Hello. Welcome to another episode of the Institute of Virtual Lunch and Learn series. Very excited today to get to talk about community. There's been so much discussion about how digital events could lead to community. And today, we have the expert, Liz Lathan from the Community Factory. Liz, welcome to the show.

Thank you so much, Jason. This is so exciting.

I can't wait to dive in. So let's start with I know you've got experiences both on the client side and on the agency side. Share with us a little bit about your perspective and how you kind of approach things, then we can we can jump in.

Yeah. Sure. So I really think that, well, from my perspective, from my background, from all the things, I think that my career started out in corporate on the brand side, Dell, IBM, lots of the Fortune five hundred types of worlds where we spent a lot of time, effort, and money creating experiences that people would come to. But we didn't spend a lot of time, effort, and money figuring out what the people would do once they got inside those experiences. And so the latter half of my career has really been helping people, once they walk through the doors that you've built for those events, actually meet each other, be each other's wingman, build community, and keep in contact after that one moment in time is over? So how do you just keep it rolling? That's what the community factory is all about and and offering communities of service to help people figure that out because we just wanna connect especially post pandemic. It's hard to go to an event and just sit and get for three days. You just wanna talk to the people, and a lot of folks have forgotten how to facilitate that.

Absolutely. Absolutely. Alright. So how did did the pandemic shape your perspective on developing community and did the influence and the influx of Event Tech shape kind of where you guys are these days or was this influence you know, were you guys doing this pre pandemic and then how did the pandemic maybe change their thinking, just to understand how you guys are approaching things?

Yeah. Sure. So, pre pandemic, we have been doing this. Actually, I would say it was an uphill battle pre pandemic. People saw the need but didn't wanna pay for the need. And then post pandemic, people are more willing to pay for it because they really, really get it. So I am in my twenty year corporate career, had go to industry events, had always gone to industry events. And after a while, when you become a little bit more senior in your career, you're going to the events less to learn from the people on stage and more to network with other folks. But the events weren't changing as our careers changed. And our industry was really go to this conference and sit and listen to some paid keynote speaker and then go to a few breakout sessions and then go to a party where the music's too loud to actually connect. So we, in twenty seventeen, some friends and I decided to try to change that and create an event that was purely peer to peer conversation. Let's take all these industry events that we're going to, learn from them, but then come to our event and actually talk. We call them spontaneous think tanks, where people get together and write on big sticky notes what the challenges are that they're trying to solve. And then take a look at those notes and start writing your name to the ones that are the challenges you've solved and can help someone else with. So the entire agenda and sessions are created by people trying to solve solve each other's problems. That was twenty seventeen, and we've been doing that ever since. So what the pandemic did for us was allow us to just learn how to do that virtually. So using Miro boards or Miro boards or things online, we can still use that sticky note construct to bring people together, solve each other's challenges, and supplement the education that they're getting in other avenues.

Very cool. I always enjoy talking to people that were playing in this world pre pandemic because I think it brings such a unique perspective as so many of us have caught up since the pandemic. How did so let me ask you. How did the influx of more event tech sort of facilitate developing communities, and what does that look like? Like, how did that change how you were implementing and utilizing the idea of community around events?

I think the virtual event tech world has been really fascinating. We spent most of our time during the pandemic only using Zoom because it was very simple to execute, very simple to enter and exit, and very simple to create breakout rooms. But when the virtual event phenomenon happened and all of these companies started creating all their virtual platforms and and creating things, It was really cool, but then when people went back to in person, you saw nobody really wanted to just do that anymore. So those technologies have really turned into, kind of three sixty five communities. They felt that they were creating communities when the events happened, but there wasn't anything to keep people going. And at the time, people didn't need to keep going. There were plenty of Slack channels and and other opportunities. But now when you get into, quote, unquote, the real world post pandemic, those virtual events are fewer and farther between because people want to gather. But what a great equalizer to have virtual programs still. You can get people without having to travel. You can get people all over the world in all different time zones, and now how do you keep them in touch? So working with some of those virtual platforms that are trying to turn into community platforms has been really interesting. You know, companies like Six Connects, which were, primarily virtual trade show platforms, are really trying to figure out a way to keep that conversation alive. And sometimes it's a challenge because companies aren't really looking to invest in something year round. But when they do, I think there's a lot of value in keeping those communities together if you have a community manager to make it happen, and that's the failure point that happens a lot.

Alright. Interesting. I've got so many questions. Let me I just wanna parse something out for our audience because we're talking obviously about virtual and hybrid, and we're kinda thrown around this community. When you talk about community, and I think I know the answer, but I wanna just kinda make sure we're very clear. You're talking about community as a associated with any kind of event. It is not a digital only as a matter of fact, I mean, based on your start, which was IRL, I assume you're looking at producing community for all types of event modalities today. Is that accurate?

Yes. So let me go through my little framework of community just to define what I think community is because it's not one or the other, and you don't have to pick, and you don't have to only be one thing. So the way that we view community, and this is a full funnel everything community, would be these five. I you can view it as a funnel. You can view it as five pillars. You can view it as a flywheel, and you'll see what I mean. So the top one, top of funnel for me is the show. And that is if you have a podcast, a YouTube channel, a a video training classes, you know, recordings like this. If you've got anything that's gonna be top of funnel that allows people in your community to be featured, people outside of your community to stumble upon it or find it or have an entry point. So that's step one. The next one, I call the the site, and the site is not your company's website. It is the asynchronous communication place where community members can go. It could be a Slack channel, Facebook group. It could be a paid, like, Mighty Network, something where people are going to find anytime day or night they can jump in and ask a question. The next one is the series of gatherings, and this is where our events come in. They can be virtual, hybrid, in person. It doesn't matter what type of gathering you're creating. The people wanna meet the people, and you have to have a regular series of gatherings even if regular only means once a year. That's okay too. That's something that people can look forward to. The next one is the sounding board, and this is your small group. Could be five people. Could be twenty people, but these are the folks that you're going to leverage their insights as your target prospects within your community. And you're gonna find out what's happening, the pulse of the industry. These are the people you're going to start featuring on that top of funnel show. These are the people that will help inspire and answer questions in your site, in your asynchronous communications, but that sounding board are kind of like your founding members. They can change out every quarter. They can change out every year, but keep that group going and keep it fresh. And then the final one, the fifth one, is the shareable moment. So what are you doing within your community that allows those communities to show their pride, or to share content from in the community outside. Creating infographics, could be swag, but something that allows people to share it inside and outside the community. So the show, the site, the series of gatherings, the sounding board, and the shareable moment. You don't need all five to make a community, but if you have a community with all five, that is a flywheel of an amazing community. If you just wanna start with one, start with a sounding board. Get twenty people together. Start a really tight knit group who then invite other people in, who then grow it that way. So there's just so many places that you can start, stop, and define community.

Wow. So many so many questions. I love it. I love the the thoroughness of it. How do you find, what's, like, the best way for an organization to start? In other words, I think that as many organizations have returned to IRL, but now we have these tools such as virtual and hybrid in our in our back pocket. And we talk a lot on this show with different organizations about what the right strategy is and, you know, when is the timeline for identifying those. I guess the same question to you in terms of community. When do you decide to build a community? Is it pre event? Is it after the event? Is it you know, I'm sure there's a a best place, but, you know, as I think people look toward twenty four and beyond and think about how to leverage their efforts, what what's your recommendation is a is a good starting point if all of that flywheel kinda seems overwhelming to some that may be watching the program?

