Research Matters Podcast

In the final installment of the Research in Practice series, Jason Luoma focuses on turning ideas into action. After establishing the organizational incentives in Part 1 and the financial infrastructure in Part 2, this episode provides a practical roadmap for launching and sustaining a research program within a clinical practice.

Jason walks through the minimum infrastructure needed to get started, from selecting an IRB pathway and building data management systems to hiring key research personnel and creating team routines that keep projects moving forward. He also shares a step-by-step 90-day pilot plan designed to help clinics complete their first practice-based research study while laying the foundation for a long-term research program.

Many of the concepts discussed throughout this series build upon Jason Luoma and Jennifer LeJeune's work on the integrated scientist-practitioner model and using social enterprise principles to sustainably fund research within fee-for-service clinical settings.

• The minimum infrastructure needed to begin conducting clinical research
• How to choose an IRB pathway and streamline research administration
• The key roles that support a successful research program and how they work together
• Why simple organizational routines create long-term research momentum
• How small practice-based studies can become the foundation for a thriving research program
• A practical 90-day roadmap for launching your first clinical research study

• Start with simple systems before adding complexity.
• Reuse templates and standardized documents whenever possible.
• Develop clear data management and security procedures from the beginning.

• Define clear research roles and responsibilities.
• Hold short, consistent meetings to maintain momentum.
• Build a sustainable pipeline of students and trainees.

• Begin with a feasible, low-burden practice-based project.
• Track recruitment, data quality, and feasibility alongside research outcomes.
• Share early successes to build credibility and attract future collaborators.

• Choose your first research question and identify your study team.
• Schedule recurring research meetings and protected writing time.
• Follow a structured 90-day implementation plan from planning through project completion.

• LeJeune, J.T. & Luoma, J.B. (2017). Using social enterprise concepts to create a sustainable culture to fund research in a fee-for-service setting . In R.T. Codd (Ed.), Practice-Based Research: A Guide for Clinicians. Routledge Press.
• LeJeune, J.T., & Luoma, J.B. (2015). The Integrated Scientist-Practitioner: A New Model for Combining Research and Clinical Practice in Fee-For-Service Settings. Professional Psychology Research & Practice46(6), 421-428. Download here.
• Portland Psychotherapy's Publications
• Portland Psychotherapy's research lab page

Research Matters Podcast is hosted by Jason Luoma, who can be found on Twitter @jasonluoma or Facebook at: facebook.com/jasonluomaphd. You download the podcast through iTunes, Stitcher, or Spotify. Reach out with suggestions, questions, or comments to [email protected].

In Part 1 of this series, we explored why research often disappears from fee-for-service clinical settings despite clinicians valuing scientific inquiry. In this episode, Jason Luoma moves from theory to implementation by outlining the financial and organizational systems that make research sustainable over the long term.

Rather than relying on leftover time or grant funding, Jason explains how to build a clinic where research is intentionally supported through budgeting, compensation structures, and organizational policies. He introduces the concept of the "research line"—a standing budget allocation dedicated to research—and discusses practical strategies for protecting research time, designing compensation systems that align with organizational values, and growing revenue ethically to support scientific work.

Many of the concepts discussed in this episode build upon Jason Luoma and Jennifer LeJeune's work on the integrated scientist-practitioner model and using social enterprise principles to sustainably fund research within fee-for-service clinical settings.

• What a research line is and why every research-active clinic should have one
• How to create a sustainable funding model for research without relying solely on grants
• Why research time should be protected through salary structures rather than billable incentives
• How organizational guardrails prevent research priorities from eroding over time
• Ethical strategies for increasing financial sustainability while remaining mission-driven
• Practical budgeting, staffing, and policy templates you can begin implementing immediately

• Create a standing research budget rather than relying on leftover funds.
• Automate research funding through a consistent financial policy.
• Review your research budget annually and adjust as your organization grows.

• Separate clinical and research responsibilities with distinct calendars.
• Make research blocks salaried and non-swappable whenever possible.
• Regularly audit whether protected research time is actually being protected.

• Invest in areas where your clinic has specialized expertise.
• Balance financial sustainability with accessibility and community impact.
• Track research outcomes alongside traditional business metrics.

