as much pressure on social media on the curation of it. And I just, I think that that's a trend. I think that that's, uh, a, a way, a thing that Gen Z is attempting to adopt less curation, more just realness, more rawness, more authenticity. Um, and meanwhile like, uh, take, uh, Instagram, Facebook, and some of those more legacy platforms, millennials and up, that's not as much the priority in fact, or it hasn't been, you know, and as they've shifted into reels, which is much more discovery based, more raw, more quick cuts and more like entertainment based.
Nick Clason (05:36):
Um, like you would go on on TikTok or any of the other platforms, shorts, reels, and you would watch something, it's like 98% or, or something like that. 90% of what you actually watch and consume is not from people that you know. So that's not really a social media anymore. It's honestly much more of like a entertainment platform you get on TikTok at the end of the night or whenever you do to be entertained. So the actual sociability is happening on apps like be real and other, just more like basic, very like nitty gritty, not a lot of bells and whistles type of thing. And I think that there's an attraction to that. And so, uh, I I just, I think that's one, one interesting shift that I'm noticing in the generation gap. I wanna also look at the workplace gap here in a minute and how I think that that plays out for you and your church.
Nick Clason (06:29):
But first I have some new stats I got from Barna. So let's dive in to those recent stats from Barna on Gen Z. Um, found some of these interesting, just wanted to share them with you. According to Gen Z or according to Barna, 56% of Generation Z claim to be Christians, which might be higher than you thought it was. I think that there's sort of a notion out there that Gen Z is deconstructing, gen Z is rethinking their faith, but 56% still claim and classify themselves as Christians. Granted, I know there's, you know, all kinds of different things on spectrum. You may claim to be a Christian, is it nominal y or whatever, whatnot. The thing that's staggeringly high though is Gen Z considers, uh, only TW or 25% of Gen Z consider themselves to have no faith at all. And here's the the crazy thing, right?
Nick Clason (07:19):
Like that is, that's the part that is alarmingly high I believe because that is the highest of any other generation by a lot. So US adults, according to US adults only 13% say that they have no faith. And the next highest, um, like breakdown age demographic thing is millennials and they're at 15%. Gen X is at 13%, boomers at 8%, elders at 5%, all of that under not saying that they don't have, uh, faith. And so here's the thing is that while you and I, if we're older and not generation Z, we may look at that and we may be like, wow, that that's alarming. And they are definitely deconstructing and that may be the label that we give to it. But what's interesting is that they surveyed Gen Z gr deeper. And these five words were the words that most defined and clarified their spiritual journey.
Nick Clason (08:12):
And they were these words, number one, they're spiritually growing. That was 39% of the population checked that, uh, number two, they're spiritually open, 35%, they're spiritually curious, 32% they are, um, spiritual in general, uh, 29%. And then they are spiritually exploring 27%. So like I said, we might have that classification as like, man, you're deconstructing what they call it a different word. And I, that was a very, very, um, uh, important learning, at least for me. I was like, okay, we're freaking out about it. And they're like, no, I'm just open. I'm just exploring. I'm just growing. I'm just checking things out. That was how they would describe it. Uh, big bucket of that, 70% of Gen Z claim to be spiritually open. 70%, that's a large stat. Um, and then furthermore, to expound upon that and that this is where I think this really gets interesting and important for churches is that these were some of the traits that, uh, the survey asked Gen Z, what do you want in your, um, church?
Nick Clason (09:20):
What do you want in your religious institution? What are the key things you're looking for? The first question, are you looking for it to be correct? 6% of teens said that they were looking for their religion to be correct. 8% of all Gen Zs said that and 9% of young adults said that. Not very high, right? Are you looking for it to be knowledgeable? Are you looking for people in your religious institutions or people around to be knowledgeable? 16% of teens said, yeah, I'm looking for them to be knowledgeable. 21% of all Gen Zs said, yeah, I'm looking for them to be knowledgeable and then 24% of young adults, so I'm looking for them to be knowledgeable. You can see that jump right from teenager to young adult. Once you become an adult, you're like, I do want someone to know something, right? To help me out.
Nick Clason (10:02):
Uh, this one was the, the highest, the highest on the graphs. You had different graphs of all these different, um, characteristics. Being honest, this is the highest one. 41% of teens want their religious institution. To be honest, 32% of all Gen Z ask for that. And 25% of young adults want honesty, want authenticity, right? Back to be real honesty, authenticity, the real you being open to new ideas. That was another category. 29% of teens want that. 28% of all Gen Z, 28% of young adults. And finally, curiosity, that one was lower with 7% of teens wanting to be curious. 11% of all Gen Z and 13% of young adults. And so they're looking for honesty, they're looking for transparency, they're looking for realness. Okay? Furthermore, and this is the last bit of the stats before we dive into what I think are pot, some potential implications for this.
Nick Clason (10:55):
51% of Gen Z say that happiness is very important to them. They are looking for happiness. Well, you know, once, once they heard that stam in this like Barna kind of collab thing where they are sharing these statistics, one other person's put in the chat, how do you define happiness? And they ask that question, they're like, what does happiness look like to you? So 43% say it looks like success and, and they used images for them to choose. So that success image was a guy holding money. That's what 43% say, happiness looks like. Successful man holding money where 23% say education is happiness. 20% say family, 8% say spiritual and 6% say health. All right? So what does all that mean? Let's dive into it and check it out. Okay? So I think that there's a workplace shift that needs to happen. Covid ushered a lot of this stuff in and your church is probably in a different spot than it was pre covid, but it may not be fully there where generation Z is interested.
Nick Clason (11:56):
Cuz here's the thing, whether this matters to you on paper or not, you are going to need to start hiring generation Z by the year 2025, which at the time of the podcast recording is only a year and a half away. Millennials and Gen Z are going to make up the majority of the American workforce. That may or may not be true in your context and in your church, but the fact is, if you're catering to boomers and Xers in the workplace, just because this is the way we've always done it and they need to get over it and they need to get used to it, that may not be your most effective strategy moving forward. And it may not bite you right in the year 2025, but 2026 rolls around 20 27, 20 28, and you're trying to recruit new young talent and they're just not interested in coming to work for your church or your organization.
Nick Clason (12:43):
Why is that the case? Here are some thoughts I have based off of this research and just some things I've observed in the last couple of years that I think might be contributing to it. So the first is this, the time off conversation and or the work life balance conversation. These are wide sweeping generalities, I understand it. And so if you're like, Hey, I'm a Gen Xer and that's not true of me. I'm saying by and large wide sweeping, um, I work for a boss, he's Gen X, he is phenomenal at giving me time off, taking care of me, making sure I have balance, work life balance, all those things. But he will of his own admission and, and own accord say that he is a workaholic and he will push it to the limit. And so, uh, that is something that is of the older generation, much more the norm.
Nick Clason (13:36):
They're looking for people who are gonna work hard and give it their all and bust it. And while that may be true, and that may even be what's necessary at times, that is not the natural disposition of millennials and Gen Z, I'm a millennial and I I am friends with and work with a lot of people that are Gen Z. I don't think that they're lazy and don't wanna work. I just simply think that they are more aware of their work life balance. They've looked to their older parents or wiser people in their life and they've seen how they've approached work and they have not, they don't want to fall to those same, you know, pitfalls that they've seen over time. So work-life balance, PTO rhythms, taking time off vacation. I have a coworker, she's Gen Z and this is her first job. And so she's been with us, um, at our job for the, about the same amount of time that I've been working there, eight months or so.
Nick Clason (14:32):
And this is her first time with like a true weekend, but she has to come back for Sundays. Sundays are not a weekend anymore, but we get Fridays off. And so she will often try to get out of the office a little bit early on a Thursday and she will often take a trip somewhere, go meet some friends, you know, whatever. So she's leaving at like two o'clock, three o'clock, hitting the road, getting there on Thursday night, hanging out. Like, and that's important to her. And so there was a Thursday night commitment that she had and she's like, I can't do that. And it was like, because this is my weekend. I need my weekend to explore, to have fun. And that's just like, I think most older generations would be like, no, you have to work yet to stay here until five. Like, that's the rules.
Nick Clason (15:16):
And I just think that that that's a shift that is happening and that's probably an adaptation that I would say is gonna need to take place in the workforce. Uh, also flexible in workspaces, like remote working should be able to be a thing. Now I get it. If you're at church and you're in ministry, you know, just how valuable and important like in-person face-to-face meetings are. If you're gonna disciple somebody, if you're gonna grab coffee with a leader, if you're gonna sit down and have breakfast with a couple and you're counseling them, like all those things are valuable. But there's a lot of computer work, there's a lot of email based work, there's a lot of like software things that can take place via remote work. And you don't have to be 100% completely in the office, your butt in a chair because the natural like tendency for that is like everyone's here.
Nick Clason (16:06):
And so if anyone needs anything, we just pop in and out of people's offices. There are tools nowadays, there's slack, there's as much as I hate it, there's Microsoft teams, there are chat based features that you can stay in touch and you don't have to have a quote unquote office or hallway or pop in type conversation. Why do we do that? I think we do that because it's comfortable, it's familiar to the way it's always been done, but the tools are there and they're probably a little bit more effective on, uh, efficiency workflow, getting people like, you know, in and outta conversations as opposed to like, Hey, how are you? And that conversation taking an extra 10, 15, 20 minutes, there's value in those things, no doubt. But generation Z and millennials are looking for more flexible workspaces if they can get their job done while out, while also being on vacation somewhere so that they can work for a few hours, they can close their laptop and then they can go and have fun on vacation.
Nick Clason (17:03):
If we are so tight and stringent and say, no, you have to be here in the office, that's not gonna lend itself well to that flexible workspace and that first one, that time off that work life balance. The other trend, the other thing that I'm kind of noticing is that the older generations, uh, Xers and boomers, they're holding on longer, they're working later, they need the money to retire, they still need the income. And this one I think is big, is because while Gen Z is pursuing happiness, uh, corporate work environment may not be the cure or key to their happiness, but if it is, especially in church, they may say like, well, I'm looking for purpose and the church helps bring me that purpose. I want to be a part of a church. However, there are older generations that are still hanging on and that are still working.
Nick Clason (17:54):
So the question is, while we want to hire younger people, where is the space for them to come into your organization attached to it, take ownership of something and begin working toward any sort of authority in your organization because you have people already holding those most important positions. And that's gonna get tricky, especially if you got those people sitting there and and holding those most important positions. Where are they going to lay down and pave away for generation Z to come in and take opportunity? The last thing I think is that Gen Z is very concerned and rightly so about their mental health, about their mental state, about their mental wellbeing, making sure that those things are taken care of, that they're important. And so your organization, if you're bringing in millennials and Gen Z, consider finding a way to help prioritize their mental health, make counseling a part of a employment benefit for them, um, and for, you know, a thing that you offer to them.
Nick Clason (18:56):
So I have one last idea, let's check it out on the other side, right? So here's my conclusion. Gen Z, well, 25% would claim that they don't have faith. I think one of the things I've noticed in my experience is that generation Z, they still love and like Jesus a lot. In fact, in this Barna co lab, they sat down and talked with two guys who were Gen Z business owners. And what shocked me and was just an interesting thing that I noticed, uh, they didn't necessarily say this, they're a part of their church, but they're Christians running a Christian organization, not doing it through the local church. So my question to myself in that moment was, if Gen Zers, like these are passionate about faith, passionate about God, they love going to things like, you know, passion, these people, they were in the event business as well.
Nick Clason (19:51):
They love going to those things, but we're not seeing them in our churches, both on the workplace side or the attendance side. Do they like Jesus and just not like the way that we do our church? I think church has a propensity right now to feel very institutionalized. And I think that that, that if that rubbed you the wrong way, and especially if you're older and you're listening to it and you're like, my church isn't institutionalized, this is what we've been doing it for years. While that may be true, the way that we've been doing church for years is American, not necessarily New Testament. The New Testament church looked very different from the American church. So are you doing church like the Bible or are you doing church like America? And there's nothing wrong with doing church like America unless it's not effective in reaching the next generation.
Nick Clason (20:36):
And in that case, that's where it becomes an issue. And so I think both from older generations holding on from workplaces not being very friendly to Generation Z, millennials and those with that type of mindset and the fact that there's just not as much space for Generation Z to, to go into these spaces, they're creating them over here to look more New Testament, to look more authentic, to look more be real, to have more community, to have more places to lean in as opposed to coming to your institutionalized church. Because if they're not there in the seats from eight 30 to nine 30, then we consider them deconstructing. And that just may simply not be true. They might just be open to exploring new ways, new, new ideas, new places to engage with these things. That doesn't necessarily mean that they're out on Jesus. It just might mean that they're out on you. So what shifts might you need to take place? What stats have you heard that you're like now that's interesting and that might change some of the way we do things because before long, millennials and generations here are going to make up the majority of our workforce. They are Gen Z is not just teenagers in your youth group, they're graduating college now. They are looking for a church to attach to. Is your church friendly to them and what they need? Or is your church stuck dogmatically to the way that things have always been done?
Nick Clason (21:59):
Well thanks guys so much for hanging out in this episode. Thrilled to have you with us. Don't forget everything that you need is gonna be available to you in the show notes. Make sure that you like, make sure that you comment, make sure that you subscribe, rating, review, all those things. Glad to be with you. If you find this helpful, we would love to continue to create and produce content like this for you. So all that stuff helps keep us going as well as head to hybridministry.xyz Click on the contact form and if you have questions, submit them there to us. We would love to start taking some questions, answering some of your questions and giving back to y'all and letting you know what our perspective is on certain hybrid things, digital, social marketing, communications, generation Z, all the above. Let us know on those topic. But until next time, and as always, stay.
23 min
May 04, 2023 Episode 043: Why I finally broke down and tried a posting service and my take aways from it
In this episode Nick will breakdown what led to him FINALLY changing his accounts to business accounts, using a posting service, the results from that, and his ultimate take away.
Follow Along on YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9pjecCnd8FVFCenWharf2g
Full Transcript:
http://www.hybridministry.xyz/043
The Spreadsheet with the Metricool Results:
https://www.hybridministry.xyz/articles/metricool
Follow Along on TikTok:
http://www.tiktok.com/@clasonnick
FREE E-Book:
https://www.hybridministry.xyz/articles/ebook
SHOWNOTES
Metricool Posting Service:
http://www.metricool.com
TIMECODES
00:00-01:39 Intro
01:39-08:53 My journey to using a social media posting service
08:53-13:07 The Results from 18 posts used on a social media posting service
13:07-18:30 Breaking down the stats from Metricool
18:30-20:08 3 TakeAways from using a Posting Service
20:08-25:23 What does this mean for social media moving forward?
