Physicians Taking Back Medicine

Physicians Taking Back Medicine

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Physicians Taking Back Medicine episodes

  • 14: Bringing back physician-owned hospitals: A rural success story

    Dermatologist Jon Ward, M.D., grew up in the Florida Panhandle. Disillusioned after just one year as an employed physician, he returned home and opened his own practice. Over the next two decades, he expanded that solo practice into a 32-location organization operating across four states, with a particular focus on providing skin cancer care in rural communities.

    With that success, Ward could have done almost anything: retire early, travel the world or buy a fleet of sports cars. Instead, he decided to help buy a rural hospital.

    Read more at MedicalEconomics.com.

    Music Credits
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    Editor's note: Episode timestamps and transcript produced using AI tools.

    0:00
    Cold open: could physician ownership save rural hospitals?
    1:01 Meet Jon Ward, M.D.: 32 locations, four states and one rural hospital
    2:05 Why he bought a hospital instead of retiring
    2:41 HealthMark Regional closes, and the deal that came back around
    4:44 A 1990 for-profit hospital and the reputation it left behind
    5:31 The Stark law, the whole hospital exception and what changed in 2010
    7:45 The thinking behind the ban on physician ownership
    8:54 The workaround: own the building, not the operating entity
    9:42 Raising $3.7 million from colleagues, plus promissory-note loans
    11:06 USDA and Treasury financing, and a $7 million first year
    12:34 Finding the profit center: why the operating rooms came first
    13:41 Charity care, EMTALA and Medicaid payments that arrive a year late
    15:17 Medicaid cuts, $50 billion for rural health and a $4.6 million award
    16:39 Cash pay at a rural hospital: what a spine surgery actually costs
    18:41 Why price transparency means little without insurer rate transparency
    20:51 Service lines today: imaging, mammography and a mobile lung screening unit
    23:04 $5 million to open the last wing, and codes as a barrier to entry
    23:59 Winning back a community that had written the hospital off
    25:33 The ask: bring back physician ownership, starting with rural
    27:46 Advice for residents weighing corporate medicine against ownership
    28:25 The business education no one gets in residency
    31:10 One practice to 32 locations: the non-metro strategy
    32:39 Model the pro forma, and don't buy the MRI in year one
    34:01 Six months of payroll he wasn't sure he could make
    35:00 Outro

    38 min
  • 13: Five surprising findings about the state of direct primary care

    For more than a decade, physicians have cited $77 per month as the average price of a direct primary care (DPC) membership. A new national survey suggests that benchmark is now substantially out of date, as well as showing a few other unexpected findings.

    The 2024 survey was commissioned by the Direct Primary Care Alliance (DPCA) and led by Kenneth Qiu, M.D., a family physician who launched his Richmond, Virginia, DPC practice directly out of residency. The survey received 465 physician responses, representing approximately 13% of the estimated 3,600 DPC practices in the United States.

    While not a definitive census of every DPC practice, the DPCA survey offers one of the largest recent datasets describing how physicians are designing and operating their practices.

    Find five findings that surprised even Qiu and his fellow survey committee members at medicaleconomics.com/view/five-surprising-findings-about-the-state-of-direct-primary-care

    Music Credits
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    Editor's note: Episode timestamps and transcript produced using AI tools.

