Fred Fisher  - Fisher Consulting

On the Unrealistic Expectations We Have in the Insurance World: "You have to know more about your insurance needs than the guy selling it, the guy who has to take continuing education classes."

Insurance is basically paying for a promise you hope you will not need to ask to be kept.  To avoid great financial loss, or to have the support of a team of lawyers, insurance is a necessary evil.  Like most things that are necessary.

Fred Fisher of Fisher Consulting has been in the insurance world for decades.  He has been working in insurance in different roles throughout his career and knows the industry inside and out.  What he shares is both educational and a bit frightening.

Listen as Fred Fisher shares hard-earned insights gained through decades in the industry as a claims expert, lawyer, consultant, and author. He uncovers the pitfalls of buying on price alone, exposes the risks of working with “order-taker” insurance agents, and explains why business owners need to demand more from their insurance brokers.

Enjoy!

Visit Fred at: https://www.fishercg.com

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Podcast Overview:

00:00 Pursuing law to help artists

06:12 Understanding legal claim complexities

14:22 Undisclosed potential claims risk

17:01 Handling an insurance claim oversight

23:41 Managing legal risks and disclosures

31:51 Handling policy order requests

36:00 How Farmers handles declines

39:30 Unexpected renovation challenges

44:34 Understanding building code coverage

48:41 Understanding tech liability policies

55:16 Delayed claims denial examples

01:01:21 Restrictive insurance policy drafting

01:09:55 Choosing not to compete anymore

01:12:29 Challenges in insurance claims handling

01:19:56 Treating renewals as new business

01:22:53 Program introduction and sponsorships

Podcast Transcription:

Fred Fisher [00:00:00]:

I used to tell my staff, never take a renewal for granted. Treat every renewal as new business because our competitor will. They're going to dive deep, they're going to find a hole, they're going to find out that our insured's doing something new that we didn't know about, that that we're not covering. And they can. So treat every renewal as new business because our competitor is going to do that because it is new business for them. So either we dig deep and compete or we lose the account.

James Kademan [00:00:31]:

You have found Authentic Business Adventures, the business program that brings you the struggle stories and triumphant successes of business owners across the land. Downloadable audio episodes can be found in the podcast link found at drawincustomers.com we are locally underwritten by the Bank of Sun Prairie, Calls On Call Extraordinary Answering Service, the Bold Business Book and as well as Live Switch. And today we're welcoming, preparing to learn from Fred Fisher of Fisher Consulting. And Fred, I gotta say I'm excited. Though you probably don't hear this very often, I'm excited to talk insurance with you.

Fred Fisher [00:01:05]:

That's, that's really interesting. That's the fastest way to clear the room is. Oh yeah, we're talking about insurance tonight.

James Kademan [00:01:10]:

We're going to talk about insurance. I got a thing at that place, right?

Fred Fisher [00:01:14]:

Absolutely.

James Kademan [00:01:14]:

No, I'm, I am super excited for a few reasons, right? One, I have some property insurance that's due, so it's top of mind. Two, I live in southern Wisconsin and we just got hit with I think four out of five days. We had hail, there's tornadoes. I got some buddies that had some baseball size hail. And I'm like, man, if I was an insurance company, I'd be like, oh, we gotta write checks. We're supposed to collect the checks, not write them. So anyways, it's top of mind.

Fred Fisher [00:01:43]:

That's the product though, that's the whole problem. The claim department is where, and this is a quote from a colleague of mine, Chantelle Roberts. The claim department is where the product is produced.

James Kademan [00:01:57]:

Ah, I like it.

Fred Fisher [00:01:59]:

I do too. And I will never take credit for it. It's Chantel's. No, she's a phenomenal professional.

James Kademan [00:02:06]:

That's awesome. So tell me a story about your business and how you got started by accident. Nah, as per usual, it's all good.