25:23-26:02 Outro
TRANSCRIPT
Nick Clason (00:00):
One. Well, hello there, everybody. Welcome back to another episode of the Hybrid Ministry Show. I, as always, am your host, Nick Clason, thrilled and excited to be with you wherever you are consuming this. Whether you are over on YouTube or whether you have found this via your podcast catcher, know that we do offer the other. So if you are on YouTube, you wanna check it out on podcasts, you can head to http://www.hybridministry.xyz If you're just listening to this. And today in particular, I am gonna drop some like visual aid representation stuff on screen as we're chatting through what we're chatting through. You can head over to YouTube today. We are going to talk about a scheduling service. Yes, I have been against this for years and years, and if you have been listening to this podcast, do you know that it has taken a minute for me to ever convert our TikTok account over from a personal to a business?
Nick Clason (00:56):
I've finally made that shift. I will tell you why, and make sure you stick around to the very end of the video for me to give you my final conclusion on whether or not you should be using a scheduling service for your social media. Before we dive in though, let me let you know that we have created a 100% completely free e-book and checklist, and for signing up for our email newsletter, you will get a copy of both of those immediately sent to your inbox. So go ahead, head to the link in the show notes for that. And without any further ado, let's dive in and let's start talking about scheduling services on social media. Here we go. All right, let's talk about scheduling services. Now, if you've listened to this podcast any length of time, you know that I have not really been much of a scheduling service person.
Nick Clason (01:51):
And so let me give you just a little brief history on all of that for me. So, uh, I started really getting into social media and social media scheduling and planning. Every church I've been in, I've had that to some level, some degree, but I've gotten mu I've really honed that in, I would say within the last three ish years. Um, and it dated back a couple churches. I'm trying to think like I really got into trying and experimenting with some stuff. Um, when I was at church in Cincinnati, I was there for a couple of years. Um, and then when I moved to Parkview, which is the church I was at before here, uh, in, in the South Chicago suburbs, I had nothing to do with social media. But then I offered to have something to do with it. Like I took on a portion of it.
Nick Clason (02:46):
And, uh, there is when I really started to hone in on more of what I'm focusing on now, TikTok and reels and stuff like that. And then that's when I met Matt, if you've been around since the beginning, you know, Matt was my co-host, the first, you know, 10 or so episodes. And so, uh, he worked at Parkview with me. Anyway, all that to be said, one of the things I discovered, cuz I had used both at my church in Cincinnati, and at the start of my time at Parkview, I used Hootsuite as a scheduler. And I think Hootsuite is fine as a scheduler, uh, for anything like Instagram feed posts or Facebook posts. Those are fine. The issue was, and I, and it may have changed, and so I may be eating my words a little bit on this. It may have changed since I most recently used it, but it could, when I started really, really taking over social media at my last church, I went to Matt, um, and I said, Hey, is there any way for me to schedule stories and, and reels or tos?
Nick Clason (03:44):
And he said, not really. And then I think within about a month of that conversation, a both of us started our exit strategies out of there, A and b, TikTok, A and Instagram all came out with, uh, schedulers. Okay? And so, uh, about a week or month ago, actually, about a month ago, I had a conversation with another youth pastor friend of mine from Indiana, and he's like, do you know that you can schedule your TikTok? And I was like, what? And so I did dive into it and yes, in fact you can, if you are a business account, you can, uh, schedule TikTok through the TikTok website. And so I was like, okay, interesting. So I started to play around with all these different things and I was like, this might be a game changer. Now let me explain to you what happened and what my journey was to end up where I ended up.
Nick Clason (04:37):
So, uh, you can natively schedule through all four of the core platforms. We're talking about Facebook, uh, which Facebook and Instagram are linked together through the Meta Business Suite, TikTok, and then YouTube. Of course you can schedule on YouTube. Um, but, but none of them, in my personal opinion, are, are optimal. And I'll give you some reasons why. Uh, when I was trying to schedule through the Facebook Business Suite, I personally, our account for whatever reason, wouldn't allow me to schedule Instagram reels. I could schedule Facebook reels, but I couldn't schedule Instagram reels. And so then that sent me on a search and I could do the other ones. I could do TikTok and I could do YouTube. However, I will say YouTube, it's just like you're uploading a regular video. And when I, when I upload on YouTube shorts on my app, it's a completely different interface.
Nick Clason (05:33):
And so, honestly, half the time I wasn't sure if I was doing it right because I'm like, is this where I put the caption? Is this where I put the title? And YouTube shorts are still a little weird and they're, I think they're still trying to figure out what they're doing over there. Um, they have put a lot more time and effort and energy into it. And so it's getting better for sure. Um, but YouTube has actually been my number one, uh, culprit, uh, downfall in all this. Anyway, I'll get to all that in a second. Uh, so I went, I searched through all these things, discovered and landed on a platform called Metro. Cool. I'll drop the link in the show notes. It might be helpful, it might be useful for you. Check it out. I can't make a blanket statement and say like, you should do this, you should do that.
Nick Clason (06:13):
I'm just gonna give you my experience and then what I would recommend if you were consulting or asking me. Um, but you might not be. And so you might be like, oh yeah, that totally works for me. Uh, but I landed on this thing called Metric Cool. I could link all four of those services, Facebook, Instagram, TikTok and YouTube shorts. I could link all four of those and I could post auto post to all of those. I could schedule it ahead of time and then it would post on its own when I, I said to post it. Okay? And so I was like, this is going to change my life. And so let me tell you the results, the stats and how it all went down, uh, on metric. I used it for two and a half weeks. I posted a total of 18 videos on that time.
Nick Clason (07:00):
And, uh, the reason I didn't use, you know, post every single piece of content that I was planning to post is cause I had some TikTok sitting in my TikTok drafts. I had some that had, I had, uh, like recaps that I hadn't even filmed yet that I couldn't like preschedule. And I was like, I'll just take care of these live. Also, metrical is free for up to, um, what was it I I calculated that was free for up to like 30, uh, days. Um, not like a trial, but like 30 days worth of posts. Um, but however, it's like if I posted Instagram reels and Facebook and TikTok a and YouTube, that counts as four. So it was like, it was more than 30, it was like 120 I think. Um, but if I post on four of those four 30 days, then I'm going to use them all up, right?
Nick Clason (07:49):
And so that was another reason I didn't schedule everything. Cause I was like, I can leave some gaps in here, uh, to save back some of their, their free, you know, posting stuff, whatever. Anyway, I digress. So I used it. Um, and the reason I used it right was because I couldn't figure out a way to do Instagram and, uh, real scheduling and all these things. The other thing is I liked it cuz it's all in one, right? If I was gonna do all the native schedulers, I'd have to have like three tabs open and do TikTok and then go over to YouTube and then go over to the meta business suite. Possible doable and definitely worth my time if that takes away from me having to schedule live, you know, live posting. And so, um, finding this was, I was really exciting moment for me.
Nick Clason (08:35):
And so I, like I said, I went all in. I was like, let me try this thing and see what happens. So I'm gonna give you the results here. Let's dive in and look at the actual nitty gritty stats. And this is where, if you're listening, you may wanna switch over to YouTube, um, and see some of these things cuz I'm just gonna, um, screenshot my spreadsheet and put it on the screen. So here we go. Okay. Like I said, I, uh, uploaded and used metrical for 18 different posts over the course of about two and a half to three weeks. Um, I posted on all four platforms, morning, evening, and night. And here were some of the results that I came up with. So, uh, let's just go, uh, one by one through each platform. So on TikTok, like I said, I posted 18, here were our watch results.
Nick Clason (09:22):
1 63, 1 44, 141, 1 77, 1 52 91, 2 21, 1 49, 1 50, 1 28, 1 35, 1 40, 1 40, 1 48, 1 40, 1 53. Those are low for us. Um, we typically, um, and we don't go super viral on TikTok. I'll just be honest. I honestly, I think we started at a time where TikTok is kind of choking down the watches. And um, you know, like I mentioned Matt, he even said something to me interesting. He's like, I think TikTok might know you're church and if they know you're a church, he's like, I don't know that they're gonna give you a ton of organic reach, which was an interesting thing. Um, so he was saying that even back when I was at Parkview that it might not be, you know, that might be some of the case. So anyway, um, we, you know, we typically live in the two 300 s and then we'll pop, you know, for some over a thousand or whatever here and there. Uh, so the average TikTok wa uh, watch analytics of my metrical posts were an average of 122.
Nick Clason (10:24):
The highest I got was 2 21 and I had two tied for the lowest at 41. So not great. Okay? Um, Instagram reels, this is what we did on Instagram reels 2 51 8 5 19 3 18, 1 38, 1 46, uh, 2 53, 2 1 45. There was one that didn't post cuz there was an error that happened actually a couple different times. I had to go in and manually redo it. That's another story for another day. 2 2 3 2 0 2 180 6, 1 34, 3 94 for an average, uh, view of 1 68. And so our highest was that one of five 19, which was the third one that we posted. And then we had three that were tied with only two views. So again, not great, we did have some perform better. And I will say this, um, between TikTok and Instagram reels, we go, we have much higher views on Instagram reels than we do on TikTok, but I think we have less engagement on Instagram than we do on TikTok.
Nick Clason (11:27):
And so it's, it's, you know, watch isn't isn't equal to engagement and engagement is a loose term, I get it. But that's comments, that's shares, that's likes those types of things. Uh, Facebook reels. Interestingly, and this was really helpful for me, and I'll share some of this in a minute with some of my takeaways, but Facebook was actually quite a beneficial, uh, it was quite beneficial for me to go back and look on Facebook. Honestly, I had it and just let it do its thing. Um, and I never really go back to Facebook to engage much, but we had some decent traction on Facebook, surprisingly, and as a youth pastor, not necessarily my goal, right? Uh, we're probably catering to and reaching parents over there. Um, which might be a good thing, might be a bad thing. I don't know. Like, I don't have like a stance on whether or not, you know, I'm happy with that or whatever.
Nick Clason (12:15):
But we did quite well on Facebook. So here's what we had on Facebook. 1 92, 62 18, 3 38, 98 4 19, 2 24, 2 57, 2 62, 1 98 42, 2 0 6, 1 93, 3 78 39, 180 9, 2 0 3. Average view of two 18 with our highest being four 19, our lowest being 39. And then finally on shorts, this is where it got bad. 4 0 7 7 4 15, 2 3 17, 6, 6, 8, 6, 3, 2, 2, 1 for an average view of 5.4 highest 17 lowest zero. So let's extrapolate and look at some of the takeaways from all of this. What does this mean? All right, so what does all of this mean? Should you schedule? Should you not, should you use metric? Cool. Here's, here are my personal takeaways. So you need to know this. I'm not using it anymore. Like what it did to us on YouTube was, was horrific. Um, and I'm not blaming metrical necessarily, right? But I I, after a couple of days I started screenshotting some of these things to my, um, free under the table consultant, Matt, Matt Johnson, former co-host of the podcast.
Nick Clason (13:36):
May he rest in peace. Uh, but anyway, I was like, bro, what's going on here? And he's like, yeah. He's like, I was worried about that for you. Cuz they, those platforms, they, they don't typically like you using third party services. So these third party services, they may be able to tap into the api, uh, and, and like allow you this, this may be a thing that they're able to actually allow happen. But basically what he was saying is he's like, I don't know that that is your optimal strategy moving forward. Kind of a bummer because it's easy for you or me as a social media manager, but it's more difficult. Um, you know, and your views might go down. And so you have to weigh out like what's more valuable. And honestly, there is a moment where it being easier for you, especially if you're going to post at the volume that I have recommended you do.
Nick Clason (14:26):
Uh, that's a lot. And so sometimes you're like, I don't wanna have to always be thinking and remembering to like get on there and live post everything. I don't wanna have to input every single thing into to Google Calendar. You know, like I used to put every single thing into Google Calendar to remind myself to post, honestly. Now I just kind of know like, oh, I gotta post three. And so I, I go to just like a picture I took of like a calendar that I wrote it all out on and I just go off of that. I don't even have anything alerting me cuz it's so woven into my rhythm and habit of just posting. So anyway, here are some of my observations. First observation is this. Not one single video across all four of the platforms was like highest. Like, it's not like this video performed well and it performed well across all four.
Nick Clason (15:15):
Like when I say the highest performing one, like the highest performing one overall, um, I think was the, the Instagram reels one. And that was one about Fruity Pebbles, right? Meanwhile on TikTok it was, it only got a hundred views on Facebook reel, it got 218 and on YouTube shorts I had four. Then my lowest overall video was the one that got zero plays on on YouTube shorts, but it got 260 on Facebook, eight on Instagram reels and 144 on TikTok. So it, it's a lottery ticket we've talked about, right? Like you punch it in all four places because it might perform well over here and not well over there. And so similarly, the highest on Instagram, I could read you those same like stats across the line. And, and the same thing, like it's not the best performing video overall, it's just simply the best performing video on that platform.
Nick Clason (16:10):
The other observation I had was that, uh, of my overall, um, analytics, Facebook had the best watches and YouTube had the worst watches, okay? In the midst of this, like I said, right, I used it for 18 posts. In the midst of this, I did have a video that had 300 or 3000, um, 556 views on TikTok. And that was posted in the middle of this run of me using Metrical for two and a half weeks. It wasn't one of the metrical videos, it was one that I posted live. Cuz it was one of those that is like, um, it splits the room in two and you got a bunch of people and you decide like, do you know this song? Do you not know this song? If you know it, go to this side of the room and sing it. If you don't walk over here in shame and then it'll change to another song.
Nick Clason (16:54):
And if you know that one, you can move over to the room, but if you did know this one before, you have to move back over here. It was one of those and it went well for us, and we're gonna do more of those and, and shoot more of those and post more of those because it worked for us. And who knows, it may be a thing that we can lean into more. Uh, or it was just a one-off. You never know how those, how those work, right? So we're just gonna try some stuff. Um, my Facebook views remained consistent. It, I saw no appreciable difference between before Metric Cool after metric, cool during metric, cool. Whether I posted it via Metric cool, or whether I posted it manually. My Facebook views pretty much remained the same. Um, this was the most disheartening one before I started using Metrical.