    0:00
    Cold open: what does a direct primary care membership actually cost, and what counts as a full panel?
    0:57 Meet Kenneth Qiu, M.D.; Emily O'Rourke, M.D.; and Kelsey Smith, M.D.
    1:46 Why the alliance ran the survey: testing word-of-mouth benchmarks against real numbers.
    2:22 How the survey was designed, vetted and distributed across the DPC community.
    3:16 Why 465 responses makes for a representative sample.
    4:03 The response rate, the leading states and the Medicaid expansion pattern.
    4:57 Women made up 67% of respondents, and why the model may appeal to them.
    5:31 Specialty mix, and why nearly a quarter of respondents were osteopathic physicians.
    7:03 An average owner age of 46, and Qiu on the "peak of despair."
    8:13 The full-panel surprise: a sizable group calls 100 to 300 patients full.
    8:43 O'Rourke on staying a micropractice by choice, not by default.
    9:31 Panels that run from under 50 to more than 1,000.
    10:10 Smith on why 1,000 patients turned out to be an overshoot.
    11:00 What "full" really means, and O'Rourke's satiety analogy.
    12:01 Staffing: more than 30% of respondents run with no staff at all.
    12:40 Why O'Rourke outsources instead of hiring.
    13:45 The case for a right-hand person, and Smith's 19-year medical assistant.
    15:30 Pricing: the $77 benchmark gives way to $98.46 per month.
    16:02 The "$50 or you're greedy" myth, and raising prices to match inflation.
    16:49 How price splits by region, rural versus urban and panel size.
    18:10 Qiu on why older rural practices price lowest.
    19:08 Practice age against price point, and the newer practices charging more.
    20:10 Pressure to raise prices, and Smith's move off age-based tiers.
    21:02 The tiering breakdown: 76.4% tiered, 15% flat, the rest on family pricing.
    21:31 Qiu on switching to family pricing to bring in whole households.
    22:45 "If you've seen one DPC, you've seen one DPC."
    23:39 Better questions than "how much should I charge?"
    24:43 Where to read the survey, and sign-off.

    26 min
  • 12: A hospital tried to replace them. These Oregon physicians fought back — and won

    What do you do when a hospital decides to replace your independent physician group with a corporate staffing company? For this group of physicians, the answer was simple: fight back.

    In the fall of 2025, Eugene Emergency Physicians (EEP) learned that after more than 35 years of serving the community, its emergency medicine contract would be awarded to an out-of-state corporate medical group. Recognizing that this action contradicted Oregon's corporate practice of medicine laws, EEP took action. They organized colleagues, contacted legislators and engaged the media. When those efforts failed, the group took legal action, filing an emergency injunction.

    Read more: https://www.medicaleconomics.com/view/a-hospital-tried-to-replace-them-these-oregon-physicians-fought-back-and-won

    Music Credits
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    Editor's note: Episode timestamps and transcript produced using AI tools.

    0:00
    Cold open: do physicians still have power in corporate medicine?

    1:02 Meet Bianca Jacobs and Dan McGee of Eugene Emergency Physicians.

    1:45 PeaceHealth closes University District Hospital over the group's warnings.

    2:42 What the closure cost: lost beds and Oregon's capacity crisis.

    4:20 PeaceHealth puts the contract out for bid and picks ApolloMD.

    5:07 Scapegoated for emergency department wait times.

    6:57 Senate Bill 951 and the "friendly physician" loophole.

    8:28 The group closes ranks and signs a 90-day pledge.

    11:17 More than 450 medical staff push back; physicians vote no confidence.

    12:57 Nurses follow, and the fight goes to the governor, legislators and the media.

    14:08 A law with no teeth: no one could enforce it.

    15:57 Running out of time as job offers pile up.

    17:27 The only path left is the courtroom.

    18:13 Assembling the legal team and the injunction request.

    19:44 Dramatic hearings and three plaintiffs, including an 8-year-old patient.

    21:50 Bracing for a personal attack on cross-examination.

    22:28 The "scab" posts and the judge who stopped the questioning.

    27:32 Holes punched in the bid-scoring process.

    27:54 PeaceHealth returns to the table and ApolloMD walks away.

    28:42 No legal fees recovered, and AAEM's backing.

    29:00 A call to medical societies and the advocacy playbook.

    30:41 The locums leverage and refusing to roll over.

    32:10 Closing advice and sign-off.

    34 min
  • 11: Standing up for kids: When one physician's voice changes everything

    What if the most important thing you do as a physician happens outside the exam room?

    Free N. Hess, D.O., a board-certified pediatrician and pediatric emergency physician, reached this epiphany early in her career when she realized that many of the children she was treating didn't need to be there at all.

    "Moving from an inner-city hospital to a rural area opened my eyes to how many injuries and illnesses could be prevented by more community resources and better education," Hess said.

    That insight didn't just change how she practiced. It changed her sense of responsibility.

    "I wanted to do more than educate one-on-one in the emergency room. I wanted a larger platform."

    Hess took action, starting the website Pedi-Mom, launching a podcast, and branching into social media. Now a national expert on child safety, Hess speaks at medical conferences, regularly consults with families, schools, and manufacturing companies, and was even interviewed for the BBC documentary "Childhood 2.0." And her work is making a difference.

