Clare and Steve stumble over the topic of disorganised and unorganised in the ‘green room’ and so explore it. Meandering through disorganised, unorganised, organised, time pressure, a sense of control, routine and other experiences, our podcasters invite listeners to understand their own personal experience of these terms. We can be minded to jump to fixing something, by buying a tool or hiring some assistance, but being curious about ourselves can identify a benefit from being unorganised. They use toys, specifically spinning toys, to unravel how perspective and frame can alter our perspective of what is, and what needs to be. Finally they invite you to consider how drivers (TA) might influence this.