Lean Out with Tara Henley

In January of 2022, during one of Toronto’s never-ending pandemic lockdowns, I launched Lean Out from the tiny kitchen of my 485-square-foot apartment. I had just left legacy media, somewhat loudly. I had been a current affairs radio producer at Canada’s national public broadcaster, the CBC. And I was worried that journalists were getting some of the biggest stories of our age wrong. I was fed up with our incuriosity on a range of hot-button issues, from pandemic policy to race and gender. The newsrooms felt increasingly stifling. It had become more and more difficult to engage in debate during story meetings, to stray from established narratives, and to put alternative voices on the air.

At the same time, I was hearing from a public that was increasingly furious with the press that was supposed to serve them. Time and time again, people would ask me: Why are you all ignoring the views and concerns of so many of our fellow citizens? What is going on with the media?

This, at a time when a strong fourth estate had never been more important. The public square was nasty and polarized. I watched wave after wave of online pile-ons and cancellation campaigns. Whole newsrooms joined in, too, purging established journalists for the slightest of infractions. The range of acceptable opinions for polite society became breathtakingly narrow. In private, journalists told me they were terrified. I feared we were losing some of the pillars of Western liberal democracy — and fast.

And me? I was bereft. Thinking and reading and writing and talking about ideas had been the great joy of my life. It had never occurred to me that that might be taken from me.

So, I decided to take a stand for civil dialogue and for open debate. I decided that we needed to stop having candid conversations in private and start having them in public. Lean Out was an appeal for speaking freely.

At the Lean Out Substack, we began publishing essays and op-eds and news roundups and written Q&A interviews, and hosting guest columnists. And on our first podcast, I posed some questions that I hoped to delve into on the program: Why is there now so much that we cannot say? Why are so many things off the table for discussion and debate? Why does all of this social justice talk feel so elitist? And why are so many of the people that progressives are supposedly fighting for just not that interested? Why are so many people tuning the media out?

Five years on, we have some answers to these questions — and we’ve found them together. Our show has listeners in more than 150 countries and 7,000 cities worldwide. This summer, we hit a milestone of one million downloads. It’s not bad for a niche Canadian current affairs podcast, largely focused on heterodox non-fiction books (and sometimes articles). Lean Out has published 256 episodes, featuring authors and journalists and academics from around the world and across the political spectrum. Our listeners, too, represent every political persuasion. We hear from Marxists, but we also hear from staunch conservatives — and, of course, from the politically homeless. Somehow, we’ve all managed to forge a little common ground.

What is that common ground? I think it rests on the conviction that most people are reasonable. That they are generally thoughtful adults that are doing the best they can to chart a path through this turbulent time. This common ground rests on the conviction that what most people want to better understand the moment we are living through, in all its complexity. That most of us can disagree without disparaging. That most of us are open to hearing new perspectives, and, in fact, feel richer for having been exposed to them. And, crucially, that we all have the capacity to change our minds.

This common ground we have built rests on a deep faith in our fellow citizens. And isn’t that what democracy is all about ?

This podcast has been the assignment of a lifetime, so it’s been a difficult decision to bring this project to a close — though the Substack will continue offering plenty of written content. In the meantime, I want to say that I am so grateful to you, our subscribers, for supporting the podcast portion of Lean Out. Each and every week, I got to speak to some of the most interesting and original writers and thinkers in the world. It was a volatile but fascinating time, in the media and elsewhere, and I got to cover it, in real time, as it unfolded.

In the process, some key themes for Lean Out emerged: pandemic policy, political polarization, the dire economic picture, particularly for our young people. A growing rage and a troubling censoriousness in our culture. The highs and lows of Canadian and American politics. The tensions between men and women. The crises facing modern men, including mental health, and the state of modern feminism, including our complicated relationship to the declining birth rate. Plus, the emergence of the woke left (which the American congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio Cortez herself has now characterized as “crazy”). And, more recently, the ascendance of the woke right, which I am increasingly concerned about.