• Establish a written research funding policy this month.
• Create recurring protected research blocks for key team members.
• Develop a simple implementation plan with clear staffing, budgeting, and review timelines.

• LeJeune, J.T. & Luoma, J.B. (2017). Using social enterprise concepts to create a sustainable culture to fund research in a fee-for-service setting . In R.T. Codd (Ed.), Practice-Based Research: A Guide for Clinicians. Routledge Press.
• LeJeune, J.T., & Luoma, J.B. (2015). The Integrated Scientist-Practitioner: A New Model for Combining Research and Clinical Practice in Fee-For-Service Settings. Professional Psychology Research & Practice46(6), 421-428. Download here.
• Portland Psychotherapy's Publications
• Portland Psychotherapy's research lab page

Research Matters Podcast is hosted by Jason Luoma, who can be found on Twitter @jasonluoma or Facebook at: facebook.com/jasonluomaphd. You download the podcast through iTunes, Stitcher, or Spotify. Reach out with suggestions, questions, or comments to [email protected]

Most clinicians are trained in research, yet very few clinical practices consistently produce it. Why? In this special solo episode, Jason Luoma steps away from the interviewer role to explore one of the biggest structural barriers to clinician-led research: incentives. Traditional fee-for-service models reward billable hours, often leaving little time for the deep thinking, writing, and collaboration that meaningful research requires.

Drawing on the experience of building Portland Psychotherapy as a clinical research social enterprise, Jason shares a practical framework for designing organizations where research is not an afterthought but a core function. He explains how changing financial structures, organizational policies, and workplace culture can create protected time for scientific discovery while maintaining a thriving clinical practice.

Whether you're leading a private practice, directing a research clinic, or simply wondering how to better integrate science into clinical work, this episode offers concrete ideas that can be adapted to organizations of many sizes.

• Why fee-for-service reimbursement unintentionally discourages research productivity
• How a clinical social enterprise differs from a traditional private practice
• Why protected research time must be built into organizational incentives—not left to individual motivation
• How financial policies can sustainably fund research without relying on grants alone
• Why organizational culture is just as important as budgeting when supporting scientific work
• Three practical changes you can begin implementing immediately to strengthen research within your clinic

• Design systems that reward research instead of expecting it to happen during spare time.
• Protect research time with salaried, non-swappable blocks.
• Build research funding directly into your organization's financial model.

• Write clear organizational policies that prioritize research, training, and community impact.
• Review your research funding strategy annually and adjust as your organization grows.
• Let financial decisions serve your mission rather than define it.

• Hire people who share your organization's values.
• Foster autonomy, purpose, learning, and belonging throughout the workplace.
• Invest in internal grants, mentoring, and professional development to encourage innovation.

• Write two policy statements that formally protect research within your organization.
• Establish one recurring, protected research block on your calendar this week.
• Choose one cultural change that strengthens research and commit to implementing it this quarter.

• LeJeune, J.T. & Luoma, J.B. (2017). Using social enterprise concepts to create a sustainable culture to fund research in a fee-for-service setting . In R.T. Codd (Ed.), Practice-Based Research: A Guide for Clinicians. Routledge Press.
• LeJeune, J.T., & Luoma, J.B. (2015). The Integrated Scientist-Practitioner: A New Model for Combining Research and Clinical Practice in Fee-For-Service Settings. Professional Psychology Research & Practice46(6), 421-428. Download here.
• Portland Psychotherapy's Publications
• Portland Psychotherapy's research lab page

Research Matters Podcast is hosted by Jason Luoma, who can be found on Twitter @jasonluoma or Facebook at: facebook.com/jasonluomaphd. You download the podcast through iTunes, Stitcher, or Spotify. Reach out with suggestions, questions, or comments to [email protected]

Dr. Mary Alvord is a clinical psychologist with over four decades of experience, known for her innovative work integrating cognitive-behavioral therapy with resilience training for youth. As founder of Alvord, Baker & Associates and the nonprofit Resilience Across Borders, Dr. Alvord has led a groundbreaking effort to merge clinical practice, research, and social impact.

In this episode, she shares how her early experiences as the daughter of immigrants shaped her mission to provide equitable mental health support for underserved communities. We explore her transition from private practice to conducting research in school-based and low-resource settings, her challenges navigating the grant and IRB systems, and her founding of a nonprofit to ensure long-term sustainability and scale.

