Hey dads, welcome to another episode of Dad Connections in 5—your five-minute boost of practical, meaningful advice to help you build a stronger connection with your daughter. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and today we’re diving into a part of parenting that’s easy to overlook but full of opportunity:

Chores.

Yep—laundry, dishes, vacuuming. You might not think of them as bonding time, but trust me—when done right, chores can become a space for connection, collaboration, and even fun.

Let’s flip the script and turn the daily grind into something that brings you closer together.

Why Chores Matter for Connection

Chores aren’t just about cleaning up—they’re about:

• Building life skills
• Sharing responsibility
• Creating moments for conversation and teamwork

And when you approach chores as something you do together—rather than something she has to do because you said so—you create space for growth, confidence, and connection.

3 Ways to Make Chores Collaborative and Fun 1. Turn Chores into a Team Challenge

Instead of saying, “Go clean your room,” try,

• “Let’s see how fast we can both clean our spaces.”
• “You take the kitchen, I’ll take the living room—let’s beat the clock!”

Set a timer. Add music. Cheer each other on. Make it a team effort instead of a solo punishment.

When she sees you jumping in alongside her, she feels respected—and that makes her more likely to participate willingly.

2. Turn on the Tunes and Turn Up the Fun

Music changes the whole vibe. Let her create a “cleaning playlist,” or take turns picking songs. Sing along. Dance while folding laundry. Be goofy.

It may sound silly—but those are the memories that stick. The joy in the ordinary.

And if she laughs at your dance moves? Even better. You’re showing her that work and play don’t have to live in separate worlds.

3. Use Chores as Conversation Starters

Washing dishes together? Folding laundry side by side? These are great moments to ask simple questions like:

• “What’s something you’re looking forward to this week?”
• “What’s one thing that made you laugh today?”
• “If we had a robot to do one chore forever, which one would it be?”

The chore gets done, and so does the connection. Win-win.

Quick Takeaway: Try This Today

Here’s your challenge: Pick one chore to do with your daughter this week—and make it a moment.

• Set a fun timer and race the clock
• Blast music and turn it into a dance party
• Ask one silly or thoughtful question while you work

Whatever it is, show her that chores aren’t just work—they’re shared time. A space where you show up together, take care of your home, and maybe sneak in a few laughs along the way.

Because it’s not just about getting the job done—it’s about how you show up while doing it.

That’s it for this episode of Dad Connections in 5. If this helped you see dishes, dusting, or laundry in a new light, share it with another dad who’s ready to turn the daily routine into a relationship-building moment.

Until next time—keep working side by side, keep having fun, and keep turning the everyday into something extraordinary.

If you’re a father searching for ways to build a deeper, more meaningful relationship with your daughter, the latest episode of the Dad and Daughter Connection podcast is a must-listen. Host Dr. Christopher Lewis sits down with Rick Walker—business leader, father of three teenage daughters, and author of the upcoming book, Nine Steps to Build a Life of Meaning: How to Unlock Your Mind, Happiness, Power, and Your Enemy's Demise—for a powerful and honest conversation about the realities and rewards of fatherhood.

Throughout the episode, Rick shares invaluable insights not only from his professional life but, more importantly, from his lived experience as a dad. One of the central themes is the importance of truly being present. Rick describes making family dinners a priority, and how even simple rituals—like driving home from summer camp or sharing milkshake runs—can be crucial opportunities to listen and connect. He emphasizes the need to go beyond just showing up: “Attention is the only resource I have to offer,” he says—highlighting that those everyday moments of real engagement are what matter most.

Rick also touches on the challenges of fatherhood: balancing guidance with allowing independence, recognizing each daughter’s individuality, and pushing through discomfort during tough conversations. He admits that sometimes daughters will push their dads away, and it’s up to us not to give up, but to keep returning, reaffirming our love, belief, and pride.

A particularly inspiring message from the episode is the idea that meaning often comes from confronting challenges. Drawing from his book, Rick discusses how fathers—and their children—grow through adversity, and why “avoiding an ounce of pain means drinking a gallon of regret.” For dads feeling stuck, burnt out, or disconnected, he gently suggests that often, the thing you least want to face is where real growth—and renewed connection—can be found.

Practical advice abounds: tell your daughter daily that you’re proud, that you love her, and that you believe in her. And, most importantly, let them see you strive not just in your career, but in being the kind of person you’d want them to choose as a partner one day.

If you’re ready to laugh, reflect, and gather actionable wisdom for your own journey as a dad, be sure to check out this heartfelt episode of the Dad and Daughter Connection. It’s a reminder that you don’t have to walk this path alone—and that every father has the power to be the dad his daughter needs. Listen now and start building that lasting connection today!

If you enjoyed this episode, we ask you to take a moment to take our Dad and Daughter Connection Survey to let us know more about you as a dad. You can also sign up to get our newsletter to stay connected to our community, and we will send items of interest to you to help you to be the dad that you want to be. Feel free to follow me on the following social media platforms: Facebook, Facebook Group, Instagram, LinkedIn, X.

Rick’s Book (9 Steps to Build a Life of Meaning): https://amzn.to/4nGYDFq

Rick’s Newsletter: https://funnel.rickwalker.com/optin?utm_source=youtube&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=hostlastname Rick on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@rickwalkertx Rick on X: https://x.com/RickWalkerTX Rick at Lumicre Private Equity: https://lumicre.com/   Rick’s Website: https://www.rickwalker.com

TRANSCRIPT

Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]: Welcome to the dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Rick Walker [00:00:12]: If you're looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you're in the right place. I'm Dr. Christopher Lewis, and the dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we'll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let's get started, because being a great dad isn't just about being there. It's about truly connecting. Welcome back to the dad and Daughter Connection. I'm so excited that you are back again this week as we walk on this path together on this journey of raising amazing daughters.

Rick Walker [00:01:03]: And, you know, none of us have to walk on this path alone. It's so important that we're willing to put ourselves out there to be willing to learn and to listen and to hear the journeys of other fathers. Because as you and I both know, the journey of fatherhood is not always easy. There are challenges, there are bumps, and sometimes you can get some bruises along the way as well. But you can learn so much from other fathers and see what they're doing, take what they're doing, adapt it, adjust it, make it your own, and identify ways in which you can take that learning and turn it into something amazing that'll help you to be the dad that you want to be. That's why this podcast exists. We want to have amazing connections with our daughters, and that's not always going to be easy. We have to learn and grow along the way.

Rick Walker [00:02:05]: We have to better understand the journey that they're on. And that's why every week, every week, I love being able to have you here to be able to learn from other fathers. And that's why I bring someone new to you every week that allows for you to do just that. This week, we've got another great guest.

Christopher Lewis [00:02:21]: Who?

Rick Walker [00:02:21]: Rick Walker is with us. Rick is the author of a upcoming book called nine steps to build a life of meaning, how to unlock your mind, happiness, power, and your enemy's demise. And he is a renowned leader across multiple domains. He's been a founder CEO of a 400 employee company, and he scaled that up from there. And he also scaled a 2020 team member nonprofit into 53 countries as a chairman. So he's done a lot of stuff. But even beyond that, he is a Father of three daughters, three teenage daughters at that. And I am really excited to be able to not only talk to him about his upcoming book, but also to talk to him about his own journey as a father.

Rick Walker [00:03:08]: Rick, thanks so much for being here today.

Christopher Lewis [00:03:10]: Christopher, it's joy. Looking forward to our time together.

Rick Walker [00:03:12]: Well, I'm really excited that you're here today. And as I, as I said, you are a father of three daughters, and I always start these conversations with an opportunity to get to know you a little bit more as a father yourself, and especially a father of a daughter. As I said, that connection that we want to build is so important. And as you think back to the moments that you've had thus far in your life with your three daughters, what is one of the most meaningful moments that you've been able to share with your daughters thus far and what made it so special?

Christopher Lewis [00:03:41]: One of the more meaningful moments has been with my daughters whenever they would finish up that summer camp. And so we've always tried to make it a point of being there to pick them up from summer camp camp and drive them an hour home just to hear everything. And if you're a dad of a teenage daughter, what you know is you get one of two things. You either get the talkative girl when she's with her friends a lot of times, or you get the quiet one who's too cool to talk to mom and dad. But sometimes if you haven't seen them in a week and they've been through a lot and they're all together, you can get them to talk. And so just being able to listen to them and hear their stories after camp, after not seeing them for a week or so and them also not seeing their sisters for a week, that's always just been a joy. So we do that every year. But yeah, I do find that it's more difficult to get them to open up.

Christopher Lewis [00:04:25]: And those handful of times where we can get them to really open up unguarded, that's always a very meaningful time.

Rick Walker [00:04:31]: I said that you had three daughters, and I know they range in age from 12 to 17. And every father that has kids knows that your kids are not going to be duplicated of one another. They are very unique individuals. They have different personalities, and you have to come to understand who they are as individuals. Talk to me about, I mean, you're a busy guy, so talk to me about how have you been able to. To really identify those unique aspects of your own daughters to. And how have you been able to make those strong connections with each of your daughters individually so that you can have that connection that you want with each one of them.

Christopher Lewis [00:05:10]: Very early on I stumbled across the work of Dr. Meg Meeker, which I imagine you've probably spoken about her a number of times on your podcast and began reading some of her work. And some of the work was life changing. Just the idea that if I could find opportunities to be able to share with my daughter that I, I love them, that I'm proud of them, I believe in them, that that makes all the difference sometimes between a daughter that follows a winning path versus one that doesn't. And so that's always been a joy to be able to do that. And so from the time they were very young, I always encouraged them to try a number of things and we always would have them in one academic activity, one musical activity, and then one sports activity at least. And so having those three things going at the same time kept us very busy. But over the long term they eventually found one thing that they really loved or two things that they really love and it's helped them.

Christopher Lewis [00:05:57]: But the musical capacity we've always found. My wife and I were musicians, we've had musicians on my wife's side of the family. I have a bachelor's degree in music. I believe that music certainly helps children with their mathematical prowess as well as their ability to I guess, consider the imaginative aspects of the intellectual. And so we've made that a very strong priority in our kids upbringing. And we've got at least one of them that's pretty dedicated to her music. But then the sports also, the sports help develop the social and seeing them differentiating in the sports element, my 17 year old, she's a pre professional ballerina, so that is an art and a sport. The these girls, they've got more muscle mass than a lot of these high school football players do, but it's a lot of artistry too.

Christopher Lewis [00:06:37]: And so just trying to figure out where they are has been really impactful. And my wife and I, and then My daughter, my 12 year old, she's the rule follower and she can do anything. She can do academics, she can do sports, she can do music, she can do anything. And so we're excited about her, but she just has a natural gift to be able to get along with people. But trying to expose them to those three different areas from very young has given us a little bit of a glimpse of what they can and they can't do. And they've been able to convince themselves that they can excel in certain areas and they can sell in certain relationships dynamics.

Rick Walker [00:07:05]: As you're raising your daughters, you have to find that balance of being able to guide your daughters while also giving them the independence to become who they're becoming. Talk to me about what you've done to be able to do just that.

Christopher Lewis [00:07:20]: Yeah, so it's a trade off. And every child is different. We have one child who's very, very independent or middle one and she's in middle school. I wouldn't second guess leaving town, leaving her at home for a week by herself. I've never done that. But I wouldn't think twice about it because she's just, she's so independent. She has such high emotional intelligence and she just sort of figures stuff out. She's reliable.

Christopher Lewis [00:07:41]: But then we have other kids that, that they need to be engaged on a regular basis because they're more social creatures and they just don't do where do well in certain social environments with either a large number of people like a public high school or a small number of people. So you have to sort of find that mix there. But it's my objective to obviously get them acclimated to a wide variety of social structures and social environment. But they're not always to do that. Especially during these critical teenage years. You have other things emotionally and socially and even spiritually in play that us as men from what I found anyway, we just can't relate to that. And so my wife, she had to speak a lot of wisdom into those, those interactions over the past number of years.

Rick Walker [00:08:22]: What are some intentional ways that you've worked to strengthen your bond or your connection with your daughters, especially during challenging times.

Christopher Lewis [00:08:29]: So one of the things I read very early on was that what teenage daughters will do is they'll, they'll tend to push the dad away. They'll push them away at some see if he's going to come back for her. And if the dad doesn't come back for her, she begins to self reinforce this idea that I've got to go and find another man that's going to sort of fill that void. Not basically the father void, but just some sort of masculine type of presence in their lives. And so I've always been one that whenever they sort of push me away, I encourage them, but then I'll pursue them. They have to know that there's nothing that they're going to do that will get me to give up on them, to back down from my commitment to have a relationship with them and also to I guess not encourage them to be on a healthy path. Going forward. Obviously, we all make stupid decisions in our lives, with our lives, but there's also some.

Christopher Lewis [00:09:14]: There's also something special about having at least one person in the world that really believes in. In you unconditionally. And that's the role that I want to. I want to play. Not that I approve of every decision or every action, but I approve of the person themselves. And I believe that my daughters can be called higher into a better future than even they can imagine themselves to be in.

Rick Walker [00:09:33]: I know that as a father, I've made my share of mistakes along the way, and I think every father makes some mistakes along the way. What's a mist that you made as a father? And what did you learn about it? Not only about yourself, but about fostering positive connections and communication with your own daughters.

Christopher Lewis [00:09:51]: For me, anyway, I failed to listen to my gut a number of times. And whenever I didn't listen to my gut, and I thought, no, I'm just overthinking this. I'm over worrying what may or may not be happening. I made a grievous error to doing that over the years. And so what I believe is that obviously this child who is a part of me, that there is some sort of resonance there there. That whenever I suspect there's an issue there, I feel something kind of within my bones, that there's something that I need to address that when I don't address it, it's an offense to the gods, if you kind of get what I'm saying there. It's an offense to fathers everywhere that I need. It's my job to be proactive, not be reactive.

Christopher Lewis [00:10:27]: And so I've got to be proactively engaging in these relationships. And when I'm not, that always tends to be a failure in that situation. In the long run, eventually. But love is always a sacrifice. It's always a sacrifice. And you often will put yourself out there. You'll make that comment, you'll make that assertion. You'll call that that child to do something that she doesn't want to do.

Christopher Lewis [00:10:45]: And it's always fun.

Rick Walker [00:10:46]: No, it's not always fun. And I definitely hear you in that. What do you do intentionally to make your daughters feel valued and heard?

Christopher Lewis [00:10:54]: So, first of all, you've got to give them eye contact. The only thing that I have to offer anyone in the world's attention, that's the only thing I have to offer. That's the only resource in the entire world, is attention. And so if I can't give them eye contact and understand, let Them understand that I'm hearing what they're saying, I'm processing it and repeat it back for them, and they can correct me if I misunderstood. That is a great deal of it. The other thing is we try to do family dinners as often as possible. Obviously, we're scattered, doing all sorts of activities, and we can't do that every night because we've got everything going everywhere with sports and music and stuff. But and having a sort of a protected dinner time, protected family time around the table, that is really, really critical.

Christopher Lewis [00:11:32]: I suspect that if a man doesn't get his dinner table right and doesn't get his books right and he doesn't get his quiet time right, he can't get his life right. Like, those are the really only three, three things that matter in your life. And so focusing on the dinner table, focus on that time together is really important. And when you can't do that, hey, you know, I'm the chauffeur. I'm driving kiddos to practices and we're talking. Even though they're exhausted, I'm letting them know, hey, I saw you make this play. What if we did this next time? What is this person saying on the court? How can we encourage our team members? And then we also talk about their future? I've also found, I'm a big believer in Viktor Frankl's work, that if we can get people focused on their future and what their future self would want them to do in the present, well, then that gets to open up an entire world of opportunity for these girls. And it gets them off the idea that my present is the only thing that matters.

Christopher Lewis [00:12:14]: But, no, I've got a future self that has certain expectations of me now, and I have a responsibility to that future self.

Rick Walker [00:12:18]: I mentioned at the beginning that you're the author of an upcoming book, nine steps to build a life of meaning. How to unlock your mind, happiness, power, and your enemy's demise. And, you know, as I was looking and reading through the book, one of the questions that came to my mind is right at the beginning, you dedicate the book to your wife and daughters. How is being a father to three girls shaped your understanding of a life of meaning?

Christopher Lewis [00:12:42]: Pent up in the idea of meaning. And people often confuse purpose and meaning to be the same thing. Purpose is a. As a condition of meaning, oftentimes. But pent up in these ideas, you have this notion of relevance. And relevance has to do with endurance, this enduring presence that I want to leave behind to the world whenever I'm dead and Gone. And I suspect for me, the most important endurance or relevance that I'm going to leave behind to the world are these three daughters and their kids and their grandkids someday. And so if I want to live a life of meaning, I have to figure out how do I get the ideas and the beliefs that I have to endure in the long run, because only by their enduring can I have a chance that they'll be relevant long term.

Christopher Lewis [00:13:26]: Because I think it was Lewis that said this, and this is a common quote, you'll see Mother's Day some years on these cards. He said that it's not what you do, but who you raise that makes your life matter. It's not what you do, but who you raise that makes that makes your life matter. And I suspect most of us, that's the state. So it's not our jobs, it's not these hobbies that we have. It's not these grand podcasts that you and I host. It's not any of this stuff. It's our kids, and they're sitting there.

Christopher Lewis [00:13:51]: That's the irony of life. The most important things are the most obvious things that you most want. And most tend to snub because they're just so commonplace. They're there all the time. They ignore you all the time, but those are the most important things. And our kids, man, the kids. If my kids don't love me and I don't love my kids, none of this other stuff matters.

Rick Walker [00:14:08]: Also in the book, you talk about picking a worthy enemy. How does that principle show up in your parenting, especially when guiding daughters through challenges in today's world?

Christopher Lewis [00:14:19]: So the book is primarily written towards men that are in the midst of this meaning crisis. This is the group of men that are sort of 25 to 45, sometimes up to 50, that don't have a worthy purpose of their lives. They don't know what they want to do. And guys like me, coming out of the business world, we always tell people to pick a goal instead of vision, and let's work the objectives and the tactics to get back to that. Let's accomplish your goals. But men that don't have a vision of what the future could possibly be, they don't have any goals. And it's impossible for us to tell them to go do something, to be something where they can't even envision a world with goals. And so my argument in the book for pick one worthy enemy is that you need something that breaks your heart.

Christopher Lewis [00:14:55]: You need something that's worth giving your life for. Some Evil to overcome in the world. And there's evil manifesting all around us. You look at pornhub, you look at the children that have been just taken completely advantage of on that platform. Well, a man giving up his life to go fight against that manifestation of evil, well, that's a worthy cause because you're protecting people, you're protecting innocents who can't defend themselves. So we look for worthy enemies. And that pursuit against the worthy enemies is what gives us not only the energy that we need to go out and try some stuff, because that's the main issue, is we're not trying. We don't have goals, we don't try.

Christopher Lewis [00:15:26]: But we need the energy. And we find that cause that problem that just shatters our heart that will give us the energy. And somehow, I don't know how it happens, but we get sort of a divine onslaught of resources to help us in that fight. We find friends that want to help us in that fight, and we can begin building coalitions and purposes. And so it starts small with our daughters. It starts on the lacrosse field, on the soccer field, it starts on the basketball court. How are we going to overcome this 10 point deficit? What are you going to call forth out of your teammates? What are you going to do on the defensive end so that you can have an offensive upset? This is the way that I've got to talk to my daughters. Because if I don't give them that level of pursuit, if I don't give that mentality that they can overcome their challenges, what kind of man are they going to marry? Look, the type of man that they're going to be looking for without that sort of mentality is a weak, defeated man who's used to losing.

Christopher Lewis [00:16:11]: No, I want my daughters focused on winning, overcoming challenges, realizing that there's failures, there's very real failures in life, but those are overcomeable as long as you have one breath left.

Rick Walker [00:16:21]: I know you just talked about that target audience for the book, and I'm going to say that a lot of dads, especially in that target audience, some of those dads, feel stuck either in a job that they don't love or routines that feel, I'll say, hollow. Based on the nine steps that you list in the book, what's the first step that a father should take when he realizes he's lost his sense of purpose.

Christopher Lewis [00:16:44]: You need to take a step. You need to make a move. And that move may be trying to discover what really breaks your heart. And I hate to really simplify it like that, but. But what angers you that you see out in the world? It may be something you see in your children's school, maybe something you see in the school district, maybe in a local church, your local synagogue. It may be something that you have around you, but it may be some sort of societal issue or some online issue. Just start working against that. And the more evil that problem is, the more divine the energy you accrue fighting against it.

Christopher Lewis [00:17:14]: I mean, the purpose of the light is invade the darkness. The purpose of the good man is invade the evil. It's. This is the way that the nature of the world works. If you want to be a good man, you want to be a man that has definition, purpose and pursuit and energy, you got to combat that which is not good. I mean, it's that simple. So we're looking around for something, and I would put a cap on it. I would say I'm going to identify something in the next two weeks.

Christopher Lewis [00:17:34]: And Sunday night at this time, this is what I'm going on. And I'm going to give it until this happens. And you've got to leave it out on the field. As they told us when we were growing up, you got to give it your all. And I'm not saying you ignore your family, I'm not saying you ignore your job to do this, but you've got to find something that you can pick up a bit of passion out of. Just a bit of passion, just a bit of energy. And that bit of energy will give you the spark that you need, need help the other steps fall in place. But we've got to pick up an idea about what's possible.

Christopher Lewis [00:18:02]: What difference I can make? Once you have an idea about what difference you can make, you have a potential for relevance.

Rick Walker [00:18:06]: Also in the book, you say that aiming low is the only sin. How can fathers aim higher in their everyday lives? Especially when they're exhausted, they're overwhelmed, or they're just feeling like they're trying to keep their head above water?

Christopher Lewis [00:18:20]: The widest mind looks into the most distant future for the most valued reward that he can purchase with the currency of the present. Let me repeat that. The wisest mind. This is the wisest father. The wisest mind looks into the most distant future for the most valuable reward that he can purchase with the currency of the present. And what you have in the present is your time and your attention. And so you've got to figure out what in the future is worth you giving your only life for. And it's not something that's lower than what you have, you have kids, you've got daughters around you, you've got people that you can call forth more out of.

Christopher Lewis [00:18:51]: You can say these difficult things. If you're not used to talking to your daughters like this, all it takes is or three times, you have to be prepared to be uncomfortable in that, in that conversation and just blurt it out, say, hey, I believe in you, I love you, I trust you, and know that you're going to have a commanding future. Or ask them questions like this, like, what would you do if you knew you couldn't fail? Or think about your most perfect ideal future self? And what would that perfect future self tell you to do? Ask reflective questions about the future to your daughters. And it's going to be uncomfortable the first three, four, five times you do it. But the more you do it, the more easier it gets and the more the relationship grows and it becomes one of trust, not just one of immediacy and putting out fires.

Rick Walker [00:19:29]: You also say in the book, no joy requires pain. For dads who are numb, burnt out, or emotionally disconnected, how can they reconnect with that joy? Even if it hurts first, you have.

Christopher Lewis [00:19:42]: To say the things that you least want to say. It's that passing comment that you thought you should have said five years ago to your wife, I'm sorry for ignoring you, or your wife, I'm sorry for going to golfing with the boys, or I'm sorry for drinking so much. It's those little things, those little steps of humility. Because what you least want to do is the thing you most need to do next. What you least want to do right now is the thing that you most need to do next. And it is that immediate pain of doing the thing that you've been putting off, the thing that your, your mind and your comfort have been enslaving you to preserve. It's that thing that's keeping you from your future. That's what.