Yeah. I think it always just like when you're creating an event. Right? It comes back to your purpose. What are you trying to accomplish? If you are trying to just start out by creating a community because you already have customers and you want them to become an advisory council and kind of feed you information about your product, and then the more people that become customers, the more people are part of your community, then you can start it with that sounding board. Start it with an event of a small group of people, bring them together virtually or in person, and then grow it from there. If you want to create a community because you want a community of practice, you know, a bunch of people within your profession to come together and kind of share thought leadership and share with each other, but you don't intend to necessarily monetize that community in any other way than sharing offers with them, you know, then that could be a bigger one. It doesn't necessarily have have your company name as a part of it. So I think when you consider, do you want a community of practice, a community of products, or a community of purpose? Which one do you want to gel, and why are you going forward? Community of practice being let's say you sell HR software. So you wanna bring together some HR professionals, and they're gonna share practices around human resources and talent management and all these things, and maybe you have an offering that can go in that community. A community of product is truly customers that are buying that HR software that you're selling. Right? So who can give you guidance and advice and insights and problems and help problem solve all around your product. And there may be some practice stuff in there, but it's truly about helping your product. And then the last one, community and purpose. So maybe you are advocating for something or lobbying for something, and so you're bringing people together to actually serve a particular purpose in the greater world that's not necessarily related to your practice or your product. So determining the the reason that you need to exist and if you're trying to monetize it or if you're trying to get goodwill.

Amazing. Is there a is there a better time in other words, is this something that or an organization is best rolling out pre event? Are they better, rolling it out right after an event when there's a built up excitement? Is there something you found that works best?

I truly, I don't think it matters. I think what really matters is how you've resourced it. So, if you've created an event to start the community in advance and get people to get to know each other by the time they get on-site to your actual event, then they're gonna feel like they've they've gelled. They're together. But it's harder. I would say, trying to get people excited, especially if you have a large amount, a couple thousand people. You've always you know, you've tried, oh, we launched the app two weeks early. Go in and start networking. No one does it because no one's thinking about your event until the day they get on the airplane to come to your event. So, I personally believe that you can tell them a community is going to be formed from the event and then design the program to let that face to face be the first time that they're really getting to know each other because now they've they've created a connection, and they really want to keep in touch. And now you say, hey. Guess what? We have a great way for you to keep in touch. Let's start with the site. Go here. It's a Slack channel. You can all stay in touch. Oh, by the way, we did a bunch of interviews on-site at the event, and that's the launch of our podcast. Wait till you see. You know? So I think that you can design it for that lightning bolt moment, lightning strike moment of the events, and then launch from there.

I love it. I think there's there's so many different ways it can go. You mentioned the idea that, if you are launching at the event, you know, you're educating people that this is forthcoming. So I I also wonder how much does this impact the idea of having community? How much does it impact how you are programming and coordinating an event in terms of scheduling content? And I guess the answer the question the follow-up to that would be, like, does it affect the first event differently than subsequent events? So does the first event get programmed differently into subsequent events, get programmed based on feedback from the community or thoughts that come up? What what what's your take?

Yeah. I think that you absolutely have to program for community because the demand gen event is different than a thought leadership event, is different from a community event. But that doesn't mean that you can't do them all in in one thing. The problem is when you get formulaic with your keynote breakout expo party, then you didn't put any time in there for community building because we're we're all guilty of it. Right? You have our lineup of speakers, the executives that need to be on stage, your parade of presidents. You've got your breakout sessions that are the the people that didn't call for papers or your sponsors that you have to kiss the ring. And then you've got your expo. Everybody's out there doing their own thing, and then you got your concerts or your one big night. Everyone gets together. The music's really loud. The alcohol's flowing. Where did you build community? So one of the things that I love, love, love to do is, start the programming with a meal. And it's difficult to scale if you have a multi thousand person event, but if you're under the, you know, three hundred person mark and you can start with some sort of family style feeling meal where people come together and you almost seat them like doesn't matter. But when you start gelling them around food and they have the small group of ten people that they got to know before the program starts, that's a super, super cool way to really get them building community. And then making sure that you're doing some sort of peer to peer. So I mentioned when we first started my sticky note thing, these spontaneous think tanks. When people first come in, if you can hand them sticky notes and have a big blank wall and just say write every challenge that you're trying to solve, one per sticky note, and just fill that wall of woes with your challenges. Now people start connecting over, oh my gosh. That's mine. And they see it. Same problem, different logo, and they're really having conversations while they're looking at the board. It's not something to do and just have up throughout the event. It's something to do in that, kind of catalyzing moment. You get thirty minutes, everyone together, make it loud, make it fun, and have people start talking. These are the little things that you just need to put inside your programming to start getting people talking to each other.

How do you blend that idea? I mean, I love that idea of around the meal. It gets people talking. They now have the space of people they can connect with, figuring that they're using some sort of event tech, some sort of software. We don't have to talk about names. We can, but how do you transition that experience in person? The sticky note idea, the family style meal, that sense of ownership of being a part of this community. How do you what's the secret sauce to transitioning that into the digital world and and getting people to engage digitally and then connect in that community on an ongoing basis?

Yeah. I think that there's so many sticky note tools that exist. You know, we tend to use MURAL, but we've used MURAL as well for that same sticky note feeling. So you bring everybody together virtually. You start with your, kind of direction setting keynote conversation, and then you ask people to click this link, jump into the board, and you, you know, have it nicely designed and built out to ask specific questions and move your attendees through the questions. And as the question is up there, they're adding sticky notes to it. So a very targeted specific question, and you're getting insights and answers. And so all of those insights that you're getting can either feed peer to peer conversations that will happen later in your event, or they feed your editorial calendar for all of your future round tables and sounding board discussions and content that you're going to create. So really just view it as content creation but leveraging the people instead of leveraging just the brains inside your company.

Oh, okay. That's I love it. I think probably people that are listening and watching this are probably they'll go through their mind. They're They're saying, wow. This sounds like a lot of work. It it's gonna require more resources and more team members to manage. I you know, I don't wanna we don't have to get specific on budget, but can you shed a little light on, is this something that does require a lot of resources? Does it not? Can it be self managed? Is it best with a third party? Does it even present revenue opportunities for those that are creating these communities? So does it become something that pays for itself? I'm I'm curious.

Yeah. I think it, again, depends on those goals and objectives. If you're really just trying to test out creating community at one of your events, you've got a hundred person event, Just either doing it yourself and bringing in some of the sticky notes and Sharpies and, you know, we can just show you what that process is like and you can do it, get some insights. Doesn't have to cost you anything. You don't have to do anything with it. It's just a feeling that you created the event all the way to bringing in facilitators like us. You know, you can spend fifteen, twenty fifth twenty five thousand dollars and have us come in and help create the program and design it, facilitate it, keep the energy up, and see it, take all those sticky notes and turn them into your editorial calendar for you and feed that back to you. And then afterwards, there's community as a service. Right? So either you put one community manager internally to manage that Slack channel and to keep people engaged and to let people know when the next webinar is or when the next online roundtable is or outsource that to a community as a service provider that can just put an admin toward it. You have to have someone inside your company as the leader. It doesn't work to have a leaderless, faceless community. Absolutely, someone must be the talent. But that doesn't mean that that person has to administer the community. So whether it's a virtual assistant, a cast company like ours, or, you know, a a marketing manager that is able to dedicate half their time to just doing the administrative stuff. You have to onboard the community members, welcome them in. Maybe you're sending them a welcome gift or maybe it's just a postcard, but there's that administrative part. I do feel like ninety percent of community management is administrative, and ten percent is really that talent energizing, catalyzing moment. So figuring out what your budget is, what you can afford, and just how big you wanna go. I think that there are solutions from zero to a million dollars a year. You know?

Absolutely. Yeah. I wanna get to some some DIY tips here just to to close out. But before we do, can you share an example of where you guys have done this? I'm curious, like, you know, we've talked theoretically here, and we've talked about the Event Tech and and the possibilities. But can you give us a real concrete example of a project that you guys have done? Again, feel free to mention or not mention client name. For me, it's less about that, but more about what the experience was that you created and so that our audience can picture this holistically.

