Ordinarily Extraordinary - Conversations with women in STEM

Lisa Fennell shares her non-linear career path—from studying police science at a technical college, to restaurant work and administrative roles, to becoming a business analyst and eventually a sales and marketing leader in utility tech. Along the way, she opens up about confidence, mentorship, being “the only woman at the table,” and what it’s like building a career without a traditional four-year degree.

What you’ll hear in this episode

What Lisa does today

Lisa explains Ping Things and the need for high-resolution, high-density grid data that can actually make it into the hands of data scientists—so utilities can train machine learning algorithms, understand what’s happening on the grid, and decide what to do next.

“Reflex vs reason”

A standout analogy the grid needs both immediate “reflex” at the edge and deeper “reason” centrally. Lisa compares it to touching a hot stove—your reflex pulls your hand back, but your brain learns “don’t do that again.” Ping Things supports the “learning” layer.

A career journey that didn’t follow the typical script

Lisa walks through her path technical college → a mentor encouraging her to rethink shift-work policing → customer service/restaurant leadership → an office role → recognized technical aptitude → business analyst → writing software requirements/specs → utility industry tech roles → sales leadership.

Working in a technical field without a four-year degree

Lisa talks candidly about how long it took to admit she didn’t have a college degree—and how mentorship, opportunity, and her own tenacity shaped her success.

Sales in technical spaces

Lisa describes the gift of translating “engineer language” into “normal language,” the importance of listening more than speaking, and how relationship-building is often the real differentiator.

Married to an engineer in the same industry

She and her husband Kevin have traveled together for industry events and customer dinners, and Lisa shares how she brings levity and connection—often with fun icebreakers that instantly melt the room.

Proud moment

A sweet moment Lisa’s dad tells Alexa about her career story (including the no-four-year-degree part), and Lisa shares how meaningful it is to feel that pride from a parent, no matter your age.

Not Expert” listener question

Kathy, Linda, and Lisa share not-expert perspectives on timing, preparation, and how workplace culture has evolved (and still has a long way to go).

In this episode of Ordinarily Extraordinary: Conversations with Women in STEM, host Kathy Nelson sits down with Dr. Elizabeth Mendes, a newly minted PhD and postdoctoral researcher whose work focuses on rare and aggressive pediatric cancers.

Dr. Mendes recently completed her PhD at Duke University, where she spent over five years researching rhabdomyosarcoma, a rare childhood soft-tissue cancer. Her goal: identify new biological targets that could one day lead to better, more effective treatments for children. Kathy and Liz explore not only the science behind pediatric cancer research, but also the deeply human reasons that drive this work.

What We Talk About in This Episode

• What pediatric sarcomas are—and why they’re so challenging to treat
  Liz breaks down complex cancer biology in an approachable way, explaining how sarcomas differ from more common cancers and why their ability to “change form” makes them particularly dangerous.
• A non-traditional path into science
  From archaeology and zoology to teaching middle school math and science, Liz shares how curiosity—and not a straight line—ultimately led her to molecular biology, cancer research, and a PhD.
• Choosing pediatric cancer research
  Liz explains why she decided to focus on rare childhood cancers that receive less funding but have devastating outcomes—and how personal experiences with cancer shaped that decision.
• Science close to the patient
  We discuss the importance (and rarity) of researchers interacting directly with patients, families, and clinicians—and how those experiences fundamentally change how science is done.
• Life after the PhD: postdocs, fellowships, and moving to the UK
  Liz shares what it’s like to finish a PhD, move countries, start a new research position, and navigate life and work during a major transition.
• Being your whole self in STEM
  From makeup and music to mental health and social media, Liz talks about rejecting outdated stereotypes of what scientists “should” look like—and why authenticity matters for the next generation.
• Representation, mentorship, and science communication
  Liz reflects on why visibility matters, especially for women and first-generation students, and how platforms like social media can help make science more accessible and human.

