Red Flag

Several years ago, when we started this podcast, we used stars as an example of how people of various perspectives and backgrounds can look at the same image but take different meanings from it. Obviously this was our entry point to talking about the now former Mississippi flag and the confederate imagery that was so prevalently featured on it. As we conclude this podcast with a look behind the scenes at the state capitol and look ahead to the new flag design referendum, we want to ask you to keep considering the question of how you view our home and what a place like Mississippi means to you.

This week, we talk with the organizers of BLMSip who succesfully put together one of the largest State capitol protests, in recent history.

Spoilers! The flag came down y'all! But was the really an overnight decision? And at what cost did it take to bring us here? The Red Flag podcast welcomes you back to Mississippi for this 3 part finale, exploring the path that lead the last state in the union to take down it's confederate battle emblem.

Final Debates and Final Votes from the floor of the Mississippi Senate - 6/28/20

HB1796 Passes.

Mississippi Senate Jun 27 2020

36-14

Mississippi House of Representatives Jun 27 2020

85-34 towards changing the State Flag of Mississippi

_**Candidates who are in favor of changing the Mississippi Flag:

_**

David Baria (D) - US Senate

Roger Wicker (R) - US Senate

Mike Espy - US Senate

**Candidates for U.S. House Mississippi District 2

Bennie G. Thompson (D)

Jeramey Anderson (D)

removal of the Confederate emblem from the Mississippi state flag and/or condemned

public displays of the Confederate emblem (this list is not necessarily comprehensive and

is updated regularly):

Philip Gunn (R), Speaker of the State House of Representatives

US Sen. Thad Cochran (R)

US Sen. Roger Wicker (R)

US Rep. Bennie Thompson (D)

Henry Barbour (R), Republican National Committee Member

Sen. Deborah Dawkins (D)

Sen. David Blount (D)

Sen. John Horhn (D)

Rep. David Baria (D)

Rep. Sonya Williams-Barnes (D)

Rep. Jeramey Anderson (D)

Rep. Kathy Sykes (D)

Candidate for US House of Rep., 4th Cong. Dist., Mark Gladney (D)

Former Gov. William Winter

Former Gov. Ronnie Musgrove

Bill Luckett, Mayor of Clarksdale

Johnny Dupree, former Mayor of Hattiesburg

Tony Yarber, former Mayor of Jackson

Vicki Robinson Slater, 2016 gubernatorial candidate

Melton Harris, Jackson Co. BOS

The MS Democratic Party

4th Congressional District MS Democrats

MS Legislative Black Caucus

Councilman Felix Gines (D), Biloxi

Chokwe Lumumba, Mayor of Jackson

Toby Barker (R), Mayor of Hattiesburg

FoFo Gilich (R), Mayor of Biloxi

Biloxi City Council (drafted and passed resolution endorsing state flag change)

Gautier City Council (drafted and passed resolution endorsing state flag change)

Atty. Gen. Jim Hood (D)

Sen. Briggs Hopson (R)

Andy Taggart - Executive Director of the MS Republican Party in 1984; political director of the

MS Republican Party in 1980 and 1981; MS State Chairman for the presidential campaign of

Ohio Governor John Kasich; former Chairman of the Greater Jackson (MS) Chamber

Partnership; former Madison County Supervisor; former CEO of MS Technology Alliance; named

by Governor Phil Bryant in 2014 as Co-Chairman of the Mississippi Department of Corrections

Task Force on Contract Review and Procurement; attorney and gubernatorial appointee to the

Mississippi Judicial Appointments Advisory Committee

Percy Bland (D), Mayor of Meridian

Lynn Fitch (R), MS State Treasurer

Carlos Moore, Attorney and Municipal Court Judge Pro Tem, Clarksdale

Rickey Authement, Alderman, City of Ocean Springs

Jason Shelton (D), Mayor of Tupelo

Mario King (R), Mayor of Moss Point

Religious Leaders and Organizations:

Southern Baptist Convention

Southern Christian Leadership Conference

Mississippi Diocese of the Episcopal Church

Mississippi Religious Leadership Council

United Methodist Church

Evangelical Lutheran Church of America (ELCA)

The Washington National Cathedral (Catholic Church)

Lighthouse Community Church, Biloxi

Academic leaders and organizations:

