Narativ Leadership Story Talks

"When you see the stories in your consumers across the board, it really brings to life the humanity of the audiences that you're serving." — Kristian Alomá

What if the most valuable thing a brand could learn about its customers isn't found in a survey, demographic profile, or spreadsheet—but in the stories they tell?

In this episode of Leadership Story Talks, hosts Jerome Deroy and Julienne B. Ryan welcome Kristian Alomá, PhD, narrative psychologist, brand strategist, author of Start with a Story, and founder of Threadline Branding. Kristian shares how a high school summer program at Northwestern University changed the course of his life, eventually leading him to explore the intersection of consumer psychology, storytelling, and brand relationships.

Drawing on his research and experience working with global brands, Kristian challenges conventional approaches to understanding consumers. Through vivid examples, including why travelers choose Airbnb over hotels, he reveals how listening beyond people's initial answers can uncover the deeper narratives that shape their decisions, identities, and relationships.

The conversation explores the distinction between the stories we tell others and those we tell ourselves, the psychology of narrative transportation, and why organizations have both an opportunity and a responsibility to see the humanity behind their customer data.

You'll Hear:

• How a summer business program at Northwestern became a defining turning point in Kristian's life and career.
• What narrative psychology is and how it helps us understand the stories people construct to make sense of their world.
• Why demographic profiles and traditional customer personas often miss what truly motivates people—and why King Charles and Ozzy Osbourne make such a revealing comparison.
• The difference between the stories people tell others and the internal narratives that shape their beliefs and behaviors.
• How asking deeper questions about travel experiences revealed motivations that conventional market research overlooked.
• Why brands should build narrative personas by listening to people's experiences rather than simply checking demographic boxes.
• How narrative transportation allows audiences to immerse themselves in a story, making experiences more memorable and meaningful.
• Why data and storytelling aren't competing approaches—and how data can make stories more credible and compelling.
• What it means for organizations to recognize their place in customers' lives and take that responsibility seriously.

Ultimately, Kristian reminds us that understanding people requires more than gathering information about them. It requires curiosity, listening, and a willingness to look beyond assumptions. When organizations recognize the stories their customers are living, they can build relationships grounded in greater understanding, relevance, and respect.

Resources

Kristian Alomá — Professional & Author

• Kristian Alomá — Official Website
• Kristian Alomá on LinkedIn
• Kristian Alomá on Facebook
• Kristian Alomá on Instagram
• Book: Start with a Story by Kristian Alomá

Threadline Branding

• Threadline Branding — Website
• Threadline Branding on LinkedIn

Experience The Listening Lab

Looking for greater clarity around your own story and purpose?
The Listening Lab is a community for leaders, coaches, and professionals who want to think more clearly, communicate more authentically, and discover the stories that move people. Start with a free 30-day trial:
https://listeninglabfreespot.carrd.co

Narativ’s online course in partnership with New Mexico State University Global Campus: Lead With Your Story (self-paced, on-demand course)
Podcast listeners get 25% off - Use code NARATIV → Register Here

Learn more about how to leverage Narativ’s storytelling method for your pitch and sales team: Download our free e-book, or you’re welcome to schedule a free 15-minute call with Jerome.

Please join our mailing list to stay updated on all our latest episodes and events.

EMAIL [email protected]
LINKEDIN https://www.linkedin.com/company/narativ-inc
TWITTER @narativ

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“What if we walked out of our homes every day with open-mindedness and curiosity?” — Jerome Deroy

In this debrief episode of Leadership Story Talks, hosts Jerome Deroy and Julienne Ryan revisit a memorable story from their conversation with Joe Diaz of AFAR Media. A blind travel writer arrives in unfamiliar places with one simple strategy: find an elbow to hold on to. And every time, someone is there to help.

That story sparks a conversation about curiosity, trust, and the power of human connection. Julienne shares a recent encounter on a train in Austria that illustrates how a small act of kindness can completely shift someone's experience.