Nick Clason (17:37):
Like right before I had videos within a week or 10 days of posting on YouTube shorts that got 2,400 views, 1,400 views and 634 views. There were some other smaller ones in there, right? But I had some pretty hefty and big views on YouTube shorts since posting on metrical, like pulling the plug and being like, I'm not using this anymore. The highest I've gotten on YouTube shorts is 49. I've had the majority of my views in single digits and I've had several with just no views at all. And so that's disheartening. And I have to, I have to start back over basically on YouTube shorts and I may have dinged myself permanently, um, or at least for a really long time by using Metric. All right, so three takeaways. What does this mean? So three takeaways. As of right now, I'm back to posting everything manually.
Nick Clason (18:37):
I'm not using the service scheduling service anymore. Perhaps, uh, that's takeaway number one. Takeaway number two, perhaps the native schedulers would, would be more advantageous. You know, I'm assuming if TikTok has a scheduler built into their website that they're gonna, um, promote and prioritize that more than they would like just a third party service like Metrical. Um, but like I said, right now I need to focus on growing our YouTube engagement back. And so therefore it's for me, I'm an all or nothing kind of person, so I could, yes, I know you're think you're listening, watching, like why don't you just schedule on on Instagram, Facebook and TikTok, again, remember Instagram, I couldn't figure out a way to schedule. So for that one it would be like, I can schedule for Facebook and TikTok, but then I need a live post for Instagram and YouTube.
Nick Clason (19:29):
It just, it, I I I would rather do it all at the same time, um, to just know, like I post all four, boom, boom, boom, boom, and I'm done. And when I say all four, I only need to post in three places. I need to do TikTok, I need to do Instagram and make sure Facebook is toggled on, and then that's taken care of. And then I need to go do YouTube. So when I say four, it's three. It's still a lot, but it's not, you know, as many as that sounds. Uh, the other thing, the other, the third takeaway for me is it's definitely tedious work, but a non bot scheduling still has proven to be the best for engagement for me, for us, and for our ministry. So, big picture, um, I have been for years, um, and on this podcast, if you go back and listen, I have been promoting two to three posts per day, five to seven days a week.
Nick Clason (20:21):
And that's a hefty content load. Uh, one, a couple things like, you know, just let you know, I, so for example, I have like a lot of games over on D y m. Um, I'll link some of those in the show notes if that's something you're interested in going, checking out. But like some of my favorites are like a gif flashback game. You watch a gif for five to seven seconds and then you're asked a question about it to immediately recall it. Another one, my all-time favorite is called emoji phraseology and it's like emoji phrases. And so I have these emojis come in animated. And so one of the things we've been doing is I've just been taking those games and we've been playing them. Um, they're 10 questions each, but I use them as one singular piece of content. And so I, I film someone playing the game or someone trying to guess the emoji phrase, but then that also like all the animations or all the like icons or whatever, all on the screen, all at that same time, so the viewer can also watch it.
Nick Clason (21:18):
And so those have really proven helpful. Those and other like I've, I've gone on D Y M and gotten other games and just had like, film students playing those games. Like those each usually come with 10 questions and I can edit those down to be like one TikTok with 10 questions each. But I've decided to extrapolate those out. We've done that with other things. Like we've used like an ABC cheese game where you bite cheese, you know, and then make a letter and the other person has to guess. And instead of, I originally shot that with the intent of it being like a one, a one hitter, but it took so long and I was like, there's a lot of like funny laugh moments and like silly things happening in between that. Like I didn't want to cut those all out and I could use, I could go from one to 10 and that can really help flesh out my calendar.
Nick Clason (22:05):
So I've done that. Um, and that's proven pretty helpful for me in helping fill out that calendar. But all that being said, I'm personally debating on scaling back a little bit after. Um, currently I'm in the month of April. This may drop in May, but I'm currently in the month of April planning out my TOS and Instagram reels and stuff like that. And I'm doing three a day and I'm personally thinking maybe I can scale this back a little bit. Um, and scaling it back will help me on the edit side not have to be so frantic and quick with everything. Um, and then I might be able to focus more on quality content instead of necessarily quantity. Um, I've been doing two to three for about six to eight months now at this point. And so our platforms are sort of leveled out, stabled out.
Nick Clason (22:49):
We've grown, we've reached the people we need to reach. Now that we're there, maybe we can focus more on bringing like some quality content. And again, I'm the editor and in a lot of cases I'm on this side of the camera too. Like I am the person doing the talking as well. And so, um, you know, I I focus a lot of timer energy on one side or the other. And so that might mean if I'm focusing more energy on the editing side, I'm not focusing as much effort on the content delivery side. And that also needs to be really good too. The editing needs to be good, the content needs to be good. And so you can't have all, you know, you can't have all those things if uh, all those things need to be good. You can't have so many and a great edit and great content.
Nick Clason (23:29):
Sometimes you just gotta throw out not so great stuff. So I'm wondering about scaling it back a little bit and I'll let you know right on here. Like, you guys will be the first to know. I will be honest with you all the way through. I'll take you with me on the journey. Like I want, if you guys have questions, like I want this to be a place where like I just workshop what I'm doing and you're hearing what I'm doing. Um, however, lemme say this, going back into the analytics, um, on all my platforms was actually encouraging and helpful to me because I thought that this third party service metric flopped and tanked me and on YouTube it for sure did. But I, like, I hadn't looked at a single one of those Facebook stats until last night when I was preparing for this episode.
Nick Clason (24:12):
And so it was helpful for me. And let me just say this as a guiding principle, not for social media only though it definitely count, but also for other areas. Go back and look at the stats. I mean that's honestly, that's one of the things about journaling, right? Is like if you journal, you can go back and you can see this is what I prayed about a year ago and here's where I am now. And it's a completely different moment than you were even a year ago, you know, but where you are right now feels overwhelming and crazy and whatever the case might be. And so go back and look and remind yourself. That's why the Israelites often built monuments. They could go back, they could look and they could be reminded of where they were and then they could see how God had been faithful to them, to his people and how they could continue to take steps forward closer to him.
Nick Clason (25:02):
So that's just what I wanna say is help, what was helpful for me, I need to do that more. I'm always looking ahead, rarely looking back. So I just wanna encourage you, if that's something that's helpful, try and find a way to bake that into your regular rhythm as a social media manager, as a youth pastor, as a pastor, whatever your role is as you navigate this. But I just wanna remind you that what you're doing matters. You are trying to reach the people of God, um, and the people who are maybe even far from God through the means and methods that God and, and the world has allowed us. We can use these things to help spread the good news of the gospel. So blessings on you, blessings on your ministry as you continue on this. And as always, don't forget, stay hybrid.
27 min
April 27, 2023 Episode 042: Can Discipleship Happen Exclusively Online?
In this episode Nick dives deep into areas in his life where he has learned a skill or discipline completely through an online format. And because of that discovery, he then asks if Discipleship can happen completely online? Is it possible for a human being to learn, know, discover and follow Jesus? Or does a one-on-one mentoring type relationship need to be there in existence? And if people can learn to follow Jesus online, what areas should the church lean into in 2023 to help make that more of a priority?
Subscribe on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9pjecCnd8FVFCenWharf2g
Follow Nick on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@clasonnick
Full Episode ShowNotes & Transcripts: https://www.hybridministry.xyz/042
FREE e-book: https://www.hybridministry.xyz/articles/ebook
SHOWNOTES
In this episode, Nick talked about multiple brands, podcasts and areas in which he's learned things online, for a complete list see below:
YOUTUBE TRENDS EPISODE:
https://www.hybridministry.xyz/032
https://www.youtube.com/trends/report/
https://prochurchtools.com/
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/fantasy-focus-football/id260537420
https://podcast.downloadyouthministry.com/
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/down-to-dunk-okc-thunder-podcast/id599740073
https://www.strandedpanda.com/mcucast
https://theologyintheraw.com/
https://www.sonlife.com/
https://www.ramseysolutions.com/
BIBLE VERSES MENTIONED:
Hebrews 10:24-25 ESV
And let us consider how to stir up one another to love and good works, not neglecting to meet together, as is the habit of some, but encouraging one another, and all the more as you see the Day drawing near.
Colossians 3:16 ESV
Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God.
1 Corinthians 14:26 ESV
What then, brothers? When you come together, each one has a hymn, a lesson, a revelation, a tongue, or an interpretation. Let all things be done for building up.
Matthew 12:30 ESV
Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters.
1 Thessalonians 5:11 ESV
Therefore encourage one another and build one another up, just as you are doing.
TIMECODES
00:00-02:53 Intro
02:53-11:20 Areas in my life I've exclusively learned something online
11:20-15:10 What is a SuperFan?
15:10-20:40 Should we create SuperFans in Faith?
20:40-28:13 What does the Bible say about relationships?
28:13-31:45 3 raw and unfiltered ideas for Churches to lean into Hybrid in 2023
31:45-32:59 Outro
TRANSCRIPT
Nick Clason (00:01):
Well, hello there everybody. Welcome back to another episode and edition of the Hybrid Ministry Show. I, as always am your host, Nick Clason. Excited to be along with you on the journey. A few are on YouTube. Hello to everyone there on YouTube. If you just got this blared in your ear holes, hello to everyone there. And hey, if you're on YouTube, you didn't know we were a podcast. We are. If you are on, uh, listening in your ear holes, you didn't know we're on YouTube, we are. So check both of the show notes or check the only show notes for both of those links. http://www.Hybridministry.xyz is all the needs and all the stops and all the places and all the things that you need for this podcast. If you're on YouTube, hit the link show notes and I'll take you there, including transcripts, which we offer for free every single episode.
Nick Clason (00:54):
In this episode, we are going to be discussing and talking about areas in life in which I have learned, discovered a skill, become proficient 100% completely through online mediums. It may be a little bit controversial, but I just want to explore some other avenues and facets and areas of life beyond just a church in which I have lived into this hybrid experience in this hybrid moment. So make sure that you stick around for that and all the way for to the end, because at the end that's where I'm going to talk about three different church ideas and musings and thoughts that I have in ways that we can lean into this and engage in this just a little bit more, um, realistically and also maybe a little bit more robustly as a church start thinking hybrid a little bit more frequently. But before we do, like I said, uh, subscribe on YouTube, hit that uh, bell button so that you know when we post a video, be sure that you subscribe in your podcast catcher so that every single Thursday one of these episodes will just automatically download for you for free.
Nick Clason (02:03):
And finally, one thing that you can do for us that's free, but is an incredible, incredible way to give back is to just simply give us a quick rating or review. Open your purple podcast app on your iPhone and let us know, hey, love this show that will help us get the word out more and more about this idea of hybrid ministry. Not because we're trying to go big and go viral, but because we want to help share and spread the hope and message of Jesus through the means and channels in which God has given to us. So that would be an incredible way for you to just help us give back. And without any further chatting, without any further discussion, let's dive in to some different areas in which I and people I know have been discipled completely online. All right, so let's talk about this idea of learning something 100 and completely online.
Nick Clason (03:02):
So real quick, the definition of a disciple, just a real quick Google search elicits me this response. A follower, someone who is adherent, a disciple, a partisan mean one means one who gives full loyalty and support to another follower may apply to people who attach to a certain person mission or method. So obviously that's gonna have some religious undertones and some religious connotations. But I was listening to a podcast the other day, shout out to my one of my favorite people, Brady Sheer, Alexander Mills, those guys over at Pro Churchill's podcast. Amazing. We'll drop the link in the show notes. By the way, there are gonna be a lot of links to just things that I like in my life in this episode because I'm what I'm talking about, I'm talking about my life, I'm talking about areas and things that I'm into that I've learned from.
Nick Clason (03:48):
And so hit the link in the show notes. If anything I say sounds interesting to you, I'll try to include it there in the show notes. But I was talk, I was listening, I wasn't talking to them. I was listening to them talk to each other about areas in life in which they have been completely discipled in a certain area, skill, facet or discipline. And it got me to thinking just that was how the title and the whole scope of this episode started. I was like, Hmm, what are areas that I've learned something completely 100% online. So I'm gonna show you two from me. And I also asked my wife last night, and I'm gonna share two from her. So for me, one area that I have exclusively learned online is the art and the area of fantasy football. Now, hear me out. Okay, if you're not into fantasy football, fantasy football is a very intricate sport.
Nick Clason (04:37):
It is literally drafting real life players. Typically for me, I'm, I'm big into, um, football, not like any other sport, baseball or basketball. So real life football players. But knowing how that plays out in the fantasy realm. So you have to learn things like, like drafting strategies. You have to learn things like ADPs or average draft position. You have to know who is going to be a high scorer or one that's well sought after. You need to know people who are maybe a little more under the radar, a little more, uh, names and nuances, uh, sleepers if you will. I know like I have learned a lot from fantasy football, for example, I'll talk to my dad now, um, who was the biggest football fan I knew growing up. But now I'll talk to him and I'll mention someone like Nick Westbrook at Kenai from the Tennessee Titans.
Nick Clason (05:27):
And he's like, who? Right now I know that name. Strictly and exclusively through fantasy football means and channels. He is just a casual football fan now at this point. And he, I mean, he plays fantasy football cuz I make him in one league that we're in together. But he doesn't know some of the deeper, more nuanced discussions and people. And I thought about it and the reason I got into fantasy football is, number one, I got asked to be a part of a fantasy football league with some friends who were, uh, know, like real life friends in person at the church or at college or something like that. But then in the years to come, I was a really terrible at fantasy football because I was like my dad. I grew up watching football with my dad. And so I drafted like my dad does, like, oh, that guy's good.
Nick Clason (06:14):
But then I started listening to podcasts. That was one of my major like avenues of learning. I found podcast, ESPN Fantasy Focused Football podcast, which had Matthew Berry on it for years, all the way up until last year. However, interestingly enough, he rotated off and I think went to NBC Sports and I still choose to follow the ESPN version, but I started listening to them and I got a lot better, a lot more skilled, and I've won some leagues now as a result of it. And I want to be clear, I'm not like bragging or saying I'm some amazing fantasy football player because I'm not, because it's all luck based, but I truly, ultimately really do enjoy it. And, uh, I feel a relationship with the people in the podcast on the other end that I listened to in my ear holes. I listened to 'em on runs.
Nick Clason (07:00):
I remember, uh, last year after the very first weekend of football, uh, the first thing I wanted to do was listen to their analysis of the first week. I wanted them to help me make sense of what just happened. And so that was something that I was like longing for, striving for. So that's one example. Another example for me is honestly the area of youth ministry. I remember how it started. I was in my office. I decided to clean it out and it was going to be a massive major overhaul change. And I was like, you know what? If I'm gonna do this, I should probably like do it while also listening to something. And that was actually how I started listening to podcasts. I discovered and stumbled upon the Download Youth Ministry podcast with heroes of mine in youth ministry, Doug Fields, Joshua Griffin. They've written books and they are the co-founders of Download Youth Ministry and many other kind of subsidiary ministries and stuff after that.
