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Raising Sons with ADHD: Challenges, Triumphs, and Support Systems
In a recent episode of the Dad & Daughter Connection podcast, host Dr. Christopher Lewis was joined by Daniel Vozenilek, a seasoned stay-at-home dad, and Dr. Norrine Russell of Russell Coaching, to discuss the intricacies of parenting children with ADHD. The conversation delved into personal experiences, parenting strategies, and resources aimed at helping fathers navigate the complexities of raising children with ADHD.
Meet the Guests
Daniel Vozenilek has spent 22 years as a stay-at-home dad, raising his two children, Mason and his daughter. Mason's ADHD has presented unique challenges that Daniel has adeptly managed. In a parallel journey, Daniel himself was diagnosed with ADHD in adulthood, offering him a deeper understanding of his son's experiences. Dr. Norrine Russell, an expert in ADHD coaching, provided valuable insights into improving family dynamics and fostering better connections.
Understanding ADHD and Its Impact on Families
ADHD significantly affects family dynamics, often causing disconnection between fathers and their children. Dr. Russell explained that fathers might misinterpret ADHD behaviors as laziness or lack of motivation. She emphasized the importance of understanding ADHD to mitigate conflict and foster stronger relationships. The discussion highlighted the disparity in fathers’ experiences when parenting sons versus daughters with ADHD, noting that power struggles are more prevalent with sons.
Creating a Supportive Environment
Daniel Vozenilek has taken his experience to create "A Dad's Guide," a resource aimed at supporting fathers parenting children with ADHD. The guide encourages a non-authoritative, supportive parenting approach, offering an authentic space for fathers to share experiences and seek advice. To further support his mission, Daniel has launched a community initiative, including a podcast and Facebook group dedicated to discussing ADHD basics, neurodiversity, brain functioning, and father-son dynamics.
Challenges and Empathy in Parenting
One of the key takeaways from the episode is the importance of empathy in parenting. Daniel shared his journey of initially struggling to understand his son's learning style and interests. Over time, he recognized Mason’s passion for automobiles, which led to a fulfilling career path. This journey emphasized the need to prioritize each child’s interests and needs, be it a neurotypical child or one with ADHD.
Building Resources and Community
Dr. Norrine Russell and Daniel Vozenilek discussed the necessity of creating resources for dads raising sons with ADHD. Russell Coaching offers coaching services for kids with ADHD, autism, and anxiety, helping families address executive functioning struggles. The podcast and Facebook group initiated by Daniel aim to provide a supportive community where fathers can discuss and receive guidance on challenges such as peer pressure, driving, post-high school planning, and financial management.
This insightful episode of the Dad & Daughter Connection underscores the continuous learning process involved in parenting. The conversation between Dr. Lewis, Daniel Vozenilek, and Dr. Norrine Russell provides a roadmap for fathers navigating the unique challenges of raising children with ADHD, emphasizing understanding, empathy, and the importance of community support.
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TRANSCRIPT
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]: Welcome back to The Dad & Daughter Connection podcast where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughters' lives, raising them to be strong, independent women. Really excited to have you back again this week. You know, every week, I love being able to sit down, talk to you, work with you as we are going on this journey together. And I call it a journey because it really is a journey. You know, my I've told you before, my my daughters are in their teenage years, in their twenties. So my experience is going to be different than your experience, but that's okay because we're all learning along the way. And every day is a learning experience. You're going to trip.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:54]: You're going to fall. You're going to pick yourself up, and you're going to keep working hard to try to be that best dad that you want to be. And that's why this podcast is here. This podcast is here to help you to be able to learn some things, pick up some tools for that toolbox that you have and that you carry along with you on a day to day basis. And you're going to learn from from fathers, mothers. You're gonna learn from other resources that we provide you. And if you've never been here before, welcome. But if you've been here week after week, you know that.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:23]: And you know that we bring you different guests that are helping you in different ways. And today we've got 2 great individuals that are here to be able to talk with us about some other resources and parenting in general. Dan Vazanelik is with us today, and Dan is working on a guide called the dad's guide for boys with ADHD. We're gonna be talking about that. But then also with us is doctor Noreen Russell, and doctor Russell is with Russell Coaching. And, this project that Dan's working on is a part of that. So we're gonna be talking to both of them about some of their own experiences. We'll mostly be talking to Dan today, but Noreen will also kind of pop in and out based on our conversation, but I'm really excited to have both of them here today.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:10]: Dan, Noreen, thanks so much for being here today.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:02:12]: Noreen Thank you for having us. It's a real pleasure. Howard Bauchner
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:14]: It is my pleasure to have you here today. And I always start the podcast with an opportunity to kind of turn the clock back in time. And Dan, I know you're a father. You're a father of a son and a daughter. I would love to be able we're gonna focus a little bit on your daughter. We're gonna put that spotlight there, but then we're also gonna talk about what you're doing for fathers of sons too. But let's talk about your your daughter first. So, and I wanna turn the clock back in time.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:38]: So let's go back to the very beginning, the very first moment that you found out that you were going to be a father to a daughter. What was going through your head?
Daniel Vozenilek [00:02:44]: It was coming from an experience of having a son who was 7 at the time. And so we were just absolutely thrilled. To be frank, we had struggled for a while to decide whether or not we were gonna have another child, but we realized the importance of having our son having a sibling so that thinking way ahead, and not doom and gloom, but thinking way ahead down the road, that once we're gone, he should still have somebody, some built in family that he can lean on. And so when we made the decision to have another child and found out that it was a girl, we just were so blessed to know that not only was our mission gonna be fulfilled, but we were gonna be able to bring another beautiful life to this world. And it's been an amazing journey ever since. She's 15 now and almost 16. And I confused them, my wife, Tina, and my daughter, Kate. And I'm doing the name thing now where it's, I'm calling her Tina and back and forth.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:03:39]: And then I just said, whoever you are.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:41]: You're not alone in that. I have done that many times. And and then my daughters are like, don't you know our names? I'm like, yeah. I I do. I you know, it's just dad brain, and we'll we'll just leave it at that.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:03:53]: I think it comes from a place of love. Right? We just love them so much that it's just we forget. Let's use that.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:59]: You know, I talked to a lot of dads and dads with sons, they walk into it and they at least seem to think that they have some concept of what to expect because they have that common experience of being a man. And they think, oh, I can do this. You know, I've gone through growing up as a guy, as a boy, as a man. But when you put the concept of raising a daughter in front of a lot of guys, there's some fear. There's some fear that creeps in. As you think about raising your daughter, what was your biggest fear or is your biggest fear in raising a daughter?
