In this episode of Compassion in a T-Shirt, I have the great pleasure of speaking with Dr Sarah Bowen—clinical psychologist, Associate Professor at Pacific University in Oregon, and one of the co-developers of Mindfulness-Based Relapse Prevention (MBRP).

I first met Sarah back in 2011 at the Joshua Tree Retreat Centre during an MBRP facilitator training. That experience had a lasting impact on me—deepening my interest in mindfulness, compassion, and their place in addiction recovery. So it was a real joy to reconnect with her for this conversation.

We explore the foundations of MBRP and how it brings together mindfulness, cognitive behavioural therapy, and motivational interviewing to support people through the ups and downs of recovery. Sarah also shares her thoughts on how compassion and self-compassion—whether front and centre or gently in the background—play a vital role in healing.

We dive into her research adapting MBRP for women with co-occurring PTSD and substance use difficulties, reflect on her time working with the late Allan Marlatt, and explore the integration of radical behaviourism and Buddhist psychology—two traditions that, while seemingly different, have surprising synergies when it comes to understanding suffering and change.

It’s a rich, thoughtful, and deeply human conversation. I hope you find it as inspiring as I did.

TIMESTAMPS:

00:00 Introduction

00:30 Discovering Mindfulness-Based Relapse Prevention (MBRP)

02:07 Exploring the core of MBRP

11:43 The role of compassion in MBRP

15:27 Adapting MBRP for trauma and gender-specific needs

21:15 Insights from working with Allan Marlatt

23:12 Integrating meditation into scientific practice

24:08 The evolution of mindfulness and behaviourism

26:11 Understanding radical behaviourism

27:59 Classical vs. operant conditioning

29:30 Behaviourism in addiction treatment

32:44 Bridging Buddhism and behaviourism

38:00 Current projects and future directions

43:08 Encouraging mindfulness practice

45:12 Conclusion and gratitude

LINKS:

Dr Sarah Bowen at Pacific University

https://www.pacificu.edu/about/directory/people/sarah-bowen-phd

Trauma-Integrated Mindfulness-Based Relapse Prevention for Women with Comorbid Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder and Substance Use Disorder: A Cluster Randomized Controlled Feasibility and Acceptability Trial (Somohano & Bowen, 2022)

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35648046/

Overlaying Buddhist and behaviorist lenses to better understand and address human suffering. (Bowen et al., 2021)

https://psycnet.apa.org/record/2021-66328-001

If you would like to learn more about compassion focused therapy, you can find Dr Stan Steindl's book The Gifts of Compassion here:

https://www.ausapress.com/p/the-gifts-of-compassion-how-to-understand-and-overcome-suffering/

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Video hashtags:

mindfulness, relapse prevention, addiction recovery, self-compassion, trauma-informed, behaviourism