Marketing Room 101

A special episode of Marketing Room 101, to celebrate the Tony's Chocolonely 8th December advent drama.

⁠Click here⁠ to find out more about the issues of unfairness and exploitation in the chocolate industry.

In this episode, host Ben Norman is joined by perhaps the friendliest man in advertising - Nick Eagle - the photographer from Sheffield, Yorkshire, whose relaxed and down-to-earth approach has led him to shoot huge campaigns for iconic brands like The BBC, Paddy Power, and Manchester United across the globe.

Nick and Ben recall the worst shoot ever and discuss the challenges and joys of the unexpected situations commercial photography creates. Nick also explains why, after years of working with heroes and national treasures like Erling Haaland, Clare Balding, and Anthony Joshua, he believes the real skill in photography is not in pressing the button, especially when shooting portraits.

Nick shares why shooting his local football club, Sheffield United, stands alongside working on Sky Sports’ biggest ever out-of-home campaign as one of his proudest moments. He also makes the case for prioritising quality over efficiency in image making, discusses why he thinks AI is similar to VAR in football, and explains why meeting in person is always worth the effort.

Finally, Ben’s brother recalls a chicken being thrown through a window, Nick talks about a man in a skip, and Ben declares his love for rubbish working men’s clubs in nondescript places.

In this episode, host Ben Norman is joined by Lindsey Clay, CEO of Thinkbox, the UK’s marketing body for commercial TV, and perhaps the industry’s most passionate voice for the power of television advertising. Before joining Thinkbox, Lindsey worked at some of the UK’s leading agencies including McCann Erickson and JWT, and today she continues to shape the industry as a Fellow of the Marketing Society, an Honorary Fellow of the IPA, and a proud member (and former President) of WACL.

Lindsey and Ben discuss the industry’s obsession with technology, why that’s coming at the expense of creativity, and what’s changed in TV in the 20 years since Thinkbox was created, before discussing the problem of gender equality in senior leadership, and what needs to change to get a 50/50 gender split amongst CEOs.

Ben presents Lindsey with some common myths from self-proclaimed tech gurus and TV critics, before Lindsey makes the case to temporarily banish advertising on Meta, why brands need to think before they invest and what would really needs to change to create a level playing field.

Finally, Lindsey has a good old sing-song, Ben reminisces over Chicken Tonight and Linsey regrets pregnant paintballing.

Links discussed in the episode:

Channel 4 – Mirror on Masculinities

Thinkbox – Context Effects

Thinkbox - Nickable Charts

Thinkbox – TV Masters Training

In this episode, host Ben Norman is joined by marketing effectiveness and analytics expert Tashan Nichols who works with some of the biggest and most successful brands in the UK as a director at ⁠Magic Numbers⁠, on top of hosting ⁠Magic Works training courses⁠, coaching others, supporting Diversity, Equity and Inclusion causes and, of course, winning tonnes of awards (like The Media Leaders Future 100, Media Week’s 30 under 30 and Campaign's star player for the7stars two years in a row, 2022 and 2023).

Tashan explains what’s so magic about numbers, and how to spot good numbers versus bad, or more accurately, how to pay attention to the right numbers at the right time based on what you want to do.

They also dispel myths around poor analytics, including the danger of the last click attribution obsession and why we need to banish marketers seeing measurement as a bolt on or an afterthought.

Tashan and Ben also discuss how to build the life you want through a blended career, rather than just settling for a 9-to-5, how to balance evidence with creative magic, and why it takes a village to raise a campaign. Plus, Tashan compares building a brand to baking a cake, tells us why advice from their grandma changed their life, and becomes the first person to say both ‘pedagogy’ and ‘coffee & walnut’ in Marketing Room 101.

In this episode, host Ben Norman is joined by author of The Art of Client Service, Robert Solomon, who, over four decades in the marketing industry, has garnered a reputation as world’s leading authority on making better advertising by building stronger relationships with clients.

Robert demystifies the often-misunderstood world of client service, outlining what it actually is (including the art and science of doing it well) and why removing it will be a big loss for agencies, but a huge loss for brands and clients… for example, would Apple’s iconic 1984 advertising campaign have ever happened without great client relationships?

Robert and Ben look at what account managers can do to win back their authority, including the importance of trust and wisdom.

Plus, Ben goes on a rant about sandwiches, Robert talks tipping, and explains why the client service discipline is a bit like Levi’s jeans.

In this episode, host Ben Norman is joined by underdog advertising’s perennial trouble-maker, Paul Mellor - co-founder of ⁠Mellor & Smith⁠ - the ad agency that gets underdogs noticed.

