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Internal Reflection And Self-Care With Dr. Nekeshia Hammond
“You deserve to have emotional health. You deserve to be emotionally healthy. You deserve to have joy. You deserve to be happy.”
In this episode, Nick speaks with Dr. Nekeshia Hammond, a psychologist and burnout prevention expert. They discuss the importance of self-care and reflection in preventing burnout, emphasize the need to unlearn the go-go-go mentality, and prioritize mental health and well-being. While it’s not always easy, practicing self-care and reflection can lead to a healthier and more fulfilling life, so they discuss strategies for preventing burnout and finding healing.
What to listen for:
“It’s life-changing when you put things into play to take care of yourself physically, emotionally, mentally, spiritually.”
“It all goes together. The physical affects the mental, the mental affects the physical.”
“All of us need our non-negotiables, whatever that looks like for you.”
About Dr. Nekeshia Hammond
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond is a respected psychologist, executive coach, and founder of Hammond Psychology & Associates. She is known for her expertise in mental health, burnout prevention, and leadership development, and she’s an international speaker and bestselling author. Dr. Hammond’s insights have been featured on NBC, ABC, CBS, FOX, and Essence Magazine, as well as platforms like Corporate Counsel Women of Color and TEDx, focusing on mental wellness and leadership balance.
Resources:
Check out these other episodes about burnout.
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Click To View The Episode Transcript
Nick McGowan (00:00.15)
Hello and welcome to the Mindset and Self -Mastery Show. I’m your host, Nick McGowan and today on the show we have Dr. Hammond. Dr. Hammond, how are you doing today?
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (00:06.354)
Yes.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (00:21.36)
I am wonderful. How are you?
Nick McGowan (00:22.946)
I’m good. It’s taken us a little while to get to this point. It’s funny. So for the audience that’s listening to this, we’ve had a bunch of technical issues and just BS. We’ve been joking and laughing through the entire thing, but there was like two minutes away from just totally rescheduling. this is potentially going to be the best or the worst episode ever. No, it’ll probably be totally fine no matter what. So let me just take a little bit of step back. Why don’t you tell us what you do for a living? And one thing that most people don’t know about you, that’s maybe a
Bazaar.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (00:54.729)
Awesome. So I’m Dr. Nikesha Hammond. I’m a psychologist, author, speaker. I’ve had a private practice. I’ve owned a private practice now for the past 15 years and I’m partially in the practice doing psychological evaluations and the other part of the time in the community working on burnout prevention with corporations and different organizations. I’m also a wife and a mom and a volunteer community leader. So I’m juggling a lot of tasks like everyone else.
And let’s see, I think my close, well definitely my close friends know, but something most people don’t know about me is I am a Gator football fanatic. Like I bleed orange and blue. And yeah, I have a different personality when I watch Gator football games, so I try not to watch them in professional settings. So yeah, I would say that’s me in a nutshell.
Nick McGowan (01:49.869)
So can I call in the Gator fan for this? No? No, calling you in as the Gator fan. I can see the Gator helmet obviously in the background too.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (01:54.409)
Sure. You want to call a Gator fan? call me. yes, for sure. For sure. For sure. well, yes. Yeah, have… The whole room is Gator themed, so yes. I did. I did. That’s my alma mater. Yes.
Nick McGowan (02:08.959)
Nice, nice. Is that where you went to school or is, okay. That’s cool. and it sounds like you do a lot of different things. There are people just in general that will feel like they have to do a lot of things. They’ll have to be at those games. They’ll have to be at tailgating as I’m sure you may. they’ll have to do all the different things that their kids want them to do that they feel like they should do. And as you started to rattle some of that stuff off, my first thought was like, well,
I could understand if somebody’s burnt out by it, but if you then get to talk to people about burnout, especially going to businesses and working with them and their employees for burnout, I think there’s a lot of stuff that we can get in with that because overall just the thought and the idea of burnout can be kind of a surface level thing for people where they’re like, yeah, I’m just constantly burnt. So next fucking question. Or they’re like, I don’t know what else to do. This is just what I should do.
So what does your overall take when it comes to just being burnt
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (03:09.737)
Yeah, I love that. I speak, when I speak about burnout prevention, it’s really from a personal lens and professional lens. So yes, obviously I’ve been in the field as a mental health professional for 15 years now, but also personally, I totally get it. Like for that person that’s like, I don’t have time for the self care. I have 500 things I’m juggling, whatever for the burnout prevention thing. Like I get it because I used to be in that mental space before I did hit burnout. And
really though is life changing when you put things into play to take care of yourself physically, emotionally, mentally, spiritually. It’s something that I like said personally had to work on as well because for me growing up and I think for a lot of people, we weren’t taught about mental health. We weren’t taught about taking care of ourselves, right? Like it was just a go, go, go mentality, achieve, achieve. like, I just remember I’m like, I never took a breath. Like I never stopped to think
wait a minute, yes, do all these achievements and that’s great, but you’re breaking down, like that’s not okay in the process and you’re not fully who you need to be and show up for in the different eras you are anyway when you’re burnt out and you deserve better than that. So it’s definitely possible, but it takes a mindset shift for that to happen.
Nick McGowan (04:28.731)
It also takes somebody like yourself to be able to change that. So even within your own little world, you and your children and your family and your friends for you to be able to be that example. If we think about our parents, they were taught this is how you do it. Their parents were taught this is how you do it. And whatever generation you are, you’re only a few generations away from the depression era when people were like, you have to do things this way.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (04:33.297)
Mm -hmm. Yeah.
Nick McGowan (04:56.308)
And the, start of factories coming in just before that and people saying, you have to do this and I need to work so that I can feed all your little kids and we can do these things and whatever else. I oftentimes will think about the way that I grew up. had my mom and my dad separate. And I kind of had that rich dad, poor dad scenario, but it was more or less rich dad, poor mom. And a lot of it was the negative mindset of
Well, I have to do these things and it sucks, but I just need to do it. And I think there’s something to be said where you can, you can take that as a kind of a bit of an energy boost in a sense to do it. But it does take you or somebody being able to step back and go, my God, what do I really need to do this? But I think that also brings in generational trauma at that point, because it just been handed down, handed down where people go, well, we all did this. We’ve all gone to Florida university, or we’ve all gone
whatever, now you should do the same thing. How do you feel about
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (05:57.639)
Yeah, that’s, I’m really glad you brought that up because it can be difficult, honestly, when we have to think about unlearning how we were raised sometimes, like how we were brought up. So for myself, I grew up in a single parent home. It was me and my brother at that time and my mom who worked multiple jobs because she was like, need to, you know, my kids have to have a good education, good place to live and all the things which I’m grateful for. But what that taught me was like, okay, just go, go, go run yourself ragged.
Hustle hard all those things like no self -care was allowed. No relaxation is allowed, but you burn out that way, right? But you and no matter how you raise like you you have to unlearn some of the things just because your parents did it and your grandparents and your great -grandparents Did it a certain way. We’re in a different like we’re in a different time now, right? We’re in a different time. So we have to do things differently We’re learning now more yay about mental health about self -care like it’s okay to take care of yourself and
still thrive, still be successful. It’s not an or. Like I was having a conversation once with an organization and they were like, well, I won’t say the name of the organization, but they were like, you know, like it’s this idea, which is not true of like, well, if you teach about self care, does that mean our employees are not going to work hard? And I’m like, no, not at all. Like, please work hard. I work hard still. I’m still doing a ton of things, but the difference is now self care is in place.
So I don’t burn out because I have to be a wife and a mom and a community leader and a business owner and all these other things. like, you can’t show up powerfully for yourself and for the people around you if you’re not taking care of yourself. But it’s a lot, like you said earlier, it’s a lot that we have to unlearn. Like a lot from our upbringing.
Nick McGowan (07:38.27)
Yeah. Yeah. All right. And even with the unlearning, it’s not like, it’s not like every single thing that you’ve been taught, you need to get rid of, you know, we, we learn things from people. Sometimes it’s what not to do probably more often than not. and you also learn things to do, but then we have to make that decision. And I think there’s also a gradient to it. There are certain energetic types that really thrive almost in
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (07:49.18)
No.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (07:53.374)
Mm -hmm.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (08:01.875)
Mm -hmm.
Nick McGowan (08:05.802)
where they have to have things being chaotic. Some of those people, mean, if we really dug deep, it’s because of the trauma they had as a child. And they feel like this is how I should do life and this is how I can win in life. But there are also the energetics that really actually thrive in, it’s a tough spot, I can do this thing and they can hit the ground running. Most people aren’t like that. But most people feel like they need to be because they see other people do it. And like you’d mentioned, mom did it, my grandma did it, this person did
all the way back to Roman times, they’ve all done it. It’s like, that doesn’t actually work for us, but we do need to actually see where that gradient is. Now, in the life that you have, doing all the different things that you’re doing, if you take a step back, and maybe just using you as the example isn’t the best thing here, but for anybody that has kids, has a career, has all these different things that are going on, being able to step back and ask yourself, do I want this?
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (08:44.531)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.