A Conversation About More Than Science

This episode goes beyond lab work and credentials. It’s a candid conversation about grief, resilience, identity, and the responsibility scientists carry—not just to discovery, but to people. Liz’s story is a powerful reminder that STEM careers don’t require fitting into a mold—and that compassion belongs in science.

If you enjoyed this episode:

• Rate and review the podcast on Apple Podcasts or Spotify
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• Share with a friend, colleague, or student who might need this story

Have thoughts, questions, or guest suggestions?
Email us at [email protected]
or leave a voicemail on our website.

In this episode, Kathy sits down with Vinayasri Nidadavolu, a specialist engineer in offshore wind energy at Siemens Energy. Vinaya’s story spans continents, megawatts, and life stages — from earning a rare degree in wind engineering to climbing offshore turbines hundreds of kilometers out at sea, and now navigating her career as a new mother.

Vinaya takes us inside the fascinating world of offshore wind turbines — explaining how today’s turbines have grown from 2–3 megawatts to an astonishing 14–15 megawatts, and what it actually looks like to work on machines that can produce enough energy for two households with a single blade rotation.

We talk about what it really takes to work offshore: the extensive safety and survival training, life aboard service vessels for weeks at a time, and what it feels like to climb, ride lifts, and work inside turbines that are now larger than many apartments. Vinaya shares vivid details about the physical, mental, and emotional demands of the job — and why she still considers it the best career decision she’s ever made.

The conversation also explores Vinaya’s path into engineering, beginning with childhood curiosity and fixing broken appliances, through being the only woman in her mechanical engineering class, to choosing sustainability and renewable energy as her long-term focus. Her story is a powerful reminder that representation matters — and that girls belong everywhere curiosity leads them.

As a new mom, Vinaya reflects on balancing motherhood with a demanding technical career, why she chose not to “compromise herself” professionally, and how leading by example matters more than ever. Her reflections on identity, resilience, and modeling possibility for the next generation are honest, thoughtful, and deeply relatable.

In the Ask the (Not) Expert segment, Vinaya shares practical, no-nonsense advice on how to ask for a raise — especially for women — emphasizing documentation, advocacy, and the importance of asking more than once.

We wrap up with rapid-fire questions that touch on self-care (never underestimate a single cup of coffee), courage, and why Vinaya believes her own life story may one day become her favorite STEM “book.”

This is a wide-ranging, inspiring conversation about engineering at scale, renewable energy, confidence, and choosing not to shrink — even when life changes.

Topics We Cover:

• What offshore wind engineers actually do
• How wind turbines have evolved from 2 MW to 15 MW
• Life, safety training, and work on offshore service vessels
• The physical reality of climbing and working inside turbines
• Choosing sustainability and renewable energy as a career path
• Being the only woman in the room — and staying anyway
• Motherhood, identity, and not compromising your career
• How (and why) to ask for a raise
• Leading by example for the next generation of girls in STEM

Music by Kay Paulus

In this episode, Kathy and Linda LaTourelle sit down with Linda Rhodes, a former large-animal veterinarian, pharmaceutical executive, entrepreneur, and author, to explore an extraordinary career path rooted in agriculture, science, and perseverance.

Linda shares her journey from being one of the few women working as a large-animal veterinarian to building a groundbreaking career in veterinary pharmaceuticals, biotech startups, and executive leadership. Along the way, she reflects honestly on the realities of being a pioneer in a male-dominated field, the personal tradeoffs that come with ambitious careers, and the importance of making intentional choices — even when there’s no clear roadmap.

This conversation dives into what really counts as STEM, why agriculture and veterinary medicine belong in the STEM conversation, and how women can redefine success on their own terms at every stage of life.