Dr. Alvord discusses her emphasis on team collaboration, ethical imperatives for outcome research, and how she's helping bridge the gap between evidence-based practice and community-based application.

In this episode, you'll learn…

• Why Dr. Alvord created a nonprofit to sustain mental health research and services

• How early training in behavioral psychology inspired her lifelong research values

• The logistical and ethical challenges of conducting practice-based research in schools

• Strategies for integrating outcome research into clinical practice

• The importance of cultural responsiveness in designing and delivering mental health interventions

• How to create a team culture of collaboration and perseverance in the face of rejection

Tips from the episode:

On building resilient communities:

• Start with prevention and reach youth early — ideally within school settings

• Empower underserved communities by removing barriers to access

• Cultural relevance and linguistic inclusivity are essential in outreach materials

On sustaining research in real-world settings:

• Private practices can support research — if values and resources align

• Building partnerships with universities offers mutual benefits in research

• Establishing a nonprofit can open doors to grants and expand your impact

On leading a mission-driven team:

• Weekly research meetings foster continuity and shared vision

• Advisory boards and community members can help shape programs

• Perseverance is key — most grant applications and papers will face rejection, but the impact is worth it

Links from this Episode: https://alvordbaker.com/

Louis Castonguay, Ph.D., is a professor of psychology at Penn State University and a leading figure in contemporary psychotherapy research. With a career spanning decades, Dr. Castonguay has focused on what truly makes psychotherapy work—examining the variables that shape client outcomes, therapeutic relationships, and the process of change.

But perhaps what sets him apart most is his leadership in Practice Research Networks (PRNs), collaborative research communities that unite clinicians, researchers, and stakeholders to study therapy as it actually happens in real-world settings. In this episode, we talk about how these networks got started, what keeps them going, and why Dr. Castonguay believes collaboration across differences isn't just productive—it's essential.

We also explore the balance between research rigor and clinical relevance, the hidden power of motivation and respect in research partnerships, and how his counterphobic drive led him to take on big challenges others avoided. This is a rich, behind-the-scenes look at a man who's helped change the culture of clinical research by running toward the hard stuff—with humility and heart.

In this episode, you'll learn…

• What Practice Research Networks are and why they matter • How clinicians and researchers can work together effectively without burnout • Why studies that are "clinically syntonic" are more sustainable and valuable • What makes Louis Dr. Castonguay run—not walk—to a meeting • How to navigate power dynamics and avoid "empirical invasions" • Why flexible participation and shared ownership are key in PRNs • How humility, curiosity, and a love of process shape good science

Tips from the episode:

Tip 1: On sustaining clinician involvement in research: • Design studies that serve both scientific and clinical purposes • Let clinicians co-create the research questions and methods • Be transparent about power and open to hearing doubts • Participation should be flexible, not all-or-nothing

Tip 2: On what makes a successful PRN: • Shared goals with diverse expertise • Mutual respect between all team members • Freedom for each member to contribute in the way that fits them • A culture where research and practice grow each other

Tip 3: On Louis's personal approach: • Counterphobic drive means he runs toward hard problems • Collaboration isn't a tactic—it's a value • Being a generalist helps bridge gaps between orientations and settings • Excellence and perfectionism can be double-edged—learn to aim "imperfectly right"

Links from this Episode:

Fostering collaboration between researchers and clinicians through building practice-oriented research: An introduction

Faculty homepage

Lab

Publications

Dr. Jacqueline (Jackie) Persons is a distinguished clinician, researcher, and Clinical Professor at the University of California, Berkeley. She served as president of the Association of Cognitive and Behavioral Therapies (ABCT) in 1999 and currently works in private practice at the Oakland Cognitive Behavior Therapy Center. With over 35 years of experience, Dr. Persons is recognized globally for her pioneering work in integrating research into private practice, particularly in the areas of case formulation and measurement-based care.

In this insightful conversation, we dive into Dr. Persons' unique journey, exploring how she built a thriving private practice while contributing significantly to scientific research. She shares practical strategies for clinicians interested in research, the importance of data collection in therapy, and how she navigates collaboration with graduate students and academic institutions. Dr. Persons also talks about balancing her clinical and research roles and why she continues to find research personally rewarding.

