Making Waves On Purpose

In this episode of Making Waves on Purpose, I am joined by Daryl Brewster, the CEO of CECP. With over 200 affiliated companies, CECP is at the forefront of a number of ESG / corporate responsibility issues and approaches. And Daryl and his team bring a very successful business-centric approach, given their previous roles in the private sector.

Daryl and I discuss a wide range of issues, including how CECP is supporting companies as they wrestle with geopolitical/regional ESG issues, the political divide in the US and the blowback that some companies are experiencing from their ESG efforts.

Great discussion with a great leader in the space.

I skipped the queue for this episode which I recorded last week with Momo Mahadav from Maala, The Israeli Business for Social Responsibility organization.

I have known Momo for many years and admire him and his work, and that work has taken on a new importance in the last month. Momo shares how companies' efforts in building DEI programs and understanding have helped them during this tragic and difficult time.

We kept the conservation focused on the work rather than the conflict, but it is hard not to have in the back of one's mind knowing that the air raid sirens could go off at any moment and the truly tragic conditions in Gaza.

I found the idea of DEI efforts being efforts in what I would call peacebuilding (at the individual level) and the need for workplaces to be safe havens to be particularly interesting and challenged some of my thinking. I also think the simple idea of calling and checking in with people affected by the conflict, in Israel and beyond, is critical.

Momo offered what I think is good advice in any situation: "Be attentive, listen to the voices."

P.S. If anyone has contact with a Palestinian CSR organization, I would love to feature what they are doing as well.

On this episode of Making Waves on Purpose, I am joined by Gregory Unruh. I have known Greg for 20 years, and during that time, he has always impressed me with his take on corporate responsibility and sustainability. And this conversation was further confirmation of his insight and unique viewpoint. We talk about a wide range of subjects, including standard assets, changing the rules of the game, innovation, integrated thinking and leadership. This is a deep dive into the problems we face and why they are so hard to solve. A fanstiatic discussion.

As always, please like, subscribe and share.

In this Making Waves on Purpose episode, Andrew Winston talks about going beyond the business case.

While ESG, CR, and sustainability efforts have always demanded a business case, I have been thinking of what my friend Michael Spenley said to me some 15 years ago: "Don't over-rely on the business case; sometimes it is not there, and we still need to act."

ESG, in its original form, is all about finding investor value. And while it feels like some believe that the arrival of ESG has implied the business case is resolved, quite the opposite is true. The business case has never been more important, and companies have to get better at telling their full ESG, DEI, CR, and sustainability story and the value it drives.

But what about when the business case might not be fully clear and yet action is needed? Sometimes, doing the right thing might come at a cost, or that cost or benefit is unknown. Too many companies, especially global ones, get caught up in the idea of cultural relativism, asking questions like "What is the right thing to do given cultural norms vary around the world or even around the US?" Most often, this stems from fear that applying their values might cost them business in some context. But that's the point of values, isn't it? If values were always easy to apply, why might we need them? Aren't they guardrails for times when we are conflicted between different values like making money and being inclusive, driving sustainability or protecting biodiversity? Do we need a business case to support women's rights? Or the rights of LGBTQ or people of color? Over the long term, I am sure there is a business case for all these issues, but it might not always be perfectly evident in the short-term view of investors. But companies need to act, nonetheless.

Andrew calls this "doing the right thing." And he points out that there is still a widespread "weird" assumption that "doing the right thing" or sustainability always costs money. We also discuss empathy in corporate strategy and planning. Andrew also pointed out something so simple and yet so profound it has remained with me: "Businesses should not be excused from right and wrong conversations." This is fundamental to the question of purpose and the role of business in society and yet continues to be pushed as branding rather than core values, identity and purpose.

This was a great discussion on going beyond the business case with some deep insights, and Andrew always brings a reasoned, thoughtful, clear and compelling position.

Please listen, and if you like what you hear, subscribe, give us a like and share with a friend who might find value in the conversation.

In this episode of Making Waves on Purpose, I speak to Lisa Hrabluk. I connected with Lisa via my good friend Christy Cook. Lisa leads Wicked Ideas, a consultancy focused on solving complex problems and the power issues surrounding them. She has a fantastic background, a super sharp mind and a fabulous ability to communicate complex ideas in understandable ways.

We discussed power, status quo, changing paradigms as we move from the Industrial age to the Knowledge age, belonging, and place. I love how Lisa embraces complexity. In so many parts of our lives and work, we try to simplify things rather than accept that things are complex and not easy to understand or solve. Lisa digs in!

