At some point in your career, you have to decide who you’re going to be when things are uncomfortable. 

In this episode of Productly Speaking, returning guest Reese Gifford joins Karl Abbott to talk about authenticity and humility, not as polished leadership traits, but as choices made under pressure. The kind that cost you something in the moment and only make sense later. 

Reese reflects on entering tech in the late 90s as a young woman with no roadmap, learning early that preparation wasn’t about impressing people. It was about survival. She shares what it felt like to be underestimated in public, to carry the weight of always being “ready,” and to unlearn the belief that strength means having it all together. 

They dig into the moments product leaders know well but rarely talk about. The pause before responding when someone comes at you hard. The risk of saying “I don’t know” in a room that expects certainty. The quiet judgment call between speaking up and staying silent, and how either choice will be interpreted. 

This conversation isn’t about getting it right. It’s about keeping your integrity when the incentives pull you in other directions. About doing your homework, telling the truth kindly, and choosing honesty even when it complicates things. 

If you’ve ever wondered whether being thoughtful is read as weakness, or whether slowing down might actually move things forward, this episode will feel uncomfortably familiar in the best possible way. 

Quotable Moments 

• “You’re affecting people in ways you’ll never fully understand.” 
• “Being kind doesn’t mean avoiding hard conversations. It means protecting people’s dignity while having them.” 
• “You don’t have to prove your worth by carrying things silently. Your voice is part of your strength.” 

About the Guest 

Reese Gifford is a product and technology leader with a career spanning cloud, security, open source, and global platforms. She has led work at the intersection of innovation and real-world impact, and brings a deeply human perspective shaped by decades of learning, unlearning, and showing up with care. 

Resources Mentioned 

• The Wandering Inn by pirateaba 
• https://wanderinginn.com 
• Outfox: The Becoming of Slate Stormheart by Reese Gifford and her son 
• Mentioned in the episode as Reese’s debut science fiction novel co-authored with her son. Availability discussed verbally on the show. 

Call to Action 

If this episode felt familiar in that quiet, uncomfortable way, you’re not alone. Share it with someone who’s trying to do good work without losing themselves in the process. Subscribe wherever you listen, and pass it along the old-fashioned way. Real stories still travel best by word of mouth. 

What if the moment everything tilts sideways at work could actually make you better at your job? In this episode, Rick Lewis sits down to talk about the messy middle of change, the kind that knocks the wind out of a team long before it becomes one of those polished “growth stories.” 

Rick brings stories from big reorganizations, mergers that paired frenemies into one team, and the kind of customer feedback loops that only surface after months of digging. He talks about the small, painfully human moments that happen when people cling to the old way because it feels safer, and the surprising clarity that shows up once you stop trying to control what can’t be controlled. 

There is a moment in this conversation where Rick describes two teams who once competed against each other suddenly being told they’re on the same side. The awkwardness, the reluctance, the gradual warmth that followed. If you've ever walked into a room where no one quite trusts the situation yet, this one will land close to home. 

And then there’s his simple, grounding ritual: stepping outside, clearing his head, and coming back to the problem with a little less fear and a lot more perspective. It’s the kind of habit product people rarely talk about but quietly rely on. 

This episode is for anyone who has ever looked at change and thought, “I know this is supposed to make sense eventually… but right now it just feels like loss.” 

Quotable Moments 

• “Change isn’t something you lose. It’s something you learn how to move through.” 
• “Data is gold dust. Reducing uncertainty is the whole job.” 
• “Once you get past that initial fear, the whole team shifts into a different gear.” 

About the Guest 

Rick Lewis is a product leader who has navigated startups, acquisitions, global teams and more than his share of thorny restructures. Formerly VP of Commercial Products at Element, he now works on AI solutions at Element Materials Technology. He brings a calm, grounded way of working that only comes from years spent facing ambiguity head on. 

Call to Action 

If Rick’s stories helped you feel a little less alone in the chaos of product work, stick around. Subscribe, share the episode with someone who’s grappling with change of their own, or reach out if you’ve got a story that deserves some daylight. Product work is rarely tidy, but it goes down easier when we learn from each other. 

Ever had one of those weeks where the roadmap is bursting at the seams, everyone wants one more thing, and you can practically feel your balance slipping through your fingers? This conversation with Katie Tamblin goes right into that moment. 

Katie shares the kind of stories product people don’t usually admit out loud. There’s the time she walked into a team with seventy‑two product “priorities” taped around the room like a horror‑movie timeline and had to help the organization face the truth about impossibility. And the moment she realized she was about to pass along the very harm she was receiving from an overwhelmed manager and had to ask herself, “What kind of leader do I want to be?” 