🌾 What We Talk About in This Episode

• Why veterinary medicine and agriculture are often overlooked as STEM careers
• Being one of the first women in large-animal veterinary medicine
• Learning to balance — and sometimes choose between — career, relationships, and personal fulfillment
• Writing Breaking the Barnyard Barrier and transitioning from scientific to narrative writing
• Navigating male-dominated spaces in biotech, pharmaceuticals, and venture capital
• Starting, scaling, and selling a successful animal health company
• Why career paths don’t have to be linear — and often shouldn’t be
• Advice for early-career professionals trying to figure out what they actually want to do
• Redefining success, freedom, and fulfillment later in life

Breaking the Barnyard Barrier by Linda Rhodes

👉 Purchase the book on Amazon here: https://www.amazon.com/Breaking-Barnyard-Barrier-Woman-Veterinarian/dp/1647792355

👉 Purchase the book on Barnes and Noble here: https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/breaking-the-barnyard-barrier-linda-rhodes/1147476620?ean=9781647792350

💡 Ask the (Not) Experts – Listener Question

“How do I find a career that I’ll like?”

Linda, Kathy, and Linda LaTourelle reflect on why it’s okay — and often necessary — to try different paths, reassess over time, and pay attention to what doesn’t fit just as much as what does.

✨ Favorite Moments

• The moment Linda first realized she could be a veterinarian
• A candid discussion about the pressure women feel to “do it all”
• Why some of the most fulfilling decades of life can come later than expected

Have a question for Ask the (Not) Experts or want to say hello?
📧 Email us at [email protected]

🎙️ Or leave us a voicemail at ordinarilyextraordinary.com

Music by Kay Paulus

In this episode, Kathy sits down with Christine Hollis, the Chief Talent and Diversity Officer at Marshall Gerstein & Borun — one of the top intellectual property law firms in the U.S. Christine brings a fresh, energetic perspective to the often-misunderstood world of patent law and STEM-driven legal careers.

Together, they explore what intellectual property (IP) law really is, how STEM professionals are critical to patent work, and why careers like technical specialist, patent agent, and IP attorney can be incredibly dynamic, creative, and rewarding. Christine also opens up about her winding path from aspiring physician to industrial/organizational psychologist to talent leader in IP law.

This conversation is uplifting, surprising, and packed with insights on innovation, communication skills, resilience, and the future of STEM in law.

Topics We Cover

• What intellectual property (IP) law actually is — and what it isn’t
• How scientists, engineers, and STEM grads power patent work
• The differences between technical specialists, patent agents, and patent attorneys
• How patent agents can take the patent bar without a law degree
• What prosecution means in the patent world
• How to know when to contact a patent attorney about an idea
• Why communication skills matter as much as technical skills
• Diversity in IP law and building a more inclusive STEM-to-law pipeline
• How remote work has shifted resilience, social skills, and workplace culture
• Christine’s path from psychology to legal talent leadership
• Why patent law is “like Disneyland” for people who love innovation

Key Messages

• STEM backgrounds are incredibly versatile. Engineers and scientists aren’t limited to labs — they can build long, impactful careers in patent law and innovation strategy.
• You don’t need a JD to work in patent law. Patent agents can draft and prosecute patents with only the patent bar + STEM expertise.
• Communication is a superpower. The ability to translate complex science into everyday language is essential everywhere — especially in IP.
• Career paths can be nonlinear and still land exactly where you belong. Christine’s story is a great example.
• Humans need connection. Christine’s insights on resilience, mental health, and post-pandemic social shifts apply far beyond law.

About Our Guest

Christine Hollis is the Chief Talent & Diversity Officer at Marshall Gerstein & Borun LLP in Chicago. She leads recruiting, professional development, DEI strategy, and organizational culture for a firm filled with engineers, scientists, and attorneys working at the forefront of innovation. Christine has a master’s degree in Industrial/Organizational Psychology and has built a career helping technical professionals thrive in people-first workplaces.

Links & Resources

• Marshall Gerstein & Borun LLP: https://www.marshallip.com
• Patent Pending Speakeasy in NYC:  https://www.patentpendingnyc.com/

Connect With Us

• Podcast Website: https://www.ordinarily-extraordinary.com
• Email: [email protected]
• Voicemail: Leave a message directly on our website!
• Follow & Review: Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or your favorite podcast platform

Your ratings and shares help amplify women’s voices in STEM. Thank you for listening and supporting our mission!