Together, Jerome and Julienne explore what happens when we approach others with openness rather than assumptions—and how the lessons we learn while traveling can change the way we show up in our own communities.

You'll Hear

• Why curiosity and open-mindedness are essential to meaningful travel—and everyday life.
• How unexpected encounters can challenge our assumptions about others.
• The ripple effect of a simple act of kindness.
• Why listening, asking for help, and trusting others can open doors to deeper connections.
• How to bring the spirit of adventure and discovery into familiar surroundings.

Resources

• Leadership Story Talks: Listen to the full interview with Joe Diaz HERE
• AFAR Media: afar.com

Experience The Listening Lab

Looking for greater clarity around your own story and purpose?
The Listening Lab is a community for leaders, coaches, and professionals who want to think more clearly, communicate more authentically, and discover the stories that move people. Start with a free 30-day trial:
https://listeninglabfreespot.carrd.co

Narativ’s online course in partnership with New Mexico State University Global Campus: Lead With Your Story (self-paced, on-demand course)
Podcast listeners get 25% off - Use code NARATIV → Register Here

Learn more about how to leverage Narativ’s storytelling method for your pitch and sales team: Download our free e-book, or you’re welcome to schedule a free 15-minute call with Jerome.

Please join our mailing list to stay updated on all our latest episodes and events.

EMAIL [email protected]
LINKEDIN https://www.linkedin.com/company/narativ-inc
TWITTER @narativ

Buy Julienne’s book ...

In this episode of Leadership Story Talks, Jerome Deroy and Julienne Ryan welcome Dick Richardson, founder of Let's Think Smart, leadership development expert, and survivor of the Miracle on the Hudson.

Dick shares his remarkable experience aboard Flight 1549 and what it taught him about human behavior in moments of crisis. The conversation moves from an unusual storytelling ritual during IBM's transformation to the role of stories in helping people navigate change, envision the future, and discover their own capacity for leadership.

You'll Hear

• What surviving the Miracle on the Hudson revealed about fear, courage, and our instinct to help one another
• How an IBM leader used storytelling and ritual to help employees embrace organizational change
• Why leaders need to make their vision of the future vivid, specific, and relatable
• How everyday crises can be navigated through practical behaviors that reshape our thinking
• Why staying calm just a little longer can make a difference when things go wrong

Resources

Connect with Dick Richardson

• Website: https://dickrichardson.com
• YouTube: Let's Think Smart
• Facebook: @LetsThinkSmart
• LinkedIn: @dickrichardson

Books by Dick Richardson

• How Smart People Think: Simple Frameworks for Better Business Decisions
• How "Smart" People Think: —and Make Predictably Bad Decisions
• Apollo Leadership Lessons: Powerful Business Insights for Executives

Forthcoming: FUBAR, Dick's book exploring practical ways to navigate life's everyday crises.

Experience The Listening Lab

Looking for greater clarity around your own story and purpose?
The Listening Lab is a community for leaders, coaches, and professionals who want to think more clearly, communicate more authentically, and discover the stories that move people. Start with a free 30-day trial:
https://listeninglabfreespot.carrd.co

Narativ’s online course in partnership with New Mexico State University Global Campus: Lead With Your Story (self-paced, on-demand course)
Podcast listeners get 25% off - Use code NARATIV → Register Here

Learn more about how to leverage Narativ’s storytelling method for your pitch and sales team: Download our free e-book, or you’re welcome to schedule a free 15-minute call with Jerome.

Please join our mailing list to stay updated on all our latest episodes and events.

EMAIL [email protected]
LINKEDIN https://www.linkedin.com/company/narativ-inc
TWITTER @narativ

Buy Julienne’s book ...

“The stories bring these terms that we sometimes use without thinking… to life.” — Jerome Deroy

What happens when three storytellers, who have never met and prepared their stories independently, step onto the same stage?