Daniel Vozenilek [00:04:34]: Honestly, we can get into this later, but I struggled a bit with my son's ADHD. And so when our daughter was born, I was concerned that I was gonna be able to meet her emotional needs in the way that a father should show up for a daughter. And, I've just been enjoying the process from day 1. It's just a different experience. And I like to say that watching my daughter grow up and raising my daughter was a bit like getting to understand what it was like for my own wife to grow up as a young lady and all of the pressures and demands that are on her and expectations and to really try to fill in the gaps where necessary. Just making sure that she knew what what love felt like, what a strong father felt like, what a compassionate and empathetic father was like so that in the future and and this is something that I used to tell my son. You know, we're modeling what Kate will look for in a partner. So we need to make sure that we are attentive to our words, that we make sure that we're soft and welcoming, you know, those sorts of things.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:05:40]: So that was my biggest challenge. But Kate's just an amazing young woman. And I know a lot of parents say that about their kids, but Kate is something special. She is considerate and kind and lovely, and in a way has made me a better person and has made me wanna strive to be a more well rounded role model for her.
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:06:00]: I'm gonna chime in here for a second because I think there's something unique about Dan's story that may resonate with some of your listeners. So I too have a son and a daughter, and both of my kids are atypical. Both have autism and ADHD. Dan, I think and you can, of course, chime in here and clarify, Dan. But I think your experience of parenting Kate is in many ways shaped more by your experience of parenting Mason than some other parents might say if they had 2 neurotypical parents. You know, when we're raising sons and they're first in the birth order and and they present a lot of challenges. And, of course, we love them passionately about we're struggling with school, we're struggling with behavior at home. And when you have a second child or another child who is a little easier by comparison.
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:06:59]: I just really I wanna acknowledge the reality of that a little bit because we are surely not the only parents who have 2 kids where one just required more attention and more focus and created stress. Not because they wanted to or they were trying to, but just through the nature of how their brains were wired. And so I think one of the things that Dan and I have in common is that our daughters are the younger ones and we're getting kind of a fresh breath in terms of parenting. That's not quite so impacted by the challenges of ADHD or other neurodevelopmental disorders. So that's an important thing to note here because we know that about 10% of kids who have ADHD, 10% of kids have ADHD, roughly speaking, 5 to 12%. And so that's our niche. That's our community of people that we're really wanting to reach out to and help.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:58]: One of the things that I guess that I would ask on that, Dan, is the fact that so there was quite an age gap between your son and your daughter. You were dealing with your son's ADHD and figuring that out as you went along about how do you support your son. You have a baby at home, and that child is gonna be pulling the time of you and your wife. So and I'm sure that that was probably not the easiest if your son wanted your attention as well. So talk to me a little bit about some of the manifestations that you had to not only work through, but also I guess some of the things that you had to work with your son on, especially in introducing that new life into the family dynamic while also dealing with the ADHD aspects of his personality that I'm sure may have been challenging at times.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:08:51]: Oh, for sure. And to add, I have been a stay at home dad for 22 years now. So I was the primary caregiver in the home. And it was easy for us to introduce Kaden to the family because Mason was so excited to have a sister, and the 2 of them have been inseparables ever since day 1. And the challenge of a d that ADHD brought as Mason moved through middle school was the times when he was at school were the times where Kate and I could do all of our amazing bonding and our connection and just spending all that time together. And when Mason would come home from school, things were really challenging. So Kate would have to kind of take a back seat while I dealt with the after school routine of getting Mason settled, getting him engaged in his homework, and trying to navigate all of that while planning for my wife to come home, have the meals, the typical stay at home parent. But I just found that the balance of the 2 was really unique because Mason's demands were very much focused on task accomplishments and that strong male role model of you need to get this done.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:09:54]: And being a father with ADHD as well, you know, that kind of complicated things too. Now, when it came to Kate, just again, the softness and the ability to relax into our our parent child role and almost develop into a friendship in a way, really softened the difficulty that I was having with Mason. And in turn too, Mason could also rely on his sister as she got older to kinda soften the mood and remind him to show up a young man should for his family.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:24]: So talk to me about you you mentioned being a father with ADHD. I found out at an older age that I had ADHD. I probably should have known when and my parents were not surprised when I told them that that I had been diagnosed with ADHD at an older age. But talk to me about how being an ADHD dad has impacted you in your interactions, not only with your wife, but with your kids and how you've had to compensate in that regard as well, especially working now with your son that has ADHD too.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:10:53]: I also was diagnosed when I was a little bit older. And the story is is when Mason started first Curator, approximately, we started to get those notes home and the indications were there. So we had him tested. And by 3rd grade, he saw, medication for ADHD. He had been seen by a doctor and we started that. What it did for me was sort of reminded me, like, wait a minute. What I was seeing in him, the struggles and challenges with his attention and task initiation and organization, especially as he moved up in through middle school, it it made me realize, well, wait a minute. I remember never feeling like I was on the same page as my classmates, always feeling behind and distracted and sort of, you know, cutting up in class, and I'd be be labeled the attention seeker.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:11:38]: So when my son was struggling, it resonated with me in a very deep way, like, almost from a place of fear that I had to make sure that he didn't struggle the way that I did. And, so at about 35, I was diagnosed as well. So funny enough, when you mentioned how my wife's dealt with my ADHD, I don't know how she's put up with me all these years. We met in 1993 so we're celebrating some anniversaries this year And it's just been an amazing journey but quite frankly the number of times she has had to repeat herself or repeat the reminders I think she just just got used to it and figured well, this is just who he is So there were some challenges there then when you put in the fact that you have 2 men in the house that are both strong minded both with adhd and sometimes dysregulated, it was, it was a real challenge for her. And my heart is with her because she absolutely did an amazing job as a role of the soft landing zone for Mason. And the comfort for me when I was struggling with the feeling of, am I being a good father? Am I doing what what God has asked me to do? Am I, am, am I showing up in the way that I should? And in those times when I would get it wrong, I would just take it so personally and internally and say, oh gosh, I'm screwing this young man up and it's already gonna be hard enough. So Tina was there for me and for Mason to make sure that we understood that we were both loved and cared for, even though we were both struggling at that.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:10]: So I guess I wanna go into this service now that you're providing. A a dad's guide and the group that you're creating and the resource you're creating. And it seems like, I mean, from your own experience, from working with your son, I mean, you're putting, I'm gonna say the blood, sweat, and tears into bringing your own experience to light, but also trying to help others walk through that experience. So talk to me about, first, you're focusing on fathers and sons. What is it unique about that relationship that made you say, let's start with this population? And then what are some of the the big aspects? Talk to me about the program itself, the guide itself, and what you're trying to share with others to help them along that journey.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:13:56]: Okay. So the reason why we started this was going back a bit, doctor Russell actually helped us with Mason when he was at the end of 6th grade, 7th grade. That's how we got to know each other. And when Doctor. Russell reached out to me one day, we were talking about how fathers tend to feel very isolated when they are struggling with their what's going on in the home. And we decided that it would be a good idea to have a place for fathers to be authentic and be vulnerable and ask for advice. And especially being a father, again, father with ADHD, son with ADHD, and being a stay at home dad, I was just I felt like I had a lot to offer. I had a lot of information and experiences to share.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:14:40]: So we decided to start A Dad's Guide parenting sons with ADHD, which is a new venture for us. And it's we've been recording some podcasts starting with the basics of ADHD and neurodiversity, the brain and executive functioning, ADHD inheritance, these sorts of things, to give dads an idea of sort of the full picture of what it's like to be a child with ADHD, but then also to parent that son in a loving way. And not by a leadership style that is, demanding and authoritative, but in one that says, hey, I'm with you. I'm your wingman, which is how I feel about my son now. And we can go on this journey together. And it really encourages fathers to get educated, to find their tribe, find other men who are either struggling or have gone through this journey. I feel like even though our daughter is 15 and it really soon doesn't really need me very much anymore to drive her around, but we really feel like this is an opportunity to give dads a place to go where they can authentically seek advice when they're feeling the struggles that come along with being a father. We're expected to, at times, have all the answers, fix all of the problems.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:15:57]: And, honestly, that's not always a realistic expectations because dads are also vulnerable. Dads also need a certain amount of love and respect and consideration. Then we bring into the fact how we were raised, what our father's model was like, and mine was a bit flawed. So I had a lot of gaps to fill in and learned a bunch along the way. And, doctor Russa, do you wanna add?
