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Show Notes
Brad interviewed Robert Breedlove on Real Vision Finance. This episode is a discussion on Bitcoin fundamentals and how they stack up against all the new features and developments taking place on other blockchain and cryptocurrency projects. Robert brings a deep philosophical approach to the topic of finance in general, always supporting his arguments with much needed historical and psychological context. Make sure to listen to the first 10 minutes of this episode, as Brad tacks on a message for his viewers that is not included in the Real Vision version of the episode.
Timestamps
00:00:00: Extended intro from Brad to the audience of MiM
00:10:45: Money comes and goes, but time only goes
00:14:18: Show start
00:16:07: Robert Breedlove Introduces himself
00:19:10: Bitcoin 101 & Inflation is theft explanation given by Breedlove
00:26:30: Bitcoin vs Crypto
00:35:20: Why learn more about Bitcoin? Is it old tech?
00:38:20: Competing with Bitcoin as money. Crypto vs. Bitcoin. Breedlove makes comparisons between Bitcoin vs Ethereum and Blackberry vs iPhone
00:41:11: Analogy of the internet
00:46:30: Is the market rational?
00:54:20: Do your friends take your advice on what to invest in?
00:56:44: Hedging Strategies for Bitcoiners
01:04:50: Are Bitcoin Maximalists Evil? Discussion on how to deal with faster and faster change.
1:12:40: Recommendations for who to listen to in the bitcoin space
1:15:02: End of episode + outro
Robert Breedlove’s Social Links
Substack
What is Money Show
Parralax Digital
Brad Mills Social Links
Brad Mills Twitter
Magic Internet Money Twitter
Magic Internet Money Facebook
Magic Internet Money Instagram
Produced by Brad Mills - Twitter, Jason Sanderson - Podcast Tech. Art by Daniel Huddlestone, Show Notes by Go Full Crypto.
Other Credits: bitconnect theme by schmoyoho, graphics by CryptoScamHub, Magic Internet Money inspired by u/mavensbot, invention of Bitcoin & all cryptocurrencies by Satoshi Nakamoto.
Coffeezilla joins Brad to dig into his motivation for creating the "Exposing Tether" video on YouTube. The two discuss Coffeezilla’s own crypto story, and what made him produce videos that expose scams. Coffeezilla provides a healthy sense of skepticism, and criticism for tether, while Brad drips historical context and commentary throughout.
Timestamps
00:00:00 Intro to Coffeezilla
00:07:38 Intro convo between Brad and Coffeezilla
00:10:13 how did Coffeezilla get into the crypto space? (Analysis of scams)
00:12:45 Coffeezilla getting interested in Tether
00:14:15 Tether’s lack of transparency
00:15:35 what was the biggest scam that Coffeezilla uncovered
00:16:50 Coffeezilla’s background
00:18:42 Type of content Coffeezilla covers on his channel
00:20:13 Bitcoin maximalism toxicity
00:23:06 Robert Breedlove and bitcoin
00:27:38 What is Bitcoin’s thesis to Brad?
00:33:11 Coffeezilla’s bitcoin thesis
00:34:56 Facebook, Google, and Surveillance Tech
00:35:40 Centralization in money
00:36:54 Coffeezilla’s opinion on decentralization
00:38:57 Projects before Bitcoin
00:39:33 Will Bitcoin survive regulations?
00:43:00 Executive Order 6102 on Gold
00:44:34 The technology behind Bitcoin and its competitors
00:49:26 How is Bitcoin solving inequality?
00:53:35 Is Bitcoin not subject to Inflation?
00:58:17 Talking about Tether video made by Coffeezilla
01:02:08 Silk Road and Ross Ulbricht
01:08:25 Coffezilla’s and Brad’s opinion on Tether
01:15:38 - Wrapping Up
Coffeezilla’s Social Links
Exposing Tether YouTube Video
Coffeezilla Twitter
Coffeezilla Instagram
Brad Mills Social Links
Brad Mills Twitter
Magic Internet Money Twitter
Magic Internet Money Facebook
Magic Internet Money Instagram
Produced by Brad Mills - Twitter, Jason Sanderson - Podcast Tech. Art by Daniel Huddlestone, Show Notes by Go Full Crypto.