Sure. Absolutely. We just had a client a couple weeks ago that wanted to create their very first advisory council. So they had sixty five people. They were partners and customers and employees that they brought together, and they invited us in to help facilitate that experience. And so it was helping them manage the the event logistics portion of it. Right? Getting people invited and making sure the venue was the right type of venue for collaboration and not just a windowless ballroom. It's really a place that has actually lots of windows and lots of natural light, and the ability to feel like it's an open environment is the first thing. So helping figure that out. Then once you get the people in the room, starting it out with that breakfast as they first come in, and really doing the sticky note thing of everyone putting their challenges up and asking specific questions along those beautiful windows to get insights for the company. So once we figured all of that out, then they have their, executives coming in and sharing road map discussions and having some panel discussions with partners. And then the afternoon is taking what we found on those sticky notes and creating peer to peer sessions led by the partners and by the internal clients with the customers being able to contribute and solve problems for each other. The interesting thing is our client did not they're a technology company, but they did not direct all of the challenges to be technology challenges they needed to solve. They let the customers share what challenges they were truly trying to solve, and they were all at a business level, which was extremely surprising to the client. But they didn't stop it. They didn't try to go put a tech solution into it. They let the customers actually have these really high level business conversations. And afterwards, they kinda said, you know, we we didn't know that that would work. That was really scary for us. But now that we've seen all of our competitors are going after every single person with a technology solution to their problems, but we were able to get in at a really high level conversation. We can change how we talk to these customers. We can change what our messaging is, and we can have a more peer to peer conversation and a less of a sales conversation knowing the sales will come later. So that first advisory council not only gave them the insights they needed, created loyalty with the customers, but gave them a new direction of how to talk talk to their customers and how to roll out more content. So from there, we're helping them put together those quarterly gatherings virtually of how to keep this group together. And then how do you expand the advisory council and make it a little bit larger without crossing the bridge and making it just a big giant conference? So now working with them on the strategy of what's an advisory council, what's a kind of quarterly meetup, and then what's now a new conference that they didn't think they needed but they could grow.

Very cool. I mean, it establishes the trust. It builds the relationship. It makes a lot of sense. When you think about an event like that from the Event Tech side, if we've got people that are you know, their ears are perking up, they're realizing this is something they should start exploring. What are some tips you can offer them both on the event tech side? What should they be thinking about? But also strategically, what are some you know, they're they're looking to take either an existing hybrid or virtual or or IRL event, and they wanna start developing this community. What are those baby steps they should take? Because, obviously, you know, it seems like that might be the right way to start this slowly. So what would you recommend?

Yeah. So I think you take this example that we just went through, and they have choices now. They've had an in person event. And so their choice now is, do we just do something in Slack and let people talk? Or do we go invest in a virtual solution that will allow our quarterly events that we now wanna have to be inside a community platform? And so if you go look, there's there's community tools and then there's virtual event tools that offer community. And so how big and robust do you wanna grow, and are you going towards, I wanna focus more on it being an event platform where people stay in touch, or I wanna focus on it being a community platform where events are part of the community. So this is a a pricing and a a strategy decision to go make. But now these virtual programs can really feel like they have a wrapper around them and feel like part of the community, so you get that community hug. I think separate from that, if you're just creating the event, so now we start to think about, oh, they wanna create a real conference, and while they have sixty five people in the advisory council, the real conference could probably have this first one, three hundred people to it. And if we're going to go hybrid with it, is that hybrid now just a live stream of the main sessions, or is it a true hybrid event where the online folks are having kind of their own separate community building experience while the in person folks are having their own community building experience? And I often think about, like, the Oscars. You know, that's I I view that as the ultimate hybrid event because you and your home viewing audience can just sit on the couch and watch the Academy Awards happen, or you can go to a viewing party where people get dressed up just like they were there, watch the whole thing, and celebrate. Or you can be on-site having that red carpet experience and going to all the parties and getting your swag bag. And so figuring out really what tech you want and what experience you want is is kind of the sixty four thousand dollar question. Right?

Yeah. No. Absolutely. I I think I love that analogy I often use if I put on my production half for a second. I usually use the sports analogy of the Super Bowl can can be consumed so many different ways, and I think you're right with the award shows. My my last question for you is thinking about creating community and thinking about the different modalities that you might do that and the looks and feels of that. How important? Because there's obviously been so much discussion, especially in the event professional community around event tech and the different feature sets and the different options that are out there. But when you start talking about this, how import how do you balance the idea of creating something that is a resource, that's a branded experience, that brings people together and keeps you in touch and creates that three sixty five community versus meeting where they already are, and you've mentioned a few times here the idea of Slack. Obviously, it's a different thing, but it might be where they're already active for their for work. So Yeah. You know, how do you decide which direction to go? Do you use a platform that specifically has a certain feature set, or do you meet them where they are? Maybe it's a little less branded, a little bit less feature rich, but it keeps you in front of them. How do you determine what the right approach is?

I'll say for most of our clients, it's budget. You know, at the moment, they're they're not paying for Slack because they're just starting their community. So they're doing the free version of Slack, which means that everything gets erased after ninety days. And so you cannot keep that going, but you just want a place for people to meet almost in in asynchronous but in short periods of time, and you're you're not trying to make an archive out of it. Once they hit that tipping point and they realize, oh, people are looking for conversations that happened more than three months ago, Now you have to consider either paying for Slack because they're there or moving to a community platform. I think that if your clients are corporate clients, Slack is very easy for them. They've already got it in, you know, as a tool that they're using. If your clients are not corporate, maybe their association, or people that aren't regularly using something like Slack, moving them to a platform might be an easier switch because it doesn't feel like a switch. It's just a, oh, I'm in this thing now. And I think that that's a solid option, but all of the platforms have a cost to them once you start to move into a fully contained thing. So you have to have the money for it, and some of them, you know, are upwards of fifteen thousand dollars a year. So really starting with what you can invest, what you're willing to invest, and how much time and effort you want to invest in getting the people over to it. I love I I'm part of some communities that are Mighty Network, that are Circle, and a couple of others. And they're great, but I don't often think to go there. Whereas Slack, I have up all the time, and all my Slack communities I'm really active in, all my ones that I have to go to, I think about it maybe once a week, once every two weeks. And so that's also something to manage.

Yeah. No. Absolutely. It's exactly what I was thinking. And I think you're right. You just gotta figure all that out and balance it depending on the use case. I said that was the last question, but I lied because I had one follow-up from earlier. We I I mentioned this in the question. I don't know if we really address it, but is there the opportunity for these communities to actually become sources of revenue? So does that and, you know, one the first question is, is that possible? And the second question is, does that then change how you think about these things strategically?

Yeah. So I think three ways to monetize your community is to consider, and one of them is just straight up charging membership fees. It's probably the hardest way to monetize unless you've already proven value, but it's, definitely a way to monetize. I think the the second one is to have a free community but then sell sponsorships into your community, and that allows you to actually make the community run. But if you want it to be your own proprietary community where you're not doing those things, then investing your own company money into the community and using it to run campaigns in there and offer community members discounts, first available opportunities to get into things, VIP access to certain events. But managing those campaigns within the community allows you to see that you will probably get significantly higher revenue from the members of your community than just from gen pop, right, the general population that you're marketing to. And so building that community creates loyalty and reminds them that you exist and continues to give them opportunity to buy more things from you. So I think those are the three paths I would consider.

Awesome. Liz, thank you so much for sharing your insights today. I I it's just so interesting to me what, you know, what we can do. And I love that you guys are doing this in twenty seventeen, and now you've got these digital tools that are helping usher further along. If people wanna learn more about you, your work, connect with you, how can they do so?

Absolutely. So I'm on LinkedIn. I live and breathe it. Liz Lathan on LinkedIn. And then the community factory .com Is our site. We do run two of our own proprietary communities as well. So if you're in the event profession, we have Club Ichi, which you can find on our Community Factory website. And if you're in more broad marketing or head of marketing, we have team CMO. The free version is for all marketers, and then the paid version is just for heads of marketing. But so that kinda gives you the opportunity not only to connect with other folks, but see how this year round community should be run.

Awesome. Awesome. Thank you again, Liz, for your time. We really appreciate it on behalf of our members that are watching and learning so much from you today. Really appreciate it.

Thank you so much for having me. This was fun.