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:16:20]: I think, you know, part of I just wanna add this little bit. You know, part of what I wanna say is that you have experienced, and I have seen over and over again in 100 of families, the disconnection that ADHD can create between fathers and their kids, sons or daughters, but quite painfully, sometimes, sons. And so while there's so many reasons for disconnection in the modern American family, I think that for us, because of our experiences and because of the practice and and what I've been doing for the last 16 years, We really wanted to focus on how to help dads better understand their sons with ADHD and decrease the conflict in the home and increase the connection.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:05]: I guess one question that I would have, and I don't know if you have the answer to this, and this is for either of you, is as you are working with dads with sons and you have a daughter yourself, Dan, I'd and it sounds like your daughter may not have ADHD. But I guess my question becomes, are either of you finding in working with individuals with ADHD that anything is specifically different in working with fathers with sons, fathers with daughters, or is it just understanding how to support your child when it comes to ADHD? Or are there specific nuances to understand in the gender dynamic that that fathers should understand? You know, if you have a child that is has ADHD, that's a daughter, some things are gonna manifest in a little bit different way. And you're gonna have to support them in a little bit different way.
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:17:53]: I don't wanna be overly gender stereotyped. Right? That's not what any of us are about these days. And so I wanna be sort of cautious about drawing generalizations. That being said, for those people who are having the lived experience of, as Dan said, you know, we had 2 men in the house, you know? And so I think some of the gender dynamics that come into play with fathers and sons when it comes to ADHD, first of all, there's just a tremendous lack of information and support for parents of kids with ADHD, which is shocking given how much public dialogue there is about ADHD and medication and over medication and over diagnosis. But when it comes to getting the basics when you get a diagnosis, we really don't do a great job of that in this country. And so one of the really important things is developing an understanding of what is ADHD, and then what is ADHD for your kid. Right? So whether son or daughter, you know, do they have something else? You know, do they have a learning disability? Do they have anxiety? Do they also have autism? I think in terms of the gender dynamics, there are some common ones. There's a lot of power struggles that I see between dads and sons and a lot of disconnection based on judgment.
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:19:12]: He's lazy. He's unmotivated. He doesn't care. He's gonna be a slacker. He has to learn. Well, if he's gonna fail, then, you know, he'll just have to learn from his failure. There's a lot of checking out on the part of dads when they feel frustrated. I think for dads of girls with ADHD, it's a little bit different.
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:19:33]: I don't think the frustration rises quite as quickly or to the point that it sometimes does with teen boys. And and sometimes I think that's because the nature of ADHD for some girls, some of the time, can be a little bit more inattentive or a little spacey. Now that is not true all the time. There are plenty of hyperactive girls, but I do think that there is a softness sometimes inherent to that relationship that leads to less conflict, less anger, less tension. And so that's, I think, part of what our mission is around a dad's guide parenting sons with ADHD is how do you better understand your son with ADHD so that level of frustration and then the subsequent kinda checking out can be decreased. And then it's just as important for girls to understand how, you know, their ADHD manifests. It's just that I think the conflict becomes a little bit less explosive. And sometimes if the co parent is a mom, I think there's still that dynamic there that can be really helpful for the daughter.
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:20:47]: And I don't think dad should check out during the teen years. But sometimes the struggle around school and grades and what parents see as being responsible, I think is just in my experience over the last 16 years, which is not everybody, just a little bit less volatile with girls.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:21:05]: That was my experience too. I I found that when Mason and I would have our conflicts, I was a different type of parent. And I almost expected him to know what to do and to follow the leader kind of a thing. And I not remembering what it was like when I was a young man myself and what I also struggled with. And a funny little story is when my wife and I were first dating, we we asked each other what we wanted to be when we grew up and had professional lives, and she had, well, I want stability, and I wanna climb the corporate ladder. I don't wanna move around a lot. I want a stable family. What would you like? And I said, I'd like to be a great dad.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:21:37]: And that was just on my radar from day 1. And our son now is 23. Kate and I were talking on the way to dropping her off to school this morning and how close they are and how much she deeply loves him and respects him as a man. We've launched him into adulthood. He makes amazing money as a service rider service adviser for Toyota and is independent on his own. And when he shows up, he lights up our lives. Just absolutely. Yeah.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:22:02]: So the the dynamic difference there is there is an endless amount of love for both kids. There is was a definite difference in the softness in how I treated Kate. Kate's neurotypical, so she is a planner. She was always with the notes and getting her stuff done. Her priorities were always do my work first, and then I have time to play. And, again, when I talked about she'll be 16 soon and won't need me, it's true. I mean, she's she's looking into colleges. She's talking about where her first job will be, where my son was just spending time looking at car videos and turbos and tuners.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:22:38]: And I here I was struggling with well, if you're spending all of your time over here doing these, just watching car repair videos, how are you ever going to get your geography going on? How are you ever gonna pass these plots? Forgetting the fact that this young man was spending his energy and his time in the field that resonated with him. So right out of high school, he knew he didn't wanna go to college. He wanted to go to trade school to be a mechanic, and the rest is history. As soon as the rubber hit the road for him, metaphorically, he took off and became his own man. And then our relationship really shifted to more of a support and advisor role. So today when my phone rings versus when he was a teenager and I would avoid the phone calls and wonder, oh gosh, what's what news is coming now? When the phone rings now or I see him at the door, all of our lives light up.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:28]: So talk to me about this community then that you're creating. I know it's a subscription model, and you're bringing these fathers together. So talk to me about, this group, what you're doing with this group, and what you're finding so far in the communication, the community, dynamics that you're developing, and what you're hoping to build in the future. Well,
Daniel Vozenilek [00:23:48]: this is again, this is a new initiative for us. So what we're hoping to build, again, is just a place for dads who are at whatever stage they're in in their parenting journey, when whether they have one son or 2 or even if they have son and a daughter with ADHD, that they can come to a place and find resources and books and other podcasts and videos to help them along in their journey to give them hope. Coming back to how I felt a bit lost and a bit hopeless and a bit isolated from my friends, I didn't realize it was through doctor Russell's great advice to go find our tribe. We needed to find our community. And the more we talked to other parents who were also struggling, the more we realize we actually weren't alone. And so that's part of the void that we wanted to also fill.