Other Credits: bitconnect theme by schmoyoho, graphics by CryptoScamHub, Magic Internet Money inspired by u/mavensbot, invention of Bitcoin & all cryptocurrencies by Satoshi Nakamoto.
Junseth joins Brad Mills for a discussion about economics and finance. Some think that many of the world’s problems can be traced back to the federal reserve, and the printing of money. Junseth makes a cogent argument throughout that things are a bit more nuanced than this perspective would lead you to believe. Many financial concepts are discussed in this episode, making it an ideal listen for those of you wishing to gain a broader understanding of market dynamics and macro economics. Savings, derivatives, Doge, DeFi, and of course, Bitcoin are all discussed within!
Timestamps
00:00:00 - Intro
00:01:22 - Junseth introduction and Bitcoin Conference
00:03:12 - Bitcoin Maximalism vs Crypto
00:05:40 - Junseth’s History with Bitcoin Uncensored Podcast
00:08:00 - How to be a good trader
00:09:36 - Elon Musk to take over Dogecoin
00:11:05 - No Oracles in Bitcoin
00:11:55 - The Mission of Junseth
00:14:58 - DeFi is a lot like a ponzi scheme
00:17:38 - Money and the Federal Reserve
00:19:50 - Junseth says we might be in a deflationary period
00:21:32 - Bitcoin is the thing itself that is valuable
00:23:20 - Applying politics to Bitcoin and modern monetary theory
00:25:40 - Will the government collapse? Or just the dollar?
00:26:42 - Civil war between Conservatives and Liberals
00:28:40 - Bitcoin as an end of the world hedge
00:29:38 - El Salvador experiment conversation about the USD
00:32:20 - Bitcoin reinvents the entire monetary infrastructure
00:35:40 - Making more sense to take on as much debt as possible
00:37:00 - Is inflation real? Is there actually inflation around? Where can we find inflation
00:41:26 - Are salaries rising at the same pace as inflation?
00:43:02 - Quality of life going up over time, easier to buy a good computer for cheaper today
00:45:40 - Where is inflation showing up in the economy?
00:48:50 - Collectibles and Investments in the economy. The power of index funds, and diversification.
00:52:40 - Story of FedEx employee who saved and indexed for 50 years
00:55:25 - Did the federal reserve unwind the quantitative easing that they did?
00:57:00 - Why does the federal reserve target inflation at 2%?
01:00:30 - Managing a portfolio to always be in the asset that is likely to go up
01:02:00 - Who benefits from inflation? Inflation is a tax on foreign companies holding USD.
01:04:40 - People 50 years ago were much more entrepreneurial
01:05:30 - Millennials have more savings than any other generation that has come before
01:06:50 - Renting vs Owning. Can millennials own houses with their current income/wealth level?
01:09:55 - Government Policy is the cause for irresponsible loans
01:11:41 - Putting money in Bitcoin vs stock market in 2011. How much risk would each be?
01:13:20 - Bitcoin is an asymmetric risk. Good opportunity for young people.
01:14:35 - Bitcoin is digital gold, and Brad was buying silver, gold, and also Bitcoin.
01:16:50 - Why does Junseth think Bitcoin is going up?
01:19:00 - How to buy a house with 3% down in Canada vs the USA. Index Funds vs House.
01:27:30 - Brad’s case for why things are not going to continue in the “business as usual” fashion.
01:31:30 - What does it look like for the stock market or economy to take a turn?
01:33:30 - Is there a lot of suffering nowadays?
01:43:01 - Would people care about the economy if they knew how it worked?
01:47:30 - Discussion on Libertarianism, UBI, and Milton Freedman
01:53:22 - Do people hold dollars? Junseth says most people don’t hold dollars
01:58:20 - Discussion on whether or not money printing causes all bad things?
02:04:00 - The morality of how money is made
02:07:03 - Buffet getting a call from the fed when the 2008 crash occurred
02:10:33 - Rich people suffer more during a market downturn
02:14:44 - Kids and graduating college kids are roped into credit card debt
02:17:30 - In depth discussion on brads upbringing, and his experience with debt
02:24:55 - Credit card debt is not collateralized, so you never need to pay it back
02:29:02 - Fractionalization of money within the banking infrastructure
02:33:50 - Do bank executives make too much money for their position?
02:39:22 - Discussion as whether or not you can own volatility
02:49:50 - What are derivatives? How did derivatives play into the 2008 crash? What are inside collateralized debt obligations?
