Former members of the Two by Twos Kyle and Kari (the group that our Meagan grew up in) discuss the apocalyptic focus on the religion, personal stories of deconstructing their beliefs, the peculiar structure of the group led by pairs of ministers called "workers", how Kyle and Kari joined and met as kids, how it compared to Meagan's experience, what they did (and didn't) believe growing up, how the pandemic led them to question their beliefs, and how they found their way back to each other after a difficult period of disconnection. Stay tuned next week to learn about the Facebook they created for former members and the devastating news that came to light.

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Kyle & Kari, Part 1 - Deconstructing The 2x2s

A podcast about cults, extreme belief, and manipulation – from two hosts who’ve actually lived it.  Hosted by Lola Blanc and Meagan Elizabeth.

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Today is part two with Warren Kohl, former member and religious leader within the 2x2s (Meagan's secretive childhood group that technically has no name). Today we'll hear how Warren left behind his dreams of medical school to become a "worker" (a minister who stays in people's homes). He'll talk about the pressure to speak with some kind of authority, how he was scolded for genuinely trying to connect with the members, being told to stay out of a domestic violence situation within the group, how his mental health deteriorated, how he finally left, and his message to those still in the religion.

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Warren Kohl, Part 2 - The Pressures of Preaching in a Secretive Cult

Today's guest is Warren kohl, a fifth generation member and former “worker” (or minister) in the 2x2’s, the group that Meagan grew up in. Warren shares how devout he was to the group at a very young age, having your entire life controlled, and how utter heartbreak in high school led him to celibacy and a deeper commitment to the group.

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Warren Kohl, Part 1 - Preparing to Preach in a Secretive Cult

Psychologist, trauma bond expert, and author of Run Like Hell: A Therapist's Guide to Recognizing, Escaping, and Healing from Trauma Bonds, Nadine Macaluso share about her relationship with ex-husband Jordan Belfort (aka The Wolf of Wall Street) and how it led her to become a therapist with a focus on trauma bonds. They also discuss "mind mapping", intermittent reinforcement, the difference between intensity and intimacy, the three phases of trauma bonds and how violence can play into them, why Nadine uses the term "pathological lover" instead of narcissist, how to tell if you're currently in a trauma bond, and green flags that are the sign of a healthy relationship.

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Nadine Macaluso - Recognizing, Escaping, and Healing from Trauma Bonds

In part two with Zoe and Lilly, survivors of Midwest Academy, one of the abusive troubled teen programs in the same organization that was spotlighted in the docuseries The Program: Cons, Cults, and Kidnapping, we dig deeper into Lily’s experience. She’ll tell us how she was in solitary confinement for two months, and how her reaction was to rebel in any way she could. We’ll get into how they both left, and how no one believed them for years - in some cases, up until just last month - how this was and still is a multi-billion dollar industry, and where they’re both at in their healing journey.

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Zoe & Lillian, Part 2 - Troubled Teens, Midwest Academy, and Solitary Confinement

Survivors of the infamous WWASP schools, Zoe & Lillian, share about their experiences being forced to join Ivy Ridge, Midwest Academy, and Casa by the Sea; All schools featured in the current Netflix docudrama, The Program: Cons, Cults, and Kidnapping. Lola & Meagan dig into how these programs were marketed to parents, the dramatic ways Zoe & Lillian were brought to the facilities as teenagers, the levels inside the program that were impossible to climb, how they could only communicate with their eyes, and how they were kept from their families.

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Kyle & Kari, Part 1 - Deconstructing The 2x2s

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