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:24:35]: And there's nothing out there like this specifically for dads raising sons with ADHD. So the best introduction to our group is at Russell Coaching, and you'll see that you can click on the link for a dad's guide. And our hope really is to do a lot of what you're doing, you know, provide support and information for dads, not as broadly as you're doing, but for a specific niche audience of dads. So we're building a library of podcasts talking about how to create connection with your son with ADHD. We're talking about, on the podcast, how to understand neurodiversity. We're talking about navigating the marriage or any kind of significant other when it comes to raising sons with ADHD. So we're building a a library of podcasts that Dan and I started a few months ago. And then there's a Facebook page also for dads where we're just inviting them to share their experiences and and to get support.
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:25:37]: So that's where we're at so far, podcasts and a Facebook group.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:25:41]: And we'll be covering all those difficult topics that are coming up for fathers who have sons in middle school now, but then we're gonna be talking about the common trappings of what our sons are gonna be engaged with, whether it be avoiding the peer pressure of smoking and vaping. What about driving? What happens after high school? How to plan and talk to your son about that. And finances. I mean, my gosh, how many struggles did we have with Mason about saving and conserving money and the importance of not only getting a job, keeping a job, showing off, but then what do you do with those very precious dollars? So that as he was transitioned into adulthood, he could support himself and not continue to rely on mom and dad to solve the problems.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:21]: Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood 5 where we ask you 5 more questions to delve deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready? I'm ready. In one word, what is fatherhood?
Daniel Vozenilek [00:26:32]: Selflessness.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:33]: Now when was the time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father to a daughter?
Daniel Vozenilek [00:26:39]: That's a good one. And I know this answer because I'm I just see it. We'll get emotional here. I opened up on my laptop one day and without if I open my laptop, it may challenge our Zoom here. But, basically, it was a a note to me saying how grateful she is that God put her mom and dad into her life and that she considers us her best friends. Now my daughter has an amazing my daughter is a connector. She has an amazing circle of friends at the ice skating rink from her middle school. Even from her summer camp, she has a pen pal.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:27:12]: I mean, she is just an absolute connector. And I know the quality of the kids that she surrounds herself with and the ones that come to her. And for her to say that we are her best friends coming from her, I knew I had arrived with her. And I have to say that was probably around the 7th grade, 7th or 8th grade. So she's amazing.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:33]: Well, now I'm gonna ask you about your kids. So if I were to talk to you, both your kids, how would they describe you as a dad?
Daniel Vozenilek [00:27:39]: He's a great man. I overheard my son. We went to a motorcycle meet 1 night together, and I happened to walk a few steps away from him to talk to one of his coworkers and introduce myself. And I overheard another one of his friends say, wow. Your your dad's really he's really, really big pool. And he said, yeah. He's a really great man. And he didn't realize that I could hear him, and I could tell in his voice that he was sincere.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:28:02]: And it just choked me up because I never talked about my father like that. And to hear my own son admire and love me in that way, I knew that, we had a bond that was not gonna be broken.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:13]: Who inspires you to be a better dad?
Daniel Vozenilek [00:28:15]: Both my kids. Yeah. A 100%. I see in them the I see in them the future. I see and I'm not pushing them for grandchildren, but I cannot wait to do this all over again in a deeper and even more meaningful way that will leave a legacy and a lasting impression. And I do believe that we were put here to make better versions of ourselves. And I cannot wait to see what comes in round 2.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:41]: Now you've given some of your own experience today. You've shared some of the things that have worked for you and some of the things that you're sharing with other dads. As you think of other dads, whether they're raising sons, daughters, etcetera, what's one piece of advice you'd wanna give to every dad?
Daniel Vozenilek [00:28:59]: Learn empathy. Learn what the real deep meaning of empathy is because we're not often taught empathy in the home unless our parents are, have an amazing relationship, a lot of communication, a lot of support that the kids can see when there's a struggle and how the parents come together to fix it and resolve it, lifting everybody up. The number one piece of advice, learn empathy. And through that, you can connect with most everybody, especially your kids. And when you understand that we are not perfect, we were not meant to be perfect. We were all meant to walk and support each other in this journey. I think that it all starts with empathy.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:39]: Now we've been talking about the program that is just starting with Russell Coaching, with your dad's your dad's group. Talk to me about if people wanna find out more about coaching, about the group, where should they go?
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:29:53]: The easiest thing to do is to go to Russell coaching dot com, or just Google Russell coaching, and it'll come up. And you can learn about our coaching services for kids with ADHD, autism, and anxiety. And we provide those services across the country. So it doesn't matter where you're at and basically help with all the things that kids who struggle with executive functioning struggle with, time management, goal settings, starting tasks, finishing tasks, and particularly as it relates to school. And then also on Russell Coaching.com, you can click on a dad's guide and check out our group and hopefully join our group and be part of what Dan is creating and I'm supporting. And we can make a difference in the lives of families everywhere.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:38]: Well, Noreen, Dan, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for both being here for the work that you're doing to help fathers and sons, and especially in this specific niche of helping them to connect and to be able to build those strong bonds. Definitely, we'll be putting links in our notes today with all of that information, and I wish you both the best.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:30:58]: Thank you so much. We appreciate you.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:59]: We're all in the same boat And it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time. We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents and bring your a game. Because those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast. Calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters and musclemen, get out and be the world to them.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:32:44]: You're the best dad you can be. You're the best dad you can be.