Christopher Lewis [00:20:18]: That's what it is. And it's that pain. If you can get rid of that pain and comfort is the number one pain, one or one thing that pain is protecting or that your comfort's protecting, it's protecting you against pain. If you can burst through that, then you've got a little bit of a glimmer of joy. But as long as you don't do the things you know you should be doing, your life is a lie. And so we've got to say the things we know we're expected to say the same things we've been talking about the last few Minutes, the encouragements, the love, the support, the belief in. I'm proud of you. Tell your wife she looks beautiful.

Christopher Lewis [00:20:47]: I mean, I don't care how crappy your marriage is. Tell her she looks lovely. Tell her that she is. Is the most amazing, whether she is or not. And you're proud and you're honored to be in this with her. I mean, say the most difficult thing. The worse your marriage is, the more you need to say it and the more you need to. To live like you mean it.

Christopher Lewis [00:21:04]: Whether you mean it or not is irrelevant at this point. We've got to say those important things that we've been holding back, because that is only the way that we can burst through the pain, burst through the comfort to get to joy on the other side.

Rick Walker [00:21:14]: So really, you know what I'm hearing, and I saw this in the book too, that you're talking about in some aspects that you have to make some sacrifices. And many men afraid in many ways to take that leap, leaping into something new, something that. That makes them sacrifice. The things that they feel are. Are the things that make them who they are, whether it's time or money or ego or whatever it might be. What does your book teach? Or what would you say to that person about embracing sacrifice as a path to meaning?

Christopher Lewis [00:21:46]: No one ever knows that you love them unless you sacrifice something to be with them. If I'm going to give my daughter her attention, that means I'm sacrificing the rest of the world for her. Everything else is a sacrifice to what I'm giving my attention to. And that's why attention connotates meaning. It means meaning. And that's what we've got to do. There's also sacrifices. Of the things that are useless in your life, you're doing a hundred useless things that have no upside whatsoever.

Christopher Lewis [00:22:11]: I can think about the golf with the buddies. I can think, for a lot of men, the drinking. Like, why are you going out and drinking two or three times a week? It has no upside. It only has catastrophic downside. Some of this stuff is just the most foolish thing you can imagine. Look, if you're taking an infinite downside risk for zero upside payout, that's kind of a foolish thing to do. That's a great thing to sacrifice and replace it with the thing you most need to do. And that what that thing you most need to do is give attention to someone who is committed to you and you're committed to and develop that relationship because all you have left after you die is your relationships.

Christopher Lewis [00:22:43]: That's all that you have. And so what we've got to do is try to figure out what are we sacrificing? Because you've already sacrificed your past. All your prior moments have been sacrificed to your present. This is all you've got. And all you're going to do is sacrifice a series of presences to be able to dictate and determine what your future is. And so we've got to realize we're living a life of sacrifice, whether you realize it or not. And what we sacrifice determines what we love, and what we love determines how relevant and how meaningful our lives will be. But everything worth keeping is worth sacrificing.

Christopher Lewis [00:23:13]: Nothing not worth keeping is worthy of offering everything you value is worthy of sacrificing to someone that is higher, to a future that's more distant and a reward that is better. Because anything you have now is always worth sacrificing for those relationships and the future that you want to see happen.

Rick Walker [00:23:33]: So inevitably, there's probably some dads that are listening right now that are feeling like they have failed. They failed in some aspect of their life. And whether it was at home or at work or with themselves. What would you tell him about redemption and legacy and starting again with meaning?

Christopher Lewis [00:23:54]: I failed a lot. In fact, whenever I try something new, I'm assuming I'm going to fail 99 times before it works. Once, I failed a lot. And this book is a story of my failures. Where I've. I've been devastated on national news, where I've had my love with my wife just completely shattered, where I've had all these failures. I had a surgery that went bad and just distorted my mind for many, many years. And I had all these things.

Christopher Lewis [00:24:18]: Things fail and just stupid things that I've done, just failure after failure. But what I've realized is the people that failed, those are the ones whose lives are actually interesting in the end. Those are the lives that have the potential to be redeemed out of this sort of muddy mire that they've been stuck in. And the redeemed man, in a world that's interested in stories, a redeemed man is more perfect than a man who's never needed to be redeemed. Because what we're saying is that a man who's lived a beautiful life and redemption is a beautiful act that if you're focused on telling a beautiful story with your. That redemption is the ultimate type of beauty and the ultimate type of story that you can tell with your life. And so the worse the man the higher the upside. It's not about the man who's always been good.

Christopher Lewis [00:24:59]: He got a little bit better. That's an interesting. That's not a story that anyone wants to hear. What I want to hear is about a man that's been in the depths of hell, that's made all the mistakes you could ever imagine, and he's bounced back from that. It's about the delta between your lowest point, your highest point, and where you in. And that delta is what matter. It's the contrast from where you were to where you're going, not the contrast of how good you are. And that little mediocre change that you made when you.

Christopher Lewis [00:25:25]: When you did this or did that. It's not about that. And so what life is. Life is just a string of failures with the occasional moment of perfection. It's just a string of failures with just an occasional moment of perfection. And however many moments of these of perfection that you can. You can get together in a life, that's what makes a life of relevance and a life of beauty and a story that people want to hear. And so for the men out there that have just been down on themselves, that have just made mistake after mistake, that just don't know how they're to come overcome it, and they just assume everything's lost, I can tell you that I understand where you've been.

Christopher Lewis [00:25:59]: I've made the catastrophic mistakes that many of you have made. And I can tell you there's hope. And let me convince you with this. I'm going to convince you literally that there's hope for you. That if a drop of hope exists, exists anywhere, it threatens all hopelessness everywhere. If a drop of hope exists anywhere in the world, it threatens all hopelessness everywhere. So my drop of hope that I have, I don't have a lot of hope. I've got a little of a drop of hope right now.

Christopher Lewis [00:26:23]: My drop of hope is now threatening your hopelessness right now. And you have a choice whether or not you're going to allow my hope to invade your hopelessness, whether you're going allowed my light to invade your darkness, that thing that you're trying to protect, that comfort that's enslaving your potential, and if you will allow my hope to invade the comfort now enslaving your potential, it'll be ripped away. It'll be ripped away. And you'll be able to see that there's a future and there's a hope, but you could never get there unless you believe hope is possible. You believe a Future is possible unless you believe that there is beauty rising out of the act of redemption. The man that turns himself around is more beautiful than the man that was always headed the right direction. That's not the story I want to hear. I want to hear story about a man that always had it together.

Christopher Lewis [00:27:03]: I want to hear about a man who confronts evil with good. I want to hear about a man who finds meaning out of meaninglessness. I want to figure out a way to hear a story about a man who takes his pain and inverts it to joy. That's what a real story is about. And if you want your kids and your grandkids to talk about you, that's the sort of life that you need to live.

Rick Walker [00:27:21]: So talk to me about how you have taken these nine concepts, these nine pieces from your book and how are you incorporating them into how you're raising your daughters.

Christopher Lewis [00:27:31]: They have to understand, and this is something, this is a job of me as a dad, is that we're going to have pain. We're going to have pain in our lives, we're going to pain in relationships and tragedy, we're going to pain the sicknesses. But a painless world would only birth joyless lives. A painless world would only birth joyless lives. And so if I can encourage them to look at that spread, to look at that spread between pain and joy, that the broader that is, the higher the joy is, then they can see that there's hope for them even in their downfall, even in their tragedy, even in these, these moments that teenage girls just assume, which is the worst thing, and it's unsalvageable. They have to understand that there's a mechanism that, where they can be able to tell more beautiful, more lovely story with their lives. And these are lessons that they're going to teach their own kids, their own grandkids one day. These are all just learning opportunities for them and even for us.

Christopher Lewis [00:28:19]: But I've got to convince my kids, and you've got to convince your kids as well, the listeners do, that there is hope on the other side of pain. And the way that we get, we, we get there is we got to convince ourselves and we got to convince our kids that whenever we see a threat, there's always an opportunity on the other side. In fact, that's what defines a wise person. Not only that they look in the most distant future for the most maximal reward, but that they see threats and they figure out a way to turn them into opportunity. And so if we realize that every threat we see is an opportunity. Every pain is a potential joy. And we're able to ingrain that in our mind. Then we begin to see that there's hope on the other side of the darkness.

Rick Walker [00:28:55]: Now, if your daughters were to describe you using one of the nine steps from your book, which step would they say that you live out the most? And which one would they say you're still working on?

Christopher Lewis [00:29:07]: They know dad can be just absolutely brutal with someone who tries to come after one of my kids or someone that I love. The the first rule, pick one worthy enemy. They know that dad can just be utterly savage if he needs to be. Obviously you never turn that aggression in where that's for protecting your inner circle, those you love from the exterior. But one of the difficulties in that I found is that we have to set forth the difference between an enemy and a counterparty. A counterparty is not an enemy. A counterparty is someone that you're negotiating with. You'll be able to operate in a good faith effort to be able to find a winnable outcome for both parties as much as possible.

Christopher Lewis [00:29:44]: But an enemy, you don't negotiate with enemies, you destroy enemies. And so I think, I think if my kids had to say one thing, they know that dad loves a good fight, but it's got to be worthy enemy. It's not just a counterparty.

Rick Walker [00:29:56]: You've also, you've advised presidents, you've led nonprofits across the 50 states and countries. And yet you also do ballet drop offs and milkshake runs and other things that a dad would do. What's the most unexpected place you found wisdom about being a dad?

Christopher Lewis [00:30:12]: I found this book about daddy daughter dates. I forgot who wrote the book, but it was like 100 daddy daughter date ideas. And I kept this book on one of my tables in my office for years. I would pick it up and thumb through it maybe once a week and try to find an idea. When the kids were young and they had this, this one date idea where you would leave the house and your daughter would have a quarter and she would flip a quarter. If it's heads, you turn right tells you turn left and you'd side in advance how many flips you would do. So you would do eight, nine, ten flips. Well, you can be a long way from your house if you're doing 10 flips.

Christopher Lewis [00:30:40]: But the rule is you have to eat dinner together at the nearest place that serves food. And oftentimes it's a gas station. It's just a gas station. And so this idea that you can have Fun would just complete and utter nonsense sense. That's something that has been useful in the past. It is still useful today that we can just do stuff, just to do stuff, just because we're goofing around together. And that's been something because I'm not naturally a playful person and that's helped me let the guard down, hear from my daughters about what's really going on in their lives, what's what they're saying. And obviously we don't get to do that as much as we used to back in the old days with all the activities and stuff.

Christopher Lewis [00:31:15]: But it takes, it takes different forms. Takes different forms. Listen to silly music, watching silly videos together in these milkshake runs. These milkshake runs are fantastic. If you, if you've never been do a chick fil a after, let's say 7:30 any night of the week. It's an entirely milkshake business. It's milkshake and fries after 7:30. And there will be a run on the milkshake machine.

Christopher Lewis [00:31:33]: You'll find 20 cars lined up and everyone's getting milkshakes. And that's part of the deal. So you got to figure out a way how to have these little routines, these little rituals in with the family, wherever you can fit them. And that's been one of the useful things, these daddy daughter days and sort of these playful times of just complete, utter nonsense.

Rick Walker [00:31:47]: Now we always finish our interviews with what I like to call the dad connection. 66 more questions to delve into you as a dad. Are you ready?

Christopher Lewis [00:31:55]: Yeah.

Rick Walker [00:31:55]: What's one word that describes your relationship with your daughters?

Christopher Lewis [00:32:00]: Productive.

Rick Walker [00:32:01]: What's the best piece of dad advice that you've ever received?

Christopher Lewis [00:32:05]: Tell them you're proud of them every day.

Rick Walker [00:32:07]: What's one activity that you and your daughters love doing together? Going to eat Mexican food and then getting shakes afterwards.

Christopher Lewis [00:32:14]: Oh, absolutely. You got to get a shake afterwards. Yeah.

Rick Walker [00:32:16]: Now, if you could give your daughters one life lesson in a single sentence, what would you leave with them?

Christopher Lewis [00:32:22]: Avoiding an ounce of pain. You will drink a gallon of regret.

Rick Walker [00:32:26]: What's one thing you've learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

Christopher Lewis [00:32:30]: That if I want my daughters to marry someone who I believe is worthy, I've got to be prepared to act like that most worthy example for them. Because they're not going to marry someone that's too far away from how good or how bad a father I want.

Rick Walker [00:32:47]: Now, you've given a lot of pieces of advice today, a lot of ideas for men for fathers to think about and to incorporate into their own lives. As we finish up today, what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Christopher Lewis [00:33:03]: Tell them the things that they need to hear and make it every day and make it uncomfortable to hear. Sometimes it'll sound like routine. But if you let them know, I'm proud of you, I believe in you. You're awesome. I love you. If you haven't told your daughter I love you, some other man will. But he won't mean it. And he'll tell it for a different reason that you won't like.

Christopher Lewis [00:33:21]: So tell your daughters that you love them. Tell them that you're proud of them. Tell them that you believe in them. They need to hear those three things from you every single day. And if we can give them those ideas that they're loved, they're believed in, and there's someone out there that's proud of them. Oh, and he just happens to be the only man who they were born in the world to be in relationship with for as long as he lives. Well, that's just a side benefit, but we've got to get our daughters used to hearing and believing the things that will uphold them going forward and the things that confirm their identity in such a secularizing culture that we live in now.

Rick Walker [00:33:56]: Well, Rick, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for all that you've been sharing today. If people want to find out more about you about the book, where should they go?

Christopher Lewis [00:34:03]: So my website is rickwalker.com rickwalker.com and I send out a newsletter about every one or two weeks is a three, two one model. So you get three bangers. So these quotes that I've been dropping, you get three of those, I call them bangers. And then I'll give you two videos. So one will be teaching for the most part, another one will be an interview and then the third thing I'll give you is either an essay or some reflective questions to think about. So either a long form essay or reflective question. These are big idea essays or big idea thoughts. Those are the best things.

Christopher Lewis [00:34:31]: The book is available beginning July 5, Amazon, Barnes and Noble, Walmart, anywhere you buy your book books and you can actually pre order it right now. So Kindle ebook. I just wrapped up the audiobook yesterday so that'll be available for pre order as well and hardback and paperback.

Rick Walker [00:34:46]: And I will put links in the notes today so you can check out this book for yourself. And Rick, again, thank you, thank you for all that you've shared today for what you're putting out into the world to help other men to be able to live that life of meaning that we've been talking about. And I truly wish you all the best.

Christopher Lewis [00:35:04]: Christopher, thank you so much for having me. I really enjoyed our time together. That's a wrap for this episode of the dad and Daughter Connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn't about being perfect, it's about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don't forget, you can find all our episodes@dad dadanddaughterconnection.com until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting, and keep being the dad she needs. We're all in the same boat and it's full of tiny screaming passengers we.

Rick Walker [00:35:49]: Spend the time we give the lessons.

Christopher Lewis [00:35:55]: We made make the meals we buy them presents and bring your A game Cause those kids are growing fast the time goes by just like a dynamite blast Calling astronauts and firemen Carpenters and muscle men get out and be the world to them Be the best dinosaur you can be Be the best dad you can.

Hey dads, welcome back to Dad Connections in 5—where in just five minutes, we give you real, practical ways to stay connected with your daughter, no matter her age. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and today we’re talking about a question every dad eventually asks: “How do I keep my daughter talking to me as she gets older?”

You know how it goes—when she’s little, she can’t stop talking. She wants to tell you about her day, her dreams, her favorite color five times in one hour. But then, things change. She gets older. More independent. And sometimes… quieter.

But here's the good news: You can stay close. You can keep the conversations going. And today, I’ll show you how.

Why This Matters

Staying connected through conversation isn’t just about knowing the details of her day—it’s about: ✅ Keeping the door open for deeper topics ✅ Building trust so she turns to you when things get hard ✅ Letting her know: “Dad is always a safe place to land.”

The habits you build now shape whether she’ll come to you later—when it really counts.

3 Ways to Keep the Conversation Flowing (at Every Age) 1. Listen More Than You Talk

This sounds simple, but it’s powerful. When your daughter shares something—big or small—pause, stay present, and just listen. Avoid jumping in with advice, correction, or distraction.

Say things like:

• “That sounds frustrating. Tell me more.”
• “What did you think when that happened?”
• "I’m really glad you told me.”

When she sees that you won’t interrupt, judge, or fix, she learns that you’re someone she can come back to again and again.

2. Make Talking Feel Natural, Not a Big Event

If every conversation feels like an interrogation, she’ll shut down. So, make talking part of your daily rhythm—not something formal.

• Use car rides, bedtime, walks, or dinner as natural check-in moments.
• Keep your tone relaxed, your questions open, and your attention full.
• Don’t force it—sometimes the best conversations happen when you’re doing something else together (like cooking, shooting hoops, or running errands).

She’s more likely to open up when it doesn’t feel like a spotlight is on her.

3. Stay Curious About Her World

As she grows, her interests will change. Music, shows, social media, hobbies—you might not always understand them. But if you dismiss them, you might also miss your chance to connect.

• Ask her what she’s into
• Watch a show she likes and talk about it
• Ask for her playlist recommendations
• Be genuinely curious, even if it’s not your thing

When you stay interested in her world, she’s more likely to invite you in.

Quick Takeaway: Try This Today

Here’s your challenge: Today, ask one open-ended question—and just listen. No judgment. No fixing. No distractions.

Try something like:

• “What was the funniest thing that happened today?”
• “If you could plan our weekend, what would we do?”
• “What’s something you wish adults understood better?”

Then—just be present. Be quiet. Let her talk. And show her with your silence that her voice matters.

Because keeping your daughter talking to you as she grows isn’t about saying the perfect thing—it’s about being consistently safe, curious, and available. And when she knows she can talk to you about the small stuff, she’ll trust you with the big stuff too.

That’s it for today’s Dad Connections in 5. If this episode reminded you of how powerful your presence can be, share it with another dad who’s working to stay close as his daughter grows up. Until next time—keep listening, keep showing up, and keep letting her know that Dad is always ready to talk.

Parenting is a continual journey, one that evolves as our children grow and as we, too, learn new ways to connect with them. This week on the “Dad and Daughter Connection” podcast, Dr. Christopher Lewis sits down with Dr. Eran Magen—father, relationship expert, and creator of the Parenting for Humans and Divorcing Dads resources—for a heartfelt and refreshingly honest conversation about fatherhood, connection, and resilience.

Presence Over Perfection

One of the central themes of the episode is the power of presence. Eran shares that being fully present—and putting away distractions, especially digital ones—lays the groundwork for genuine connection. Whether through playful activities like acro yoga or watching a favorite show together, the focus isn’t on orchestrating perfect moments, but on truly showing up for our kids, time and time again.

Respect and Emotional Safety

Eran emphasizes treating children with deep respect, validating their feelings, and giving them true space to express themselves. Instead of rushing to fix problems or dismissing their emotions, he advocates for really listening—even paraphrasing back what they’ve shared—to make sure they feel heard and understood. This builds not only trust but helps children develop a positive, self-compassionate inner voice that stays with them for life.

Connection Before Correction

Drawing from his work at ParentingForHumans.com, Eran introduces the concept of prioritizing connection over correction. When the bond between parent and child is strong, discipline becomes less about control and more about collaboration. It’s about building relational habits—like kindness, presence, and respect—into everyday life, so that challenges are easier to navigate when they arise.

Navigating Divorce and Co-Parenting

For fathers navigating separation or divorce, Eran offers wisdom and hope. He urges dads not to let shame or fear of disconnection hold them back from seeking support, or from fighting for meaningful time with their children. Even in limited circumstances, quality of presence trumps quantity—being truly engaged makes all the difference.

Whether you’re a dad seeking fresh ideas, a parent amid big transitions, or simply someone passionate about fostering strong family relationships, this episode is an inspiring listen. Tune in for practical tips, honest stories, and compassionate advice that will help you nurture lasting bonds—one present moment at a time.

Ready to be inspired? Listen now to the full conversation on the “Dad and Daughter Connection” podcast!

If you enjoyed this episode we ask you to take a moment to take our Dad and Daughter Connection Survey to let us know more about you as a dad. You can also sign up to get our newsletter to stay connected to our community and we will send items of interest to you to help you to be the dad that you want to be. Feel free to follow me on the following social media platforms: Facebook, Facebook Group, Instagram, LinkedIn, X.

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]: Welcome to the dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]: If you're looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you're in the right place. I'm Dr. Christopher Lewis and the dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we'll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let's get started. Because being a great dad isn't just about being there. It's about truly connecting. Welcome back to the dad and Daughter Connection.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:05]: Welcome back to the dad and Daughter Connection, where every week I love being able to talk to you about this connection that you want to build with your daughters. And we do that every week because it is a process. This journey that you're on is going to be one where you're going to have to learn, you're going to have to grow, you're going to have to be willing to be open to finding new ways to build that relationship day by day. Because as your daughter grows, you can't just think that one way of doing things is going to happen and stay the same. You got to keep adjusting and being there, being engaged and helping your daughter one step at a time and being engaged and connected to your daughter in so many ways throughout their life. That being said, that's why every week I bring you different guests, different people with different experiences to help you along this journey, to give you some tools for your toolbox and to allow for you the opportunity to learn and grow, to be able to find new ways to build those stronger connections and to leave every episode with an opportunity to be able to start something new from the end of that episode on. This week we got another great guest. Dr.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:28]: Aran McGinn is with us today. And Aron is someone that, as he says, he believes in relationships, believes in people and helps people to have better relationships. Perfect fit for you as a dad with a daughter. He's also a father of a son, so we're going to be talking about his own journey being a father. He's been working with individuals for quite a few years and most recently he's been created two new resources that are definitely going to help you as a dad. He has a site by the name of Parenting for Humans as well as divorcingdads.org we're going to talk about both of these resources and some things that may help you along the way, depending on your own situation and where you're at. And I'm really excited to have him here today. Aron, thanks so much for being here.

Eran Magen [00:02:18]: My great pleasure. Thank you for inviting me on.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:21]: Well, it is my pleasure having you here. And as I said, you are a father of a son and I am really excited to be able to delve a little bit into you as a dad to get to know you and your own journey. I guess as you think back to the time that you've had with your son thus far, what's one of the most meaningful moments that you've been able to share with him and what made it so special?

Eran Magen [00:02:41]: I'm glad you want to talk about my son, because it's my favorite topic. And, you know, if we don't watch ourselves, we're going to have the podcast equivalent of me showing you every photo of my son except an audio version that I have. I'm. I'm one of those people. There are a lot of good moments. The most recent, I'll go with the most recent that, like, stood out to me, which was really fun. And then I'm happy to scan backwards, if you want, and come up with even better ones. I do a thing called acro yoga, and Acroyoga has very little to do with yoga and more to do.

Eran Magen [00:03:04]: Like, sometimes people call it partner acrobatics. It's when. When people balance on each other. And a lot of parents do this with their kids, right? The parent lies down on his or her back, and the kid is on the parent's feet, sort of belly down, arms forward, Superman, right? Like, we. We all do this with our kids, but it gets much more sophisticated, and you can do many more interesting things. People can sit on other people or stand on other people or flip around on other people and so on. And you can do it with grownups, and you can do it with kids, obviously. And it's easier with kids because they're little, alert.