Nick Clason (07:53):
But honestly, I had never even really met the guys. And up to this point, I've only met them a handful of times at this point through just different conferences and events that I've gone to. But what happened was I started listening to there at that time they called it the D YM web show, short for download. Youth ministry helped me get better, uh, at youth ministry. But at the, I think the real thing that it helped do and and they even talk about it on the shows, it helped me as a solo youth pastor in a church of under 400 people. I, I, you know, I didn't have a team. I didn't work for a team. Like I had a pastor, like a senior pastor that was my boss and that was it. I didn't have like a youth team, anything like that. And so they were sort of like my youth team place to, to listen to ideas, to chop it up, to hear things.
Nick Clason (08:40):
They helped me think through some different nuances. They would talk about events that they would do, and then I would figure out how I could bring those and adapt them. And I truly attribute a lot of my just skill and development as a youth pastor professionally to them, to their podcast. Now, in both of my cases, fantasy Football and the Download Youth Ministry podcast, those happened through, uh, podcasts obviously, right? And uh, that's just, that is a means. That is a avenue. Okay? Um, similarly, I asked this question last night as I was preparing for this show to my wife. I was like, what are some areas in life that you have learned or become proficient at completely online? She gave two answers. Her answers were a couple years ago. She used to be a seller on Etsy. She would make decorative wooden signs and she would sell them.
Nick Clason (09:31):
And she did quite well at it. Actually. She quit her nursing job in an effort to be able to do that. But I remember she learned and discovered the idea and, um, practice best practices of things like search engine optimization on Etsy, how to create good and um, proper listings that are gonna help you get indexed well in search as well as thumbnails and how to do that and all those types of things. And she learned almost all of that through a Facebook group that she discovered that had, uh, just like an Etsy seller Facebook group of people kind of go back and forth, give tips, tricks of the trade. And then another area, um, in the last probably two years or so, she's gotten really into just nutrition, the power of food and how important food is. Food is fuel to your body. Um, and not like dieting per se to just like lose weight, but really like to pursue health, um, in how to do like swaps from the standard American diet, what to avoid, what things to know and look for.
Nick Clason (10:31):
And for her, she said the area, um, that she really found, uh, interesting, um, in to, to learn all of that was mostly through Instagram and following Instagram accounts. And so in those, for examples, so fantasy football, youth ministry, Etsy sellers, and then like the area of nutrition to me, to my wife, almost 100% of our knowledge, 100% of our, uh, development in those areas happened through online mediums and online channels. Now, don't turn it off, don't freak out. Let's expound upon this just a little bit more and let's bring in some of the church implications and some of the theological conclusions that we, uh, should wrestle with and come to. Now, I will also say, before we dive into some of the theological stuff, I will also say that this sort of idea, especially if you remember me talking about, um, in the last little segment about me wanting to hear the analysis from week one, that is a current YouTube trend.
Nick Clason (11:38):
I'll drop the link to the episode where I expanded upon the YouTube trends report from 2022 in the show notes. But that is a thing that people are, uh, eager for. So uhno, another area, probably the biggest that I am nerding out on in being a super fan is I am a Oklahoma City Thunder basketball fan. And I wanna listen to what the guys on down to Dunk have to say about just about every game, everything that happens, trades off season moves, like it'll happen and that'll be one thing. But then what I most look forward to is, again, the analysis that these guys have as experts in the field as people who talk about it a lot. Similarly, I'll also do that like over the weekend on Saturday, my wife and I went and saw Antman in the WASP quantum mania, and I immediately went and downloaded the Marvel Cinematic Universe podcast, Antman in the WASP Quantum Mania recap episode because I wanna hear all they have to say, I watched the movie, I like the movie, but they're gonna think deeper about it.
Nick Clason (12:41):
They're gonna have theories about it. And so that is like this idea of a super fan as someone who attaches to pop culture, but with people who have more analysis to it and in all of these things, right? Like there's something there that can be done in the church space. Now, I wanna get to that in a minute, but before we do, I want to chat through and just think through like in all these things. I learned a lot through podcasts. I learned a lot through y or podcasts and or long form YouTube accounts. My wife learned a lot through like Facebook groups or following Instagram accounts. Um, and neither one of us really honestly said anything about TikTok or short form video content. However, uh, both of the things that the question, right? Was what are areas in which you feel that you've become an expert in through something completely online.
Nick Clason (13:33):
And I don't, I think my reason for why that would be the case is that, um, most of the areas you become an expert in, it takes time and TikTok and Instagram reels, they just haven't been here for that long of time. But one thing that is interesting to note is that I think that what is, uh, what you discover online in Instagram reel, Instagram reels or TikTok short form video, sort of like formats is you discover new people and new pieces of content, it's harder in those mediums to create super fans. So I think those are there for discoverability. And then I think your goal is to get them to follow for more, to save for later or to get them to watch something longer or listen to something longer that you already produce. So you wanna like just get discovered, find something niche, and then have them, uh, come follow you somewhere else on.
Nick Clason (14:30):
Um, honestly, and unfortunately, so those platforms are massive and huge right now. However, I think that they are, they help create a, a pathway and a funnel step for those people to, to dive deeper. There are TikTok ERs, Instagram real people that I love to follow, um, when I see them pop up on my for you page, but not my, that's not how I engage with them. That's not how I engage with people. I get on there and I just start going on my for you page. And whatever the algorithm feeds me is what it feeds me. I'm not on there specifically looking or searching for a person or specific, uh, niche piece of content at that moment. I was thinking about this last night, but I don't have a personal relationship with any of the people that I have mentioned or that I have learned from in these areas.
Nick Clason (15:21):
I would love to, but it's honestly almost never realistic for a lot of different reasons. Maybe one, like the distance of where they live in physical proximity to where I live, or just simply the size and scope of their platform that, um, they, this is how they get their messaging out to the masses and the multitudes because they are so big and they are, they do have such a large scope. And so, uh, when I do find another fan, a person who also listens to this podcast, a person who also is following some certain Instagram account, in my wife's case, we have an immediate connection around our fandom or following of this particular thing. And so I wanted to think through why does scripture discipleship disciple making the Bible? Why doesn't it feel that that same way, like if I find someone who's another down to dunk fan, we're immediately vibing on that.
Nick Clason (16:23):
But when I find someone who's another Christian, do I immediately vibe with them? And I've never really thought about it, right? Because one is like pop culture and one is like faith. And those are two categorically different things. I get it. However, there are some similarities to it, like in this, like we are following like the same people over here in faith, we're following the same people, right? We're following Jesus of Nazareth, the guy who was discipled, uh, discipled people and then murdered for who he claimed to be, but then rose again three days later. And so I wonder like, is is faith, is Christianity not niche enough? Like is it too mainstream? Is it too much in the public eye? Uh, or is there too much diversity of opinion? Or is is it like you find someone but you don't like, I mean, I'll, I'll give you an example.
Nick Clason (17:20):
I'm kind of just workshopping this in my brain, but like I will find people who say they're Christians and I'm just immediately kinda like, I, I take a step back as opposed to a step in. And maybe it's because there's some spiritual element going on. Satan doesn't want me to connect or whatever. Or maybe I, I like personally I'm leery because I just don't know where they're coming from. And so instead of like assuming things or whatever, I just kind of like nod and smile and keep going. Maybe that's just what's baked into our culture, right? You don't talk about finances, you don't talk about religion and you don't talk about politics. And maybe because religion finds itself in that category of taboo and things you don't talk about, maybe that's why I don't talk about it. Maybe it's because I'm already a pastor and I'm deeper in it than most people who are just, uh, churchgoers.
Nick Clason (18:12):
I don't know what the reason is, but as I'm like just thinking these things out and teasing these things out, there should be a connection. I mean, that's literally one of the things that we talk about as followers of crisis, that we have this connection that despite any of our other differences, that unifies us and brings us together because we identify with the work and person of Jesus. And so therefore that should be what drives us, and that should also be an area that can connect us one another. So, um, an example of that actually of areas that I may connect with people around faith are, or maybe other people who listen to other things or connected to other organizations that I too am connected with. I think about like theology in the Raw Podcast done by Preston Sprinkle. And I think about people who listen to that.
Nick Clason (19:03):
If I found out a Christian listen to that, I would immediately have a different type of connection than just a casual, I'm a Christian, um, or someone who's connected to a ministry organization that I have grown up being connected to called Sun Life. If I knew that, I'd be like, oh, you're a Sun Life person. That makes sense. In fact, that's one of the major reasons in which I took the job I took here in Texas. I found out that a lot of the leadership had been, uh, trained in the Sun Life way of doing things, which sounds like a cult, but really it's just they're trying to model after the, the work of Jesus and what he did in his life, not just his death on the cross, but his life that he modeled and, you know, inviting people to, to come and see he'd follow me, that he'd make them fishes of men and then challenging them to go on and and bear much fruit.
Nick Clason (19:49):
So there are opportunities for that, but I just think like for some reason there's not that connection. And I want to figure out how we can do that and what that might look like. And it, I don't know that that's necessarily only conforming to the ways of this world. However, I do think there are some things that we can learn from the, the ways of the world, the pop culture, the super fan ideas that can help us in creating some of those moments, um, in, in faith, in cul in, in faith, and in our, um, followership of Jesus. So let's, let's dive a little bit deeper. Um, and let's, let's talk a little bit more about the actual discipline of learning some of these skills, um, and how that can be translated from not just like niche pop culture things, but how can we actually do that as faith communities.
Nick Clason (20:40):
So one of my learnings, and this might terrify you, so don't call me a heretic and turn this off when I say this, but you can learn a skill without a relationship with the other person. Now, I think a lot of times we learn from other people, but I think that you can learn a skill devoid of relationships with other people. I just evidenced four examples for real life examples. And there are more. I mean, I talked about like theology in the raw, sun life, thunder, basketball, marvel cinematic universe. I mean, another one that's just coming to my brain right now is finances through Dave Ramsey. I've met the man one time when I went, went down and did my debt-free scream. But after and beyond that, I've learned all I've learned about him through digital means and digital mediums. I also think, and sometimes churches find themselves falling prey to this, that you can exclusively meet in person with no digital or hybridization options on Sunday mornings and on Wednesday nights.
Nick Clason (21:44):
And you can say we don't do any of those other things because that's not how you learn. That's not how you become a disciple. And so you meet on Sundays and you meet on Wednesdays, but you never actually experience any life transformation because you haven't really done anything other than quote unquote meeting together in person you've met in person. But that is all that there is in their relationship. There's nothing more beyond that. There's no actual relationship that happens Monday through Friday. It only happens on Sunday morning in the allocated space. And I think that that is really my biggest argument for hybrid just because you meet in person once a week and you're like, we're all about this. Where else are you leaning into these things? Because if you're not creating more moments for people to connect to those relationships, cuz mind you, I have said you can learn disciplines and things in other areas without a relationship.
Nick Clason (22:49):
However, the church does often start with a relationship. So I'm not saying to take that and throw that baby out with the bathwater, but what I am saying is that you can have those relationships and offer more growth, offer more opportunities for people to attach to this faith community here in the other days throughout the week. Let's talk about some of the biblical basis for relationships. I'm gonna read for you several verses here, and then at the end I'm gonna, uh, give you a couple of observations. So probably the, the most famous meeting together verse comes from the book of Hebrews chapter 10 verses 24 and 25. All of these come out of the ESV that says, and let us consider how to stir one another up to love and good works, not neglecting to meet together as as the habit of some, but encouraging one another and all the more as you see the day of the Lord drawing near Colossians chapter three 16 says, let the word of Christ dwell richly in you teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing Psalms and hymns and spiritual songs with thankfulness in your heart to God.
Nick Clason (24:03):
First Corinthians 1426 says, what then, brothers, when you come together, each one has a hymn, a lesson, a revelation, a tongue or an interpretation. Let all things be done for building up. Matthew chapter 12, verse 30 says, whoever is not with me is against me. And whoever does not gather with me scatters First Thessalonians five 11 says, therefore encourage one another and build one another up. Just as you are doing, let's look also to the life of Christ, his life with his disciples. His invitation, like I said, was, uh, to invite them to just come and see, to explore. Then ultimately he gave them a challenge, Hey, come follow me, drop your nets and come follow me. And then he gives him a further command. And this is where the sacrifice and servanthood often comes in of following Jesus is not just to follow me, but he's going to change you, transform you and make them into fishers of men.
Nick Clason (24:56):
And then finally in John chapter 15, we see the verse about the vine and the branches and abiding. And he says, you, I want you now to be called friends and I want you to bear much fruit. So I want you to do what I just did. If you walk with Christ and first John, it says, if you walk with, uh, if you want to follow Christ, you must walk as he walked and live as he lived. So what are the ways in which he lived? He invited people to come and see, uh, earth first. He, yeah, yeah, he invited 'em to come and see, then he invited them to follow him. Then he was gonna change them, transform them, make them into fishes of men until finally then he would, uh, send them out to bear much fruit and repeat and replicate that process of multiplication.
Nick Clason (25:42):
So in all those verses and in the method of Jesus, all of those things are done in person and can be done in person. Yes. And also they can be done in hybrid spaces as well. And I don't just mean like zoom small groups and online church streaming. What I mean is I have a lot of relationships with people across the country in Facebook groups. I have relationships with people that on regular, ongoing basis, I have a once a week phone call with a friend of mine from college where we do accountability and talk through each other's lives. I have a once a month coaching call with people that I do do on Zoom, uh, or that I do do just through a regular old phone call. Like there are other channels and places to enhance relationships that aren't just Sunday morning at 10 30.
Nick Clason (26:34):
You see what I'm saying? Like that's what I'm trying to say. Like it doesn't have to only fit into that mold and that hurts our brain. And that freaks some of us out, especially some of us who adhere to a more traditional stance on gathering together in church. But what I'm saying is not that we should forsake that, but what I am saying is that you can't, someone who's truly interested in something, some sort of discipline can be challenged to learn more through some other additional methods and means. And if you're really into it, like I was about thunder basketball or my wife was about nutrition, they will eat those things up. However, what we've done is we've reduced commitment down to one single metric in the church. And that's church attendance. And here's the thing, that's not an indication of a disciple, but because we've reduced it down to church attendance, what we do is we've actually dumbed down the commitment to the point where we say, Hey, let's get the most amount of attendance here.
