Seen Out Loud

Reimaging child welfare starts with looking inward. On this bonus episode, get to know more about host Matt Anderson as he provides candid responses to listener questions about reimaging child welfare, the power of listening, and his source of hope. 

Email us at [email protected] with your questions or comments about the podcast.

00:01:45  | Adrian McLemore, Program Officer, Annie E. Casey Foundation, and Host, FosterStrong Podcast: What keeps you hopeful while doing this work, given how the premise of foster care is centered around traumatic experiences?

00:03:56  | Lyndsey Wilson, CEO, FirstStar: I’d love to hear you talk about why, as a service providing organization, is it important to prioritize hearing and telling stories?

00:07:04  | Maureen Sorenson, Senior Director of Foster Care Operations at Coordinated Care of Washington and Part-time Lecturer in the School of Social Work at the University of Washington: How can we encourage more [prospective] adoptive parents to be focused on reunification?  Maureen alludes to Seen Out Loud S1, E1: WHAT IF WE DIDN’T HAVE TO WAIT UNTIL BAD ENOUGH Matt references Seen Out Loud S1, E6: THE WALLS STARTED TO COME DOWN

00:10:12  | Kathleen Creamer, Managing Attorney of the Family Advocacy Unit, Community Legal Services of Philadelphia: What does it say about us that we’ve designed a system where expressions of care and compassion for parents are experienced and described by parents as miraculous exceptions?  Matt references Seen Out Loud S1, E2: LOOKING FOR THAT WARM HUG ALL MY LIFE

00:13:34  | Gina, Kinship Parent and Family Partner: When you’re talking about amends, what does it mean [for child welfare] and how can we all work towards reestablishing trust with the [child welfare] systems.   Gina references Seen Out Loud S1, E1: WHAT IF WE DIDN’T HAVE TO WAIT UNTIL BAD ENOUGH  “Amends” are also discussed in Seen Out Loud S1, E7: TITLE THE MOMENTUM IS BUILDING 

00:16:31  | Austin, Program Coordinator, Psychological Department of Social Services: How can we become better listeners? Can you offer any practical suggestions for how all of us can become better listeners?  

00:19:17  | Matt shares final thoughts on Season 1 of Seen Out Loud. Call in at (512) 815-3956 to leave a message with your questions.

 
Resources 

Submit your questions to our host by emailing our team at [email protected]. 

Join our LinkedIn group to ask Matt Anderson and other professionals your questions about reimagining child welfare 

Book: “The Whole Language: The Power of Extravagant Tenderness” by Father Greg Boyle 

From the national to community level, hear how the movement to prioritize family well-being is gaining momentum. In this season finale, three guests give insight on conversations taking place across the country around supporting families and recognizing their value. Jerry Milner, former Associate Commissioner at the Children’s Bureau, shares his perspective on the progress of the child welfare transformation work on a national scale. Sharee Pemberton and Commissioner Hope B. Haywood of a rural county in North Carolina discuss how community leaders can bring about change and build trust through listening to families and meeting them where they are.
 
Shownotes: 

00:01:50  | Meet Jerry Milner, Ph.D., and hear his take on the family well-being movement.
 
00:09:05  | Matt asks if amends are necessary for the child and family well-being movement to advance.   

00:09:50  | Matt reflects on his conversation with Jerry and expands on the idea of how professionals and organizations within the child welfare system can make amends with children and families.

00:12:13  | To demonstrate how the movement is taking shape locally, Matt introduces Sharee Pemberton and County Commissioner Hope Haywood.

00:17:14 | What led Sharee to her work as an advocate for child and family well-being?

00:19:26 | Commissioner Haywood talks about the impact of hearing from Sharee at the County Commissioner meeting.

00:23:00  | Sharee shares her thoughts about the importance of trust and access.

00:26:39  | Commissioner Haywood shares how she is adopting new perspectives by learning more about her community. Sharee reacts to feeling heard.

00:30:00  | Matt shares his final thoughts on this episode conversions and the conclusion of Season 1.