Eran Magen [00:03:31]: And so this is something that I've been doing with my son since he was little, and we do it a little bit. I kind of wish he was super into it and he's kind of into it, but he's the most into it when he can show off to other people, when it's just the two of us. He's like, I don't know if I need to do it right now. But we were playing soccer in his school after I picked him up, and we're playing with another kid that often plays with us there. And then my son went off and did something else. And in the meantime, I was doing some acro yoga with this other kid, introducing him to it, and his mom, who was there and consented to the whole thing. And my son ran back and really wanted to do some acro to show the other kid that he knows more. That was very motivating for him.

Eran Magen [00:04:06]: And then we did, and it was fun. But then the next day we came out, and it was sort of the first day of spring here in Connecticut, and we. We just stepped out to the yard, and out of nowhere, my son says, dad, do you want to do some acro yoga? Do you want to practice? And my heart just Expanded. It was just so nice because he, he, you know, I didn't suggest it, I never mentioned it, but it was sort of back on his mind. And it's just so nice to feel like our kids are into things that we're into and they want to spend time together doing those things. That was a really fun moment, but they're just thousands of these stories. This is the most recent. I keep a spreadsheet that I made when he was born.

Eran Magen [00:04:36]: When he was born, I did two things. I created an email inbox for him, which I occasionally write to things that I can't say now that he wouldn't understand. So I write stuff that I want to tell him, letters for later, and I'll give him the login credentials when he's. Or 18 or something. And the other thing I did is start this spreadsheet called Milestones and Memories and First Times. And I just sit down and write stuff that happened every once in a while. So I have like this long list that I can go through and see the things that were exciting for me. When he was 2, when he was 4, when he was 6.

Eran Magen [00:05:04]: It's really fun. And this is one of those moments.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:06]: As your son is getting older and you are trying to guide him and work to be able to mold and meld him into the adult that he is becoming, how do you balance guiding your son while also giving him the independence to grow into his own person?

Eran Magen [00:05:23]: I think my job is mostly to provide kind of safety and nourishment and let him grow where he grows. I'm not trying too hard to move him one way or another. I'm vegan, for example. I don't insist on him being vegan. Not my job, not his problem. I keep my home vegan because it's more comfortable for me. But if he really wants to bring something into that, we're in the supermarket and we'll buy stuff and he really wants to get something that isn't, that's fine. Then we will.

Eran Magen [00:05:47]: Certainly, if we're out in the world and he wants to get something or word a party and he wants to eat a thing, everybody eating totally fine. And so I'm not trying exactly to mold him into anything. I'm trying to provide good supports for him as he grows into things. There's a little bit of a gray line, right? Because if I see him kind of starting to spin out about something, be really anxious about something in a way that I think is not necessary, I'll try to help him figure out ways to not be upset about it. And so is that molding? I sometimes ask myself. Yeah, but it feels very kind of benevolent and not coercive. You know, this. This feels more like me removing roadblocks than forcing him to go down a specific path.

Eran Magen [00:06:24]: And so I really think there are many ways to describe the job of parent, and many people have lots of ideas about what those jobs are. I think they're probably all true. I think one of the most important parts of being a parent, one of the most important jobs, is creating the voice that kids have inside their head, how they talk to themselves, because that voice will stay on for many, many years. And changing that voice requires a huge amount of therapy. And so that, to me, is a very, very important part of what I think about as a parent. How I hear him talking to himself and helping him adjust that voice. I'm not trying to tell that voice what to tell him to do. Right.

Eran Magen [00:06:56]: It's more how he relates to himself. So in a real sense, one of my primary jobs is making sure he has a good relationship with himself. What he grows up to be is up to him.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:07:04]: What are some intentional ways you've worked to strengthen your bond with your son, especially during challenging times?

Eran Magen [00:07:11]: I would divide the ways into two big categories. I think one is just helpful habits, and the other is maybe specific events or specific things in time. The most important habit by far is bringing my full presence. Right. My phone is away. My phone is often on do not disturb. It's 100% focus on him when I'm with him. And I think that makes an enormous difference.

Eran Magen [00:07:31]: He's not orbiting. We do stuff together. And when we're not doing stuff together, then we're not. Then we're doing stuff separately. But if we are connecting, I'm fully there. I'm not splitting my attention. And I think that's enormously important. The other thing that I do, I don't want to make it sound like I am the first person to do this or the first to have thought about it, but I just think it's so important, is I communicate with him with great respect.

Eran Magen [00:07:55]: I treat him as a person, not as a soldier or a servant or an ignorant person or any of those things. If he has a question or if he has a thought, we really discuss it for as long as he wants to, basically. And when I see that he's starting to look in different directions and is getting antsy, then we'll go do something else. Like, we don't have to belabor the point, but really taking Very seriously. His thoughts, his questions, his ideas, his opinions, they really count. So these are all things that I would put in the relational habits bucket in terms of the, like, more specific things that I do to strengthen the bond. We really do a lot of this stuff together. So for example, videos, YouTube, you know, or shows on Netflix or whatever, we watch those things together and we'll talk about them.

Eran Magen [00:08:37]: It's a big part of what we talk about later. And I think it's helpful to help him process and understand what he saw and what his opinion is and whatever. But I don't just like send him off to watch a thing and then we do our next thing. A lot of this kind of activity is something that, that we'll do together and it creates a huge amount of shared language and shared jokes and shared things. We also do just a lot of activities together. I'm into a lot of stuff and I'll offer these things to him and if it's of interest to him, then we'll do it and we'll go, you know, ice skating or practice proto jiu jitsu on the carpet or cook together or whatever, whatever it is. But a lot of time and a lot of shared activities. So I think this combination of doing lots of stuff that we both enjoy together and being very respectful of his preferences and opinions and thoughts and questions and ideas, and interacting him as though he's an actual person and not less of a person than I am.

Eran Magen [00:09:26]: These are probably the main columns supporting the relationship.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:29]: What's a mistake that you've made as a father and what did you learn from it about fostering a positive connection?

Eran Magen [00:09:37]: There are a couple of things. I remember where I noticed my son having difficulties with some things. And I thought, ah, the world will correct this. I don't need to step in. And that's sort of a, I don't know, call it like a general tendency that I have. I guess in some contexts it's good, in some contexts it's bad but. Or helpful and unhelpful rather. I guess.

Eran Magen [00:09:53]: But I tend to wait until stepping in and intervening with something and often that's a good thing. Like, you know, a lot of parents are really worried about their kids still using a pacifier when they're X months old or. And I've never seen a kid in college with a pacifier in his mouth. You know, like these things tend to work themselves out, but people can get super worried. And so I'm usually of the opinion that like the world will fix this. We just give it time and this will work out. But there are some things where he really had difficulty, and I waited too long to step in and do what I would consider a more significant intervention. Right.

Eran Magen [00:10:27]: Like some kinds of. I want to be mindful of my son's privacy as well, because in 60 years, when he chooses to do something, or in 40 years or 20 years, you know, somebody digs up, the podcast says, oh, you used to do this thing. So I'm actually. I'm very mindful of the privacy of kids in sessions that I do, including, I guess, when I'm interviewed. This is the first time that I'm talking about this. But he had some social challenges that he was going through and were noticeable to me. And I thought, oh, the world will polish this off. This will be okay.

Eran Magen [00:10:53]: And I think it was like, it. It required some sort of a more thoughtful, intentional intervention that eventually the school recommended, and then we did. And I think it's been very helpful and not. Not too hard. We didn't catch it super late. Like, no crisis resulted, but I could have done it earlier. I felt sad for not doing it, because it just would have made, I think, life a little easier for him during those, I don't know, two, three years. And now there's something that there's a pathway that got laid down that was not the most helpful.

Eran Magen [00:11:20]: And changing something and undoing something is always harder than it is just correcting course earlier on. So I don't know if this is exactly answering your question in terms of, like, a relational mistake, but this is a parenting mistake that I feel that I made and learned from.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:11:33]: No, it definitely does. And I think that, I mean, learning that is definitely something that all of us have to do along the way as well. Is there anything that you intentionally do to make your son feel valued and heard?

Eran Magen [00:11:45]: There are a few things that I do. And really, a lot of how I relate to my son is in service of making him feel valued and heard. And so I'm trying to pick out the more specific things that I do because a lot of this is on my mind, kind of ongoing. How do I make sure that he feels like he has a voice? And so a few things that I can say when he's upset about something. I remember this when he was two, and I remember this two weeks ago when he was seven and a half. I don't shut down the upset. I spend some time, a good deal of time, letting him express the upset, and I'm still comforting him during the process. But I don't say it's not a problem.

Eran Magen [00:12:19]: I don't say, you know, stop crying. I don't say, you know, I ask him to explain what happened and what was so upsetting. And I'll kind of sit in it with him and I'll paraphrase and say it back and so on. But I'm not trying to shut it down or fix it too quickly. And I think that's really important because I've seen him develop this habit of as a result, I believe, of when something upsetting or surprising or scary happens, he'll have the reaction, but then he'll narrate the process back to me and sort of calm himself down as he more or less immediately gains an understanding of this story and what made him upset. I think that's been really useful. But I think just in general, it's a nice thing for people to do with one another, right? Not shut down the upset, but rather sit with it for a little bit and sit in it together. His opinions really matter.

Eran Magen [00:12:57]: If he suggests things that didn't occur to me, I'll consider them really seriously. He's at this point, he's suggested some ideas for not just ways to spend a day, but like a vacation destination or a totally new activity that we've never done that he just heard about from a friend, and that becomes a real thing. We'll research it together a little bit, and if it seems appealing, we'll go and give it a try. So he really gets to to lead when he wants to, or at least suggest directions, and then I'll operationalize it. But he has a real voice and a real say in how we spend time individually and as a family.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:30]: Now, I mentioned at the beginning that you have a few different resources that are available. You have your parentingforhumans.com website as well as divorcingdads.org and both of those were created not only to help others like yourself that were going through similar things, but also in your work and your engagement with people and seeing the need. You expanded that. And there are a couple of questions that came up when I looked at both of these sites. And I think first and foremost, when I was [email protected], your site emphasizes connection before correction. Can you explain what that means and why it's so crucial for parents, especially fathers?

Eran Magen [00:14:12]: It's my strong belief and also my consistent observation that when the relationship between a parent and a child is good, everything is easy. There's just not the constant conflict. There's not the badgering. Do this now, like I told you a thousand times, things are just easy and smooth. And when people have a stronger relationship, then there's more trust and there's more willingness to be vulnerable and honest on both sides. And there's more forgiveness and there's more cooperation. And so spending time just laying the foundations and having a good relationship just preempts and prevents all these negative things that then need to get corrected. It's sort of like living a life and eating well and doing a reasonable amount of exercise and sleeping enough, socializing and having enough fun, and then you just have to deal with a lot less, fixing medical problems.

Eran Magen [00:14:57]: Right. They just tend to happen. And I think it's very much like that in relationships too. Just spending time building a strong relationship rather than relying on occasional forceful corrections which leave everybody, I think, unhappy, basically. And for a lot of people growing up, the role of the dad is often as the disciplinarian. At least that's the caricature. I'm not totally sure that that's always true or even true the majority of the time. I know a lot of soft dads, and I know a lot of harsh moms, and I know a lot of harsh dads and a lot of soft moms.

Eran Magen [00:15:26]: But I do think that a lot of men, certainly from the past three generations, grew up not being taught how to show affection in a soft way and how to connect in a way that feels warm and comfortable and consistent, as opposed to occasionally dropping in and doing some big gesture, but in the meantime being sort of cold or reserved or stoic. And when you don't have a strong relationship, inevitably things start, start sliding and then you need big corrections to happen, which I think damage the relationship further. So I'm a big, big believer of creating that foundation of just a strong relationship through good daily, call it relational hygiene, just developing good relational habits. Things that we do without thinking over the course of the day as, as a habit that we, we adopt. And through that, strengthening the relationship constantly.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:13]: Now, many parents want to be more supportive, but fall into that problem solving mode. How can dads become better listeners and emotionally attuned to their kids?

Eran Magen [00:16:23]: There's one technique that I think is magic and keeps us safe. It keeps us from making these kinds of relational mistakes. And the technique is not only magic, but also super simple, which is what's so nice about it, which is paraphrasing. Learn to say back what the other person said to you. And the, the thought behind it is the thought we want to have behind it when we're paraphrasing. Is, am I understanding your experience correctly? Just that, right? So our kids come in, our kid comes in and looking, you know, unhappy. And we say, what's going on? And kid is in a sharing mood that day. And she says, oh, my friend Jessica is being a pain at school.

Eran Magen [00:16:59]: And so to be able to say in our heads, huh, let's see if I understand correctly my kid's experience and saying, so Jessica is being mean to you because that's what we understood. And then our kid might say, no, no, she's not being mean to me. She's being super nice to me. But I know that behind my back she, blah, blah, whether we get it right or we get it wrong, it doesn't matter. Just putting herself in a position and in kind of a mental stance of trying to understand our child, child. And all we need to do is say back what we heard. We don't need to interrogate, we certainly don't need to diagnose, definitely not give advice. Just getting in the habit of when our kid looks upset to just once, just for one turn, try to paraphrase, try to say back what we understood.

Eran Magen [00:17:40]: And seeing what happens. And very often they will share more and more. And it's kind of amazing because parents often feel like their kids, once they hit a certain age, will not share with them anymore. But if we're not trying to shape their experience, they want to be heard, right? And as we build trust with them, they share more and more. So if I could suggest one single thing, which I think is what you, you were asking me to do, I would say try paraphrasing once as the first thing you do in a conversation and see what happens. And then if you can, keep on paraphrasing as they continue talking.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:07]: Now, you also talk about emotional safety and parent child relationships. What are some simple everyday ways fathers can do that?

Eran Magen [00:18:15]: So I'll continue a little bit from my previous answer and then I'll give a couple of other things. The huge power of paraphrasing comes not just from having the child correct you yes or no, but we're showing so much when we're trying to check if we understand the child's experience right. We're showing that we want to know. We're showing that we're not judging and we're not taking charge of the conversation. We're letting the child lead. We're showing that we're curious about the child's experience and validated. There's just so much power there. And we do all this pretty Implicitly, through the process of paraphrasing.

Eran Magen [00:18:44]: I think also doing it explicitly is very, very important. So a lot of us grew up not seeing examples of. Well, some of us just grew up without having people around us saying, I love you or I care about you or any of those things. And then we feel awkward saying them ourselves to other people. And likewise, maybe we never saw examples of people saying something like, your happiness is the most important thing for me, or I really care about how you feel, and I want to know what. What could make things better for you, in your opinion or any. Any of those things. And I think that the assumption of telepathy, or the hope of telepathy, silent relationship killer, including between parents and kids.

Eran Magen [00:19:22]: Right? Because we know parents occasionally will say in anger, everything I do, I do for you. How could you possibly think that I don't care? And usually when it's done in anger, it happens because it's. It's too late into the process. And the kid really didn't understand. The kid really didn't see it. And being able to verbalize it earlier is so important. So I think getting into the habit of telling our kids, not in anger, but in great warmth and happiness to say, I'm so happy to see you happy. Let's say something good happened.

Eran Magen [00:19:48]: Our kid, you know, did something that our kid feels good about. And to say, this is awesome. I'm so glad to see you so happy. You know, I love seeing you happy like this. Like, just remembering to say these things rather than just say, good job, you know, punch in the shoulder, move on with our day. It's so important to verbalize it. And when our kid is upset to say, I can see you're upset, you know, and I really want to help you solve it. Or if our kid says, I really want to get into band at school.

Eran Magen [00:20:11]: And then two days later, we realized that it would be a good idea for a kid to spend more time practicing the oboe or. Or whatever it is using to get into band. And to say, not just, I think you should be practicing your oboe. Like, if you want to get into band, I think you should just. But to lead with. I remember a couple days ago, we were talking about how much you want to get into band. And their kid goes, yeah. And we say, you know, I.

Eran Magen [00:20:31]: I want to see you achieving your goals, right? I want to see you happy and doing things you want to do. And it looks like band is one of those things. And. And I was thinking about ways, you know, things you could do or we could do to help you get into band. Do you want to talk about this? Do you want to hear what I'm thinking? Right. But just being explicit about our goodwill toward our child, ridiculous as it sounds to many parents, is so important because the kids don't know. How would they know this is their first time around. Right.

Eran Magen [00:20:54]: We're just. We're expl. Expecting them to know all these things that they. They might not. And so being explicit about our goodwill toward our kids is enormously important. So that's one thing. And the second thing I'll say much more briefly is remembering to be present is number one, to be nice is number two, and to be respectful is number three. So being present, I talked about this already.

Eran Magen [00:21:13]: Just actually having times when are dedicated to our kids and everything else on the side. Being nice. By being nice, I mean remembering to actually say thank you, remembering to praise, remembering to tell them how good we feel when we're around them or we see that they did certain things. These are all so important and don't happen often. And then number three, in terms of being respectful, I touched on this before. Treating them like we would treat people who are farther from us, like we would treat colleagues in terms of the level of respect. So not just kind of waving your hand at them when it's time for them to leave or do a thing, but actually turning our body and looking at them and saying, why don't you? Blah, blah, blah, or would you please? Or things like that, instead of shouting instructions from a distance, coming over and speaking with them and saying about the things that we want them to do. So being present, being kind, being respectful goes an extremely long way in just developing habits around that into our daily behavioral, relational repertoire.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:05]: Now, I mentioned that you have another resource called divorcing dads.org and I know that you created that not only for yourself, but for others that are going, that went through or are going through divorce and what they can do to be able to not only stay connected to their child, but be advocates for their child, etcetera, etcetera. And I know that divorce can bring a sense of failure or shame. When I've talked to dads that have gone through this in the past, that's definitely the case. What's the first mindset shift that you encourage fathers to make when they go through a separation?

Eran Magen [00:22:39]: I think the very first act to do when going through a separation is to connect with support. Like you said, a lot of people are blocked because they feel ashamed of what's happening, whether or not they Feel it's their fault. They feel like this is a shameful thing and not to discuss or they don't want to talk about it with other people. It's very common. I agree. But to connect with support is step one. Step one is not to eliminate the shame or remove the shame. That can take a long time.

Eran Magen [00:23:01]: Connect with support anyway, right? Just going to deal with the shame. You don't have to change it right away. We do want to change it later on. But step one, by far the most important thing, connect with support. Friends, family, people who care about you, counseling, faith leaders, you know, a hotline, whatever it is. But just connect with somebody. Start getting support. Don't, you know, sit alone in your dark home despairing.

Eran Magen [00:23:23]: That road leads to very bad places. Just immediately reach out and connect with support.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:27]: Now I know that in looking at your site you've said that co parenting is more like being co workers than ex lovers. How can dads adopt a more businesslike approach to parenting with an ex without sacrificing empathy or communication?

Eran Magen [00:23:44]: There are many flavors of co parenting, you know, depending on how the separation and divorce happen. I know co parents who used to be be romantic partners. They have a very good relationship and it's very easy and fluid and supportive and friendly and that's wonderful. And I think that's ideal. And sometimes that doesn't happen, right? Sometimes there's neutral at best relationships or sometimes there's a lot of bitterness and hostility and stress. And still things need to happen, right? Decisions need to happen about the kids. Logistics do need to be coordinated one, one way or another. So what I'm going to say now, I'm referring to these more high tension in or more conflict ridden relationships.

Eran Magen [00:24:19]: Not the super friendly. If it's super friendly then, then great, be super friendly. You don't need to force collegial relationship on a friendship. If there's a friendship there, that's ideal, that's wonderful. But if there isn't, how do we still communicate? So tension will rise as conflict rises. Anything we can do to reduce conflict, I think is worth doing. And you know what, I'll take another little detour here. There's this, I think myth floating around that kids are hurt by divorce.

Eran Magen [00:24:40]: The divorce is bad for kids. That's not the case. What's bad for kids is being exposed to parental conflict whether or not the parents are married or divorced. And you can see this easily in very bad relationships where people stay together. The kids have a very difficult time and will carry that difficult time for a long time and divorces that are friendly and cooperative and work well, the kids are doing fine later on, it's so important to insulate the kids from parental conflict. So ideally reduce conflict and at any rate insulate the kids from the conflict. And so first principle is whatever we can do to reduce conflict, we should. And if we're able to discuss it with the other parent in advance, things that we disagree on but can agree on, on solutions that work for everybody, great.

Eran Magen [00:25:18]: If we can't do it on our own, go to a mediator, work on that, go to a co parenting coach or counseling or something like that. These things exist and work and are well worth it in terms of treating the parent as a colleague. Create boundaries, Create boundaries that work for you and ideally work for the other parent as well. But certainly they have to work for you. Whatever makes you feel safe physically, emotionally, relationally is fair game. You can ask, please don't contact me during these and these hours unless it's an emergency or you can say, let's limit our communication to email. Email, I'd rather not talk on phone or it's too spontaneous or make up a reason or whatever you need. Right? But if it's too activating for you to talk with the other parent or you get kind of sucked into conflict this way, then find communication methods that do work for you and respect the wishes of the other parent about this.

Eran Magen [00:26:02]: Right. Because the goal is to reduce tension. There's so much stuff that can easily activate either parent and so find ways to communicate that cause the least amount of activation for the other parent. And the other is like in a work setting, just have very clear delineation. Here are the to do on items. Here's what you're going to do. Here's what I'm going to do. Is this correct? Just assume nothing, make it super, super clear what's going to happen.

Eran Magen [00:26:26]: And lastly, if the other parent is acting in ways that are upsetting to you or uncomfortable to you as you're trying to do something for your child, just do your best to put aside, ignore the emotional layer of the communication. Focus on the logistical so you can do that. Just like if you had an annoying co worker and there was nothing you could do about it because you tried fixing it and the language didn't change and you went to HR and they don't care and they're like, well, well they're technically within the balance of whatever and so you can't change their behavior. But focus on the actual specifics that need to happen in Order to make sure you're taking care of your kid. And remember that this person is no longer your anything other than the parent of your children. Right. I think it's a very helpful semantic switch to go from my ex to my kid's mom because it's actually true. That is the function of the person in your life right now.

Eran Magen [00:27:12]: And I think it helps us remember also that this person is actually very important. Important. And we need to treat that person with the right level of respect and consideration because our kids need their mom. It's like they need their dad. And it reminds us to just tread a little more lightly because we don't want to actually hurt our kid's mom or distance our kid's mom. The kids need their mom. We just need to figure out how to coordinate.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:34]: Some fathers worry about becoming less present or connected after a divorce. What can they do to maintain a strong bond with their kids, even if custody time is limited?

Eran Magen [00:27:45]: Feminine There are a few things to do and I'll say them in no particular order. One is work to have more time with the kids. It can happen through discussion and agreement or it can happen through legal action. But don't give up on having more time with your kids. That's really important because it's very easy to perceive a societal message that says there's no reason for you to have more time with your kids or of course they should be spending more time with their mom. It's kind of a societal default at this point and you don't have to accept the default default. And it's okay for you to want to and act to have more time. So again, first and foremost, express your wishes clearly.

Eran Magen [00:28:19]: And if your wishes can't be met, if you're not able to see them as much as you would like, consider pursuing them possibly through legal action. That's a possibility. Consult with a lawyer and see what can happen. Or at least I mean start with mediation and then ideally go to non adversary legal representation, which is a whole thing that I wasn't aware of before, where it's a lawyer who, who signs an agreement with you in advance to never represent you in court. And so they're incentivized to keep you out of court because if you go to court, you stop working with that lawyer. So the incentives become aligned through that kind of practice. So if you and your kid's mom can get with a non adversarial practice, that's a huge win. And if necessary, yes, go to court, of course.

