In this episode of Pebble Presents, I talk with Johanna Pino, brand strategist, graphic designer, author, and instructor, about how to successfully brand a product or business. We discuss Johanna’s career journey, the four stages of successful branding, and what can get you to a sound design strategy (as well as the importance of implementation). This episode isn’t about one designer’s preferences. It’s about what’s possible when you apply a reliable method of brand work, so the investment has tangible impact. 

If you work in marketing, branding, or create assets and communications that use your company’s brand, this is for you!

Emelia Rallapalli is the founder of Pebble - a brand strategy and marketing research consultancy. With decades of experience in global brand planning, strategy, and research, Pebble has helped shape businesses of all kinds, from ambitious start-ups to global Fortune 100 companies. 

Johanna Pino is a brand strategist, graphic designer, author, and instructor. She has been creating strategy, identity, and strategic communication for startups and Fortune 100s, across industries for 30 years. Her passion is in creating functional beauty that solves problems and makes the world better.

Welcome to Pebble Presents.

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Like this episode of Pebble Presents? Share it with colleagues & friends! Apple Podcasts and Spotify to rate/review/subscribe to the show.

PebbleStrategy.com. 

You can also find us on LinkedIn and Instagram.

Thanks for listening!

References

• The Elements of Branding by Johanna D. Pino
• Johanna Pino on LinkedIn
• Johanna Pino Branding
• What Color is Your Parachute by Richard N. Bolles (referenced)

Show Notes
0:28 - Emelia introduces Johanna and today's focus
2:40 -  Johanna traces her unlikely path to branding
6:34 - Johanna on family influence — and why blazing her own trail was the only option
8:02 - Johanna explains why she wrote The Elements of Branding — and what she wanted it to do differently
14:11 - Johanna breaks down the 4 stages of branding and why each matters
17:27 - Johanna on navigating conflicting stakeholder opinions
19:11 - Johanna on external audience research, customer opinion, visual equities — and how she applies each
23:41 - Johanna shares how to present discovery so client teams can align for strategy
26:13 - Johanna talks through phase lengths, design process, and team structure on the client side for decision-making
34:53 - When to lock design direction and why implementation needs as much planning as the design
42:54 - Johanna's advice for business leaders to set their branding process up for success
44:24 - Emelia leads Johanna through our lightning round
51:48  - Emelia wraps up the episode

Episode Credits
Executive Produced & Hosted by Emelia Rallapalli
Produced by Stephanie Watanabe 
Edited & Post Produced by Erin Zimmerman
Artwork & Design by Liisa Turan-Walters

In this episode of Pebble Presents, I talk with Eric Dunn, co-founder and executive director of Here Be Dragons, about creative independence and what it reveals about where the industry is heading. We dig into why consolidation creates opportunity for micro agencies, how independent shops are collaborating rather than competing, and what it takes — on both the agency and client side — to do work that actually holds up.

Emelia Rallapalli is the founder of Pebble - a brand strategy and marketing research consultancy. With decades of experience in global brand planning, strategy, and research, Pebble has helped shape businesses of all kinds, from ambitious start-ups to global Fortune 100 companies. 

Eric Dunn is the co-founder and executive director of Here Be Dragons, a San Francisco-based creative agency. Over 25 years, he's worked with clients ranging from startups to Fortune 500 companies to the U.S. government, earning a reputation as what he calls "a zealot for creatively driven brands." Here Be Dragons has created work like "Shoulda' Been There" for Improv Comedy Clubs — the club's first brand campaign in its 60-year history. He is one of the clearer, more honest voices I've encountered on what's actually happening in the creative industry right now.

Welcome to Pebble Presents.

- - - - - - - - -

If you liked this episode of Pebble Presents, please share it with colleagues and friends! Find us on Apple Podcasts and Spotify to rate/review/subscribe to the show.

Want more? Visit PebbleStrategy.com. 

You can also find us on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/pebble-strategy/) and Instagram(https://www.instagram.com/pebblestrategy/).

Thanks for listening and joining the conversation!

References

• Eric Dunn on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/here-be-dragons
• Here Be Dragons website: https://www.hbdagency.com

Show Notes 

0:28 - Emelia introduces today’s special guest and topic

3:32 - Eric shares how he got into advertising and creative work

6:04 - Eric on the founding of Here Be Dragons

11:21 - Eric and Ken's early conversations about what Here Be Dragons would stand for

13:36 - Emelia and Eric discuss agency consolidation and what it means for independent shops

21:27 - Eric shares what clients want that large agencies can't deliver — and what makes a strong client partner for an independent agency.