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In a recent episode of the Dad & Daughter Connection podcast, host Dr. Christopher Lewis was joined by Daniel Vozenilek, a seasoned stay-at-home dad, and Dr. Norrine Russell of Russell Coaching, to discuss the intricacies of parenting children with ADHD. The conversation delved into personal experiences, parenting strategies, and resources aimed at helping fathers navigate the complexities of raising children with ADHD.
Meet the Guests
Daniel Vozenilek has spent 22 years as a stay-at-home dad, raising his two children, Mason and his daughter. Mason's ADHD has presented unique challenges that Daniel has adeptly managed. In a parallel journey, Daniel himself was diagnosed with ADHD in adulthood, offering him a deeper understanding of his son's experiences. Dr. Norrine Russell, an expert in ADHD coaching, provided valuable insights into improving family dynamics and fostering better connections.
Understanding ADHD and Its Impact on Families
ADHD significantly affects family dynamics, often causing disconnection between fathers and their children. Dr. Russell explained that fathers might misinterpret ADHD behaviors as laziness or lack of motivation. She emphasized the importance of understanding ADHD to mitigate conflict and foster stronger relationships. The discussion highlighted the disparity in fathers’ experiences when parenting sons versus daughters with ADHD, noting that power struggles are more prevalent with sons.
Creating a Supportive Environment
Daniel Vozenilek has taken his experience to create "A Dad's Guide," a resource aimed at supporting fathers parenting children with ADHD. The guide encourages a non-authoritative, supportive parenting approach, offering an authentic space for fathers to share experiences and seek advice. To further support his mission, Daniel has launched a community initiative, including a podcast and Facebook group dedicated to discussing ADHD basics, neurodiversity, brain functioning, and father-son dynamics.
Challenges and Empathy in Parenting
One of the key takeaways from the episode is the importance of empathy in parenting. Daniel shared his journey of initially struggling to understand his son's learning style and interests. Over time, he recognized Mason’s passion for automobiles, which led to a fulfilling career path. This journey emphasized the need to prioritize each child’s interests and needs, be it a neurotypical child or one with ADHD.
Building Resources and Community
Dr. Norrine Russell and Daniel Vozenilek discussed the necessity of creating resources for dads raising sons with ADHD. Russell Coaching offers coaching services for kids with ADHD, autism, and anxiety, helping families address executive functioning struggles. The podcast and Facebook group initiated by Daniel aim to provide a supportive community where fathers can discuss and receive guidance on challenges such as peer pressure, driving, post-high school planning, and financial management.
This insightful episode of the Dad & Daughter Connection underscores the continuous learning process involved in parenting. The conversation between Dr. Lewis, Daniel Vozenilek, and Dr. Norrine Russell provides a roadmap for fathers navigating the unique challenges of raising children with ADHD, emphasizing understanding, empathy, and the importance of community support.
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TRANSCRIPT
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:16]: Welcome back to The Dad & Daughter Connection podcast where we bring you guests to be active participants in your daughters' lives, raising them to be strong, independent women. Really excited to have you back again this week. You know, every week, I love being able to sit down, talk to you, work with you as we are going on this journey together. And I call it a journey because it really is a journey. You know, my I've told you before, my my daughters are in their teenage years, in their twenties. So my experience is going to be different than your experience, but that's okay because we're all learning along the way. And every day is a learning experience. You're going to trip.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:54]: You're going to fall. You're going to pick yourself up, and you're going to keep working hard to try to be that best dad that you want to be. And that's why this podcast is here. This podcast is here to help you to be able to learn some things, pick up some tools for that toolbox that you have and that you carry along with you on a day to day basis. And you're going to learn from from fathers, mothers. You're gonna learn from other resources that we provide you. And if you've never been here before, welcome. But if you've been here week after week, you know that.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:23]: And you know that we bring you different guests that are helping you in different ways. And today we've got 2 great individuals that are here to be able to talk with us about some other resources and parenting in general. Dan Vazanelik is with us today, and Dan is working on a guide called the dad's guide for boys with ADHD. We're gonna be talking about that. But then also with us is doctor Noreen Russell, and doctor Russell is with Russell Coaching. And, this project that Dan's working on is a part of that. So we're gonna be talking to both of them about some of their own experiences. We'll mostly be talking to Dan today, but Noreen will also kind of pop in and out based on our conversation, but I'm really excited to have both of them here today.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:10]: Dan, Noreen, thanks so much for being here today.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:02:12]: Noreen Thank you for having us. It's a real pleasure. Howard Bauchner
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:14]: It is my pleasure to have you here today. And I always start the podcast with an opportunity to kind of turn the clock back in time. And Dan, I know you're a father. You're a father of a son and a daughter. I would love to be able we're gonna focus a little bit on your daughter. We're gonna put that spotlight there, but then we're also gonna talk about what you're doing for fathers of sons too. But let's talk about your your daughter first. So, and I wanna turn the clock back in time.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:38]: So let's go back to the very beginning, the very first moment that you found out that you were going to be a father to a daughter. What was going through your head?
Daniel Vozenilek [00:02:44]: It was coming from an experience of having a son who was 7 at the time. And so we were just absolutely thrilled. To be frank, we had struggled for a while to decide whether or not we were gonna have another child, but we realized the importance of having our son having a sibling so that thinking way ahead, and not doom and gloom, but thinking way ahead down the road, that once we're gone, he should still have somebody, some built in family that he can lean on. And so when we made the decision to have another child and found out that it was a girl, we just were so blessed to know that not only was our mission gonna be fulfilled, but we were gonna be able to bring another beautiful life to this world. And it's been an amazing journey ever since. She's 15 now and almost 16. And I confused them, my wife, Tina, and my daughter, Kate. And I'm doing the name thing now where it's, I'm calling her Tina and back and forth.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:03:39]: And then I just said, whoever you are.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:41]: You're not alone in that. I have done that many times. And and then my daughters are like, don't you know our names? I'm like, yeah. I I do. I you know, it's just dad brain, and we'll we'll just leave it at that.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:03:53]: I think it comes from a place of love. Right? We just love them so much that it's just we forget. Let's use that.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:59]: You know, I talked to a lot of dads and dads with sons, they walk into it and they at least seem to think that they have some concept of what to expect because they have that common experience of being a man. And they think, oh, I can do this. You know, I've gone through growing up as a guy, as a boy, as a man. But when you put the concept of raising a daughter in front of a lot of guys, there's some fear. There's some fear that creeps in. As you think about raising your daughter, what was your biggest fear or is your biggest fear in raising a daughter?