In this debrief of our September Live Story Show, Jerome Deroy and Julienne Ryan reflect on the unexpected connective tissue that emerged across the stories of Carlo Odicino, Anna Vafeiadou, and Dr. Sona Sherratt.

One theme stood out: belonging.

Each storyteller approached it from a completely different direction — exclusion and its impact on leadership, leaving the familiar to begin a new chapter, and adapting to a new culture while wrestling with what it means to belong.

Jerome and Julienne also explore why stories continue working on us long after we've heard them. A story can take on new meaning days or weeks later, resurfacing when a conversation or experience suddenly connects us back to what we heard.

You’ll Hear:

• How an unexpected common thread emerges when storytellers share experiences without knowing one another’s stories
• Three very different ways the September storytellers brought the idea of belonging to life
• Why words like belonging, courage, change, and transformation become more meaningful when grounded in lived experience
• The role of courage across all three stories
• Why the right story can feel different depending on the moment in which it is told
• How listening to someone else’s story can continue to inspire, stimulate, and influence our thinking long after the story ends
• Why the connections an audience makes between stories may be just as important as the ones the storytellers intended

Resources:

Watch or listen to the full September Live Story Show featuring Carlo Odicino, Anna Vafeiadou, and Dr. Sona Sherratt.

Subscribe to Leadership Story Talks wherever you listen to podcasts and on YouTube so you don’t miss an episode.

Experience The Listening Lab

Looking for greater clarity around your own story and purpose?
The Listening Lab is a community for leaders, coaches, and professionals who want to think more clearly, communicate more authentically, and discover the stories that move people. Start with a free 30-day trial:
https://listeninglabfreespot.carrd.co

Narativ’s online course in partnership with New Mexico State University Global Campus: Lead With Your Story (self-paced, on-demand course)
Podcast listeners get 25% off - Use code NARATIV → Register Here

Learn more about how to leverage Narativ’s storytelling method for your pitch and sales team: Download our free e-book, or you’re welcome to schedule a free 15-minute call with Jerome.

Please join our mailing list to stay updated on all our latest episodes and events.

EMAIL [email protected]
LINKEDIN https://www.linkedin.com/company/narativ-inc
TWITTER @narativ

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“Being welcomed into a relationship, a country, or a workplace is one thing, but being able to remain yourself once you arrive is something completely different.” — Sona Sherratt

What happens when we share the experiences that shaped us—and give each other the space to really listen?

In this special live edition of Leadership Story Talks, Jerome Deroy and Julienne Ryan welcome three past podcast guests—Carlo Odicino, Anna Vafeiadou, and Dr. Sona Sherratt—to tell six-minute personal stories about pivotal moments in their lives.

Carlo shares a difficult piece of feedback that forced him to confront the gap between how much he cared about his team and how his leadership was actually being experienced. Anna takes us into the decision to leave a decade of environmental advocacy behind and build something of her own. And Sona traces a journey across countries and cultures to explore the unwritten rules we absorb about belonging—and what happens when we begin to make those rules visible.

The stories were not planned to connect, yet striking threads emerged between them: how we are seen and heard, how we adapt to the people around us, how feedback can change us, and what becomes possible when we create spaces where people feel safe enough to reveal more of themselves.

You’ll Hear

• Why Carlo’s commitment to candor wasn’t creating the care and connection he thought it was—and the feedback that changed his approach to leadership.
• How shifting from “failure is not an option” to “it’s all learning” changed the way Carlo leads his own company.
• The moment Anna recognized that work she had helped initiate was becoming reality—and why that success became a catalyst for leaving and starting her own business.
• What the very different reactions to Anna’s resignation revealed about change, courage, and the people around us.
• How moving between India, the United States, and England taught Sona to notice—and eventually absorb—the unwritten rules of belonging.
• Why one research participant’s phrase, “I prepare my face,” crystallized something Sona had experienced throughout her own life.
• How power, culture, and context can cause us to contract or expand depending on who is in the room.
• Why psychological safety can be something we feel in our bodies before we consciously understand it.
• The unexpected connections between three stories told by people who had never heard one another’s stories before—and the role listening plays in allowing those connections to emerge.