03:00:00 - The five things to fix society!
03:03:45 - Discussion on COVID-19 and its causes, elaboration on crisis
03:12:55 - Brad brings things back to the central bank printing money
03:20:00 - Wrapping up, Closing Thoughts
Links to Mentions in the Show
Federal Reserve Website
Milton Freedman
Quality of Life Index
Find Junseth
Junseth.com
Uncensored Bitcoin Podcast
Find Brad Mills
Brad Mills Twitter
Magic Internet Money Twitter
Magic Internet Money Facebook
Magic Internet Money Instagram
Produced by Brad Mills - Twitter, Jason Sanderson - Podcast Tech. Art by Daniel Huddlestone, Show Notes by Go Full Crypto.
Other Credits: bitconnect theme by schmoyoho, graphics by CryptoScamHub, Magic Internet Money inspired by u/mavensbot, invention of Bitcoin & all cryptocurrencies by Satoshi Nakamoto.
Nicolas Burtey joins Brad to discuss what it is like building the Bitcoin Beach Wallet on the Lightning Network. Nicolas is the co-founder of Galoy Money, a company that works on bringing the lightning network to the people who need it, through open sourced, community based applications. This episode covers a range of topics including Bitcoin Beach, Lightning Network Scalability, and the merits of building on lightning in the midst of the DeFi frenzy. Nicolas brings his perspective as someone who has worked on VR, then Ethereum, then dedicating his time exclusively to Bitcoin.
Timestamps
00:00:00: Podcast Start and Introduction
00:03:40: Nicolas’s Introduction and conversation begins by talking about Bitcoin Beach
00:05:50: Nicolas’s backstory as someone who got into VR, then cryptocurrency through Ethereum
00:09:07: Nicholas starts looking into the lightning network from a payments perspective
00:14:32: Investors are sleeping on the lightning network, DeFi attracting Investors through deceptively enticing ROI
00:18:25: What it is like building on the lightning network
00:24:02: Building the Bitcoin Beach community with Michael Peterson
00:27:20: Discussion on Custodial vs Non-Custody Wallets. Bitcoin Beach Wallet is Custodial and acts as a sort of Community Bank
00:29:00: How is the Wallet of Satoshi scaling?
00:31:28: Economics of El Zonte and El Salvador
00:35:20: People trading in El Salvador, should people even try trading?
00:37:38: What does it take to scale the Bitcoin Beach Wallet?
00:40:50: How to help with the Bitcoin Beach Wallet project
00:42:10: Thirty communities have reached out to the Bitcoin Beach Wallet. What is the future of the lightning network in these communities?
00:44:00: Translation of Bitcoin content into various languages
00:47:04: Bitcoin Lessons building bite sized Bitcoin educational material
00:49:52: People travelling to El Salvador to help with Bitcoin education
00:52:01: How to help out with the Bitcoin Beach Wallet. Brief discussion on Proof of Reserves, Liquidity on the Lightning Network.
00:55:00: Outro, thanks and pitch to invest in Lightning Network Companies
Links to Mentions in the Show
Bitcoin Lessons
Bitcoin Beach
Bitcoin Beach Wallet
Wallet of Satoshi
GaloyMoney Website
GaloyMoney Github
Lightning Network
Guest Social Links
Nicolas Burtey Twitter
Brad Mills Social Links
Brad Mills Twitter
Magic Internet Money Twitter
Magic Internet Money Facebook
Magic Internet Money Instagram
Produced by Brad Mills - Twitter, Jason Sanderson - Podcast Tech. Art by Daniel Huddlestone, Show Notes by Go Full Crypto.
Other Credits: bitconnect theme by schmoyoho, graphics by CryptoScamHub, Magic Internet Money inspired by u/mavensbot, invention of Bitcoin & all cryptocurrencies by Satoshi Nakamoto.
In this episode of Magic Internet Money, host Brad Mills invites Coindesk editor Ash Bennington onto the show to talk about Real Vision, Ash’s online web show about the world of finance. The duo discuss Ash’s experience at Coindesk and during the Dotcom bubble in the late 90’s. Brad questions Ash on the part he plays in his own show, most notably as a neutral voice between guests. Ash offers his thoughts on blockchain technology and how the digitization of finance, like everything else digital seems inevitable.