Eran Magen [00:28:54]: But step one, make your wishes known. Step two, argue and work to actualize your wishes. Having said this, in the meantime, what do you do in terms of connecting with your kids? One really important thing to remember is that, that it's extremely hard for kids to become disconnected from their parents. There are many kids, I'm sure that all of us know, and maybe some of us have been, who see their dad once a week, twice a month, once a month, three times a year. And still as kids had this sense of like, this is my dad and it's exciting, I'm going to go see my dad. Where, you know, as the dad in the story, you're like, this is horrible. I'm never seeing my kids and I don't know what's going on with them. But the kids remain very connected to their parents.

Eran Magen [00:29:31]: It takes a lot to disconnect, connect the kid from the parent. And so fear less, have less fear about your kids becoming estranged from you. Again, do what you can to have more time. But, but it's unlikely your kids will stop thinking about you as their dad or as their parent and want to connect with you. So that's, number one, just kind of reduce intensity internally. Number two, during the times that you do have together, be a hundred percent present, especially if you don't have a lot of time together, 100% present, zero distractions, block everything off. It's, it's amazing what the impact of this kind of quality time is. And if you look around at friends who have access to their kids all the time, you may discover that they have a lot less quality time with their kids than you do because they're not as focused, they kind of take it for granted.

Eran Magen [00:30:12]: And you can build an amazing relationship off of a handful of times a week for a relatively short amount of time. If you're 100% focused and present on the relationship, you don't need to do crazy stuff. You don't need to constantly bombard them with gifts. You do not need to play catch up with the things that they do with the other parent or compete on gifts and excitingness and whatnot. Just focus on being the best father you can be while you're with them. It'll take you such a long way and they will stay connected to you. Just be present, Just use that time that you have well.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:46]: You also provide scripts and guidance for difficult conversations. What's a good way for a dad to explain the divorce to his child in an age appropriate, supportive way?

Eran Magen [00:30:57]: So back to first principles. It's really important to insulate kids from parental conflict. Exposing Kids to parental conflict and parental animosity is just very bad for the kids. The kids are strongly connected to both parents. They can't help it. Asking them to acknowledge that you're upset or hurt or, you know, what have you, it is tearing them apart. It's just so damaging. And so leaving that part out, I think is very important.

Eran Magen [00:31:23]: Maybe that's something you talk about with them when they're 30. It'll still hurt when they're 30, but by then they will have figured some of it out. But leave out the hurt and the nastiness. And I would say talk in terms of friendship. Talk in terms of, we were such good friends for a long time, you know, and we lived together and we had you and we had your sister, and we were so happy in doing this. And at some point, and then whatever the actual story is, I think it's fair to say maybe it was your decision, maybe it was Mom's decision, maybe it was a mutual decision. But you could say, like, you know, at some point we realized that we don't want to live together anymore. We want to live separately.

Eran Magen [00:31:53]: And we, of course, continue to be our parents. And that's a point to keep emphasizing. Right? We both love you so much, and you. You are so important to us. But we didn't want to continue living together. We decided to go more or less our separate ways, but to continue to be your parents and make sure that we're taking care of you and all of this and kind of present it fairly lightly. I wouldn't say nonchalantly. It's not like, I mean, unless that's the model of relationships you want your kid to have in their head, if that's how you're thinking about it.

Eran Magen [00:32:18]: But for me, personally, I don't want to present it as, oh, yeah, you know, we were super committed to each other and lived together and then decided not to. And, you know, we'll see what happens, happens next. Like, it's a big thing. Maybe it's a big, important decision, and it's okay to say it was. It was sad for us or it was hard to figure out how to continue from there. But, you know, we knew all the time that the most important thing is to take care of you, blah, blah, blah. And I think that about covers it. So just kind of sanitize it a little bit in terms of conflict.

Eran Magen [00:32:41]: Sanitize the conflict out of it. Explain that you reached a decision that was ultimately mutual. Right. Even if, let's say it was. It was Mom's idea And you really didn't like it. Eventually you agreed to the separation, obviously. Right. You're not camping out under mom's bed against her wishes.

Eran Magen [00:32:55]: Like you agreed at some point that this needs to happen. Sanitize the conflict. Emphasize that was a mutual decision. Emphasize repeatedly that you are committed to your kids, that they're important to you, that you love them, that you want to do the right thing for them always. And that's about it. You don't need to dwell on it an enormous amount. Kids, especially when they're younger, up until, I don't know, maybe nine or so, are so amazingly self centered. They don't dwell too much on like your experience of things.

Eran Magen [00:33:20]: It doesn't really matter to them. They just need a story that makes sense to them, to them. And I think that version of the story is reasonable that you tell them later on as they get older. If they want more detail, maybe you can share. But I would encourage everybody to not disparage the other parent ever again and not start kind of hearing the kid in both directions or say things that are can be upsetting about the other parent. And if you hit a point where the kid asks a question, which they will at some point about the other parents motivation or about the other parent's thinking or about why would the parent do this thing? The answer is, you know, I really don't totally understand it myself, but I respect your mom's wishes or you know, her choices. And I don't have a better answer that sometimes people do things that we don't understand completely, but they still get to make the choices that they make and leave it at that. If the kid wants to go talk to the other parent about it, fine.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:34:07]: We always finish our interviews with what I like to call the dad connection six where six more questions to delve into you a little bit deeper as a dad. Are you ready?

Eran Magen [00:34:16]: I am ready.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:34:17]: What's one word that describes your relationship with your son?

Eran Magen [00:34:20]: Joyful.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:34:20]: What's the best piece of dad advice you've ever received?

Eran Magen [00:34:24]: I'll give you a twofer actually. As I was going through the separation process and I was very worried about my son becoming essentially estranged from me because I didn't see him a lot the first few years and a friend taught me to ask two questions whenever I start kind of spinning out. One is how's my son doing? And the other is how's my connection with my son? And as long as the answer is good and good, then there's nothing to worry about. Sure. I might want to See him more. Sure, I might worry about what will happen in the future, but right now, he's well, he's taken care of. He's fine. And my connection with him is great.

Eran Magen [00:34:50]: And so the problem is more in my head than in the world. So learning to ask these two questions, specifically, going through a divorce or separation, how's my son doing? How's my connection with my son?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:34:59]: What's one activity you and your son love doing together?

Eran Magen [00:35:02]: There's so many. I'm gonna have to go with wrestling. I've been doing jiu jitsu for many years now, and I love it. And I'm very careful not to sort of impose it on my son, but I would say at least every other day, he'll sort of tackle me to the ground and then start climbing on me and kind of shriek and enjoy himself. And it's just super fun. It's so physical. It's not violent. Like, we're very gentle with each other.

Eran Magen [00:35:21]: There's so much physical contact that happens that's really fun. Sometimes it'll stop and ask a technical question, and then I feel good about being able to explain something, but it's. We're just messing around most of the time, so just kind of rolling around on the carpet or the beanbag. It's just super fun.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:35:33]: If you could give your son one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Eran Magen [00:35:38]: I think about this a lot. One life lesson, one advice for life that I would give my son. Son feels so momentous. A message that I often convey to him is, you can learn anything. You can become great at anything if you're willing to put in the work.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:35:53]: Finally, what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their kids?

Eran Magen [00:36:02]: Have focused, present fun with your kids, starting now, and never stop. It's not a later thing. Just right now, start having the relationship you want to have all the time.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:36:11]: Well, Aran, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for being here today, for sharing your journey as a father, but also the resources that you have created. If people want to find out more about you, where should they go?

Eran Magen [00:36:22]: Well, first of all, thank you for your very thoughtful questions and responses. I really appreciate it. Like, it's clear that you're so connected and interested and thoughtful about it. It's really. It's such a pleasure to get to think about my own parenting this way to learn about me. I. Yeah, the two places would be either parenting for humans.com that you mentioned or divorcing dads.com that you mentioned then I'm very easy to find and contact through these places.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:36:46]: Well, again, Aran, thank you. Thank you for being here today and for sharing this and I wish you all the best.

Eran Magen [00:36:53]: Likewise. Thank you so much.

Hey dads, welcome to another episode of Dad Connections in 5, the podcast that gives you quick, meaningful ways to strengthen your relationship with your daughter—five intentional minutes at a time. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and today we’re talking about something fun, energizing, and powerful for connection: exploring new hobbies and interests together.

You don’t need a perfect plan, expensive equipment, or shared expertise. You just need curiosity, a little time, and a willingness to try something new—with her.

So let’s talk about why exploring hobbies together matters, how to get started, and a few creative, low-pressure ideas that can bring you closer today.

Why This Matters

Shared experiences build strong relationships. And when you try something new with your daughter, you’re not just filling time—you’re saying:

• “I want to know what you enjoy.”
• “I’m interested in learning with you.”
• “It’s okay to be beginners together.”

These moments create laughter, conversation, teamwork—and long-lasting memories. Plus, you’re modeling a growth mindset: that it’s always okay to try something new, even if you’re not good at it right away.

3 Practical Ways to Explore New Interests Together 1. Let Her Lead the Way

Ask your daughter: “Is there anything you’ve always wanted to try?”

It might be something unexpected:

• Painting or digital art
• Martial arts
• Photography
• Gaming
• Baking a new recipe
• Gardening
• Creative writing or poetry

If she’s passionate about something—even if it’s not your thing—lean in. Trying it together shows her that her interests matter to you, and it gives her the chance to take the lead for once.

2. Try Something Neither of You Has Done Before

Pick something totally new to both of you. That way, you’re both starting from scratch and learning together.

• Take a beginner class online (like drawing, coding, or sign language)
• Build something—a birdhouse, a puzzle, a LEGO masterpiece
• Learn a few chords on the guitar
• Explore nature—go geocaching, hiking, or try birdwatching

This levels the playing field. You’ll laugh together, mess up together, and figure things out as a team. That’s where connection grows.

3. Make It a Monthly “New Thing Day”

Pick one day a month to try something totally different together. It could be 30 minutes or a whole afternoon. Rotate who picks the activity.

• Make it a tradition:
  • “New Thing Saturdays”
  • “Try-It Tuesdays”
  • “Adventure Afternoons”

Snap a picture, keep a small journal, or just reflect together after: “What did you like? Would we do it again?”

You’re not just adding fun to your routine—you’re building shared memories that stick.

Quick Takeaway: Try This Today

Here’s your challenge: Ask your daughter one simple question—“What’s something new we could try together this week?”

• Let her brainstorm
• Offer a few ideas if she’s unsure
• Pick something low-pressure and do it—just for the fun of it

And remember—it doesn’t have to be perfect. It just has to be together.

Because in the end, trying something new with your daughter isn’t really about the activity itself—it’s about the space you’re creating to grow, laugh, and connect.

That’s it for today’s Dad Connections in 5. If this episode sparked an idea, send it to a fellow dad who’s ready to explore new adventures with his daughter. Until next time—keep showing up, keep trying new things, and keep building that lifelong connection.

On the latest episode of the Dad and Daughter Connection podcast, Dr. Christopher Lewis sits down with Dustin Lolli, lead singer of the band Sanctus Real, for a candid conversation about what it really means to be a present, engaged dad—especially to daughters at two very different life stages. Throughout the episode, listeners are treated to heartfelt stories, honest admissions of “mistakes,” and practical wisdom on raising confident, independent daughters.

Fatherhood Across Generations

Dustin shares the unique experience of being a father to both a 21-year-old and a 5-year-old daughter. He reflects on the surprises and joys of meeting each child exactly where they are—from encouraging an early love of art and animals in his oldest, to discovering what makes his youngest “tick.” The message is clear: there’s no manual, and every child truly is unique. What matters most is the willingness to stay curious, adaptable, and humble.

Fostering Independence & Stability

One powerful theme is the delicate balance between guidance and independence. As Dustin describes, the journey is a “push and pull”—supporting his daughters as they take chances, make mistakes, and hone their passions, while also providing a secure foundation they can always come home to. He espouses the importance of loving consistency over quick fixes, and of letting kids know that stability and support are always present, even as they navigate their own paths.

Music, Family, and Finding Passion

Music runs deep in the Lolli family, but Dustin is quick to note that he and his wife encourage their children to find their own unique passions, not simply follow in their footsteps. An especially touching moment is Dustin’s retelling of recording “Confidence” as a duet with his daughter Arden—not because she wanted the spotlight, but because it was a special moment to connect and create together.

Faith, Hope, and Real-World Parenting

With faith at the center of his message, Dustin brings a sense of hopefulness to the challenges of raising kids today, especially when it comes to social media and comparison culture. He emphasizes leading with love, authenticity, and an understanding that parenting is about the child’s needs, not the parent’s expectations.

Why You Should Listen

This episode isn’t just for dads; it’s for anyone who values deep family connections, honest conversations, and real-life stories about learning, loving, and growing together. Tune in to hear Dustin’s thoughtful insights and be inspired to show up as the parent your children need—flaws, questions, and all.

Ready to be inspired? Listen to the full episode of the Dad and Daughter Connection—you’ll come away with wisdom to last a lifetime.

If you enjoyed this episode we ask you to take a moment to take our Dad and Daughter Connection Survey to let us know more about you as a dad. You can also sign up to get our newsletter to stay connected to our community and we will send items of interest to you to help you to be the dad that you want to be. Feel free to follow me on the following social media platforms: Facebook, Facebook Group, Instagram, LinkedIn, X.

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]: Welcome to the dad and Daughter Connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]: If you're looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you're in the right place. I'm Dr. Christopher Lewis and the dad and Daughter Connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we'll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let's get started. Because being a great dad isn't just about being there. It's about truly connecting. Welcome back to the dad and Daughter Connection.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:54]: I am so excited that you're back with us again this week. As always, every week, I love being on this journey with you and I call it a journey because the connections that we want to build with our daughters happen daily. But we have to do what we can to learn, to grow, to build stronger connections. And it's not always going to be easy. There's going to be some bumps in the road. You got to be willing to go for the long run, go in for the long haul and make sure that you know that you can ask for help, you can learn from others, and that's what this podcast is all about. Every week I love being able to bring you different people with different experiences that are fathering in different ways, are building those connections in different ways, but they are learning along with their daughters as well, and that is so important. This week we got another great guest.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:50]: Dustin Lally is with us and Dustin is the lead singer of Sanctus Real, a band. If you've never heard of it, I'm going to say Google it, but I'll have a link in the notes today. But definitely it is a band that's been around for over 30 years. Amazing music. We're going to talk a little bit about his music as well, but he's a father of four and he's got two daughters. He's got a 21 year old daughter and a five year old daughter. So we got both ends of the spectrum and we're going to talk about that journey that he's been on to be able to build those strong connections with his own daughter. And I'm really excited to have him here today.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:23]: Dustin, thanks so much for being here.

Dustin Lolli [00:02:24]: Well, thanks for having me. This is great.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:27]: Well, I'm really excited to have you here. And as I said, building those relationships takes time. It takes effort. And you know, I think as you think about both your daughters and as I said, they're at two ends of the spectrum in regards to where they are in life. What's one of the most meaningful moments that you've been able to share with your daughters and what made it so special?

Dustin Lolli [00:02:51]: I think I've always had, you know, our oldest daughter is a firstborn. So the first four years she was just with us. And so there's, there was a lot of connecting time there, right? Like, and I was young, I mean, I was 21 when we got married. My wife got pregnant three months after we got married. So her birthday is two days from our first year anniversary. So I was a kid, right? Like having a child and not only having a child, having a girl child for a 21 year old boy, you know that you have these, these moments and I, I just, I just fell in love immediately. But you have so much, Obviously when you're 21, you really have so much to learn. And I think what I noticed first off, like one of the first meaningful moments where I was like, okay, this is a unique child, like a unique person, right? This isn't, I don't know what it is.

Dustin Lolli [00:03:40]: When you're young, you're like, everything is going to fit into almost like a movie. You're right, like you, you're making the steps of your life and then the first plot twist happens and it's like, oh, I gotta deal with this. But my daughter, from an early age, she loved to go out and draw. And it was like amazing at an early age. And she had a great vocabulary. She'd be talking early and one day she's drawing and she drew a shark and a seal and the shark was eating the seal and she drew blood everywhere. This is a girl, a little baby girl. She's like 4 years old and I'm 5 years old maybe and, and I'm like, what is that? And she said she was watching the Discovery Channel and saw Shark Week, right? I remember this feeling of like, this is a sweet baby girl, but she also loves, loves this other nature and animals and art.

Dustin Lolli [00:04:31]: And it was, I know it doesn't sound like much, but for me I was sitting there going, I've got a lot to learn about this and helping her see these things. And I loved it. But you're looking at it from a perspective of, I thought it was going to be this sweet, dainty little thing. And here she's drawing blood coming out of a seal, right? Like, oh. And she still Works with animals, right? This is. She's had this love for animals, and she was like, just real little, and she. Now she works with dogs, and she works and she draws, and it's amazing. So that little moment with just me and we're looking at this thing, I was like, okay, this.

Dustin Lolli [00:05:04]: I got a lot to learn about my own daughter. And so we started doing things more with animals. And, like, she started learning about animals, and we took her to. She has a really great picture where they had a live wolf. She got to take pictures, like, actual pictures with the wolf. And so just those moments to start with her were just. I found her loves, right? Her interests and her mom. We just found what she loved, and we really are.

Dustin Lolli [00:05:29]: What we really wanted to do from the beginning was. Was encourage her to do the things that she loved. And part of our. Even our schooling that we gave her was art, and we wanted her to learn with passion. That moment, though, stands out because it was like a turning point for me, right? Like, I was like, okay, I gotta change my thinking to, this is a real human being. This isn't. This isn't just out of a movie. This is a girl who' to develop and develop her own passions and develop her own things.

Dustin Lolli [00:05:55]: And I'm a guy, and I have no idea what any of that looks like.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:05:58]: So now you also have a daughter that's five and two other kids along with your other daughter. So I guess now with having a daughter at the other end of the spectrum, and you have an adult daughter now, how are you taking what you learned from your firstborn in building that relationship with your youngest as well?

Dustin Lolli [00:06:23]: It's funny because I think it's two things psychologically. It's not just, hey, I get to learn from her. It's that I'm older anyway. Like, I see the world differently. There's a lot of experience with having four, and they're all very distinct personalities and different people. And so I think for me, it's. It's not just, hey, thinking back to how my oldest name is Arden. It's not just thinking back to that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:06:45]: It's.

Dustin Lolli [00:06:45]: It's kind of taking the sum of all of this experience and going, what this girl? And of course, she's in a different place again because my youngest, her next closest sibling, is 14, so she's kind of an only child at this age, too. So we're looking at it from a perspective again of we want her to be healthy emotionally, we want her to be healthy mentally. And there are so many things now in Life that will from screens and to all of this stuff that are going to try to take some of that away from her that we're learning and we're doing our best to have a balanced, balanced life. And we learned that with Arden. The problem with Arden was, you know, you have these kids who are easy. And I thought I was a great parent with her because she was intelligent early on, she was emotionally very chill. And of course there was always something she wasn't perfect. But I always thought, man, I must be a good parent.

Dustin Lolli [00:07:39]: And then the next ones come along and it's, you know, they're boys, so they're different. But even so, you're like, okay, maybe every kid is unique and different. And I think that kind of experience or now it's like we're looking at our, our youngest and she is full of life, the baby to a T. She is loud and fun and dramatic and all of these things. And I think for us, in a lot of ways it's like every child of ours has been different and unique and our job is to love them the best way that we know how. And we've learned that with our other kids. There's no formula to it. There's no point A to point B.

Dustin Lolli [00:08:14]: If you do this, this, this and this, it's going to be perfect. Because all our kids have different genetic makeup. And I don't mean like mother, dad, I just mean like they were born different, they think differently, they feel differently. And so as a parent, especially with this one, we're just trying to find, okay, what makes her tick and what makes her thrive. And she is the most fun little five year old you'll ever come across. It's incredible.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:37]: You mentioned the fact that some of the things that you did with Arden to help her to real of the passions that she had. And I guess as you think about in raising her to where she is today, how did you balance guiding her while also giving her the independence to becoming her own person?

Dustin Lolli [00:08:58]: I think probably a lot of mistakes, you know. No, it's a great question. I think it's still a question that's in process for us. I mean, she's 21. Even now you're like, you still want to protect, but then you also know you can't, you have to let go in a lot of ways. She just came to us and she wants to go to Ireland with a group and she'd have to fly by herself. And the dad and me is like, oh, I don't know. And then you go, but she's 21, and we've never really tried to keep her from anything.

Dustin Lolli [00:09:27]: But as a dad, there's this safety thing, which there's all of these things that you're like, I'm supposed to protect her. I'm supposed to do all this. So as they get older, that with a girl is so much harder to let go of. Like my boys, I'm like, whatever, just go, man up, do the thing. Which good or not, it's just a natural process. I don't even think of it other than it's a natural thing. I would have wanted my dad to do that when I was 18, like, go mess up a few times. But the girl, that's hard because however, genetically we're inclined to be this way.

Dustin Lolli [00:09:56]: So my wife helps a lot with that. You know, we have a very balanced relationship. She is a girl, and I know this is dad. Daughter is hard because you don't understand, like, what they feel, what she's going through. And so I rely on her a lot for a lot of the emotional things. And I hope we've always tried to make a good team with it, but I think you have to over. Over the. From the time she's been 16 and on, it has been a tug of war and a push and pull of Arden, you have to prepare for the future.

Dustin Lolli [00:10:25]: You have to do the things it takes to be a successful person without mom and dad, while at the same time saying, arden, we are your safety net right now. You can make mistakes. You have a stable home, you have a stable place. And if you go out there and fail, even now, we tell her this all the time. This is your time to take chances. This is your time to go seek out this art, go do this thing and build your future. But just know that if it doesn't work out, you have a stable landing ground right now. And so it is.

Dustin Lolli [00:10:56]: It's a push and pull of like, we're here, stability's here. But because you have a foundation, you can go take risks, you can go do those things, and we're all for it, and we'll support you in anything. Obviously, I'm in music. My daughter has a great voice. She's beautiful voice, but she doesn't want to sing. And so it's like those balancing moments where you're like, I can offer you these opportunities because of what I do. And she's saying, but that's not my heart. Those are the things we work through, and those are the things, okay, so what is your passion? What do you want to do.

Dustin Lolli [00:11:24]: And it's a tug of war always inside of me now.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:11:26]: You talked about, and you kind of joked about it, that you probably made some mistakes. And all of us make mistakes. I mean, we are not perfect. There's no manual to how you raise a kid. And I guess as you think about those mistakes, what's a mistake that you made as a father and what did it. What did you learn from it about fostering positive communication?

Dustin Lolli [00:11:49]: I use the word mistake. I kind of did say it as a joke. I think sometimes I look at people and say, you only know when you made a mistake because we know what the right thing was. And so it's our weight, it's our judge. So the truth is, I don't know how many mistakes I've made because I don't know always what the right thing was. So you're just doing your best. And so you look back and go, maybe if I had done it this way, it would have gone better. But hindsight's 20 20.

Dustin Lolli [00:12:13]: It's hard to deal with that. You just learn to grow from it. With my daughter, you think of girls and you think of emotions. You think of it. My daughter is a very stable, quiet, emotional person. She feels things strongly, but she doesn't always show them. And as a guy, you have these stereotypical wrong things. This is part of.

