This episode of the InForm: Podcast was a free-wheeling conversation, which lasted a little over an hour, between Neil and Duke Novak. 

In the conversation, we discuss the work of Psychoanalyst Donald Winnicott and the impact that has had on how Duke and Neil Think about their own work with children and teens.

Some of the ideas that we talk about in the episodes are:

• Deprivation and institutions in group homes.
• The holding environment. 
• Fear of being dropped.
• not becoming callous as one does clinical work.
• The true self and the false self.
• And when it cuts somewhat famous quote, “ it is a joy to be hidden, and a disaster to not be found.“