Music by Kay Paulus

In today’s episode of Ordinarily Extraordinary – Conversations with Women in STEM, Kathy and Linda sit down with environmental engineer and river guide Mishael Umlor — a woman who pressed pause on her engineering career to live a year of adventure, intention, and joy.

Kathy first met Mishael this summer while rowing through the Grand Canyon on a 14-day paddle trip. What began as a passing “Wait… you’re an engineer?” moment turned into months of wanting to learn more about her unconventional, intentional path. Today, you’ll hear that full story.

About Mishael Umlor

Mishael holds both bachelor’s and master’s degrees in environmental engineering and worked for the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers on hydrology, water quality, and river systems modeling. After earning her PE, she made the bold decision to step away for a year to travel, guide rivers, reconnect with family, and build a life that aligns with her values.

During her year away she:

• Guided rafting trips in the Grand Canyon
• Traveled for six weeks in Belize — where she and her husband had their wedding attire custom-designed
• Rode motorcycles through Central America
• Spent months backcountry camping in Baja
• Completed a five-week ski tour using a DIY truck camper
• Visited family across the Midwest
• Got married
• And reconnected with the outdoors in ways that shape the next chapter of her engineering career

Her story is a powerful example of designing a life with intentionality, courage, and creativity.

In This Episode, We Talk About:

• How Mishael discovered environmental engineering through community college and a love of math
• Her experience working for the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers
• Taking a year off after earning her PE — what she learned and how she made it possible
• The logistics and finances of long-term travel and seasonal living
• River guiding, safety stories, and what it’s really like flipping a fully loaded kitchen boat in the Grand Canyon
• Finding balance between a technical career and a passion-driven outdoor lifestyle
• What she wants her engineering career to look like next — and how she plans to blend contract work and river-based fieldwork
• The beauty of creating a life you actually want (even when it doesn’t look like the traditional path)

Why You’ll Love This Episode

Mishael’s story is a refreshing and inspiring look at the many ways women in STEM can shape careers that don’t fit into boxes. Her honesty about fear, joy, logistics, and dreams makes this a conversation that will resonate with anyone rethinking their own path — whether early, mid, or late career.

Connect & Follow

If you enjoyed this episode, please rate and review the podcast on Apple Podcasts or Spotify — it helps others discover these stories.

Follow the podcast so you never miss an episode, and share with a friend, colleague, or fellow adventurer.

Have a question or comment?
Email us at [email protected]

or leave a voicemail at Ordinarily-Extraordinary.com

In this special episode, Kathy and her co-host Linda sit down for a heartfelt conversation about the release of Kathy’s brand-new Women in STEM Coloring Book—a three-year passion project created in collaboration with her daughter, Emily. This book showcases contemporary women in STEM, brought to life through hand-drawn illustrations and inspiring biographies.

Kathy shares the story behind the book, why representation of real, modern women in STEM matters, and how her daughter’s artwork brings these stories to life. They talk through favorite pages, the women featured, the challenges and joys of self-publishing, and the importance of normalizing women in STEM from an early age.

Whether you’re a parent, educator, or someone passionate about STEM advocacy, this episode gives you a behind-the-scenes look into creating a resource designed to inspire the next generation.

In This Episode We Discuss:

• The origin and three-year journey of creating the Women in STEM Coloring Book
• Why showcasing contemporary women—not just historical figures—is so important
• The need to normalize women in STEM roles for both girls and boys
• How Emily created 31 hand-drawn illustrations and character pages
• Favorite featured women:
  • A bat scientist
  • A glaciologist
  • A crash test engineer
  • A satellite communications engineer
  • A code breaker
• How the biographies and real photos in the back bring authenticity to the book
• The process and unexpected challenges of self-publishing through Amazon KDP
• Kathy’s experience approaching local stores and embracing the identity of “author”
• A fun sidebar about Linda’s granddaughter writing and illustrating her own books
• What comes next as the book launches during holiday season

About the Book

STEM Super Stars: Women of Today Changing the World
A beautifully illustrated coloring book featuring 25 real women working in STEM fields today. Perfect for kids, classrooms, and anyone who wants to see more representation in science and technology.