Nick Clason (27:32):
And so let's reduce the level of commitment to as low the lowest common denominator as possible. Get the most amount of people here. Oh look, now we have the most amount of butts in seats. Look at our church growth. And the reality is, is that you can offer more, but you're afraid to because the metrics may not make it seem worth it. And you though you can be offering something actually useful and actually beneficial to people to help them grow in their faith, to make spiritual decisions, to foster spiritual life transformation. We don't, we hold back because it doesn't offer the same return that Sunday morning at 10 30 offers. And that's a tough pill to swallow.
Nick Clason (28:14):
So let's round this thing out. Like I said at the top, here are three in live time unchallenged things that could be done, but I don't have exact frameworks for that. You could maybe begin to start thinking through in churches. The first is podcasts more than just your Sunday sermon from your lead pastor, but podcasts in certain areas, certain disciplines, certain classes, maybe like through the Old Testament, new Testament letters of Paul. I mean, think, think, go to like maybe a seminary catalog. What are things that they're offering students in seminary? And what are things that you have the bandwidth or maybe should make the bandwidth to create, to help encourage and equip your people to become more well versed in their knowledge of scripture? See, our our normal response to that is, oh, let's host a class. And, uh, there's nothing wrong with hosting a class, but what if someone's not available when you decide to host a class, but they still want to engage in it?
Nick Clason (29:14):
Is there a way to do both? Or instead of hosting the class, realizing that for you as a pastor, hosting a class often requires an evening time commitment from say, seven o'clock until eight 30. Or if you sit down and record a podcast, you can do that during your normal office nine to five office time. You see what I'm saying? There might be a greater return on that. And then you can offer that class for something different, better, more robust that you're hoping to do. Similarly, you could do either YouTube or, or not hosting on YouTube, but some other platform, video based type classes. You can do like a six week class on navigating grief. You can do an eight week class on lust and purity. You can do a seven week class on, um, the, the methodology of following Jesus. You can do a 10 week class on spiritual gifts.
Nick Clason (30:09):
See, there's all kinds of different ways out there, and I hear the rebuttals right now, and I hear them even in my own brain. Yeah, but I don't wanna put something out there that someone could take and misconstrue. And that might be true. However, if you're not doing it that way, where are you doing it? People do need to know these things. They need to know how to navigate grief and they need to know about lust and period. And they need to know about the ways of follow Jesus. And they need to know about their spiritual gifts. And you probably don't have the bandwidth in your current schedule to offer all those at the same time. Maybe you're the only pastor or you only have one pastor, and so he has to host one class and then move to the next class and then move to the next class.
Nick Clason (30:44):
Or he could offer them all by shooting them on a video, on a phone or whatever the case might be. And offering them, offering them through YouTube via playlist, offering them on some video course thing that's a little bit more, got a little bit more accountability built into it or whatever. The final idea is just ongoing devotionals and or reading plans that you can offer. You can, uh, curate or create you version reading bible plans. You can, um, write your own, you can get your whole church reading through a certain thing if you're in like a sermon series. And John, for example, you can, while you're in the Book of John, you can have people reading through the book of John together in their daily quiet time, giving them something to do, something to turn to in their, uh, daily quiet time discipline. So those are just three kind of ideas, like I said, un unchallenged, un uh, not not seeing a lot of people doing them, but just ideas to continue to lean into some of those hybrid moments.
Nick Clason (31:46):
Well, once again, everyone's so glad you're here. Thank you for sticking to the end. I hope I didn't step on toes too hard, but I do want to get us thinking more and more in this way. I know for me, I experience as a pastor a lot of in-person moments and I get frustrated when I see the church not thinking through some of these other avenues that are available to them that they're just not really doing anything with. And so I hope that this is helpful to you. I hope you see it as an encouragement. If you're listening to this podcast, you probably already think this way. And so share it with someone who might be helpful for them to think in a new way. As always, a rating, a review, a subscribe, all those things are incredibly helpful. You can follow me on my YouTube channel link in the show notes or my TikTok account, which I do post two of these for every single episode, uh, throughout the week. So go grab those along with some other, um, church communications, church social media and church marketing tips type thoughts. Those all on my social media, both on TikTok and also on YouTube in the shorts category. But hey, until next time, and as always, stay hybrid.
33 min
April 20, 2023 Episode 041: Church Marketing Tips from Starbucks, Target and Walmart
In this episode Nick explores and examines how Starbucks advertises and markets. As well as what we can learn from Target and Walmart and how every touch point is an opportunity to market yourself and convey who you are, and how the church can do that more effectively!
Join the Email List, Get FREE Stuff: https://www.hybridministry.xyz/articles/ebook
Complete Transcripts Available: http://www.hybridministry.xyz/041
Watch on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9pjecCnd8FVFCenWharf2g
Come Follow Nick on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@clasonnick
SHOWNOTES
6 PART CHURCH SOCIAL MEDIA FRAMEWORK:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLngXlSr64YaIbzg_DNJrTrCtBHQnxcOVo
Episode Referenced:
https://careynieuwhof.com/episode549/
TIMECODES
00:00-02:24 Intro
02:24-05:15 Everything you do is Marketing
05:15-08:03 Every Touch Point Matters - Church Marketing from Street to Seat
08:03-11:51 The Reality of Hybrid - Beyond Street to Seat
11:51-15:40 What "est" is your church?
15:40-1643 Outro
TRANSCRIPT
Nick Clason (00:01):
Well, hello there everybody. Welcome back to another episode of the Hybrid Ministry podcast. We are now officially finished with the six part church social media framework. Be sure to head to the link in the show notes, either http://www.hybridministry.xyz/041 for this episode of the Hybrid Ministry Podcast. Or if you're watching on YouTube, be sure to check out the link in a description where we have linked the full and complete hybrid ministry church, social media, six part framework, four churches in 2023. We walk through setting up a platform all the way at YouTube through TikTok, through Instagram, through Facebook, linking all of your accounts, how to use email, text, messaging, website, and then finally, how to put all those together for a completely full free and flushed out church social media framework. We hope that you find that helpful, advantageous, beneficial. Just wanna say thank you for watching.
Nick Clason (01:02):
Thank you for sharing. Uh, the month of February and March have been our two highest downloaded months in the entire history of the podcast. We could not do what we are doing without you, so, so thankful that you are along for the ride and for the journey. One major piece of the church social media framework is short form video content. That's the beautiful thing with YouTube, TikTok, Instagram, and Facebook. All four of them right now are focusing on short form video content. And so I wanna encourage you, if you have not hit the link in the show notes to check out our 100% completely free ebook, our ebook, which asks the question, have I already ruined my, ruined my church's TikTok account? The short answer to that is probably not, but we wanna help you walk through taking a step-by-step approach to filming, posting, editing, adding audio, all the things that you need to do for short form video content.
Nick Clason (01:52):
And you can do that right in the TikTok app. And then you can take that same video and you can disseminate it out to all the other social media platforms. Once again, so thrilled that you are here for this episode. In this episode, we are going to be looking at Starbucks. Does Starbucks actually market more on that in just a minute? Last thing I just wanna ask you for is if you are available, interested or willing to give us a five star review, that will be incredible. A subscribe, a rating or review. All of those things help get the word out about what we are doing here on this podcast to help you get out to the masses and the people who are along for this journey, and also trying to navigate this church communications, church social media landscape of 2023. Without any further ado, let's dive into this question.
Nick Clason (02:39):
Does Starbucks Market? Hey everyone. I was recently listening to a podcast the other week, um, and I'm gonna link it in the show notes. It was with Bill McKendry. He is the, um, the guy kind of behind the, um, Jesus ads that you might have seen in the Super Bowl, the ads. Um, he gets us and he was on with Carrie Newk, who is a prolific author, podcaster, blogger in the Christian kind of Roman space and in leadership. And they were talking about, um, marketing, the whole idea of marketing. And so there's just so many good things in that episode. If you haven't listened to it or list or heard it yet, check the link in the description. But one of the things he said really stood out to me, and I kind of want to, um, dive into that a little bit deeper, especially with a lens and an eye for and towards church, um, marketing and church spaces.
Nick Clason (03:27):
And so he said he had a conversation with Howard Schultz of Starbucks, and he said that, um, everybody, this is what Howard Schultz, the guy of Starbucks, I said, everybody assumes that branding and marketing is all about advertising. It's not right. And he goes on to say, if you think that branding and marketing are just about advertising, then you really don't understand branding at all. So you might be thinking like, what is he even talking about? And the the reality is, is that what McKenzie Cano is pointing out to to new H on the podcast is he says, you don't see a lot of Starbucks ads or commercials, do you and Kerry Newhouse's like, no, I guess you're right. I I don't really see a lot of those things. And McKendry goes, that's because of this guy Howard Schultz. He says, every single thing you do is branding.
Nick Clason (04:10):
Every single thing you do lends itself toward marketing. And so you might be thinking as a church like, well, that sounds great. That sounds amazing actually, cuz we don't have a giant budget. And you know what actually it is. But if you are a church with a small budget and you don't have someone with an eye for this or someone who has the intentionality towards what Howard Schultz of Starbucks is actually doing, it's going to be difficult for you in my personal opinion. And so, um, I wanted to think through what Starbucks actually does, like what they consider a successful, um, encounter, a successful opportunity. And so if every single thing you do is marketing, if every single thing you do is branding, that means that every single touchpoint matters. And so what McKendry was pointing out to New H in the podcast is he was saying, that's why Starbucks cups look so cool.
Nick Clason (04:56):
That's why there's such a particular way that every Starbucks is, uh, required by corporate to be laid out. That's why the music is a certain level. That's why the vibe looks a certain way. All of that stuff matters. And so I just wanna kind of pause and think through that, through the lens and through the eyes of the church. So if every single touchpoint matters, let's think about somebody visiting, coming to, um, exploring your church for the very first time. Um, let's think through they are going to be going from the street to the seat. So what are all of the touchpoints between the street and to the seat? So when they pull in the signage that they see the way your parking lot looks, how upkept is your, are your ground? Do you have a parking lot team? Do you have signage for visitors?
Nick Clason (05:43):
Flash your lights if you're a visitor, honk your horn If you're a visitor, do you have people with signs? Do you have greeters? Once they finally park their car and they get out, how are they greeted? Are your greeters just glorified door holders that a lump of, uh, block of wood could also accomplish their job? Or are your greeters actively looking for new guests, actively greeting people standing at the door, keeping the door propped open? You know, more than just standing there and saying, hello sir, hello ma'am. But like, are they using names? Are they trying to get to know people? Are they helping escort new people to the lobby? What does your lobby look like? What's your guest experience in the lobby look like? Do you have a newcomers welcome kit or anything like that? Are you just gonna give them a mug, which is what every single church in America does?
Nick Clason (06:30):
Or are you giving them some sort of tailor-made thing that's gonna be maybe a little bit more beneficial or advantageous to them as a family? Um, how is the kids' check-in process as a dad of young kids? The kids' check-in process when it's assumed that you know what's going on is an absolutely awful experience. So what does that experience look like for people who have no idea what they're doing? Is it clear where they're supposed to go? What do they do if they're new? How do they fill out the information needed to get a kid checked in? How long does that process actually take? Is it clear where they're supposed to go? Is your room, are your room layouts clear? Is your building clean? Does your kids' area seem safe? Do you have safety? Do you have security? Do you have people with branded t-shirts for your church and all the way through finally walking into the auditorium?
Nick Clason (07:20):
How does you know the, how does the bulletin look? How does the actual auditorium look? How do the screens look? How, like, think about the all of that and this like, this is leaning a little bit. Guest services, I get it right? And I'm, I'm doing that all with the, the purpose. But like, but I want you to think about this. When is the last time that you walked through your church building through looking through the lens and eyes of a first time guest, someone who has no idea, no context, no framework for what it's like being in your church? That's what I want to encourage you to do. I want you to encourage you to think about those things. And then the reality is this, is that if every single touchpoint matters, think about all the opportune touchpoints that we just walked through. So let's talk about the reality of hybrid.
Nick Clason (08:07):
This is the hybrid ministry podcast after all. And a lot of times we focus on digital because I think most churches do actually do a decent job at least having their, their mind or their eyes set on the physical or thinking about and thinking through what a physical experience is going to look like for somebody coming to your church newcomer or someone who's been going to your church for a hundred years. But what does your pre street to seat experience look like? See, the reality is most churches do have someone thinking street to seat. They have someone thinking guest services, they have someone thinking worship team, tech team, kids team. Like you have someone thinking about that, whether they're doing a good job or not. That may be a whole nother story. But what about before they ever even determine they're going to come to your church?
Nick Clason (08:54):
Because here's the god honest truth, most people are not just driving by at a Sunday morning at 8 45, 9 o'clock, whatever time they would need to be driving past your church and be like, you know what we should do? We should go to church. Like they're going to come to that decision over a, a sequence of weeks, months. Um, and maybe it's from driving by your church, maybe it's from seeing an ad. Maybe it's from seeing t-shirts that people are wearing of your church in and around the community. Maybe it's just a word of mouth recommendation, any sort of thing. But the, the fact is, once someone that has narrowed in their focus on your church, they have gotten to that conclusion and they have come to that place for one reason or another. What was that reason? And then, and then here's what they're gonna do.
Nick Clason (09:44):
If they're under the age of 35 or 40, probably they're more than likely going to check your church out online everywhere. Your website, your socials, your livestream, your kids' ministry page, all those types of things. I'll give you an example. A couple weeks ago it was March Madness and my wife, um, and I were watching March Madness. Let me be more clear. I was watching March Madness and I was trying to get her interested in March Madness. And there was a commercial about wings from Wingstop, which I'm not a big Wingstop guy, it's very, um, commercial. It's very chain. That's not my thing. I don't love Wingstop, don't love beat up. I love like a good kinda like dive bar wing place. That's, that's typically my preference when it comes to wings. And so my wife was like, you know, sounds good Wings. And I was like, I mean, yeah, wings always sound good to me, but for that night wings sounded good to her.
Nick Clason (10:37):
And so she started googling in our town Best Wings in our Town and started getting all these recommendations, Yelp, Google Maps, five stars, four stars, four and a half stars, whatever. And we found this little bar that served wings that were supposedly pretty good. And so we start researching that, researching the wings, and then we're like, okay, is this gonna be a place that like, is kid friendly? Like can we bring our kids to this bar? Is that gonna be okay? And so we start like researching that and reading through the reviews and reading through what people say. My point in saying all of that is that before we ever stepped foot in that restaurant, we did all kinds of different research. Not a ton, right? But like five to 10 minutes worth of research about wings, about the environment, about the prices, about the menu, all those things before we ever took our step into the, um, the bar.