Nick McGowan (09:04.094)
How do I feel about these things? But how do you work with people when they have to pull themselves out of that to then look at it from a third party perspective, which can be sometimes difficult when you’re so inundated and so overwhelmed by
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (09:19.305)
Yeah. And I would definitely say you actually hit the nail on the head. The number one thing that I’ve seen as an issue, if I really look back over the past 15 years in this field, once I became licensed, 15 years in this field, is that people don’t, we don’t take enough time to reflect, like taking the step back because we’re so in our situations, whether it’s family work, school, whatever it is, we’re
in our situations, we’re overwhelmed, we’re stressed out. We’re not taking a moment to reflect. So like you said, like these are three questions I often tell people to ask themselves, hopefully at least once a week is number one, how am I doing? And be honest with yourself because typically we’re checking in with everyone else around us, but we’re not checking in with ourselves. So you have to ask yourself, how am I doing? And then the second thing to ask yourself
What do I need? So physically, emotionally, spiritually, mentally, you know, we’re all in different places depending on what’s going on in our lives. Sometimes we’re at a really dark season. Sometimes we’re at a joyous season or somewhere in between, but what do you need? And then the third question to ask yourself is what step do I need to take today in order to improve my life?
depending on your energy level, you might be at a point where you’re like, I’m ready to take a leap or you’re ready to take a baby step. And both of those are correct. It just depends on where you’re at. how are you doing? Are you overwhelmed, stressed out and frazzled? Maybe you could just take a baby step or maybe you need to take a break, which counts too. Or are you at a great place and you have the momentum and you’re like, I’m ready to take a leap in my self care or in my physical growth, emotional, spiritual, mental growth.
Both of those are the correct answer. again, like you said, it takes you reflecting on what is going on with you. And that’s definitely of the thousands and thousands of people that I’ve met from all over the world at this point, that is something that we are missing is taking a minute and reflecting and checking in with ourselves.
Nick McGowan (11:33.423)
And let’s break that down a little bit more because it can be easy for you and I to have this conversation. It can be easy for whoever’s listening to this to do whatever they’re doing to just listen to a conversation. It can be easy to just fucking talk about things, but it’s not easy to do the work. Obviously it’s important and imperative for us to do the work, but we have to understand that it takes time to be able to do it. Like I’ve had conversations with people about this. We’re like, look, man,
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (11:39.774)
Mm -hmm.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (11:45.907)
Mm -hmm.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (11:58.04)
yeah,
Nick McGowan (12:00.998)
If I just have this conversation, I just ask myself, am I okay? Or am I doing this thing or whatever? It’s like, it’s not going to fix me. I get that. Like the whole point is to be able to actually have those conversations and check in and work through it. But understand that us just playing on Instagram or screwing around watching TV isn’t actually checking in with yourself and being able to work through it. So what sort of advice do you give to somebody that’s trying to figure out like, how do I actually work through these?
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (12:07.781)
Mm -hmm.
Nick McGowan (12:29.978)
How do I peel out a little bit of time for myself without feeling shame from peeling something away from somebody else?
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (12:38.237)
Yeah, so definitely allowing yourself to have the mindset shift that you deserve to have emotional health. You deserve to be emotionally healthy. You deserve to have joy. You deserve to be happy. For some of us, we are struggling with self -love, which could deal from childhood trauma or something that happened even yesterday. Like we’re dealing with worthiness issues and self -love and all those sorts of things. But
It makes such a huge difference when you work and taking care of yourself. So another concrete thing that I encourage people to do is what I call take a minute for yourself daily, a minimum of a minute daily. And you can even time yourself with your cell phone like 60 seconds because I started like this as well. Cause I was in a place, a mental place where I was just like, I don’t have time for this. don’t have time for self care. Like it was just, that’s what made sense to me back then.
Nick McGowan (13:20.476)
Mm -hmm.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (13:33.577)
But I was like, okay, fine. have 60 seconds, right? So you take a minute and whether it’s taking a walk outside, I love nature, so I love being in nature, but whether it’s watching the sunrise, the sunset, drinking a cup of tea, I’m a tea drinker, prayer if you believe in that, deep breaths, whatever it is for you in that one minute, what that does is no, it’s not gonna solve all your problems, but you start to retrain your brain.
So your brain understands you deserve and need to reset and recharge. You need the downtime. Your brain and your body do not need to be in a constant state of fight or flight. it is so unhealthy, physically and emotionally unhealthy to constantly be and like, what’s next? What do I do? What’s on the to -do list? I gotta do this, I gotta do that. Like it can, it will ruin your health if you stay in that state. But again, starting with taking the minute.
to reset and recharge is like a tangible thing that you can start with in order to start seeing the improvements that you need.
Nick McGowan (14:38.577)
We sometimes forget that we are a machine. Like the organism needs rest. We don’t, we don’t always get the rest that we need. Even if we sleep, we’re not always getting the rest because we’re stressed or what have you. But I, I, at different times we’ll think about like, if I leave my computer on for a few days, it’ll start to just slow down. If you leave your phone on, you really need to turn these off and reconnect them to the network at least once a week.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (14:42.066)
Yes.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (14:45.683)
Yes.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (14:58.493)
Mm -hmm.
Nick McGowan (15:06.407)
But if it just keeps getting bogged down and bogged down and bogged down and you have problems and we forget about that as people where we’re like, no, I’m good. Just keep moving along. And it’s like, it just gets worse and worse and worse. But taking the 60 seconds is again, an easy thing for us to talk about. It can be hard to be able to put that stuff in the use, but being able to, that’s where the discipline comes into play. And look, I’ve had my own problems with that where I’ve tried different things. I’ve had hour long or two hour long whole
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (15:11.155)
Mm -hmm.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (15:18.275)
Yes, it does.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (15:23.944)
Yeah.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (15:33.565)
Mm -hmm.
Nick McGowan (15:36.262)
Routines in the morning and at night and then some that are not at all, but it’s funny I was actually having a conversation with my mental health coach where we were talking about the little routines that we do like meditating or Journaling or whatever the thing is it works for you I try to at least at least meditate for five minutes at least five minutes I’m typically a lot better between 10 and 20 minutes two times a day, but sometimes it doesn’t
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (15:48.637)
Yes.
Nick McGowan (16:03.824)
But being able to actually spend that little bit of time, again, the conversation I was having with my mental health coach was like, isn’t it funny how when we don’t do those things, that’s typically a rough day. But when you do those things, you’re like, I feel a little better. So even just taking that moment, and that’s for each person to be able to figure out where do you take that moment? Now you’ve got kids, you’ve got a family, you’ve got friends, you’ve got responsibilities in community, you’ve got a business, you got all these things to some people.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (16:14.557)
Yep.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (16:18.949)
Yep. Yeah.
Nick McGowan (16:32.783)
hearing just the list of stuff like that makes them just want to pour a drink. So how do you find the
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (16:40.137)
Yeah, I love how you said that. And it does feel like that some days. It’s just like, wait, what? I look up and I’m like, Exactly. Like, wait, how did 800 things get on my to -do list? No, but I make the commitment. I believe in non -negotiables. I think all of us need our non -negotiables, whatever that looks like for you. So the only way that I can do my crazy busy schedule currently is because I have a commitment.
Nick McGowan (16:45.621)
You’re like, my god.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (17:10.109)
to my non -negotiables and my self -care. So like now when I wake up in the morning, I no longer like run to my email. Like the first thing I used to do is run to my phone. What’s the email I missed from last night or checking Instagram or something else. For me, it’s like, no, I immediately when I open my eyes, it’s like gratitude practice for me personally, because of my faith, I do a devotional prayer. Like that’s how I start my day. It’s very intentional. do take, I take more than a minute now, but I started out with
being as disciplined as possible with taking that minute, which is so necessary. When you take the minute, when you start this and you’re like, my God, I didn’t even know I was that stressed out or my body was that tense. Like it really is life changing. And then physical exercise, extremely important to me now, getting sleep, extremely important to me. So it’s really about purposely living a life where you’re like, yes, all these external things matter to me because they do, but so does my physical and emotional and mental
Nick McGowan (17:48.526)
Yeah.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (18:08.797)
Like those things are important too. So when you get to that mindset, because I’m like, I’m not going back. You know, I’m not going back to the burnt out, stressed out all the time, overwhelmed person, because also that doesn’t help me in the roles that I currently have anyhow. It doesn’t help me and it doesn’t help the people around me. So that’s how I quote unquote do it all is like, what is making sure I have my non -negotiables, setting my boundaries and doing my best to live a very healthy life.
Nick McGowan (18:38.264)
And you still have days. Rough days. Everybody does. Yeah.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (18:40.795)
of course. yeah. yeah. Yeah. yeah. Those days are still there. Yeah, it’s not a perfect life for sure. No, no. Yeah.
Nick McGowan (18:45.454)
Yeah. And the reason why I bring that up is so that we can talk about like, are times where I’m sure both of us have those days where you’re like, damn, I should have done this differently. I should have done that, but still showing grace to yourself and being able to understand like, all right, well do what you can in the day that you have be present, but then also try to figure out little systems for yourself. Like if, if it’s a matter of, look, I have to get up and not instantly just look at Instagram or whatever it
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (18:57.314)
for sure. Yeah. Exactly.