34:21 - How the collaborative micro-agency model works at Here Be Dragons

42:23 - The business reality: how independent agencies make the economics work

45:52 - Eric and Emelia discuss the talent and mentorship crisis: what's been lost and what's at stake

57:07 - What AI still can't do.

59:20 - What Eric is optimistic about for the future of the creative industry

1:01:57 - Emelia wraps up the episode

In this episode, Emelia Rallapalli pulls back the curtain on Pebble Strategy's recent brand refresh with longtime collaborators Liisa Turan-Walters and Theo Fanning. Together, they walk through why the timing was right, how they approached the project, and why strategy has to lead design. They cover the steps of a brand refresh and how to set teams up for success during a new brand system rollout. Emelia closes with what she learned by becoming her own client — and how it's changed Pebble.

Emelia Rallapalli is the founder of Pebble - a brand strategy and marketing research consultancy. With decades of experience in global brand planning, strategy, and research, Pebble has helped shape businesses of all kinds, from ambitious start-ups to global Fortune 100 companies. 

Liisa Turan-Walters is a creative who builds practical, scalable brand systems — designing frameworks that carry across every touchpoint, from websites and decks to print and physical spaces. Her clients have included Google, Visa, Samsung, TED, UnitedHealthcare, Hippo Insurance, and McDonald's.

Theo Fanning is the founder and creative director of Strange & Co., with a career spanning branding, advertising, and experience design across companies large and small. An illustrator and filmmaker by background, he brings a distinctly multidisciplinary lens to brand and creative work.

Welcome to Pebble Presents.

- - - - - - - - -

If you liked this episode of Pebble Presents, please share it with colleagues and friends! Find us on Apple Podcasts and Spotify to rate/review/subscribe to the show.

Want more? Visit PebbleStrategy.com. 

You can also find us on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/pebble-strategy/) and Instagram(https://www.instagram.com/pebblestrategy/).

Thanks for listening and joining the conversation!

References

• Book: Building Distinctive Brand Assets, by Jenni Romaniuk

Show Notes 

0:21 - Emelia introduces today’s guests and topic

0:50 - Liisa and Theo share the career paths that led them here

3:20 - Liisa shares why it was the right time for a Pebble brand refresh

9:20 - Theo and Liisa describe their approach to reworking the Pebble website

10:38 - Emelia discusses how the team employed and applied a strategy around the design for Pebble

15:20 - Theo and Liisa share when they think it's time for a brand refresh

17:08 - Emelia, Liisa, and Theo discuss characteristics of bad branding and core steps in the redesign

30:47 - Theo and Liisa discuss when to do a full rebrand versus refresh

31:35 - Liisa shares how to enable client teams for implementation success 

40:26 - Emelia describes how the brand refresh for Pebble went, and her takeaways

48:32 - Theo and Liisa participate in a lightning round

53:08 - Emelia wraps up the episode

Episode Credits

Executive Produced & Hosted by Emelia Rallapalli

Produced by Stephanie Watanabe 

Edited and Post Produced by Erin Zimmerman

Artwork and design by Liisa Turan-Walters

Website copy by Theo Fanning

Pebble illustrations by Goce Ilievski

Pebble website UX and Development by Eric Hsu

This Episode was recorded at Handsome in San Francisco, CA.

In this episode, Pebble Presents Emily Cushman. Emily walks us through her journey from her second-grade self (knowing she wanted to work in branding and advertising) to the cultural shift working in agencies vs working client-side. She shares what she’s found most effective when making a case for brand in companies where teams don’t know - or, in some cases, don’t care - about brand. Listen in to hear why Emily thinks research and insights are an essential part of brand building.

Emelia Rallapalli is the founder of Pebble - a brand strategy and marketing research consultancy. With decades of experience in global brand planning, strategy, and research, Pebble has helped shape businesses of all kinds, from ambitious start-ups to global Fortune 100 companies. 

Emily Cushman is a brand and creative leader who’s spent more than twenty years helping some of the world’s most loved brands find their voice and purpose. Today, as Director of Global Brand Strategy at Zendesk, she leads the charge on defining what the brand stands for — turning strategy into stories and ideas that connect with people on a human level. 