As with many of my conversations, it could have gone much longer. I may need a more flexible format for these conversations, as this one could have kept going for an hour at least. Enjoy, and if you like what you hear, please subscribe, scroll down to give us five stars and share our content with a friend.

This podcast is the first episode of season two of Making Waves on Purpose. In it, Jennifer Davis, of the Jennifer Davis Media Group, turns the tables and leads the two of us in conversation. It was a fabulous and fun conversation and outlines much of the thinking I will flesh out in season two.

I am so grateful to all the guests who joined season one:

Georg Kell

Lane Jost

Celina Gorre

Craig Beatty

Dylan Siegler

Josh Henretig

Rafael Velasquez Garcia

Dawnita Wilson

Gib Hedstrom

Zeev Klein

Bea Boccalandro

Mandar Apte

Neil Edwards

Bree Fram

Erika McMullen

Nandika Magdavgar

Olivia Albrecht

Jared Chung

And to all who listened!

It has been a great experience, and I have experimented with some different approaches and lots of varied topics, but all centered around the emerging role of business in the world. I can think of no more important issue, yet I worry about the overall effort. Far too many of these efforts are performative. And too few companies see this for what it needs to be: transformational. Societal issues and purpose, most of the time, remain bumper stickers rather than boardroom issues. However, that is changing, and the question is how can we ensure that these efforts develop innovation in ideas and approaches rather than compliance-based risk avoidance with some employee engagement on the side? To do so, the effort to redefine the role of business in society must be aligned with the emerging roles of government, civil society and individuals, or we create a dog's breakfast of change. Lots more to say on this, but let's save it for season two.

On deck, in the coming weeks, we have:

Andrew Winston

Greg Unruh

Lisa Hrabluk

P.S. If you like what you hear, and I hope you do, please subscribe. I am not hoping to monetize this effort, but it does help to show potential guests that people are listening. Many thanks!

Jared Chung is a name you should know. Jared is the Founder of CareerVillage.org a technology nonprofit that crowdsources career advice for youth at a massive scale. They engage an online volunteer corps of tens of thousands of working professionals in building a huge online repository of answers to every career question you can imagine. Like Donors Choose, and Khan Academy, Career Village is an impressive non-profit that serves a need by leveraging technology and unique insights into what it takes to engage and animate users on both sides of the conversation. Amazingly, Career Village has a 99% answer rate and serves over 5 million users. Jared is smart, genuine and generous at a time when those qualities couldn't be more needed.

In our conversation, we covered lots of ground, but what struck me most was his take on how we invest too much value in the identity created by our jobs. Ponder that for a minute. This is a person who has devoted his life to helping others build their careers, yet he hopes we place less importance on the identities we gain from our careers. I love it when the podcast opens up conversation that is amazingly important, open and honest, and this was a perfect example of that.

A must-listen! And if you like what you hear, please give the show a 5-star rating.

Olivia Albrecht is CEO at Aspiration, a climate finance and solutions company. While carbon offsets are a controversial topic, if we are to hold companies' feet to the fire on scope 3 emissions, they need to have all the tools available to them, including offsets. It is simply not conceivable that we can meet the need without them. Responsible offsets also drive a wide number of co-benefits, but they need to come after significant reductions and changed business models and must be additional, high quality, long term, and verifiable… and they won't come cheap, nor should they.

This conversation with Oliva gives a peak into the industry and how those who are developing and selling carbon offset projects are thinking about them. A great conversation with a leader putting together a multi-disciplinary team with varied views to meet the growing need for carbon solutions.

In this episode, I am joined by Nanadika Madgakar, the Senior Director for Strategy and Growth for CECP.

Nandika has years of experience in ESG, corporate responsibility and purpose, having worked for companies and non-profits. She also worked as a journalist in India.

Her work with CECP and the CEO Investor Forum has given her a front-row seat to how company leaders and their teams are working on Integrated Long-Term Plans including key forward-looking metrics specifically focused on their company's future growth, strategy, and risk.

I have been amazed and grateful for how many great thinkers in the space have come on the podcast and openly shared with me. It has been a real privilege and this conversation with Erika McMullen the CEO of Moxie Consulting Group proves the point.

We discuss DEI, cancel culture, engaging the majority and more. I was especially grateful for her open sharing of times when she got it wrong. With so much cancel culture coming from the right and left, many are paralyzed with fear of saying or doing the wrong thing. This inhibits the change and growth we need so badly. I hope you enjoy this wonderful, authentic, and engaging conversation.