In this episode, Andrew is joined by Kathy Miller, a former senior operations executive whose career spans large-scale manufacturing, unionized environments, and global operations leadership. Kathy brings a rare perspective shaped by decades of leading under intense performance pressure, followed by formal training in positive psychology.

Rather than approaching meaningful work as a matter of motivation or engagement tactics, Kathy focuses on how work is designed, how standards are held, and how leaders relate to people when conditions are demanding. Her experience “on the concrete,” not just in offices, grounds the conversation in the realities many leaders face daily.

Together, Andrew and Kathy explore what it means to create meaningful work in operational environments, where the consequences of leadership decisions are immediate and visible, and where dignity and performance must coexist.

• Meaningful work is shaped less by inspiration and more by how systems are designed and sustained under pressure.
• Dignity and high standards are not competing values, they depend on one another.
• Leaders communicate meaning through everyday behaviors such as feedback, presence, and accountability, not just through vision or intent.
• Operational environments reveal how leadership choices affect people when work is physical, repetitive, and time constrained.

Many conversations about meaningful work focus on autonomy, purpose, or culture at a conceptual level. This episode brings the conversation into environments where work is highly structured, performance is tightly measured, and leadership is tested daily. Kathy challenges the idea that care for people requires lowering expectations and offers a grounded view of how meaning is built through systems, relationships, and consistent leadership choices. The conversation is especially relevant for leaders navigating complexity, fatigue, and pressure while still wanting to take people seriously.

Kathy Miller is a senior manufacturing executive, author, and leadership advisor with more than 25 years of global experience across aerospace, automotive, and diversified industrial organizations. Over the course of her career, she has led multi-billion-dollar operations and worked across hundreds of plants worldwide, earning recognition for her work in operational excellence and culture change.

Kathy is the author of MORE Is Better: Leading Operations with Meaning, Optimism, and Relationships for Excellence, and co-author of Steel Toes and Stilettos. She holds a Master of Applied Positive Psychology from the University of Pennsylvania, an MBA, and is an ICF-certified leadership coach.

In this episode, Andrew is joined by Steve Taylor, professor of leadership and creativity at the Worcester Polytechnic Institute (WPI) Business School, to explore how art, aesthetics, and sensory experience shape meaningful work.

Steve brings a rare perspective as both a leadership scholar and a practicing playwright. Rather than treating leadership as a set of competencies or frameworks, he invites us to see it as a craft, one that develops through judgment, reflection, and lived experience.

Together, Andrew and Steve examine how we come to know work not only through ideas and analysis, but through our bodies, our senses, and our relationships with others.

• Meaningful work is not only something we think about, but something we sense and experience through our bodies and relationships.
• Organizational aesthetics offers a way to understand power, ethics, and culture beyond formal structures and rational models.
• Art and reflective practice help leaders engage with complexity rather than prematurely simplify it.
• Discernment, the ability to notice what truly matters, including what is missing or unexpected, is a critical leadership capability.

As organizations prioritize speed, clarity, and efficiency, many people feel increasingly disconnected from the human experience of work.

This conversation challenges the assumption that meaning can be designed or optimized through logic alone. Instead, it offers a deeper view of meaningful work rooted in craft, reflection, and the courage to stay present with uncertainty.

Steve Taylor is a professor of leadership and creativity at Worcester Polytechnic Institute (WPI), where his research focuses on organizational aesthetics and reflective practice. He is the author of several books on leadership and organizations and an accomplished playwright whose work has been staged internationally. His scholarship and artistic practice shape the lens he brings to this conversation.

In this episode, Andrew is joined by Sue der Kinderen, organizational health psychologist and researcher. Rather than focusing only on how people feel at work, Sue invites us to pay closer attention to what people actually do.

Drawing on her research into eudaimonic well-being at work, Sue introduces a behavioral view of meaningful work, one rooted in personal growth, pursuit of purpose, and positive relationships. Together, Andrew and Sue explore how these behaviors show up in real organizational settings, why context and culture matter so much, and how leaders can create environments that support reflection, courage, and sustainable well-being.

• Meaningful work is not only about well-being, but about well-doing through everyday behaviors
• Eudaimonic work shows up through personal growth, pursuit of purpose, and positive relationships
• These behaviors are partly stable but strongly shaped by work climate and leadership
• Reflection and social support are essential for sustaining meaningful work, especially during change
• Eudaimonia requires courage and discomfort, not constant positivity

As work becomes faster, more complex, and increasingly shaped by technology, many people struggle to find meaning in what they do. This conversation offers a grounded alternative to abstract ideas about purpose by showing how meaningful work can be built through concrete actions and supportive contexts.