Over the years, Emily has guided Fortune 500 companies and emerging brands alike to bridge the gap between purpose, product, and experience, and her work has always centered on helping brands show up with clarity, heart, and authenticity.

At her core, Emily is a storyteller — one who believes the best brands don’t just sell, they inspire. She’s passionate about uncovering the spark that moves people, and turning that insight into creative ideas that build connection, culture, and growth.

Welcome to Pebble Presents.

- - - - - - - - -

If you liked this episode of Pebble Presents, please share it with colleagues and friends! Find us on Apple Podcasts and Spotify to rate/review/subscribe to the show.

Want more? Visit PebbleStrategy.com. 

You can also find us on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/pebble-strategy/) and Instagram(https://www.instagram.com/pebblestrategy/).

Thanks for listening and joining the conversation!

Show Notes 

0:28 - Emelia introduces today’s special guest and topic

2:06 - Emily recalls the journey that led her to her current profession

6:36 - Emelia shares a memory that Emily unlocked for her - and the two discuss looking back to pay-it-forward

19:27 - Emily divulges what happened, professionally, when she stepped out on her own

20:46 - Emily discusses how brand strategy discipline lives within the organization on the company side vs. on the agency side

23:56 - Emily recounts an example of when she was able to talk about brand so the organization recognized its necessity

26:09 - Emily describes what her team has done to position Zendesk globally for growth

28:26 - Emily shares where she sees insights being used and leveraged with the greatest impact for brand in organizations 

37:00 - Emelia and Emily discuss the brand as behavior, not just message

39:11 - Emily describes the culture of her company and if she has had to evangelize and make the case for brand

41:20 - Emily shares what she’s found has helped make the financial case for brand

43:11 - Emelia invites Emily to participate in a lightning round

51:44 - Emelia wraps up the episode

Episode Credits

Executive Produced & Hosted by Emelia Rallapalli

Produced by Stephanie Watanabe 

Edited and Post Produced by Erin Zimmerman

Artwork and Design by Liisa Turan-Walters

Today, Pebble Presents Sam Ladner. Emelia and Sam discuss Sam’s professional path that took her from journalism to sociology, the difference between foresight and innovation, and why foresight and visioning work so well in companies and applied settings. They also explore time, timing, and tempo: what they are, why they matter, and how to manage an attention budget as carefully as a financial one.

If you are looking to grow your company sustainably, this episode is for you!

Emelia Rallapalli is the founder of Pebble - a brand strategy and marketing research consultancy. With decades of experience in global brand planning, strategy, and research, Pebble has helped shape businesses of all kinds, from ambitious start-ups to global Fortune 100 companies. 

Dr. Sam Ladner is a sociologist who helps teams innovate, design, and learn. She has worked at Amazon, Microsoft, and Workday, reaching the rank of Senior Principal Researcher, and is the author of two books on methodology (working on her third): Practical Ethnography and Mixed Methods. Using qualitative and quantitative methods, Dr. Ladner’s research focuses on productivity, technology, and work. She received her PhD from York University and is a proud Canadian.

Welcome to Pebble Presents.

- - - - - - - - -

If you liked this episode of Pebble Presents, please share it with colleagues and friends! Find us on Apple Podcasts and Spotify to rate/review/subscribe to the show.

Want more? Visit PebbleStrategy.com. 

You can also find us on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/pebble-strategy/) and Instagram(https://www.instagram.com/pebblestrategy/).

Thanks for listening and joining the conversation!

Resources

• EPIC - https://www.epicpeople.org/
• Sam Ladner website: https://www.samladner.com/
• Freedom.to: https://freedom.to/
• Pomodoro Technique: https://www.pomodorotechnique.com/
• Readwise: https://readwise.io/

Show Notes 

0:28 - Emelia introduces today’s special guest and topic

2:55 - Sam shares the journey that led to her current profession

11:27 - Sam recalls family influences behind her career path

15:53 - Sam investigates some of the biggest misconceptions about sociologists’ work

19:03 - Sam describes what sociological practices look like within a commercial setting

22:06 - Sam discusses her work in foresight and how she applies the practice today

28:36 - Sam breaks down how to bring visioning work into the corporate world 

37:56 - Sam defines and discusses temporality and how it helps to unlock new thinking in business 

44:48 - Sam describes types of crises on the horizon and how businesses can (and should) start planning for them now