In this episode, you'll learn…

• How Dr. Persons integrates cutting-edge research into her private practice

• The benefits of measurement-based care and data-driven therapy in Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT)

• Practical steps for clinicians who want to combine private practice with research

• How to collaborate with academic institutions and bring research skills into a clinical setting

Tips from the episode:

On integrating research and practice:

• Set up systems that allow seamless data collection during therapy sessions to improve clinical outcomes and generate research data.

• Use measurement-based care not only to inform treatment but also to guide research questions.

On balancing multiple roles:

• Collaborating with students and academic institutions can expand your research capabilities without overwhelming your practice.

• Creating structured time set aside for research—such as a dedicated day per week—can help maintain a balance between clinical and research work.

On clinical and research success:

• Stay involved in professional organizations like the Association of Cognitive and Behavioral Therapies to maintain your network and stay updated on new developments.

• Regularly attend and present at conferences to contribute to and learn from the wider scientific community.

Links from this episode:

• Oakland CBT Center - Jacqueline B. Persons, Ph.D

• Oakland CBT Center - Research at the Oakland CBT Center

• Behavioral Health Research Collective (BHRC) - Resources

Research Matters Podcast is hosted by Jason Luoma, who can be found on Twitter @jasonluoma or Facebook at facebook.com/jasonluomaphd. You can download the podcast through iTunes, Stitcher, or Spotify. Reach out with suggestions, questions, or comments to [email protected].

Dr. Patricia Arean is is the Director of the Division of Services and Intervention Research at the National Institute of Mental Health (NIMH), as well as a clinical researcher and former professor at the University of Washington's Department of Psychiatry and Behavioral Sciences. With over 30 years of experience, Dr. Arean has focused her career on increasing access to mental health services for underserved communities. She has led multiple research initiatives, including the UW Alacrity Center, which aims to redesign psychosocial interventions for underserved populations, and the Creative Lab, which explores digital mental health solutions using mobile technology.

In this insightful conversation, Dr. Arean shares how her early experiences in public hospitals and community mental health centers shaped her passion for working with underserved communities. She discusses her journey of developing partnerships with community organizations and navigating the challenges of research in marginalized populations. Dr. Arean also delves into her groundbreaking work in integrating technology with mental health services and how she has managed to conduct large-scale studies in underserved communities using innovative digital tools. This episode provides valuable lessons for researchers interested in social justice, technology, and community-based research.

In this episode, you'll learn…

• How Dr. Arean's early work experiences influenced her commitment to underserved communities

• The steps she took to build trust and partnerships with community organizations

• Why understanding the unique needs of marginalized populations is crucial for effective research

• Strategies for navigating the challenges of recruitment and participation in underserved communities

• The role of technology in expanding access to mental health services for populations with limited resources

• How Dr. Arean approaches collaborations with technology companies to create evidence-based mental health solutions

Tips from the episode:

On Building Partnerships with Underserved Communities:

• Approach community organizations with a genuine desire to understand their needs and challenges.

• Be prepared to adapt your research goals based on the community's priorities.

• Establish relationships with key gatekeepers or champions within the community to facilitate trust and access.

On Developing Effective Research Practices:

• Accept that working with underserved populations may involve messy samples and unexpected challenges.

• Engage with clinicians, staff, and community members to ensure your research is relevant and respectful.

• Incorporate community input when designing research protocols and collecting data.

On Leveraging Technology in Mental Health Research:

• Digital tools can significantly improve recruitment and engagement in underserved communities.

• Flexibility is key when working with technology partners, as their products and services may evolve.

• Maintain a focus on developing solutions that work for marginalized populations, even if it means overcoming technological barriers like limited broadband access.

Links from this Episode:

• Article on Dr. Patricia Arean's Position at the National Institute of Mental Health

• UW Alacrity Center

• The Creativ Lab Homepage

Tony Biglan, Ph.D., is a Senior Scientist at Oregon Research Institute and Co-Director of the Promise Neighborhood Research Consortium. For the past thirty years, he has conducted research in the development and prevention of child and adolescent problem behavior. He is a former president of the Society for Prevention Research and was a member of the Institute of Medicine Committee on Prevention. As a member of Oregon's Alcohol and Drug Policy Commission, he has helped to develop a strategic plan for implementing comprehensive evidence-based interventions throughout Oregon.