Resources: 

Thriving Families, Safer Children: National Partnership to Reinvent Child Welfare Expands | Annie E. Casey Foundation Blog 

About Hope B. Haywood: Randolph County Board of Commissioners | Randolph County, NC 

About Sharee Pembleton: My Journey to Change Agent by Sharee Pemberton | Smart Start 

Randolph Partnership for Children 

About Jerry Milner, Ph.D.: About | Public Knowledge 

National Family Support Network | Championing Family Support

Communities of Hope

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Brett and Jessica Crisp have been married for over a decade and have a 9-year-old adopted son. They served as licensed foster parents with Children’s Home Society of North Carolina from 2016 to 2020. Through their experiences as adoptive parents and former foster parents, they have become advocates for reunification, as well as parents and foster parents working together.

SHOW NOTES
00:01:25  | How do children in foster care bond with foster parents?   

00:03:38  | Hear from the Crisps’ about the first visitation with London’s parents as they recall seeing their joy in seeing their daughter, but also fear of letting their guards down. 
 
00:08:28  | At what point did the Crisps’ relationship with London’s parents take a turn?
 
00:19:00  | As London’s parents and the Crisps’ relationship improved over time, both families found themselves having a deep connection.

00:21:31  | The court issues a continuance on London’s case for an additional three months after a 14-month separation.

00:23:27  | How can foster care families advocate for birth parents and families?

00:28:08  | London’s case is suddenly dropped and the Crisps are told that within a day, she needs to go home to her birth parents.

00:34:04  | Shortly after London reunified with her birth family, her parents reach out to the Crisps to stay connected. 

00:39:15  | What do the Crisps want people to learn and take away from their story? 
 
RESOURCES

1. Growing Families through Foster Care to Permanency | Children’s Home Society of North Carolina 
2. Working With the Courts for Permanency | Child Welfare Information Gateway 
3. Birth Parent/Foster Parent Relationships to Support Family Reunification | Child Welfare Information Gateway  

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Hear what life was like for Jaquia Wilson, the youngest of nine children, who went from growing up with a loving mother in the Bronx to aging out of foster care without a support system. Jaquia demonstrates resilience through a series of tragedies, resulting in her entering foster care as a teenager. With a little help from a caring social worker, Jaquia’s fighting spirit leads her to college and, now, advocacy work for youth in care. 

Show Notes:
00:01:05  | Meet Jaquia Wilson as she shares stories from her childhood memories in Bronx, New York.
 
00:09:10  | “I didn’t know what to do,” says Jaquia, “I was 15 [years old] and my mom had just passed. My family had to figure out what to do with a 15-year-old that was expecting.”

00:10:54  | What is it like to be a pregnant teen? Hear from Jaquia as she describes the array of emotions she experienced. 
 
00:13:00  | What happens when a teen like Jaquia enters the foster care system in North Carolina?

00:20:32  | Who were the people in Jaquia’s life during her teenage years in foster care?   “It’s a little bit like a revolving door, I feel like,” says Jaquia. 
   
00:26:13  | Jaquia shares where she drew strength to continue making steps towards independence and success after aging out of foster care.

00:28:01  | Life after foster care: At 17 years old, Jaquia heads to college, but runs into unforeseen roadblocks with housing that she was prepared for.

00:34:17  | Jaquia deep dives into her vision for foster care and shares what she wants youth in care to experience, and answers insight about what she aims to help create.

00:34:54  | Matt shares his final thoughts. 

Resources: 

Judicial Bypass Procedures: Undue Burdens for Young People Seeking Safe Abortion Care | Advocates for Youth 

What happens to kids who age out of foster care | House of Providence 

North Carolina LINKS Program |NC DHHS 

Jaquia Wilson, Webinar Host | The Unlearning of Child Welfare: Webinar Series 

Written by Jaquia Wilson: Redefining "Child Welfare Expert" | Children’s Bureau Express  

How the Child Welfare System Made Me Prioritize Education Over Myself | The Imprint 

Support Services for Youth in Transition: Housing | Child Welfare Information Gateway

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Hear from Alise Morrissey about the impacts of individuals—a volunteer, a judge, an attorney, and a program leader—who offered glimmers of hope by seeing her for who she was instead of her circumstances. Alise tells her story of going from straight-A student to giving birth amidst a prison sentence. She reveals how her faith, the people who showed her kindness, and the determination of being there for her child led to recovery from substance use disorder and reunification with her daughter.