What follows is an honest, funny, and surprisingly comforting look at how balance, empathy, humor, and human limits shape the work we do. Katie talks openly about burnout, unreasonable expectations, why saying no is an act of care, and how creativity survives only when we give ourselves actual space to think. 

If you’ve ever felt stretched thin or stuck between competing demands, this one might feel a little too real in the best possible way. 

Quotable Moments 

• “Stressed‑out, burned‑out people in back‑to‑back meetings all day do not have aha moments.” 
• “You can’t compare a release candidate to the car you drive off the lot. You compare it to the first prototype that probably didn’t even start.” 
• “Once a team learns to expect failure, you’ve lost the project. Getting that horse back in the stable is nearly impossible.” 

About the Guest 

Katie Tamblin is a seasoned data and software advisor with more than twenty years leading product, data science, technology, and marketing teams. She’s also the author of The Lean-Agile Dilemma and someone who has lived through more than a few “how did we get here” product moments. 

Call to Action 

If this episode made you feel a little more normal in the chaos of product work, you’re in good company. Subscribe, share it with a teammate who’s quietly drowning under too many priorities, or pass it along to the person who needs to hear that saying no is not a moral failing. Real product stories travel best person to person, usually over a much‑needed cup of coffee. 

Resources Mentioned 

• Dr. Todd Rose – Collective Illusions 
• Mentioned in Katie’s discussion about conformity, belonging, and self‑silencing. 
• Collective Illusions — Todd Rose
• Katie Tamblin’s book – The Lean-Agile Dilemma 
• Discussed in relation to balance, team culture, and the difficulty of saying no. 
• Katie Tamblin | Lean-Agile Dilemma

Ever wonder how a punk‑rock kid hauling amps through Midwest basements ends up helping steer one of the world’s most widely used pieces of enterprise software? 

Yeah… us too. 

In this episode, Scott McCarty invites us into the winding, deeply human story behind his career — a life that didn’t unfold in straight lines so much as heartfelt pivots. 

Scott shares what it felt like when the band he’d poured his whole identity into began losing steam and what it meant to walk away from a dream with no backup plan except “maybe I should get a computer job.” He talks about the moment he first saw a command execute on a remote machine, a tiny spark of wonder that would eventually pull him into NASA, startups, and finally product management. 

Along the way we explore the late‑in‑life discovery that helped him make sense of all those turns, the surprising lessons buried in punk‑rock logistics, and the hard‑won understanding that you don’t need to be a superhero to make a difference. Sometimes your 3 percent of influence is enough. 

This is an episode about reinvention, humility, agency, and finding meaning in the mess. 

A warm, honest conversation for anyone who’s ever looked at their path and thought: 

“How did I end up here… and does it all matter?” 

 Spoiler: it does. And Scott tells us why. 

Quotable Moments 

• “A song is a product led growth thing. You can’t really force somebody to listen to it.” 
• “You might only have control over three percent of the problem, but if that three percent is impactful, then do it.” 
• “There’s not really a way to hack your way to better. You just learn what you learn.” 

About the Guest 

Scott McCarty is the Global Senior Principal Product Manager for Red Hat Enterprise Linux. His path from punk‑rock basements to enterprise software leadership is shaped by curiosity, resilience, and a willingness to step into the unknown. After roles in sysadmin work, NASA, startups, sales, and product marketing, he found his home in product management, where he helps guide one of the most widely used Linux platforms in the world. 

Call to Action 

If Scott’s story rings true to your own winding journey in product work, share this episode with someone who might need that same bit of encouragement today. Subscribe and leave a quick review so more real product stories can find the people who need them. And if you’ve got a messy path or hard‑earned lesson of your own, reach out. Productly Speaking is where stories like yours finally get their space. 

Resources Mentioned 

• Ikigai (concept overview) 
• https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ikigai  
• Red Hat Enterprise Linux (product page) 
• https://www.redhat.com/en/technologies/linux-platforms/enterprise-linux  
• Podman (official site) 
• https://podman.io/  
• Podman Desktop (official site) 
• https://podman-desktop.io/  
• CNCF project listing for Podman Desktop 
• https://www.cncf.io/projects/podman-desktop/  
• NASA (homepage) 
• https://www.nasa.gov/  
• American Greetings 
• https://www.americangreetings.com/  
• Telnet (protocol overview) 
• https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telnet  
• The Power of the Powerless by Václav Havel (StoryGraph) 
• https://app.thestorygraph.com/books/4a76f11a-8ad8-4f9e-976c-3e5e28d1766d  
• Scott’s writing 
• Educated Confusion: http://educatedconfusion.com/  
• Crunchtools: https://crunchtools.com/about/  
• Red Bull Rampage (event page) 
• https://www.redbull.com/int-en/events/red-bull-rampage  

Product management gets talked about like it’s all clarity, confidence, and momentum. But most of the time, it’s not.