54:48 - Sam shares advice to help executives navigate long-term thinking

56:26 - Sam divulges how she manages her attention budget

59:19 - Emelia and Sam discuss executive functioning, dysfunction, and reflection

1:05:23  - Sam participates in a lightning round with Emelia

1:14:34 - Emelia wraps up the episode

Episode Credits

Executive Produced & Hosted by Emelia Rallapalli

Produced by Stephanie Watanabe 

Editing and Post Produced by Erin Zimmerman

Artwork and Design by Liisa Turan-Walters

In this episode, Pebble Presents Aaron Hall, a naming expert and founder of Emphatic Branding. Together, Emelia and Aaron discuss naming for brands, companies, and products: everything from the process and stages of naming, to the differences is between pre-screening, vetting, and linguistic analysis for name development (and why each is important). 

Aaron shares how he uses AI in his naming process and workstreams so he can deliver better work for his clients. He also helps us understand the difference between naming strategy and creative name development. 

This was an insightful conversation! If you are considering names for your brand, company, or product…this episode is right on time for you.

Emelia Rallapalli is the founder of Pebble - a brand strategy and marketing research consultancy. With decades of experience in global brand planning, strategy, and research, Pebble has helped shape businesses of all kinds, from ambitious start-ups to global Fortune 100 companies. 

Aaron Hall is a naming expert and the founder of Emphatic Branding. He’s been naming things for 23 years. He founded Emphatic a year ago because he loves sharing his passion for naming with clients.

Welcome to Pebble Presents.

- - - - - - - - -

If you liked this episode of Pebble Presents, please share it with colleagues and friends! Find us on Apple Podcasts and Spotify to rate/review/subscribe to the show.

Want more? Visit PebbleStrategy.com. 

You can also find us on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/pebble-strategy/) and Instagram(https://www.instagram.com/pebblestrategy/).

Thanks for listening and joining the conversation!

Resources

• Emphatic Branding: https://www.emphaticbranding.com/ 
• Emphatic Branding on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/emphaticbranding/
• Laurel Sutton, Senior Strategist & Linguistat Catchword Branding: https://catchwordbranding.com/team/laurel-sutton/
• Book recommendation: ”Brand Naming” by Rob Meyerson

Show Notes 

0:23 - Emelia introduces today’s special guest

2:26 - Aaron shares the journey to his current profession

4:52 - Aaron divulges what makes a naming expert tick and breaks down the process of a naming expert

17:15 - Aaron defines linguistic analysis and its importance vs prescreening

20:16 - Aaron shares considerations for hiring a native speaking naming expert - and is it important?

24:28 - Emelia asks Aaron if there is a best time in the process to bring in a naming specialist, and they discuss how they named their own companies

30:21 - Aaron explains the difference between naming creative and naming strategy

33:18 - Emelia and Aaron discuss when the creation of brands, sub-brands or renaming a brand may not be the best idea

42:21 - Aaron shares what he recommends folks read to help them with naming, and the AI tools he uses to make his business flow

50:32 - Aaron participates in a lightning round with Emelia

59:32 - Emelia wraps the episode

Episode Credits

Executive Produced & Hosted by Emelia Rallapalli

Produced by Stephanie Watanabe 

Editing and Post Produced by Erin Zimmerman

Artwork and Design by Liisa Turan-Walters

This week, Pebble Presents a short, end-of-year reflection by our host, Emelia Rallapalli. Emelia shares her thoughts, reactions, and reflections on 2025, as well as a glimpse into what she will be focusing on in 2026. 

This episode is especially for you, fellow business owners, small company leaders, and anyone who is thinking about similar themes as we close out the year. 

Emelia Rallapalli is the founder of Pebble - a brand strategy and marketing research consultancy. With decades of experience in global brand planning, strategy, and research, Pebble has helped shape businesses of all kinds, from ambitious start-ups to global Fortune 100 companies. 

Welcome to Pebble Presents.

- - - - - - - - -

If you liked this episode of Pebble Presents, please share it with colleagues and friends! Find us on Apple Podcasts and Spotify to rate/review/subscribe to the show.

Want more? Visit PebbleStrategy.com. 

You can also find us on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/pebble-strategy/) and Instagram(https://www.instagram.com/pebblestrategy/).

Thanks for listening and joining the conversation!

Show Notes 

0:21 - Emelia welcomes you back to today’s special solo episode of the podcast

1:03 - Emelia pauses to acknowledge something important

1:55 - Does Artificial Intelligence have a place in Emelia’s current and future workflows?