Daniel Vozenilek [00:04:34]: Honestly, we can get into this later, but I struggled a bit with my son's ADHD. And so when our daughter was born, I was concerned that I was gonna be able to meet her emotional needs in the way that a father should show up for a daughter. And, I've just been enjoying the process from day 1. It's just a different experience. And I like to say that watching my daughter grow up and raising my daughter was a bit like getting to understand what it was like for my own wife to grow up as a young lady and all of the pressures and demands that are on her and expectations and to really try to fill in the gaps where necessary. Just making sure that she knew what what love felt like, what a strong father felt like, what a compassionate and empathetic father was like so that in the future and and this is something that I used to tell my son. You know, we're modeling what Kate will look for in a partner. So we need to make sure that we are attentive to our words, that we make sure that we're soft and welcoming, you know, those sorts of things.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:05:40]: So that was my biggest challenge. But Kate's just an amazing young woman. And I know a lot of parents say that about their kids, but Kate is something special. She is considerate and kind and lovely, and in a way has made me a better person and has made me wanna strive to be a more well rounded role model for her.
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:06:00]: I'm gonna chime in here for a second because I think there's something unique about Dan's story that may resonate with some of your listeners. So I too have a son and a daughter, and both of my kids are atypical. Both have autism and ADHD. Dan, I think and you can, of course, chime in here and clarify, Dan. But I think your experience of parenting Kate is in many ways shaped more by your experience of parenting Mason than some other parents might say if they had 2 neurotypical parents. You know, when we're raising sons and they're first in the birth order and and they present a lot of challenges. And, of course, we love them passionately about we're struggling with school, we're struggling with behavior at home. And when you have a second child or another child who is a little easier by comparison.
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:06:59]: I just really I wanna acknowledge the reality of that a little bit because we are surely not the only parents who have 2 kids where one just required more attention and more focus and created stress. Not because they wanted to or they were trying to, but just through the nature of how their brains were wired. And so I think one of the things that Dan and I have in common is that our daughters are the younger ones and we're getting kind of a fresh breath in terms of parenting. That's not quite so impacted by the challenges of ADHD or other neurodevelopmental disorders. So that's an important thing to note here because we know that about 10% of kids who have ADHD, 10% of kids have ADHD, roughly speaking, 5 to 12%. And so that's our niche. That's our community of people that we're really wanting to reach out to and help.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:58]: One of the things that I guess that I would ask on that, Dan, is the fact that so there was quite an age gap between your son and your daughter. You were dealing with your son's ADHD and figuring that out as you went along about how do you support your son. You have a baby at home, and that child is gonna be pulling the time of you and your wife. So and I'm sure that that was probably not the easiest if your son wanted your attention as well. So talk to me a little bit about some of the manifestations that you had to not only work through, but also I guess some of the things that you had to work with your son on, especially in introducing that new life into the family dynamic while also dealing with the ADHD aspects of his personality that I'm sure may have been challenging at times.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:08:51]: Oh, for sure. And to add, I have been a stay at home dad for 22 years now. So I was the primary caregiver in the home. And it was easy for us to introduce Kaden to the family because Mason was so excited to have a sister, and the 2 of them have been inseparables ever since day 1. And the challenge of a d that ADHD brought as Mason moved through middle school was the times when he was at school were the times where Kate and I could do all of our amazing bonding and our connection and just spending all that time together. And when Mason would come home from school, things were really challenging. So Kate would have to kind of take a back seat while I dealt with the after school routine of getting Mason settled, getting him engaged in his homework, and trying to navigate all of that while planning for my wife to come home, have the meals, the typical stay at home parent. But I just found that the balance of the 2 was really unique because Mason's demands were very much focused on task accomplishments and that strong male role model of you need to get this done.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:09:54]: And being a father with ADHD as well, you know, that kind of complicated things too. Now, when it came to Kate, just again, the softness and the ability to relax into our our parent child role and almost develop into a friendship in a way, really softened the difficulty that I was having with Mason. And in turn too, Mason could also rely on his sister as she got older to kinda soften the mood and remind him to show up a young man should for his family.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:24]: So talk to me about you you mentioned being a father with ADHD. I found out at an older age that I had ADHD. I probably should have known when and my parents were not surprised when I told them that that I had been diagnosed with ADHD at an older age. But talk to me about how being an ADHD dad has impacted you in your interactions, not only with your wife, but with your kids and how you've had to compensate in that regard as well, especially working now with your son that has ADHD too.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:10:53]: I also was diagnosed when I was a little bit older. And the story is is when Mason started first Curator, approximately, we started to get those notes home and the indications were there. So we had him tested. And by 3rd grade, he saw, medication for ADHD. He had been seen by a doctor and we started that. What it did for me was sort of reminded me, like, wait a minute. What I was seeing in him, the struggles and challenges with his attention and task initiation and organization, especially as he moved up in through middle school, it it made me realize, well, wait a minute. I remember never feeling like I was on the same page as my classmates, always feeling behind and distracted and sort of, you know, cutting up in class, and I'd be be labeled the attention seeker.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:11:38]: So when my son was struggling, it resonated with me in a very deep way, like, almost from a place of fear that I had to make sure that he didn't struggle the way that I did. And, so at about 35, I was diagnosed as well. So funny enough, when you mentioned how my wife's dealt with my ADHD, I don't know how she's put up with me all these years. We met in 1993 so we're celebrating some anniversaries this year And it's just been an amazing journey but quite frankly the number of times she has had to repeat herself or repeat the reminders I think she just just got used to it and figured well, this is just who he is So there were some challenges there then when you put in the fact that you have 2 men in the house that are both strong minded both with adhd and sometimes dysregulated, it was, it was a real challenge for her. And my heart is with her because she absolutely did an amazing job as a role of the soft landing zone for Mason. And the comfort for me when I was struggling with the feeling of, am I being a good father? Am I doing what what God has asked me to do? Am I, am, am I showing up in the way that I should? And in those times when I would get it wrong, I would just take it so personally and internally and say, oh gosh, I'm screwing this young man up and it's already gonna be hard enough. So Tina was there for me and for Mason to make sure that we understood that we were both loved and cared for, even though we were both struggling at that.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:10]: So I guess I wanna go into this service now that you're providing. A a dad's guide and the group that you're creating and the resource you're creating. And it seems like, I mean, from your own experience, from working with your son, I mean, you're putting, I'm gonna say the blood, sweat, and tears into bringing your own experience to light, but also trying to help others walk through that experience. So talk to me about, first, you're focusing on fathers and sons. What is it unique about that relationship that made you say, let's start with this population? And then what are some of the the big aspects? Talk to me about the program itself, the guide itself, and what you're trying to share with others to help them along that journey.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:13:56]: Okay. So the reason why we started this was going back a bit, doctor Russell actually helped us with Mason when he was at the end of 6th grade, 7th grade. That's how we got to know each other. And when Doctor. Russell reached out to me one day, we were talking about how fathers tend to feel very isolated when they are struggling with their what's going on in the home. And we decided that it would be a good idea to have a place for fathers to be authentic and be vulnerable and ask for advice. And especially being a father, again, father with ADHD, son with ADHD, and being a stay at home dad, I was just I felt like I had a lot to offer. I had a lot of information and experiences to share.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:14:40]: So we decided to start A Dad's Guide parenting sons with ADHD, which is a new venture for us. And it's we've been recording some podcasts starting with the basics of ADHD and neurodiversity, the brain and executive functioning, ADHD inheritance, these sorts of things, to give dads an idea of sort of the full picture of what it's like to be a child with ADHD, but then also to parent that son in a loving way. And not by a leadership style that is, demanding and authoritative, but in one that says, hey, I'm with you. I'm your wingman, which is how I feel about my son now. And we can go on this journey together. And it really encourages fathers to get educated, to find their tribe, find other men who are either struggling or have gone through this journey. I feel like even though our daughter is 15 and it really soon doesn't really need me very much anymore to drive her around, but we really feel like this is an opportunity to give dads a place to go where they can authentically seek advice when they're feeling the struggles that come along with being a father. We're expected to, at times, have all the answers, fix all of the problems.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:15:57]: And, honestly, that's not always a realistic expectations because dads are also vulnerable. Dads also need a certain amount of love and respect and consideration. Then we bring into the fact how we were raised, what our father's model was like, and mine was a bit flawed. So I had a lot of gaps to fill in and learned a bunch along the way. And, doctor Russa, do you wanna add?