Season 5 of Productly Speaking explores the human side of product work — authenticity, balance, uncertainty, and values.

These are conversations about what product management actually feels like when things are unclear, when the roadmap breaks, or when the rules everyone repeats stop making sense.

This season features conversations with Scott McCarty, Katie Tamblin, and Rick Lewis, and closes with a conversation about values, integrity, and authenticity in leadership with Reese Gifford.

I slowed the show down this season, reworking the sound and flow to make space for more honest, reflective conversations, the kind you usually only have after the meeting ends.

No frameworks.

No polished PM stories.

Just real people talking about what actually happened and what it taught them.

Season 5 launches April 14th, with new episodes released weekly.

AI is supposed to feel magical. So why does it so often leave product teams confused, overpromised, or quietly disappointed?

In this episode, Karl sits down with Dina Atia, a PM working on AI products at Microsoft, to talk about what it is actually like to build in the middle of the hype. Dina shares candid stories from the trenches, like watching teams chase “cool” AI ideas that never quite map to real human needs, and the moment she realized AI was not a mysterious genius but also definitely not “just matrix math,” either.

Along the way, she tells a surprisingly relatable story about learning to solve a Rubik’s Cube, and why that experience changed how she thinks about intelligence, perception, and expectation‑setting with stakeholders. They also dig into the emotional side of AI adoption, including the fear of being made redundant, the discomfort around privacy and environmental impact, and the quiet tension PMs feel when bold visions collide with very incremental progress.

This is a grounded, honest conversation about hype, disillusionment, and what it takes to keep building thoughtfully when everyone else wants miracles. If you have ever felt caught between excitement and skepticism, or responsible for translating big promises into something real, this one will hit close to home.

Productly Speaking: where product management gets real.

Key Quotes: 

• “Not understanding the problem is a huge one… especially in the AI space.” 
• “AI isn’t thinking. It’s predicting the next word.” 
• “Bring back engineers being lazy! What is the minimum we can do to solve this problem?” 
• “Nobody achieves anything significant alone.” 

Resources & References: 

• Gartner Hype Cycle: https://www.gartner.com/en/research/methodologies/gartner-hype-cycle  
• Freytag’s Pyramid: https://writers.com/freytags-pyramid  
• Tools mentioned:  
• GitHub Copilot: https://github.com/features/copilot  
• Lovable: https://lovable.dev/  
• V0: https://v0.app/  
• Cursor: https://cursor.com/  

Connect with Dina Atia: 

https://www.linkedin.com/in/dinaatia/  

What if the thing you are closest to is actually what is blinding you?

In this episode, Karl talks with Jake Bowen-Bate about the quiet, human challenges of building products in fast‑moving environments. Jake shares what it really feels like to work in places where you are building the plane, flying it, and still figuring out how the controls work, all while knowing the money might literally run out if you get it wrong. The pressure is real, the workload never quite matches the capacity, and the fear hums in the background more often than anyone likes to admit.

They also dig into a surprisingly emotional story about “dogfooding” your own product. Jake reflects on the moment he stepped away from a product he had lived inside for years and started using the market leader instead. What he discovered was uncomfortable, eye‑opening, and deeply human. Features he once dismissed as nice to have suddenly became things he felt he could not live without. It forced him to confront how easy it is to lose empathy when familiarity turns into tunnel vision.

This conversation is about curiosity, humility, and the emotional attachments users form that never show up neatly in a backlog. If you have ever felt stretched too thin, questioned your own assumptions, or realized a little too late that users care about things you overlooked, this episode will feel uncomfortably familiar, in the best possible way.

Key Quotes 

• “We as product managers… should probably be trying to use where we can our own products that we're building… But when I started using our biggest competitor… I suddenly realized a lot of things that I had probably just missed.” 
• “When they spoke to me about features, it was very easy for me to dismiss those as nice-to-haves… When actually, I quickly realized once I started using them that I got a very strong emotional attachment to them.” 
• “If the decision is made, communicated, and explained, it can be a pretty mediocre decision because it’s still better than a decision that hasn’t been made, communicated, or explained.” 