Resources

Carlo Odicino
One Team Partners: www.oneteampartners.com

Anna Vafeiadou
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/anna-vafeiadou-12579a130/

Sona Sherratt
TEDx Talk — What Your Body Knows Before You Do: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Xvv0IoyvmE
Hult Ashridge Executive Education: https://www.hultashridge.com/en/

EXPERIENCE
Join us for the next Live Story Show, Stories That Shaped Us, on November 19, 2026:
https://us02web.zoom.us/webinar/register/WN_-3vZOkBXSaeREkZARkQbzQ

PRACTICE
Experience the Listening Lab with a free one-month trial—a small community of practice where we come together to listen to real people, real challenges, and real stories, and get better at staying present when conversations matter:
https://thelisteninglab.framer.website/

Experience The Listening Lab

Looking for greater clarity around your own story and purpose?
The Listening Lab is a community for leaders, coaches, and professionals who want to think more clearly, communicate more authentically, and discover the stories that move people. Start with a free 30-day trial:
https://listeninglabfreespot.carrd.co

Narativ’s online course in partnership with New Mexico State University Global Campus: Lead With Your Story (self-paced, on-demand course)
Podcast listeners get 25% off - Use code NARATIV → Register Here

Learn more about how to leverage Narativ’s storytelling method for your pitch and sales team: Download our free e-book, or you’re welcome to schedule a free 15-minute call with Jerome.

Please join our mailing list to stay updated on all our latest episodes and events.

EMAIL [email protected]
LINKEDIN https://www.linkedin.com/company/narativ-inc
TWITTER @narativ

Buy Julienne’s book ...

What are the things you’ve always wanted to do—but keep putting off until you have more time?

After six years of building and running schools, Ravi Gupta found himself exhausted and disconnected from parts of himself he had put aside. At weddings, while reading, or simply watching other people pursue something they loved, he kept noticing the same thing: reminders of experiences he wanted to have, skills he wanted to learn, and passions he had never made space for. So he started writing them down.

That became his “Invisible List”—and the beginning of an experiment: choose one passion each year and commit to pursuing it. Since then, Ravi has taken on everything from surfing and tennis to novel writing, powerlifting, cooking, and even studying for the MCAT. Each pursuit became more than learning a new skill. It became a way of reconnecting with curiosity, challenging himself, and rediscovering parts of who he was.

In this episode of Leadership Story Talks, Ravi joins Jerome Deroy and Julienne Ryan to explore the ideas behind his book, The Invisible List: One Passion a Year, Every Year. Their conversation moves from burnout and identity to lifelong learning, the role of ritual and consistency, and how we might use AI without giving away the very thinking and creative struggle that help us grow.

You’ll Hear:

• How Ravi’s experience launching a school in North Nashville became one of the most formative—and difficult—experiences of his professional life.
• How burnout after starting six schools in six years led him to recognize his own “Invisible List.”
• Why writing down the things you’ve always wanted to do can be the first step toward actually making space for them.
• How different seasons of life call for different kinds of pursuits—from skills you can practice in spare 20- or 30-minute windows to immersive “skill-baticals.”
• Why Ravi decided to spend a year preparing for the MCAT as a kind of “mental marathon,” training memory, attention, curiosity, and problem-solving.
• Ravi’s approach to AI: struggle with the problem first, then use technology once you’ve reached the limits of what you can do yourself.
• Why he believes brainstorming and idea generation may be exactly where we should be most cautious about outsourcing our thinking to AI.
• How creating rituals around learning can make it easier to keep showing up consistently.
• A simple exercise for beginning your own Invisible List: one hour, a pen and paper, no phone, no Google, no AI—and permission to write down everything you’ve wanted to try.
• Why imagining the next decade of your life can create excitement and momentum long before those experiences actually happen.
• How Ravi’s pursuits are increasingly shifting from individual growth toward service—and why training as a firefighter may be next on his list.
• The reminder at the heart of Ravi’s message: there may never be a perfect time to begin, so don’t wait.