Sue der Kinderen is an organizational health psychologist, coach, and thought leader with over 20 years of experience at the intersection of work, health, and human potential. Originally trained as a counselling psychologist in South Africa, she later completed a PhD in Organizational Psychology at the Vrije Universiteit Amsterdam, where her research focused on eudaimonic well-being behaviors at work.

Through her platform Ncourage, Sue translates psychological science into speaking, thought leadership, and bespoke workplace interventions, with a strong emphasis on social support and peer reflection as drivers of sustainable change.

Work does not happen in a vacuum. It happens in spaces that shape how we feel, think, connect, and grow.

In this episode, Andrew sits down with Jenna Mikus to explore what it means to design for human flourishing. Jenna brings a rare interdisciplinary lens that bridges architecture, wellbeing science, organizational design, and philosophy. Together, they unpack the concept of eudaimonic design and what it looks like in practice, from homes and workplaces to educational and community environments.

• Meaningful work depends on the environments that surround us, including physical, organizational, and social conditions.
• Eudaimonic design blends external structure with personal agency, recognizing that flourishing emerges through interaction, not control.
• Inclusive design strengthens wellbeing for everyone by offering choice, flexibility, and dignity across diverse needs and life stages.
• Sensory experience, awe, and delight play an underappreciated role in motivation, creativity, and connection at work.
• Designing for flourishing requires interdisciplinary thinking and a willingness to sit with complexity and uncertainty.

As organizations rethink work, space, and culture in a post-pandemic world, this conversation offers a deeper foundation for those decisions. Rather than asking how to bring people back or drive performance, we should consider what conditions help people become their best selves.

This episode expands the meaning of meaningful work by showing how design, wellbeing, and purpose intersect in everyday environments.

Jenna Mikus is a strategic advisor and researcher who brings together architectural science and wellbeing science to shape environments that support human flourishing.

She is the Managing Partner of Eudae Group, where she guides organizations in designing spaces and experiences that elevate health, belonging, creativity, and innovation. Her work draws on more than twenty years of consulting experience, a background in engineering and design, and ongoing research across Human Buildings Interaction, salutogenic design, and inclusive environments.

Jenna also serves as the Flourishing by Design Chair and holds fellowship appointments with the University of Melbourne’s Centre for Wellbeing Science and Queensland University of Technology’s Centre for Decent Work and Industry.

• Follow Jenna on LinkedIn
• Eudae Group
• Flourishing by Design (FxD) community of practice
• University of Melbourne Centre for Wellbeing Science
• Queensland University of Technology Centre for Decent Work and Industry

In this episode, Andrew speaks with Bree Groff about why our days at work deserve protection on their own terms and how leaders can build healthier, more human team environments.

Together, they explore why burnout often signals a deeper business issue, how time becomes the most undervalued resource in the workplace, and what it looks like to create systems that support real people rather than extract from them.

Bree Groff is a workplace culture expert and author of Today Was Fun, with a career spent guiding leaders at companies like Microsoft, Google, Pfizer, and Memorial Sloan Kettering through complex change.

Human happiness is not a business case. Bree argues that engagement is simply human happiness in corporate language, and she invites leaders to value the finite days people give to work rather than justify them through productivity gains.

Burnout has structural roots. Chronic overwork often reveals a broken business model. When the math no longer works, leaders must rethink priorities, resources, and expectations instead of placing the burden on individual resilience.

Practical systems make work more human. Bree shares several tools that help teams reset and reconnect, including protected “golden time,” deep work blocks, and open narration when the workload is unusually heavy. These small practices build trust and reduce isolation.

Fun and hard work can coexist. The goal is not to avoid effort but to create an environment where people can show up fully and work hard without sacrificing well-being or dignity. Joy, collaboration, and emotional steadiness help teams move through demanding moments together.

Meaningful work requires leaders who understand that every workday is a real day in someone’s life, and that structure, pacing, and expectations shape whether people thrive or slowly burn out. Bree’s insights offer a blueprint for designing team environments that honor time, reduce unnecessary suffering, and rebuild the human connections that make work sustainable.

These ideas have clear implications for anyone responsible for people, culture, or performance.

Bree Groff is a workplace culture expert and author of Today Was Fun: A Book About Work (Seriously). She advises senior leaders on transformation, culture, and organizational change, informed by her work with Microsoft, Google, Pfizer, and Memorial Sloan Kettering. Bree’s career includes serving as CEO of NOBL Collective and working as a Senior Advisor at SYPartners. Her approach to work centers on humanity, practical design, and the belief that our days are precious and worth spending well, which sits at the heart of this conversation.