✔ 31 single-sided coloring pages
✔ Science, Technology, Engineering, Math & “Other” categories
✔ Real photos and biographies of every woman featured
✔ Hand-drawn illustrations by Emily Nelson
✔ Created in Minnesota and inspired by women making real impact across the globe

Buy the Book

Amazon Link: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0G2YSJ9XW
Bulk or Educational Orders: Contact Kathy at [email protected] for information

Credits

• Hosted by: Kathy Nelson & Linda LaTourelle
• Produced by: Ordinarily Extraordinary Podcast
• Music: Custom intro/outro by Kay Paulus

In this inspiring and deeply human episode, Kathy and Linda sit down with Amanda Mavropoulis, a global project and portfolio management leader in technology including 15 years in the electric utility space, and one extraordinary career pivot.

Amanda shares her unconventional STEM journey—from early days taking apart alarm clocks, to working in IT as a student worker, to a long career in utilities, and ultimately into her “unicorn job” at a major tech company. Along the way, she opens up about her unexpected breast cancer diagnosis, navigating treatment after leaving a longtime job, and the clarity and boldness it brought to her next steps.

This conversation is filled with humor, wisdom, honesty, and plenty of laughs as Amanda, Kathy, and Linda reflect on career longevity, teamwork, life detours, and why sometimes you just have to “science the hell out of it.”

Topics We Cover

• A full-circle reconnection: How Linda and Amanda met during a massive utility system conversion—and why team culture matters.
• Life in a global tech environment: Agile management, nonstop meetings, time zones, boundaries, and protecting heads-down time.
• Finding balance: Hybrid work, maintaining work–life separation, setting expectations, and empowering teams.
• Career pivoting after 15 years in utilities: What it’s like to be “new again” in a fast-paced tech company.
• Breast cancer survival and perspective shifts: How Amanda approached treatment, resilience, and redefining what she wanted out of life.
• Unicorn jobs: Applying for stretch roles, building confidence, and not letting fear stop you.
• STEM pathways that aren't linear: Environmental science beginnings, early IT work, accidental opportunities, and embracing unexpected journeys.
• Hiring challenges today: Entry-level roles requiring experience, the impact of layoffs, and navigating the job market as a new grad.
• Diversity of thought & representation in tech: Why it matters and what Amanda sees in her new workplace.

About Amanda Mavropoulis

Amanda is a technical project and portfolio management leader with a BS in Environmental Studies from Texas A&M, an MS from Walden University, and three decades in the IT and utility sectors. She’s known for her leadership, empathy, ability to build strong teams, and her passion for mentoring women entering STEM fields. She’s also a breast cancer survivor whose resilience fueled her leap into a dream role in global technology.

Connect with the Podcast

We’d love to hear from you!
Have a question, comment, or want to submit your own “Ask the Not-Expert” question?

• Email: [email protected]
• Website & Voicemail: ordinarilyextraordinary.com

Music by Kay Paulus 

Follow Kay on Instagram @kaypaulus8

In this bonus, Halloween and Bat Week episode, we talk with Dr. Kristen Lear, a bat conservation scientist, National Geographic Explorer, and If/Then® Ambassador whose lifelong passion for misunderstood creatures turned into a career protecting bat populations around the world.

Kristen shares how a childhood Girl Scout project building bat houses led her to a career at Bat Conservation International (BCI), where she now directs the Agave Restoration Initiative—a binational program supporting endangered nectar-feeding bats and the ecosystems (and tequila plants!) they rely on.