Yes.
Nick McGowan (19:14.852)
then maybe you actually need to look at how you’re relating to those things. Like I’m no longer on social media active in the way that I was before, because I used to do the same thing. I’ve just instantly wake up and next thing you know, I’m like 15, 20 minutes into Instagram. I’m like, how the hell did I get here? I need to go to the bathroom and brush my teeth and like do life, you know? But being able to set yourself up to not fail as often may just look like moving your phone.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (19:31.305)
Yep. Yeah, yeah.
Nick McGowan (19:42.327)
or figuring out a way, like how do I do this? What do I do to be able to get myself out? If you have pets, it’s an easy way. You just go walk them or what have you. But are there little things that you’ve figured out for yourself that work with how you are and who you are to be able to make sure that you do those things more consistently?
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (20:00.829)
Yeah. So I make it a point, for example, so I travel a lot and go into different cities and whatnot with speaking engagements and different work projects. So I’m a window seat girl, but I make it a point. I’m like, okay, open the window, like look outside, you know, just really take a minute to like observe nature. Like I’m a nature lover. So if it’s a sunset or sunrise or there’s just clouds or wherever it is, like, but it’s
It’s just being intentional and that’s just a small thing, but it really does like, okay, just reset, recharge for a second. Like even if I’m on the plane or, the same thing with the mornings, like there’s no morning that I want to miss because I need to start my day with some inspiration and motivation, honestly, because some days, like you said, like they’re rough, like they’re hard and it still is your overall, you’re stressed out, but it helps a little bit more often to put something in the place to almost like buffer
So doesn’t feel as heavy. It’s still heavy. Whatever you’re going through is still heavy. But when you put certain things into place, it can make it a little bit easier to get through.
Nick McGowan (21:08.671)
And if we think of those things that you do, that’s almost like a doorway into the other things that can help you also heal. Just like spending that time to go, my gosh, and I didn’t know that I was that stressed out or that my body is like screaming. Like, can we finally just calm down or thank you or what have you and being able to actually step through those. I think that’s the thing that we can all remind ourselves of, even if this sucks to do this thing, you don’t want to do it. You’re just trying to figure out what’s the thing that’s right for me to do.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (21:22.063)
yeah.
Nick McGowan (21:38.391)
The more that we do those things, the more that we’re opening ourselves up to what else is deeper. our subconscious will start to talk to us about that and say, this is what’s going on, but we’ve got to be part of that. And when you work with the clients specifically that are not just burnt out, but there’s deeper reasons why they’re burnt out. How do you work with them to be able to understand that the burnout is just a symptom? It’s really deeper problems that maybe aren’t being looked at that subconsciously they’re terrified
at like how do I get out of this career? I don’t want this relationship or I don’t want to do this thing but they’re afraid to do that so they just keep perpetuating the burnout. How do you work with them
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (22:23.163)
Yeah, yeah, great question. so there are some organizations that I speak with where people are vulnerable, which is great, and start to express it. Sometimes people know what their burnout is connected to. And again, it could be something when they were growing up learning, they’re not good enough or they’re not fill in the blank. They’re not pretty enough or they’re not the, you their size or their height. Like there’s all sorts
different things that we start off with telling ourselves why we’re not good enough or we’re not worthy of self love or we’re not worthy of taking a break on those sorts of things. And then we learn that and have to unlearn that. But what I always encourage people to understand is that you don’t have to go through this process alone. So if you know that there’s a deeper issue going on with you, there are so many individuals who are, that can be helpful to you. So whether it’s a coach, whether it’s
a mental health professional, whether it’s a mentor, friend, it really depends on what exactly is you’re going through. But nonetheless, don’t think you have to go through all this alone, especially if you’ve already tried and you’re like, I’m so overwhelmed. I don’t feel like anything’s working and that sort of thing. Please reach out to someone else around you who can be helpful for you during this process. Because sometimes as a former therapist, I will say sometimes it’s just not enough to try to figure it all out on your own and you don’t have
That’s why there’s professionals out there who can help to guide you through that process so you can heal through certain traumas that you haven’t fully healed through yet and then be that much stronger and better on other side, if you will, of the healing.
Nick McGowan (24:00.298)
Yeah. I want to also add that therapy isn’t always just the answer. There’s so much more to it. There are different modalities, there are different treatments, different ways to go about it. So I think about the people that are like, what the fuck, man, I’ve talked to people before. I don’t want to talk to anybody else anymore. It’s because really the trauma is still within their cells and needs to be processed out and talking.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (24:15.698)
Yeah.
Nick McGowan (24:25.407)
works for certain people. even I have a mental health coach that I work with and that’s a lot of talk therapy. But I also have acupressure that I go through in deep subconscious processing sessions with sometimes take fucking hours. But you’ve got to go through that work to be able to couple that all together. But we also need to figure out what works for us. So trying different things, EMDR, DBT, all the different things to be able to try them out. It’s not just when people talk about therapy, they think I’m just talking to somebody.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (24:32.349)
Yeah. Yep.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (24:44.871)
Yes. Yes.
Nick McGowan (24:53.845)
and somebody’s asking me, how do you feel about that? That’s not always the answer, but what sort of modalities and things do you work with to be able to help people beyond the level of just therapy?
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (25:06.131)
Yeah, and you’re absolutely right. I, a mental health professional, I also stand by that because there are billions of people on the planet, billions of people, everyone doesn’t need therapy, even though I thought that at the beginning of my career, because we learn and heal differently. So I, yes, I’m definitely an advocate for therapy, but for some people that’s just not the route and that’s okay.
And for some people it’s going to work amazing. So there are ways, there’s so many ways, but physically to take care of yourself. Like you said before, I mean, there’s acupuncture and there’s acupressure and there’s yoga and there’s all sorts of physical things that you can work on to, to heal yourself in that way. And then emotionally, I know there’s a lot of different retreats out there now, which I think are amazing. I’ve actually personally been on different retreats around the world, which had very huge healing properties. You don’t
to do that though, if that’s not your thing. But there’s that aspect. And then there are some of us who need more social support around us. doesn’t necessarily have to be therapeutic or it I’m sorry, it is therapeutic, it doesn’t necessarily have to be from a mental health professional. But that extra support, that extended support can be helpful as well. But there’s, yeah, there’s a lot
I mean, there’s apps now, like there’s so much that’s out there. It’s just the most important thing again is taking a step back for you and knowing like, what do you need? Like how are you doing and what works best for you? And like you said too, sometimes you have to try different things and you’re like, try this. Nope, that doesn’t work for me. I know for myself personally, when I read a lot of self -help books and they’re like, just wake up at like the crack, like four o ‘clock in the morning and start your day. like, not, not for me. Like I’m not a morning person.
I’m gonna read the book for the night owls, you know? Like, I’m not gonna try that, because I know that’s not gonna work for me, right? But I mean, but seriously, like do what works best for you. And again, if you try something, I’ve tried sound therapy, like there’s so many different things. You try something, you’re like, that’s not for me, then you try something else. But there’s something that works for you. I truly believe that. There’s something that works best for you. You put that into place and you work, continue to work on your healing journey.
Nick McGowan (27:20.787)
Yeah, this is all, it’s a fun process when we really look at it outside of being in the shit when you’re working through it. Because if, if you’re going through a deep processing session and someone’s like, isn’t this fun? You’re like, that’s the wrong F word. It’s close, but not totally there. because it’d be tough. There’s a lot of stuff to go through, but figuring out like, let me try this. Let me work on this. Let me try this thing. Even for somebody that says like you dimension, they’re different apps, just downloading an app and just trying it, giving
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (27:33.575)
Yeah.
Nick McGowan (27:50.4)
that try of a few days. Wake up at dumb o ‘clock in the morning and see if your body actually works with that. Some people are like, man, I feel great when I wake up at two or three, like beautiful. I have a really difficult time even getting my ass close to bed by like 1130 midnight and trying to get enough sleep. And I think it’s a thing that back to burnout. We think, well, if I go to bed later, I can get more stuff done. And if I will wake up earlier, I can get more stuff done.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (27:59.301)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (28:04.937)
Yeah.
Nick McGowan (28:17.972)
Then you’re looking at like a four, maybe five hour window of sleep. Some people’s bodies are okay with that. Most of us, the organism is not. It’s screaming like, need water and I need sleep. And what is your problem? Why aren’t you giving me these things? But just to test that stuff out can be huge. Are there things that you’ve found that really have helped the majority of the clients that you work with to kind of take that next
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (28:44.029)
Yeah, definitely. I’m glad you mentioned the sleep. Sleep is so critically important. I say that as a person, like you said earlier, I used to purposely, highly would not recommend it, but get like two, three, four hours averaging of sleep. I was exhausted. It led to brain fog, couldn’t concentrate. I can go down a whole list of things that happened, but in my mind, it made sense, like because I was like, let me be more productive and let me sleep later. Like hustle hard. Like it was ridiculous.