Dr. Biglan is the founder of Values to Action, an organization dedicated to evolving more nurturing societies. He has helped to identify effective family, school, and community interventions to prevent the most common and costly problems of childhood and adolescence around the world. Working to advance the reforms called for in his most recent book, Rebooting Capitalism: How We Can Forge a Society That Works for Everyone, Dr. Biglan advocates for the creation of "Action Circles," small groups of like-minded people who devote as little as 15 minutes a day to come together to study a problem in an effort to devise a solution.

In this episode, you'll learn…

• A powerful lesson about not taking the criticism and advice of others too seriously.
• About the tensions between administration and scientists and the balance of doing what it takes to gain funding while remaining true to callings and passions.
• About the groundbreaking work done from the 1970s to the present at Oregon Research Institute in Eugene, OR and the creation of the first behavior change clinic in Oregon.
• That being politically and socially active and fighting for justice are possible and needed, even while remaining dedicated to science and research work and keeping a good balance, including family and leisure.
• The importance of science support people and participatory democracy.
• That serendipity and luck can play a part in success and that there are many paths, not just one "right" one.
• The importance of idleness.
• About some frustrations with NIH and the problem of addressing individual issues instead of the whole social context.
• About prevention and the concept of "Action Circles."

Tips from the episode

On the weight of the opinions of others, even older mentors and those in leadership positions…

• Learn from Dr. Biglan's personal account of having suicidal thoughts because his dissertation methodology was judged so harshly.
• Be encouraged by his later discovery that the very same dissertation became one of his greatest life accomplishments and his name is now attached to the concept of "the Biglan Model" because of it.
• Remember his advice: If you're working on your dissertation and they tell you it's no good or not worthwhile and so on, just remember they could be mistaken. This, of course, applies to most things in life, not just dissertation work.

On participatory democracy…

• Support people are vital to everything. Honoring them and giving them a voice will only improve success.
• Listen to colleagues who hold different priorities than yours and release some power and control.

On gaining funding while holding on to personal passions and what's important …

• A lot depends on luck or serendipity as to who you meet or how fate happens to put you in the right place at the right time.
• Having a good system and good support people for writing grants is important.
• Scientists also have a responsibility to fight for things to get done. As Dr. Biglan says, It's imperative that scientists speak up and not simply wait outside the halls of the federal government and hope that somebody will do the right RFA.

On making use of idleness…

• Dedicate time and thought to your passions during your "idle" time. Let your mind focus on what is important to you.
• Follow Dr. Biglan's example of getting up early in the morning to write what he wants, not what work requires. Spend time during vacations or days off so that there is no tension or guilt about neglecting work.

On implementing reform and Values to Action…

• If you are concerned about the state of the world and you're not sure what to do about it, join or create an Action Circle at Values to Action.
• To learn about implementing reforms, read Rebooting Capitalism: How We Can Forge a Society That Works for Everyone.
• We all need to look up from our work and be addressing those problems.

Website Nurture Effect: http://www.nurtureeffect.com/

Website Values to Action: https://www.valuestoaction.org/

Dr. Biglan's books on Amazon

Twitter: https://twitter.com/ABiglan

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/anthony-biglan-093b7710/

French and Raven Bases of Social Power

Bertrand Russell Essay

Psychological Bulletin Article on Stress

Research Matters Podcast is hosted by Jason Luoma, who can be found on Twitter @jasonluoma or Facebook at: facebook.com/jasonluomaphd. You download the podcast through iTunes, Stitcher, or Spotify. Reach out with suggestions, questions, or comments to [email protected]

Dean McKay, Ph.D., A.B.B.P. is Professor of Psychology at Fordham University where he is a member of the clinical psychology doctoral program. His lab, Compulsive, Obsessive, and Anxiety Program (COAP) provides instruction to undergraduate, masters, and doctorate levels. Dr. McKay's expertise is in anxiety and obsessive-compulsive behavior, with his current focus being on Covid-19 related stress and anxiety. He has further interest in anxiety pertaining to political conditions, and he has a passion for clinicians to receive ongoing continuing education. Dr. McKay conducts some private practice and does some consultation as well. He has published over 200 peer-reviewed articles and book chapters, and he is the editor or co-editor of 19 books. He is board-certified in Clinical and Cognitive-Behavioral Psychology from the American Board of Professional Psychology.