    Read more at MedicalEconomics.com.

    Music Credits
    Medical Education by Art Media - stock.adobe.com

    Editor's note: Episode timestamps and transcript produced using AI tools.

    0:17
    — Dr. Free Hess introduces herself and her background in pediatric emergency medicine
    1:18 — From the Bronx to rural Florida: How the move changed her perspective on preventable injuries
    4:33 — Frustration with one-on-one education in the ER and the decision to build a larger platform
    4:49 — Launching Pedi-Mom, the podcast, and expanding to social media including TikTok
    6:09 — Safe sleep: Explaining the difference between bed sharing and room sharing, and why "co-sleeping" is a problematic term
    8:18 — Why safe sleep generates so much backlash, and working with parent advocates who have lost children
    11:15 — Expanding into speaking, documentaries, and consulting on child safety and online predators
    12:03 — Why physicians need to be on social media and how to get started
    13:25 — Practical advice for overcoming the fear of criticism and imperfection online
    16:16 — Discussion of a viral post on teenage pregnancy and the broader threat of child sexual exploitation
    20:11 — How advocacy opens doors: BBC's "Childhood 2.0" documentary and collaborating with outside influencers
    21:22 — The scope of child sexual abuse and how social media and AI have expanded predators' reach
    23:15 — Explaining sextortion: How it works, why teen boys are the primary target, and the link to suicide
    25:01 — Advice for parents and physicians on protecting kids online
    25:44 — The sextortion story that changed everything: A mother's message and a Department of Homeland Security arrest
    28:18 — Saving parent thank-you messages as motivation, and the impact of getting just one physician online
    30:19 — Advice for physicians on reaching out to peers when things go wrong on social media
    33:22 — Closing thoughts on why the benefits outweigh the risks of speaking out

    35 min
  • 10: Physicians fight for malpractice reform — and win

    New Mexico has faced its share of health care challenges in recent years, but perhaps none has been more urgent than the loss of physicians, many of whom cite the state’s extreme malpractice climate as a major reason for leaving. 

    “Between 2017 and 2024, between 200 and 300 physicians left the state as a net negative,” says Aaron Snyder, M.D., a board-certified emergency physician practicing in Albuquerque. “It’s the only state in the country that actually had a net loss during that period.”

    Snyder, who has been fighting for malpractice reform since arriving in New Mexico in 2021, believes the medical-legal risk of practicing there bears much of the blame. Indeed, surgical oncologist Amani AJ Jambhekar, M.D., says she left the state for mainly that reason.

    “It wasn’t that I was personally worried I would be sued,” Jambhekar says. “It was the downstream impact of the malpractice environment on the ability to recruit collaborating plastic surgeons and provide the care our patients need.” In the two years that she practiced in the state, Jambhekar says that she didn’t see a single plastic surgeon move into her community.

    Jambhekar advocated for malpractice reform by writing op-eds, sharing information on social media and visiting legislators before ultimately deciding to leave the state.

    “As a surgeon who treats patients with breast cancer, I had patients driving more than 250 miles to get comprehensive reconstructive care. The environment was very, very challenging because of these limitations.”

    Read more at MedicalEconomics.com.

    Music Credits
    Medical Education by Art Media - stock.adobe.com

    Editor's note: Episode timestamps and transcript produced using AI tools.

    0:16
    — Introduction: Aaron Snyder, M.D., on New Mexico's net physician loss from 2017 to 2024

    0:37 — Amani AJ Jambhekar, M.D., on the plastic surgery access crisis and why breast cancer patients were driving 250 miles for reconstructive care

    3:15 — History of New Mexico's Medical Malpractice Act and the structure of the Patient Compensation Fund

    5:00 — The 2021 legislative overhaul: raised caps, uncapped punitive damages, and lumping independent practices in with hospital systems

    7:52 — Personal financial exposure under New Mexico's limited asset protections

    8:03 — Punitive damages attached to 92% of malpractice cases and the forced-settlement dynamic

    9:42 — A $412 million nuclear verdict in a urology case accelerates the physician exodus

    10:00 — A husband-and-wife primary care team closes after two decades and relocates to Missouri; insurers exit the state