Morris Stocks, UM interim Chancellor

Robert Khayat, former UM Chancellor

Dan Jones, former UM Chancellor

Mark Keenum, MSU President

Jim Borsig, MS University for Women President

The University of Mississippi

Mississippi State University

University of Southern Mississippi

UMMC

Mississippi University for Women

Delta State

Jackson State University

Alcorn State University

Mississippi Valley State University

Millsaps College

The SEC

The NCAA (prohibits post-season collegiate tournaments is MS due to the current flag)

Ole Miss Coaches Hugh Freeze, Andy Kennedy and Mike Bianco

MSU Coaches Dan Mullen and Ben Howland

SEC Football Coaches Nick Saban and Steve Spurrier

Board of Trustees for State Institutions of Higher Learning (2001)

Robert Luckett, Ph.D., Jackson State University

Stephanie Rolph, Ph.D., Millsaps College

Janice Brockley, Ph.D., Jackson State University

Alison Greene, Ph.D., Mississippi State University

William Storey, Ph.D., Millsaps College

James Giesen, Ph.D., Mississippi State University

Christian Pinnen, Ph.D., Mississippi College

Otis W. Pickett, Ph.D., Mississippi College

Robert S. McElvaine, Ph.D., Millsaps College

Kathryn Green, Ph.D., Mississippi Valley State University

Anne Marshall, Ph.D., Mississippi State University

C. Sade Turnipseed, Ph.D., Mississippi Valley State University

Bridget Smith Pieschel, Ph.D., Mississippi University for Women

Elizabeth Anne Payne, Ph. D., University of Mississippi

Anne Twitty, Ph.D., University of Mississippi

Max Grivno, Ph.D., University of Southern Mississippi

Susannah J. Ural, Ph.D., University of Southern Mississippi

Charles Westmoreland, Jr., Ph.D., Delta State University

Darren Grem, Ph.D., University of Mississippi

Alexandra Finley, Ph.D., Mississippi State University

John R. Neff, Ph.D., University of Mississippi

Ted M. Ownby, Ph.D., University of Mississippi

Amy Wiese Forbes, Ph.D., Millsaps College

Erin M. Kempker, Ph.D., Mississippi University for Women

Andrew P. Haley, Ph.D., University of Southern Mississippi

Kevin D. Greene, Ph.D., University of Southern Mississippi

Jarod Roll, Ph.D., University of Mississippi

April Holm, Ph.D., University of Mississippi

Rebecca Tuuri, Ph.D., University of Southern Mississippi

Kyle F. Zelner, Ph.D., University of Southern Mississippi

Patrick Connelly, Ph.D., Mississippi College

Jason Ward, Ph.D., Mississippi State University

James Pat Smith, Ph.D., Professor Emeritus of History, USM

Douglas Bristol, Ph.D., USM

Andrew N. Wegmann, Ph.D., Assistant Professor of History at Delta State University

Civic, Economic and Non-Profit Organizations:

Mississippi Economic Council

Mississippi Development Authority

Gulf Coast Business Council

Mississippi Gulf Coast Chamber of Commerce

Mississippi Business Journal

Mississippi Manufacturer’s Association (2001)

MS NAACP

National NAACP

Biloxi NAACP

Jackson Co. NAACP

Hancock Co. NAACP

Gulfport NAACP

Stone Co. NAACP

Steps Coalition

League of Women Voters of MS

Mississippi Onward PAC

Mississippi Rising Coalition

The Flag for All Mississippians Coalition

The Mississippi Rainbow Center

Come As You Are (CAYA)

The American Family Association (2001)

The ACLU of MS

Southern Poverty Law Center

Emmett Till Interpretive Center

Jenna R. Fassbender Center for LGBTQ Alliance

Harrison Co. Federation of Democratic Women

Jackson Co. Federation of Democratic Women

The Ecumenical Coalition for Women and Families

DSU Gender and Sexuality Alliance

Children’s Defense Fund (Southern Regional Office)

Mississippi Center for Justice

National Association of Social Workers (MS Chapter)

Human Rights Campaign Mississippi

Spectrum Center (Hattiesburg)

New South Collective

Hijra House

Mississippians Stand Together

Hattiesburg Indivisible

Indivisible Golden Triangle MS

Indivisible Jackson Metro Area

Indivisible L.O.U. (Oxford)