6:33 - Emelia divulges what keeps things new and interesting for her at Pebble

8:46 - Emelia talks about what she’ll be prioritizing for the business in 2026

10:03 - Emelia is ready to explore the concept of value

12:05 - Emelia wraps up the episode with a question: What are YOU focusing on for your business in 2026? 

Episode Credits

Executive Produced & Hosted by Emelia Rallapalli

Produced by Stephanie Watanabe 

Editing and Post Produced by Erin Zimmerman

Artwork and Design by Liisa Turan-Walters

In this episode of Pebble Presents, host Emelia Rallapalli and Renato Silvestre discuss the rapid development of survey research and accompanying rise in survey fraud. They explore the impact of technology on survey participation and the importance of quality control before diving into the intricacies of survey design, data quality, and the challenges of sample fraud in market research. 

If you are ready to learn how fraud impacts research and how we can think and act differently to quell it, then this episode is for YOU!

Emelia Rallapalli is the founder of Pebble - a brand strategy and marketing research consultancy. With decades of experience in global brand planning, strategy, and research, Pebble has helped shape businesses of all kinds, from ambitious start-ups to global Fortune 100 companies. 

Renato Silvestre is a research and analytics leader with over 30 years of experience delivering actionable insights to drive business growth. As Founder + Chief Insights Innovator at Strategence, Renato combines deep expertise in market research, data science, and AI with a creative, strategic mindset. With a passion for innovation and a hands-on approach to research from exploratory ideation through in-market tracking, Renato is recognized for turning complexity into clarity and impact.

Welcome to Pebble Presents!

- - - - - - - - -

If you liked this episode of Pebble Presents, please share it with colleagues and friends! Find us on Apple Podcasts and Spotify to rate/review/subscribe to the show.

Want more? Visit PebbleStrategy.com. 

You can also find us on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/pebble-strategy/) and Instagram(https://www.instagram.com/pebblestrategy/).

Thanks for listening and joining the conversation!

Resources and References 

• Strategence: https://www.strategence-us.com/
• Strategence on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/strategence
• Strategence on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/strategence_smarts

Show Notes 

0:23 - Emelia introduces today’s topic and returning guest, Renato Silvestre

4:04 - Renato discusses the rise of survey fraud in research and what can compromise the quality of research outcomes

20:27 - Renato identifies quantitative surveys and research that are more vulnerable to fraud in the respondents, and a BIG challenge that comes with DIY research

27:40 - Renato explains factors that contribute to the evidence that the longer a survey is in field, the risks of fraud go down

32:45 - Emelia and Renato discuss when DIY research might be a good solution for you and why taking time and being thoughtful in your research process is important

37:44 - Renato discusses leveraging new technologies - including artificial intelligence

40:19 - Renato lists practical preventative measures in doing your own survey research, points of comparison in self-conducted online surveys, and shares if he would consider working with a research “one-stop shop”

46:24 - Emelia and Renato share their key takeaways from the episode

48:12 - Emelia brings the episode to a close

Episode Credits

Produced by Stephanie Watanabe 

Editing and Post Produced by Erin Zimmerman

Artwork and Design by Liisa Turan-Walters

In this episode, Pebble Presents Tiffany McNeil, a brand and innovation strategist and insights executive. Together, Emelia and Tiffany discuss Tiffany's journey into the field, the critical role of insights in driving innovation, and the balance between research and business realities. Tiffany shares her experiences in various organizations, emphasizing the importance of understanding consumer needs and the evolving landscape of research methodologies, including the impact of AI. The discussion also touches on the skepticism surrounding research in organizations and the need for a balanced approach to insights and strategy.

If you want to innovate in your industry, and aren’t sure what the next best step is…listen in to today’s episode!

Emelia Rallapalli is the founder of Pebble - a brand strategy and marketing research consultancy. With decades of experience in global brand planning, strategy, and research, Pebble has helped shape businesses of all kinds, from ambitious start-ups to global Fortune 100 companies. 

Tiffany McNeil is a consumer-driven strategist with over 20 years of experience building human-centered brands and products. She has worked in both large organizations and startups and, in 2018, started Oaktown Strategy, an insights-led strategy & innovation firm where she remains the CEO and lead strategist.

Welcome to Pebble Presents.

