More children are being convicted of crime and our prisons are nearly at capacity. But Steve Chalke thinks he has a solution.

The founder of the Oasis Charitable Trust, which runs a chain of academies and the UK’s first secure school, works closely with children who have committed the worst crimes. He advocates for radically changing our schools, the education system, and how we rehabilitate our young offenders.

Amol and Steve also talk about their shared background, the crisis of masculinity, and how a rejection at the age of 14 lead him to where he is today.

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Amol Rajan is a presenter of the Today programme on BBC Radio 4. He is also the host of University Challenge on BBC One. Before that, Amol was media editor at the BBC and editor at The Independent.

Radical with Amol Rajan is a Today Podcast. It was made by Lewis Vickers with Izzy Rowley. Digital production was by Gabriel Purcell-Davis. The editor is Sam Bonham. The executive producer is Owenna Griffiths.