Indivisible MS Delta

Indivisible Northeast Mississippi

MS Gulf Coast Indivisible

South Mississippi Indivisible

MS Reproductive Freedom Fund

Mississippi Association for Justice

Mississippi Humanist Association

Newspapers/Media:

Clarion-Ledger

Jackson Free Press

The Sun Herald

Mississippi Business Journal

Greenwood Commonwealth

Delta Democrat Times

Daily Mississippian

Columbus Commercial Dispatch

Brookhaven Daily Leader

Hattiesburg American

WJZD94.5 FM

WLOX (ABC/CBS affiliate, MS Gulf Coast)

SuperTalk Radio

BamSouth.com

Hattiesburg Post/Hub City Spokes

Cities and Counties that have removed state flag from public spaces:

Clarksdale

Hattiesburg

Magnolia

Grenada

Jackson

West Point

Columbus

Starkville

Oxford

Vicksburg

Greenwood

Greenville

Moss Point

Waveland

Leflore Co.

Washington Co.

Oktibbeha Co.

Sunflower Co.

Adams Co.

Hinds Co.

Biloxi

Tupelo (current state flag removed from Tupelo Police Dept. by Mayor Shelton, Tupelo City

Council passed resolution along racial lines to require display of current flag on all other

municipal properties)

McComb

Pascagoula

Meridian

Cleveland

Bolivar Co.

Pass Christian

Bay St. Louis

Businesses/Corporations:

BancorpSouth

Mississippi Power

Huntington Ingalls Shipyard

Sanderson Farms

Betta Boats, LLC, Bay St. Louis

Pharr Construction

Benjamin Electric

State Caps

Harvest Trends, Inc.

Sanderson Farms

Sustainable Equity, LLC

MGM Resorts International*

Apple*

Pepsi Co.*

Merck*

Joe Max Higgins, CEO, Golden Triangle Development LINK

Reed Smith, LLP – Law Firm of Attorney Michael Scott with locations throughout the U.S. and

internationally

(*CEO has publicly denounced symbols of hate and white supremacy, but not current MS state

flag specifically)

Notable native Mississippi cultural leaders:

Archie Manning

Greg Iles, award-winning writer

Jimmy Buffet

Richard Ford, Pulitzer Prize-winning novelist

Morgan Freeman

Kathryn Stockett, author of “The Help”

Aunjanue Ellis, actress in “The Help,” “Quantico”

Jim Barksdale, former Netscape CEO and philanthropist

John Grisham

Myrlie Evers-Williams, civil rights activist and wife of slain activist Medgar Evers

Boo Ferris, former Boston Red Sox pitcher

Hanna Roberts, Miss Mississippi 2015

Jack Reed, Sr., business leader

Reuben Anderson, former MS Supreme Court Justice

Glen Ballard, Grammy-winning music producer

Bailey Howell, Basketball Hall of Fame

Great-great-grandson of President of the CSA, Jefferson Davis

David Banner, musician

Genesis Be, musician

Big KRIT, musician

Rick Cleveland, Exec. Dir. Of MS Sports Hall of Fame

Rip Daniels, owner of WJZD 94.5FM and host of “It’s a New Day” talk show

Paul Gallo of The Gallo Show on SuperTalk radio

Susan Glisson, former Director at William Winter Institute for Racial Reconciliation and racial

reconciliation practitioner

Pam Johnson, Author

Joe Max Higgins, CEO, Golden Triangle Development LINK

Others:

US state, Oregon

Philadelphia, PA

US Capitol, Washington DC

(List compiled by Mississippi Rising Coalition)

"65 Percent" History is catching up to us as we dive into the referendum that solidified our current state flag.

Links:

Mississippi Flag Referendum (April 2001)

https://ballotpedia.org/MississippiFlagReferendum(April2001)

Sons of Confederate Veterans

http://www.scv.org

Quotes:

Leslie B. McLemore II: “The state’s flag’s job is representation of the state to outsiders. The flag [represents] each state’s personal identity. So when your identity is wrapped around the Confederacy…I personally don’t understand it.”

Greg Stewart: “For me, it is a flag that represents everyone’s history… if we want to change it, that’s fine. But it’s not going to be changed by demonizing my ancestors.”

Leslie B. McLemore II: “That [Confederate] history is something that is not only divisive, but it’s a losing history.”

