I’m really excited to share these stories with you about how our missteps and disappointments and serendipity lead us smack-dab into our life plans.

Today, I’m talking with my guest Becca about creative actualization: how our drives for self expression and creativity get derailed whether by internal narratives or structural oppression, or the demands of making our work “marketable.” It’s a conversation about how we keep on creating, even if that looks like playing the piano for no one but ourselves. 

Becca and I talked about a lotta stuff in this episode, as we feel our way into the major themes we’ll be exploring on And The Next Thing You Know. Among the subjects we touched on: Punching up, not down. Forming a sense of self and creative endeavor with little family support. The demands of being “profitable,” who can afford to do art, and the integration of art into our regular lives.

Imposter syndrome and working through our blocks. Decolonizing your time! Piano – just playing vs. performing in front of people. Sucking at something before you get good. This is so important! Embracing our imperfections.

Karaoke culture – giving ourselves permission to love singing and, also, to be bad at it! Grappling with our sense of inherent “badness” and the systems that hold us back.

The Jewish teaching of tikkun olam: the repair of the world and of ourselves. The consumption of art vs. the creation of art, and the treachery of false dichotomies. 

We’re kind of smart, I guess. Except I didn’t know who Jeff Koons was when Becca mentioned his very commercial pop art (sorry/not sorry?) Here are some of the cultural and popcultural creators and creations we referenced in the episode:

Becca paraphrased a quotation, “Art is controversial, or else it’s propaganda.” We didn’t figure out who said it, but here are some related quotes that may have been the crux of her remembering: 

W.E.B. Du Bois: “…I do not care a damn for any art that is not used for propaganda.” (Which is the opposite sense of propaganda that Becca intended.)

George Orwell: “All art is propaganda…on the other hand, not all propaganda is art.”

Keith Haring: “I don’t think art is propaganda; it should be something that liberates the soul.”

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Full episode transcripts are here.

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The banana peel is by Max Ronnersjö.

The theme and interstitial music are by Jon Schwartz.

Thanks everybody. We’re so glad you tuned in.