Into The Mud Podcast

Comedian and Emmy-winning writer Josh Gondelman (Last Week Tonight, Desus & Mero, The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel) joins Into the Mud to get candid about the messy gap between impressive résumés and follower counts. We dig into how social media has reshaped comedy, the pressure of clout-chasing, and whether quality or quantity really wins in today’s entertainment industry. Plus, Josh shares hilarious “muddy moments” from high school drama competitions to life on the comedy stage.

Bio: Josh Gondelman is a comedian and writer based in New York City. He was head writer and executive producer for Desus & Mero on Showtime, contributed to the final season of The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel, and spent five years at Last Week Tonight with John Oliver, where he won four Emmy Awards, two Peabody Awards, and three WGA Awards. His standup specials People Pleaser (2022) and Positive Reinforcement (2025) are streaming now.

Gondelman’s comedy has been featured on Conan, Late Night with Seth Meyers, The Late Late Show with James Corden, and NPR’s Wait Wait…Don’t Tell Me. He is also the author of the essay collection Nice Try and co-creator of the viral “Modern Seinfeld” Twitter account.

Josh’s Social Media: @JoshGondelman, www.JoshGondelman.com, and www.ThatsMarvelousNewsletter.com .

Follow along at @IntoTheMudPodcast on all platforms!
For the visual version, follow along on YouTube!

Your Hosts: Alex Kumin (@Alex.Kumin) and Drew King (@DrewKingNYC). 

Contributing Editors: Manthan Baldha, Sarah Webb (@SWAudioPost) and Drew King.

Filmed and recorded at @TheMalin in New York City.

www.IntoTheMudPodcast.com

Porn star and former Broadway music director Jonah Wheeler (aka @ShowoffJonah) joins Into the Mud for an unfiltered deep dive into sex work, kink, and intimacy. From his career pivot out of theater to the realities of OnlyFans, public sex, radical queer spaces, and even the lessons learned from butthole surgery, Jonah gets real about the liberating power of body acceptance, confidence, shame, and the joy of sexual exploration.

Bio: Jonah Wheeler is an adult performer, musician, and general goofball based in New York City. His videos center around authentic connection, self discovery, and roleplay, and his social media work is known for meticulous explications of queer kink. A former Broadway pianist, he performs live with his partner in life and in comedy John Coons.

Jonah’s Social Media: @ShowOffJonah, www.ShowOffJonah.com

Follow along at @IntoTheMudPodcast on all platforms!
For the visual version, follow along on YouTube!

Your Hosts: Alex Kumin (@Alex.Kumin) and Drew King (@DrewKingNYC). 

Contributing Editors: Manthan Baldha, Sarah Webb (@SWAudioPost) and Drew King.

Filmed and recorded at @TheMalin in New York City.

www.IntoTheMudPodcast.com

Opera singer and voice teacher Matthew Anchel joins Into the Mud to get real about body positivity, plus-size shaming, and queer representation in entertainment. From his time at the Met Opera to competing on Worst Cooks in America, Matthew opens up about navigating diet culture, Ozempic, fatphobia, and dating—all with humor, honesty, and heart.

Bio: Bass Matthew Anchel, hailed as “a voice to watch” by The Wall Street Journal, has appeared with many of the world’s leading opera companies and orchestras, including the Metropolitan Opera, Lyric Opera of Chicago, Santa Fe Opera, Glyndebourne Festival, and Carnegie Hall. A frequent presence at the Met, he has sung the Master of Ceremonies in Cinderella and the Jailer in Tosca, and covered roles in new productions of Die Meistersinger von Nürnberg, Don Carlos, Fedora, Dialogues des Carmélites, The Exterminating Angel, and Cendrillon. Other recent highlights include Bartolo in Le nozze di Figaro with Opera San José, Sarastro in Die Zauberflöte with Arizona Opera, Banquo in Macbeth at Stadttheater Giessen, Lamberto in Pia de’ Tolomei at Spoleto Festival USA, Vanuzzi in Die Schweigsame Frau at Bard Summerscape, and solo appearances in Mahler’s Eighth Symphony at Carnegie Hall and Mozart’s Requiem with Stiftsmusik Stuttgart.

Earlier in his career, Mr. Anchel was a member of the ensembles at Oper Stuttgart and Oper Leipzig, performing roles in Il barbiere di Siviglia, La bohème, Les Contes d’Hoffmann, Eugene Onegin, Der Rosenkavalier, and more. He has also been heard with Opera Theatre of Saint Louis, Opera San Antonio, Anchorage Opera, St. Petersburg Opera, and the Los Angeles Opera’s Young Artist Program, where he appeared under the baton of James Conlon. An accomplished competition singer, he was a Grand Finalist in the Metropolitan Opera National Council Auditions and has received prizes from Palm Beach Opera, Opera Index, the George London Foundation, and the Loren L. Zachary Competition. A New York City native, Mr. Anchel holds a Bachelor of Music in Vocal Performance from the Manhattan School of Music.