    15:00 — Emergency physicians absorbing primary care volume; a jaundiced patient's story prompts real-time legislator outreach in the ER

    16:27 — QR codes for constituent contact, rallying major health systems, and the emergence of HB 99

    18:26 — What HB 99 actually does: caps on punitive damages, raised evidentiary standard, and post-discovery sequencing

    20:00 — Jambhekar on leaving New Mexico, feeling relieved, and the state as a cautionary tale for Virginia

    22:54 — Jambhekar on missing her New Mexico patients; the outsider trial bar's structural grip on an unpaid legislature

    25:00 — Resident retention rates, incentive gaps, and what it would take for Jambhekar to return; Snyder on how advocacy became an antidote to physician burnout

    30:00 — Closing from host Rebekah Bernard, M.D.

    30:40 — End

    31 min
  • 9: When facts become ‘arrogance’: Physicians push back against political theater

    Physicians don’t show up to legislative hearings expecting applause. In fact, most arrive knowing the vote may already be decided. They come anyway — on their own time, at their own expense, often canceling clinics or trading call shifts — because patient safety is worth two or three minutes at a microphone.

    What they don’t expect is to be personally attacked for telling the truth.

    Yet that is exactly what happened during a recent Florida legislative hearing on a bill that would allow psychiatric mental health nurse practitioners to practice independently, without oversight by a psychiatrist. After calm, evidence-based testimony from multiple physicians outlining differences in training, patient safety risks and noncompliance with existing law, the bill sponsor closed not by rebutting the data — but by attacking the physicians themselves.

    They were described as “arrogant,” “obnoxious” and “greedy.” The sponsor claimed doctors were profiting off nurse practitioners, earning thousands of dollars per month per clinician, joking that physicians could use the money to “buy a plane and go to The Bahamas.”

    It was not a debate over policy. It was political theater — and physicians were cast as villains for refusing to play along.

    Read more at MedicalEconomics.com.

    Music Credits
    Medical Education by Art Media - stock.adobe.com

    Editor's note: Episode timestamps and transcript produced using AI tools.

    0:00
    – Florida legislator’s closing remarks attacking physician testimony

    0:24 – Episode introduction: Physicians speak out against unsupervised psychiatric nurse practitioner legislation

    1:38 – Dr. Vicki Norton’s committee testimony on training differences and patient safety

    4:23 – Interview with Dr. Norton: Reaction to lawmaker’s comments

    7:22 – Introduction of Dr. Ankush Bansal

    7:57 – Dr. Bansal’s testimony on physician education, ethics, and access to care

    9:58 – Dr. Bansal reacts to sponsor’s personal attacks

    13:32 – Introduction of Dr. Mays DeBose (South Carolina advocacy effort)

    13:57 – Dr. DeBose on physician image, humility, and legislative communication

    15:11 – South Carolina “turf war” characterization

    15:43 – Dr. DeBose describes committee hearing experience

    16:02 – Dr. Phil Schaefer testifies on lack of data

    16:18 – Legislator comments about AI replacing radiologists

    16:42 – Dr. Schaefer responds to AI comment

    18:27 – Florida bill sponsor closing remarks (“It’s going to be cool”)

    19:06 – Dr. Schaefer on legislators’ understanding of medicine

    19:46 – Call to physician advocacy

    20:34 – Dr. Norton on overcoming personal attacks and getting involved

    22:48 – Dr. Bansal’s advice for physicians interested in advocacy

    23:43 – Dr. Schaefer on why physicians struggle to engage politically

    24:33 – Dr. DeBose on supporting organized medicine

    26:05 – Dr. DeBose on collective voice and combating learned helplessness

    28:20 – Final encouragement to join local and state medical societies

    29:02 – Closing remarks from host Dr. Rebecca Bernard

    30 min
  • 8: Avoiding the ‘P-word’: Why these physicians are taking the ‘no provider pledge’

    “Please stand, raise your right hand, and repeat after me: I pledge not to use the word provider when referring to physicians and further, to encourage my colleagues to do so. You may be seated.”

    So began rheumatologist Dr. Robert McLean’s inaugural address as 2019 President of the American College of Physicians — and with it, his mission to eliminate the “P-word,” provider, as a term for physicians.