Resources:

• Ravi’s company, The Branch
• Ravi’s book, The Invisible List: One Passion a Year, Every Year
• Lost Debate podcast
• Majority 54 podcast: 

--    

Experience The Listening Lab

Looking for greater clarity around your own story and purpose?
The Listening Lab is a community for leaders, coaches, and professionals who want to think more clearly, communicate more authentically, and discover the stories that move people. Start with a free 30-day trial:
https://listeninglabfreespot.carrd.co

Narativ’s online course in partnership with New Mexico State University Global Campus: Lead With Your Story (self-paced, on-demand course)
Podcast listeners get 25% off - Use code NARATIV → Register Here

Learn more about how to leverage Narativ’s storytelling method for your pitch and sales team: Download our free e-book, or you’re welcome to schedule a free 15-minute call with Jerome.

Please join our mailing list to stay updated on all our latest episodes and events.

EMAIL [email protected]
LINKEDIN https://www.linkedin.com/company/narativ-inc
TWITTER @narativ

Buy Julienne’s book ...

“The wonderful thing about storytelling is it’s a craft and you can get better at it.” — Peter Orton

At 30, Peter Orton had tenure as a public school teacher and the promise of a secure career. But when his father sensed he wasn’t happy, he asked a simple question: “So what’s stopping you?” Within a week, Peter resigned and eventually headed west to pursue his dream of becoming a writer.

Nearly a decade later, a phone call from legendary writer Richard Matheson changed everything. Peter had submitted scripts for Steven Spielberg’s Amazing Stories. Matheson’s notes? Two words: “Shoot it.” Soon after, Peter was working at Universal Studios as a story editor.

That turning point began a career spanning Hollywood, Stanford, IBM, and the Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health. Along the way, Peter founded IBM’s Global Storytelling Practice and became a teacher and scholar of how stories work.

In this episode, Peter joins Jerome Deroy and Julienne Ryan to reflect on a lifetime of studying, practicing, and teaching storytelling—and what he’s learned about the craft along the way.

You’ll Hear:

• The conversation with Peter’s father that led him to leave a tenured teaching position at age 30 and head to Los Angeles
• Why pursuing his dream didn’t mean overnight success—and what Peter did for nearly a decade to learn the craft of screenwriting
• The remarkable phone call from Richard Matheson that led to Peter becoming a story editor on Steven Spielberg’s Amazing Stories
• How Peter’s interests in storytelling, education, and media eventually came together at Stanford and IBM
• Why IBM began investing in storytelling as a leadership and communication competency
• The difference between recognizing a story and understanding what actually makes something a story
• Why knowing your audience may be the most important rule in storytelling
• How concrete, sensory details help your audience create a “little movie” in their minds—and make a story more memorable
• Why stories often become shorter and stronger as we refine them
• Peter’s thoughts on the increasingly visual future of storytelling and communication
• Why turning points—both intentional and accidental—can be powerful starting places for finding our stories
• Why storytelling isn’t something you either have or don’t have, but a craft that improves through practice and feedback

Resources & Links

Peter Orton is the author of The Elements of Story: How to Craft Engaging Story for Effective Communication and Presentation.

Learn more about Peter and his work at Working Stories

Experience The Listening Lab

Looking for greater clarity around your own story and purpose?
The Listening Lab is a community for leaders, coaches, and professionals who want to think more clearly, communicate more authentically, and discover the stories that move people. Start with a free 30-day trial:
https://listeninglabfreespot.carrd.co

Narativ’s online course in partnership with New Mexico State University Global Campus: Lead With Your Story (self-paced, on-demand course)
Podcast listeners get 25% off - Use code NARATIV → Register Here

Learn more about how to leverage Narativ’s storytelling method for your pitch and sales team: Download our free e-book, or you’re welcome to schedule a free 15-minute call with Jerome.