At Lean Out, we heard from thinkers I have long admired: George Packer, Thomas Chatterton Williams, Michael Lind, Yascha Mounk, Musa al-Gharbi, Sebastian Junger, Nadine Strossen, Meghan Daum, David Greenberg, Ruy Teixeira, William Deresiewicz. We heard from more conservative feminists like Freya India and Mary Harrington and Louise Perry, and from more liberal feminists like Molly Jong Fast and Anna Louie Sussman and Susan Swan and Anastasia Berg. As well as gender critical feminists like Joanna Williams and Rosie Kay. We heard from Matthew Continetti on the old right in America, and Sohrab Ahmari and Oren Cass about the new right now being formed.

We heard reflections on the state of the left from Daniel Oppenheimer and Joan C. Williams and Eric Kaufmann. We heard from socialists like Freddie deBoer and Ben Burgis and Catherine Liu, and social conservatives like Tim Carney. We spoke to Richard Reeves and Nicholas Eberstadt and Zac Seidler and Jacob Savage about men’s struggles, and Leah Libresco Sargeant and Elizabeth Grace Matthew and Andrea Mrozek and Cory Clark about the challenges women grapple with. We spoke to Larissa Phillips and Daniel Cox about the ongoing war between the sexes.

Over the years, so many wonderful journalists have joined the program: Amanda Ripley, Ruby Cramer, Alec MacGillis, Michael Powell, Michael Forsythe, Mike Pesca, Andy Mills, Vicky Nguyen, Hadley Freeman, Conor Friedersdorf, Ryan Zickgraf and Zaid Jilani. And here in Canada, we’ve been joined by Paul Wells, Jen Gerson, Andrew Potter, Steve Paikin, Andrew Coyne, Holly Doan, Brian Stewart, Phoebe Maltz Bovy, Peter Menzies, Harrison Lowman, Terry Glavin, Tony Keller, Jason Guriel, Stephen Marche, and the up-and-coming podcaster (and Lean Out’s guest host) Chief Aaron Pete. And of course, the late, very much missed CBC broadcaster David Cayley.

Our work here has been referenced in Canadian and American media, on podcasts and Substacks, in books and in classrooms, and has led to invitations to speak at media conferences and public events, and to testify at the Canadian House of Commons.

Declining trust in the media became a central, and unifying, concern for the show. In 2024, the editor of the Literary Review of Canada, Kyle Wyatt, assigned me the Massey Essay on the state of the media, a collaboration between the LRC and Massey College at the University of Toronto. The essay tied together many of Lean Out’s disparate conversations on politics, economics, and culture. That essay — and the knowledge gained from all of those podcast episodes — has now become a book, The Trust Spiral.

And so, the conversation continues, as I venture out into the broader world of media to bring what we have learned here to a wider audience, and to discuss and debate the stories that the media has gotten wrong. Over Lean Out‘s lifetime, a lot more facts have emerged. It turns out the press did bungle some big stories, from the lab leak theory and school closures, to the Canadian “mass graves” story and the trucker convoy. We are happy that we’ve been able to be part of the media’s reckoning around them.

We will need much more of that in the future if we are to regain the trust of the public we serve.

So, where do we at Lean Out go from here? Unfortunately, I now have to acknowledge some of the realities of the current digital media environment. The fact is that we independents have not yet solved the business model problem.

In the earlier days of the show, I had help producing it, from Harrison Lowman and later Lauren Toffan, and help with factchecking from Luke Ettinger. For some time now, though, I have been a one-woman shop. Getting the show to air every week involves finding and booking guests, conducting research and interviews, editing the show, mixing it, factchecking it, and producing edited transcripts. Increasingly, the math on the business end does not add up. And from a capacity perspective, I don’t have the hours to continue the show and continue our output of written material, something subscribers have been keen to see more of.