    “People stood, smiled, I got some claps, and several came up afterward to thank me,” McLean recalls. “It kind of became my moniker. For the rest of the year, at every committee meeting, I would start with the ‘No Provider Pledge. If somebody slipped up and used the word provider, they had to throw a dollar in the kitty.’”

    Six years later, McLean is still widely recognized among recent ACP physician leaders as the standard-bearer against the term. “At a recent AMA meeting, when the word ‘provider’ slipped into speeches by CMS Director Dr. Oz and AMA CEO Dr. Whyte, people sitting nearby would turn around and look at me and shake their heads,” he said. McLean notes that the AMA and other major physician organizations have longstanding policy opposing use of the term.

    While some may argue that fighting a word isn’t worth the effort, McLean and others believe replacing physician with provider represents far more than semantics. It reflects a deeper erosion of professional identity, clarity, and trust in American medicine.

    Read more at MedicalEconomics.com.

    Music Credits
    Medical Education by Art Media - stock.adobe.com

    Editor's note: Episode timestamps and transcript produced using AI tools.

    Introduction to the "Provider" Problem (00:00:13)
    Overview of the episode’s focus on the term "provider" and its impact on physicians’ roles and identity.

    The "No Provider Pledge" and Its Reception (00:00:36) Dr. McLean introduces the "No Provider Pledge" and describes physicians’ reactions to it.

    Origins and Spread of the Term "Provider" (00:02:34) Historical background of the term, its use by insurance companies, and its effect on healthcare roles.

    Confusion in Clinical Titles and Patient Perception (00:04:06) How patients are confused by titles, and the implications for care and professional identity.

    Declining Standards in Nurse Practitioner Education (00:06:18) Concerns about the quality and rigor of nurse practitioner training and its consequences.

    Legislative Changes and Nurse Practitioner Autonomy (00:07:36) Dr. McLean’s advocacy experience and the evolution of laws allowing nurse practitioners more independence.

    Differences in Training: Physicians vs. Non-Physicians (00:10:10) Discussion of the rigorous, standardized training for physicians compared to other practitioners.

    Personal Sacrifice and Physician Burnout (00:13:07) Dr. Alaba shares the personal costs of becoming a physician and the emotional impact of being called "provider."

    Corporate Medicine and Physician Demoralization (00:15:14) How corporate healthcare, loss of autonomy, and generic titles contribute to physician burnout and suicide.

    Propaganda and the Visual Blurring of Roles (00:17:12) Analysis of social media posts that visually equate physicians and non-physicians, reinforcing the "provider" label.

    Physician Reactions to Lack of Recognition (00:18:22) Doctors’ emotional responses to being grouped with non-physicians and the importance of proper recognition.

    Strategies to Reclaim Physician Identity (00:19:33) Dr. McLean discusses ways to push back against the "provider" term and reclaim professional identity.

    Relational vs. Transactional Care (00:21:22) Emphasis on the unique physician-patient relationship and the dangers of commoditizing healthcare.

    Market Forces and Commoditization of Medicine (00:22:32) Discussion of how insurance and private equity treat healthcare as a commodity, harming the profession.

    Comparison to Legal Profession and Final Thoughts (00:23:25) Comparison to law, concluding with a call for physicians to reclaim their identity and resist being called "providers."

    27 min
  • 7: The rising toll of private equity in health care
    A newly published study in the Annals of Internal Medicine has added more fuel to the growing alarm over private equity’s expanding role in American health care. Researchers found that hospitals acquired by private equity (PE) companies experience a decrease in staffing and salaries, as well as an increase in emergency department patient deaths and patient transfers to other hospitals.

    This isn’t the first time such concerns have surfaced. Previous studies have shown that patients treated in private equity–owned hospitals suffer more hospital-related adverse events including bloodstream and surgical site infections and falls. A 2023 systematic review went further, concluding that private equity ownership was consistently associated with increases in costs for patients and payers with mixed to harmful impacts on quality, noting an association with reduced nurse staffing levels and a shift towards lower nursing skill mix. Researchers concluded: “No consistently beneficial impacts of PE ownership were identified.”

    To explore how these findings play out in the trenches, Physicians Taking Back Medicine spoke with two doctors — anesthesiologist Marco Fernandez, M.D. and emergency physician Robert McNamara, M.D. — both of whom have witnessed firsthand the consequences of private equity in health care and are now leading efforts to reverse its influence.