Nick Clason (11:31):
And so I just wanna say that, and I just want to encourage you as a church to start thinking greater than street to seat. Every single touchpoint that you offer from your church matters. If that's what Starbucks does, which is the largest coffee chain in America, then your church can probably learn a couple of things from Starbucks. Another thing that was fascinating from the episode that I want to point out here before we wrap it up is that he went on to talk about this marketing and branding firm that works with all kinds of different competitors. And he used the example of Walmart and Target and he said, each and every competitor, each and every store, each and every entity, whatever it is, can only have one e s T. And when he said e s t, he said, for example, like Walmart is the cheapest and Target is the coolest.
Nick Clason (12:20):
But I just wanna ask you a question. Is Walmart always the cheapest? Sometimes Target is actually cheaper than Walmart, but you could, you, and he uses this example in the podcast. He says, there's a guy who's like, I, I would throw on slippers and a hoodie and not wash or wash my hair, brush my teeth, anything like that, just head into Walmart and grab something quick. But if I wanna go to Target, I gotta get myself ready, right? Why is that? He said, because each of those places have embraced what their e s t is Walmart being cheapest, target being coolest. So what is that for your church? You probably have something in mind, whether you've thought about it or not, um, spoken or unspoken, just about every place has an E s T that they want to be. What we often run into as agencies, churches, whatever, is that we want to be multiple of them.
Nick Clason (13:09):
Well, we wanna be the coolest and we wanna be the cheapest and we want, you just can't be that. You have to pick one of those things and really hone in on it. So is your church gonna be the church that's all about worship or is your church gonna be the church that's all about kids and student ministry? Or is your church gonna be the church that's all about ex expositional, expository preaching? Is your church gonna be the trendy church? Is your church gonna be the church with good coffee? Is your church? You see what I'm saying? And like, those things matter, but like one thing often rises above and rises to the top of what your church is. And and this is true of businesses and whatnot. And here's the thing. He used an example in the podcast. He says, Southwest Airlines always said, we love you, we love our customers.
Nick Clason (13:52):
And he said, that works until it doesn't. And when Southwest had their debacle around Christmas and they couldn't get people home for their Christmas and family gatherings, no amount of messaging, no amount of like, we love you, we are the airline oven for the people. None of that mattered. He said anymore why? He was like, because they failed. Like they dropped the ball big time and people didn't feel that love sitting in the airport for 24, 36, 48, 72 hours. That is not the messaging that Southwest was giving across during those times. And so you can say what you are, but then you also have to turn around and deliver it. And so everything you do about your church, every single touchpoint that you make, it matters. So what are you going to do? What is that, that key core marker that you're going to be with your church?
Nick Clason (14:41):
And listen, I would, I would recommend if you're a youth pastor, if you're a church communications person, a church social media person listening to this podcast, you're probably gonna wanna have to have a sit with some upper level leadership around this conversation. If you're not a person at the table to have that conversation, ask your direct report. Hey, what, like, how, how can we come up with this? And your church may already have had some of those things. So then go back through and grade those things. Hire a secret shopper, like all sorts of different things. But I like, I just, I wanna point out that I think most churches do a good job, a decent job, you know, with people like secret shoppers, first time guests, all those things. But what are you communicating beyond the doors, beyond the Sunday morning, beyond your primary meeting experience?
Nick Clason (15:26):
And what is your messaging to them? Because if, well he said the Starbucks guy, everything you do is branding, then have you taken enough time to distill that one to your primary core, what your messaging is going to be? Well, thanks everyone for hanging out again for another episode in the Books Hybrid Ministry episode 41. We are now only about 15. No, that's a less than that. We're like 11, 10, 11 episodes away from one year worth of podcasting. So we'll do something exciting on episode 52. I'll need to look, cuz I have a couple bonus episodes that have dropped that have, you know, kind of messed with our, our numbering there or whatever. But, but super excited to be with you, grateful that you're continuing to be along in the journey. Hey, if you have questions, if you wanna get in touch with me, follow me on YouTube, follow me on TikTok, hit me up in the dm, head to our website, hybridministry.xyz. We would love to hear from you. We would love to start answering some questions. So if you have those, send them our way. But once again, thrilled that you were here with us and we will talk to you next time. And don't forget, and as always, stay hybrid.
17 min
April 13, 2023 Episode 040: The Sixth Step of the Church Social Media Framework: Putting it All Together
In this episode Nick Recaps each step of the Church Social Media Framework for 2023, and he puts it all together. Get your notebooks out (or head to the transcripts) to take notes as we go quickly through all areas and social channels and lay out a church social media and marketing strategy.
Follow Along on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9pjecCnd8FVFCenWharf2g
TikTok: http://www.tiktok.com/@clasonnick
Transcripts: http://www.hybridministry.xyz/040
SHOWNOTES
//TRAILER
https://www.hybridministry.xyz/034
//YOUTUBE
https://www.hybridministry.xyz/035
//TIKTOK
https://www.hybridministry.xyz/036
//FACEBOOK
https://www.hybridministry.xyz/037
//INSTAGRAM
https://www.hybridministry.xyz/038
//EMAIL, TEXT & WEBSITE
https://www.hybridministry.xyz/039
COMPLETE YOUTUBE PLAYLIST
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YCREabCjGg&list=PLngXlSr64YaIbzg_DNJrTrCtBHQnxcOVo&index=1
NUCLEUS WEBSITE BUILDER:
https://www.nucleus.church
TIMECODES
00:00-02:24 Intro
02:24-06:08 Becoming All Things to All People on Social and Digital Media
06:08-08:36 Step #1: A Good Church Website
08:36-11:08 Step #1 after the Website: YouTube
11:08-17:53 The Full Weekly Social Media Strategy
17:53-20:10 Better Weekly Church Emails
20:10-21:59 Outro and Final Encouragements
TRANSCRIPT
Nick Clason (00:00):
Well, hello everybody. Welcome back to another episode of the Hybrid Ministry Show. My name is Nick Clason. I am going to be your host. And in this episode we are taking the last, uh, several episodes where we talked through YouTube, TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, email, text, website. And then we're gonna put it all together and hand you the perfect custom package social media plan for your church here in 2023. Excited to have you with us. As always, wanna let you know that every single episode we provide for you transcripts, you can head over to hybridministry.xyz for this episode. You'll go back slash 0 4 0 for episode 40. Also, we are on YouTube, so go ahead and click the subscribe button over on that. And finally, every little, uh, piece of content I pull out for these episodes, we also post those over on TikTok, so you can follow me, hit all those things up in the show notes and any other links and articles and relevant things that we're going to be talking about.
Nick Clason (01:10):
I will also drop in the podcast episode show notes. Again, you can find all of that, um, just in your podcast catcher or at hybrid ministry dot x y z. Additionally, in as always, you know the drill, it would be incredibly beneficial and helpful to us if you'd consider giving us a rating or a review, a like or a subscribe on YouTube. All in any of those things, help us just be found, just be seen and get this message of hybrid ministry out to the masses a and to the world. And so if that's something that you have the time or are willing or able to do, we would greatly, greatly appreciate it. And as a thank you, we want to offer you a 100% completely free ebook. The title of the ebook is, have I already Ruined My Church's TikTok account? How to Post a TikTok from Scratch, starting at the very beginning from A to Z.
Nick Clason (02:00):
You can head to the show notes for a link to the ebook as well. Um, and what will come along with that is when you sign up, you'll also get a bonus throw in of the social media checklist. Everything you need to do every time you post to every single social media platform. Once again, so glad that you're with us. Let's go ahead and dive in and put all of the last several episodes together. Well, everyone, if you are just diving in, you, what you're doing is you are catching us at the sixth episode of the sixth Part Church Social Media Framework for Churches in 2023. And what we've done is we've parsed through each individual's social media platform as well as spent some time on website, email, and text. And so really we had four, and then we had an additional three that we package into one episode that was in the most recent episode.
Nick Clason (02:50):
And then in this episode, we're gonna take all of those facets, all of those pieces, and we're going to put them all back together. So, uh, just as a reminder, all the way back at the very beginning of this episode in the trailer, um, I'll drop a link to those in the show notes. But we started with and talked about YouTube and if you've listened to any of these episodes or even just maybe a few of them, you are probably in the boat, probably one or two camps, one, wow, good information. Thank you. No way on the earth I would have time to do any of that. And I get it right, like it's a lot. It can feel overwhelming and definitely if you have none of it started starting and launching, some of these things will feel potentially overwhelming. The other camp is you're ready to take the hill.
Nick Clason (03:36):
You're like, let's go. I'm all in. I believe in this stuff. I think we do need to lean more into the hybrid space and reach more people where they are. And whatever the camp you're in, let me just remind you that one of the things we talked about in the very, very, very first episode is that the apostle Paul reminds us and says that he became all things to all people. And in that way, we're gonna do that. And I'm not saying that we're gonna bend to culture and go, you know, the wayward ways of the world, but we are going to find the places that our people are and we're going to intersect and enter into their life, um, with the places that they're finding themselves. And so a majority of people are spending time on phones, on social media, and, and, you know, this is how they are living their lives.
Nick Clason (04:22):
Like less and less people are sitting down, uh, to browse a computer to find information about churches, websites, whatever, whatnot. But what they are doing is they are navigating, scrolling and spending majority of time on social media. Now, every demographic is a little bit different. You know, gen Xers, boomers might be spending more time on Facebook where millennials might be spending more time on Instagram. Gen Z and Jen Alpha are finding themselves on things like TikTok can be real. The fact of the matter is like we have this unique moment in history and time on social media where all of the platforms are in an alignment of what they want, short form, vertical video based content. And this is how we can provide that, and we can put that together on a social media strategy for our churches. So before you give up, before you let go, this is the why behind the, what all these reasons is.
Nick Clason (05:19):
We wanna show up in some of the most meaningful places of people's lives. And not because we think that like, you know, someone stumbles across a short 32nd TikTok that they're gonna like repent and give their life to Christ. But we're building a rapport, we're building a relationship. We're showing up regularly in the places that they also are finding their time to show up. And that's what the Apostle Paul, that's what missionaries, that's what pastors would do. So how can we, how can you position yourself and leverage yourself as a church to show up in a spot where you can help build trust and build rapport with people so that yeah, one, you are building a relationship, eventually down the line, they do make a decision, make a commitment, and become a more committed and devoted follower of Christ. So step number one, the first thing that you're gonna want to do is you're gonna want to have a good church website.
Nick Clason (06:16):
Your website is sort of the backdrop and the, or the backstop you, if you will, of all of your social media platforms. For any of you who are baseball fans, you know that behind every, uh, catcher, um, there's a backstop. And so a pitcher throws and if the ball goes too far behind them, the ball gets stopped by what is called the backstop. And you can, you're gonna kinda want that as your website. It's also gonna sort of be your kind of home base. I'm very into baseball analogies this morning, apparently went to a baseball game last night. Uh, nonetheless, you want these things to sort of be your place where people can know, um, where they can always turn to. And so all of your social links should be able to go out from your websites as well as if you ever need to just embed a video or a resource or something like that, you need to have a website that is mobile friendly.
Nick Clason (07:08):
Um, and that is also, you know, probably, let's be honest, even mobile first one that feels familiar to people, one that looks like other, um, websites that they're spending their time on. And so if you don't have a website yet, odds are you probably do hone that in a little bit. Um, get that built out so that it's a little bit more user friendly. Um, and begin to think about how can you create even like blogs or resources or other additional pieces of content that can go with and supplement some of the other social media things that we are gonna be talking about. My all-time favorite website builder is from Nucleus. The guys up in Canada, pro Church tools, Brady Shearer and those guys. Phenomenal website builders. So easy. So user friendly and built four churches and four pastors. And you don't need a lot of like website information.
Nick Clason (07:59):
Know how knowledge to pull one of those off. So if you, um, are thinking about starting one or you're like a side ministry youth pastor and you have the go ahead from your senior pastor or communications team to build some sort of like additional website, this can be a great one. Stop shop. It also, excuse me, it also has podcast like functionality, sermon, um, upload places where you can link YouTube videos, all those types of things. So let your website kind of be your first stop, your first shop on, um, creating a backstop and creating a home base for everything else that we're about to talk about.
Nick Clason (08:38):
All right, so what about, uh, what, what's the first step then? All right, so the first step I would say and I would recommend is that we make it YouTube begin recording and putting up long form YouTube videos of your content, of your sermons from the weekend. And if you, um, did not go back and have not listened to the YouTube episode, uh, one of the things that I have been recommending, and one of the things that we have been doing in my own church in my own context is we don't have the framework and the infrastructure to like live stream our student ministry services. And so instead of, uh, buying cameras and hooking it up to the soundboard and just posting a video of me or anyone else on our team teaching, we are actually sitting down in front of a camera, much like I'm doing right now and just pre-filing our message, talk our message content that allows us to craft it and hone it specifically for YouTube, make it better YouTube length, create YouTube hooks.
Nick Clason (09:40):
I can do some post-production editing type stuff, but then that also gives me like video clips that I can use later, oh, excuse me, that I can use later on down the road in and for social media. And so starting with YouTube as your spot, the other reason why that's important is because as we go, we're going to incorporate and use TikTok, Instagram reels, Facebook reels, and YouTube shorts. We're going to use all of those things. And if we're posting little, little snippets of, of the sermon of the message at the end of it, you can just have a ender screen that says, watch the full video on YouTube. And so when you do post something that goes viral or, or is seen by more people than just those who are following you or your church, what you can do is you can be pushing them to a longer form piece of content.
Nick Clason (10:30):
It's pushing them down that funnel, you're building a relationship with them and maybe they see a few of your messages, 1, 2, 3, of just the little clips until finally they're like, maybe I do wanna hear this message. Maybe there is something interesting and enticing that's gonna want me to click and hear the full version of this message. And so that's why I recommend starting with YouTube, starting with filming your messages and getting them posted up there, PA pr, use all the YouTube practices, use good thumbnails, use good titling, put 'em in playlists, use SEO related things, and all of that information is available for you and to you. In the YouTube episode that we talked about, Facebook reels, Instagram reels, YouTube shorts, and TikTok, I would recommend posting anywhere from 10 to 15 pieces of short form content per week. That is on average two to three pieces of content per day when you're in the growth phase.