Chellese Hall: Maybe we should all view this flag as a threat to our heritage as current Mississippians. This flag takes away my voice as a young black woman creating a space for herself in a state whose flag waves like a hostile beacon.

Boilerplate:

“Red Flag” is produced by Podastery Studios and hosted by Beau York and Chellese Hall. Our Music is by Clouds & Crayons with additional music provided by Loki Antiphony. Album art by Tyler Tadlock. This episode was written by Rachel James-Terry. Transcriptions by Daisy Stackpole. Special thanks to advising Producers Rodrick Red & Dereck Russell. Be sure to see our show notes for additional credits and links to the stories referenced in this episode. If you want to learn more about how you can support the creation of this podcast please visit RedFlagPodcast.com and follow us on Instagram and Twitter @RedFlagPod.

Special Guests: Greg Stewart and Leslie B. McLemore II.

"I Love Mississippi." There was a time when the Governor of Mississippi and President of the United States were not as chummy as they are now...

Links:

James Meredith at University of Mississippi

https://50years.olemiss.edu/james-meredith/

Dr. Marvin King

https://politicalscience.olemiss.edu/marvin-king/

Ross Barnett “I Love Mississippi Speech”

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ygVf3FxKxJU

Quotes:

“If Mississippi is going to maximize its potential, compete with surrounding areas, and be a substantial national and global contender in education and commerce, to be the best version of itself, to attract major businesses that can help our state and people grow socially, culturally, and economically, and retain and attract our biggest asset–the people who are here–then we must have and promote a healthy environment of inclusivity and acceptance, not one that almost always appears to be divided by racial turmoil, and that won’t happen until we learn and accept that although old traditions may never die, they can in fact be broken.”

–Chellese Hall and Beau York

Boilerplate:

“Red Flag” is produced by Podastery Studios and hosted by Beau York and Chellese Hall. Our Music is by Clouds & Crayons with additional music provided by Loki Antiphony. Album art by Tyler Tadlock. This episode was written by Rachel James-Terry. Transcriptions by Daisy Stackpole. Special thanks to advising Producers Rodrick Red & Dereck Russell. Be sure to see our show notes for additional credits and links to the stories referenced in this episode. If you want to learn more about how you can support the creation of this podcast please visit RedFlagPodcast.com and follow us on Instagram and Twitter @RedFlagPod.

Special Guest: Dr. Marvin King.

"Symbols matter." Just ask the fans of Batman, Superman, or any brand enthusiast. But what if your logo doesn't match your message? Looks like them podcasters are at it again!

Links:

Derek Russell

https://www.imdb.com/name/nm3053783/bio

Dr. D’Andra Orey

http://www.jsums.edu/polisci/faculty-and-staff/dandra-orey-ph-dchair/

Quotes:

“[A seal] triggers something in your mind so when you see it, it almost becomes an allegory for you.” –Derek Russell

“When you’re dealing with an entertainment industry that is controlled by a large white majority, I don’t think how we feel is necessarily taken into consideration. I know adults who watched the show as kids and thought nothing about the Confederate images because it was beyond their understanding then. It was just a fun show to watch. But now, as adults today, who know and understand the history of the civil war, they find the representation in the show problematic.” –Chellese Hall

“In the case of The Dukes of Hazzard, art is imitating life. It’s like a revisionist wrote the script. It took something that we find hurtful and problematic and turned it into this symbol of heroism. I don’t think it was deliberate. But it speaks to how people try to convince us that our feelings towards the flag are trivial.” –Chellese Hall

“Implicit association … you can't give us a social desire response, which is what we often find in surveys, I mean who's going to admit with having a bias against black or white?” - Dr. D'Andra Orey

Boilerplate:

“Red Flag” is produced by Podastery Studios and hosted by Beau York and Chellese Hall. Our Music is by Clouds & Crayons with additional music provided by Loki Antiphony. Album art by Tyler Tadlock. This episode was written by Rachel James-Terry. Transcriptions by Daisy Stackpole. Special thanks to advising Producers Rodrick Red & Dereck Russell. Be sure to see our show notes for additional credits and links to the stories referenced in this episode. If you want to learn more about how you can support the creation of this podcast please visit RedFlagPodcast.com and follow us on Instagram and Twitter @RedFlagPod. Special Guests: Derek Russell and Dr. D'Andra Orey.