    Music Credits
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    Editor's note: Episode timestamps and transcript produced using AI tools.

    0:00 – Intro

    Announcer tees up new study showing ED mortality rises after private equity hospital acquisitions. 

    1:22 – Guest Intro: Dr. Marco Fernandez
    Anesthesiologist; president, Midwest Anesthesia Partners and Association for Independent Medicine. 

    1:41 – Hospital Contracts Replaced by PE Firms
    Fernandez explains two contracts lost to TeamHealth and NorthStar, no RFP, community backlash, OR shutdowns. 

    4:32 – Dr. Robert McNamara’s Background
    Long-time critic of private equity’s role in emergency medicine; sets context from a 2021 interview. 

    5:00 – How Private Equity Operates
    Investment return expectations, cost-cutting, staffing model changes, profit over patient care. 

    6:34 – Study Data: Mortality, Staffing Reductions
    ED death rates, declines in FTEs, salary cuts in ED/ICU after PE acquisition. 

    7:21 – Personal Impact on Fernandez & His Family
    Private equity staffing squeezes, inadequate nursing support, and his mother’s suffering. 

    10:32 – Wider Trend: Mortality in PE-Owned Facilities
    Research also finds higher death rates in PE-owned nursing homes and hospice. 

    10:52 – “Penny Wise, Pound Foolish”
    Fernandez on leadership short-termism, physician exodus, higher long-term costs, persistent understaffing. 

    11:57 – Working With Legislators & AGs
    Corporate practice of medicine laws, tightening loopholes, educating state leaders. 

    13:03 – What Corporate Practice of Medicine Means
    McNamara explains non-physician control, enforcement failures, and harmful workarounds. 

    14:23 – Grassroots & Organized Medicine
    Joint advocacy efforts, silos among specialties, need for education and alignment. 

    15:47 – Reimbursement Reality for Anesthesiology
    The “30% problem”: Medicare valuation error in the ’90s, lower unit pay, subsidy dependence. 

    17:26 – How the Miscalculation Happened
    Time not accounted for in reimbursement; only anesthesia affected. 

    18:01 – Subsidies, Locums, Unsustainable Economics
    Why most anesthesia groups now require hospital subsidies; Fernandez’s pivot to independent contracting model. 

    19:39 – Private Equity Pitch: “Efficiency” and Subsidy Cuts
    Bait-and-switch promises to administrators; consolidation and extraction incentives. 

    21:29 – Golden Parachutes & Senior Partners
    Deals driven by outgoing partners, quotas, short visit times, erosion of practice control. 

    22:28 – Strategies to Fight Back
    Litigation, protecting physician groups from corporate replacement, expanding advocacy. 

    23:33 – Going Beyond AMA & Specialty Societies
    Coalition-building with large independent orthopedic groups; focusing on state-level strategy. 

    25:40 – Physician-Led Advocacy & Taking Action
    Host discussion on organized medicine vs. grassroots disruption and multi-front tactics. 

    26:41 – Advocacy as Antidote to Burnout
    Meaning, connection, and purpose through engagement. 

    27:46 – Changing Mindset & “Showing Up”
    Networking, persistence, attending meetings, building momentum. 

    29:08 – Closing Reflections & Call to Action
    Partnership, unity, and showing up as vehicles to reclaim medicine. 

    29:11 – Outro
    Host sign-off and thank you.
    30 min
  • 6: Keith Smith, M.D., and the free market revolution in surgery
    When patients walk through the doors of the Surgery Center of Oklahoma, they often bring stories of frustration, fear, and financial devastation from their encounters with America’s health care system. Yet, what they find in Oklahoma City is radically different: a transparent, patient-centered surgical experience at a fraction of the cost of most hospitals and surgery centers.

    At the heart of this revolution is Keith Smith, M.D. , an anesthesiologist and co-founder of the Surgery Center of Oklahoma. His model has become a beacon for patients and an inspiration for physicians, proving that health care can be both affordable and high quality—if physicians are willing to step outside of the traditional third-party payer system.

