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Join Marissa and Andrew Remington Rillera in the church library for today's bonus episode discussing Andrew's book Lamb of the Free: Recovering the Varied Sacrificial Understandings of Jesus's Death, his insight into the sacrificial system of the Torah, and the implications this has for our theories about atonement and family life.

Things mentioned in the episode: 

-Andrew's article on Ephesians 2

-Jesus and the Law of Moses: The Gospels and the Restoration of Israel within First-Century Judaism, by: Paul T. Sloan

-Anselm's Cur Deus Homo

-Hannah Bowman's  article From Substitution to Solidarity: Towards an Abolitionist Atonement Theology

-Peter Leithart's critique of Andrew's book

-Andrew's response to Peter's critique

Find Andrew on X/Twitter and Bluesky

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Episode Chapter Markers: 
3:21—Andrew's bio/introduction
6:23—Penal Substitutionary Atonement (PSA) defined
22:20—Is PSA "the Gospel"?
47:28—Significance of the "washing" imagery in the sacrificial system
57:13—Where did we go wrong with our understanding of this imagery?
1:01:22—What are the implications for parenting?
1:18:43—Discussion of recent social media conversation on PSA & critiques of Andrew's book

***

Connect with Marissa & Kelsey across social media

Marissa: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, YouTube, Facebook

Kelsey: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, Facebook

PreorderThe Myth of Good Christian Parenting: How False Promises Betrayed a Generation of Evangelical Families for 40% off now. 

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Join Marissa Franks Burt and Kelsey Kramer McGinnis In the Church Library as they answer your questions. In this final episode for S1, they answer: 

12:52 Q: Could you describe the survey process you used?

22:44 Q: Where on the theological/denominational spectrum do most of these resources fall? What about your book? What about your biases?

36:25 Q: Can you speak to the parallels between authoritarian parenting and penal substitutionary atonement (PSA)? 

38:25 Q:How as research/writing/podcasting affected your parenting?

50:08 Q: Have these resources set parents up for spiritual and emotional abuse? If so, how? 

You can connect with Kelsey and Marissa on social media:

Marissa: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, YouTube, Facebook

Kelsey: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, Facebook

PreorderThe Myth of Good Christian Parenting: How False Promises Betrayed a Generation of Evangelical Families for 40% off now. 

Send us a text

Join Marissa Franks Burt and Kelsey Kramer McGinnis In the Church Library to discuss Nancy and Colin Campbell's Above Rubies ministries, as well as some of their resources—The Power of Motherhood and Be Fruitful and Multiply—and their connection to CCM's Newsboys.

Mentioned in the episode: Orphan Fever: The Evangelical Movement's Adoption Obsession, by: Kathryn Joyce

You can connect with Kelsey and Marissa on social media:

Marissa: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, YouTube, Facebook

Kelsey: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, Facebook

PreorderThe Myth of Good Christian Parenting: How False Promises Betrayed a Generation of Evangelical Families for 40% off now. 

Send us a text

Join Marissa Franks Burt and Kelsey Kramer McGinnis In the Church Library for a conversation with Tia Levings, author of the best-selling memoir A Well-Trained Wife: My Escape from Christian Patriarchy.

Connect with Tia online: Facebook, Instagram, Threads, Substack

You can connect with Kelsey and Marissa on social media:

Marissa: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, YouTube, Facebook

Kelsey: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, Facebook

And Pre-order The Myth of Good Christian Parenting: How False Promises Betrayed a Generation of Evangelical Families wherever books are sold! 

Sign-up form for pre-order bonuses coming soon!

PreorderThe Myth of Good Christian Parenting: How False Promises Betrayed a Generation of Evangelical Families for 40% off now. 

Send us a text

Content Warning: This episode contains discussion of child mistreatment, abuse, and death. 

Join Marissa Franks Burt and Kelsey Kramer McGinnis In the Church Library to discuss the book To Train Up A Child, by: Michael and Debi Pearl.

You can connect with Kelsey and Marissa on social media:

Marissa: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, YouTube, Facebook

Kelsey: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, Facebook

And Pre-order The Myth of Good Christian Parenting: How False Promises Betrayed a Generation of Evangelical Families wherever books are sold! 

PreorderThe Myth of Good Christian Parenting: How False Promises Betrayed a Generation of Evangelical Families for 40% off now. 