Dustin Lolli [00:12:31]: As a young man, you have a daughter and you realize, okay, she's not a stereotype. She's a person. And she has her feelings, but she also has strong here. And I think without taking the time and having the humility to learn what it is that makes her tick, you can just jump the gun on stuff, and you can just plow right into things and go, oh, well, honey, let me tell you how to do this. And I think there were a lot of times where I thought I knew what was right for her, and I thought I knew if I gave her this advice and she did it, but. But after the fact, I go, if she were me, that might have worked, but she's not me. And so in a lot of ways, parenting to me is. There's a checklist for parenting, and I think it's good, but for me, it doesn't work.

Dustin Lolli [00:13:11]: Parenting to me is loving your kids the best way possible. And that might be being tough on one at some point and being less tough on another at some point, but it's knowing them, and if you know them well enough, you know how to love them well. And I think the biggest mistakes that I made, I think, were a lot of Times where I was more interested in giving them advice based on my opinion than based on where they were or what her needs were in the time I, like, wanted to be right rather than I wanted to help her. And so I don't think my motive early on as a dad, sometimes I was just doing the best I could. If I had a chance to talk to me, then I would say, you're doing the best you can, but you're doing the best you can for yourself instead of the best you can for your family or for your daughter. There's a lot in there. I could nuance that all day long. I could unpack that all day long.

Dustin Lolli [00:13:56]: But I don't always love the word mistakes because I think we create the baseline to judge on now, obviously, for breaking the law or something, but we're creating this baseline of like, well, this is the right thing and if we didn't do it, then you're a failure or it's a mistake. And parenting, I mean, everything might be a mistake because you could probably do everything better at some point.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:14:14]: You hit the nail on the head there. I think that everybody will second guess, and we are innately programmed to second guess and say, have I done that right? And as men, I've talked about this before, so many men are programmed to be fixers. We walk into a situation, we don't always listen, we don't always hear what our daughters are telling us, but we come in and think, oh, I can fix this. And that's not always what they need. And so one of the best things that someone ever told me, and it was kind of too late for me at the time, but was when you go into a conversation with your daughters, you should let them have the ability to say whether the conversation is a listening or a fixing conversation. Because if it is a listening conversation, you need to turn that part of your brain off that says, I'm trying to fix this for you, and you need to let them struggle with it and just talk through it. But if they say, no, this is a fixing conversation, then you can turn that right back on and truly give them the advice that you're prone to give for your daughters. What's one way that you show your daughters that they can always count on you?

Dustin Lolli [00:15:21]: I think that's an earned thing over time. I don't know if there's one action. I think being there over the years, you know, I would say my 21 year old, it's just consistency. I think there's no one action when she's been through hard times, you just, you're there. When she's having her great times, you're there. I love to be able to just tell people, hey, if you do this, it's going to be great. The thing is, your listeners don't even know my family life. I could be the worst dad in the world, pretending here.

Dustin Lolli [00:15:48]: And that's okay. To me, life in and of itself is this flow thing where a lot of people love to have step by step things. And I think trust is earned over time, even with your kids. I think love is a daily thing where you're choosing somebody above yourself, especially your kids. And I think you can't be a good parent unless you go into parenting thinking, I'm going to give something up for my children. And I've learned that over the years. And I think I do have a wonderful family life and I do have great kids and. But I think they would even tell you that there's never been a moment.

Dustin Lolli [00:16:21]: It's just, it's earned. Over the years, from when she was little, she learned that mom and dad were going to be there and they were going to be our priority. Now, I will say this. One of our early things we decided as a couple was we weren't going to change our lives for our kids. We were going to include our kids in our lives. And so our kids have always had a semblance of this is what mom and dad do and we're a part of it. I've seen a lot of families, they have a child and suddenly their entire life changes. They don't see friends anym, they don't go out anymore.

Dustin Lolli [00:16:52]: The kids on a 7pm bedtime. And that can't be deviated from. We didn't do any of that. Now whether that's psychologically right or wrong, we didn't do any of that. We said, okay, we're going to include our baby girl in everything that we do. And so she would come out to eat with us and we were involved in a lot of ministry stuff. So she would go to all of this stuff and sometimes she'd stay up late. And so.

Dustin Lolli [00:17:14]: And the reason why I say that is because in a lot of ways our kids, instead of just being the center of attention, they were a part of a family. Arden wasn't a only child. And when she thought, oh, I get everything, she knew she was going to go with mom and dad to everything. She was a part of it. And that was a healthy thing. So answering your question, I think the lifestyle choices and the day to Day. Consistency, love, consistency is what really for, I think, developed our relationship. So it kept it strong when she went to teenage years.

Dustin Lolli [00:17:46]: And here's the other thing. My daughter was such a good child. I would have these people say to me all the time, I mean, this became a just wait till she's a teenage. You think you got it good now, but just wait till she's a teenager. They all fall off the road. She's a girl. And you know what? I. My wife and I used to look at each other and be like, that doesn't mean that's going to happen to Arda.

Dustin Lolli [00:18:05]: And you know what? It never did. She's always been a consistent. I mean, it's been amazing. She's been the easiest child and, you know, a lot of that's her own thing. But I like to think some of that's just the stability and the fact that she's gone every day knowing how loved she really is. So one moment I couldn't tell you. I think it's a collection and an earning of trust over the years and just the stability and a consistency that it takes unselfish love to get there.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:32]: Now, I mentioned at the beginning that you are the lead singer with Sanctus Real. And one of the questions that I had for you because I know that a little while back you. There is a song called Confidence, and it's a powerful song that definitely resonated with many of your fans. More recently, you released an acoustic version of it with your daughter Arden. And what inspired you to create that rendition? And how did involving Arden deepen your connection to the song and the message?

Dustin Lolli [00:19:03]: Well, it's crazy because my daughter was 14 years old when we first had her sing on it. And it went something like this. We were doing a radio event and we were making a video and we wanted kids to sing originally instead of me on this video that we were making for this radio event. And the only kid in the room was arden. She was 14. We said, hey, Arden, can you come sing? I had never heard her sing for real. She did not sing out loud. I didn't know if she could sing.

Dustin Lolli [00:19:29]: It's kind of crazy. My wife will tell you, like, she just would shy away from singing. But my baby boy, Ian, who was little at the time, he would have been. He would have been like five, would tell us that he wanted Arden to sing him to sleep at night because she had a voice like an angel, which we never heard. So I said, arden, can you sing this? She so didn't want to sing it. We have this video of her singing it. She's got a hoodie on and her, she's like slouched over, over. But when she's saying this sound came out.

Dustin Lolli [00:19:58]: And I remember our guitar player Chris looking at me like, whoa, what is happening? So instead of having kids, we just had her voice on it. 14 year old Arden, and we play this radio event, and there's 70 of the biggest radio stations in the country for Christian music in this room. And this video comes on, right? And this voice. And after it was over, I get people coming to us asking who the girl was that sang our song. And they're handing me business cards. And she got record offers at 14, like, hey, when she's ready, let me know. And I'm like, she doesn't even sing. Like, she's never sang in front of people or anything.

Dustin Lolli [00:20:36]: And so that's where it started at this thing. That's not what you heard. That was like the first time she's saying this in front of people. But she doesn't love the stage. She doesn't love what she sees as. I don't think that's what I want to do. But there was always this connection to this song through that. And then when we were deciding to do this acoustic version and I was like, baby girl, people love that.

Dustin Lolli [00:20:57]: And I would love to do a duet. Like, so could this just be the one time you do it right? And she agreed to it and we did a video of it and it, you know, it's funny because we put that out and we still get people in comments who are like, who's this Arden artist? Where do I find her music? How do I listen to her? I'm like, that's it? That's all you got? But I love, you know, she still sings around the. I mean, her voice is special. And this is one of those things as a dad where you're like, I'm hoping that at some point she goes, I love to sing. I want to do this. And then I could bring her into so much more. But until then, I just got this one special moment with her, and it is special. And I, you know, again, I'm always like, your first time singing on video and you might have a half a million views, it's your only video you've ever done, you're pretty successful, you should probably do it again.

Dustin Lolli [00:21:48]: So we're still working on it. I'm gonna get her back on there. My other daughter, by the way, you won't have a problem. She'll probably want to sing on. So she's five and she has no fear and no, she wants the stage. So that should be fun.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:00]: I know that you as being the lead singer of this band, your band is definitely touring. You're spending a lot of time on the road. How do you navigate the balance between touring with Sanctus Real and being present in your children's daily lives?

Dustin Lolli [00:22:17]: I have four our guitar players for there's three of us that, that are the band and we have 11 kids between us and we've all been married a good amount of time. Healthy, healthy marriages, healthy relationships. You don't do this, you don't do what we do in a healthy way unless your family are your partners in it. And one of the things about being around for as long as we are, we can control our touring. And so there are seasons where we're gone quite a bit. But I always tell people this, I always say we're actually home more than most people. Most people have have nine to five jobs, they're gone or more. They're gone eight, 10 hours a day and then they come home and they're tired and they're worn out and you know, it's hard.

Dustin Lolli [00:22:57]: That's hard. And I don't ever want anyone ever. People ask us how we do it and I'm always like, I watch my dad get up at 4 in the morning for 30 years and work and be exhausted. I have a great life and a great job. And yes, it's, it's challenging sometimes it is, but every job is. So when I come home, here's why I say that is when we're home or home, I write songs for people. So I might go for a couple hours a day here and there. But when I come home, unlike most jobs, I'm home.

Dustin Lolli [00:23:23]: I don't have anything else to do, I'm home. And what we normally try to do is play three days a week and be home for. And some seasons we'll have a bigger tour and we'll be gone more but then we have a lot of time off so I might be home for a month straight. So it's really just navigating these seasons and, and my wife gets used to it, she has a rhythm. When I'm gone, my older kids, it's normal life. But dad's here all the time. Time dad's home, it gets to do stuff like I've helped coach my kids baseball team. It's a little harder on the five year old and sometimes being home a lot is even harder for her because I'll be home for a month and then I'm gone for two weeks.

Dustin Lolli [00:24:00]: And she doesn't know what to do with that because she got into a routine. But we work through all of that and she's, you know, she's actually been on the road now that we're older too. My wife will come on the road sometimes and take her with like she's been on the road with us a few times. So we try to include. We're such a family based band now, now that our goal is to include our family. My son works for us, our drummer son works for us. So we do our best and our families are partners in what we do. They get it.

Dustin Lolli [00:24:27]: It's our jobs too. So dad has to have a job and we just try to include him as much as we can, like we did with Arden in that video. I mean, that's part of that. We're going to include our families. I think one of the coolest parts about what I do for a living is not just what I do, but talking about this thing is it's actually had open doors for my kids in the future too. Like my one son plays guitar, loves it. I get to offer my kids something that I never had. And that's an avenue in music if they want to.

Dustin Lolli [00:24:54]: It's connections in music if they want to. And so far they, they have, they want to jump in and so it's great. So it works well for us because we're very, very aware of it. Like our families are our number one priorities and we all know that. And so if you know that, then you're going to build your tour around it, you're going to build your career around it. And so we maintain that balance. We work really hard to keep that balance.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:17]: You know, I know that a lot of your music touches on themes of faith and perseverance. How do you incorporate those themes into your parenting? And do your kids influence the messages you choose to convey through your songs?

Dustin Lolli [00:25:32]: I think so. I think I am a big believer in hope. We are a Christian band in the sense of like, that's our message of hope. And I look at the world today and just see a lot of people lacking, honestly, just hope. Regardless of what the situations, regardless of all the other stuff. It's just we travel and we talk to people and you're talking about our songs. And we hear so many stories about how our songs impact people because we try to put these messages of hope into them. But we also hear over and over again just the hopelessness that People deal with on a day to day basis.

Dustin Lolli [00:26:04]: And that's the world that we're raising our kids in. Social media, this is comparison. And it's all of these things that your kids are dealing with that I never had. This generation is dealing with things that even I never had to deal with, which is really, it's like the first time that we are going to have to study something that's never really been done, like kids and their screens and their social media. The influence of all of this information coming at us all the time. I tell my kids all the time, just turn your screens off for a week and you won't even know what's happening. And your world is so good and it feels so bad because you are being inundated with information constantly. And we need to know what's going on out there.

Dustin Lolli [00:26:43]: Again, this, this balance, but it does, it impacts a lot of what I write about, a lot of what I'm passionate about. I believe in doing the right thing in every situation as best as we can. I believe in love. I believe that, you know, I don't think anybody's a robot. And so therefore we come into situations with people and we prescribe methods of healing, but we're also different. And so for me, even with my kids, it's. I don't ever want to get into the know it all way of saying, hey, this is how you fix it. Right? I think we're all created differently.

Dustin Lolli [00:27:20]: Different likes, different tastes, different intelligences, different things. And until we know what those things look like, it's hard to even give advice to people to say, hey, do this thing. Because that advice could be dangerous for somebody who doesn't think or feel the same way that you do. And so I take all that into account, you know, with my kids. And then even with our message, like how do we give a message to people that is, is hopeful and a blessing rather than painful and a curse, basically, right? And I think it's my worldview. Like my worldview doesn't change whether it's looking at my kids or whether it's looking at my career or whether it's looking at our music, right? It's, it's my worldview. And for me, I'm a Christian, so my worldview comes from that. So it impacts every part of what I do and what I think.

Dustin Lolli [00:28:05]: And if it didn't, then I, it'd be hard to say this is who I am or this is what I believe. So I don't separate those things. I don't separate family from music or music from career. All of those things are made up from the worldview of that I believe love and loving people. Well, and you win. I think I'm a good dad, not because I know what I'm doing, but because I love my kids enough to try to steer them to what is healthy and whole and balanced and find that. And I think that that's always worked for me through my whole life. I've always felt like the best things that have ever happened in my life are because I chose to do the right thing in the hardest moments.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:40]: Now, I know you just mentioned a few minutes ago that your BO are interested in the music industry and they've shown interest in music and kind of the business side and playing as well. Sometimes, you know, with artists and families, sometimes people would say, stay away from it. I've dealt with this. I've been this don't do what I've done. You kind of said, you know, I'm going to help them. I'm going to do what I can to be able to do that. So how do you nurture their creativity while guiding them through the challenges that you've had in your own life in the industry?

Dustin Lolli [00:29:10]: Industry awareness. I always say there's two types of people in the music business. There's the artist and there's the people who make money from the artist. And you have to understand that. And I'm not even saying that's necessarily a bad thing, that's why it's a music business. But when you are healthy and aware that this is what's happening around you, you can create and do things and love what you do. But you also aren't going to get heartbroken because somebody betrayed you. Even though what they really did was they chased the money.

Dustin Lolli [00:29:37]: Money. Artists are just creative and ethereal and raw that we tend to take everything. Now, I'm not really that way, as you probably tell, but they tend to take everything personally or it just is a blow to their self esteem. But the reality is they're not turning their back on you. They're turning their face toward money. That's usually what it is. If you can't make them money, they're going to go somewhere that can because that's the business. Which is funny because I say that it sounds so bad, but I actually don't think it's that bad.

Dustin Lolli [00:30:04]: I just think it's the reality that we have to to deal with. And most people aren't aware enough of it to do it in a healthy way. But my kids, that's one of the beauties is that they've got somebody who's going before them that can help them see and walk through that, because it is about staying in a healthy place. All we do is put sounds in the air and hope people like them. There's nothing too artsy fartsy about me, and you probably never had anybody say that on your podcast, but to me, it's like, this is what I do. This is what I've been blessed with, the gift to do, to be able to sing. And I try to instill that with my kids. Don't get too, too arrogant about anything.

Dustin Lolli [00:30:35]: This just happens to be the thing that you're good at. And if you're good enough at it, people will pay you to do it. And if you're good enough to have people pay you to do it, then you're good enough to have people try to take money from you to do it. And so you have to understand the way the world works around you and be healthy and whole. And just knowing that I'm there to help guide them through that is why I'm like, hey, if you love music and you want to do this for a living, it's a great job. You just have to be aware of the pitfalls, that's all.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:30:58]: Now, I know that, that you and your wife Sarah perform together as a folk duo as well, and the group name is this Way Home. How has collaborating musically with Sarah impacted your family dynamics and your approach to parenting?

Dustin Lolli [00:31:12]: It's the best. It's awesome. If you listen to those songs, those songs probably reflect our family life. These songs, let's Get Old Together, they're cute. Not trying to be cheesy, they're just cute. These are how we treat each other and how we love each other and all that kind of stuff. And our kids have seen that, and they know our family life. And my daughter says, I love it because it's real, it's you, and it's our way of kind of expressing.

Dustin Lolli [00:31:33]: And Sarah's great singer. We did it before the band, and we're just now starting it back up again. And our kids love it because I think they see mom and dad at their most happy. But it is us. It's how we are at home, our banter. And I think in a lot of ways, when people see that, they get an actual view of how we are at home, which everyone wonders. How people are at home. Well, that's kind of how we are at home.

Dustin Lolli [00:31:55]: I mean, our kids are. And, you know, our son played with us the last time we went out. So it's again, more family based thing. So it's my favorite thing. It's folk music, it's easy to write. It's my side project that's just my release. And it reflects, I mean, you hear the songs, it reflects our worldview, it reflects kind of our family and what our core is. So yeah, go check that out.

Dustin Lolli [00:32:16]: I'd actually love when people check that out.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:32:18]: We'll definitely put a link over to it. And reflecting on your journey, what lessons from your own upbringing did you. You strive to pass on to your kids, both in life and through your music?

Dustin Lolli [00:32:31]: A lot. My parents divorced when I was 3. My mom remarried, so I've had a stepdad and then my dad remarried. So my family is very scattered. It was hard, but it was probably the most healthy thing it could be in an unhealthy situation. But there was a lot of other things, so it wasn't optimal. And I think part of that for me has always been I would never want my kids to go through that. So I wanted to break those chains of consistent.

Dustin Lolli [00:32:52]: And so my kids, kids see even now in talking to me, they see, wow, Dad's life was a lot different. They talked to me about my family life growing up. I love it. I have so many good memories, but it was very different. There was a lot of times where I'd be waiting, hoping my dad showed up to pick me up and whether or he just couldn't do it. And I still remember the sadness. I had stepbrothers who went through a lot of hard stuff. And I watched it all and.

Dustin Lolli [00:33:16]: And I think for me it was like. More than anything else in my life, I want to know that I gave my kids a chance, a stable chance. I want them to know that they can try to do crazy things. If they want to be musicians or they want to be artists, they can do it because they know that there's a baseline of foundation that they can fall back into, take risks, do crazy things. That's okay because you have a mom and dad who care enough and we're there to support you through it all. And they've been healthy. I mean, it's been good. But I think more than anything for me, I wanted my kids to have a stability that I never really had, that I never felt a dad, honestly.

Dustin Lolli [00:33:50]: And I have a great dad. If he hears this, he's great dad. But it's different, right? It's different. I didn't ever want my kids to go through that kind of separation and that kind of fear that we went through when we were little. And even now, like I said, they see the difference. They see the dynamics. They see stories that I tell. And they're old enough now to understand that it's meaningful to have a mom and dad who have stayed together for 22 years and who show that they love each other every day.

Dustin Lolli [00:34:14]: I mean, that's meaningful. That's something that is driven with my family life a lot. I just want my kids to see stability.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:34:20]: We always finish our interviews with what I like to call the dad connect section. 6. So six more questions that delve a little bit more into you as a dad. Are you ready?

Dustin Lolli [00:34:28]: Okay. Yeah.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:34:29]: What's one word that describes your relationship with your daughters?

Dustin Lolli [00:34:34]: Eclectic. I wanted to say something easy, like healthy or stable, but I think my daughters love that we do creative things a lot and our conversations are eclectic on purpose and just. I think my oldest daughter would love that. I think she'd love that I just said the word eclectic.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:34:49]: What's the best piece of dad advice that you've ever received?

Dustin Lolli [00:34:54]: Love your wife. Well, you'll be a good dad if you love your wife. I think that was something that you don't correlate when you're young and getting, you know, you're about to enter dadhood. But the stronger your relationship with your wife is, the stronger your relationship with your daughters is. That's what I feel like. And I love that advice. And that may not work for everybody. You might have hard hardships, but that was for me.

Dustin Lolli [00:35:15]: That was a big thing for me.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:35:16]: What's one activity that you and your daughters like doing together?

Dustin Lolli [00:35:20]: My oldest one's watching movies. Movies. We both love kung fu and we love just action movies, which is interesting. Again, she's great, and so that's something she always wants. If there's a new martial arts movie out, she'll just be like, dad, we got a new one. And we'll sit down and watch and make jokes about it the whole movie. We talk all the time about various things. She loves video, and so she's always.

Dustin Lolli [00:35:42]: She wants to be a voice actor, which is great. She's a cool voice. And so she's always talking about arts. And since I'm in music, you know, I have some unique perspectives on what she loves the little one right now. I get to be the male doll in whatever game she's formulating. Come, dad, let's play. Here. I've got a boy doll here.

Dustin Lolli [00:35:59]: It's yours. Okay, thanks, baby. Then I just Watch her play. Basically, it's great.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:36:03]: If you could give your daughters one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Dustin Lolli [00:36:08]: Oh, man. I would say take chances. Not security chances. As a dad, like, I don't, but don't be afraid to fail. Don't be afraid to fail. And don't. That's always been the one thing I've said to my oldest daughter. A lot is just, just life is meant to be lived.

Dustin Lolli [00:36:22]: So if you, the more balanced you are, the less fearful you are of taking a chance. So do that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:36:27]: What's one thing you've learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

Dustin Lolli [00:36:31]: That I don't know anything. And if I did, it's not for the right reasons. And I think just as I'm getting older, motivation's everything. Our motives and what, why we do what we do is more important than what we do in the first place. And I think early on it was like everything was I was doing was trying to prove that I was a good dad instead of actually trying to be a good dad dad. And so I, I think for that it's just open. Have an open mind with your kids. They're all different and they all respond differently.

Dustin Lolli [00:36:59]: And as I've gotten older, I just realized the less I know, sometimes the better off I am.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:37:03]: Finally, what advice would you give to other dads who want to build the lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Dustin Lolli [00:37:10]: Love them. Well, I could come up with something like, real deep and be like, hey, do this checklist. But I just don't think that works. Your daughters are your daughters and they are their own own unique people and personalities. And you have to know what makes. You have to know that. You have to get to know them well enough to know how to love them well. There has to be a connecting point on a human level.

Dustin Lolli [00:37:30]: And it's not just a dad daughter relationship. It's you showing that you're going to be there forever regardless. And that's earned again, I think that's earned over the course of years where you love them well, you treat them well, you support them well, you learn about them, you show interest in their interest, interests, and ultimately you just be the stable force that they need. And because ultimately it's not about us. It's not about us dads. I think the healthiest thing we can think about is it's not about us in the relationship. It's they're the child. It's about us supporting them.

Dustin Lolli [00:38:04]: And so I think there has to be an unselfishness to it that A lot of us don't want to give up. We don't want to give up us. And you don't have to give up all of you. But trust me when I say day, you'll be happier when you start making it about your kid rather than about you. And you'll find freedom in that. And so I would say to them, if you find yourself doing it because you want something, you need to change that. That's. That's where it needs a change.

Dustin Lolli [00:38:27]: It can't be about you. It has to be about her and has to be about her future and her relationship and her stability. And I promise you, when you do that, you'll be rewarded as well. Like, not all sacrifice, you'll be rewarded as well. Well, it's the way it's supposed to be.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:38:42]: Well, Dustin, I just want to say thank you. Thank you for your time today, for sharing your own journey. If people want to find out more about you, about the band, where should they go?