    I had the privilege of speaking with Smith for the Medical Economics podcast Physicians Taking Back Medicine. For me, the conversation was not only professionally inspiring but also deeply personal. As a family physician, I’ve referred my own patients across the country to Oklahoma for surgeries they could not afford locally.

    One of my patients without health insurance was quoted $20,000 at a local hospital for a life-saving surgery—so expensive he needed to sell his Harley-Davidson motorcycle to pay for it. Instead, he flew to Oklahoma, where he underwent surgery for under $5,000 (including travel and lodging), and returned home with his dignity, health, and savings intact.

    That kind of story raises the obvious question: Why isn’t this model being replicated everywhere?

    Music Credits
    Medical Education by Art Media - stock.adobe.com

    Editor's note: Episode timestamps and transcript produced using AI tools.

    Patient Frustrations and Introduction to Keith Smith, M.D. (00:00:14)
    Overview of patient struggles with the healthcare system and introduction to Keith Smith, M.D., and the Surgery Center of Oklahoma.

    Smith’s Background and Motivation (00:00:54) Smith's early career, government payment frustrations, and decision to leave traditional hospital practice.

    Founding the Surgery Center of Oklahoma (00:01:40)
    How Smith built his reputation, gathered colleagues, and started the surgery center to protect patients financially and medically.

    Early 90s Healthcare Problems and Free Market Motivation (00:02:27)
    Declining quality of care, financial abuse by hospitals, and the decision to create a fair, market-driven alternative.

    All-Inclusive Cash Pricing Model (00:04:02)
    Explanation of the center’s cash pricing, initial patient stories, and dramatic cost differences compared to hospitals.

    Building the Price List and Industry Pushback (00:05:27) Development of a public price list, industry backlash, and the center’s role as a champion for affordable care.

    Posting Prices Online and Market Impact (00:06:35) Decision to post prices online in 2009, attracting patients nationwide, and sparking a price war in healthcare.

    Growth and Influence of the Surgery Center (00:07:42) Expansion to a larger facility, multi-specialty services, and inspiring other centers to adopt transparent pricing.

    Patient Success Story and Website Usability (00:08:39) A patient’s experience using the website, cost savings, and positive outcomes compared to traditional hospitals.

    Surgeon Compensation and Hospital Billing Disparities (00:09:55) Discussion of the vast difference between hospital charges and actual surgeon payments.

    Market Creation and Price Matching (00:10:09) How public pricing led to market competition, price matching by hospitals, and the creation of a healthcare marketplace.

    Eliminating Middlemen and Keeping Prices Low (00:12:19) How removing hospital profit motives keeps surgery prices reasonable and benefits both patients and physicians.

    Barriers for Surgeons Adopting the Model (00:12:38)
    Challenges and fears preventing more surgeons from leaving the traditional system for a free market approach.

    Entrepreneurship and Payment Systems for Physicians (00:13:11)
    The need for confidence, entrepreneurship, and understanding payment logistics for physicians considering this model.

    Atlas Billing Company and Free Market Medical Association (00:14:32) How Smith’s billing company and association help other physicians transition to cash-based or hybrid models.

    Headwinds and Examples of Success (00:15:46) Real obstacles, government resistance, and examples of other centers successfully adopting the model.

    Advice for Physicians Considering the Model (00:18:23) Practical steps for doctors: starting small, finding leadership, and considering relocation to more receptive areas.

    Overcoming Inertia and Finding Opportunities (00:20:29) Discussion of geographic and systemic barriers, and strategies for launching a physician-owned center.

    Risks of Insurance Contracts and Going Independent (00:22:14) Risks of working with insurance companies, benefits of independence, and advice to leave government payments.

    Economic Principles and Physician Value (00:23:44)
    Understanding value from an economic perspective and the importance of seeing value through the patient’s eyes.

    The Free Market Model as a Positive Alternative (00:25:03)
    The benefits of the free market approach for physicians and patients, and encouragement to explore the model.

    Closing Remarks (00:25:54)
    Host’s closing comments and invitation to future episodes.
    27 min
  • 5: Can DPC save the rural health crisis?
    Fifteen years ago, family physician Lee Gross, MD, was running a small private practice in southwest Florida and struggling to stay afloat. Reimbursements were declining, administrative costs were rising, and Medicare requirements grew more burdensome each year. The turning point came when a small business owner approached him with an unusual proposal: since all the employees already saw Gross as their doctor, why not pay him directly to take care of them?