Absolutely. If you're working on something in the event space, whether you're event tech or if you're marketing or if you're planning for twenty twenty four, you wanna share your experiences, maybe you've learned some important lessons over the last year or two. We'd love to hear from you. Shoot us an email. We'd love to have you on the show because we're really looking here to build our community to use Liz's, vernacular so that we can share more with everybody out there as everybody marches forward, and we continue reinventing the industry. So thank you so much for joining us today. We'll see you again real soon here on another episode of the Institute of Virtual Lunch and Learn series. Have a great day.

 

Hello. Welcome to another of the Institute of Virtual Lunch and Learn series. Very excited today to be speaking with Becca Mazur, senior principal consultant from Cvent Consulting. Becca, welcome to the show.

Happy to be here, Jason. Thanks for having me.

Absolutely. I'm looking forward. I know we had a conversation a couple weeks ago before the recording date here. And, you know, I know you bring a lot of knowledge to the table, a lot of different perspectives. Can you share a little bit of your background so our audience understands your perspective?

Yes. Absolutely. So I very recently came to Cvent on the Cvent Consulting team, but, you know, it's quite a journey to get here. Early in my career, I was actually in entertainment of all things. Realized that wasn't exactly where I wanted to be, but was planning events on the side. And unbeknownst to me at the time, this was a whole career. So took the plunge, went into events professionally, started on the planning side, you know, heavy into the logistics of things. I ended up, working at a few agencies along the way. So I had that great agency experience. And then I was fortunate enough to go in house, post agency, into a company called Cognizant. Worked on, you know, their flagship event for many years. Pandemic happened. As we all know, that that impacted things a lot, which I'm sure we'll get to. And it really gave me the opportunity to dive into more of an event strategy role focused around event technology and how to just make processes better, you know, make make make sure we're using tools better. And yeah. So I I turned that into, you know, leading event technology over at Cognizant. And that led me to Cvent, where I'm on the consulting team there doing a very similar role instead of working in house for one client, or for one company, I get to do the same thing for lots of clients. So it's great, and I love it.

That's awesome. And and and strategy and event tech are a huge huge thing right now. So I think a lot of our viewers are probably watching and thinking about what their events look like. And I think the tech stack and the idea of how to integrate and use technology, obviously, the pandemic, you know, it really ushered in this new era of technology and virtual, and that's obviously led to hybrid. But to your kind of experience, it's been around for a while. It's been developing slowly in the background. What's your perspective on that? Like, what's that development look like over the last couple years?

Of of just event technology in general? Well

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. So, yeah, I mean, obviously, webinars have been around for a while. We're we're never really considered events though. You know what I mean? Webinars were always more of a marketing channel that was meant to just push information out, more demand generation. Well, pandemic happened. Everything became digitized. Everything was online. Events became virtual. So that in and of itself shifted the way we thought about webinars and virtual events as a whole. But in general, the digitization of events allowed us to see how much data we had and the amount of data we could get from events. You know? In the in the past, we were used to registration data. Who who registered? Who showed up? Maybe a feedback survey with, you know, questions that were, you know, maybe different, from one event to the next. So there was no really good way to measure events. So all of this data came out of the pandemic, I would say, and

Interesting. Yeah.

Everything moving to virtual. So, you know, really accelerated events, into a marketing channel in and of itself. I think they were always there, and they were always on the cusp, or they were always utilized, but really, really recently becoming a bonafide channel. So, you know, with that said, the data the data is overwhelming. Go ahead. Yeah.

Yeah. So, I mean, let's talk about the data a little bit, and it maybe deviates a little bit from where we were thinking of of going here. But, there is so much data. It's been such a hot topic. But I think for some, they don't necessarily recognize the amount of data and the kinds of data. So you mentioned registration data. But when you dive deeper, you know, there's other metrics. Talk can

you talk to to

to to us a little bit about some of those things that you take into account now?

Oh my gosh. Yeah. I mean and and again, there are things that we hadn't really thought about before. Engagement data, I would say, is the key, and that's, you know, where the events channel itself shines is the ability to meet people where they are and cultivate these real relationships and learn to get to know your audience in a way that is very personal, and in a way that you know that the content that you're presenting is or is not hitting. You're not gonna get that from a click or from a website visit necessarily. So the data that we have kind of uncovered from this virtualization of events allows us to see what's working, what's not working, and make really data informed decisions as we move forward in planning our events, in setting our objectives, in setting KPIs, which we can get into, the, a plethora of metrics that are available, now than ever before. And and the importance of setting key objectives, right, for your events. There's so much information that you can get, but you don't need it all. You know, a lot of it is nice to have. It's not necessarily need to have. You know, if if your, if your goal is to get a ton of new leads from a demand generation virtual event or webinar, you need to know what's happened. You can't just see who's signing up and who is attending. You need to know what's happening with that information after the event. And I know that we could go down a whole rabbit hole after this. So you let me know where you want me to go.

Yeah. No. I think I think I actually think it's really interesting because I think there are so many pieces of data, so many KPIs that you can pull. But I really like what you just said, and I think it's important for our audience to think about is you don't need them all. You have to think I guess, let me ask you. I guess you have to think about which ones are applicable for your event or for what your event goals are. Is that like, if you're planning, how do you think about what data to look at without getting overwhelmed and having decision paralysis based on how much information is available?

It's honestly that's why it's so important to set those objectives upfront because the the data and the metrics aren't gonna drive the objectives. It's gonna be the other way around. So if you know what what success looks like for your event, you'll be able to find out what metrics will help you determine whether or not your event was a success. So let me give you a good example. So let's take a virtual event or a webinar if we're, you know, since Sure. Since that's more like this format. Not only do you know who attended, you know, how long they watched for, you know, if they watched live or they watched on demand, you know, these are all things that are gonna help inform not only decisions on how you format and make and make your events better, but you're gonna get, this detailed information on each person individually that is attending or is not attending or is joining in live or is waiting to watch on demand or, you know, best case scenario, joins live and then watches again because, you know, they they enjoy the content so much or they wanna revisit it. All of these things are gonna help you, you know, connect with your audience a lot better and personalize your, your future communications with them, the way you develop your relationships with them. You get to know them on a more personal level, and the event technology side of it helps you automate all of that so it's not as overwhelming.

Okay. So that was gonna be my my follow-up here is that if we have more data on each particular participant, does it change the framework in which we communicate with all those people? Absolutely. Okay. Alright. So

So gone are the days where you would just send a thank you email to everybody that attended. Now, you know, like I said, who who signed up and who didn't sign up. So already, you can quickly segment into two very simple list. I'm sorry you missed it. And that message is very different than I'm so glad you joined us. Very different, you know, messages. Same, you know, same thing you're sending them. You know, maybe you're sending the people that joined, more content because you know how much they're interested. Maybe you're sending the people that missed it a link to on demand. And then after they watch that on demand, then you send them a link to more content. So, basically, you're able to, based on, different engagements that people have, with your event, you're able to do you know, you're able to segment that audience in a way to personalize the communication that goes to them.

Okay. So with so much data accessible, it begs the question, like, how does this impact strategy when you're in the planning phases, and figuring out what kind of event to produce, virtual or hybrid or IRL, how do you take that into account as you're kind of thinking about strategic options?

Sure. I mean, the biggest thing is to know your audience. Right? I mean, know what's gonna resonate with them. So in addition to the objectives, obviously, you're gonna produce a very, very different event if your goal is peer to peer networking than if you are doing demand generation. Right? So one, it's important to know why you're doing the event that you're doing. And two, it's important to know your audience really well. You know, identify the personas, if you can, of of who makes up that audience and understand, dig in to what is gonna resonate with that audience and how they're you're gonna engage them in the best way possible. You know, if you're going virtual, if you find that that is the best strategy for you based on, you know, the the type of, content you wanna deliver, based on the fact that it it you wanna reach a larger global audience as opposed to hyperlocal. And if networking isn't as critical, that's more more critical, about the content and about the information you wanna get out. I mean, that's gonna be a virtual event. And and you're gonna wanna make sure that you have engagement opportunities throughout, you know. It's no longer about a talking head as we're talking heads right now.