Please join our mailing list to stay updated on all our latest episodes and events.

EMAIL [email protected]
LINKEDIN https://www.linkedin.com/company/narativ-inc
TWITTER @narativ

Buy Julienne’s book ...

“When we gain context, it does give us permission to just appreciate the other person, even if we still don't agree with them.”
— Julienne B. Ryan

Overview
What happens when curiosity becomes less about getting answers and more about truly seeing another person?

In this debrief of our conversation with Martin Koehler, Jerome Deroy and Julienne B. Ryan explore how genuine curiosity, full attention, and appreciation can create the conditions for people to show up differently. They discuss the difference between questions that open a conversation and questions that shut one down, why context can challenge our assumptions, and the value of looking for good intentions—even when someone’s words initially rub us the wrong way.

You’ll Hear

- Why listening, attention, and appreciation can feel like a rare gift
- How curiosity can reveal what’s really underneath someone’s stated challenge
- The connection between storytelling and asking better, more open-ended questions
- Why questions like “When did this happen?” and “Where did you learn that?” can lead somewhere assumptions cannot
- How gaining context can increase patience and understanding, even when we disagree
- Why looking for the good intention behind someone’s words can open up dialogue instead of shutting it down
- How being genuinely heard and acknowledged can help people appreciate something in themselves they may not have recognized before

Resources

Check out episode 201 with Martin Koehler here: https://narativ.com/podcasts/one-hour-no-agenda-the-power-of-honest-conversation-with-martin-koehler/

Experience The Listening Lab

Looking for greater clarity around your own story and purpose?
The Listening Lab is a community for leaders, coaches, and professionals who want to think more clearly, communicate more authentically, and discover the stories that move people. Start with a free 30-day trial:
https://listeninglabfreespot.carrd.co

Narativ’s online course in partnership with New Mexico State University Global Campus: Lead With Your Story (self-paced, on-demand course)
Podcast listeners get 25% off - Use code NARATIV → Register Here

Learn more about how to leverage Narativ’s storytelling method for your pitch and sales team: Download our free e-book, or you’re welcome to schedule a free 15-minute call with Jerome.

Please join our mailing list to stay updated on all our latest episodes and events.

EMAIL [email protected]
LINKEDIN https://www.linkedin.com/company/narativ-inc
TWITTER @narativ

Buy Julienne’s book ...

What happens when the work you do stops being abstract—and you come face-to-face with the people whose lives depend on it?

For Latanya Mapp, that happened on her first day working for UNICEF in Ethiopia. Sent into an area devastated by drought and crop failure, she encountered an experience that would stay with her throughout more than three decades of work across international development, diplomacy, philanthropy, and social change.

In this episode of Leadership Story Talks, Jerome Deroy and Julienne Ryan speak with Latanya about the importance of staying close to the people affected by our decisions. She reflects on shifting power and capital toward those closest to the problems, building relationships that allow leaders to be “called in” rather than called out, and why simply saying “my door is always open” may not be enough.

Latanya also shares what happened when she stepped away from traditional organizational leadership and created space for discernment. Asked the deceptively simple question “Who are you?”, she rediscovered a thread that had been present throughout her life: sometimes finding what comes next means returning to what was there all along.