Nick Clason (11:28):
If you're not in a phase where you're looking to grow and get a lot of awareness and people seeing you, um, then you still wanna try and remain consistent and you can maybe back that down to just one per day. Um, but what I would recommend is that you can, like I said, use the clips from your YouTube teaching video pre-filed and put them on your TikTok and Instagram reels account. I would also then aim, uh, to use things like trending sounds, trending hashtags, uh, templates that you see in cap cut. You know, the more time that you spend on TikTok personally, you're gonna know these things. And if you're like, well, that's not me, that's okay. Um, I would, I would beg you and recommend that you reach out and find someone in your church who's Gen Z, who's younger or who's a teenager, um, and who might have some ideas of things that you could do.
Nick Clason (12:18):
But keep in mind that the trends, they are quick. I mean, I remember at one point, um, I bookmarked one on like a Thursday and I came back around on Monday and it wasn't a thing really anymore. So you kind of just gotta jump on it and post it when it's available and ready to do that. So don't miss out on those. Hop onto those. And some of those things are, are the things that are gonna help you get discovered the most by outside people because it's, it's a popular thing in the moment. And so TikTok is pushing those pieces of content and you'll know the ones that are trending when like you get on TikTok yourself or Instagram or whatever, and you see it 2, 3, 4, 5 times in like one sitting, one stint. You know, it, it's just one of those things that like, it just keeps recurring.
Nick Clason (13:03):
You're like, okay, how can I use this? And if you go back even before the six part church social media framework, we did an episode on YouTube trends. And one of the things that they found was that they said, uh, consumers, um, are looking for content creators who are going to post like mem ified content or they're going to make jokes about like certain things in pop culture or whatever. So that is a thing that is both culturally relevant and I think it also can work for your churches. And so if you are using, um, TikTok, any of those things, think of it less of like a mini sermon posting platform and more of like a meme, a funny account like that. That's really why people are getting on those apps. They're getting on those apps to be entertained. What about Instagram? So Instagram that everything I just said, that's your Instagram reels strategy, however, there's more to do on Instagram.
Nick Clason (14:00):
So, um, what I'll do is, um, and I laid this out in the Instagram, uh, podcast, but on on your feed, if you hired me and you're asking me to like, uh, consult your church, this is what I would propose. I would propose a me Monday, 10 memes, curate them all throughout the week and then post your 10 best memes in a carousel post. I would recommend a TikTok Tuesday where you post one of your tos also to the feed. I would do a Wednesday night recap of what's going on in your church. So maybe like a carousel post of all the ministries that are meeting that night. Uh, if not, like I'm a youth pastor, so our main kind of night is Wednesday anchors us. And so I would do, um, if I don't have the ability to do photos, I would just do like a recap post.
Nick Clason (14:45):
Um, on Thursday I would do some sort of like recap from your message. Uh, on the week on Friday I would do a photo dump of like, uh, a week in the life of my church. And then Saturday I would do either a sermon quote post or an invite back to church Sunday post. And if you don't wanna post Sunday, uh, then save that quote post for Sunday and do a, use the like Saturday invite to church post. There's a seven day posting strategy on your Instagram feed on stories. Uh, I would also focus on engaging heavily in your stories with your people. That's sort of the spot to kind of go back and forth and that's where your actual followers are going to be engaging and interacting with you. Um, and so you can take any of the other like Instagram real content that you've been posting that didn't also post to the theater that maybe didn't do as well.
Nick Clason (15:32):
And you can also share those to your, uh, Instagram stories. And then you can use things like slider tools, question tools, true or false tools, poll tools, uh, question stickers and engage with your audience in that way. And so you can use the content you're already using and just repurpose it and push it out for stories. Other fun story ideas beyond reels are things like you can do like hot takes, like hot take oatmeal, oatmeal, um, raisin cookies are the best cookie. And put a little slider thing with like the fire emoji. Are they gonna slide it all the way down cuz they don't agree or all the way up cuz they do agree. You can do, uh, sermon recap quizzes or um, like total recall things like, I love things where you watch, have 'em watch a little clip and then you ask 'em a question about the clip they just watched.
Nick Clason (16:19):
Uh, you can do things like polls, you can do things like games. Um, take any game that you would maybe play on like a screen in your room, uh, especially if you're like youth pastor and you can just adapt it to Instagram. You can also post prayer requests and ask people like, what's going on in your life? How can we be praying for you? Stories have a lot, a lot of potential to help engage with your people one-on-one. So what would I do on Facebook? So like we talked about back in the Facebook episode, you should have a page that's your place where you're gonna be able to start throwing money towards ads if that's something that you're interested in or that you want to do. But I would also have a private group where you can have people. Um, and that's where you can really segment things out.
Nick Clason (16:58):
So parents of students, parents of kids, members of your church. And that's really where I would just spend the majority of your time. And in there I would do a very minimal amount of things. I would, uh, send like a weekly email of some sort. And if you have a good website, you don't need to make your email announcement heavy. You can make your email one story plus one call to action and that's it. And then you can take that good story that's gonna have a little bit more of like a blogy type vibe and you can also post that in your Facebook group with like an image that relates to the email of what's going on. And then I'll just post like one or two other things like, um, share, you know, share, share a photo of your view right now, um, bible emoji quizzes, just fun, quick kind of hitter things that you can post in there.
Nick Clason (17:47):
But then just let the group do its thing. Let the people drive the remainder of the content. I would also recommend sending out an email and a great to do that is Tuesday, it's historically been one of the like email days. They've done all sorts of studies on it. So schedule an email to go out by Tuesday morning at 9:00 AM then that way your people are gonna get used to it in a rhythm of expecting an email from you at the same time. Uh, if your email center gives you the opportunity to schedule it, I would definitely recommend scheduling it. That way you can get a little bit ahead and you don't have to just be chasing your email every single week. Uh, I would also perhaps consider linking some of the current messages in your email or any of the other things you wanna do on social media, any of the things you're trying to do to lean into the hybridization, lean into it and send links to those things in email because what it's gonna do is gonna kind of help create this like circular funnel of like hitting those pieces of content more and more and multiple times.
Nick Clason (18:44):
And the same thing is true with texting. You can send out registration forms, you can send out reminders of things. All those can be linked directly to your website that you have built. Again, that's your backstop. And so now you have this all-inclusive plan from website with socials including YouTube and email and texting and all of that is sort of like your package. Listen to build anything from scratch, it takes work, takes effort, whatever platform you're on, it's gonna also just take consistency. So if it's, um, like in a group text, you can text out your TikTok link, you can stage announce your new YouTube channel, um, and emails. You can invite parents to Jo to jump into your Facebook groups, whatever the case may be. But use the different platforms to help cross promote as you're starting from scratch to help build that base, build that core of those people, um, subscribing and getting on things.
Nick Clason (19:36):
And then a couple different times a year, run a blitz, get it like a big deal of a thing going on. Like right now, for example, I'm gonna date this because this is gonna come out after, but during March Madness we've been doing like a, a serial bracket in our youth ministry where people are voting on serial matchups and um, we've been using our parent email to help push and promote, um, the serial things, you know, going on in our, our ministry. So those can kind of help balance both the in-person and the online. And that's where you really get to see and use that hybrid stuff. Reminder, do not forget that God has placed you strategically where he has placed you. And while all of that slew of things may seem overwhelming, don't forget two things. One, just take one step and two, that's why we have transcripts.
Nick Clason (20:29):
So you can go back and you can parse that out and you can take that a little bit slower. If you were listening at 1.5 or two times speed, go back to the transcript and lay some of those things out. What is your next step if you're, if you've got nothing going, get a website Bill. If you got a website, then go ahead and get a YouTube channel you're not posting regularly. Start pre-filing your content, you know what I mean? Like, just take it one bite, one step at a time. You don't have to have it all done tomorrow. This is just my proposed and my recommended church YouTube strategy. And I think more, what I would say of all things is that at some point churches are gonna have to realize that social media is more than just a side gig or a volunteer role.
Nick Clason (21:12):
It is a full-time effort for somebody to pay attention to, to watch the analytics, to know what's going on. And so good luck to you as you navigate this, as you embrace it. We are always here. Please don't ever hesitate to reach out hybrid ministry.xyz for questions, for comments, for concerns, or follow us on YouTube or TikTok to hit us up in the dm, shoot us a message. However we can help. We wanna remind you that we are here, we want to give you guidance, point you in the right direction, but blessings on you, blessings on your ministry. And as always, never forget to stay hybrid.
22 min
April 06, 2023 Episode 039: The Fifth Step of the Church Social Media Framework - Email and SMS Marketing
In this episode Nick unpacks the importance of Church wide email and text (sms) messaging. What is the role of these common marketing practices? Does it have a place in church? How should your church, in 2023, approach it? Along with what role does the church website play in all of this? All that and more in this episode!
Follow Along on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9pjecCnd8FVFCenWharf2g
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@clasonnick?lang=en
Show Notes & Transcripts: http://www.hybridministry.xyz/039
TikTok E Book: https://www.hybridministry.xyz/articles/ebook
SHOWNOTES
Step 1: YouTube: https://www.hybridministry.xyz/035
Trailer: https://www.hybridministry.xyz/034
Planning Center People: https://www.planningcenter.com/people
HubSpot: https://www.hubspot.com/
SMS Marketing Rules and Regulations: https://act-on.com/blog/sms-marketing-regulations/#:~:text=The%20Telephone%20Consumer%20Protection%20Act%20(TCPA)%20is%20a%20United%20States,sending%20them%20marketing%20text%20messages
TIMECODES
00:00-02:46 Intro
02:46-08:43 Email and Text Messaging's Place in Church Communications
08:43-15:19 What is Email Marketing for Churches?
15:19-17:57 What should you expect from Email Marketing?
17:57-22:05 What is SMS or Text Message Marketing's place in churches?
22:05-23:22 The Role of your Church Website
23:22-24:20 Outro
TRANSCRIPT
Nick Clason (00:00):
Well, hey there everybody. Welcome back to another episode of The Hybrid Minister Show. I am your host, as always, Nick Clason. So excited to be here with you. And in today's episode, we are going to be talking about email and text messaging. So you're like, wait a minute, hold on. I thought that this was the sixth part, church social media framework for churches in 2023. And yes, you would be correct. And then you're thinking, wait a minute, I email and text. That doesn't count. And actually I think it does. And so we're gonna dive into that why I think it matters, why I think you should be utilizing it for your church and why it can be beneficial. But before we do, if you don't know, we are on YouTube every single episode. So hey, to everyone watching on YouTube, it's good to see you over there on video.
Nick Clason (00:54):
If you're just listening to this in your ear holes, click the link in the show notes to head on over to YouTube to take a look, to watch, to even to subscribe. That'd be amazing. We'd love to have you over there. If you discovered us on YouTube or on shorts, we wanna let you know that we are also on website and we have a podcast. And so you can head to http://www.hybridministry.xyz. This is episode 39, so http://www.hybridministry.xyz/03. If you click that direct link, it will take you very specifically to this episode with transcripts for this episode, or if you just head to that website and head over to the blog section. There are two articles there, both with links to free, completely free resources to help you and your church navigate this social media landscape that we are in, including the ebook.
Nick Clason (01:40):
Have I already ruined my church's TikTok account by what I've done and what I've posted? No, you should download it so that you know exactly what to do from start to finish all the way through. Uh, and maybe you know what you're doing, but maybe you have some volunteers or some staff and you, uh, want to help them understand what they're doing. You can put that ebook in their hands and it will help take them from a complete novice to an expert on TikTok in just a few short steps. And so that is a resource that we hope that will be beneficial to you. And, uh, hopefully something that, you know, that you can use and utilize for years and years to come, or at least for this year probably, because TikTok will then make an update and we'll have to update the book along with it.
Nick Clason (02:22):
Um, if you find that helpful or if any of this helpful a share or a rating or a review would be incredible, it would just be your way of helping, uh, us get the word out, um, and letting your friends know that, hey, this is something that's useful, beneficial, and I am, uh, listening to it and you should as well. So without any further ado, let's dive into email and text messaging. Okay, so email, texting. I thought we were talking about social media. Well, if you go all the way back to the very first episode of this, and if you haven't had a chance to listen, um, you can go back. We dropped a trailers like a two-part trailer on kind of previewing this and then also the first episode, um, on YouTube where we sort of like laid the framework. But one of the things that we talked about was we talked about this idea of a funnel.
Nick Clason (03:08):
And so if you are watching, you'll see me try to create one with my hands, but a funnel kinda like a triangle, right? The top is wider. You're gonna catch more people and the bottom is more narrow. Uh, the thing that most churches don't understand is that they actually start probably, um, depending on your marketing strategy. And I know that churches probably bach at that term marketing in some cases, but, um, churches almost always start with people more mid to bottom of the funnel. And so what then becomes tricky is you already have a very committed group of people that are already very deeply invested in your organization. They're just not, um, you're just not getting people on the top of the funnel, especially if you're a church that's, that's dying or hasn't seen new, um, people, you know, come through your doors in a while.
Nick Clason (03:55):
And so social media might be one of your avenues to try and do that. And it very much can be YouTube, TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, all four of those phenomenal platforms. But in order to, and also might I add before I continue on, they're great marketing platforms too. Like some of the best marketing that our world has ever seen, cheapest marketing that our world has ever seen. So you can utilize those two year advantage. However, email and texts, I think are ways to drive people down the funnel more. Um, once they've found you on Instagram, once they found you on YouTube, once they've found you on t TikTok to drive them down the funnel more, um, and then ultimately become more and more, um, super fans of you. And I know that's not what we're trying to do in church, uh, but before they become a committed Christian, cuz ultimately the goal is to drive them to become a deeper, more devoted disciple of Jesus.
Nick Clason (04:51):
But if they're just discovering you on social media for the first time as a church, uh, you just want them to like you, right? You just want them to trust you as a church. You just want them to think your content is useful, beneficial, um, and helpful to them in their life. And so you just wanna drive them deeper and deeper. And so maybe you offer them something free like an ebook or maybe you offer them something, um, you know, like a checklist that they can get, uh, on their own and they, they sign up for an email list or a text messaging list or something like that and you drive them deeper down the funnel, right? And so that you a little bit, you gotta think about it, you might have a couple different tracks kind of going on. And that's what like super next level marketers do is they have like this, this track of people that are already their contributors or people who've already bought things and they got people who are just like in an awareness sort of like track trying to like discover more about your company.
