What is the most alarming part of Donald Trump's presidency? Certainly the theater of Trump is distressing: the antics, the buffoonery, the duplicity, the degradation of political norms, the coarsening of public discourse...and yet, of course, the actual policies (or lack thereof) implemented by the Trump administration are alarming as well. But is there really a fundamental distinction to be made between past presidents and Trump? Or is Trump, by handing over the machinery of government to bankers, conservative think tanks, and corporate elites, indistinguishable from any other right wing politician? Or, for that matter, distinguishable from any other politican, period? This one got a little heated, in a good way: Dane and Kevin argue about moral imperatives as applied to politics, the valorization of voting, and the logic of "lesser of two evils" thinking. The thirtieth episode is a milestone, no? And special thanks to Hale Allen for supplying the episode inspo.