Send us a text

Join Marissa Franks Burt and Kelsey Kramer McGinnis In the Church Library for a conversation with Sunita Theiss to discuss neurodiversity in faith communities and families

Connect with Sunita online: Instagram, LinkedIn, Substack

Mentioned in the conversation:

--Use code LIBRARY for a discount for her upcoming workshop and Q&A: Parenting PDA Children with Grace & Hope:  A Christian Perspective on Understanding, Supporting, and Raising PDA Children (8/14/25 at 9AMPT/12ET)

--Use SUNITA15 for $15 off low demand parent coaching now through 8/31/25. Learn more about Sunita's work with Amanda Diekman's team and schedule a free intro call here. 

--Accessible Church: A Gospel-Centered Vision for Including People with Disabilities and Their Families, by: Sandra Peoples

--Dr. David and Amanda Erickson of Flourishing Homes and Families and their new book The Flourishing Family

--Key Ministry resources and conference

--Kim Botto's work

--With Ministries

You can connect with Kelsey and Marissa on social media:

Marissa: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, YouTube, Facebook

Kelsey: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, Facebook

And Pre-order The Myth of Good Christian Parenting: How False Promises Betrayed a Generation of Evangelical Families wherever books are sold! 

Bookshop Amazon Barnes&Noble 

PreorderThe Myth of Good Christian Parenting: How False Promises Betrayed a Generation of Evangelical Families for 40% off now. 

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Join Marissa Franks Burt and Kelsey Kramer McGinnis In the Church Library to discuss the book Parenting: 14 Gospel Principles That Can Radically Change Your Family, by: Paul David Tripp.

You can connect with Kelsey and Marissa on social media:

Marissa: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, YouTube, Facebook

Kelsey: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, Facebook

And Pre-order The Myth of Good Christian Parenting: How False Promises Betrayed a Generation of Evangelical Families wherever books are sold! This week, Barnes & Noble is offering 25% off preorders with the code PREORDER25.

PreorderThe Myth of Good Christian Parenting: How False Promises Betrayed a Generation of Evangelical Families for 40% off now. 

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Join Marissa Franks Burt and Kelsey Kramer McGinnis In the Church Library for a conversation with Pieter Valk of Equip Ministries to discuss James Dobson's Bringing Up Boys, masculinity, and the implications of popular Christian parenting teaching for LGBT+ people.

Connect with Pieter online: Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, Twitter

Mentioned in our conversation: Equip's Parent Course

You can connect with Kelsey and Marissa on social media:

Marissa: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, YouTube, Facebook

Kelsey: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, Facebook

And Pre-order The Myth of Good Christian Parenting: How False Promises Betrayed a Generation of Evangelical Families wherever books are sold! 

Sign-up form for pre-order bonuses coming soon!

PreorderThe Myth of Good Christian Parenting: How False Promises Betrayed a Generation of Evangelical Families for 40% off now. 

Send us a text

Join Marissa Franks Burt and Kelsey Kramer McGinnis In the Church Library to discuss the Growing Kids God's Way parenting empire. In Part 2, we discuss how Gary and Anne Marie came to be popular Christian parenting experts, their curricula Growing Kids God's Way, and the controversy surrounding their methods. 

For more reading on the Ezzos, see http://ezzo.info/

"The Parent Trap," by: Jensen Davis takes an in-depth look at the Ezzos' approach

You can connect with Kelsey and Marissa on social media:

Marissa: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, YouTube, Facebook

Kelsey: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, Facebook

And Pre-order The Myth of Good Christian Parenting: How False Promises Betrayed a Generation of Evangelical Families wherever books are sold! 

PreorderThe Myth of Good Christian Parenting: How False Promises Betrayed a Generation of Evangelical Families for 40% off now. 

Send us a text

Join Marissa Franks Burt and Kelsey Kramer McGinnis In the Church Library for a conversation with Catherine McNiel and Jason Hague, authors of the book Mid-Faith Crisis: Finding a Path Through Doubt, Disillusionment, and Dead Ends.

Connect with Catherine online: Bluesky, Facebook, Instagram, Threads, Twitter/X

Connect with Jason online: Facebook

You can connect with Kelsey and Marissa on social media:

Marissa: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, YouTube, Facebook

Kelsey: Website, Substack, Instagram, Threads, Twitter, TikTok, BlueSky, Facebook

And Pre-order The Myth of Good Christian Parenting: How False Promises Betrayed a Generation of Evangelical Families wherever books are sold! 

Sign-up form for pre-order bonuses coming soon!

PreorderThe Myth of Good Christian Parenting: How False Promises Betrayed a Generation of Evangelical Families for 40% off now.