Today Dr. McKay shares his thoughts about the obligation of people in academia having to do work that "may potentially raise some uncomfortable questions and allow us to advance topics that maybe people in other settings don't have the luxury of doing." Dr. McKay addresses the types of things mentors look for in students who are applying to their programs and offers tips on identifying and screening good candidates. It could be surprising to hear that a major thing he asks about in an interview is how they manage to relax. In a day when being accepted to programs is increasingly difficult, Dr. McKay sees this ability as an indicator of how the student will manage in the future. He addresses the intense struggles with stress that come from the benchmarks of performance students must achieve. His compassion for students and sound advice to regularly disconnect from work stem from personal experiences where he actually found himself bedridden from stress and at one point needing surgery for gastrointestinal issues at a very young age. While he is quite serious about his counsel to take vacations and guard weekend time for rest and non-work activities, he admits that during the past COVID-year the lines between work and home have become increasingly difficult to maintain. As he jokes with his colleagues, "every day is Blursday." Time has little meaning, and schedules and organized events are difficult to maintain. Dr. McKay wishes to be a good example to his students and believes that, as a psychologist, it is important to do the things he would advise his clients to do. Protecting his down time in an environment where work is constantly in his space is vital.

In addition to his recommendations to take time out for self-care, Dr. McKay discusses the tricky territory of defining what a "co-author" actually is. In a world where everyone needs to be published, he sees a need for mentors to be careful with balancing the desire to be generous with credits and making sure there is legitimate call to cite names. Allowing a student recognition is important, but the students must be able to defend work they contributed. Dr. McKay shares a personal anecdote in which he worked on a project with a litany of co-authors and two of the credited authors contributed only two sentences to the work. He sees situations like this as doing a disservice to students who, when faced with the real-world demands, won't have the knowledge to back up their claims on their resumes.

Finally, Dr. McKay shares some of his personal methodology for balancing writing time to make it more productive and his thoughts on taking stock of the "50,000 foot overview" of his future plans. He concludes with his ideas about his personal clinical work and suggests that, "researchers do themselves a little bit of a disservice by not actually seeing clients periodically."

In this episode, you'll learn…

• The obligation academia has to advance causes that could raise some uncomfortable questions.
• Things to look for when screening students for a graduate program as well as things students should think about when picking a mentor.
• The importance of guarding personal time and taking vacations.
• The difficulties of disconnecting from work in Covid times.
• The importance of giving valid credit for co-authors on published works.
• How to manage writing time and maintain productivity.
• Mental tools for organization.
• About balancing a clinical practice while maintaining research work and how the two dovetail.

Tips from the episode

On finding good candidates for a research program…

• Students need to have a baseline ability to relax and destress. The rigors of the graduate program world are intense and will take a mental and physical toll if a student does not understand how to balance time and seek time disengaged from the work.
• Students should be able to back up their research work and defend their publications. Too often mentors are generous with credit, which does a student a disservice when they enter the real world and don't have the actual background or knowledge to function well.
• While conducting a stress interview for the sole purpose of making students uncomfortable is not a good choice, asking the hard questions and requiring a student to defend their ideas is not unreasonable. How they respond is a good indicator of how they will handle other things in the future.

On finding a mentor …

• Remember to look for someone who is genuinely nice and compliments your values.
• Remember that it is a six-year commitment and that is a long time to live with a person who wears you down instead of builds you up.

On the balance of work and relaxation …

• It is vital to disengage from work to maintain a healthy lifestyle. Vacations should be enjoyed. Going off grid is advisable. Weekends should be protected as non-work times.
• The Covid year has made it increasingly difficult to separate work and home, but now more than ever a firm determination to be away from work for scheduled periods is advisable.

On co-author credit…

• There is a delicate balance of mentor generosity in sharing credit and making sure the claimed acknowledgement is legitimate.
• Offering co-authorship to someone who has not contributed much paves the way for students to enter research programs and real life unprepared.

On maintaining productivity in writing while balancing work and home…

• Take stock of your week in the beginning and plan for times to focus on writing.
• Have "protected time." Stay away from emails and social media.
• Facilitate blocking out the world by maintaining your environment. Some people work well with music, some do not, for example.
• If you need to step away from the computer, go exercise or do something alone where you can think and work through ideas mentally.