And I’m like, no, that’s so not healthy. So doing your best, if you have to reach out to a sleep specialist, because a lot of people I’ve talked to struggle with sleep, struggle with turning their minds off, if you will, at night. And what that leads to though is restless sleep. You’re not getting good quality sleep. It definitely affects your physical and mental health. So again, if you need to, well, try on your own to get sleep, but if that still doesn’t work, like connecting with a sleep specialist.
to see what is the best route for you and on the physical level too, because it all goes together. The physical affects the mental, the mental affects the physical. It all goes together. a cycle.
Nick McGowan (29:54.012)
Yeah. And if we look at, right, well, I’m getting a handful of hours of sleep and I’m still feeling stressed and whatever. And I’ve done the same thing. I, there are times where I think about, had a colleague I worked with years ago and she was like, you’re always running around. You’re doing all these things. And like, my God, what do you do? was like, I get four hours of sleep and drink too much fucking coffee and off I went. And then hit me years later. I was like, my God, gross. But that was for me to be able to learn through that and figure that out. If we’re going to bed.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (29:59.069)
Mm -hmm. yeah.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (30:18.599)
Yeah. Yes.
Nick McGowan (30:22.855)
and we’re only getting a handful of hours of sleep and you’re not actually getting restful sleep, that’s where you can figure out, well, maybe I need to meditate for a minute, two minutes, just turn everything off, that can shift it, but that’s again, part of that discovery process of like, huh, what’s gonna work for me? And I’m glad that you’re, I’m really glad that you mentioned when you first started that therapy was like, this is the savior in a sense. It’s not. well, I mean,
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (30:32.275)
Mm -hmm.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (30:47.219)
Yeah, I believe that in my 20s.
Nick McGowan (30:50.436)
We all kind of look at what’s the thing where we go, cool, this could be it. And we also want to look for the savior in a sense, not to bring faith into it, but there’s a religion specifically, more so faith, the faith of having, I know that I’ll be okay. I know that this will work out. And if you believe in God or you believe in the energy or whatever you believe in, just understand that good things are happening for us and we get to do this, but we also get to look through and see how do I work with
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (30:55.357)
Yeah.
Nick McGowan (31:19.846)
If somebody just says, talk to somebody and that doesn’t feel right, you’ve got to understand why it doesn’t feel right. It might just be a weird thing because somebody, when you’re eight years old, told you, we don’t talk to people, but it might be a weird thing because you’re terrified because of the stuff that you go through. So once you get somebody that’s actually in that spot where they’re like, look, I want to heal. I want to grow from this. What sort of path do you take them on to be able to figure out what helps them grow for them personally?
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (31:48.403)
Yeah, so a lot of times with the organizations, it’s more of a larger question if you will, but one of the things that is a part of it, like you said, with growth, it is physical growth, emotional, mental, and also spiritual, depending on people’s different belief systems, of course. But it really is taking a look at what are your strengths, what lights you up, what brings you joy, who is in
support corner, if you will, because sometimes we also have to, which is hard, but really take a step back when we look at our relationships in our life. I mean like friendships, coworkers, if you have a significant other, like the people around you, are they fully supporting you or are there some toxic individuals? How do you change the amount of time sometimes that you spend with certain people if they’re not uplifting and motivating and inspiring you? it’s
There’s really more of an assessment that has to happen and it’s very individual based of physically, are you doing emotionally? How are you doing mentally and spiritually? But I will say that the support piece is also really the social support piece is also critically important. And actually last year the US Surgeon General, he out a report that loneliness there was like a loneliness epidemic that was happening and how
Loneliness, usually he’s talking about like smoking and diabetes and all sorts of physical issues affect us physically, but loneliness can also affect us physically and emotionally and like really tear us down where we’re not connecting with others in the way that we need to. So again, taking that assessment too of like socially, how are you doing and how are you connected with others? And for anyone listening to this who right now is like, you know,
there are some toxic people in your corner, just know too that there are a lot of people in the world who want to support you, who care about you, who are good for your mental health. It’s a matter of being connected and finding those said individuals though.
Nick McGowan (33:55.453)
And that takes the steps to be able to actually start moving in that direction and look at those things. It’s interesting about the loneliness. I think that’s a symptom of the pandemic that happened four years
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (34:01.851)
Yes.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (34:07.911)
It got worse after yes, for sure. For
Nick McGowan (34:08.891)
Yeah. And it’s also a symptom of social media and the surface lives that we see where we go, well, these people are doing all these crazy, amazing things. Okay. I was talking to somebody recently where it was like even the curated people that have cameras following them around. They’re curating that they’re showing you what they want to show you. And the people that are trying to be authentic. I think that’s where this platform, not just my show,
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (34:17.233)
Nick McGowan (34:36.764)
Podcasts that are like this. This is a fucking live conversation those of you that will listen to this It’ll be down the road, but this is live like this isn’t curated as much and then I think Understanding from our own person that we want to curate things We want things to be a certain way maybe because of a generational trauma or how you feel Life should look because of what somebody else said we need to be able to step back and look at those things You’d be difficult to do it. I’m glad that you’ve been able to talk
Not only the stuff that has worked for you, but that you’ve been able to talk in front of and inspire a lot of people to actually start to look at those things from a personal lens instead of how do I do this as a community or what have you. For the people that are trying to figure out how do we go about this, what sort of advice do you give to somecbody that’s on their path towards self
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (35:27.377)
Yeah, that’s great. So, so definitely taking the steps, asking yourself those questions as like related to how are you doing? What do you need? What steps do you need to take? Again, who, who is it for you right now that maybe you have this person already in your life. Maybe you’re like, I have a rock star therapist or I have a rock star or significant other or coworker, mentor, coach, whomever it is. Maybe you already have those people.
But if you don’t, what is a step that you need to take next for your growth and for your self mastery? Because again, typically I have found that this is not a, it starts off alone, if you will, like asking yourself these questions, but it’s not a process that you’re doing by yourself. Where I’m at now, thankfully, and extremely grateful for in my physical, mental, emotional, and spiritual health is I didn’t do this alone. So I have.
amazing mentors, still great coaches, great communities that I’m a part of. Like we are just positive people, you know, kind of cheering each other on, helping our helping each other in business and personal life to kind of get through and navigate. But it really does take a larger community, but finding the people for you who make sense to move you forward in the direction of the self mastery and the healing process that we’re all on
Nick McGowan (36:54.435)
And I think there’s a, it’s important that you keep talking about the community aspect, the positivity of it. Something that I’m sure we both agree on, but haven’t actually touched on. And I want to do it for the cynical people. Listen to this. We’re not just talking about fucking sunshine and rainbows and people that are like, you need to positive your way through all these things. You need to be able to have conversation with people that can say, this is really tough right now. Are you all right? How are you doing? Like this
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (37:13.467)
no. yeah, no.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (37:21.734)
yeah,
Nick McGowan (37:24.229)
This is a tough situation and somebody that’s just like, no, I don’t want any of the negativity. Just there are times where people reach out to me. Like you can’t just mindset your way through life. It’s like, got it. I understand that you can’t, it’s a part of it, but you actually need to look at those tough things too. And like you were saying, having a community or having people that are in your corner that you can have both sides of those conversations with and be able to listen to or hear from you
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (37:38.045)
Yeah.
Nick McGowan (37:50.095)
be able to work through that stuff is not just a everything in the world is always going to be great because that’s not the way it is.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (37:55.677)
Definitely not. I’m in a lot of communities with entrepreneurs and those are not the conversations. Like everything’s great and perfect. No, we’re like, my gosh, like today is crazy or this week. Help me. No, no, it’s definitely, yeah, definitely not. Definitely not.
Nick McGowan (38:00.77)
Yeah.
Nick McGowan (38:04.195)
The world’s Yeah.
Nick McGowan (38:11.823)
And those are the great people to be able to work with, have conversations with. And I think I don’t want to tell people what to do, but if there’s somebody that’s only saying, want just positivity in my life and I won’t handle any negativity that you have to be able to talk about real things, they’re repressed. And there are things that they actually need to work through and you’re probably not going to be able to help them with that. So being able to step away and go, okay, cool, noted. You deal with it on your own.
I’m glad you brought up the entrepreneurs because when you really get into deep conversation with entrepreneurs after they get past the, I’m great and hear all the things and they’re like, fuck our process is so fucked right now. And I have no idea where the money’s coming in next month. And we spend so much money and God, why do we have so much fucking inventory? What’s the deal with all these things? Like you get into those deeper things where it’s like, wow, those people that are leading that need to be healed too. They probably need to sleep more and meditate, et cetera.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (39:07.517)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Nick McGowan (39:09.754)
Well, look it has been absolutely wonderful to have you on I appreciate the time before we let you go Where can people find you and where can they connect with
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (39:18.321)
Yeah, the best place to find me is my website drnikeshahamond .com, drnikeshahamond .com or on Instagram, dr .hamond.
Nick McGowan (39:31.716)
Beautiful. Again, thank you so much for your time today. It’s been a
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (39:35.613)
Thank you.
https://youtu.be/2mPhCqRs_AI
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By Nick McGowan“You deserve to have emotional health. You deserve to be emotionally healthy. You deserve to have joy. You deserve to be happy.”