    Music Credits
    Medical Education by Art Media - stock.adobe.com

    Editor's note: Episode timestamps and transcript produced using AI tools.

    Introduction to DPC and Rural Health care Crisis (00:00:14)
    Overview of DPC, recent policy changes, and the episode’s focus on rural health care and DPC.

    Dr. Lee Gross’s Background and Early Practice Challenges (00:00:52) Dr. Gross describes his medical background, move to Florida, and frustrations with traditional practice.

    Electronic Medical Records and Medicare Barriers (00:01:53) Early adoption of EMR, government regulations, and financial penalties from Medicare.

    Medicare Payment Cuts and Practice Sustainability (00:02:47) Struggles with declining reimbursements, attempts to find alternative revenue, and the unsustainable fee-for-service model.

    Epiphany: Transition to Direct Primary Care (00:03:47) Realization that insuring primary care is inefficient; inspiration to start a subscription-based DPC model.

    DPC Business Model Details (00:04:50) Explanation of DPC pricing, services, and the elimination of third-party billing.

    DPC in Rural Florida: Practice Viability (00:05:22) Challenges of rural practice, patient volume, and how DPC enables sustainability with fewer patients.

    DPC as a Rural Health care Solution (00:06:28) Discussion on why DPC fits rural areas and legislative efforts to promote it.

    Telemedicine vs. DPC in Rural Settings (00:07:09) Limitations of telemedicine alone and the value of continuity with a known primary care doctor.

    Cost Comparison: DPC vs. Federally Qualified Health Centers (00:08:57) Senate testimony on DPC’s cost-effectiveness and the administrative overhead of traditional models.

    Introduction of Rural DPC Physicians (00:10:18) Transition to interviews with three rural DPC physicians.

    Dr. Lee Gillum’s Background and DPC Journey (00:10:24) Dr. Gillum’s return to rural Tennessee, dissatisfaction with traditional practice, and switch to DPC.

    Impact of DPC on Rural Community (00:11:45) How DPC has improved access for uninsured and underserved patients in rural areas.

    DPC and Rural Practice Sustainability (00:12:33) Challenges for small practices, Medicaid/Medicare reimbursement, and how DPC enables survival.

    Dr. Nehemiah Weimar: DPC in Rural Indiana (00:13:35) Dr. Weimar’s pediatric DPC practice, local hospital closures, and the importance of time in patient care.

    Dr. Katie Worden Greer: DPC in Rural Oklahoma (00:15:19) Dr. Greer’s background, transition from tribal health to DPC, and building a practice in a small town.

    Medicare Opt-Out Dilemma for DPC Doctors (00:16:51) Explanation of Medicare opt-out rules and the catch-22 for rural DPC physicians needing supplemental income.

    Dr. Lee Gross on Medicare Opt-Out Policy (00:17:56) Gross discusses the risks and advocacy efforts to change Medicare opt-out requirements for DPC.

    Dr. Lee Gillum on Medicare Challenges (00:19:25) Gillum shares his hybrid practice, difficulties with Medicare, and the impact on patient care and finances.

    Administrative Burdens of Medicare (00:21:00) Discussion of data submission requirements, reduced payments, and the impact on small practices.

    Balancing DPC and Community Roles (00:23:14) How DPC allows flexibility for rural doctors to serve multiple community roles.

    DPC’s Role in Rebuilding Trust in Rural Health care (00:24:24) Importance of time and trust in rural communities, and how DPC addresses these needs.

    Advice for Starting DPC in Rural Areas (00:25:25) Dr. Greer encourages physicians to consider DPC in rural settings and explains patient acceptance.

    Future of Direct Care Model (00:26:31) Dr. Gross reflects on DPC’s growth, its challenges, and the hope it offers for younger physicians.

    Podcast Conclusion (00:28:40) Host wraps up the episode, summarizing the stories and mission of the podcast.
    30 min

About Physicians Taking Back Medicine

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Physicians Taking Back Medicine is a new podcast from Medical Economics. Hosted by Dr. Rebekah Bernard, each episode dives into the real-world challenges facing today’s doctors: MOC, scope of…

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