Joan Brugge has worked for nearly 50 years as a cancer scientist, studying the earliest signs that someone might become sick. Then the Trump administration canceled her lab’s funding. The administration’s attacks on medicine, culture, and education—which include funding cuts and verbal threats—are about more than just budgeting and bravado. Our host, Anne Applebaum, speaks with Ruth Ben-Ghiat, a professor of history and Italian studies at New York University and the author of Strongmen: Mussolini to the Present, who argues that this effort is part of a larger autocratic project to maintain power.

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