In this episode, Nick speaks with Dr. Nekeshia Hammond, a psychologist and burnout prevention expert. They discuss the importance of self-care and reflection in preventing burnout, emphasize the need to unlearn the go-go-go mentality, and prioritize mental health and well-being. While it’s not always easy, practicing self-care and reflection can lead to a healthier and more fulfilling life, so they discuss strategies for preventing burnout and finding healing.
What to listen for:
“It’s life-changing when you put things into play to take care of yourself physically, emotionally, mentally, spiritually.”
“It all goes together. The physical affects the mental, the mental affects the physical.”
“All of us need our non-negotiables, whatever that looks like for you.”
About Dr. Nekeshia Hammond
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond is a respected psychologist, executive coach, and founder of Hammond Psychology & Associates. She is known for her expertise in mental health, burnout prevention, and leadership development, and she’s an international speaker and bestselling author. Dr. Hammond’s insights have been featured on NBC, ABC, CBS, FOX, and Essence Magazine, as well as platforms like Corporate Counsel Women of Color and TEDx, focusing on mental wellness and leadership balance.
Resources:
Check out these other episodes about burnout.
Interested in starting your own podcast or need help with one you already have? Send Nick an email or schedule a time to discuss your podcast today!
Thank you for listening!
Please subscribe on iTunes and give us a 5-Star review! https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-mindset-and-self-mastery-show/id1604262089
Watch Clips and highlights: www.youtube.com/channel/UCk1tCM7KTe3hrq_-UAa6GHA
Guest Inquiries right here: [email protected]
Your Friends at “The Mindset & Self-Mastery Show”
Click To View The Episode Transcript
Nick McGowan (00:00.15)
Hello and welcome to the Mindset and Self -Mastery Show. I’m your host, Nick McGowan and today on the show we have Dr. Hammond. Dr. Hammond, how are you doing today?
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (00:06.354)
Yes.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (00:21.36)
I am wonderful. How are you?
Nick McGowan (00:22.946)
I’m good. It’s taken us a little while to get to this point. It’s funny. So for the audience that’s listening to this, we’ve had a bunch of technical issues and just BS. We’ve been joking and laughing through the entire thing, but there was like two minutes away from just totally rescheduling. this is potentially going to be the best or the worst episode ever. No, it’ll probably be totally fine no matter what. So let me just take a little bit of step back. Why don’t you tell us what you do for a living? And one thing that most people don’t know about you, that’s maybe a
Bazaar.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (00:54.729)
Awesome. So I’m Dr. Nikesha Hammond. I’m a psychologist, author, speaker. I’ve had a private practice. I’ve owned a private practice now for the past 15 years and I’m partially in the practice doing psychological evaluations and the other part of the time in the community working on burnout prevention with corporations and different organizations. I’m also a wife and a mom and a volunteer community leader. So I’m juggling a lot of tasks like everyone else.
And let’s see, I think my close, well definitely my close friends know, but something most people don’t know about me is I am a Gator football fanatic. Like I bleed orange and blue. And yeah, I have a different personality when I watch Gator football games, so I try not to watch them in professional settings. So yeah, I would say that’s me in a nutshell.
Nick McGowan (01:49.869)
So can I call in the Gator fan for this? No? No, calling you in as the Gator fan. I can see the Gator helmet obviously in the background too.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (01:54.409)
Sure. You want to call a Gator fan? call me. yes, for sure. For sure. For sure. well, yes. Yeah, have… The whole room is Gator themed, so yes. I did. I did. That’s my alma mater. Yes.
Nick McGowan (02:08.959)
Nice, nice. Is that where you went to school or is, okay. That’s cool. and it sounds like you do a lot of different things. There are people just in general that will feel like they have to do a lot of things. They’ll have to be at those games. They’ll have to be at tailgating as I’m sure you may. they’ll have to do all the different things that their kids want them to do that they feel like they should do. And as you started to rattle some of that stuff off, my first thought was like, well,
I could understand if somebody’s burnt out by it, but if you then get to talk to people about burnout, especially going to businesses and working with them and their employees for burnout, I think there’s a lot of stuff that we can get in with that because overall just the thought and the idea of burnout can be kind of a surface level thing for people where they’re like, yeah, I’m just constantly burnt. So next fucking question. Or they’re like, I don’t know what else to do. This is just what I should do.
So what does your overall take when it comes to just being burnt
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (03:09.737)
Yeah, I love that. I speak, when I speak about burnout prevention, it’s really from a personal lens and professional lens. So yes, obviously I’ve been in the field as a mental health professional for 15 years now, but also personally, I totally get it. Like for that person that’s like, I don’t have time for the self care. I have 500 things I’m juggling, whatever for the burnout prevention thing. Like I get it because I used to be in that mental space before I did hit burnout. And
really though is life changing when you put things into play to take care of yourself physically, emotionally, mentally, spiritually. It’s something that I like said personally had to work on as well because for me growing up and I think for a lot of people, we weren’t taught about mental health. We weren’t taught about taking care of ourselves, right? Like it was just a go, go, go mentality, achieve, achieve. like, I just remember I’m like, I never took a breath. Like I never stopped to think
wait a minute, yes, do all these achievements and that’s great, but you’re breaking down, like that’s not okay in the process and you’re not fully who you need to be and show up for in the different eras you are anyway when you’re burnt out and you deserve better than that. So it’s definitely possible, but it takes a mindset shift for that to happen.
Nick McGowan (04:28.731)
It also takes somebody like yourself to be able to change that. So even within your own little world, you and your children and your family and your friends for you to be able to be that example. If we think about our parents, they were taught this is how you do it. Their parents were taught this is how you do it. And whatever generation you are, you’re only a few generations away from the depression era when people were like, you have to do things this way.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (04:33.297)
Mm -hmm. Yeah.
Nick McGowan (04:56.308)
And the, start of factories coming in just before that and people saying, you have to do this and I need to work so that I can feed all your little kids and we can do these things and whatever else. I oftentimes will think about the way that I grew up. had my mom and my dad separate. And I kind of had that rich dad, poor dad scenario, but it was more or less rich dad, poor mom. And a lot of it was the negative mindset of
Well, I have to do these things and it sucks, but I just need to do it. And I think there’s something to be said where you can, you can take that as a kind of a bit of an energy boost in a sense to do it. But it does take you or somebody being able to step back and go, my God, what do I really need to do this? But I think that also brings in generational trauma at that point, because it just been handed down, handed down where people go, well, we all did this. We’ve all gone to Florida university, or we’ve all gone
whatever, now you should do the same thing. How do you feel about
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (05:57.639)
Yeah, that’s, I’m really glad you brought that up because it can be difficult, honestly, when we have to think about unlearning how we were raised sometimes, like how we were brought up. So for myself, I grew up in a single parent home. It was me and my brother at that time and my mom who worked multiple jobs because she was like, need to, you know, my kids have to have a good education, good place to live and all the things which I’m grateful for. But what that taught me was like, okay, just go, go, go run yourself ragged.
Hustle hard all those things like no self -care was allowed. No relaxation is allowed, but you burn out that way, right? But you and no matter how you raise like you you have to unlearn some of the things just because your parents did it and your grandparents and your great -grandparents Did it a certain way. We’re in a different like we’re in a different time now, right? We’re in a different time. So we have to do things differently We’re learning now more yay about mental health about self -care like it’s okay to take care of yourself and
still thrive, still be successful. It’s not an or. Like I was having a conversation once with an organization and they were like, well, I won’t say the name of the organization, but they were like, you know, like it’s this idea, which is not true of like, well, if you teach about self care, does that mean our employees are not going to work hard? And I’m like, no, not at all. Like, please work hard. I work hard still. I’m still doing a ton of things, but the difference is now self care is in place.
So I don’t burn out because I have to be a wife and a mom and a community leader and a business owner and all these other things. like, you can’t show up powerfully for yourself and for the people around you if you’re not taking care of yourself. But it’s a lot, like you said earlier, it’s a lot that we have to unlearn. Like a lot from our upbringing.
Nick McGowan (07:38.27)
Yeah. Yeah. All right. And even with the unlearning, it’s not like, it’s not like every single thing that you’ve been taught, you need to get rid of, you know, we, we learn things from people. Sometimes it’s what not to do probably more often than not. and you also learn things to do, but then we have to make that decision. And I think there’s also a gradient to it. There are certain energetic types that really thrive almost in
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (07:49.18)
No.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (07:53.374)
Mm -hmm.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (08:01.875)
Mm -hmm.
Nick McGowan (08:05.802)
where they have to have things being chaotic. Some of those people, mean, if we really dug deep, it’s because of the trauma they had as a child. And they feel like this is how I should do life and this is how I can win in life. But there are also the energetics that really actually thrive in, it’s a tough spot, I can do this thing and they can hit the ground running. Most people aren’t like that. But most people feel like they need to be because they see other people do it. And like you’d mentioned, mom did it, my grandma did it, this person did
all the way back to Roman times, they’ve all done it. It’s like, that doesn’t actually work for us, but we do need to actually see where that gradient is. Now, in the life that you have, doing all the different things that you’re doing, if you take a step back, and maybe just using you as the example isn’t the best thing here, but for anybody that has kids, has a career, has all these different things that are going on, being able to step back and ask yourself, do I want this?