Time Stamps
00:00:31 - Introduction
00:04:10 - What is Real Vision?
00:07:32 - How Ash got into crypto
00:15:27 - Differences between financial journalism and media
00:18:18 - Token speculation and securities discussion
00:24:58 - Comparison between blockchains and traditional finance
00:31:33 - Security protocols and blockchain upgrades
00:37:40 - Social media influence on markets, their effects
00:45:03 - Benefits of blockchain technology
00:49:46 - Game theory and governments
00:56:57 - Bitcoin philosophy and related questions
01:01:02 - History of centralized banks and decentralized finance
01:08:05 - Risk and how institutions manage it
01:13:20 - The fed and the pandemic
01:17:00 - “How is the banking system not on the brink of collapse?”
01:28:00 - Reducing cost of goods, rising cost of education, health
01:31:35 - Twitter question for Ash, future speculation and goals
01:37:29 - 2001 bubble analogies, then and now
01:45:08 - Closing remarks
Links to Mentions in the Show
Real Vision
CoinDesk
Clubhouse
Swan
Uniswap
Liquid Network
Distributed Ledger Technology (DLT)
The Creature from Jekyll Island
America’s Bank
Find Ash Bennington
Ash Bennington LinkedIn
Ash Bennington Twitter
Find Brad Mills
Brad Mills Twitter
Magic Internet Money Twitter
Magic Internet Money Facebook
Magic Internet Money Instagram
Produced by Brad Mills - Twitter, Jason Sanderson - Podcast Tech. Art by Daniel Huddlestone, Show Notes by Go Full Crypto.
Other Credits: bitconnect theme by schmoyoho, graphics by CryptoScamHub, Magic Internet Money inspired by u/mavensbot, invention of Bitcoin & all cryptocurrencies by Satoshi Nakamoto.
On this episode of Magic Internet Money, host Brad Mills invites Why Buy Bitcoin author Andy Edstrom onto the show to discuss the potential that Bitcoin has in the world of finance. The two open with a discussion about “number go up (NGU)” tech and Andy’s book. Brad asks Andy for his take on how institutional backing stands to benefit Bitcoin. Andy talks about debt structure and his experience in finance and how working with institutional players educated him with insight into how modern markets work. Finally, the two wrap up with a discussion about what governments at local and international levels are doing to handle the current economic situation.
Timestamps
00:00:07 - Intro
00:01:30 - Show start
00:05:50 - “NGU tech” and writing Andy’s book
00:10:22 - Institutional buyers and game theory
00:16:48 - Financial planning in an institution vs as an individual
00:24:10 - Bitcoin and equal opportunities
00:27:24 - Speculation on altcoin and bitcoin futures
00:37:40 - Balance in finance; staying diverse in turbulent markets
00:40:31 - Andy’s “worst investment ever” and “If I had 1000 bitcoin”
00:49:50 - Debt structure and Michael Saylor
00:57:40 - Newcomers to Bitcoin and risk
01:03:40 - Discussion about Andy’s book and time with crypto
01:07:40 - The Californian exodus and the politics of taxation
01:15:45 - “What could governments do?” Japanese central banking
01:22:11 - Speculation about institutional money holders
01:29:43 - Ethical case for Bitcoin
01:32:20 - Closing remarks
Links to Mentions in the Show
Why Buy Bitcoin
Swan Bitcoin
Michael Saylor
MicroStrategy
People leaving California
Negative interest rates in Japan
Find Andy Edstrom
Andy Edstrom
Andy Edstrom Twitter
Find Brad Mills
Brad Mills Twitter
Magic Internet Money Twitter
Magic Internet Money Facebook
Magic Internet Money Instagram
Produced by Brad Mills - Twitter, Jason Sanderson - Podcast Tech. Art by Daniel Huddlestone, Show Notes by Go Full Crypto.
Other Credits: bitconnect theme by schmoyoho, graphics by CryptoScamHub, Magic Internet Money inspired by u/mavensbot, invention of Bitcoin & all cryptocurrencies by Satoshi Nakamoto.
Brad Mills invites financial expert Greg Foss onto the show to talk about Bitcoin breaking into traditional finance. Greg discusses his 30 years of experience in the field of engineering and finance. Greg further explains to Brad the differences between a closed end fund and an ETF, and why a closed end fund in Canada is a big step for Bitcoin. The two debate about the current financial system; Brad on the side that it’s a ponzi scheme casino and Greg on the side of mathematics. Finally the duo speculate about the current state of the Canadian economy, and what Bitcoin might be able to do to help.