Dustin Lolli [00:38:51]: They can go to sanctusreal.com any of the social media things. We're kind of everywhere. If you Google it, you'll see all the links. Music's on YouTube. It's kind of everywhere. All you gotta do is look it up. This way home. Same thing.

Dustin Lolli [00:39:02]: I mean, we're on Spotify primarily. We don't treat that as like this big thing that we're promoting and all that kind of stuff. That's kind of our own little thing. Thing. So, yeah, I just google it this way home and sanct this real well.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:39:14]: Dustin, I truly appreciate your time today. Thank you for sharing everything that you've shared and I wish you all the best.

Dustin Lolli [00:39:20]: I thank you. Appreciate it. You guys are great.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:39:22]: That's a wrap for this episode of the dad and daughter connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn't about being perfect. It's about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don't forget, you can find all our [email protected] until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Outro Performer [00:39:53]: We're all in the same boat and it's full of tiny, screaming past messengers. We spend the time, we give the lessons, we make the meals, we buy them presents and bring your A game. Cause those kids are growing fast the time goes by just like a dynamite blast Calling astronauts and firemen carpenters and muscle men get out and be the world you down Be the best dad you can be Be the best dad you can.

Hey dads, and welcome to another episode of Dad Connections in 5, the place where five minutes of real talk helps you build a deeper bond with your daughter—one small moment at a time. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and today we’re tackling something every dad hears a hundred times a day:

“Why?”

• Why is the sky blue?
• Why do I have to eat vegetables?
• Why do people lie?

Those questions may come at you fast—and at the most inconvenient times—but today we’re talking about why your daughter’s “why” questions are one of the best opportunities to connect, inspire, and grow her confidence.

Let’s dig into the power of curiosity and how you, Dad, can fan the flame with just a little enthusiasm and intention.

Why Her Questions Matter

Curiosity is how kids learn about the world—and about themselves. Every “why” question is a window into how your daughter thinks, what she wonders about, and what she values.

• When you answer with interest, you show her that her thoughts matter.
• When you stay patient, you build her confidence to keep exploring.
• And when you say “I don’t know—but let’s find out,” you teach her that learning never stops.

The way you respond helps shape whether she keeps asking—or starts holding back.

3 Ways to Encourage Curiosity (Without Getting Exhausted) 1. Say “That’s a Great Question!” First

Even if you don’t know the answer—or you’re tired or distracted—start with validation.

• “Wow, that’s a smart question.”
• “I’ve wondered that too!”
• “I love that you’re thinking about this.”

That response tells her: “Dad cares about what I think. It’s safe to wonder out loud.”

2. Make It a Mini Adventure Together

You don’t have to be a walking encyclopedia. When you don’t know something, say:

• “Let’s look it up together.”
• “Let’s do a little experiment.”
• “Let’s ask someone who might know.”

Whether it’s googling a fact, reading a book, or asking a grandparent—you’re showing her that curiosity leads to action.

This builds her confidence to keep asking and seeking.

3. Ask Questions Back

Sometimes, the best way to keep curiosity alive is to turn the question around.

• “What do you think?”
• “Why do you think that happens?”
• “What would you do if you were in charge?”

Now, she’s not just receiving information—she’s thinking critically. You’re helping her build her own ideas, and that’s the real magic.

Quick Takeaway: Try This Today

Here’s your challenge: The next time your daughter asks a “why” question, don’t brush it off.

• Start with enthusiasm—“Great question!”
• Be curious together—“Let’s find out.”
• Ask her opinion—“What do you think?”

Even if it’s a small moment, it makes a big impact. Every curious question she asks—and every thoughtful answer you offer—is one more brick in the foundation of her confidence, her creativity, and your connection.

Because when you fuel her curiosity, you’re not just answering a question—you’re building a lifelong love of learning and showing her that Dad is her biggest cheerleader.

That’s it for today’s Dad Connections in 5. If this episode reminded you how powerful your voice can be in shaping your daughter’s growth, send it to another dad who’s in the thick of the “why” phase. Until next time—keep showing up, keep wondering with her, and keep encouraging her to stay curious.

What does it mean to truly connect with your daughter? In this heartfelt episode of The Dad and Daughter Connection, Dr. Christopher Lewis sits down with Joe Carlucci and his daughter, Valentina, to explore the depth of father-daughter relationships, the power of perseverance, and the joys (and trials) of building a business—and a life—side by side.

The Carlucci story is more than just a tale of pizza and world records; it’s a masterclass in showing up, learning together, and making family the center of everything you do. Joe, the owner of Valentina’s Pizzeria in Huntsville, Alabama, shares how having his daughter involved in the restaurant has changed everything about how he leads, listens, and loves.

“I want her to have a life, to experience everything,” Joe shares, emphasizing that legacy isn’t about business success but about the kind of father he is. Valentina, already a Guinness World Record holder for pizza tossing at just 12, brings her own flair and opinions to the family business, reminding listeners that kids don’t just follow in parents’ footsteps—they blaze their own trails.

Parenting, of course, isn’t without challenges. Joe’s candid stories of failure, resilience, and growth highlight the value of letting your kids see you struggle and rise again. The episode dives deep into co-parenting, stepfamily dynamics, and the importance of putting pride aside so kids can feel fully supported, no matter what.

What makes this episode truly special is the genuine banter and obvious affection between Joe and Valentina. Their shared laughter, friendly teasing, and mutual admiration are a testament to what’s possible when dads choose presence over perfection.

If you’re a dad looking to build a stronger relationship with your daughter—or anyone inspired by stories of resilience, family, and food—this episode is an absolute must-listen. You’ll walk away with practical advice, heartfelt wisdom (“If you fall down ten times, get up eleven”), and maybe even a craving for a slice of the world’s best pizza.

Ready to be inspired? Tune in to this episode of The Dad and Daughter Connection and discover how showing up, listening deeply, and making your child your priority can change everything—for both of you. Find all episodes and more at dadanddaughterconnection.com.

TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]: Welcome to the dad and daughter connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]: If you're looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you're in the right place. I'm doctor Christopher Lewis, and the dad and daughter connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we'll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let's get started. Because being a great dad isn't just about being there, it's about truly connecting. Welcome back to the Dad and Daughter Connection, where every week we have a great opportunity to be able to meet and work together, to be able to build those bonds that we want to have with our daughters, one day at a time. And I love that you come back every week to be able for us to be able to work together and to be able to find new ways to be able to engage with our daughters and find ways to be able to build those stronger bonds. So I thank you for coming back every week.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:20]: That's why this podcast exists. It exists to help you and to be able to give you some tools for your toolbox that you can walk away from every episode with some different things to think about in regards to the relationship that you have with your daughter and that relationship that you want to have with your daughter. Every week, I love being able to bring you different guests with different experiences that are having these great relationships together, but also that you can grow from the relationships that you are hearing from them. Sometimes we have dads on, sometimes we have daughters on, Sometimes we have dads and daughters on. And today, we have just that. I'm really excited to be able to have Joe, Carlucci and his daughter, Valentina, on. And we're gonna be talking to them about the journey that they've been on in regards to some food, some world records, and a little bit more to be able to talk about the bond that they have in correlation to all of this. And I am really just really excited to have them here today.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:19]: Joe, Valentina, thanks so much for being here today.

Valentina Carlucci [00:02:21]: Thank you.

Joe Carlucci [00:02:22]: Thank you very much. It's an honor. We appreciate the opportunity.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:25]: Well, I am really excited to be able to have you here. We've been trying to make this work for a while, so I'm I'm really excited that we were able to find a time to be able to do this. I guess first and foremost, what I would love to do is talk to me about your relationship and what makes your bond so special.

Joe Carlucci [00:02:42]: Because she's my air, my breath, my world. Like, she's my everything. She's a smart ass, but she's amazing and, she's my heartbeat. She's the reason, I get up to be a better person, father, boss, son, and friend every day, every week, every month, every minute, every second of my life.

Joe Carlucci [00:02:58]: And, Valentina, what's the best part? I know that you work alongside your dad at the restaurant. And I guess as you think about that and the and the opportunity that you have to work with your dad, what's the best part about working alongside your dad in the pizza business?

Valentina Carlucci [00:03:13]: Getting to correct Tim because he makes a lot of mistakes, and I have to end up being the boss and taking care of everyone because he doesn't always know what to do when he's working. He can be a little. So

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:27]: So for you that are listening, Valentina just kind of twirled her finger around her around her ear saying that he's a little crazy. So I don't know, Joe. I mean, you said she's opinionated, but she definitely has her opinions here. And where does she get that from? Definitely not you. Right?

Joe Carlucci [00:03:45]: No. I'm not very opinionated. I keep my comments to myself. I'm very low key. I'm low spoken. I don't ever put gas on the fire. I usually put water. She likes to, which is okay sometimes, make make dinner for the staff, make desserts, give everybody a break, give them raises.

Joe Carlucci [00:04:01]: She's, all for the inmates and and not for the 40 sometimes. But when she has to throw the hammer down, she'll throw it down to anybody. So I give her that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:04:11]: I guess, Joe, seeing it, like you said, that, you know, Valentina is your heir. You said that, you know, she is following in your footsteps here. When did you first notice that Valentina shared your passion for pizza?

Joe Carlucci [00:04:22]: Man, she's been every step of the way at every restaurant I've had, food truck. I mean, since she was in diapers and strollers, she's always been inside the pizzeria restaurant business. When she got old enough to stand up, to wash dishes, to wipe tables down and sweep, like, I never thought anything of it. And when I launched Valentina's four and a half years ago, I had called her mother and said, hey. I'm gonna open a pizzeria again, and, I wanna name it after Valentina. She's like, let me ask her because, you know, she's kind of quiet sometimes. And I'm like, yeah. I don't know how she feel.

Joe Carlucci [00:04:51]: And she asked her, and she was like, absolutely. One thing only is no pineapple on pizza. And we end up having And we end up putting pineapple on pizza. And then when she came to work a lot more with me, she asked me about my records and did she get one? And I just thought it was a kid wanting to do what her dad does or not every day. And then as she got older, I mean, she's 12. She's got a long way to go, and then she it's in her blood, and she loves it. And I told her it's not the easiest, but today's age, we have changed the way we do things in the industry. You know, we're only open twenty seven hours. I like to say we like the Chick fil A pizza. We're closed Sunday and Mondays.

Joe Carlucci [00:05:26]: We don't open for lunch. We only open for dinner. It is where the area we are, but, I want her to have a life too, and I don't want the the life to be inside this restaurant. I don't she gotta put the time in, but at the same time, I want her to experience other things as well. And she's right now adamant about taking it over.

Joe Carlucci [00:05:42]: So I guess for those that are listening that don't know you, Joe, and don't know your your your background and don't know the restaurant, give me a little bit of the history which led you to some world records so that someone that doesn't know you gets a better feel for not only what led you to starting Valentina's, but what led you to moving from New York to Alabama?

Joe Carlucci [00:06:05]: Sure. I'm a consultant. I used to be a consultant. Excuse me. And I came down to Alabama fifteen years to go to open a pizzeria, and I just fell in love with Huntsville, Alabama, where we are now at Valentina's. And I decided to come down and help the gentleman and move the consultant down here. The consulting thing was kinda hard in the South, and I ended up working for him. Along the way, I've had a couple restaurants and I failed at them, and they she was my passion to keep driving.

Joe Carlucci [00:06:29]: And when you get knocked down, you gotta get up 10 times harder and faster, and no one's gonna worry about you or cry about you, and you have to take care of yourself. And I taught her that. Like, one thing I could teach is you never give up. I did not, by the wildest dreams, think this restaurant, Valentina's Pizzeria, would ever blow up to what it is. We went from having 10 employees to having 47 employees. We have a full time life coach, a GM that, has a law background that runs the whole entire restaurant. She loves her. I have a manager that's, been with me ten years, and we're growing every day.

Joe Carlucci [00:07:01]: We just bought a food truck again to go do double dip, and I love the area of Huntsville, Alabama. I mean, people think Alabama. I think my cousin Vinny, and I probably look like my cousin Vinny. But it's just been a great experience. We went from a 1,500 square foot to buying our own land and having a 5,000 square foot with 190 seats. I was actually kidding around with her the other day and I said, you know, someone offered me millions of dollars to sell. She's like, you can't sell. To my restaurant.

Joe Carlucci [00:07:25]: I said, what about 10,000,000? I said, no. 20. She said, no. We're not selling. I said, what do you mean we can't sell? She goes, the restaurant's for me. I said, yeah. But that's a lot of money. We can go to Disney.

Joe Carlucci [00:07:35]: We can have some I'm a system. The reason why we have this restaurant and all this money is because of me, because we wouldn't have this amazing place without me. So you have to put that factor into. You can go on that.

Joe Carlucci [00:07:50]: So I need them. I said, well, I was just kidding, but she goes, good. You can get all you want, but it's mine. So it is everything that we're doing is for her to build the brand, and she's gonna have to, put the hair back, put the apron on, and firstly in those pizzas.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:03]: Now, Joe, you mentioned that you strive to be a strong role model for Valentina. What are the most important qualities that you try to demonstrate for her?

Joe Carlucci [00:08:11]: Have a backbone, have a voice, have empathy for people, care, but believe in yourself and love yourself more than anybody loves you. And don't listen to the critics or the keyboard warriors or the haters. Like you can do anything you put your mind to. Listen. I'm probably the dumbest guy you ever speak to on your podcast. I can't screw a light bulb in. Okay? And I put my head down and described. Hard work beats talent every day and twice on Sundays.

Joe Carlucci [00:08:35]: And you can outwork anybody any day, any week, any month. And that's the hardest lesson to teach her because sometimes she can be a little lazy, but I still love her. Yeah. You know? But it's the youth, but we're getting we're getting it out of you. We're we're kicking it out of you. But I would, like, teach her that. Never give up on yourself and believe in others. Don't give up on others either.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:08:52]: Now, Valentina, based on what your dad just said and what he's taught you, what have you learned from your dad about hard work and dedication?

Valentina Carlucci [00:09:00]: Well, so for one, if you do a job, do it correctly and try to do it good. It's okay to make a mistake, but don't make the same mistake a million times. And then, of course, like, if you fall down 10 times, get up 11 times. So, like, overall, like, never give up and always try your hardest no matter what the job is.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:24]: I love that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:09:24]: Now, Joe, parenting comes with challenges. It's not always easy. And I know that in the past you've spoken about letting your kids see you fail and grow. And you just mentioned that you have failed and you've had to pull yourself up and keep going. Can you share a moment where you learned an important lesson in front of Valentina that she had that you wanted her to learn even though it may have been hard for you?

Valentina Carlucci [00:09:46]: At one time, the quarantine family.

Joe Carlucci [00:09:50]: Chris, when we had the food truck during COVID, we'd go out in the beginning because it was a lockdown and sell, like, 200 pizzas. And as time got on and they lifted the the lockdown, she'd come out with me in a 20 degree weather. She'd be sweating on the food truck. She was, like, 78 years old. We sell four pizzas, literally. I had to throw all the dough away, all the ingredients. It was, like, week after week until I finally decided that the money I'd save from COVID during with the food truck is to make the transition to a brick and mortar again. But got life lesson just, why are we doing this? Can we go home? Like, no.

Joe Carlucci [00:10:23]: We're gonna stick it out, and we'd sell pizzas in five hours. It was just teaching her how to not give up. I did this political box over the course of last four months with the president on there, and we got a lot of backlash from it. And I'm not very political. I'm just controversial. I don't know a lot of it. I'm saying it's not controversial in my mouth. You can ask anybody my rep, but I've never brought up politics once before this election.

Joe Carlucci [00:10:45]: Never. Oh, never. I don't talk about it, but college football, as you know, where you are too is king, and I just had to think of a marketing scheme. Well, long story short, it has developed into an animal of its own. And it took on a whole new world here for the last two months. It's been insane. And we had a customer or a stalker not even a stalker, keyboard warrior come in on last Saturday who was already trashing us. And it was a little incident, and I had to be a little bit more professional around her and just put the water on the fire that time with her and her younger sister, who's always over at my house, her stepsister.

Joe Carlucci [00:11:21]: Didn't teach her, like, sometimes you have to control yourself because I had my staff. I had people there, and I had my daughter there. And I don't wanna, like, do what my what I really wanna do, but, you know, it's not professional and it's not teaching her anything. So I had to handle that situation a little different. Not saying I wouldn't if she wasn't there, but it would've been a lot easier to not handle the right way. But when my dog when you turn around and your daughter's looking at you, it's the older man that you don't wanna be fighting or screaming at people. So sometimes, like I told her, dads are not perfect. I never had a 12 year old.

Joe Carlucci [00:11:50]: I've never had a 13 year old. So guess what? I'm gonna mess up because I've never had a kid before. So I'm learning as she's learning. So I just let her know that I'm not perfect in any way, shape, or form and that no matter what, I'm always gonna love her even if she's burns pizza sometime.

Valentina Carlucci [00:12:05]: So I correct you when you burn pizzas, but I don't burn pizzas, and that's why my pizzas are better.

Joe Carlucci [00:12:11]: Well, maybe we'll ship them one if you tell us.

Valentina Carlucci [00:12:13]: Yeah. Well, no. It'll be bad. So we we freeze it. We can? Yeah. Okay.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:12:19]: That would be great. So, Valentina, you just heard your dad talk about some challenges that he's had and some struggles that he's gone through. And I guess as you think about that and you've seen your dad struggle with different things, how did that affect you and affect the way that you think about making mistakes?

Valentina Carlucci [00:12:39]: It made me wanna try harder. It made me wanna do the business more. It made me wanna make my dad proud. And it also, like, taught me some lessons on, like, whenever anyone comes into your electronic complaining, he didn't escalate it at all. But whatever you do, do not escalate it and make it worse because that's the one bad thing you could do. And then you could be in the wrong if, like, you do anything to them because the customer is always right.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:10]: And Valentina did put up her quotes because, you know

Joe Carlucci [00:13:13]: Yeah.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:13:14]: I get it. Now, Joe, I know that you mentioned the fact that Valentina's got step siblings, and you've talked in the past, I know about co parenting and co parenting can bring its own challenges. So you've talked about that in the past with step kids and half siblings. What has helped you to maintain a strong unified family dynamic?

Joe Carlucci [00:13:35]: Well, my pride, it's hard enough to be a kid in 02/2025. Her mother and I didn't have the best, and we didn't have the worst relationship. We didn't do anything to hurt each other. We just weren't the right fit. So why make your kids suffer for twenty, thirty years because you made a decision in thirty seconds when you went to bed. Right? So it wasn't always like this. I I had a a lot of, looking in the mirror like, who's the problem? Is the world the problem, or is Joe the problem? And I decided that I was the problem. And her stepdad is she's so lucky to have a dad like that.

Joe Carlucci [00:14:08]: I mean, I think he's one of the most amazing people. She has one of the best mothers that god has ever created in a very weird, people say, relationship. Her past sister is over my house. It's always my always my my Christmas. My my girlfriend gets her gifts, sends the gifts. She's over my house three weeks, four weeks out of summer. She sleeps over during the week. I mean, she's like my second kid, and we we're actually all a family, and it and it works.

Joe Carlucci [00:14:31]: I think it's sometimes under those situations, not every situation is like mine. You have to look in the mirror. And I just made a pact that I know it's gonna be a tough life for any kid growing up, and I'm not gonna make my daughter's life harder. And we're we're all friends. Like, her stepdad does pest control. He does my house. He does my restaurant. I have a problem.

Joe Carlucci [00:14:48]: He comes here. Her mom and I co parent very, very well together, respect each other. My girlfriend knows my situation, and she's open to it. And she loves Cadence just like she loves Valentina. So it worked. Everybody at the restaurant, my GM, my managers, like, they take Valentina. They sleep over her house. She sleeps over there.

Joe Carlucci [00:15:08]: I mean, it's a big family. It's one big family, and it all starts with knowing what to do, when to do it. And it's not always about me. Like, if it's better than my daughter's life to co parent and put our differences aside from fifteen years ago, then let's do it. I mean, if you saw her step sister here, do you think she's my daughter? She just bring drags her stuff in. We had a pizza named after her on the menu. So it works. You just had to do a lot of soul searching.

Joe Carlucci [00:15:33]: I think that's the hardest thing for people today is, like, look in the mirror. I'm not talking about situations where someone's died or cheated. My situation was nothing like that. We were just oil and water. She's an engineer. I'm a pizza guy with ADHD, but we're better off we are now because I told her she's got two dads instead of one. Right? So it worked on both hands.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:15:50]: And, Valentina, what's one thing your dad does that makes your whole family feel connected and supported?

Valentina Carlucci [00:15:55]: Well, he's always open for Cadence to come over here. He treats her like how he treats me. He's, like, best friends with my stepdad and my mom. He always invites him over to the restaurant. Whenever my mom drops Cadence off sometimes at the house, she'll even stay for a little longer and just talk to my dad. So it's not like how it would be for normal parents that are not together anymore. They're fine in a room together. They could talk normally like friends.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:16:26]: Joe, with the situation and the kind of the family dynamic that you have right now, what advice do you have for dads that are navigating co parenting challenges while keeping their child's best interests at heart?

Joe Carlucci [00:16:37]: Put your pride aside. Look through the lens as your child would. Put yourself in your child's shoes. Even if you can't get along, don't you know what I'm saying? If you can't say anything nice, don't say anything. Not every situation is gonna be like mine. So the less said is the better. So it no matter what, that's gonna be your mother and that's you're gonna be the father for the rest of her life. So you have to figure out some way to at least respect each other as a parent, everything else, you know, under your situations, but say less.

Joe Carlucci [00:17:02]: I know because kids today don't wanna go back and forth and hear about the kids fighting or the parents saying this. This parent said death and step you know what I mean? It it's just hard enough for these kids. It's hard enough. So if if you can't get along, which is understandable in certain situations, don't say anything. Just don't comment on it, and then they don't have to feel that they have to stick up for that, parent. They don't have to defend that parent. It also makes you look worse, I think, as a parent because kids are not stupid. They're smart.

Joe Carlucci [00:17:27]: The older they get, they'll see. They'll feel it out, Whether their dad's absent, their mom's absent, or just whatever the situation is, they they'll they'll figure it out. You don't have to lead them to order. They're they're smarter than us.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:17:38]: Now I know, Joe, you've had a number of businesses that you've started that may have been successful, may have failed. What's the biggest lesson though that you've learned in business that has also helped you as a father?

Joe Carlucci [00:17:49]: Open minded. Take advice from people that have been there. Maybe people that are in their seventies. You know, as a father that had multiple kids or been in my situation and in the industry, I have, been blessed and lucky and honored to be, taught under Tony Geminiani. He has over 200 locations in the number of pizza in The US, and he's been, like, a mentor to me in every way. And looking up to other people that have kids or in my situation and that are good role models for their kids that I could take advice from moving forward.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:18:20]: And Valentina, I know you help your dad at the restaurant and you work hard. What's your ultimate dream in the pizza industry? I know you said you already cook and you're you're better than your dad. So how do you want to follow in your dad's footsteps or go beyond your dad in this industry?

Valentina Carlucci [00:18:35]: Well, I wanna be exactly like him or maybe even better when I grow up. I wanna have over a thousand stores.

Joe Carlucci [00:18:43]: Okay.