With contagious enthusiasm, Kristen explains how she uses infrared cameras, environmental DNA (eDNA), and community partnerships to track and protect migratory bats across Mexico and the U.S. Southwest. The conversation covers everything from bat “supermoms” and nocturnal fieldwork to tequila, rabies myths, and why bats are vital pollinators and pest controllers.

They also discuss Girl Scouts as a gateway to STEM, Bat Week (the annual celebration leading up to Halloween), and Kristen’s mission to make the world a friendlier place for these essential — and often misunderstood — creatures.

💡 Topics We Cover

• How Kristen’s childhood love of “underdog animals” led to a career in bat conservation
• Her early Girl Scout project building bat houses and creating a “Go Batty!” patch
• What bat scientists actually do in the field — from mist nets to infrared tech
• Using eDNA (environmental DNA) to track migrating bats through agave plants and hummingbird feeders
• The relationship between bats, agave, and the tequila industry
• Debunking myths about bats and rabies
• How to humanely remove a bat from your house
• What it’s like to work nights studying nocturnal animals
• Girl Scouts, mentorship, and how Kristen’s mom inspired her confidence
• Kristen’s work as an If/Then Ambassador and National Geographic Explorer
• Why Bat Week matters — and how you can get involved

🌎 Resources & Links

• Bat Conservation International: www.batcon.org
  
  
• Bat Week: www.batweek.org
  
  
• If/Then® Initiative: www.ifthen.org
  
  
• Follow Dr. Kristen Lear: LinkedIn – Kristen Lear
  
  

🧠 Key Takeaways

• You can make a career out of your childhood passion — even bats!
• Conservation is as much about people and partnerships as it is about science.
• Technology like infrared imaging and DNA sampling are transforming wildlife research.
• Myths about bats are being replaced with understanding — thanks to scientists like Kristen.
• Supporting pollinators helps protect ecosystems and local economies.

Music by Kay Paulus 

Follow Kay on Instagram @kaypaulus8

In this episode, Kathy and Linda talk with Catherine Jackson Jones, a coach and mentor with the National Math and Science Initiative (NMSI), a nonprofit organization dedicated to expanding STEM opportunities for students and empowering educators to bring real-world STEM experiences into classrooms across the country.

Catherine shares how NMSI builds awareness and access to STEM fields, particularly for students in under-resourced and rural communities. Through long-term partnerships with school districts, NMSI provides professional development for teachers and administrators, helping them integrate critical thinking, communication, and problem-solving skills into every subject. Catherine explains how the initiative creates lasting change by training educators to sustain programs long after NMSI’s involvement, ensuring equity and opportunity for all students.

Catherine also opens up about her personal journey — growing up in poverty, being the first in her family to graduate college, and how a single teacher’s belief in her changed the trajectory of her life. That experience fuels her passion for helping students see their own worth and possibilities, no matter where they come from.

Together, they explore:

• How NMSI supports teachers and districts to create engaging, hands-on STEM learning
• The importance of exposure, opportunity, and representation in STEM education
• The ripple effect one teacher or mentor can have on generations of learners
• How engagement and curiosity transform learning environments
• Breaking cycles of poverty through education and belief in possibility

Ask the (Not) Expert

A listener asks:

Catherine shares her teacher’s perspective: divide responsibilities clearly, let everyone choose their section, and document who’s responsible for what. That way, teachers can fairly assess individual contributions — a real-world lesson in accountability and teamwork.

Rapid Fire Questions

• Favorite STEM book: Alchemy of the Mind, by Diane Ackerman
• Favorite college course: Shakespeare with Dr. Rey
• Best advice ever received: “You’re bigger than the moments that surround you.” – Theresa Smith, the teacher who changed her life

Episode Takeaway

Catherine’s story is a testament to the power of education, mentorship, and believing in others. Her passion for teaching — and for helping students realize their potential — reminds us that opening even one door can change entire families and communities.

Learn More

Visit the National Math and Science Initiative at www.nms.org
to learn how to get involved, support programs, or explore partnership opportunities.

Music by Kay Paulus 

Follow Kay on Instagram @kaypaulus8