Resources Mentioned 

• Inspired — Marty Cagan (https://app.thestorygraph.com/books/dec05575-b75f-4127-b00f-0b44af6f1724) 
• Crossing the Chasm — Geoffrey Moore (https://app.thestorygraph.com/books/db6bfb5d-0747-4576-a487-47989e928167)  
• Jake’s website: https://jakebowen-bate.co.uk/  
• Jake on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jakebowenbate/  

What happens when all the advice you followed turns out to be wrong for the job in front of you?

In this episode, Karl talks with Katie Tamblin about the lived reality of building products inside what she calls “chunky corporates” and why so many well‑intentioned product efforts quietly fall apart there. Katie shares hard‑earned stories from decades inside large organizations, including the moment she realized that everything she knew about building new products simply did not apply to replacing systems that people depended on every single day.

She tells a vivid replatforming horror story where a team got all the way to the brink of launch, only to discover that almost none of the real data actually worked in the new system. What followed was not a quick fix, but an 18‑month delay, a lot of stress, and some very uncomfortable conversations. Along the way, she explains why customers will never happily “move into a tent” while you rebuild their house, no matter how optimistic the plan sounded on a slide.

This is an honest, empathetic conversation about pressure, misalignment, investor expectations, and the emotional toll of trying to modernize systems without breaking trust. If you have ever felt stuck between how product work is supposed to look and how it actually feels inside a big organization, this episode will make you feel very seen.

Featured Quote: 

"Lean and Agile were designed for building software for the first time that no one’s using yet. Chunky corporates are managing decades of existing products and data—that’s a completely different beast." – Katie Tamblin 

What You’ll Learn in This Episode: 

• Why lean and agile principles break down in large organizations 
• The MVP myth in replatforming (and Katie’s “tent in the garden” analogy) 
• How data migration becomes the biggest gremlin in product transformations 
• The illusion of agility and why sprints don’t guarantee success 
• Practical advice for PMs in startups vs. complex enterprises 

Resources & Links: 

• Katie’s Book: The Lean Agile Dilemma (https://link.springer.com/book/10.1007/979-8-8688-0321-5) 
• Katie’s Website: www.katietamblin.com 
• Subscribe to Productly Speaking: www.productlyspeaking.com 

 Have you ever realized a mistake only after you hit send?

In this episode, Karl sits down with Lee Fischman to talk about the very human side of product work, the part that rarely makes it into neat success stories. Lee shares lessons shaped by decades of building products across wildly different industries, including the hard-earned habit of letting every message sit before responding. Not because it sounds wise, but because he learned the consequences the painful way, more than once.

They also revisit a moment when a product seemed completely dead on arrival. While working on an internal chatbot platform with almost zero adoption, Lee chose an uncomfortable path and reshaped how the product showed up for its users. That shift did not come from clever ideas, but from paying attention to how people actually worked and what they needed help with, even when it conflicted with how the product was “supposed” to be used.

Along the way, the conversation touches on humility, messy communication, navigating difficult personalities, and why product management is ultimately about people, not artifacts. If you have ever felt the weight of unclear expectations, second-guessed a decision after making it, or wondered how much of this job is really about human relationships, this episode will feel like a knowing nod rather than a lecture.

Key Quotes: 

• “A product manager’s job is to move her product forward to best serve the interests of its users and the business. Inside the organization, she represents the product.” 
• “You don’t get paid to manage chaos. You get paid for the skills you bring while facing a chaotic situation.” 
• “Product management is about people—the people who use your product, the folks you work with, the men and women you report to. If you want to excel, double down on all the ways you work with and value people.” 
• “You can build your own market, but then some advancement’s going to come in where all of a sudden that’s no longer a need what you service. If you don’t stay ahead and reinvent yourself over and over, you find yourself in a bad spot.” 

Resources & Links: 

• Lee Fischman on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lee-fischman/  
• Lee’s Book: How to Excel at Digital Product Management (https://www.amazon.com/Excel-Digital-Product-Management-comprehensive/dp/B0DPVNX178/) 
• Lee’s Medium: https://medium.com/@lee.fischman  

Welcome to Season 4 of Productly Speaking! In this short kickoff episode, host Karl Abbott introduces the theme for the season:

Why do products fail and what can we learn from those failures?

We’ll explore the hidden risks, organizational dynamics, and human factors that shape product success or lead to disaster.

If you’re a product manager, founder, or anyone building products, this season will challenge your assumptions and help you think differently about success and failure! Subscribe so that you don't miss an episode!