On maintaining a clinical practice while doing research …

• Seeing clients periodically is important to keep a perspective and learn.
• It is important to see procedures implemented rather than just talk about them.
• You need to know about clinical care if you're going to teach people about clinical care.

Links from the episode:

Dr. McKay's Fordham profile: https://www.fordham.edu/info/21660/psychology_faculty_and_staff/5430/dean_mckay

Research Lab: https://www.fordham.edu/homepage/2789/coap

Psychology Today profile and list of books: https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/contributors/dean-mckay-phd

Twitter: https://twitter.com/docmckay?lang=en

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dean-mckay-71b14310/

P.E. Meehl Article: http://www.dgapractice.com/documents/meehl_case_conferences_adapted.pdf

Research Matters Podcast is hosted by Jason Luoma, who can be found on Twitter @jasonluoma or Facebook at: facebook.com/jasonluomaphd. You download the podcast through iTunes, Stitcher, or Spotify. Reach out with suggestions, questions, or comments to [email protected]

Dr. Hayes is a Nevada Foundation Professor of Psychology in the Behavior Analysis Program at the University of Nevada, Reno. An author of 46 books and nearly 650 scientific articles, he is especially known for his work on Acceptance and Commitment Therapy, which is one of the most widely used and researched new methods of psychological intervention in the last 20 years. Dr. Hayes has received many national awards, such as the Lifetime Achievement Award from the Association for Behavioral and Cognitive Therapy. His popular book Get Out of Your Mind and Into Your Life was, at one point, the best-selling self-help book in the United States, and his new book A Liberated Mind has been recently released to wide acclaim. His TEDx talks have been viewed by over 600,000 people, and he is ranked among the most cited psychologists in the world.

In this wide ranging conversation, we discuss how Dr. Hayes started his work life as a political organizer and how this has influenced him to work behind the scenes to organize coalitions to get things done. We talk about how he has built his lab culture throughout the years. We discuss his tendency to get involved in important controversies in psychology, such as the prescription privileges debate, and how he has learned to navigate those subjects and attendant criticisms. We discuss the importance of acknowledging those who have helped you along in your life and career, including those critics who have helped you grow. Finally, we talk about he works with his students, including how he encourages an atmosphere of questioning each other with good humor and supporting students to seek after what brings them vitality and meaning.

In this episode, you'll learn…

• How Dr. Hayes is trying to redefine what evidence-based therapy means and why he wants to have it under the umbrella of evolution science
• How working in the political realm transformed his future in science and psychology
• About the controversial past of his work and how that has affected his teaching methods and philosophy
• About the vital role collaboration plays
• To appreciate those who helped to get you where you are

Tips from the episode

On politics and where change happens…

• Groups make a difference. People make a difference.
• You can lead from behind.
• You have to work as hard as anyone. Be willing to do anything.
• Take down the hierarchy.

On micro steps...

• Be driven by a gut sense of connection.
• Watch what lifts you up, entertains, and interests you.
• Have confidence in your heart and what brings you bliss.
• What seems a chaotic mess to the outside is all connected.
• Have faith that the big picture is playing out.

On the role of mentors and what they offer…

• Every person has brought something to the direction things went.
• Even our greatest critics can offer positive gifts.
• Always remember to have gratitude for those who encouraged and influenced you.

On lab philosophy…

• Create cultural traditions that invite growth.
• Open the society to diversity of ideas. Never hide ideas from others.
• Be willing to talk about emotions.
• Invite critics to come in. Controversy is a good thing. Embrace criticism.
• It is not tearing down another person to make a bold statement.
• Celebrate each other's accomplishments regularly.
• Keep your eye on the larger values-based purpose of having a research community in the first place.
• Have fun.

Links from the episode:

• Dr. Steven Hayes' website and blog
• Scholarly works of Dr. Hayes
• Dr. Hayes' TEDx Talk

Research Matters Podcast is hosted by Jason Luoma, who can be found on Twitter @jasonluoma or Facebook at: facebook.com/jasonluomaphd. You download the podcast through iTunes, Stitcher, or Spotify. Reach out with suggestions, questions, or comments to [email protected]