Valentina Carlucci [00:18:43]: No. I'm being for real. Like, I do wanna have over a thousand stores, and I want my pizza place to be number one in the whole world to where all these influencers are trying to come here saying how good our pizza is. And so, like, one day when my dad dies, I can just look up, no, I made him proud.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:19:00]: Joe, talk to me about what is having Valentina involved in the restaurant done or changed in the way that you run your business?

Joe Carlucci [00:19:10]: Oh, everything. Since she was born. My whole way I look at people and I treat people and I act when she's not here because I I always think, like, it's great you you do it when she's not when when she's here, but in anything you do when she's not here. It's just changed the way my perspective on life is on people and having empathy for my staff and caring for them and just I used to be a Gordon Ramsay of pizza that's yelling, screaming, throwing things in. They say you get more flies with honey. So I'm still working on that, but, you know, I hired a full time life coach to help navigate where I wanna go and help people understand my vision. My standard is extremely high the way I carry the restaurant, and I expect everybody to meet that standard, always there, but I wanna be better than yesterday. I don't care about today.

Joe Carlucci [00:19:56]: I don't care about tomorrow. So she has a big influence in that because if I could build the standard for Valentina's and the standard I wanna be as a man, then she'll know what kind of man she needs. And I don't care if she she'll always be open to telling me, hopefully, that she has a boyfriend because, like, since she was, like, six, I would open the door for her and tell her, if they don't open the door, they don't open the door, don't get in. So now when we go home tonight or we go to Korean barbecue or for pizza, I'm I'm in the car, and she's sitting outside standing outside. I'm like, what are you doing? She's like, I'm not getting until you open this door. And I'm like, oh my god. This is a little too much. And I said, what are you gonna do if you're on a date? She said, I'm gonna Uber.

Joe Carlucci [00:20:35]: I'm gonna call you. I said, okay. Good. I've been, I'm literally at six in the morning. I'm gonna take her to the school. She'll just stand outside. It'd be 30 degrees. She's like, I'm not getting in.

Joe Carlucci [00:20:43]: I'd get out of the car. I gotta go around. I gotta open the door. So she knows what she's doing on that end.

Joe Carlucci [00:20:49]: Now earlier, Valentina, I talked about the Guinness world record for pizza tossing. Congratulations.

Valentina Carlucci [00:20:55]: Thank you.

Joe Carlucci [00:20:56]: What was that experience like, and what did your dad teach you to help you get there?

Valentina Carlucci [00:21:01]: Well, so how my dad taught me was when I was at his house, at the time, I was only there Sunday, Monday, and then I left Tuesday morning. So both days, we practiced for, like, four hours. And then he gave me, like, this rubber dough, and I bring it to my mom's house with me and I practice every day. And so before I tried to get the, record, I, like, practiced a lot. And there was some tears because I, like, really wanted to win, and I did. But the process of it was really fun. My mom got to come, and we had this whole, like, little celebration.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:38]: And, Joe, seeing Valentina break a world record at such a young age must have been an incredible moment. How did that feel as a father?

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:21:45]: It was one of the greatest moments of my life to see her do it. And, actually, she was the one with the idea. It wasn't me throwing this on her. Like, I never want her to get in this industry. It's a tough industry, but, like, she keeps pushing that idea away. So when she wanted to do this, she was eight or nine.

Valentina Carlucci [00:22:00]: Four. No. You want four? When I wanna do

Joe Carlucci [00:22:03]: No. When you did the Guinness record.

Joe Carlucci [00:22:05]: Oh. She was eight or nine. She can't count. She's really bad at math.

Valentina Carlucci [00:22:07]: No. I'm good at math.

Joe Carlucci [00:22:08]: But just having her want to do it and then her actually accomplishing it, it was a goosebump feeling, kind of like one of those moments that were surreal.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:16]: Now, Joe, earlier in the conversation, you talked about that you invested in a life coach to help you grow as both a father and a business owner. What's been the biggest shift for you and your mindset since starting that journey?

Joe Carlucci [00:22:29]: The biggest shift has to be my attitude because as hard as it is and it's many layers I have on my back, whether it's the loans, the mortgage, like, everything starts and ends with me. And even the box, I put a bull's eye on my staff. Like, I knew that politics and religion, you don't bring into the restaurant, and I did both. And I did both. And learning how to understand and deal with that, but also 47 people do not work for me. I work for 47 people. I work for my staff. They don't work for me.

Joe Carlucci [00:22:57]: And he has taught me that and helped me with that. And understanding what that means is hearing people, letting them have a voice, understanding them, understanding, like, no one's perfect. No one has perfect life inside and outside of here. And it's just shifted my attitude of the perspective I I have on people.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:16]: And, Valentina, have you noticed any changes in your dad since he started working with a coach?

Valentina Carlucci [00:23:20]: Yes. So I will say before, he wasn't the best when with when people would start crying. Of course, he would, like, try to hug them and ask them what's wrong, but he wasn't the best with it. And now if you notice because we have a ton of girls that work for us, and girls can be emotional. And he's just gotten a lot better with it, like, with emotions, understanding, and dealing with them. And I think the life coach really helped with that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:23:46]: Joe, I guess as we finish up, what legacy do you hope to leave for Valentina both as a father and as a businessman?

Joe Carlucci [00:23:53]: Well, it's just one. I don't care about the business. That was the best that I could make to her. That's my legacy. Like, I love pizza, some of my blood, but my legacy is is as a father. There's nothing second or close to it. I I can care less if she did this. Whatever she wants to do in life, she's gonna be super successful.

Joe Carlucci [00:24:10]: But my legacy is as a father, not as anything to do in this industry at all. There are so many more talented people in this industry than me. I've just been blessed to be around some great mentors like Tony. And at moments, I've captured those winning championships at that minute, that second, that hour, but nothing comes close to being a dad. That legacy is number one and the most important to me.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:36]: And, Valentina, if you had to give your dad a best dad award, what would it be for?

Valentina Carlucci [00:24:40]: Being the best dad, everything he does is amazing. Of course, he'll make mistakes on the way of being the best dad, but to me, he's the best dad that there can ever be.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:24:49]: And we always finish our interviews with what I call the dad connection six. And a lot of times I have these just for dads, but with both of you here, I'm gonna ask both of you these questions and see see what you have to say. So, Valentina, I'm gonna start with you. What's one word that describes your relationship with your dad?

Valentina Carlucci [00:25:06]: Amazing.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:07]: And let's flip it. Joe, what's one word that describes your relationship with Valentina?

Joe Carlucci [00:25:11]: Princess.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:12]: Valentina, what's the best piece of advice your dad's ever given you?

Valentina Carlucci [00:25:15]: If it's all Valentine times, get up eleven.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:18]: And, Joe, what's the best piece of dad advice that you've ever received?

Joe Carlucci [00:25:22]: Listen to them, don't hear them. Or hear them, don't listen. You know when they say you you you're listening, but you're not hearing me? Hear them. A lot of parents don't hear their kids. They listen to their kids, but they don't hear what they're saying. It's a big difference. My employees do the same thing sometimes.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:34]: Valentina, what's one activity that you and your dad love to do together?

Valentina Carlucci [00:25:38]: Anything that includes having fun.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:40]: And Joe?

Joe Carlucci [00:25:41]: Cooking. She we've been going out for Korean barbecue on Sundays and, Italian on Mondays. And she said to me about six months ago, like, these meatballs are horrible. Just and she knows how to make our meatballs in the sauce. She's like, can you just can we just cook at home? Can you just teach me? I was like, yeah. So we stopped going out to eat. Then we started doing the Korean cooking at home and the Italian the next day. And that's probably the best way to describe the connection was cooking.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:06]: Now, Joe, I'm gonna follow-up with that. And if you could give Valentina one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Joe Carlucci [00:26:12]: It's not how hard you hit. It's how hard you hit back. Kinda like getting knocked down, get up, but, like, every life's gonna throw you a lot of curve balls. You gotta be able to swing them all over.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:20]: Valentina, what's one thing that your dad has taught you that you'll never forget?

Valentina Carlucci [00:26:25]: I'll say if you try anything, always try your best at it. Or again, like, no matter what you go through, no matter what happens, never have an excuse for it. Always do it.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:39]: And Joe, what's one thing you've learned about yourself since becoming a dad?

Joe Carlucci [00:26:43]: That I can't do this because I didn't think I could. Scary. As long as I'm on this earth, I have to lead by example and I didn't think I could do it. It's not an easy job for any of us. And just trust me, dealing with this one. I have Corrine in there. Let me tell you, you know where Draly is to all the girls. So

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:00]: Valentina, what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters? What would you say to them?

Valentina Carlucci [00:27:08]: Don't always nag your kids around. Meaning, like, say if you correct them once, that's okay, or a couple of times. But if all you do when you're with them is, oh, why does your hair look so bad? Or your room's a mess, or you've been a slob lately. And if you just keep on correcting them, they'll never come out of their room and they won't wanna talk to you because every time they talk to you, it's just them insulting you instead of saying, hey. Would you like some help or would you like want me to clean your room if you are do a deep clean or something? There's always a necessary way to say something.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:43]: And Joe, what would you say?

Joe Carlucci [00:27:44]: But you sell second time. You can't make up time in life, so make them your world because you don't have them for a long time. The older they get, the less they are. So make them your priority. Don't make other things your priority. My priorities are if I'm not working, I'm with her. If I'm not and if sometimes she's working with me and I'm with her outside of the year. But make them your priority.

Joe Carlucci [00:28:06]: Not a priority where it's it's a business and, you know, in the sense of, like, oh, I gotta take them to sports. I gotta spend quality time with them, whether it's with homework, watching a movie, listening to them, hearing them.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:17]: Well, Joe, Valentina, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for your time tonight and for sharing this journey that you're on. It's not over. It's definitely just the starting point and we'll continue throughout your lives together. And I know that I have loved to being able to see this dynamic play out in front of me, but I know that others will learn from this as well. And I truly wish you both the best.

Joe Carlucci [00:28:42]: Thank you.

Valentina Carlucci [00:28:43]: Thank you.

Joe Carlucci [00:28:44]: It was an honor to have a be with you today.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:28:45]: That's a wrap for this episode of the dad and daughter connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident, independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn't about being perfect. It's about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don't forget, you can find all our episodes at dadanddaughterconnection.com. Until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting, and keep being the dad she needs.

Musical Performer [00:29:16]: We're all in the same boat, and it's full of tiny screaming passengers. We spend the time. We give the lessons. We make the meals. We buy them presents and bring your AK. Because those kids are growing fast. The time goes by just like a dynamite blast. Calling astronauts and firemen, carpenters and muscle men.

Musical Performer [00:29:56]: Get out and be the world to them. Be the best dad you can be. Be the best dad you can be.

Hey dads, welcome to Dad Connections in 5—your quick stop for five-minute insights to help you connect with your daughter in real, lasting ways. I’m Dr. Christopher Lewis, and today we’re talking about something that can easily be missed in the hustle of daily life:

Celebrating small wins.

Not the straight A report cards or the championship games—though those matter too—but the little victories: finishing a tough homework assignment, making a new friend, getting through a hard day with courage.

Why do the little things matter so much? Because when we celebrate those, we’re telling our daughters:

• “I see you.”
• “You’re growing.”
• “Your effort matters, not just your outcome.”

Let’s unpack how noticing and celebrating the small stuff builds confidence, connection, and resilience.

Why Small Wins Matter

Think about this: If your daughter only gets praise for “big things,” what message might she take in? That she has to perform or achieve something grand to earn your attention.

But when you highlight small efforts and daily courage, you’re reinforcing:

• Her value isn’t based on results
• Progress matters more than perfection
• You’re with her in the everyday, not just on the mountaintop

That kind of support builds a solid foundation—the kind she can stand on when life gets hard.

3 Practical Ways to Celebrate Small Wins 1. Call It Out in the Moment

Notice when she makes a good choice, shows effort, or keeps trying—even if it didn’t go perfectly.

Say things like:

• “I saw how you stuck with that even though it was tough—that’s awesome.”
• "You were nervous about that presentation, but you did it anyway. I’m proud of your courage.”
• “You handled that with kindness. That matters.”

You're not waiting for perfect. You're praising the process—and that builds confidence.

2. Create a “Win Wall” or “Victory Jar”

Turn small celebrations into a visible ritual.

• Write down little wins on sticky notes and post them on a wall
• Drop them into a jar and read a few at the end of each week
• Let her decorate it with her own flair

This teaches her to track her own growth, not just rely on outside praise. And it's a fun, visual way to reflect on how far she’s come.

3. Celebrate with Connection, Not Just Rewards

You don’t need to buy anything or throw a party. Sometimes, the best reward is your time and presence.

• “Let’s grab ice cream and talk about how you crushed that quiz.”
• “Want to go on a walk and celebrate how brave you were today?”

These moments say: “I noticed. I care. Let’s share this joy together.” That’s how trust grows—and how relationships deepen.

Quick Takeaway: Try This Today

Here’s your challenge: Catch your daughter doing something small—but good. And celebrate it.

• Did she help without being asked?
• Finish a book she’s been reading?
• Manage her frustration better than last week?

Whatever it is, name it. Praise it. Celebrate it.

Because every small win you see and speak into life becomes part of her inner voice—the one that says:

• “I can do this.”
• “My effort matters.”
• “Dad believes in me.”

That’s it for today’s Dad Connections in 5. If this episode reminded you of the power of paying attention to the small stuff, share it with another dad who’s walking this journey too.

Until next time—keep encouraging, keep noticing, and keep celebrating the small wins that are shaping the big story.

When it comes to the unique and deeply important relationship between fathers and daughters, few conversations are as honest, insightful, and practical as the recent episode of the “Dad and Daughter Connection” podcast featuring Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield. Whether you’re a father looking for inspiration, practical tips, or simply reassurance that you’re not alone on your parenting journey, this episode stands out as a must-listen.

Honest Conversations About Fatherhood

Host Dr. Christopher Lewis welcomes Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield, a renowned expert on father-daughter dynamics, back for a candid and heartfelt conversation. She shares her personal story—growing up as one of four daughters with a father from a tough South Chicago background, and navigating a complex but loving relationship marked by resilience and honest effort. Dr. Canfield’s openness about family wounds, generational patterns, anger, and the need for introspection brings a refreshing vulnerability to the dialogue. Her reminder is clear: you don’t need to be perfect, but you do need to be present, willing to learn, and capable of examining your own story.

Practical Strategies Every Dad Should Know

One of the episode’s biggest strengths is its wealth of actionable advice. Dr. Canfield emphasizes the power of curiosity, vulnerability, and humility in connecting with daughters. She advocates for practical steps like

• Starting meaningful conversations—even if it means getting creative or asking your daughter to teach you something new,

• Making amends and taking responsibility when you’ve made mistakes,

• And, perhaps most importantly, “dropping your anger”—a theme that resonated deeply with listeners and quickly went viral on social media.

Dr. Canfield also explores how fathers can help daughters build resilience and self-confidence in the digital age. She encourages dads to lean in with curiosity when confronting social media challenges, ask thoughtful questions, and co-create boundaries around technology use.

Why You Should Tune In

This episode is not just for dads who feel like they have it all figured out—it’s for every father, at every stage, who wants to do right by his daughter. The conversation is compassionate, empowering, and full of wisdom you can put into practice today.

Ready to build a deeper, more meaningful relationship with your daughter? Listen to the full episode of the “Dad and Daughter Connection” and take your first step towards being the dad she needs—present, engaged, and always willing to grow. TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:02]: Welcome to the dad and daughter connection, the podcast for dads who want to build stronger bonds and raise confident independent daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:12]: If you're looking to build a stronger bond with your daughter and help her grow into a confident, independent woman, you're in the right place. I'm doctor Christopher Lewis, and the dad and daughter connection is the podcast where we dive into real stories, expert advice, and practical tips to help you navigate the incredible journey of fatherhood. In every episode, we'll bring you conversations that inspire, challenge, and equip you to show up as the dad your daughter needs. So let's get started. Because being a great dad isn't just about being there, it's about truly connecting. Welcome back to the Dad and Daughter Connection. I am so glad that you are back with us again this week. As always, every week, you and I are on a journey together as we are working to build those strong relationships with our daughters.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:06]: And it takes time. It takes effort. It takes a willingness to jump all in because every day is gonna be different, and some days are gonna be better than others. And you have to be willing to learn. You have to be willing to take that jump and know that you're not always gonna have all the answers. And that's why every week this podcast is here to give you some some help, some hints, some tips to be able to add to your own toolbox so that you can be that dad that you wanna be, so that you can keep showing up with your daughter and building that strong relationship that you want. And that's why every week, I love being able to bring you different guests with different experiences that can help you to do just that. And this week, I am really excited because I'm bringing a guest that I've interviewed on a previous podcast back, and I am so excited to introduce her to you.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:00]: Doctor Michelle Watson Canfield is with us today, And Doctor. Canfield and I go back. The last time that we talked, I think was in 2020, and we were talking about her newer book at that point called Let's Talk. And at that time, that was a new book for her that she was just bringing out and was conversation starters for dads and daughters. But she has been talking to dads, working with dads for many years in helping them to build great relationships with their daughters. She's had a radio show. She has a podcast now. She has a number of books that are out there.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:38]: She speaks. She does a little bit of everything, and I am really excited to introduce her to you and to have her here today. Michelle, thanks so much for being here today.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:02:47]: Oh my goodness, Christopher. It's great to be back, and glad we can kinda, in a way, pick up where we left off.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:52]: Definitely. You know, it it it's been a few years, but I think we both been rowing in the same direction. And I love the fact of the work that you're doing and helping dads. And, you know, I think that the work that you're doing and that that I'm trying to do here just work so well in tandem.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:03:09]: Exactly. We line up our vision and our passion lines up where we care. We care about our country being healthier from the ground up. And you and I, you're, you know, a girl dad. I'm one of four daughters. We both come at this from different vantage points, but we totally believe, right, that our country will be healthier from the ground up with healthier women. And so often when we see unhealthy women, it's a dad void or a dad wound that leads them to massage that wound or fill the void in unhealthy ways oftentimes, not always. And if dads can dial in with more intention and consistency to their daughters' hearts, literally, that will change our country, make it better, make it stronger.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:03:52]: You know, one of the things that I love doing, and I would love to to have a conversation with you first on is I wanna talk about your dad. Because as you said, you're one of four daughters. And so your dad had his hands full in in helping you to become the person that you are today. I guess first and foremost, tell me about your dad.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:04:11]: So my dad grew up on the South Side Of Chicago, and he was one of seven kids, six boys, one girl, three different last names among those kids, grew up in with really abject poverty being his standard. He was always really industrious and creative in finding ways to make money. So even as a kid, he would say, if I buy this amount of fireworks and go around the neighborhood and sell them, you know, I can do 10 times the money I put out, I can get back in. Like, very creative and industrious, which then led him years later after he was even like he rode. He get bucked off bulls and and stuff, and he would break his leg, but anything to make money. He had to pay his own way because his dad was an alcoholic, died of gangrene in a boxcar, worked for the railroad. They were divorced at that point, his parents. And so he really had to always make his own way.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:05:11]: Again, South Side Of Chicago, even then, really one of the most gang ridden crime dominant places. Like, my dad was in gangs from the time he was 12. So you kinda look at this fact that my dad had no template for how to be a dad. None. And so as he got older, you know, he marries my mom. They were in the military together. My mom was my dad's boss. They were stationed in the army in San Francisco.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:05:38]: And about six years in, my parents decided that they were gonna get their life kind of under new leadership, new management, and they started a faith journey together as Jesus followers. They're doing this thing together, trying to grow because my mom then on her side came from an abusive father who was a farmer in Minnesota who was sexually molesting his children. And to be candid here right at the front, I'm one of the fallouts even of that grandfather's abuse. So my parents find each other with a lot of brokenness, a lot of unmet needs, a lot of lack of fathering that was positive. So my dad finally, we moved from California to Oregon, so my dad could, of all things, goes to seminary. He's gonna become a pastor, which what was funny is he was raised Catholic. And my grandma, again, my Chicago grandma would say, well, I'm getting in the front door to heaven. You're gonna get in the back door as a a Baptist.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:06:33]: You know? And it was kind of this funny, banter between them. And so I'm just telling you that that foundation of my dad's life, which shows that he's an overcomer dad. He's a resilient dad, a man in many ways. He's a hardworking man. But you want to know the downside of what he was raised with is he didn't learn how to always, what I would call, lift up the hood of his car when he saw the red light, and I'm using that obviously as a metaphor of his own stuff, and how to look at when a red light comes on the car and we look at that, you can either ignore it. You can get a hammer out and pull the lid of the car up, the hood of the car, and just bang out the wires you don't wanna look at so that the light goes out. But at the end of the day, if you ignore the light, you're gonna have a problem. And so I really believe that some of my passion for fathers is to help equip dads to have a skill set that I often wish my dad would have.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:07:39]: My dad's in his late eighties now, where my dad would say to me, like you know, this is maybe a decade ago where I'm saying, dad, do you think we're all that close? And he goes, not as close as you'd like us to be. And I said, yep. Yep. Pretty much. Because I wanna have deeper conversations. I want my dad to delve into my heart space and mine the depths of what's there by asking better questions. And so a lot of the ten years in Portland where I'm doing this group for dads of daughters who were daughters in their teens or twenties, and even since then where I speak at conferences or write books or do my dad whisperer podcast, is I wanna equip dads to set the bar higher in what they require of themselves in growing in their skill set as a man without just saying, yeah. I'm not so good at communicating, or, yeah, I'm not so good at emotions, or, yeah, that's kinda we're different, or I don't like her reaction, so I just back off.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:08:37]: I'm like, dad, no. I wanna equip you to lead your daughter and lead yourself to a deeper relationship. So in many ways, I don't wanna give a false narrative here or presentation, if you will, of my story of going. My dad and I are really in a great place. Because to be honest with you, Chris, my dad and I are really tough place right now because my dad isn't willing to look at his stuff. And it has created some real big challenges within the last year. My dad's words to me as we sat together at lunch, Portland, Oregon, he said, I think we're at an impasse. And I said, yeah, I think we are.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:09:18]: And that breaks my heart because I am all about advocating for father daughter health. And yet I'm saying to dads out there that are gonna places that are really hard with their daughters, you gotta do your own work. You gotta lift that hood of your car and say, where is the wiring faulty? Where things aren't firing like they need to and like they were created to, which is going to involve humility. It's going to involve self introspection. It's going to involve honesty, making amends, taking responsibility, asking forgiveness, and going deeper in your relationship with your daughter. So I love my dad. But to be honest with you, it's really interesting that you started by asking that question about his story because I wanna be honest in what I'm sharing with you today.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:10:06]: Well, I appreciate you sharing that. I guess, in you talking about that, is there something you wish your dad understood about you that would bring you closer together?