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:16:20]: I think, you know, part of I just wanna add this little bit. You know, part of what I wanna say is that you have experienced, and I have seen over and over again in 100 of families, the disconnection that ADHD can create between fathers and their kids, sons or daughters, but quite painfully, sometimes, sons. And so while there's so many reasons for disconnection in the modern American family, I think that for us, because of our experiences and because of the practice and and what I've been doing for the last 16 years, We really wanted to focus on how to help dads better understand their sons with ADHD and decrease the conflict in the home and increase the connection.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:05]: I guess one question that I would have, and I don't know if you have the answer to this, and this is for either of you, is as you are working with dads with sons and you have a daughter yourself, Dan, I'd and it sounds like your daughter may not have ADHD. But I guess my question becomes, are either of you finding in working with individuals with ADHD that anything is specifically different in working with fathers with sons, fathers with daughters, or is it just understanding how to support your child when it comes to ADHD? Or are there specific nuances to understand in the gender dynamic that that fathers should understand? You know, if you have a child that is has ADHD, that's a daughter, some things are gonna manifest in a little bit different way. And you're gonna have to support them in a little bit different way.
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:17:53]: I don't wanna be overly gender stereotyped. Right? That's not what any of us are about these days. And so I wanna be sort of cautious about drawing generalizations. That being said, for those people who are having the lived experience of, as Dan said, you know, we had 2 men in the house, you know? And so I think some of the gender dynamics that come into play with fathers and sons when it comes to ADHD, first of all, there's just a tremendous lack of information and support for parents of kids with ADHD, which is shocking given how much public dialogue there is about ADHD and medication and over medication and over diagnosis. But when it comes to getting the basics when you get a diagnosis, we really don't do a great job of that in this country. And so one of the really important things is developing an understanding of what is ADHD, and then what is ADHD for your kid. Right? So whether son or daughter, you know, do they have something else? You know, do they have a learning disability? Do they have anxiety? Do they also have autism? I think in terms of the gender dynamics, there are some common ones. There's a lot of power struggles that I see between dads and sons and a lot of disconnection based on judgment.
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:19:12]: He's lazy. He's unmotivated. He doesn't care. He's gonna be a slacker. He has to learn. Well, if he's gonna fail, then, you know, he'll just have to learn from his failure. There's a lot of checking out on the part of dads when they feel frustrated. I think for dads of girls with ADHD, it's a little bit different.
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:19:33]: I don't think the frustration rises quite as quickly or to the point that it sometimes does with teen boys. And and sometimes I think that's because the nature of ADHD for some girls, some of the time, can be a little bit more inattentive or a little spacey. Now that is not true all the time. There are plenty of hyperactive girls, but I do think that there is a softness sometimes inherent to that relationship that leads to less conflict, less anger, less tension. And so that's, I think, part of what our mission is around a dad's guide parenting sons with ADHD is how do you better understand your son with ADHD so that level of frustration and then the subsequent kinda checking out can be decreased. And then it's just as important for girls to understand how, you know, their ADHD manifests. It's just that I think the conflict becomes a little bit less explosive. And sometimes if the co parent is a mom, I think there's still that dynamic there that can be really helpful for the daughter.
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:20:47]: And I don't think dad should check out during the teen years. But sometimes the struggle around school and grades and what parents see as being responsible, I think is just in my experience over the last 16 years, which is not everybody, just a little bit less volatile with girls.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:21:05]: That was my experience too. I I found that when Mason and I would have our conflicts, I was a different type of parent. And I almost expected him to know what to do and to follow the leader kind of a thing. And I not remembering what it was like when I was a young man myself and what I also struggled with. And a funny little story is when my wife and I were first dating, we we asked each other what we wanted to be when we grew up and had professional lives, and she had, well, I want stability, and I wanna climb the corporate ladder. I don't wanna move around a lot. I want a stable family. What would you like? And I said, I'd like to be a great dad.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:21:37]: And that was just on my radar from day 1. And our son now is 23. Kate and I were talking on the way to dropping her off to school this morning and how close they are and how much she deeply loves him and respects him as a man. We've launched him into adulthood. He makes amazing money as a service rider service adviser for Toyota and is independent on his own. And when he shows up, he lights up our lives. Just absolutely. Yeah.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:22:02]: So the the dynamic difference there is there is an endless amount of love for both kids. There is was a definite difference in the softness in how I treated Kate. Kate's neurotypical, so she is a planner. She was always with the notes and getting her stuff done. Her priorities were always do my work first, and then I have time to play. And, again, when I talked about she'll be 16 soon and won't need me, it's true. I mean, she's she's looking into colleges. She's talking about where her first job will be, where my son was just spending time looking at car videos and turbos and tuners.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:22:38]: And I here I was struggling with well, if you're spending all of your time over here doing these, just watching car repair videos, how are you ever going to get your geography going on? How are you ever gonna pass these plots? Forgetting the fact that this young man was spending his energy and his time in the field that resonated with him. So right out of high school, he knew he didn't wanna go to college. He wanted to go to trade school to be a mechanic, and the rest is history. As soon as the rubber hit the road for him, metaphorically, he took off and became his own man. And then our relationship really shifted to more of a support and advisor role. So today when my phone rings versus when he was a teenager and I would avoid the phone calls and wonder, oh gosh, what's what news is coming now? When the phone rings now or I see him at the door, all of our lives light up.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:28]: So talk to me about this community then that you're creating. I know it's a subscription model, and you're bringing these fathers together. So talk to me about, this group, what you're doing with this group, and what you're finding so far in the communication, the community, dynamics that you're developing, and what you're hoping to build in the future. Well,
Daniel Vozenilek [00:23:48]: this is again, this is a new initiative for us. So what we're hoping to build, again, is just a place for dads who are at whatever stage they're in in their parenting journey, when whether they have one son or 2 or even if they have son and a daughter with ADHD, that they can come to a place and find resources and books and other podcasts and videos to help them along in their journey to give them hope. Coming back to how I felt a bit lost and a bit hopeless and a bit isolated from my friends, I didn't realize it was through doctor Russell's great advice to go find our tribe. We needed to find our community. And the more we talked to other parents who were also struggling, the more we realize we actually weren't alone. And so that's part of the void that we wanted to also fill.