- - - - - - - - -

If you liked this episode of Pebble Presents, please share it with colleagues and friends! Find us on Apple Podcasts and Spotify to rate/review/subscribe to the show.

Want more? Visit PebbleStrategy.com. 

You can also find us on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/pebble-strategy/) and Instagram(https://www.instagram.com/pebblestrategy/).

Thanks for listening and joining the conversation!

Show Notes 

0:23 - Emelia introduces Tiffany, today’s special guest

1:34 - Tiffany shares the path she took to get to her current profession

10:28 - Tiffany recalls when she determined that her area of expertise was insights and research for innovation

14:05 - Tiffany outlines skills and capabilities a good insights person should possess if they are supporting or collaborating with innovation teams

18:02 - Tiffany explains how she has negotiated and managed situations where a consumer product idea isn’t feasible, or the company ignores the consumer research to do what they want

26:36 - Tiffany explains the dynamics and conditions that allow a company to embrace research, and provides examples of previous projects

34:53 - Tiffany shares the “best practices” she learned at Del Monte and throughout her career that she has carried forward to help companies grow today

44:56 - Tiffany shares what qualitative insights she likes to begin with, to inform the work she is about to do, as well as quantitative insightsthat she finds valuable at the back end of the research

49:02 - Tiffany shares what, in many situations, could be more important than consumer research for product development 

52:34 - Looking forward, Tiffany divulges what she is excited about in the field of innovation and insights

1:00:37 - Emelia wraps up the episode

Episode Credits

Executive Produced & Hosted by Emelia Rallapalli

Produced by Stephanie Watanabe 

Editing and Post Produced by Erin Zimmerman

Artwork and Design by Liisa Turan-Walters

In this episode of Pebble Presents, host Emelia Rallapalli chats with Butler Looney to talk design and building strong brands from the inside out. Butler discusses how he went from an art history major to Executive Creative Director at a tech company, the importance of having a clear and focused design brief for creatives, and why he has developed a sense of empathy for business stakeholders when making a case for design within companies and organizations.

Emelia Rallapalli is the founder of Pebble - a brand strategy and marketing research consultancy. With decades of experience in global brand planning, strategy, and research, Pebble has helped shape businesses of all kinds, from ambitious start-ups to global Fortune 100 companies. 

Butler Looney is Executive Creative Director at Honeybook. Based in San Francisco, he has worked for top design agencies like Turner Duckworth as well as in-house, leading and building teams at companies like Fitbit and Headspace.

Welcome to Pebble Presents.

- - - - - - - - -

If you liked this episode of Pebble Presents, please share it with colleagues and friends! Find us on Apple Podcasts and Spotify to rate/review/subscribe to the show.

Want more? Visit PebbleStrategy.com. 

You can also find us on LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/pebble-strategy/) and Instagram(https://www.instagram.com/pebblestrategy/).

Thanks for listening and joining the conversation!

Resources and References 

• Article: “Design assimilated into business, but did business ever understand design?” by Natasha Jen for The Drum - https://www.thedrum.com/opinion/2025/04/01/design-assimilated-business-did-business-ever-understand-design
• Honeybook: https://www.honeybook.com/
• Butler Looney on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/butlerlooney/

Show Notes 

0:23 - Emelia introduces today’s special guest: Butler Looney.

1:44 - Butler recounts the twists and turns of his journey into brand and identity design.

13:27 - Emelia recalls a personal story involving Butler and her son (and branding), and asks what factors are most important when he decides on his next projects: the people, or the opportunity/brand.

16:41 - Utilizing a recent quote by Natasha Jen: “Designers now speak business fluently, but business has not learned to see design,” Butler and Emelia discuss the miss between the business side and design, and where it would be possible to bridge that gap.

26:42 - Emelia asks how to better arm marketers and creative leaders in business with being able to make the case for the importance of thoughtful design.

30:26 - Butler and Emelia discuss why creators need sandboxes to play in, and the leap of faith it can take for stakeholders to get on board when you can’t prove the results of design ahead of time.

34:34 - Butler details how he became the Creative Director at Honeybook (where he is now), and the business case he made to persuade the organization to rebrand.

40:19 - Butler explains how he started working with new-to-world brand, Fanstake, and what it was like to work on it.

45:35 - Butler runs through the significant rebrand he undertook at Ginger - how it came to be, a bit on the design strategy.

52:09 - Emelia introduces a new segment of questions for Butler: Lightni