Timestamps
00:00:07 - Introduction
00:02:23 - Show start
00:04:44 - QBTC vs Bitcoin, what’s the difference?
00:07:04 - The importance of tax deferred accounts permitting Bitcoin
00:14:11 - Differences between an ETF and a closed end fund
00:22:10 - Archegos “black eye on the US hedge fund community”
00:25:17 - Currency Wars discussion and other book recommendations
00:28:00 - The Casino for whales debate
00:37:34 - A brief economic history lesson about Rogers Communications
00:44:44 - Credit rating arbitrage discussion
00:48:05 - Shareholder profits, taxpayer losses.
00:55:40 - Understanding capital structure and the regulated market
01:04:00 - Quebec pensioners and lessons about risk
01:08:40 - The higher perspective of the regulated economy
01:12:45 - Bitcoin as default protection
01:15:55 - Why do banks have equity?
01:19:43 - Toxic debts and brady bonds conversation
01:28:55 - How equalization affects Canadians
01:33:05 - What if Canada owned Bitcoin?
01:36:04 - The Alberta situation and Canadian economic speculation
01:40:14 - Discussion on the adoption of Bitcoin
01:47:25 - Validus Power Company discussion
01:52:10 - Bitcoin and it’s relation to traditional finance giants, MMT
02:00:50 - Closing remarks about gold
02:04:39 - Outro and social media plugs
Links to Mentions in the Show
Three IQ
QBTC
What is a closed end fund?
What is an ETF?
Fred Pye
Archegos controversy
Currency Wars by James Rickards
What is credit rating arbitrage?
Validus Power
Jeff Booth
Find Greg Foss
Greg Foss Twitter
Find Brad Mills
Brad Mills Twitter
Magic Internet Money Twitter
Magic Internet Money Facebook
Magic Internet Money Instagram
Produced by Brad Mills - Twitter, Jason Sanderson - Podcast Tech. Art by Daniel Huddlestone, Show Notes by Go Full Crypto.
Other Credits: bitconnect theme by schmoyoho, graphics by CryptoScamHub, Magic Internet Money inspired by u/mavensbot, invention of Bitcoin & all cryptocurrencies by Satoshi Nakamoto.
In this episode, Brad teams up with Jeff Booth, author of 'The Price of Tomorrow' and one of the leading voices on technology and its impact. His book delves into how technology brings forth abundance and the danger of holding onto the economic systems of the past. As a person who's worked in the technology space for over 20 years and is an avowed Bitcoiner, Jeff has some interesting insights to share on how those two fields intersect. The two talk about the long-term impact of money printing, why Bitcoin is superior, and why deflation is a good thing for economies. Plus, how does Elon Musk balance allegiances to Bitcoin and the Fiat money world?
Timestamps
00:00:00 - How does Jeff balance being an entrepreneur and the whole media circuit?
00:01:59 - The conviction of any entrepreneur, and Elon Musk nearly lost Tesla
00:04:26 - Lessons from Jeff's parents after they lost real estate in the '80s
00:07:36 - Why inflation is hidden tax - that enriches the 1%
00:18:53 - Universal basic income is against the concept of free markets
00:26:39 - Bitcoin is not the backup plan – it's the plan
00:40:26 - What could Elon Musk's thought process be on Bitcoin?
00:47:25 - Bitcoin's more than just about price
00:48:00 - What would it have been like if we'd been on a deflationary currency since the gold standard?
00:53:06 - There's no place you can hide if 90% of humanity lacks the basics and 5% has everything
00:55:53 - AI and drug experimentation/ breakthroughs
00:58:21 - How was it like for Jeff to speak to the House Of Commons about Bitcoin?
01:02:08 - How does Jeff's wife perceive Bitcoin?