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:24:35]: And there's nothing out there like this specifically for dads raising sons with ADHD. So the best introduction to our group is at Russell Coaching, and you'll see that you can click on the link for a dad's guide. And our hope really is to do a lot of what you're doing, you know, provide support and information for dads, not as broadly as you're doing, but for a specific niche audience of dads. So we're building a library of podcasts talking about how to create connection with your son with ADHD. We're talking about, on the podcast, how to understand neurodiversity. We're talking about navigating the marriage or any kind of significant other when it comes to raising sons with ADHD. So we're building a a library of podcasts that Dan and I started a few months ago. And then there's a Facebook page also for dads where we're just inviting them to share their experiences and and to get support.
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:25:37]: So that's where we're at so far, podcasts and a Facebook group.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:25:41]: And we'll be covering all those difficult topics that are coming up for fathers who have sons in middle school now, but then we're gonna be talking about the common trappings of what our sons are gonna be engaged with, whether it be avoiding the peer pressure of smoking and vaping. What about driving? What happens after high school? How to plan and talk to your son about that. And finances. I mean, my gosh, how many struggles did we have with Mason about saving and conserving money and the importance of not only getting a job, keeping a job, showing off, but then what do you do with those very precious dollars? So that as he was transitioned into adulthood, he could support himself and not continue to rely on mom and dad to solve the problems.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:21]: Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call our fatherhood 5 where we ask you 5 more questions to delve deeper into you as a dad. Are you ready? I'm ready. In one word, what is fatherhood?
Daniel Vozenilek [00:26:32]: Selflessness.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:33]: Now when was the time that you finally felt like you succeeded at being a father to a daughter?
Daniel Vozenilek [00:26:39]: That's a good one. And I know this answer because I'm I just see it. We'll get emotional here. I opened up on my laptop one day and without if I open my laptop, it may challenge our Zoom here. But, basically, it was a a note to me saying how grateful she is that God put her mom and dad into her life and that she considers us her best friends. Now my daughter has an amazing my daughter is a connector. She has an amazing circle of friends at the ice skating rink from her middle school. Even from her summer camp, she has a pen pal.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:27:12]: I mean, she is just an absolute connector. And I know the quality of the kids that she surrounds herself with and the ones that come to her. And for her to say that we are her best friends coming from her, I knew I had arrived with her. And I have to say that was probably around the 7th grade, 7th or 8th grade. So she's amazing.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:33]: Well, now I'm gonna ask you about your kids. So if I were to talk to you, both your kids, how would they describe you as a dad?
Daniel Vozenilek [00:27:39]: He's a great man. I overheard my son. We went to a motorcycle meet 1 night together, and I happened to walk a few steps away from him to talk to one of his coworkers and introduce myself. And I overheard another one of his friends say, wow. Your your dad's really he's really, really big pool. And he said, yeah. He's a really great man. And he didn't realize that I could hear him, and I could tell in his voice that he was sincere.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:28:02]: And it just choked me up because I never talked about my father like that. And to hear my own son admire and love me in that way, I knew that, we had a bond that was not gonna be broken.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:13]: Who inspires you to be a better dad?
Daniel Vozenilek [00:28:15]: Both my kids. Yeah. A 100%. I see in them the I see in them the future. I see and I'm not pushing them for grandchildren, but I cannot wait to do this all over again in a deeper and even more meaningful way that will leave a legacy and a lasting impression. And I do believe that we were put here to make better versions of ourselves. And I cannot wait to see what comes in round 2.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:41]: Now you've given some of your own experience today. You've shared some of the things that have worked for you and some of the things that you're sharing with other dads. As you think of other dads, whether they're raising sons, daughters, etcetera, what's one piece of advice you'd wanna give to every dad?
Daniel Vozenilek [00:28:59]: Learn empathy. Learn what the real deep meaning of empathy is because we're not often taught empathy in the home unless our parents are, have an amazing relationship, a lot of communication, a lot of support that the kids can see when there's a struggle and how the parents come together to fix it and resolve it, lifting everybody up. The number one piece of advice, learn empathy. And through that, you can connect with most everybody, especially your kids. And when you understand that we are not perfect, we were not meant to be perfect. We were all meant to walk and support each other in this journey. I think that it all starts with empathy.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:39]: Now we've been talking about the program that is just starting with Russell Coaching, with your dad's your dad's group. Talk to me about if people wanna find out more about coaching, about the group, where should they go?
Dr. Norrine Russell [00:29:53]: The easiest thing to do is to go to Russell coaching dot com, or just Google Russell coaching, and it'll come up. And you can learn about our coaching services for kids with ADHD, autism, and anxiety. And we provide those services across the country. So it doesn't matter where you're at and basically help with all the things that kids who struggle with executive functioning struggle with, time management, goal settings, starting tasks, finishing tasks, and particularly as it relates to school. And then also on Russell Coaching.com, you can click on a dad's guide and check out our group and hopefully join our group and be part of what Dan is creating and I'm supporting. And we can make a difference in the lives of families everywhere.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:38]: Well, Noreen, Dan, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for both being here for the work that you're doing to help fathers and sons, and especially in this specific niche of helping them to connect and to be able to build those strong bonds. Definitely, we'll be putting links in our notes today with all of that information, and I wish you both the best.
Daniel Vozenilek [00:30:58]: Thank you so much. We appreciate you.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:59]: We're all in the same boat And it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time. We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents and bring your a game. Because those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast. Calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters and musclemen, get out and be the world to them.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:32:44]: You're the best dad you can be. You're the best dad you can be.