Matthew’s Social Media: @MatthewAnchel, www.MatthewAnchel.com

Follow along at @IntoTheMudPodcast on all platforms!
For the visual version, follow along on YouTube!

Your Hosts: Alex Kumin (@Alex.Kumin) and Drew King (@DrewKingNYC). 

Contributing Editors: Manthan Baldha, Sarah Webb (@SWAudioPost) and Drew King.

Filmed and recorded at @TheMalin in New York City.

www.IntoTheMudPodcast.com

Actor and musician Lisa Helmi Johanson gets deeply vulnerable about her harrowing experience with postpartum PTSD following a traumatic 68-hour labor and emergency C-section. In this cathartic, tender, and surprisingly funny conversation, Lisa opens up about brainspotting therapy, intrusive thoughts, identity loss, and what it means to slowly piece yourself back together while parenting in a world that doesn’t prioritize maternal mental health. This is an essential listen for anyone who’s felt broken, gaslit, or utterly alone in early motherhood.

Bio: Lisa Helmi Johanson is a biracial, multi-hyphenate artist whose work spans acting, music, writing, and activism. A classically trained violinist and vocalist, she made her Off-Broadway debut soon after moving to NYC and went on to star as Christmas Eve in the national tour of Avenue Q, later appearing on Broadway, Off-Broadway, on tour, and in TV and film (Law & Order, Hallmark).

During the pandemic, Lisa became a community organizer and turned to writing to explore her identity as a Korean-Finnish American woman and mother. Her plays—including The Porch on Windy Hill and Kim Loo Gets a Redo—have been staged regionally and in NYC, with new projects in development including Zitkala-Sa’s Astonishing Wild West and Aigoo, Jinjja?.

At her core, Lisa is a storyteller committed to making the world more just and beautiful—for her audience, and for her child.

Lisa's Social Media: @Hurricane_Helmi, www.LisaHelmiJohanson.com

Follow along at @IntoTheMudPodcast on all platforms!
For the visual version, follow along on YouTube!

Your Hosts: Alex Kumin (@Alex.Kumin) and Drew King (@DrewKingNYC). 

Contributing Editors: Manthan Baldha, Sarah Webb (@SWAudioPost) and Drew King.

Filmed and recorded at @TheMalin in New York City.

www.IntoTheMudPodcast.com

This week, Into the Mud goes gloriously off the rails with stand-up comedian Zahid Dewji. What starts as a conversation about outgrowing people and places quickly spirals into an unexpectedly hilarious and heartfelt deep-dive into spiritual growth, vibrational energy, comedy burnout, porn bans in Texas, regrets, and the cosmic chaos of being human. Equal parts wild and wise, this episode is a chaotic gem about letting go, laughing through the spiral, and trusting the double helix of life to bring you exactly where you need to be.

Bio: Zahid Dewji is an NYC based comedian and former staff writer on NBC’s The Tonight Show Starring Jimmy Fallon. He was previously the head writer of OFTV’s Roast of Bert Kreischer & The Roast of Whitney Cummings.

Born in Queens, NY to East African Indian immigrants, the Z-man was raised in Houston, where he began his comedy career and quickly became a Texas favorite. Zahid has toured the country with comedy icon Whitney Cummings as well as viral sensation Noel Miller and has been featured on countless comedy festivals including Oddball Comedy Fest, Laughing Skull and Moontower Comedy Festival.

His debut special “Where is God?” was released in 2023 with Don’t Tell Comedy.  He also has a set filmed with OFTV available to stream exclusively on Only Fans (yes, really). 

Zahid’s Social Media: @ZahidDewji, www.ZahidDewji.com

Follow along at @IntoTheMudPodcast on all platforms!
For the visual version, follow along on YouTube!

Your Hosts: Alex Kumin (@Alex.Kumin) and Drew King (@DrewKingNYC). 

Contributing Editors: Manthan Baldha, Sarah Webb (@SWAudioPost) and Drew King.

Filmed and recorded at @TheMalin in New York City.

www.IntoTheMudPodcast.com

What does it really mean to “do the work”? In this wildly thoughtful and hilarious conversation, producer and social justice advocate Darren Biggart unpacks his viral essay on the quiet, lifelong practice of disrupting internalized systems of power. Together, we explore the murky territory between growth and guilt, comfort and courage, and being seen as “good” versus actually doing good.