• Bree’s website: https://www.breegroff.com
• Today Was Fun: A Book About Work (Seriously)

Healthcare workers enter their roles with deep values and a desire to help others, yet many find themselves in systems that constrain their ability to act on those values. In this episode, Laura Holford and Anu Gorukanti explore how community, creativity, and spirituality give clinicians a way to restore agency and reconnect with their humanity.

The trio discuss moral distress, moral injury, and the heavy emotional load that comes with caring for people inside profit-driven institutions.

Laura and Anu describe how their work at Introspective Spaces creates room for vulnerability across hierarchy, rebuilds trust among clinicians, and strengthens the capacity to show up with presence.

• Moral injury affects many people in healthcare: Systemic constraints, understaffing, and inequities create powerlessness, isolation, and grief that clinicians often carry alone.
• Community care restores agency: Gathering across roles allows clinicians to see each other’s humanity and rebuild connection, trust, and collective strength.
• Creativity and spirituality support sustainability: Practices like the Artist’s Way help clinicians return to their values, slow down, and show up with integrity.
• Mutuality improves patient care: When clinicians tend to their own well-being, patient outcomes improve and the work becomes more sustainable.

Meaningful work requires environments where people feel connected, valued, and aligned with their purpose. This episode shows how collective care, shared reflection, and creative practice support real change. The conversation offers leaders and teams a model for building workplaces where humanity and healing can thrive.

Laura Holford, RN MSN is an oncology certified nurse and public health nurse in Sacramento, California. She focuses on reducing nursing burnout and moral distress and works to rebuild accountability in healthcare. Laura draws on liberation theology and her background as a campus minister and lay community pastor. She helps people develop reflective and spiritual practices that support meaningful work and clear action.

Anu Gorukanti, MD is a pediatric hospitalist and public health advocate at a county hospital in Los Angeles. Her work centers on health equity, racial justice, and the role of contemplation in social change. Anu believes that clarity about personal values creates space for a more authentic life and more compassionate systems.

• Introspective Spaces
• The Artist’s Way by Julia Cameron
• Emergent Strategy by adrienne maree brown
• The Art of Gathering by Priya Parker
• The Wounded Healer by Henri Nouwen

In this episode, philosopher Kevin Aho joins Andrew Soren to explore how modern life has turned meaning into measurement. Together, they examine how neoliberal values have reshaped higher education, the wellness industry, and even our sense of self.

Kevin and Andrew discuss how the culture of busyness and the commodification of well-being have left many people feeling unmoored, and why rediscovering our shared humanity might be the most important work of all.

Kevin Aho is Professor of Philosophy and Chair of the Department of Communication and Philosophy at Florida Gulf Coast University. His work explores existentialism, phenomenology, and the philosophy of health and illness.

• Meaning has become a metric. When education and work are reduced to measurable outputs, we lose sight of their deeper purpose: to help people grow, think critically, and engage with one another as human beings.
• The wellness industry reflects a deeper emptiness. The rise of “self-care” culture often masks structural problems, placing responsibility for well-being entirely on individuals instead of addressing the social conditions that shape health and belonging.
• The self is not a solo project. Kevin challenges the notion of a separate, autonomous self, suggesting that meaning and identity only exist through relationships with others.
• Community is the antidote to alienation. Small acts of connection, through art, education, or shared spaces, can help rebuild the collective life that neoliberal culture erodes.

In a time when organizations are driven by efficiency and individuals feel pressured to optimize every part of life, this conversation reminds us that meaning cannot be measured or achieved alone.

For leaders and changemakers, Kevin’s ideas offer a call to design systems and workplaces that honor interdependence, nurture reflection, and restore our sense of community and care.

Kevin Aho is Professor of Philosophy and Chair of the Department of Communication and Philosophy at Florida Gulf Coast University. His research spans existentialism, phenomenology, hermeneutics, and the philosophy of health and illness. Through his books, Kevin explores what it means to live well, face suffering, and find meaning in our finite lives. His forthcoming work, A Phenomenology of Functional Neurological Disorder, continues this inquiry into how illness and vulnerability reveal what it truly means to be human.

What can Aristotle teach us about meaningful work today?

In this episode, Andrew Soren sits down with Marcel Meyer, professor at the School of Economics and Business at the University of Navarra, to explore how virtue ethics can help us navigate modern leadership and organizational life.