Nick Clason (05:39):
Okay? But here's the thing about email, and here's the thing about text is that they cost almost $0 to facilitate, uh, especially if you're like not looking to go full out, you know, become like a business on this. You're just trying to become a church to supplement what else you have going on on social media where some of these other platforms, yeah, you can do them all for free, but to really get some of that like, like legitimate organic, um, or I'm sorry, not organic, but some of that legitimate like far-reaching reach that people are often looking for. If you wanna like have an amazing Easter ad or something like that, you're probably gonna have to put some dollars behind it. And that's true just about everything in life. If you want something that is incredible and is gonna work for you to the best of its abilities, it's gonna probably be behind some sort of premium paywall, whether that be a tech service or an email service.
Nick Clason (06:34):
However, as a church, you probably already have some of these tools at your disposal that you may or may not be tapping into depending on how much know-how you have. Cuz just about every church in America, um, has or should have some sort of church management software people, uh, a people software, a data captures sort of thing, you know, church, community builder, the rock, whatever. All of those have email, um, woven into it as well as text messaging woven into it. However, are they the most useful and beneficial advantageous of, you know, taking those emails, creating a funnel type content, moving people through a pathway and a process just depends if you kind of know, if you know what you're doing on there. So let's dive in a little bit more on that before we do a couple of just quick hitter stats so that you're aware of why text messaging and email can be so effective in your church today in 2023.
Nick Clason (07:31):
First thing is this, 94% of people on the internet use email. 94%. That is crazy, right? That is more than TikTok. That is more than Facebook. That's like a wider adoption percentage of people. Almost everyone on the internet has an email account. Furthermore, 75% of adult users on the internet say that email marketing is their preferred form of marketing, which is fascinating because I don't think that we often think of email or texts as, as sexy as some of these other social media type platforms. But, uh, three, three quarters of people that use the, uh, internet so that they would just prefer email marketing to be done to them via email. The return on investment, the ROI is higher on these platforms, texting and email than they are on other social channels. And then finally, text message, open rates can go as high as get this, are you ready for it?
Nick Clason (08:31):
98%. So let's dive in. Let's unpack what's going on here and why this can be so important and advantageous for your church. All right, so what is email marketing? If you were to just go on and you were to, to Google email marketing, there's a potential that you could get kind of lost in the weeds of, of terminology and words that are maybe not super familiar to you. But at its core, basically email marketing is an opportunity for an organization to connect regularly with its fans and at a church level, right? Like maybe they're not fans, but it's an opportunity for us to connect with members of our congregation. There's a lot of ways that churches actually believe it or not, have a upper hand on some companies with email marketing. And the reason of that is because they, like I said, they already have kind of a core base of people.
Nick Clason (09:24):
We already have a core base of people that we are pulling from, all right? And so it's not solely dependent upon us to craft and curate and build our own email list from zero. We already sort of have a base that we're starting with. And that's, that's an amazing place to be and that's an amazing advantage that we as a church, I I think sometimes we lament our, our position in the space. Like, oh, what was us? We're just a church, blah, blah, blah. Like, we have advantages that like other companies don't have. We're often handed email list with already done work for us. And so we just need to steward that well and continue to build upon that. And so I think that there's a, there's a space and a way to do that. Um, the church, like right, oftentimes we might have a hard time with social media or marketing or websites, but in this particular case and in this particular space, I think the church might actually have an upper hand.
Nick Clason (10:15):
So who is email marketing for you might be asking. It's for, honestly, it's for everybody. We said 94% of internet users say and claim that they have an internet account or an email account on the internet. So yeah, you should be using email in your church, you should be sending out regular updates. And here's the thing, um, and we're gonna talk about this a lot in the next episode, but if we have stuff on social media, we can use our email to supplement, to push, to promote people towards what we're already doing online so we can help connect our people, especially in our church, to what we're doing online. And then we can use online to help connect people to our email marketing list to help connect them to our church, our local body, our local assembly. Okay, so how do we start this? What do we do?
Nick Clason (11:03):
If you're like, okay, great, I'm in, I'm sold, what do I do? Well, first and foremost, if you're part of a church, you're probably watching this as a church, you know, social media manager, a youth pastor or a volunteer who's been handed the reigns of running social media on your church, what are you supposed to do? In most cases, like I said, I believe most churches, um, probably do, and if they don't, they probably should have some sort of church management database system. You know, I currently at the church, I'm at used church Community builder. In the past I've used Rock, I've used, um, uh, we've used ACS realm, we've used planning Center people. These are all different ones that I've used in different places. I've been in my, my ministry, my life. Uh, the reality is you probably want to at least start there because there's going to be the vast majority of your data, of your people, of your email addresses living and existing in there.
Nick Clason (11:59):
And depending on the, uh, decision making prowess of people, there are gonna be people who in your church, who've already invested in that, paid for that and want you to be using it. I think that that's a great place to start. Um, what if your church doesn't have a database? Well, I definitely would encourage you to do it, and I know that there are some free ones out there. I know that Planning Center people, I believe, at least when I looked at it, this is like five plus years ago, but they said that they would be forever and always free. Um, there are other modules, which is part of the, the downside is like you can get all your data in planning center people, but then to use it for giving or to use it for events or whatever, like those aren't free. And so for them to pair and work well with each other, uh, you have to start paying.
Nick Clason (12:46):
And so that's the downside. However, let me just say my favorite, the planning center you pay like individually, so like a giving is a, a different price and events is a different price and registration is a different price and services is a different price and all these things, it, it adds up quickly. However, let me just say it's, it was my favorite database I ever worked with, ever, ever, ever. Um, I currently, and most churches I feel like have adopted like c b Church community seems to be a really popular one. Um, very much not my favorite one. It's, it's good, it's sleek, it's got web interface, that's fine. But like on the email side, on the marketing side, and I know that, um, if you guys have been around from the very, very beginning listening to our podcast, if you go back and listen to episode one, the episode like seven or eight, I had a co-host, his name was Matt, he moved and his new job wouldn't really allow him to, to be on this podcast regularly.
Nick Clason (13:39):
So we've sorta, um, amicably parted ways. He's doing his thing, I'm doing my thing. But Matt was a marketing a marketer first that worked in a church. And I know that his big thing was that databases don't always give him what he wanted as a marketer. So as a marketer, like someone who works in the business space, what he recommended was HubSpot. Um, and that is, that's for making money for businesses and churches are built, uh, with a different, um, need on those church management softwares. And he thought that we could do everything we needed to do for churches in HubSpot. Now, um, to, uh, you know, to push back on that a little bit, he might not have known everything that we needed as churches, right? Like for example, HubSpot might not have a baptism date field in the church community in the like database thing, right?
Nick Clason (14:33):
But it is, it will give you everything that you need for email addresses, websites, you can create ClickFunnels, you can create, uh, all types of things where you can very easily capture someone's name and email address and then move them down a pathway or a process. And that's what Matt was trying to do at the church that we were both at in Chicago, at Parkview. Ultimately, that's part of the reason why he ended up stepping away. And myself as well. We just, we, he couldn't get people on board with the idea. All that being said, you, if you don't have something, you should have something and you should at least start with exploring some of these free ones. So I'll drop some of these links in the show notes, uh, HubSpot, I'll drop planning center people in the, in the show notes so that you have those things to check out.
Nick Clason (15:16):
Um, hopefully that's something that's useful and beneficial to you. What should you expect? The, the one main thing I want you to know is that you should not get discouraged by what seems to be low email open rates. So according to studies that have been done for years and years and years, the average email list open rate is 21.3%, which I get that seems crazy low, but when it pertains to email marketing, if you're anywhere in that range, you are succeeding. Surprisingly. I know it's crazy. Uh, this is why delivering things like valuable content with interesting subjects and things that are gonna actually cause people to actually click open the emails is so important. I mean, just think about it for yourself, right? You probably get inundated with emails and you probably just bulk delete them. You're not gonna open them. That's exactly why email openers are at 21.3%.
Nick Clason (16:07):
That's why it's important to be creative with your subjects. So a couple of things, send it from a person. I've found, uh, if you send it from such and such baptist church.com, uh, this week's announcements that is so easy to ignore, I'm sorry, no offense, no one cares about your announcements enough to open your email list because they're also swimming through their child's elementary school email list and they're Cole's coupons that they're getting. And like all these things, right? They don't care. But if you send it from Pastor Jim and he says, this one key thing helped me grow my faith, all of a sudden you're like, wait, what was that? I wanna know what Pastor Jim's, one key thing to growing in his faith was maybe I should click open that. And then what that is is that's a short little blurb and then boom it to link out to a YouTube short or a full YouTube message that you've done.
Nick Clason (16:54):
All of a sudden, wait a minute, now we're cooking with gas. See what I'm saying? And if you're not just always only capturing moments from your sermons, then when you send it to your church, people who have already maybe seen that because they've already attended your service. However, keep in mind, at least in most churches I've been to the average person attends 1.4 times per month. So that means they probably more than likely didn't see the sermon. So that is not a bad strategy. However, if you have the bandwidth in time to create something more like a podcast or something else or some other like, um, some other resource that explains more to them, that's gonna be even more valuable. Where your pastor's sitting down having a conversation with another person on staff or a host and he's talking through some of these things and it's maybe sermon related or sermon adjacent, but not just sermon.
Nick Clason (17:43):
So that's an example of how you can start to kind of bump your email open rates, think through sending it from an actual person and think through crafting sub uh, subjects that spark and evoke curiosity. So that's email marketing. What's text message marketing? So same thing, short message service or sms. You probably heard that before. Marketing is another word to just say text message marketing, but it's a form of marketing that businesses use to send promotions to customers via text message. There's three main benefits of SMS messaging as far as I can see. Number one, it's fast, okay? As opposed to waiting and hoping for people to discover your content and social media, you post it, you kinda wait, you see, does this thing hit the lottery tickets? Do the views go up? SMS messaging your fans, followers, people that likeactually post SMS hap uh, messaging happens almost instantaneously.
Nick Clason (18:37):
Secondly, the open rates are ridiculous. Open rates are an alarming 98%, which compared to email marketing seems like a messaging hack that is almost too good to be true and you might be right. And then finally, response rates are also good too. You can send a message and rates are are good. Around 45% of people say that they respond to text messaging, uh, messages compared to only about 7% of click rate through email marketing statistics. So those are some of the, um, upsides. Who is it for? Well definitely for, for I think younger people in your church, gen z, gen Alpha, who may only have like an email address to create an account. Um, and they don't, they only like nominally check it. Um, also for parents, um, for people in your church, people, almost everyone has a cell phone these days so you can use it.
Nick Clason (19:27):
The downfalls of it though can be tricky because you are gonna be navigating some red tape and I will drop a link in the show notes for more of that. Um, and kind of how to navigate that so that you don't get in trouble with like, um, the government and people who are trying to regulate text messaging and text messaging marketing. Um, but while that 98% open rate seems like something you may want to take advantage of it, you also want to be careful not to abuse it either. For example, um, I order my t-shirts from an, actually this is one of those t-shirts, um, from an online t-shirt company and I clicked up, I clicked on a text messaging thing, um, when I ordered to get like a discount and they text me every single day. I ignored them honestly, like I'm not, but the thing is, I'll probably go back and order from them.
Nick Clason (20:12):
And so when that time comes, I'll scroll back through my messages and see are they offering any sort of promo right now before I go back in order. However, you gotta be careful to not blur that line. So I would suggest probably somewhere between one and two times a week a absolute maximum, maybe even less. But you can, again, if you add value and you send something that's interesting, people are going to be much more inclined to open it. If you're just listen to me. If you're just sending announcement after announcement after announcement about in-person event, in-person event, in-person event, they're not interested in that. However, if you're like, Hey, have you seen this hilarious TikTok that we just posted? Check it out. People might be more inclined to click through some of those things that may seem unspiritual to you. You just have to weigh the benefit of it.
Nick Clason (20:59):
Cuz here's the thing, if you do send that a few times and that becomes something that people look forward to, then when you do send something meaningful and valuable, they're actually going to click on it and not ignore it because you've sent them things before that seem normal that aren't just invitations back to the church picnic. So the best way to start, I would say, is to build this through your database. Um, some databases require weird things like ours, church community builder, they require needing to know the carrier. So like Verizon at and t, um, others, you can, you can collect them through other text messaging services that you pay per text or whatever. Um, whatever the case may be. A great place to start is probably your church database cuz you've already gotten permission to collect some of that data and so thus to then start parcelling off and using some of that, uh, is not a bad place to start with already a base of people.
Nick Clason (21:50):
Just make sure that someone has a hook into being able to sign up for a text messaging service if that's something that, uh, they're gonna be able to want to do. Like I said, there are some rules for it. So make sure that you check those out. Link in the show notes. Last but not least, I would definitely be remiss to not mention website. You wanna have a website, um, not necessarily an app and um, our friend Brady Sheer talks about this all the time, so go search stuff on him about church apps. But you wanna have a good mobile friendly website that you can sort of operate as your central stop for everyone in your church and they can know that they can always go to that website and they can get the information that they need. So then your email and your text messaging things are not your primary vehicles and drivers of communication.
Nick Clason (22:38):
And so if someone's like, crap, where's that information? They're not having to dig back through emails and be like, is that the one? Is that the one? Is that the one? They can know that they're gonna go to your website and it's gonna be useful and reliable. And so I'm not gonna talk much on that cuz that's gonna sort of be the glue to everything in the next episode. But we can't, um, we cannot neglect and we cannot forget to talk about the importance of a good mobile friendly website that people can access on their phones at just about any given time in the world. That links and curates and pulls together all of these social media, email, tech, all these things and they all sort of swirl in and the website is your central spot where all of those are pointing back too. Well, hey everyone, thanks again so much for hanging out in this episode.
Nick Clason (23:26):
I hope you found this info about email and text messaging helpful. I know I didn't give a lot of like very like, Hey, go to this website and do it because a lot of it is gonna be dependent upon your church. So start exploring, start having those conversations and if they're not existing, hey, guess what? You are the pioneer of this. Don't let it die like it is your, uh, you. This is something that you can steward and that you can take to help spread the message of Jesus to both the people in your church. Drive them deeper down that funnel to be more devoted followers of Christ as well as helping people outside of your church connect more and more with your local church. You are doing an incredible work. Keep it up. Um, and don't forget as always to stay hybrid.
25 min

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Hybrid Ministry is complicated and hard. Or is it? How do pastors and youth pastors create a vibrant extension, not replacement, of what's already happening during their weekly church services? To…

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