Bio: Darren is the Director of Civic Programs at The Shed, where he develops artistic work, social impact initiatives and public programs. Producer: Four seasons of Encores! Off Center, the gala production of Evita, Diary of a Tap Dancer, v. 6, and 40 unique pop-up events for The Lobby Project at New York City Center, where he also co-founded an internship for early-career artists; Ayodele Casel’s While I Have the Floor (Spoleto Arts Festival); To Feel a Thing (Holland Festival, NY Live Arts, The Shed). Founding Program Director: A Broader Way Foundation, an arts-centered leadership program for middle school girls. Assistant Vocal Producer: West Side Story film, dir. Stephen Spielberg; Kimberly Akimbo cast album. Co-Director: Idina Menzel’s World Tour (2017). Director/facilitator: YoungArts, Pace University, Harvard University, & Plymouth State University. Co-founder: tall poPpy, inc, an artist-led social enterprise that develops performance work, educational & advocacy programs, alongside Jeanine Tesori and Torya Beard. M.Ed: Harvard University (Leadership in Education Award Recipient); BFA: University of Michigan.

Darren’s Social Media: @LBCNU, www.DarrenBiggart.com

Follow along at @IntoTheMudPodcast on all platforms!
For the visual version, follow along on YouTube!

Your Hosts: Alex Kumin (@Alex.Kumin) and Drew King (@DrewKingNYC). 

Contributing Editors: Manthan Baldha, Sarah Webb (@SWAudioPost) and Drew King.

Filmed and recorded at @TheMalin in New York City.

www.IntoTheMudPodcast.com

Comedian Elle Orlando joins Into the Mud for a refreshingly honest and beautiful conversation about the kind of loneliness that lingers—even when you're surrounded by people. From the isolating pursuit of stand-up to the heartbreak of lost friendships and the double-edged sword of social media, Elle unpacks what it means to feel alone in a hyperconnected world. Together, Alex, Drew and Elle explore introversion, gender dynamics in comedy, and the longing for deep connection in a culture of curated personas. It's vulnerable, funny, and all too relatable.

Bio: Elle Orlando is an NYC-based stand up comedian originally from Chicago, actor, and Host of (her podcast) The Elle Diablo Show. Elle is currently touring around the country as well as featuring for comedians like Kyle Dunnigan, Ian Lara, Michael Kosta, Rich Voss, & more. Elle has been featured on Sirius XM’s The Bonfire with Big Jay Oakerson and Dan Soder and is passed at clubs such as New York Comedy Club, The Stand, Rodney’s Comedy Club, The Comedy Mothership (ATX), Chicago Zanies & more. Elle wishes she had more credits to offer you but this is pretty much it. Elle’s material is silly, stupid, light and dark and people laugh the entire time during her shows (pretty cool) she has never bombed in her life (lie). 

Elle’s Social Media: @_ElleOrlando_ , www.ElleOrlandoComedy.com, El Diablo Show Podcast

Follow along at @IntoTheMudPodcast on all platforms!
For the visual version, follow along on YouTube!

Your Hosts: Alex Kumin (@Alex.Kumin) and Drew King (@DrewKingNYC). 

Contributing Editors: Manthan Baldha, Sarah Webb (@SWAudioPost) and Drew King.

Filmed and recorded at @TheMalin in New York City.

www.IntoTheMudPodcast.com

In Part 2 of this special two-part episode, Maui-based therapist and career coach Natalie Diaz returns—this time to coach the hosts. After diving into her own journey from corporate hustle to purposeful living in Part 1, Natalie guides Drew and Alex through some of their own muddy challenges. With Alex exploring time management and Drew confronting perfectionism, this real-time coaching session offers practical tools, emotional insight, and a gentle reminder that growth often begins in the mess.

Bio: Natalie Diaz is a Maui-based licensed therapist and career coach who helps driven professionals reclaim their time, energy, and clarity—so they can prioritize what matters most: their health, relationships, and creating a life they don’t need a vacation from. Her approach blends strategic planning with deep inner work, guiding clients to unlearn hustle culture, redefine success on their own terms, and design lives rooted in presence, purpose, and peace.

Before launching her coaching and mental health practice, Natalie spent over a decade in New York City climbing the corporate ladder as a Chief of Staff and real estate executive. Though outwardly “successful,” she felt burned out and unfulfilled, ultimately leaving behind a lucrative career to pursue work aligned with her values. A graduate of Williams College and NYU’s Master of Social Work program, Natalie’s advocacy and writing have been featured in Forbes, USA Today, and The New York Daily News. Today, she supports clients nationwide through her 1:1 coaching and psychotherapy practice, and when she’s not working, you’ll find her exploring Maui with her dog Franklin or planning her next adventure.

Natalie’s Social Media: @NatalieDiazWellness, www.NatalieDiazWellness.com

Follow along at @IntoTheMudPodcast on all platforms!
For the visual version, follow along on YouTube!

Your Hosts: Alex Kumin (@Alex.Kumin) and Drew King (@DrewKingNYC). 

Contributing Editors: Manthan Baldha, Sarah Webb (@SWAudioPost) and Drew King.