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:10:16]: You know, in some ways, I really think he does understand me. He knows I'm a fireball. He knows I've got a lot of intensity and passion. And sometimes, he's like, calm down, Michelle, you know, or bring it down a few notches. And I say, dad, I'm just trying to have an honest conversation. But, you know, one of the things I've learned in my profession, almost thirty years now in mental health, you know, in the trenches with men and women, a lot of daughters, a lot of dads. In fact, now I'm coaching more with dads around the country now that I've moved from Portland to Arkansas, right, where dads are reaching out. And I love being in the trenches with dads and daughters or just the dad saying, I don't even know where to go in my own story.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:11:01]: I don't even know what that looks like. My dad didn't model that, or I didn't grow up in a family where mental health was all that valued. And so, really, as I come at this theme of how do we become healthier people so that our relationships are healthier, what I I know is my dad knows I'm intense. I'm a communicator for a living. I wanna go deep is what I think in some ways, it's it's not as much that my dad doesn't know things about me. It's that I haven't always known things about him. And we even started I'll call it a game where for a number of years I may have even shared this back in twenties that with you that my dad and I, for a number of years, would shop on Monday nights and get our groceries. You know? So here I'm a single adult because I've only been married now for not even five years.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:11:48]: You know? Got married at the age of 60 for the first time. That came up in our last conversation, you know, back in '20. But so here I am, you know, especially through my fifties where my dad and I wanting to forge a stronger, healthier bond with my dad because this is my passion, my mission, my calling. And so I said, dad, what if we went and got groceries on Monday nights? It was my idea. So we go to Costco for dinner. Yeah. I'm a cheap date. Right? He'd buy dinner.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:12:15]: A lot of times I would, you know, pizza, salad. I know. So not healthy, but it's so good. And we would have conversations there at the picnic tables at Costco, and then we go across the street to this other store and buy groceries. And so on the way home, Chris, I started this thing where I said, dad, we've only got ten minutes. What if you told me one story from your childhood, from your life? And he go, okay. So I found that that was a way that my dad could handle a short story. And I remember he got to the point at one point where he said, I think I've told you all my stories.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:12:49]: And I said, I wanna hear him again. And new details would emerge. And it helped me understand my dad better. And I truly do understand that he didn't really get all that much fathering or all that much parenting input or all that much relational, I would say, foundation laid in his own life, and that has left him at a deficit. And he's overcome so much. I'm so grateful for that. And yet I just say to dads, don't ever stop doing your own work. Do your own work to face your own deficits, your own wounds.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:13:23]: Because if you don't, your daughter may outgrow you in her skill set, and the distance between you at a heart level or relational level will get wider. And one of the things I was gonna say probably five minutes ago that comes back to my mind now is that because I sought out a profession. Right? I'm a licensed professional counselor with a master's in counseling psychology, a PhD in health psychology, where I understand the importance of relational health, is that I would say we all have a window of tolerance. We can only handle so much, but the beauty is we can expand how much we can tolerate. Our capacity for emotional, I would say, communication, our emotional depth, our vulnerability, our honesty, how that impacts resilience can grow. So, dad, if you're at a place where you're like, yeah, I just didn't get dealt a great hand from my family of origin, I wanna say you can grow. Reach out to me. I'll do work with you.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:14:24]: I'll help you face some of your own stuff. Because the more you face those things in yourself, the healthier bond and relationship you will have with your daughter. No doubt.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:14:36]: Now I know you mentioned the fact that dads need to be able to unpack things for themselves. And as you look back at the years that you've had with your dad, and I know it's been quite a few, but as you have had those years with your dad, are there things that you wish that your dad had done differently when it came to building your relationship? So if you think all the way even all the way back to when you were young, to where you are today, are there things that you wish that he did differently?

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:15:05]: You know, I think I'm gonna start by answering what he did well and what he did what I would say even right, even though that's a relative term, a subjective term. But my dad, because of the lack of fathering role model, he would ask other men, what should I do? So back when I was, you know, I would say in my early teens, you know, middle school, he came to me, and I have a sister two years younger, and he said, we're gonna start something called a life notebook because some other dad said to him, this would be good to have meetings with your daughters, with your kids. So with him, it was daughters. So he got me a notebook, and I'm like, okay. This is really awkward. I'm sitting with my dad down in his office, you know, and we're having this meeting. And he would start by saying, Michelle, I know you struggle with fear. Let's talk about that.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:15:55]: And, hey, that was wouldn't you say, Chris, that was huge steps forward for my dad to say. I didn't even know what to talk about or what to do. He would say, let's talk about your name and what it means. So we go to the website, look up well, there wasn't much web then. Somehow he accessed the meaning of my name, and he would write it out for me. So I begin to have pages in this life notebook. And because my dad at the time was going to school to become a pastor, he would use the Bible as a template. What does the Bible say about your name? What does the Bible say about fear? Now some people listening might go, oh, that's really super weird.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:16:33]: I'm not trying to shove anything down anyone's throat. I'm just telling you my story. And so my dad did things like, okay, we're gonna do something he called perfume day because he went to a men's retreat where they said, what are your kids like? Do that more with them. So my dad came home and said, okay. It was Christmas time. We're gonna start a tradition, which we did for probably twenty five years. Once I got married, he said, you're you're on your own. Husbands get to carry that mantle now or that torch.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:17:01]: So he would take me out to Nordstrom or it was Meyer and Frank and Macy's back in the day, and he would sit in the perfume section at Christmas time. And I would try all the smells, like you gotta put perfume on your body. They smell different, right, on every woman. And then he would buy me whatever perfume I wanted. So look at my dad's, and I'm gonna try to create rhythms and traditions that begin to set a foundation of letting you know that I care about you. So I wanna give my dad big props for that. But now to your question of what do you wish your dad would have done different? One of them is I wish my dad would have had a lot less anger. And that is something that across the board in my now fifteen years, if you can believe that, of walking alongside dads, coaching dads of daughters.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:17:54]: That's come out as a huge theme. And I've been coaching or mentoring or counseling women since I was 19, and I'm almost 65. So this is forty five years. I've been close to women's stories on my own where they say, my dad's anger is done more to destroy stuff inside me than anything else. And even though daughters hate when their dads are disappointed, I would say the anger thing is a big, big, big deal. In fact, even since you and I talked a couple of years ago, not even two years ago, a friend interviewed me for his podcast, put a 47 clip, you know, out onto social media. I've never had anything go viral. This one, three point four million views.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:18:39]: And all I said in this interview was, dad, I got a three word phrase for you that you've got to keep in mind to become a better dad to your daughter. Three words, drop your anger. And what I said in that forty seven second clip, Chris, is your anger will do more to destroy the core of who your daughter is. Hurt her spirit, make her give up and stop trying, and she will internalize your view of her into the core of who she is, and it will shut her down and make her stop trying. Your anger will do more to destroy her than anything else. So I said, dad, make a commitment today to make a vow with your mouth that you are not going to respond in anger? And I know that seems like a big ask, but every dad I know loves his daughter and wants to be a better dad to her. I'm like, dad, that one thing will be a game changer is if you can tell you start to respond in anger and the numbers zero to 10 are climbing inside of you, you gotta give yourself a time out. Get away.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:19:43]: You'll never regret coming back and responding or disciplining or correcting your daughter if you do it after you've calmed your own brain down. When our mid brains are on fire, we flood our prefrontal cortex, that front part of our brain, and we go offline. You may not even remember some of what you said, but your daughter will carry it for years. So, dad, one thing, I wish my dad would have been better at he he didn't blow up a lot, but I could feel it, and I avoided wanting to step on those landmines. So that's one thing. I think another thing is I wish that my dad would have come and made amends more when he did maybe respond in anger or overreact on his own. I think that would have been a huge game changer from another one would be for my dad to take responsibility for things that really were his fault or his part. And often I, I would say I was left to believe it was me who was bad or me who overreacted or it was my fault.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:20:48]: And so those are some things that I wish my dad would have done different that I wanna say out front here and very clearly because I know there's dads listening that say, I love my daughter. I wish we were closer. I've talked before about a bombed out bridge between a dad and a daughter, between your heart and her heart, and ways that you can repair the bridge, rebuild the bridge is, dad, you gotta start by taking responsibility for your part, even if it's deficits, rather than making excuses and make amends and come with humility. And I I think a game changing question a dad can ask his daughter is tell me how I hurt you when. It may be, tell me how I hurt you when I responded that way. Tell me how I hurt you when your mom and I divorced. Tell me how I hurt you when I had that affair. Tell me how I hurt you when I was so busy with work.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:21:42]: I didn't have much time for you in those years. And when you come with humility and say, I wanna listen more than I talk. Got two ears, one mouth. Dad, watch what happens in your relationship. I promise you, it will be a game changer for her to know that you want to hear how you've impacted her, and then you listen without defensiveness. Watch what happens. It will be life changing for both of you.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:08]: Now I know that you've had a lot of experiences over the years in working with dads. And in your experience, what would you say are some unconventional ways fathers can initiate deeper conversations with their daughters, especially during the teenage years?

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:22:24]: Unconventional. Oh, you're catching me by surprise. I'm intrigued by that. You're making me think. Right? You're making me on the fly go deeper. So I love that, which by the way, you ask great questions. So that's really when you said conversations is why that second book. Because as the dads I was leading in the Abba project, I said, you know, Abba means daddy in Aramaic and men love a project.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:22:46]: And I said, do you guys want more practical action steps, right, to reach your daughter's heart? So it has 60 themes in that book. Dad leader to laugh, leader to love, leader to listen. And I even have leader to lament in there because if there's been wounds there and then the listen one is how your daughter can ask you questions about your life. So in some ways, that might be an unconventional different step a dad could take is to get my book, hand his daughter the book because the end is where she can ask you questions about your life. And so you don't have to reinvent the wheel. But, dad, your daughter wants to know what obstacles you've overcome. She wants to know how you learn things the hard way. So what some questions in there where she can ask you, dad, tell me what you wish you wouldn't have done.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:23:36]: Tell me about the stupid decisions you've made, but that you've learned the hard way. I mean, I always think why are these, I would say, stupid shows on television such a hit about quote, unquote reality TV? I think it's because we wanna see a trademark worse than our own, but there's no redemptive side of it. There's no learning the right way or the hard way. Dad, let her know the stories of your life. Because I've had some dads say, oh, I don't want her to know that. But as your daughter heads into her teen years, her brain is developing this midsection. The corpus callosum is is where you go from right brain to left brain is growing and developing, and your daughter's is really interested in the gray areas more, not the black and white things. The less concrete she wants to know the messy stories with what you learned the hard way because she's then internalizing resilience to go, you know, whatever your last name is, like Lewis.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:24:30]: That's what Lewis' do. They don't give up when it's hard. They don't shut down just because they've had obstacles. So you're that might be an unconventional new tool for your toolbox, dad, is okay. I'm gonna start opening up more about some of my messy story with the part of the story of what I learned and how I course corrected on the other side. Maybe another unconventional way is that you let your daughter see your emotion that's softer. That's the cool thing is testosterone grows and like, as dads grow, testosterone decreases. It tends to increase for women, and that helps men become softer, more tenderhearted.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:25:09]: Let your daughter see your tears. Let her see what breaks your heart, not just the strength, right, of how hard you work or how hard you overcome. That might be unconventional. I think another thing might might be, let your daughter teach you something she's good at that you're not good at. It may be spending time in the kitchen because she loves cooking and you're, you know, you're all thumbs and you drop things. Let her be better at you in some areas. Teach you what she knows where you're not in the lead. Ask her what are 10 outrageous things you wanna do in your life.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:25:45]: 10. Give me 10. I mean, one of mine back in the day was I wanna write a book. I never thought I could write a book. I still in some ways go, I'm not an author. Well, apparently, I am. You know? But I think the more you as a dad are humble, soft, tenderhearted, and you join your daughter in what she's good at, you may say, I am very uncomfortable with this. I am very awkward because we're gonna go to a paint paint by number night where you're guided to do a a painting.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:26:15]: I am so not right brain gifted. I don't know how to paint. But if that's what she loves, go do it with her. She loves books, and you're not so much of a reader. Take her to a bookstore. Let her pick out a couple books, and you walk through the aisles with her. The more you can join her in what she loves, she will bond with you in ways like never before.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:26:35]: Now social media can be definitely something that is challenging for parents, for fathers. How can fathers effectively support their daughters in developing resilience and self confidence in today's social media driven culture?

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:26:51]: Well, we all know it isn't going anywhere. In fact, I recently did a couple podcasts. I do a dad daughter Friday blog, which I've done now for eleven years, where I'm wanting to give dads bite sized practical wisdom, which I know you've been very passionate about that as well. Having having dads who may not wanna read a whole book or listen to the audio, but get can get short snippets. But recently, I focused on doctor Jonathan Haight who wrote the anxious generation about how social media is really destroying our our kids. Right? Delay as long as you can, giving them a phone that has access, right, to the world beyond their walls. But at the same time, we all know it isn't going anywhere. So I would say, dad, limit the amount of time your kids are on there.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:27:34]: Let her push back. Let her react. Let her have a fit. Let her get angry because her brain is so impacted, right, by the amount of time and exposure to what's on social media. But I say, dad, know what she's looking at, limit her screen time, have her plug in her phone every night. Everybody's phone goes to a dock, so she doesn't have access because, honestly, Chris, I have counseling clients in their teens that never turn off their phone. And they'll say, yeah. I got a text at 2AM.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:28:04]: And I'm like, what are you doing with your phone on? But I can't go against a family norm just because I'm a therapist and inform them. Right? It's not my call. But I would say, absolutely. Have your kids shut off their phone at night. Absolutely. They need more deep sleep, REM sleep for their own health, wellness, and development. But, dad, join your daughter. Go sit with her and say, show me what you're looking at.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:28:28]: I wanna see the sites you're accessing. Put safeguards. Right? There's a lot of them out there. There's even you know, I just interviewed a guy on Gloo AI, g l o o a I, where they're putting safeguards, right, on phones, on social media so that there can be more safety around what your kids are watching. And we know with AI, you know, kids believe what they hear. They believe it as solid concrete facts. Anything they hear on social media. And I know that may be an overreach, but would you agree with me? They tend to believe if the Internet says it, it must be true.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:29:04]: Well, what's happened with AI is they're developing relationships. So he sits with his daughter, this Glue AI guy, and says, hey, AI. Tell me a story to my daughter, Paige. And the thing will talk to your daughter as if she's a real person and say, I love you, Paige. I love you too. So these, you know, artificial intelligence realities for kids are stepping in and kind of creating pseudo relationships. So, dad, be aware of what your daughter's listening to, how she's using AI, and come with curiosity. If she feels your judgment, she's gonna hide more from you.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:29:38]: But if you come curious, tell me what you're hearing. And the better questions you ask, the closer you'll be, which I remember when I went to counseling school, I was getting my master's. My very first counseling class was doctor Joan McElroy. She said, you will be a better counselor if you learn to ask better questions. And I would say, dad, you will be a better dad, a girl dad, if you learn to ask better questions of your daughter. So rather than coming going, what are you listening to with that tone? Right? What are you looking at? She's gonna shut down and go, I ain't showing my dad that. But if you come and ask questions with a tone of voice that's curious, she'll hear it more as you wanna know about her world rather than you're interrogating her. What are you looking at versus tell me what you're looking at? Show me what you're looking at.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:30:23]: I'm interested. Let's learn together. You can ask her, did you hear anything maybe off base with what they just said? Could we look together on the Internet and explore what we just heard said as concrete fact? And you teach your daughter that how to think, not just what to think by doing that with her because you may go, that was not even true. And she just swallowed it. Remember her brain doesn't fully develop till 25 that prefrontal cortex to make good decisions and have judgment and reasoning. So there's not something wrong with her at 15 that she swallowed that, that someone told her that's her brain isn't fully developed. And that's why she needs you to help find ways to explore it, ask questions. And you let her find it out and go, oh my goodness.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:31:08]: I didn't even know that wasn't true. And you're sitting right there with her, bonding the whole time and teaching your daughter how to ask better questions of herself and what she hears out on social media.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:31:20]: Now reflecting on your extensive counseling experience, what are some common misconceptions that fathers have about their daughter's needs or perspectives, and how can they best overcome them?

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:31:32]: Well, I think sometimes a misconception is that dads will tell their daughters, don't make a big deal out of everything, or don't care about what that girl says or that guy tends to be girls, to be honest with you. That's why we have a movie called Mean Girls, not Mean Guys. But you cannot tell your daughter not to care about what other girls think. Just don't let it bother you. Just don't listen to the mean girls. It absolutely is impossible for us as women. It's our core wiring as girls to be relationally driven. And so to tell her you're overreactive, don't let those bullies or those mean girls bother you, or don't let what everybody else says is popular.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:32:12]: Or even to tell your daughter, don't care about what the style is. Some girls care a lot about how their outfit looks. And And so I would even say to dads, a misconception is that your daughter, even on the way out the door with an outfit that you think no daughter of mine is gonna go out looking like that, that's not the time to course correct. She's planned that outfit or her hairstyle. In fact, I would say a really proactive dad tip is I call it dadvice, is what about saying, that dress is really short and that is showing a lot of skin or she's gonna draw all the wrong kind of guys if if she's wearing that. Use that as a teachable moment, dad, to say, oh, okay. I wanna say right now, go change. But I would also ask who will did mom know about that outfit? That's between you and your and, you know, her mom, whether you're married or not, have that conversation adult to adult.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:33:07]: But you're saying, hey. What if we set up an experiment today? What if you noticed? Do you get more guy attention in that outfit? Do you get less? What kind of guys are drawn to you in that really short skirt? Like, use those teachable moments to help your daughter learn how to interact with the world around her, and you get to speak into her life saying, if I was a teenage guy, it would be really hard to look at your eyes and see your intelligence with that much skin. But I know. I'm old fashioned. I know I'm old. Hey. Maybe we could learn together. I wanna hear some things.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:33:42]: So let's meet up after school, take her to somewhere fun that she loves to eat, and have conversations with her to teach her how to think, not just what to think. Like I keep saying, you are in her life for a purpose as a dad to help steer, and you may need to pull the dad card. You know what, hon? I know you love that, but I really I can't support that one. But if every time you're blocking her way from being expressive with her style or her personality, she will find a way to hide it from you and still pull that off. So the more she can be honest with you and open with you and you're coming together, some of the times that unconventional might be, you know, that you asked even earlier, what's an unconventional dad tip? It may be compromising and coming together saying, I'm really uncomfortable with this. Ask mom, what do you think? Ask other other women in your life. It might be a sister or a coworker or your mom. You're growing and being okay with things that might be a little uncomfortable for you.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:34:42]: But for the sake of the relationship, you're finding a middle ground.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:34:46]: Now as you look ahead to the work that you are doing to the work that you're doing with dads, what emerging challenges do you foresee in the father daughter relationships, and how can fathers proactively address them to maintain strong connections?

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:35:00]: You know, I think the clear one we've talked about is social media and the impact and the amount of input girls are getting from especially their peers about what is acceptable to believe. You know, we have a lot going on with gender confusion. I think on this side of the pandemic a little bit, it's less of a hot button issue, but it still is there. Is gender confusion, gender identity, right, and who you are. And, you know, the more your daughter can even have a faith foundation, then when you're not there as her earthly father, can she connect with God perhaps as a heavenly father? I think that's really a confusing time in our culture where there's so many spiritual leaders falling and failing that sometimes your daughter may wanna throw the baby out with the bathwater. I don't wanna touch faith with a 10 foot pole and maybe you as a dad say, I'm so lost. And then the whole family kinda throws faith by the wayside. I would say, dad, why not enter into that arena with her and say, let's read something together that we both find interesting about faith or about your identity as a woman.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:36:15]: Right? That's getting really hit hard in our culture where it's almost scary for a girl to hold strong to an identity as a female, even as a a bold, resilient, strong woman with a voice who has I I always think voice and choice are what get hard with us as women. You don't wanna be too loud. You don't wanna be too soft or too quiet. Dad, champion your daughter's voice and her choice. What does she care about? What is she passionate about? And regardless of what's happening in the culture, if you and your home can support your daughter's gifts and passions, it will outrank, and that will stand. I I really believe this, and I've seen it over three decades, is your view of her will really take hold stronger than what the voice of the culture and the narrative that she's hearing about what matters. What happens between you and her will really outrank, outlive, outlast the other voices. And the research confirms that that every area of your daughter's life will be better and stronger with a stronger bond to you.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:37:27]: Better grades in school, more likely to finish high school and attend college, greater self esteem, greater academic performance. She will be more likely to find steady employment, healthier weight, less body dissatisfaction. She'll delay her sexual debut. She will have more resilience. I mean, on and on. Every area of her life will thrive by a connection to you. So I would say, dad, don't get sidetracked with being afraid of every other voice or the narrative or the cultural climate because your bond with her is more important than all of that.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:38:03]: Well, Michelle, I just wanna say thank you. And we always finish our interviews with what I typically call our dad connection six, and I still call it the dad connection six. But usually, it's just for the dads. But I'm gonna ask you a couple questions. I wanna see what your answers are as well.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:38:19]: I love it.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:38:20]: What's one word that describes your relationship with your dad?

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:38:25]: Complicated.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:38:26]: What's the best piece of dad advice you've ever received or heard?

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:38:31]: Probably where a dad told me that he had a three word phrase that was a game changer for him with his daughter, which is tell me more. Is that a daughter looks at a dad's face, and when she sees deers deer in the headlights kind of eyes that are trailing off or he's disinterested, that goes into make her think she's uninteresting and unworthy of being listened to. My friend, Mike Betts said that is he learned, he's a business coach for companies. And he said, I say to them all the time, tell me more. And I helped that company figure out their vision, their their strategies. And he said, when I brought that to my daughter, it was a game changer because I learned to listen longer to her rather than, okay, that's a lot of words or that was a lot of listening, but just tell me more. She began to open up more. So I would say that stands out really at the top of one of the best things I've heard a dad say.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:39:27]: If your dad could give you one life lesson in a single sentence, what would it be?

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:39:32]: My dad has given me a life lesson, which is never give up. My dad, he's been beat down, and he hasn't stopped. He's continued to get up again with resilience. So I'd say never give up.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:39:44]: And the final question, what advice would you give to other dads who want to build a lasting and meaningful relationship with their daughters?

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:39:51]: I've got two three word sentences, which you can tell a lot of these are three words. But one is drop your anger. That's the one I've told you before. Drop your anger. And the second one, so that's more what not to do. This one is what to do. Pursue her heart. We as women, we thrive, we blossom, we grow.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:40:12]: We're successful when our heart is engaged. But hearts for women shut down, and we put the wall up when we don't feel safe or we feel threatened. And so the more you pursue her heart and wanna connect, there's your word of your podcast, connect with her heart. She will open up to you. She'll open up to the world. She will be more of her authentic self and who she truly is, the more she's hard engaged. So if you as a dad pursue her heart, even more than her head, both matter, but pursue her heart, I would say you're gonna see not only your relationship thrive, but you will see your daughter thrive.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:40:48]: Well, Michelle, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for being here today, for your passion, and for your work, and helping dads to be better dads. And if people wanna find out more about you, where should they go?

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:40:58]: Mhmm. You can go to doctormichellewatson.com. M I c h e l l e Watson Com. You can find links to my two books, and one of them is in Spanish. So even if that there, that's on Amazon. Let's talk conversation starters for dads and daughters. First one, dad, here's what I really need from you, A guide for connecting with your daughter's heart, and then I've got my dad daughter blogs that you can also subscribe. They're all free.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:41:22]: I've got lots of free resources there. And then links to the dad whisperer podcast, which is on all platforms as well.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:41:29]: Well, we will put links in the notes today. Michelle, thank you for being here today, and I wish you all the best.

Dr. Michelle Watson Canfield [00:41:34]: Oh, always a joy to connect with you, Chris. Thanks so much for having me back.

Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:41:37]: That's a wrap for this episode of the dad and daughter connection. Thanks for joining us on this journey to build stronger bonds and raise confident independent daughters. Remember, being an engaged dad isn't about being perfect. It's about being present. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe and share it with a fellow dad. And don't forget, you can find all our episodes at dadanddaughterconnection.com. Until next time, keep showing up, keep connecting, and keep being the dad she needs.

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