Fred Fisher [00:02:15]:

You know, up until recently, the insurance industry has never been a destination profession. Everybody got into it by accident. You don't go to business school, say, I want to be working for an insurance company. That just does not happen. It Is more so now, though, because more and more colleges and universities do have risk management insurance curriculums, which is unnecessary. But for me, when I went to University of California, berkeley in the 60s, at least I think I did, and I graduated with a social science field major, but I'm more of a gestalt thinker. And so I couldn't just take political science because what good is that without knowing something about journalism or know something about sociology or know something about psychology? In the real world, all that works together. And so that's why I did a social science field major.

Fred Fisher [00:03:06]:

But when you graduate with a degree like that, where you're going to end up is probably selling life insurance, which is exactly what happened. But I intentionally had already enrolled in law school to go at night. And the reason I did that and the reason why it was intentional is back then, everybody wanted to be a lawyer. And so unless you really were smart, you didn't get into the top law schools. And even then, if, even if you did, if you didn't graduate in the top 10% of your class, you probably didn't have a job waiting for.

James Kademan [00:03:36]:

For you. Wow.

Fred Fisher [00:03:38]:

And I didn't, you know, and I didn't want to work for corporate America or whatever anyways. I wanted to be an entertainment lawyer. I wanted to represent artists and musicians because I had a lot of friends who were artists and musicians in Berkeley, in the Bay Area at that time. And I thought, well, I could help protect them, you know, from the evil of corporate America, what have you. And one thing led to another, and I got a job as a law clerk eventually. And the other reason I did this too, is because if you went to the top law schools, like I said, you wouldn't have a job. But if you went to a night law school and you could get a job in the legal industry during the day, you had a job waiting for you was 90%. I like those odds.

Fred Fisher [00:04:15]:

I like those odds. So I ended up kind of getting a job as a law clerk in what was called an insurance defense law firm. And I have nothing but good experience from that. The gentleman who was heading that firm up, and we were all employees of an insurance company, so this was in house counsel. And he loved teaching, he loved young people and helping them really learn. And as a result, you, if you work there, you, you could move to another law firm, you know, after a year and a half or so, and one thing led to another, and I did that. And then I. And then, unfortunately, the partner of that law firm, after eight months, decided, well, we don't really need a law clerk.

Fred Fisher [00:04:57]:

What we need is somebody who's licensed and can do Fred's job and also go to court, you know, on minor motions, so. Enough to send somebody heavy out. And so I got laid off. Boo. Yeah. But he actually did me a favor. I had friends that were work. I had a couple of friends that were working at this claim adjusting firm, and they were doing something I didn't even know existed.

Fred Fisher [00:05:19]:

They were handling nothing but what were called professional liability claims. They were handling cases against lawyers, insurance agents, real estate brokers, medical malpractice, which I stayed away from. A little too real for me. And oddball stuff for Lloyd's of London, including Seedman Zo, you know, for companies that manufacture seed, you know, for. For farmers, so to speak.

James Kademan [00:05:42]:

Yeah.

Fred Fisher [00:05:42]:

Coat it with this little clay stuff so that it could be put into a mechanical planter so they could have control over one seed every six inches. How do you like that? I mean, if you're. If you're going to be planting seed in 500 acres, you know, that's a lot of seed if you don't manage it correctly. And it's really expensive. So this was a whole different world. And so I handled a claim involving that where nothing grew. 500 acres, nothing. It was like what happened.

Fred Fisher [00:06:12]:

You know, I'll never forget the phrase necrosis of the cotyledon boy. There's a federal regulation on it, and I'll never forget it. But it was interesting work and I was good at it. And especially when it came to lawyers and insurance brokers, you had what was called a claim within a claim. I mean, at first you had to decide that the attorney screwed up or did the insurance broker screw up, and then what was the underlying matter they were working on? Because that's where the damages are, supposedly. And so you didn't know whether you were with an attorney malpractice case, whether you were going to handle a personal injury statute of limitations problem, or the attorney didn't file the lawsuit on time. And then the next case has to do with a merger and acquisition. Wow.

James Kademan [00:06:55]:

You see, What a variety.

Fred Fisher [00:06:56]:

Yeah, exactly....