Filmed and recorded at @TheMalin in New York City.

www.IntoTheMudPodcast.com

Licensed therapist and career coach Natalie Diaz joins Into the Mud to share her bold leap from New York’s relentless corporate grind to building a slower, more intentional life and practice in Maui. In this first half of a two-part conversation, Natalie opens up about healing her nervous system, unlearning hustle culture, and creating a career that prioritizes people over profits. Stay tuned for Part 2 next week, when Drew and Alex step into the hot seat for some real-time coaching with Natalie.

Bio: Natalie Diaz is a Maui-based licensed therapist and career coach who helps driven professionals reclaim their time, energy, and clarity—so they can prioritize what matters most: their health, relationships, and creating a life they don’t need a vacation from. Her approach blends strategic planning with deep inner work, guiding clients to unlearn hustle culture, redefine success on their own terms, and design lives rooted in presence, purpose, and peace.

Before launching her coaching and mental health practice, Natalie spent over a decade in New York City climbing the corporate ladder as a Chief of Staff and real estate executive. Though outwardly “successful,” she felt burned out and unfulfilled, ultimately leaving behind a lucrative career to pursue work aligned with her values. A graduate of Williams College and NYU’s Master of Social Work program, Natalie’s advocacy and writing have been featured in Forbes, USA Today, and The New York Daily News. Today, she supports clients nationwide through her 1:1 coaching and psychotherapy practice, and when she’s not working, you’ll find her exploring Maui with her dog Franklin or planning her next adventure.

Natalie’s Social Media: @NatalieDiazWellness, www.NatalieDiazWellness.com

Follow along at @IntoTheMudPodcast on all platforms!
For the visual version, follow along on YouTube!

Your Hosts: Alex Kumin (@Alex.Kumin) and Drew King (@DrewKingNYC). 

Contributing Editors: Manthan Baldha, Sarah Webb (@SWAudioPost) and Drew King.

Filmed and recorded at @TheMalin in New York City.

www.IntoTheMudPodcast.com

Alex Wong is a wildly successful performer and an unapologetic optimist—and this week, the hosts try to figure out how he does it. While Into the Mud usually dives headfirst into life’s messes, Alex W. brings a calm, clear-eyed approach that feels like an antidote to the mud. Alex K. and Drew tend to fall into the familiar trap of “compare = despair,” but this week, Alex W. gently flips the script, offering a perspective where comparison becomes a source of inspiration instead of shame. In a moment when the world feels like it’s constantly ending, this episode is a much-needed palate cleanser—grounded, joyful, and full of practical wisdom for staying light without floating away.

Bio: Born in Canada, Alex Wong began his tap and jazz training at age seven before starting ballet at ten with Vancouver’s Goh Ballet Academy. He quickly made a name for himself—winning two Junior World Titles in Tap and Showdance in 2000, earning the Royal Academy of Dance Solo Seal, and claiming the Bronze Medal and Audience Choice Award at the 2003 Genee Competition. In 2004, he became the first Canadian to win the prestigious Prix de Lausanne, subsequently joining the American Ballet Theatre Studio Company and soon after Miami City Ballet, rising to soloist by 2007. His extensive repertoire includes leading roles in Balanchine’s Symphony in Three Movements, Agon, Western Symphony, The Nutcracker, Twyla Tharp’s Push Comes to Shove and In the Upper Room, Mark Morris’s Silhouettes, Paul Taylor’s Funny Papers, and classic works by Bournonville, Dolin, Mills, and Villela.

In 2009, Alex auditioned for So You Think You Can Dance, reaching the Top 20 before contractual issues forced his exit—then returned in 2010 to reach the Top 10, only to be sidelined by a snapped Achilles tendon during a Bollywood routine. After intensive surgery, recovery, and another Achilles injury, he pivoted to commercial and theatrical work—joining NBC’s Smash, Glee, Dancing with the Stars, American Idol (Hollywood semi-finals), and signing with Bloc Talent Agency. He made his Broadway debut in Disney’s Newsies (as “Sniper”), contributed to Emmy-winning routines, released his first dance single “Crave,” and appeared in film/TV (The Greatest Showman, Fosse/Verdon, Marvelous Mrs. Maisel), continued as a recurring SYTYCD All-Star, and remains a major figure in dance and social media.

Alex’s Social Media: @AlexDWong, www.TheAlexWong.com

Follow along at @IntoTheMudPodcast on all platforms!
For the visual version, follow along on YouTube!

Your Hosts: Alex Kumin (@Alex.Kumin) and Drew King (@DrewKingNYC). 

Contributing Editors: Manthan Baldha, Sarah Webb (@SWAudioPost) and Drew King.

Filmed and recorded at @TheMalin in New York City.

www.IntoTheMudPodcast.com