Yes. Yes.

But it's no longer about that as much. You know, what's great is to add elements of engagement throughout. So, I mean, I wish there was something beyond, you know, the the polls and the q and a, but right now, that

is, you

know, where we're at.

But even there, there's a

But even there. Yeah.

Yeah. Right? Exactly. Because you can see what the frequently asked questions are. You can see where in the cadence of an event people are asking questions. You can sense, like, when their curiosity is peaked and what topics are triggering questions. So I think even there, there is information to be gathered even.

Absolutely. It's just it's so important. And there and there are also and I could go down. I know what we'll put maybe we should put a pin in this because I would love to talk more about just webinar format as a whole and how that's changed and, you know, how to increase engagement without sacrificing production and all of that. So let's put a pin in that.

Fair enough.

Wanna know just about, you were talking a little bit more about KPIs and and strategy help. Yeah.

Yeah. And I think my question is for people that are watching because I think we've got people that are watching that are, you know, sort of revising their digital strategy. Maybe people that are first adopting, maybe they sat out during the pandemic, and they're starting to integrate these tools more. So I think the question I have for you is how do you've been doing this for a while. I've been working on the event tech side of things. How do people start in the shallow end? You know, a lot of times people come in with grandiose ideas, but how do you help an organization say, start out slowly and start using these tools and not getting overwhelmed by the data?

Okay. So first of all, no one should ever be overwhelmed by data. Data is your friend, and and it's only gonna help you. Right? It's it's figuring out, you know, how how you're gonna use it. That's important, of course. But in terms of starting on the shallow end from a virtual perspective, you know, one, know that the tools are out there. The tools were not always out there. You know? Sure. Even Zoom wasn't there. Like, in the way that it is today. Right. Just a few years ago. So there's that is one thing. But, you know, don't be afraid to start on tools like that, tools that you use day to day, because, you know, that's your familiarity. And that that's that's where, you know, in terms of, like, starting slow. Get comfortable with including engagement. You know, tools like Zoom, Teams, all of that do allow for for q and a, for chat, for, for polls, you know, opportunities. So make sure you're just getting your feet wet in engaging the audience in a two way discussion. Even if it's not audio two way, as long as they're participating and engaging, you'll know if a chat lights up that what you're saying is resonating. You'll know if a poll is, you know, heavily participated in Sure. That people are engaging. And polls, by the way, super easy. I mean, you're on LinkedIn, you scroll by, you see a poll. It's really hard not to participate in poll. So it's just a very, like, low stakes way to make sure, that people are engaging with your content. I think that's great.

That's a great point too. Use the technology that you're familiar with. Exactly. I know you have a really strong opinion, actually. Let's talk about that, about webinars and sort of changes that have, happened from the pandemic. So, here's your moment. I know you you said to me before, you really wanna make sure you share your perspective on webinars and and how they're done these days. So, tell us what your thoughts are on webinars and production.

Yeah, absolutely. The pandemic changed the game. We, you know, we we came into a place where we could do nothing except experience things from the comfort our of our own homes. And everybody needed to do something to set their events apart, especially when they were in the virtual space. So these tools really, really grew and and expanded and became it became possible to create webinars that are a high production value now. Before, we didn't have tools to do that. We didn't have the desire to do that. Now it's demanded of us to do that. So, yes, you can dip your toe in, go in the shallow, and get used to the engagement side of this new era of webinars. But really, when you dive into to the new tools that are available, you see what's possible. You can see on this right now, there's, you know, lower thirds. You can do that in a Teams resume. Maybe one day you can. Sure. But, you know, these things that make, a webinar more like a newscast, more like, you know, an interview. And let me tell you, most field marketers or demand gen marketers that are used to running webinars pre pandemic are not necessarily equipped to produce what's expected of a webinar now. So one thing I did when I was at Cognizant was I really, really pushed to have a producer on every webinar we did. You know? Yes. You want them to be easy. Yes. You want them to be turnkey. Yes. There are solutions that do allow you to have that high production value without having a producer, but I'll tell you, it makes a world of a difference. So if you do have it in your budget to bring on someone that will just run the board, run the the room, if you will, so you can focus on the content, so you could focus on the speakers and less about the run of show. You know, let a producer let someone who's used to doing that in person in for live events. They're going to be your best asset when it comes to upping the production value of your webinars and making sure that, you know, you do stand out from a sea of of competitors when it comes to this space, you know, it makes a difference. And it's not it's not even just about the tool you're using, that production element. Just having a run of show makes a difference. Just having, you know, preparing, having a, you know, a rehearsal, making sure that everybody, especially if you're having, like, multiple speakers, that everybody has a good connection, that everybody is centered the way they need to be. I I know we did a little of that before we got started. You know, it's just so important because it is gonna change the audience perception of of the end result.

Yeah. Well, look, I I hold no no punches. I I come from the production side, have a production company. So we you you know, you're speaking my language. I couldn't agree more. And I think, you know, it's it's important for people to hear that it's not there's multiple ways to attack getting into this and upping your game. It it could be content. It could be an interaction. It could be production. There's different ways to go about this. And I think that insight is tremendous. You mentioned your previous experience at Cognizant and bringing on producer and doing, enhanced webcast or webinars. Can we talk a little bit you just recently joined, Cvent Consulting. So can we just so we understand, what are you doing in that role and what's and what is your, daily response your responsibility?

Sure. Yeah. So less around the webinar side of things, more around the total event program side of things. So, what I didn't mention is, you know, I didn't go into too much detail on. So at Cognizant, I had the opportunity to really streamline the way that we were doing events end to end. So not just the planning of the event, but, you know, how we were capturing the event in the marketing mix, and making sure that was happening consistently across our event program. You know, having a data strategy going into every event we did to make sure not only were we ensuring that data was captured, but data was captured in every element of, you know, our participation at all of those events in a way that, that made sure that we were gonna get the information, on the attendees, on the leads in the most timely way possible. So, you know, the next part of that was ensuring that our systems were integrated. One that, you know, we were using tools in in a, you know, in a smart way. We weren't, you know, all over the place and that and and everybody using different tools, but consolidating tools to make sure that we were set up for optimal integration. Really, really making everything run like clockwork from that point on, allowing the company to get really, really solid, accurate data from their events that they could use to inform decisions, to activate the data over to sales, to, you know, measure the data, to, you know, plug data into dashboards, all of that, just to make sure that, you know, end to end, it was a well oiled machine, cross functional teams collaborating together. So those are the types of things I did at Cognizant. Mhmm. Now, you know, I was in search of the next great opportunity, the next great company to be able to, you know, impart that type of experience on. And, you know, c vet was a a tool that I used

Sure.

Every day when I was at Cognizant and really helped me to shape what that strategy was, from an event efficiencies standpoint and automation standpoint. Well, little did I know, Cvent has, an incredible consulting team within the organization that does just that for their clients. So working with clients to ensure they're fully leveraging their event.

That's cool.

Inclusive of Cvent , you know, providing solutions on everything from streamlining their event processes to designing purposeful integrations based on their requirements, of course, and just elevating their overall program performance for long term impact. So that's what I'm doing now, and it's it's awesome.

So when you draw on that experience, you're you know, maybe you're talking to a new client. And what what's, a little tidbit maybe you share with them that you've learned over the last couple of years that has helped to streamline that total event experience, but also taking into account the event tech stack and sort of thinking about these tools. What what's something that you know, piece of advice that you might share with our listeners and our viewers as they think about preparing for their twenty twenty four initiatives?