It is with mixed emotions that I am ending the podcast component of the Lean Out Substack — but not without enormous gratitude. It has been a wonderful run. As one of my mentors recently reminded me, everything has its season. Thank you all for joining me on this wild ride, and for your support, in all the forms it has taken.

For paying subscribers of the Lean Out Substack, all payments will continue to be paused as we transition to written-only content and find our footing. For audio listeners on other platforms, if you haven’t already, I encourage you to subscribe to my Substack, tarahenley.substack.com. Going forward, I will be publishing some mix of essays, op-eds, news roundups, media criticism, and written Q&A interviews. We will see what works best in the new format. I have already begun work on my next book — about the rupture between men and women — so you can expect lots of content around that theme. I may be leaving the airwaves, for now, but you’ll still be able to find me on the screen and on the page.

Thank you again. It has been the adventure of a lifetime.

And now, on to the next chapter …

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This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit tarahenley.substack.com

Hello, everyone! I’ve returned from the tranquility of the Gulf Islands on the West Coast of Canada and I’m now busy trying to get my bearings in the crumbling, crazed (but very much alive) metropolis that is Toronto. I’ll soon have some thoughts to share on the insights my weeks offline yielded — more than you might imagine! — along with an announcement. But for today, I want to catch you all up on a few developments from the summer.

The Trust Spiral continues to gain momentum. I have been pleasantly surprised by the level of interest in the book, which, as we know, focuses on media standards and practices, a topic that rightfully makes many people’s eyes glaze over. I have really enjoyed the conversations I’ve been having with fellow journalists, including with those who remain skeptical of my argument.

I’ve also had the pleasure of interacting with members of the public and hearing why they’ve lost trust in the media. One point in particular has been driven home to me by news consumers. Time and time again, I heard that they are having an increasingly difficult time figuring out what the actual facts are on any given story. Countless people told me that they were baffled by the current news environment; they said they felt increasingly compelled to read multiple sources across the political spectrum, attempting to piece things together for themselves. This, of course, is far from ideal. Not only is it time-consuming — it offloads the work we journalists should be doing on to the public at large — but it is also profoundly disorienting and dispiriting. This feedback indicates that we in the media are failing in our basic function, which, as the investigative reporter Matt Taibbi has said, is simply to tell people what’s happening.

On to other news … Some weeks back, I did a livestream with my colleague and friend Meghan Daum. I’m happy to be able to share that video with you today. For years, Meghan was one of my favourite people to read. During the pandemic, when she launched her terrific podcast, she became one of my favourite people to listen to. Now she’s become one of my favourite people to talk to as well. In this livestream, we discuss The Trust Spiral and delve into the Canadian “mass graves” story. (In June, the American outlet Persuasion commissioned me to write a piece on that journalistic debacle; you can read it here.)

For more Trust Spiral coverage from this summer, you can watch my interview with the Canadian Senator (and former journalist) Pamela Wallin here, on her No Nonsense podcast. Lean Out guest host Chief Aaron Pete also had me on his show, Nuanced. My Full Press co-host Harrison Lowman invited me on the Hub Dialogues program at The Hub. The Canadian journalist Peter Nowak was kind enough to host me on the Do Not Pass Go podcast and I spoke with the Canadian commentator Brian Lilley on the Full Comment podcast. I also appeared on the Conversations podcast, over at the American outlet First Things. I also had a very interesting conversation on the start-up podcast The Canadians.

If you missed it, I was lucky to get to launch my press tour with an event with Cardus in Ottawa, in conversation with the National Post’s parliamentary bureau chief Stuart Thomson. You can read reviews of the book at MediaPolicy.ca, Blacklock’s Reporter, The Brandon Sun, and at the Chicago outlet Arts Fuse. You can read a Q&A between myself and Meagan Gillmore over at Canadian Affairs.

A special thank you goes to Lydia Perović from the excellent Long Play Substack, who organized a lively pub night event for the book last week in Toronto. And to Meghan Daum, William Deresiewicz, Uri Berliner, Thomas Chatterton Williams, Eric Kaufmann, and Ruy Teixeira for their generous endorsement blurbs for the book.