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (08:44.531)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.
Nick McGowan (09:04.094)
How do I feel about these things? But how do you work with people when they have to pull themselves out of that to then look at it from a third party perspective, which can be sometimes difficult when you’re so inundated and so overwhelmed by
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (09:19.305)
Yeah. And I would definitely say you actually hit the nail on the head. The number one thing that I’ve seen as an issue, if I really look back over the past 15 years in this field, once I became licensed, 15 years in this field, is that people don’t, we don’t take enough time to reflect, like taking the step back because we’re so in our situations, whether it’s family work, school, whatever it is, we’re
in our situations, we’re overwhelmed, we’re stressed out. We’re not taking a moment to reflect. So like you said, like these are three questions I often tell people to ask themselves, hopefully at least once a week is number one, how am I doing? And be honest with yourself because typically we’re checking in with everyone else around us, but we’re not checking in with ourselves. So you have to ask yourself, how am I doing? And then the second thing to ask yourself
What do I need? So physically, emotionally, spiritually, mentally, you know, we’re all in different places depending on what’s going on in our lives. Sometimes we’re at a really dark season. Sometimes we’re at a joyous season or somewhere in between, but what do you need? And then the third question to ask yourself is what step do I need to take today in order to improve my life?
depending on your energy level, you might be at a point where you’re like, I’m ready to take a leap or you’re ready to take a baby step. And both of those are correct. It just depends on where you’re at. how are you doing? Are you overwhelmed, stressed out and frazzled? Maybe you could just take a baby step or maybe you need to take a break, which counts too. Or are you at a great place and you have the momentum and you’re like, I’m ready to take a leap in my self care or in my physical growth, emotional, spiritual, mental growth.
Both of those are the correct answer. again, like you said, it takes you reflecting on what is going on with you. And that’s definitely of the thousands and thousands of people that I’ve met from all over the world at this point, that is something that we are missing is taking a minute and reflecting and checking in with ourselves.
Nick McGowan (11:33.423)
And let’s break that down a little bit more because it can be easy for you and I to have this conversation. It can be easy for whoever’s listening to this to do whatever they’re doing to just listen to a conversation. It can be easy to just fucking talk about things, but it’s not easy to do the work. Obviously it’s important and imperative for us to do the work, but we have to understand that it takes time to be able to do it. Like I’ve had conversations with people about this. We’re like, look, man,
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (11:39.774)
Mm -hmm.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (11:45.907)
Mm -hmm.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (11:58.04)
yeah,
Nick McGowan (12:00.998)
If I just have this conversation, I just ask myself, am I okay? Or am I doing this thing or whatever? It’s like, it’s not going to fix me. I get that. Like the whole point is to be able to actually have those conversations and check in and work through it. But understand that us just playing on Instagram or screwing around watching TV isn’t actually checking in with yourself and being able to work through it. So what sort of advice do you give to somebody that’s trying to figure out like, how do I actually work through these?
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (12:07.781)
Mm -hmm.
Nick McGowan (12:29.978)
How do I peel out a little bit of time for myself without feeling shame from peeling something away from somebody else?
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (12:38.237)
Yeah, so definitely allowing yourself to have the mindset shift that you deserve to have emotional health. You deserve to be emotionally healthy. You deserve to have joy. You deserve to be happy. For some of us, we are struggling with self -love, which could deal from childhood trauma or something that happened even yesterday. Like we’re dealing with worthiness issues and self -love and all those sorts of things. But
It makes such a huge difference when you work and taking care of yourself. So another concrete thing that I encourage people to do is what I call take a minute for yourself daily, a minimum of a minute daily. And you can even time yourself with your cell phone like 60 seconds because I started like this as well. Cause I was in a place, a mental place where I was just like, I don’t have time for this. don’t have time for self care. Like it was just, that’s what made sense to me back then.
Nick McGowan (13:20.476)
Mm -hmm.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (13:33.577)
But I was like, okay, fine. have 60 seconds, right? So you take a minute and whether it’s taking a walk outside, I love nature, so I love being in nature, but whether it’s watching the sunrise, the sunset, drinking a cup of tea, I’m a tea drinker, prayer if you believe in that, deep breaths, whatever it is for you in that one minute, what that does is no, it’s not gonna solve all your problems, but you start to retrain your brain.
So your brain understands you deserve and need to reset and recharge. You need the downtime. Your brain and your body do not need to be in a constant state of fight or flight. it is so unhealthy, physically and emotionally unhealthy to constantly be and like, what’s next? What do I do? What’s on the to -do list? I gotta do this, I gotta do that. Like it can, it will ruin your health if you stay in that state. But again, starting with taking the minute.
to reset and recharge is like a tangible thing that you can start with in order to start seeing the improvements that you need.
Nick McGowan (14:38.577)
We sometimes forget that we are a machine. Like the organism needs rest. We don’t, we don’t always get the rest that we need. Even if we sleep, we’re not always getting the rest because we’re stressed or what have you. But I, I, at different times we’ll think about like, if I leave my computer on for a few days, it’ll start to just slow down. If you leave your phone on, you really need to turn these off and reconnect them to the network at least once a week.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (14:42.066)
Yes.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (14:45.683)
Yes.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (14:58.493)
Mm -hmm.
Nick McGowan (15:06.407)
But if it just keeps getting bogged down and bogged down and bogged down and you have problems and we forget about that as people where we’re like, no, I’m good. Just keep moving along. And it’s like, it just gets worse and worse and worse. But taking the 60 seconds is again, an easy thing for us to talk about. It can be hard to be able to put that stuff in the use, but being able to, that’s where the discipline comes into play. And look, I’ve had my own problems with that where I’ve tried different things. I’ve had hour long or two hour long whole
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (15:11.155)
Mm -hmm.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (15:18.275)
Yes, it does.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (15:23.944)
Yeah.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (15:33.565)
Mm -hmm.
Nick McGowan (15:36.262)
Routines in the morning and at night and then some that are not at all, but it’s funny I was actually having a conversation with my mental health coach where we were talking about the little routines that we do like meditating or Journaling or whatever the thing is it works for you I try to at least at least meditate for five minutes at least five minutes I’m typically a lot better between 10 and 20 minutes two times a day, but sometimes it doesn’t
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (15:48.637)
Yes.
Nick McGowan (16:03.824)
But being able to actually spend that little bit of time, again, the conversation I was having with my mental health coach was like, isn’t it funny how when we don’t do those things, that’s typically a rough day. But when you do those things, you’re like, I feel a little better. So even just taking that moment, and that’s for each person to be able to figure out where do you take that moment? Now you’ve got kids, you’ve got a family, you’ve got friends, you’ve got responsibilities in community, you’ve got a business, you got all these things to some people.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (16:14.557)
Yep.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (16:18.949)
Yep. Yeah.
Nick McGowan (16:32.783)
hearing just the list of stuff like that makes them just want to pour a drink. So how do you find the
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (16:40.137)
Yeah, I love how you said that. And it does feel like that some days. It’s just like, wait, what? I look up and I’m like, Exactly. Like, wait, how did 800 things get on my to -do list? No, but I make the commitment. I believe in non -negotiables. I think all of us need our non -negotiables, whatever that looks like for you. So the only way that I can do my crazy busy schedule currently is because I have a commitment.
Nick McGowan (16:45.621)
You’re like, my god.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (17:10.109)
to my non -negotiables and my self -care. So like now when I wake up in the morning, I no longer like run to my email. Like the first thing I used to do is run to my phone. What’s the email I missed from last night or checking Instagram or something else. For me, it’s like, no, I immediately when I open my eyes, it’s like gratitude practice for me personally, because of my faith, I do a devotional prayer. Like that’s how I start my day. It’s very intentional. do take, I take more than a minute now, but I started out with
being as disciplined as possible with taking that minute, which is so necessary. When you take the minute, when you start this and you’re like, my God, I didn’t even know I was that stressed out or my body was that tense. Like it really is life changing. And then physical exercise, extremely important to me now, getting sleep, extremely important to me. So it’s really about purposely living a life where you’re like, yes, all these external things matter to me because they do, but so does my physical and emotional and mental
Nick McGowan (17:48.526)
Yeah.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (18:08.797)
Like those things are important too. So when you get to that mindset, because I’m like, I’m not going back. You know, I’m not going back to the burnt out, stressed out all the time, overwhelmed person, because also that doesn’t help me in the roles that I currently have anyhow. It doesn’t help me and it doesn’t help the people around me. So that’s how I quote unquote do it all is like, what is making sure I have my non -negotiables, setting my boundaries and doing my best to live a very healthy life.
Nick McGowan (18:38.264)
And you still have days. Rough days. Everybody does. Yeah.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (18:40.795)
of course. yeah. yeah. Yeah. yeah. Those days are still there. Yeah, it’s not a perfect life for sure. No, no. Yeah.
Nick McGowan (18:45.454)
Yeah. And the reason why I bring that up is so that we can talk about like, are times where I’m sure both of us have those days where you’re like, damn, I should have done this differently. I should have done that, but still showing grace to yourself and being able to understand like, all right, well do what you can in the day that you have be present, but then also try to figure out little systems for yourself. Like if, if it’s a matter of, look, I have to get up and not instantly just look at Instagram or whatever it
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (18:57.314)
for sure. Yeah. Exactly.