Sure. I mean, it's all about having a common perspective and alignment between cross functional teams, especially when it comes to things like events. Because so many different parts of the organization touch events, and while it might seem overwhelming to get alignment there, it just needs a little bit of initiative. Right? And and the resource. Right? If you don't have the resource in house, obviously, you can call on to, I think, that consulting to help, you know, kind of kick start that. But it's really about just taking stock of your current state and knowing that there is such an opportunity to make things easier, to make things easier on your planners, to capture things in a way that is consistent. And more importantly than ever, as budgets are getting cut, a true opportunity to prove the value of what you're doing to leadership. Because at the end of the day, it's the bottom line. At the end of the day, it's ROI, however you wanna define that. But, you know, putting this all together and investing the the time just to make sure that everybody is aligned and your processes and systems are aligned, it's gonna pay off dividends in the end and and really help you be a more strategic player in the organization as a whole, and make sure that, you know, events are really seen as the, you know, incredible drivers of of of business as they are. Events, when I say, you know, events, I'm not just talking in person events, you know, just to, you know, bring this full circle, you know, webinars are virtual events. And this is a whole world of, and this is a whole world, that we need to make sure is connected in your ecosystem. So, yeah, I would say if I was talking to a client now and they were in complete disarray, you know, there's an opportunity here. And not only is it gonna make your life a lot easier, but it's gonna help you see the true value of what you're doing.

Yeah. And it strikes me it it's kind of very simple advice in a sense, but it's fantastic advice because if you can even if you could have all parties aligned internally, I think, if everyone understands the power of the event, what it's going to do for the overall organization, have buy in. I think it probably makes the process easier because everyone's charging the same direction.

So Absolutely. We're all working together. We're all on the same team. You know?

Yeah. Yeah. Far too often, I think they're seen as, like, this other thing that's happening. Oh, I have to participate. Well, it's it's going to benefit you,

in many ways. So And now we know and now we know the how. Not just the you know? It's

true. Alright. Eye on the clock as we look to wrap up. Where do you see the industry going in the future? Like, you've been working you know, I I always like speaking with folks like yourself because you've been working on the Event Tech side beyond, you know, pre pandemic even. Obviously, many people jumped in during the pandemic, which is excellent. Lots of innovation happening. But, you know, you've seen a little bit longer tail. Where do you see or hope that the industry will go, with this bigger adoption? I I

I I mean, I think we're seeing it. I think something like the pandemic really helped us understand and value how much we craved in person interaction and just interaction in general. So, you know, I think I'm hopeful that, you know, we're we're on an upward trajectory from here. But I think, you know, technology caught up and is is now, you know, on that same trajectory. We're not slowing down and expectations are high, for anyone that attends events now. So my hope is that innovation keeps happening. Things that are happening in the world of technology make their way into events. You know, we hear the word AI, you know, and how's that gonna impact events, but just, you know, knowing that we are an industry that's keeping up now as as opposed to one that maybe just kind of got comfortable, in doing the same type of things the same way. I really see an opportunity for technology to make a huge impact on events going forward. And I'm excited to see what happens and and be a part of of leading that change, for sure.

Absolutely. I'm looking for an AI avatar to host this show. So if anyone out there

Oh, yeah. In terms of something, let let me know. There's some stuff out there. Let me tell you. That's a whole another.

There is.

There is.

Yes. Absolutely. On the production side, we use some AI already. It's kind of incredible. Becca, a pleasure to get to chat with you. If people wanna learn more about you, your current role with Cvent Consulting, how can they find you?

Sure. The easiest way is LinkedIn. Becca Mazur is my name, and it's also the, you know, the the tail of my LinkedIn handle. So linkedin dot com slash becca mazer, m a z u r. But love, love, love to connect. I love meeting new people. I love networking, and I love just helping others as much as I can. Paying it forward. Awesome.

Awesome. Well, Becca, thank you again for joining us. We'll have you again on the show at some point. Thank you so much for sharing.

We'd love to join again. Thank you so much.

Absolutely. Thank you for sharing so many of your insights. If you have a a story, a success story, or you're driving technology, you wanna share your perspective on where events are, we wanna hear from you. We want you to join the program. Feel free to shoot us a note here. Otherwise, we'll see you again real soon here on another episode of the Institute of Virtual Lunch and Learn series. Thanks for joining us today. Have a great day.

 

Hello, and welcome to another episode of the Institute of Virtual Lunch and Learn series. Before we jump into today's conversation, I wanted to invite anyone watching to share their perspective on what's going on in the industry. Lots of changes, lots of redefining of activities. We'd love to hear from you and have you as a guest on the future show. So, just shoot us an email at the information below. But today, very excited to talk about all things operations with Jitter, Garcia Jitter. Welcome to the show.

Thank you, Jason. Thank you so much for having me. I'm excited to be here.

Absolutely. I'm looking forward to the conversation. So, it's always good to start with a little bit of background. Tell us a little bit about your career, where you come from, kinda your perspective. I know you're with Entire Productions now, but love to kinda get a sense as to, what your perspective is on things.

Yeah. Absolutely. Well, my experience in the event industry really started out working on the brand side. I started out working at Dow Jones and The Wall Street Journal. That was my very first introduction into the events world. And there, I was the only events person on the marketing team having very little experience before that. So being on my own, it was very tough, but also really amazing to kinda get thrown into the events industry and getting that experience. Eventually, I landed on a full event team at what is now Warner Brothers Discovery and later at another events team at Univision. And that experience really led me to love the events world even more, being able to, you know, bounce ideas off of other people who are like minded and and learn from them. At Univision, I worked my way up to VP of event marketing and brand experiences, providing me a very different experience altogether in that my responsibilities really shifted from being in the weeds on planning to focusing on the company's overall event strategy and how to find a balance between delivering a business message and entertaining their audience through every touch point. I was there for seven years. And then most recently, I made the big move from the East Coast to the West Coast, and I'm now very happy to be on the agency side as VP of operations at the experiential event and entertainment production company Entire Productions. My role here has now afforded me the opportunity to grow even more, you know, shifting from overseeing the production of events, the strategic, side of client event strategy, to overseeing operations for an event company as a whole. So a lot of a lot of different types of experiences always within the event industry, and and very grateful for my career journey.

Very cool. Very cool. I think there's probably folks that are watching now that are at all versions of those, levels. Some on single member teams and those that are on larger teams. And I I think actually that helps blend to the conversation because, you know, we are talking to an industry that does handle events in many different capacities. So, you know, those that are doing things alone or part of a bigger bigger outfit, you know, different ways that things are operating. So, to start today, I I was curious. What are you seeing currently now that you're on the agency side? Mhmm. You know, we're we're recording here late December, twenty three. So looking into twenty four, and as people are starting to think about what they're gonna do by the time this lands in front of our audience, it'll be early next year. What what are you kind of seeing people are thinking about and starting to implement 04:24?

Yeah. You know, my first observation really has been that there's a lot more hesitation from clients. There's shorter lead times, smaller budgets. So the hesitation comes with actually green lighting these events. You know, of course, every industry has been impacted differently. The entertainment space has obviously had a tough year with the strikes, and and events were directly impacted by that. And yet I'm even seeing within the tech and health care communities that those industries are slower to green light events too. I think it's just the world we live in now post pandemic and and everything that's going on that's impacting that, you know, willingness to just move forward right away. So that's something that I've been seeing a a lot more of these days.

How do you handle shorter lead times and Mhmm. From from most conversations I'm having, it seems that events are also getting more complex because there's any number of different varieties of events. So when I hear more complicated and shorter timelines and longer to green light things, How are you handling that? And I think that might be really insightful for our audience who's also probably working on different lead times and trying to figure out how they can tackle events as well.

Yeah. There's definitely been, a transition period. You know, one of the things I've been focusing on at entire is working to get the team in a proactive state. I think that because we as a as an industry have been pushed to this very reactive state where because things are short you know, lead times are shorter, budgets are smaller, and the clients are are less ready to move forward, when before the pandemic in an earlier time, you know, it was a lot easier to kind of, bring them to that conclusion. We are now pushed to be, again, very reactive. So what I'm focusing now on is trying to set the team up for success and trying to anticipate these changes, to anticipate these longer lead times, and and make them more proactive. There again, there's a transition period for that where we have to kind of tackle the things that are on our plate now as well as seeing the things that are coming at us within a month at a time. So we can't really get to a proactive state until, you know, three to six months, in time. So it has been challenging, but I do have an optimistic outlook on it because, again, having this embracing change is what's going to allow us to to get there.