Drawing from Aristotle’s concept of eudaimonia (human flourishing), Marcel shares how cultivating character, wisdom, and purpose allows leaders to create workplaces where people thrive individually and collectively.

• Virtue is developed through action and reflection. Ethical character isn’t innate, but built through everyday choices, habits, and feedback that shape who we become at work and in life.
• Flourishing happens in community. Meaningful work and ethical growth depend on relationships and shared responsibility, not isolation.
• Leadership is a form of rhetoric. Effective leaders inspire through pathos (empathy), logos (reason), and ethos (character), which aligns emotion, logic, and integrity to create trust and shared purpose.
• Hope and optimism can be cultivated. Drawing from Positive Organizational Scholarship, Marcel outlines how leaders can foster environments that generate positive cycles of emotion, action, and growth.

Aristotle may not have written about modern workplaces, but his philosophy offers a timeless framework for understanding what makes work meaningful. Marcel’s perspective bridges ancient wisdom with organizational science, offering leaders practical ways to ground their teams in purpose, integrity, and human connection. This episode is for anyone curious about how moral character and practical wisdom can shape organizations that truly enable people to flourish.

Marcel Meyer is a professor at the School of Economics and Business at the University of Navarra, specializing in ethical leadership, organizational behavior, and Aristotelian virtue ethics. His research examines how leadership grounded in virtue and purpose fosters human flourishing within organizations. Marcel’s work integrates philosophy with management practice, spanning topics from executive communication on sustainability to the cultivation of practical wisdom in leaders. A former corporate trainer for companies like Volkswagen and Liebherr, he brings both academic and applied expertise to his study of virtue in business.

What makes people feel they truly matter at work? In this episode, we talk with Dr. Beverly Kaye, a trailblazer in career development, employee engagement, and retention. For more than 50 years, Bev has shown that the small things leaders do, like noticing and naming what they see, can have the biggest impact on whether people grow, feel valued, and choose to stay.

In their conversation, Andrew and Bev explore why growth is more than climbing the ladder, how everyday conversations shape engagement, and what it means to lead with an “opportunity minded” approach.

• Noticing creates mattering. Saying out loud what you see in someone is the simplest way to show they matter.
• Growth is not just up. Careers can be kaleidoscopes, shifting through lateral moves and fresh perspectives.
• Conversations are retention tools. Stay interviews and everyday check-ins build trust and engagement.
• Opportunity mindset matters. Leaders and employees can either be opportunity minded or opportunity blinded.

Meaningful work isn’t only about the tasks we do, but how others see us and help us grow. Bev’s lifetime of work shows that noticing, mattering, and honest conversations are the foundation of engagement and retention.

Dr. Beverly Kaye is recognized internationally as one of the most knowledgeable voices on career development, employee engagement, and retention. Her books have become classics for managers and organizations worldwide, offering simple, practical tools for growth and retention that stand the test of time.

In the blog, we expand on Kaye’s ideas with more context and examples, including her concept of kaleidoscope careers. Read more here: https://www.eudaimonicbydesign.com/resilience/bev-kaye

This week, we’re celebrating a milestone: the 50th episode of Meaningful Work Matters!

Over the past two years, we’ve spoken with more than 50 researchers, thinkers, and practitioners who are reimagining what makes work meaningful.

To mark this moment, we are doing something different. Instead of an interview, Andrew shares his own reflections, based on an article co-written with his mentor and friend, Dr. Carol Ryff. Together, they explore what it means to see work not only as a driver of productivity or advantage but also as a moral commitment and a way of reclaiming the communal soul of work.

This special solo episode invites you to pause, reflect, and imagine how workplaces can become modern-day polis: moral communities designed for human flourishing.

• Andrew reflects on what it would mean to treat organizations as moral communities, drawing inspiration from Aristotle’s polis.
• He explores the tension between individual wellbeing and collective flourishing, and why both matter for the future of work.
• The episode touches on what makes “decent work” a foundation for human thriving, and why organizations cannot ignore it.
• Andrew shares why the business case for wellbeing is not enough, and what it takes to move beyond metrics into moral purpose.
• Finally, he considers how the arts and the stories we tell can help us reclaim the deeper soul of work.

This conversation is an invitation for reflection, dialogue, and action. For a deeper dive into the themes Andrew shares in this episode, visit our companion blog.

If you have been part of our journey so far, thank you. If you are new, this is a perfect time to start listening. And if something resonates, we would love for you to share it with a friend or colleague and let us know what ideas or stories it sparks for you.