Yes.
Nick McGowan (19:14.852)
then maybe you actually need to look at how you’re relating to those things. Like I’m no longer on social media active in the way that I was before, because I used to do the same thing. I’ve just instantly wake up and next thing you know, I’m like 15, 20 minutes into Instagram. I’m like, how the hell did I get here? I need to go to the bathroom and brush my teeth and like do life, you know? But being able to set yourself up to not fail as often may just look like moving your phone.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (19:31.305)
Yep. Yeah, yeah.
Nick McGowan (19:42.327)
or figuring out a way, like how do I do this? What do I do to be able to get myself out? If you have pets, it’s an easy way. You just go walk them or what have you. But are there little things that you’ve figured out for yourself that work with how you are and who you are to be able to make sure that you do those things more consistently?
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (20:00.829)
Yeah. So I make it a point, for example, so I travel a lot and go into different cities and whatnot with speaking engagements and different work projects. So I’m a window seat girl, but I make it a point. I’m like, okay, open the window, like look outside, you know, just really take a minute to like observe nature. Like I’m a nature lover. So if it’s a sunset or sunrise or there’s just clouds or wherever it is, like, but it’s
It’s just being intentional and that’s just a small thing, but it really does like, okay, just reset, recharge for a second. Like even if I’m on the plane or, the same thing with the mornings, like there’s no morning that I want to miss because I need to start my day with some inspiration and motivation, honestly, because some days, like you said, like they’re rough, like they’re hard and it still is your overall, you’re stressed out, but it helps a little bit more often to put something in the place to almost like buffer
So doesn’t feel as heavy. It’s still heavy. Whatever you’re going through is still heavy. But when you put certain things into place, it can make it a little bit easier to get through.
Nick McGowan (21:08.671)
And if we think of those things that you do, that’s almost like a doorway into the other things that can help you also heal. Just like spending that time to go, my gosh, and I didn’t know that I was that stressed out or that my body is like screaming. Like, can we finally just calm down or thank you or what have you and being able to actually step through those. I think that’s the thing that we can all remind ourselves of, even if this sucks to do this thing, you don’t want to do it. You’re just trying to figure out what’s the thing that’s right for me to do.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (21:22.063)
yeah.
Nick McGowan (21:38.391)
The more that we do those things, the more that we’re opening ourselves up to what else is deeper. our subconscious will start to talk to us about that and say, this is what’s going on, but we’ve got to be part of that. And when you work with the clients specifically that are not just burnt out, but there’s deeper reasons why they’re burnt out. How do you work with them to be able to understand that the burnout is just a symptom? It’s really deeper problems that maybe aren’t being looked at that subconsciously they’re terrified
at like how do I get out of this career? I don’t want this relationship or I don’t want to do this thing but they’re afraid to do that so they just keep perpetuating the burnout. How do you work with them
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (22:23.163)
Yeah, yeah, great question. so there are some organizations that I speak with where people are vulnerable, which is great, and start to express it. Sometimes people know what their burnout is connected to. And again, it could be something when they were growing up learning, they’re not good enough or they’re not fill in the blank. They’re not pretty enough or they’re not the, you their size or their height. Like there’s all sorts
different things that we start off with telling ourselves why we’re not good enough or we’re not worthy of self love or we’re not worthy of taking a break on those sorts of things. And then we learn that and have to unlearn that. But what I always encourage people to understand is that you don’t have to go through this process alone. So if you know that there’s a deeper issue going on with you, there are so many individuals who are, that can be helpful to you. So whether it’s a coach, whether it’s
a mental health professional, whether it’s a mentor, friend, it really depends on what exactly is you’re going through. But nonetheless, don’t think you have to go through all this alone, especially if you’ve already tried and you’re like, I’m so overwhelmed. I don’t feel like anything’s working and that sort of thing. Please reach out to someone else around you who can be helpful for you during this process. Because sometimes as a former therapist, I will say sometimes it’s just not enough to try to figure it all out on your own and you don’t have
That’s why there’s professionals out there who can help to guide you through that process so you can heal through certain traumas that you haven’t fully healed through yet and then be that much stronger and better on other side, if you will, of the healing.
Nick McGowan (24:00.298)
Yeah. I want to also add that therapy isn’t always just the answer. There’s so much more to it. There are different modalities, there are different treatments, different ways to go about it. So I think about the people that are like, what the fuck, man, I’ve talked to people before. I don’t want to talk to anybody else anymore. It’s because really the trauma is still within their cells and needs to be processed out and talking.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (24:15.698)
Yeah.
Nick McGowan (24:25.407)
works for certain people. even I have a mental health coach that I work with and that’s a lot of talk therapy. But I also have acupressure that I go through in deep subconscious processing sessions with sometimes take fucking hours. But you’ve got to go through that work to be able to couple that all together. But we also need to figure out what works for us. So trying different things, EMDR, DBT, all the different things to be able to try them out. It’s not just when people talk about therapy, they think I’m just talking to somebody.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (24:32.349)
Yeah. Yep.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (24:44.871)
Yes. Yes.
Nick McGowan (24:53.845)
and somebody’s asking me, how do you feel about that? That’s not always the answer, but what sort of modalities and things do you work with to be able to help people beyond the level of just therapy?
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (25:06.131)
Yeah, and you’re absolutely right. I, a mental health professional, I also stand by that because there are billions of people on the planet, billions of people, everyone doesn’t need therapy, even though I thought that at the beginning of my career, because we learn and heal differently. So I, yes, I’m definitely an advocate for therapy, but for some people that’s just not the route and that’s okay.
And for some people it’s going to work amazing. So there are ways, there’s so many ways, but physically to take care of yourself. Like you said before, I mean, there’s acupuncture and there’s acupressure and there’s yoga and there’s all sorts of physical things that you can work on to, to heal yourself in that way. And then emotionally, I know there’s a lot of different retreats out there now, which I think are amazing. I’ve actually personally been on different retreats around the world, which had very huge healing properties. You don’t
to do that though, if that’s not your thing. But there’s that aspect. And then there are some of us who need more social support around us. doesn’t necessarily have to be therapeutic or it I’m sorry, it is therapeutic, it doesn’t necessarily have to be from a mental health professional. But that extra support, that extended support can be helpful as well. But there’s, yeah, there’s a lot
I mean, there’s apps now, like there’s so much that’s out there. It’s just the most important thing again is taking a step back for you and knowing like, what do you need? Like how are you doing and what works best for you? And like you said too, sometimes you have to try different things and you’re like, try this. Nope, that doesn’t work for me. I know for myself personally, when I read a lot of self -help books and they’re like, just wake up at like the crack, like four o ‘clock in the morning and start your day. like, not, not for me. Like I’m not a morning person.
I’m gonna read the book for the night owls, you know? Like, I’m not gonna try that, because I know that’s not gonna work for me, right? But I mean, but seriously, like do what works best for you. And again, if you try something, I’ve tried sound therapy, like there’s so many different things. You try something, you’re like, that’s not for me, then you try something else. But there’s something that works for you. I truly believe that. There’s something that works best for you. You put that into place and you work, continue to work on your healing journey.
Nick McGowan (27:20.787)
Yeah, this is all, it’s a fun process when we really look at it outside of being in the shit when you’re working through it. Because if, if you’re going through a deep processing session and someone’s like, isn’t this fun? You’re like, that’s the wrong F word. It’s close, but not totally there. because it’d be tough. There’s a lot of stuff to go through, but figuring out like, let me try this. Let me work on this. Let me try this thing. Even for somebody that says like you dimension, they’re different apps, just downloading an app and just trying it, giving
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (27:33.575)
Yeah.
Nick McGowan (27:50.4)
that try of a few days. Wake up at dumb o ‘clock in the morning and see if your body actually works with that. Some people are like, man, I feel great when I wake up at two or three, like beautiful. I have a really difficult time even getting my ass close to bed by like 1130 midnight and trying to get enough sleep. And I think it’s a thing that back to burnout. We think, well, if I go to bed later, I can get more stuff done. And if I will wake up earlier, I can get more stuff done.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (27:59.301)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (28:04.937)
Yeah.
Nick McGowan (28:17.972)
Then you’re looking at like a four, maybe five hour window of sleep. Some people’s bodies are okay with that. Most of us, the organism is not. It’s screaming like, need water and I need sleep. And what is your problem? Why aren’t you giving me these things? But just to test that stuff out can be huge. Are there things that you’ve found that really have helped the majority of the clients that you work with to kind of take that next
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (28:44.029)
Yeah, definitely. I’m glad you mentioned the sleep. Sleep is so critically important. I say that as a person, like you said earlier, I used to purposely, highly would not recommend it, but get like two, three, four hours averaging of sleep. I was exhausted. It led to brain fog, couldn’t concentrate. I can go down a whole list of things that happened, but in my mind, it made sense, like because I was like, let me be more productive and let me sleep later. Like hustle hard. Like it was ridiculous.