Show Notes
00:00:55  | Meet Alise Morrissey and hear her story from formative years to young adulthood where Alise recalls how her mom was her biggest cheerleader.

00:02:55  | Alise shares how she started to feel angry and rebel in her preteen years.

00:09:00  | What supports are offered to young Alise when she finds out she is expecting while incarcerated in the short term?   

00:12:30  | What happens when pregnant women with substance use disorder aren’t met with empathy and understanding over judgement?

00:15:30  | Hear from Alise on how one inspiring person had a profound impact on her spirituality and life.

00:21:02  | As an indigent inmate and while her daughter is a few months old, Alise describes writing 60-70 kites or messages requesting to learn more about her case and find out what’s happening with her child.

00:23:40  | Alise describes being met where she was, as one attorney fought on her behalf and on behalf of her baby.

00:24:30  | Alise describes meeting a CASA advocate that “saw beyond the yuck,” and decided that in order to support Alise’s child she had to get to know the birth parent. 
 
00:26:40  | Alise describes the effects of having two voices follow her through treatment.
 
00:30:55  | What happens when a birth parent gets to connect with the foster family?
 
00:33:40  | Hear from Alise on why professionals should embrace the messiness of co-parenting.
 
00:35:34  | What is the “Parent to Parent” program?
 
00:41:40  | Advice from Alise on how to communicate with skeptics about families affected by the child welfare system.
 
00:44:00  | Final thoughts from Matt.

Resources

Supporting Young Parents: State and local examples | Child Welfare Information Gateway 

Supporting Children and Families Affected by Parental Incarceration | Child Welfare Information Gateway 

King County’s Parents for Parents program  

Nacy Roberts-Brown, Former Director of Catalyst for Kids, Washington 

Transforming Hearts and Minds Through Valuing Parent Voice | Children's Bureau Express


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Systems change when people change. And people change through stories. Dr. Bruce Perry candidly offers compelling insights on the power and science of storytelling. This episode demonstrates how some of the most important things we can do to improve family well-being and change systems starts with listening.

Show Notes: 
01:45  | Matt shares his origin story as a caseworker and shares what happened when he stepped back from his social worker checklist and listened to someone’s story.

07:00  | What are the origins of the book title “What Happened to You?” as it relates to Dr. Bruce Perry’s work? 

09:10  | How can we alter the trajectory of the current child welfare system?

10:12  | What happens when practitioners ask families “What happened to you,” versus “What’s wrong with you?" Dr. Bruce Perry references how this question shift derived from Dr. Sandra Bloom’s work on The Sanctuary Model.

12:15 | Matt shares, “I think that if we’re worried about kids who are coming into CPS and we’re worried about their safety (which we are), then we have to be worried about their parents, their families, and their communities, too.”

13:00  | Dr. Bruce Perry on his decision to use storytelling in his work.

14:10  | Dr. Bruce Perry shares his insights on the impact of storytelling on a listener. 

17:48  | Matt shares an audio clip from Episode 2 “LOOKING FOR THAT WARM HUG ALL MY LIFE” with Shrounda Selivanoff.

19:50  | Dr. Bruce Perry recalls his book with Oprah where she describes her experience of being seen and preludes stories from a documentary he’s working on.

21:20  | How can people create powerful connections and open brave spaces for deep understanding? 

22:45  | Dr. Bruce Perry asks, “how do we make it easier for our front-line people to be the providers of [full, present] moments.”

25:50  | Assessing and working towards relational wealth versus relational poverty.

26:45  | What is “traumatic wisdom” and where does it come from?

30:12  | Dr. Bruce Perry offers advice to organizations and systems on chasing change.

32:10 | Matt shares final thoughts.