For the past 20 years Paul has helped brands like Paddy Power, Brooks Running, Hotels.com and Fat Lad at the Back get noticed by troubling the market-leading big dogs.

Paul and Ben discuss the difference between big dog and underdog brands, why the biggest brands have it easy, and what underdogs need to do to punch above their weight.

Paul makes the case to banish underdogs acting like market leaders, and explains why better, braver advertising is the only option available to them.

They also discuss the difference between essential critical thinking and pesky problem spotting, how to find the ‘one thing’ to grow your underdog and the joys of loitering (instead of just relying on data).

Plus, Paul rants about marketers who do everything they can to avoid thinking, he becomes the first person to say ‘Bonza’ in Marketing Room 101 and he decides that the ultimate underdog is actually an eel.

Download your copy of ⁠13.5 Ways to Grow Your Underdog Brand ⁠

In this episode, host Ben Norman is joined by Jordan Stachini, who describes herself as an ROI obsessed marketer who loves a Guinness and doesn’t do ‘fluffy’.

Jordan is the owner and founder of ⁠Co&Co⁠, the agency in Manchester she set-up at 30 years old and just one month before the Covid-19 pandemic stuck.

Jordan talks about the journey she’s been on since ‘accidentally’ setting-up an agency, the benefits of choosing stability over speed and the difference between the privilege of stress and the danger of burnout. She also outlines how marketers can be ROI obsessed without killing creativity (and what they can learn from Surreal).

Into Marketing Room 101 Jordan commits exclamation marks in pursuit of better writing and storytelling for brands.

Jordan and Ben also discuss why (good) marketers need to stop fearing AI, and why a lack of common sense is the reason for most bland advertising.

It also becomes clear Ben has no idea what his brother does for a living, while Ben and Jordan disagree about Manchester vs Yorkshire, but agree on North vs South.

In this episode, host Ben Norman is joined by one of the most decorated creative leaders in UK advertising, Mick Mahoney.

Mick has led some of the world’s biggest agencies, working with some of the biggest brands from being Creative Director at BBH (including working on Jonnie Walker’s epic ‘The Man Who Walked Around the World’) to ECD at Havas Worldwide and Y&R London, then CCO Ogilvy.

But more recently Mick has turned his attention towards helping more people to access creativity, understand it, and feel more confident using it. In doing so Mick has co-authored The Creative Nudge with previous guest Kev Chesters, he's developed the world’s first professional training programme for Creative Directors and released his debut solo book The Complete Creative Director.

Mick turns out to be both the most unreasonable (in a good way) and unrestrained guest to enter Marketing Room 101. Ben and Mick discuss the new book, Mick’s stubborn refusal of home office equipment, why Mick has more energy today than 30 years ago and why he’s happy to give away his secrets.

Mick then makes the case to banish five (yes five!) things, from brand value vinyls to problem spotters and pool tables.

Mick also explains how pitching is destroying the creative industry and why it’s the agency’s fault, not the client’s. Ben is then put in a tricky situation and Mick decides he doesn’t want to murder his family.

In this episode, host Ben Norman is joined by the godfather of challenger brands and anti-dullness campaigner, Adam Morgan - who, in 1999, after years as a planner in top agencies (including as Planning Director at TBWA\Chiat\Day) - wrote the international best-selling challenger brand bible Eating the Big Fish and set up the consultancy he still runs today: eatbigfish.

Adam and Ben discuss challenger brands and what’s changed for them in the past 25 years, as well as Adam’s recent work with Peter Field and Jon Evans on The Extraordinary Cost of Dull - uncovering the true cost of dull creative and media to brands and marketers.

Plus, find out what The Four Horsemen of the Dullocalypse are and how to fight them, why cows are more interesting than advertising, why AI could be the saviour, and why Ben’s brother is a genius.

In this episode, host Ben Norman is joined by Louise Tullin, Marketing Director at ⁠55/Redefined⁠, an organisation dedicated to changing life and work for people over 50 for the better.

Louise and Ben tackle the issue of age in marketing and advertising, looking at how and why the over-50s are being ignored and just how big of a problem it is, through to the commercial case, and why brands should see age as a path to growth, not a box to tick.

Plus, what can brands learn from Dove and The Olympic Committee on how to include over 55s without turning off younger audiences? And what can Amazon, Cadbury’s and Gogglebox tell us about the power of including older people in humour?

Louise also plugs a load of great books and talks about cats.

Links to everything discussed in the episode –

⁠Revolting Women by Lucy Ryan ⁠

⁠Invisible Women by Caroline Criado Perez⁠

⁠Bolder by Carl Honore⁠

⁠Much More to Come by Eleanor Mills ⁠

⁠Lifelife: Cat’s Protection Fostering Scheme ⁠