And I’m like, no, that’s so not healthy. So doing your best, if you have to reach out to a sleep specialist, because a lot of people I’ve talked to struggle with sleep, struggle with turning their minds off, if you will, at night. And what that leads to though is restless sleep. You’re not getting good quality sleep. It definitely affects your physical and mental health. So again, if you need to, well, try on your own to get sleep, but if that still doesn’t work, like connecting with a sleep specialist.
to see what is the best route for you and on the physical level too, because it all goes together. The physical affects the mental, the mental affects the physical. It all goes together. a cycle.
Nick McGowan (29:54.012)
Yeah. And if we look at, right, well, I’m getting a handful of hours of sleep and I’m still feeling stressed and whatever. And I’ve done the same thing. I, there are times where I think about, had a colleague I worked with years ago and she was like, you’re always running around. You’re doing all these things. And like, my God, what do you do? was like, I get four hours of sleep and drink too much fucking coffee and off I went. And then hit me years later. I was like, my God, gross. But that was for me to be able to learn through that and figure that out. If we’re going to bed.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (29:59.069)
Mm -hmm. yeah.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (30:18.599)
Yeah. Yes.
Nick McGowan (30:22.855)
and we’re only getting a handful of hours of sleep and you’re not actually getting restful sleep, that’s where you can figure out, well, maybe I need to meditate for a minute, two minutes, just turn everything off, that can shift it, but that’s again, part of that discovery process of like, huh, what’s gonna work for me? And I’m glad that you’re, I’m really glad that you mentioned when you first started that therapy was like, this is the savior in a sense. It’s not. well, I mean,
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (30:32.275)
Mm -hmm.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (30:47.219)
Yeah, I believe that in my 20s.
Nick McGowan (30:50.436)
We all kind of look at what’s the thing where we go, cool, this could be it. And we also want to look for the savior in a sense, not to bring faith into it, but there’s a religion specifically, more so faith, the faith of having, I know that I’ll be okay. I know that this will work out. And if you believe in God or you believe in the energy or whatever you believe in, just understand that good things are happening for us and we get to do this, but we also get to look through and see how do I work with
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (30:55.357)
Yeah.
Nick McGowan (31:19.846)
If somebody just says, talk to somebody and that doesn’t feel right, you’ve got to understand why it doesn’t feel right. It might just be a weird thing because somebody, when you’re eight years old, told you, we don’t talk to people, but it might be a weird thing because you’re terrified because of the stuff that you go through. So once you get somebody that’s actually in that spot where they’re like, look, I want to heal. I want to grow from this. What sort of path do you take them on to be able to figure out what helps them grow for them personally?
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (31:48.403)
Yeah, so a lot of times with the organizations, it’s more of a larger question if you will, but one of the things that is a part of it, like you said, with growth, it is physical growth, emotional, mental, and also spiritual, depending on people’s different belief systems, of course. But it really is taking a look at what are your strengths, what lights you up, what brings you joy, who is in
support corner, if you will, because sometimes we also have to, which is hard, but really take a step back when we look at our relationships in our life. I mean like friendships, coworkers, if you have a significant other, like the people around you, are they fully supporting you or are there some toxic individuals? How do you change the amount of time sometimes that you spend with certain people if they’re not uplifting and motivating and inspiring you? it’s
There’s really more of an assessment that has to happen and it’s very individual based of physically, are you doing emotionally? How are you doing mentally and spiritually? But I will say that the support piece is also really the social support piece is also critically important. And actually last year the US Surgeon General, he out a report that loneliness there was like a loneliness epidemic that was happening and how
Loneliness, usually he’s talking about like smoking and diabetes and all sorts of physical issues affect us physically, but loneliness can also affect us physically and emotionally and like really tear us down where we’re not connecting with others in the way that we need to. So again, taking that assessment too of like socially, how are you doing and how are you connected with others? And for anyone listening to this who right now is like, you know,
there are some toxic people in your corner, just know too that there are a lot of people in the world who want to support you, who care about you, who are good for your mental health. It’s a matter of being connected and finding those said individuals though.
Nick McGowan (33:55.453)
And that takes the steps to be able to actually start moving in that direction and look at those things. It’s interesting about the loneliness. I think that’s a symptom of the pandemic that happened four years
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (34:01.851)
Yes.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (34:07.911)
It got worse after yes, for sure. For
Nick McGowan (34:08.891)
Yeah. And it’s also a symptom of social media and the surface lives that we see where we go, well, these people are doing all these crazy, amazing things. Okay. I was talking to somebody recently where it was like even the curated people that have cameras following them around. They’re curating that they’re showing you what they want to show you. And the people that are trying to be authentic. I think that’s where this platform, not just my show,
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (34:17.233)
Nick McGowan (34:36.764)
Podcasts that are like this. This is a fucking live conversation those of you that will listen to this It’ll be down the road, but this is live like this isn’t curated as much and then I think Understanding from our own person that we want to curate things We want things to be a certain way maybe because of a generational trauma or how you feel Life should look because of what somebody else said we need to be able to step back and look at those things You’d be difficult to do it. I’m glad that you’ve been able to talk
Not only the stuff that has worked for you, but that you’ve been able to talk in front of and inspire a lot of people to actually start to look at those things from a personal lens instead of how do I do this as a community or what have you. For the people that are trying to figure out how do we go about this, what sort of advice do you give to somecbody that’s on their path towards self
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (35:27.377)
Yeah, that’s great. So, so definitely taking the steps, asking yourself those questions as like related to how are you doing? What do you need? What steps do you need to take? Again, who, who is it for you right now that maybe you have this person already in your life. Maybe you’re like, I have a rock star therapist or I have a rock star or significant other or coworker, mentor, coach, whomever it is. Maybe you already have those people.
But if you don’t, what is a step that you need to take next for your growth and for your self mastery? Because again, typically I have found that this is not a, it starts off alone, if you will, like asking yourself these questions, but it’s not a process that you’re doing by yourself. Where I’m at now, thankfully, and extremely grateful for in my physical, mental, emotional, and spiritual health is I didn’t do this alone. So I have.
amazing mentors, still great coaches, great communities that I’m a part of. Like we are just positive people, you know, kind of cheering each other on, helping our helping each other in business and personal life to kind of get through and navigate. But it really does take a larger community, but finding the people for you who make sense to move you forward in the direction of the self mastery and the healing process that we’re all on
Nick McGowan (36:54.435)
And I think there’s a, it’s important that you keep talking about the community aspect, the positivity of it. Something that I’m sure we both agree on, but haven’t actually touched on. And I want to do it for the cynical people. Listen to this. We’re not just talking about fucking sunshine and rainbows and people that are like, you need to positive your way through all these things. You need to be able to have conversation with people that can say, this is really tough right now. Are you all right? How are you doing? Like this
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (37:13.467)
no. yeah, no.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (37:21.734)
yeah,
Nick McGowan (37:24.229)
This is a tough situation and somebody that’s just like, no, I don’t want any of the negativity. Just there are times where people reach out to me. Like you can’t just mindset your way through life. It’s like, got it. I understand that you can’t, it’s a part of it, but you actually need to look at those tough things too. And like you were saying, having a community or having people that are in your corner that you can have both sides of those conversations with and be able to listen to or hear from you
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (37:38.045)
Yeah.
Nick McGowan (37:50.095)
be able to work through that stuff is not just a everything in the world is always going to be great because that’s not the way it is.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (37:55.677)
Definitely not. I’m in a lot of communities with entrepreneurs and those are not the conversations. Like everything’s great and perfect. No, we’re like, my gosh, like today is crazy or this week. Help me. No, no, it’s definitely, yeah, definitely not. Definitely not.
Nick McGowan (38:00.77)
Yeah.
Nick McGowan (38:04.195)
The world’s Yeah.
Nick McGowan (38:11.823)
And those are the great people to be able to work with, have conversations with. And I think I don’t want to tell people what to do, but if there’s somebody that’s only saying, want just positivity in my life and I won’t handle any negativity that you have to be able to talk about real things, they’re repressed. And there are things that they actually need to work through and you’re probably not going to be able to help them with that. So being able to step away and go, okay, cool, noted. You deal with it on your own.
I’m glad you brought up the entrepreneurs because when you really get into deep conversation with entrepreneurs after they get past the, I’m great and hear all the things and they’re like, fuck our process is so fucked right now. And I have no idea where the money’s coming in next month. And we spend so much money and God, why do we have so much fucking inventory? What’s the deal with all these things? Like you get into those deeper things where it’s like, wow, those people that are leading that need to be healed too. They probably need to sleep more and meditate, et cetera.
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (39:07.517)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Nick McGowan (39:09.754)
Well, look it has been absolutely wonderful to have you on I appreciate the time before we let you go Where can people find you and where can they connect with
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (39:18.321)
Yeah, the best place to find me is my website drnikeshahamond .com, drnikeshahamond .com or on Instagram, dr .hamond.
Nick McGowan (39:31.716)
Beautiful. Again, thank you so much for your time today. It’s been a
Dr. Nekeshia Hammond (39:35.613)
Thank you.
https://youtu.be/2mPhCqRs_AI