Podcast Mentions
The Price of Tomorrow (Book by Jeff)
Humans Need Not Apply (book)
Artificial general intelligence
Elon Musk's "Bitcoin is almost as bs as Fiat money" tweet
Peter Diamandis
Find Jeff Booth on:
Jeff Booth Twitter
Find Brad Mills on:
Brad Mills Twitter
Magic Internet Money Twitter
Magic Internet Money Facebook
Magic Internet Money Instagram
Produced by Brad Mills - Twitter, Hamilton - YouTube, Jason Sanderson - Podcast Tech
Other Credits: bitconnect theme by schmoyoho, graphics by CryptoScamHub, Magic Internet Money inspired by u/mavensbot, invention of Bitcoin & all cryptocurrencies by Satoshi Nakamoto.
In this episode of Magic Internet Money, host Brad Mills invites fellow podcaster Jordan Harbinger onto the show to discuss NFTs, second passports, taxation, and money laundering. Both parties agree on the speculation that NFTs are a tulip style bubble, but are here to stay. The duo share their experiences paying taxes in the cryptocurrency space. Jordan explains how tax evasion is nearly pointless with Bitcoin, since the point of the blockchain is accountability. Jordan also offers his experiences in scam busting, and explains how NFTs could be a new gateway for money launderers akin to money laundering in the art collecting business. Finally, the two discuss the possibilities of second passports in the event of government overreaching for crypto assets.
Timestamps
00:00:34 - Show start/Collectable value
00:12:38 - Asset allocation with Bitcoin and related assets
00:19:25 - NFT bubble speculation
00:26:39 - Current Bitcoin trend, what it would take to change it
00:33:03 - How circumstances affect how deep into Bitcoin you should go
00:36:18 - “The demise of the stock market” and speculation about the fed
00:39:45 - The value of diversifying assets and self investment
00:44:40 - How the podcast market shifted during the pandemic
00:48:34 - Who’s talking about NFTs?
00:58:35 - Jordan’s story about Ethereum
01:03:00 - Measuring in Bitcoin terms
01:13:05 - Taxation and Bitcoin
01:18:55 - Speculation about “government overreach”
01:24:08 - Closing remarks and social links
Links to Mentions in the Show
What is an NFT?
ICOs and why they’re important
Clubhouse
Cassius Marsh
Art sales money laundering
Dogecoin
John McAfee
Find Jordan Harbinger
Jordan Harbinger.com
Jordan Harbinger Twitter
Find Brad Mills
Brad Mills Twitter
Magic Internet Money Twitter
Magic Internet Money Facebook
Magic Internet Money Instagram
In this episode of Magic Internet Money, host Brad Mills invites lead editor of BoxMining.com, Michael Gu onto the show to discuss the recent NFT boom. Brad warns it’s a “tulip style bubble”, but remarks it’s a technology that’s here to stay. Michael offers his experience working in the field of gaming as an example of the future of NFTs. The two discuss how the field of collectables and art sales could be changed by the adoption of NFT technology. Brad and Michael speculate on altcoins, the effects from macromarkets on crypto, and the philosophy of Bitcoin. They further speculate on the future of crypto asset based games and what a successful model for one might look like.
Timestamps
00:00:43 - Show start
00:00:56 - The NFT bull market
00:04:59 - Ethereum’s relationship to NFT
00:08:40 - Game assets not a model for NFTs
00:13:08 - History between ETH and BTC
00:17:58 - Bitcoin maximalist philosophy
00:21:23 - Maximalism and motivations in life
00:24:12 - Risk among cryptocurrencies
00:31:50 - Risks for newcomers in the crypto space. “Degen pits”.
00:39:00 - Anti-altcoining and the debate around it
00:43:04 - Macro markets and their relation to Bitcoin
00:46:36 - Infinite Fleet and NFT video game assets
01:00:27 - The metaverse and the economic side to gaming
01:05:10 - The collectables market
01:12:03 - Crypto games and non-crypto games
01:15:06 - Recommendations about Bitcoin and NFT
01:20:14 - Closing remarks and outro
Links to Mentions in the Show
What is an NFT?
Mark Cuban
Uniswap
Samson Mow
Infinite Fleet
What is the metaverse?
Clubhouse
Lightnite
Find Michael Gu
Michael Gu Twitter
Boxmining.com
Find Brad Mills:
Brad Mills Twitter
Magic Internet Money Twitter
Magic Internet Money Facebook
Magic Internet Money Instagram
From the publisher's feed
My name is Brad Mills, I am a Bitcoiner. I'm an average person, I just got into Bitcoin early. I'm not a coder, I look at this space from the point of view of a regular user. I believe BTC is the…