One of the great benefits I have had through volunteering for the Scrum Alliance has been the opportunity to work with a long list of inspiring and brilliant people. At the top of that list is Jukka Lindstrom. Jukka is someone who’s approach to exploring and solving problems is so different from my own that I felt like every time we collaborated on something, I got better at what I was doing just by working with him. A few years ago Jukka left his job as an Agile Coach and Trainer and started working full time with traditional organizations. At the start of 2016 he joined Cargotec to head up their Digital Transformation effort. If you think Agile Transition is hard, consider that it is only a small part of the transformation of digitizing a global organization with 11,000 people who are used to working in an analog world.

In the first part of the interview Jukka and I talk about the work he’s been doing since leaving Reaktor and what it’s like trying to transform a company of 11,000 people to not just Agile, but a digitized way of working as well. Leaving the Agile Consulting world to go back into a traditional environment is a brave choice, but for Jukka, it presented an opportunity to test out what he had learned and see if he could help. While it has provided him with great learning experiences, it has also come with some tough moments. In the second part of the interview we focus on how what that career transition has been like and how he has avoided getting trapped in the doldrums when he is faced with working in a more traditional environment.

Show Notes

00:09 Interview Begins

00:57 Jukka’s role at Cargotec and what the company does

02:37 The difference between Agile Transformation and Digital Transformation

07:36 The complexity of transformation at Cargotec

08:44 Why is this level of transformation so much harder than basic Agile transformation

10:10 The mindset shift

11:54 Placing a bet on technology when you don’t know exactly what you’ll be able to do with the result yet

13:00 transforming11,000 people … “that’s like 1,200-1,500 teams of people”

15:00 Where do you learn faster? Working in software or more traditional (manufacturing) companies

17:15 Becoming an Agile Bodhisattva

17:52 When you walk back into the waterfall, doesn’t it kinda suck? And how do you stay inspired?

19:45 Realizing that the reason you feel stuck is because you aren’t being true to yourself

22:37 How to avoid playing the victim and taking ownership of your own learning and joy

24:30 “I’m not having fun… why am I doing this?”

25:27 If you can’t find fun in what you’re doing, you’re doing the wrong thing

25:55 Things Jukka does outside of work that helps him stay engaged and learning while he is at work

27:00 MIT’s ULab

Links from the Interview

Cargotec Website: http://www.cargotec.com

Singapore Cargo Port Timelapse Video https://youtu.be/HrZg96L8yaY

MIT’s ULab Course https://www.edx.org/course/u-lab-leading-emerging-future-mitx-15-671-1x

Leading from the Emerging Future by Otto Scharmer http://amzn.to/2dJJ1TL

Reaktor https://reaktor.com

If you’d like to contact Jukka

LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/jukkalindstrom

Twitter https://twitter.com/jukka_lindstrom