I’m a big fan of the Centre for Free Expression at Toronto Metropolitan University, so I was thrilled when they recently hosted me for a discussion of The Trust Spiral with Canadian Press reporter (and longtime Carleton journalism school instructor) Jim Bronskill. I’ll be posting that here when it’s available to the public.

I’m pleased to announce that I will be appearing at the Kingston Writers Fest next month, in conversation with Literary Review of Canada editor-in-chief Kyle Wyatt, who was the catalyst for The Trust Spiral — assigning me the 2024 Massey Essay, on which the book is based. You can get tickets to our event here.

Despite all this activity, I did still manage to take a few weeks totally, blissfully offline. As mentioned, this hiatus bore much fruit, which I hope to share with you all in coming days and weeks. Stay tuned for more!

Thanks for reading Lean Out with Tara Henley! This post is public so feel free to share it.

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit tarahenley.substack.com

In the maelstrom that is modern life, we’ve lost any sense of seasonality. These days, the summer is as non-stop as any other time of the year and the long, sun-drenched days can come and go without any real rest or relaxation. But I remember a time in the not-too-distant past when July and August offered a welcome lull — a time to retreat, to recharge, to reinvent. To dream, even. The summer felt expansive, wondrous. I’m convinced that this annual reprieve was essential for maintaining sanity.

So this year, I’ve decided to bring back the slow summer.

It’s been a busy 2026 so far at Lean Out, during our fifth year in operation. The newsletter has surpassed eight million views and has been on the Substack bestseller list. The podcast, meanwhile, has just published its 256th episode. Not bad for a niche Canadian outlet dedicated to heterodox non-fiction current affairs books (and sometimes articles). That’s all down to you, Lean Out’s wonderful subscribers, and I can’t thank you enough for your support.

My latest book based on the work that I’ve been doing here — and on the 2024 Massey Essay — will be released in North America at the end of this month. (Pre-orders are helpful, should you be so inclined.) The Trust Spiral: Why the Media Needs Objectivity is already getting a great response and it has been especially gratifying to field interview requests from across the political spectrum. You can listen to a portion of my recent Ottawa book event, hosted by Cardus, on last week’s podcast.

Lean Out normally goes dark for three weeks in the summer, but this year we are taking an extended break as I promote my new book and then take a few weeks of much-needed time offline — hopefully in the wilds of British Columbia. All monthly payments have been paused as of today, and yearly subscriptions will be extended when we resume production in the fall.

As I slow down and reflect on the year so far — and mull over where Lean Out might go next — I’d love to hear from you on what is working and not working about this newsletter and podcast. Your feedback is most welcome.

In the meantime, my hope for all of you is that you are also able to unplug at least a bit this summer, rediscovering all of the things that make life most worth living, from nature and travel to food and family and friendship and community. And of course, good books!

I’ll be doing my best to recapture that same spirit of adventure and discovery, and will share it with you all when I return in the fall.

Lean Out with Tara Henley is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit tarahenley.substack.com

One of the themes of the Lean Out podcast is a crisis in confidence in the mainstream media. In a few weeks, my new book on this topic will be released in the United States and Canada. The Trust Spiral: Why the Media Needs Objectivity unpacks where we in the press have gone wrong — and what we need to do to regain the public’s trust. Cardus in Ottawa hosted me for an event on June 9, where I was joined onstage by a fellow Canadian journalist. I am happy to share a portion of our discussion today.

Stuart Thomson is a Canadian journalist and the Parliamentary bureau chief for The National Post.

Stuart Thomson and I are in conversation, today on Lean Out. Transcript to come for paid subscribers.

Lean Out with Tara Henley is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit tarahenley.substack.com

It has now been five years since the Kamloops band made an announcement of the discovery of the “remains of 215 children” at the former Kamloops Indian Residential School, kicking off an intense period of national grief and anger. A month ago, The Globe and Mail editorial board made news around the world, declaring the national press’s lack of scrutiny of the claim a “failure of journalism.” My guest on the program today is an award-winning journalist who was early on this story — and he’s here to unpack its aftermath.