Resources:
Documentary Film “From Place to Place” | Institute for Family 

EP 66: Social Workers in Film | NASW Social Work Talks Podcast 

Dr. Bruce Perry’s website 

Book: What Happened to You? Conversations on Trauma, Resilience, and Healing | Authors: Oprah Winfrey and Bruce D. Perry, M.D., Ph.D. 

Oprah Winfrey and Dr. Bruce Perry on 60 Minutes: Treating childhood trauma | CBS News 

Resources | The National Child Traumatic Stress Network

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Shrounda Selivanoff takes us on a journey from childhood to motherhood, including a head-on collision with the child welfare system. Hear from Shrounda on how being seen and acknowledged for who she was changed her life forever. Shrounda is a passionate mother, kinship caregiver, and parent ally who inspires and helps other parents who experience the system through her work as public policy director at Children’s Home Society of Washington. 

Show Notes: 

0:50  | Meet Shrounda Selivanoff, who talks about the result of growing up in an isolated, overburdened family. 

4:45   | Shrounda shares that school was her haven and that at 13 years old, a newfound friend offered to help in her moment of need. 

6:08  | The beginnings of motherhood and battling substance use disorder. 

20:02   | Hear from Shrounda how being seen and acknowledged for who she was changed her life forever. 

22:14   | Shrounda describes how stepping into being loved for exactly who she is and not feeling the need to be something else helped her change the direction of her life. 

33:30   | A new kind of warm hug with King, grandson, and Alexis, daughter.  

34:32   | As a mom, professional, and advocate for children and families, Shrounda says “My story is your story. We’re in this together.” 

35:40  | Matt and Shrounda share final thoughts. 

Resources: 

Kinship Care Resources | Child Information Gateway

Children's Home Society of Washington

Shrounda’s Work | In Pursuit of Growing and Healing: Changing Child Welfare 

Shrounda’s Work | Choose Compassion When Supporting Parents

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Spoken word poet, Slam Anderson, and her mom, Lillie Lee-Williams, engage in an emotional conversation demonstrating the strength of family bonds despite a 14-year child welfare-initiated separation. This episode questions what would happen if the child welfare system was designed to support root causes of family stress instead of waiting for late-stage intervention. Plus, Slam recites her spoken word poem “My Need for Change,” detailing her experiences with the system, which Matt Anderson refers to as the “anthem” of the family well-being movement. 

Show Notes: 

0:56  | Meet Slam Anderson, spoken word poet
 
1:08  | Slam recites the first segment of her original poem “My Need for Change.”
 
2:50  | Slam shares insight on life growing up and how her mom poured into Slam and her siblings' lives while struggling to make ends meet.
 
5:00  | Meet Lillie Lee-Williams, Slam’s mom.
 
6:55  | What would’ve helped Lillie’s family?
 
8:26  | What does it feel like to go through a system that isn’t designed to truly listen to what families need? Listen to Lillie’s experience when she asked for help.
 
9:40  | What happened to Slam when she and her siblings were separated from their mother, Lillie? Slam reveals her story and shares the second segment of her poem “My Need for Change.” 
 
16:00  | How does Slam find her love for poetry?
 
17:54  | After 14 years, Slam and Lillie share how reconnecting was emotional and exhilarating.
 
20:05  | The third and final segment of Slam’s spoken word poem “My Need for Change.”
 
21:20  | Matt asks Lillie, “What do you want us to know? What do you want us to do?”
 
23:00  | Matt shares final thoughts. 

Transcript:
View transcript here

Resources: 

Slam works with these organizations to promote self-empowerment and love: Kitchen Table and FosterStrong 

Introduction to Family Well-being: Promoting Child & Family Well-Being | Child Welfare Information Gateway 

Program example of in-home services that build supports for families: CHSNC | Family Preservation Program 

Kinship Care Resources | Child Information Gateway 

Housing Services | Child Welfare Information Gateway 

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Seen Out Loud, formerly Seen and Heard, is a show about disrupting the child welfare system by the simple act of seeing families in their full humanity. Listen to their stories with your host Matt Anderson. Tune in weekly to hear new perspectives and compelling insights that can lead to the radical transformation of America’s foster care system.