Absolutely. And and when you're working with your internal team, but also being proactive with clients that are hesitating, that are concerned having shorter timelines that obviously are being budget sensitive, how do you you know let's pretend we were in a a pitch call or in a meeting to discuss twenty twenty four plans. And what are, I guess, two questions sort of in one. What are the objections you're hearing? And then what are you offering as counsel that is helping people feel comfortable with moving forward?

Yeah. That's an interesting question. This is something that I also felt, not just at entire, but in previous positions as well, that post pandemic, what we're really needing to do is educate our internal stakeholders, or, excuse me, clients. I've always been on the on the brand side, so I still have a habit of calling them internal stakeholders. But, really, just with whether they're internal clients or external clients, the the majority of our job as events people is to educate them on what is most important when making these decisions about their events. Right? That I feel like is something that we didn't really have to do as much, before. But because budgets are being scrutinized so intensely, we now have to educate, these stakeholders on how their budgets are being allocated, what is, you know, going to be utilized the most for the for the for the money that they're, allocating to these experiences, you know, our recommendations and suggestions for how can they get the most value out of it. That is something that I think on on whether or not you're on the brand side or on the agency side is most important for your stakeholders. And and, again, I think that that's been a shift, because we haven't had to do that as much before. Does that make sense?

Oh, absolutely. Yeah. No. I think, you know, there's so many aspects of change that we've observed, and, obviously, our focus has been a little bit more on the tech side, and how that's playing a role. But the reality is there's so many different pieces of the event ecosystem that we've seen change. So I guess, one of to that end, you know, thinking about tech, how in a post pandemic space now, how is tech changing operations? You know, we talk about it a lot on this show in terms of user experience and thinking about what an event looks and feels like. But I think it also must play a role in operations and

Yeah.

Both digitally and IRL. So I'm kinda curious about your perspective.

Yeah. You know, I've always been of the mindset to use tech as a tool and not as a replacement, to help help and inspire employees and and not to replace them. I think a lot of people feel that way too. And and our CEO, Natasha Millers, is very tech forward and really embraces opportunities to learn new tech capabilities, how they can support the success of the company, as well as how they can elevate the experiences that we bring to our clients. From an operation standpoint, our team is is fully remote. So utilizing technology is really critical in bringing the team together and ensuring alignment. You know, tools as simple as Slack and the Google Suite, you know, if they are used strategically, they can be simple, but really incredibly effective in operating and and running a team. I also think it's really fascinating to see the tools that are now becoming available to us as event planners, you know. And even sorry. Not even just as event planners, just professionals in general. There's a there's an AI tool, I don't know if you're familiar with it, that you can use to take notes during meetings. So you can have them join have this AI tool join a Zoom call, and it will listen and summarize the goals of the meeting, take note of action items. It determines who's speaking and what their tone is. All of that is recapped and memorialized in an efficient and concise way. And the first time that I I saw something like that, it's just it's I've never experienced anything like that, and it's, again, fascinating how it can be used.

It is. And the AI does much better doodles than I do during meetings,

to be fair. Yeah.

You mentioned Slack and the Google suite and and, obviously, the AI component here. These are obviously very useful in certain terms of planning. Did they change how you're communicating with the client side? So when we think about agency communication to client and making things more efficient and helping all teams to sort of charge forward in the same direction. I'm sure some of our viewers are obviously using many of these tools, but are there tips and and things that maybe you can offer from an operational standpoint that you are seeing that kind of maybe make things more efficient, which obviously means that you're also using budget and time in a better manner.

Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, even just taking the Google suite as an example, giving more ownership to the client to view the, you know, notes that are being taken, allow them to to collaborate with you so that they can be more vocal about what they're envisioning. I think it does depend on the client as well. You know, sometimes the client wants to be more involved, and sometimes the client, is not an actual planner, so they don't want to be. So it does it does tend to, you know, need, that level of, understanding or or buy in from the client. But I think that those tools just afford us a a better way of collaborating with clients so that, again, they can, see these documents in development or they can, collaborate with us when we're taking brainstorming notes. They can add their own two cents in a way. There are just there's just a plethora of ways that we can utilize those tools to our advantage. And it allows us the flexibility to pull back if there's a client that doesn't need that type of interaction. You know? So I I think it just depends on, again, strategically, approaching these tools, to be used in the best way possible for however your relationship is unfolding with your client.

Absolutely. And then in terms of the kinds of events that you're planning for for twenty four and beyond, talk to us about the modalities. Are you guys doing hybrid? Are you doing virtual? Are you only doing IRL? Are you doing a combination? Just so we can kinda understand Yeah. What kind of yeah.

I am seeing a number of IRL events. You know? There's still several clients who are embracing the virtual component and, or virtual as a replacement to an IRL. Like, that's definitely still a prominent, experience that is being planned. But I think for as we kind of map out twenty twenty four, we're seeing a number of IRL large scale in person events that is really, you know, exciting. I think it's exciting to think that we're we're coming back to a place after the pandemic that we can start planning out for those types of events again. And it is it is also nice to see that virtual is not completely obsolete. It's it's still, a component. There are definitely hybrid components to these IRL events that, you know, elevate the experience further, elevate the ability to network, and expand reach as well. So I'm kind of seeing a lot of things, you know, all the different types of interactions, all the different types of experiences that embrace virtual components as part of IRL as well.

Very cool. So I guess that begs my question then. How does the different modalities of events and the varying kinds that you're seeing Mhmm. Play a role and and then talking about the tech that we were talking about just a second ago. How does all that influence the operations in terms of, you know, there are different things that it takes to produce an IRL versus a virtual versus a hybrid. So from an operations perspective, obviously, we've talked about, like, sort of increased efficiency of communication and the ability to use the AI to sort of help organize notes and kind of drive things forward. What do you find if someone's listening to this, I guess, and watching, and they are, you know, like you said, they're adding IRL back in or maybe they're growing what IRL they did this year, and they're adding hybrid and virtual components perhaps. How do you address, operations? What what's changed operationally speaking since the pandemic? Because, really, you know, a lot of people will say, and I mean, I guess I kind of agree with this, when you're kinda putting on two events in one when you produce a hybrid. There are two different kinds of things going on. Often, you know, at the same time, sometimes asynchronously. But from an operational perspective, what does that look like? What are what are pitfalls that people need to be aware of, and and how do you address those?

Yes. I mean, it is an interesting it's it's interesting because it has changed the way that we plan events as well. Like you said, having, you know, a virtual component as well as an in person component is essentially two different experiences that you have to plan for. So it does take more labor, it does take more planning hours, and it does take more organization on on the planner side to ensure that you're covering your bases. There's no at least in my experience, I'd be really interested to hear if anybody else has a different, solution. But to me, I've I haven't found a solution that, really allows for one size fits all planning. I've seen that, and I've you know, the way I've organized the teams that I've that I've led, a team that's dedicated to the virtual experience and a team that's dedicated to the in person experience. Again, just to ensure that each of those audiences are not losing any quality of, you know, product, any quality of the experience, and, every turn that the experience takes, whether it is virtual or whether it is in person, is being thought through and, is you know, dedicated planning time has been set to that as well.

Absolutely. So I'm I'm gonna meet hopefully, I'm not putting you on the spot here. But what have you found doesn't work? Because, I mean, one of one of my favorite things about doing this show is kinda learning from everybody that joins us and sharing that knowledge with our viewers. And so Yeah. If the if there's something that you found doesn't work, it would be great to hear that because I think it informs those that are watching so they don't make the same mistakes.