Terry Glavin is a Canadian journalist, an author, and a columnist for The National Post.

Terry Glavin is my guest, today on Lean Out. Transcript to come for paid subscribers.

Lean Out with Tara Henley is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit tarahenley.substack.com

It’s Canada Day and many of us are reflecting on our nation and where we are at. We know that we are more divided than ever, but how did we get here? My guest on the program today has just written a book on political polarization in the country. He says the roots of our divisions run deep — and the consequences are dire.

Eric Merkley is an assistant professor of political science at the University of Toronto, and director of the Policy, Elections, and Representation Lab. His new book is Polarization, Eh? The Causes and Consequences of Affective Polarization in Canada.

Eric Merkley is my guest, today on Lean Out. Transcript to come for paid subscribers.

Lean Out with Tara Henley is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit tarahenley.substack.com

On June 10, the Canadian broadcaster David Cayley passed away, surrounded by loved ones, playing bluegrass music. He died in the Toronto home that he had shared with his wife for the past 42 years. It was a home that I had just begun visiting him at in recent months, drinking coffee and talking about books and ideas. David was a brilliant mind, a generous person, a fearless soul. As his friend and former executive producer Bernie Lucht told me this week, “David simply did not accept standing narratives.”

I had great admiration and respect for him. I am happy to replay our recent interview, in tribute to David and all that he was. You can hear his smile in voice.

David Cayley was a Canadian broadcaster. He was a husband and a father and a grandfather, and a friend to many. For thirty years, he made documentaries for the CBC Radio program Ideas. He was also the author of eight books. His last was The CBC: How Canada’s Public Broadcaster Lost Its Voice (And How to Get It Back).

David Cayley is our guest, today on Lean Out. Transcript to come for subscribers.

Lean Out with Tara Henley is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit tarahenley.substack.com

On October 19, citizens in the province of Alberta will vote on whether they want to proceed with a referendum on separating from the rest of Canada. My guest on the program today has written a new book about the history of these tensions — and why they have now come to a head.

Tyler Dawson is an opinion editor at The Globe and Mail. His new book is The Republic of Alberta: An Idea That Won’t Go Away.

Tyler Dawson is my guest, today on Lean Out. Transcript to come for paid subscribers.

Lean Out with Tara Henley is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit tarahenley.substack.com

The big news in Canada this week has been The Globe and Mail editorial board’s admission that the industry and the paper bungled the unmarked graves story from 2021 — that this in fact constituted a journalistic failure.

In light of this, I am bringing you an episode of my media criticism podcast with The Hub, Full Press, from last week, which took stock of how we in the Canadian media got this story so wrong. This is an especially important conversation, now that the Senate human rights committee has voted to criminalize residential school denialism, with a penalty of up to two years in prison. (UPDATE: The Canadian Senate as a whole has now voted to reject the criminalization of residential school denialism, voting 41 to 32 against it.)

Thanks for listening, and thank you to The Hub for giving me permission to re-air this episode. Transcript to come for paid subscribers.

Lean Out with Tara Henley is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit tarahenley.substack.com

You wouldn’t think that a woman declaring that she is into men would a subversive act — but at some point during recent years, this became the case in certain circles. Particularly online feminist circles. My guest on the program today has written a new book on female heterosexuality and she says it’s time we acknowledge that the vast majority of women are, in fact, straight.

Phoebe Maltz Bovy is a Toronto cultural critic. She is the opinion editor for The Canadian Jewish News and co-host of the Feminine Chaos podcast. Her new book is The Last Straight Woman — On Desiring Men.

Phoebe Maltz Bovy is my guest, today on Lean Out. Transcript to come for paid subscribers.

Lean Out with Tara Henley is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber.

This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit tarahenley.substack.com