You’ll Hear

• How Latanya's first day with UNICEF in Ethiopia became one of the defining experiences of her life
• Why leaders need to stay connected to the people ultimately affected by their work
• How seeing the human stories behind statistics can transform our sense of responsibility
• The thread Latanya sees connecting her work across diplomacy, international development, philanthropy, and social change
• What it means to shift power and capital toward people closest to the problems
• Why communities need to tell leaders what they actually need rather than having solutions imposed upon them
• What Latanya learned when reproductive justice organizations publicly challenged Planned Parenthood
• Why an “open door” isn't enough if people don't feel they have permission to walk through it
• How building genuine stakeholder relationships can create opportunities for leaders to be “called in” rather than called out
• Why Latanya stepped away from traditional organizational leadership to create space for discernment
• What the deceptively simple question “Who are you?” helped her rediscover about herself
• Why the work closest to your heart and closest to your abilities may be the best place to begin when the problems around us feel overwhelming

Resources

• Latanya Mapp | LinkedIn
• Latanya | Culture Seekers
• The Everyday Feminist: The Key to Sustainable Social Impact—Driving Movements We Need Now More than Ever — Global Fund for Women
• Navigate AI Collaborative | Discover AI Solutions Today

Experience The Listening Lab

Looking for greater clarity around your own story and purpose?
The Listening Lab is a community for leaders, coaches, and professionals who want to think more clearly, communicate more authentically, and discover the stories that move people. Start with a free 30-day trial:
https://listeninglabfreespot.carrd.co

Narativ’s online course in partnership with New Mexico State University Global Campus: Lead With Your Story (self-paced, on-demand course)
Podcast listeners get 25% off - Use code NARATIV → Register Here

Learn more about how to leverage Narativ’s storytelling method for your pitch and sales team: Download our free e-book, or you’re welcome to schedule a free 15-minute call with Jerome.

Please join our mailing list to stay updated on all our latest episodes and events.

EMAIL [email protected]
LINKEDIN https://www.linkedin.com/company/narativ-inc
TWITTER @narativ

Buy Julienne’s book ...

Overview

What can we learn from what someone doesn't say?

In this debrief of our conversation with Logan Yonavjak, Jerome Deroy and Julienne B. Ryan explore the power of noticing what is absent from a conversation: the pauses, hesitations, avoided subjects, gestures, and even changes in breathing that can reveal something words don't.

Sometimes those omissions point to a blind spot—something we haven't yet recognized about ourselves. But once we become aware of them, what we leave unsaid can also become a deliberate communication choice.

Jerome and Julienne discuss how pauses, breath, body language, and carefully chosen omissions can make storytelling more engaging by giving an audience room to participate and fill in the blanks.

In a world of oversharing, effective communication isn't always about adding more. Sometimes it's about knowing what to leave out.

You'll Hear

- Why listening for what's not being said can reveal blind spots
- What Julienne learned about pauses and hesitation from her experience in recruiting and reference checking
- How body language, facial expressions, gestures, and breathing communicate beyond words
- The difference between unconsciously avoiding something and intentionally choosing not to say it
- Why a well-placed pause can cause an audience to lean in
- How leaving space allows listeners to fill in the blanks and participate in a story
- Why storytelling requires curation rather than simply sharing everything
- How “less is more” applies to leadership communication
- Why breath and silence are powerful tools when presenting
- A simple invitation to become more mindful of what you say—and what you don't

Resources

Related Episode: Listen to the full conversation with Logan Yonavjak or watch the interview on YouTube, for more on leadership readiness, high-pressure environments, and what we can discover by paying attention to what's not being said.

Experience The Listening Lab

Looking for greater clarity around your own story and purpose?
The Listening Lab is a community for leaders, coaches, and professionals who want to think more clearly, communicate more authentically, and discover the stories that move people. Start with a free 30-day trial:
https://listeninglabfreespot.carrd.co

Narativ’s online course in partnership with New Mexico State University Global Campus: Lead With Your Story (self-paced, on-demand course)
Podcast listeners get 25% off - Use code NARATIV → Register Here

Learn more about how to leverage Narativ’s storytelling method for your pitch and sales team: Download our free e-book, or you’re welcome to schedule a free 15-minute call with Jerome.

Please join our mailing list to stay updated on all our latest episodes and events.

EMAIL [email protected]
LINKEDIN https://www.linkedin.com/company/narativ-inc
TWITTER @narativ

Buy Julienne’s book ...