Yeah. No. Absolutely. I think it's I'm double clicking on what I just said in terms of I mean, I think what doesn't work is having virtual take a back seat to the planning or vice versa, having the in person experience take a back seat to the planning and only focusing on the virtual experience. It doesn't work when you have, you know, a planning team or one planner who is only going to, prioritize one of those experiences over the other. I think what's really important is ensuring that you have, planning hours dedicated to both experiences so that you can prioritize the audience, journey, the attendee journey for whether it's a virtual, attendee journey or whether they're coming in person to the event. So, yeah. Again, just saying that I do feel it's a little bit you know, it's definitely more challenging. It's a little bit more planning hours that you have to dedicate to projects that are hybrid like that. But I think that the, outcome and the product that you'll produce will be so much more impactful. It'll resonate further with each of those audiences, and it'll be it'll be worth it for sure.

No. That that's really I think that's great to hear. I think that that idea that it's two different events that needs the appropriate attention and time and planning and care Yeah. Is something that, you know, you can't you almost can't say it enough. So, I'm curious when you think about you know, I'm sticking with hybrid because it seems to be what many are talking about, but I'm also curious, I guess, on the virtual side. When you talk about producing these kinds of events and you think about it from an operation perspective, can you share some insight into what a team typically looks like? I think for many, that are looking to grow their efforts and get into hybrid may not fully be aware of the kinds of teams that these kinds of efforts require. And and I know that you guys kinda deal in a broad range of of solutions and and team members. So can you share some insight into that side of things?

Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, if I pull also just from, you know, past events that I've produced as well. When I was at Univision, we did an event, conference called Leading the Change. And in twenty twenty one, they're twenty twenty one, twenty twenty the years are going by so fast, and I don't I can't I can't think about what year it was. It's all a blur. But, but, ultimately, you know, it was one of our first times incorporating a virtual component and a virtual audience to an in person experience. And what I remember in working with the agency production agency that I partnered with at the time, this is when I was still in New York, there were again, there were dedicated teams to focus on just the virtual audience, and then there was a dedicated team for the in person production. So it really did require, especially for this audience, which was, almost two hundred, attendees in person as well as, you know, a virtual audience that we were targeting a hundred plus people as well. It really did require those two different work streams because they were, you know, working virtually, just thinking about the virtual experience. It required a a platform, that had specific, you know, camera shots and, audience interactions that could be you know, audience could engage with during the presentations and during the the, panel discussions, etcetera. Like, that required its own planning stream. And so I dedicated at least, you know, one dedicated planner, and then our production agency, had at least two other people focusing on that, so that they can handle all the conversations with the, virtual platform. They could they could handle all the branding and the graphics that are specific to the virtual experience as well. Any other content that needed to be built out on the site, like, all of that is an event in its own. And then for the rest of the team that was planning the in person, conference, that's, you know, all of the logistics with the hotel, all of the AVN production needed on-site, all of the, speaker management that we needed to ensure we're physically going to be there and taken care of and any green room needs. Like, all of that is a a whole separate event in itself too. So having those two planning streams, again, working towards the ultimate goal of creating content that could live on the site afterwards, and had good content for what the the stream was going to be live and then what the in person audience was going to be experiencing in the room. Like, all of those things had to work in concert. But, again, from a planning and operational standpoint, it had to be divided into, those different work streams.

I I I love that. I mean, it it's so true. There's so much going on that you really do need a dedicated team for each, and then you need coordination between those teams. You said something, though, that I wanna just hone in on for a second because I think it's really interesting. The idea of thinking about producing an event, taking into account everything you just went through on both sides of the equation for for the hybrid component and for the in person, but then also thinking about how that content can live on beyond the event. Has that changed the operational approach and consideration for an event? Like, was that part of the dialogue five, eight years ago understanding you were on the client side? But, you know, did were you thinking like that, or is that a mindset change that we are all now sort of facing because that's the way this technology allows us to further leverage these investments?

That was a conversation that I think became more and more important as the years went on. When I first joined the event industry, that was not something that you know, I I was at a media company too. I was at the Wall Street Journal and Dow Jones. And, you know, on the Wall Street Journal side, we were we as as a marketing team and me as the event planner, I was planning these high touch, a list celebrity editorial interviews that were not being recorded and saved for future use, which to me now is is insane to think about. But it was, you know, it was photographed, and it was written about afterwards. But the actual content that was created in terms of video content was not ever, utilized. I think it was archived, if we did end up, taping any of those. So so I do think, like, that was, you know, over a decade ago. So it was it was a while ago. And since then, the evolution of social media, how, you know, in a professional space, that engagement is also taken into account, and the data from from that engagement is utilized as ROI, for for clients and for stakeholders in general and and also widening your reach for whatever event you've you've executed against, is is really incredible in terms of how that how the importance of of an event content living beyond just the event, has been. Right? So, again, looking back at that and how it was never a priority to capture content for an audience outside of the room and how now in everything that we do, even, you know, even as, you know, running a company, wanting to take footage and content to showcase the the work that we're doing, from an engagement standpoint to potential clients and and also how can we use this for marketing. Like, that's that's one way of using it. And then also on the client side and the experience side, capturing what that experience was like so that they can memorialize and also, broadcast to their own internal channels and external channels what what was done. I'm rambling, but all

this to say. Yeah. No. I think no. I think I think it's I I really think it is a perspective change, and I think it's Yeah. Been reinforced by the technology that's influencing and making content available. Because I don't think pre pandemic, we were so mindful of an event living on and being repurposed. That's the question. So I think no. I you're not rambling. I think it makes a lot of sense. And I think I I think it's something that our viewers need to be thinking about is that Yeah. When you're planning an event, you're not necessarily planning it solely for that singular day. And, yes, there are events that you're planning for that that are for that purpose, but there's fewer and fewer of them. Just the same way virtual is not applicable to everything, it doesn't mean that capturing and rebroadcasting stuff is is applicable to everything, but I just think it's another tool in the war chest. So, my last question for you, having made that jump from client side into agency, Yeah. Are there tips you might offer our viewers that, they might take into account now that you've seen both sides of the equation to have a better experience either with their current agency or choosing an agency? Are there things that you might, you know, lend some insight into that that would help people better communicate and facilitate better events?

I mean, I think you you nailed it right there by saying communication. Communication is going to be, the most critical component to any type of professional relationship, whether that's with your internal stakeholders, with your internal team, or with external agencies that you bring on to be an extension of your own team. So I would I would recommend that, any of you making those types of decisions, any decision makers here, just ensuring that the language in which you communicate with your partners is aligned. Right? That you are able to fully, communicate what your vision is, that your partner is able to receive that vision and communicate to you how it's going to be executed upon, because having that same, language is going to be critical in ensuring alignment throughout the planning process. I would also say just what my experience has afforded me is, you know, I've learned to just be ready for anything. The world is incredibly dynamic. You know, who knows what's going to happen in in our industry, in another industry that impacts our industry. You know, it's it's all about keeping your ducks in a row and also being flexible and and giving yourself grace. So whether that's new tech, whether that's, you know, crazy world events that are happening, any Sure. Anything that's gonna throw us curve balls, the only constant that we can really expect is change. So my playbook is really just to continue to stay informed, be adaptable, and and be ready to pivot when needed.

Love it. That that's and that's our goal here is just to share knowledge and allow everybody to continue learning and be ready to pivot. Jitter, such a pleasure to get to chat with you and really hear your insights. If folks that are watching wanna keep up with you or learn more about entire, how can they do so?

Yep. Please do find me on LinkedIn, and you can also, see Entire at entire productions.com  We're happy to help with any type of experience you have, whether that is virtual, whether that is in person. Anything that you can dream up, we can help with.

Awesome. Awesome. Well, thank you so much, Jitter. Really appreciate your time and your contribution today. For those of you absolutely. And for those of you watching, we look forward to sharing another Institute of Virtual Lunch and Learn with you in the near future. If you wanna share your perspective on what's going on in the industry, shoot us an email. We'd love to have you on the program because we're really looking to hear from everybody, every facet. Wherever you play in the industry, we wanna hear from you and and learn from you as well. So So thanks for joining us today. Have a great day. We'll see you again real soon here at the Institute of Virtual. Take care.