Silver On the Sage

Welcome to Season 5 of Silver On the Sage Podcast.  We are four months away from celebrating our two year anniversary and fourteen interviews away from our 100th episode.  I want to thank all those who contributed to today's campfire episode - I can’t think of a better way to acknowledge the immeasurable impact that Philmont has had on us, than gathering together to share music and stories.  Enjoy the show! 

Set List:
Intro - 8 year old Caitlin
Iron John Logan - Highway Creek
Ali Meeks - Landslide & Moreno
Trevor Lombardi - Waiting On a Song
Larry & Evan McLaughlin and Andy Gerhart - Paradise
Carly & Dylan McDermott - Hold me Close and New Railroad
Chris Sawyer - River Town
Chris and Rod Taylor - Dublin Blues

Lottice Taylor - Poem by Robert Service - The Men that don't fit in
Metcalf 2022 - Bonito and Crossing The Bar
Rob Heyduck - Touch Me Not
Cyphers 2016 with Tyler Minchow - Jesse Got Trapped in a Coal mine
Tom Munch - On the loose 
Mathias Olson and Slim Uribe-Goertz - Bittersweet and Leave Colorado
Ben Herries & 2015 Metcalf Staff - Old Man Song 
Josh Standard with Hawk &Crow - Shove the Pigs Foot Further in the Fire & Adeline

Ingria Jones - Frozen Logger Song
Jimmy Lowe - Roland the Headless Thompson Gunner & Tam Lin
John Hardin Sawyer - The Broken Road
The Calico Stray - Georgetown
Bucko Cowden - Piggy
Miguel Salazar - Pickin Charlie
Dom & Geno Alesandrini - Hesitation Blues and Greenback Dollar
Sam Anderson - I won't be found & The Gardener
Sam and Annie Anderson - Down in the Valley
John Ficke  - Philmont Don't forget me
Beaubien 2012 Staff  - Someday Soon

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Alex Avé Lallemant has lived and traveled all over the world as a Foreign Service Officer.  He shares a witty and insightful interview, revealing how impactful our time on staff really is.  As a young fourteen year old, Alex was tested on the trail. His crew pushed him to lead, and he found himself building confidence and accomplishing more than he ever thought he could.

Alex spent five summers in the Ranger department, and one summer in the backcountry.  Infused with the spirit of adventure, positively, and comradery - Alex saw the backcountry staffed camps as the organs and the rangers as the lifeblood of the Philmont experience.  As Rayado Trek Coordinator for two summers in 96 and 97, Alex witnessed the Rayado program build confidence in youth in a genuine, non-performative way - giving participants a unique and energetic rocket fuel for life.   

Alex was at the ranch this summer, as an advisor on trek with two of his three sons.  Their crew consisted of scouts from all over the world. For Alex, being able to experience Philmont with his kids, and really see them begin to understand and love it’s magic - was a recursive and full-circle feeling, hard to put into words.

Alex is currently the Consular Section Chief at the US Embassy in Harare, Zimbabwe. He has been a career Foreign Service Officer since 2000 with extensive experience in national security, immigration law, counterterrorism, refugee resettlement, humanitarian assistance, and more. His work is a calling and a passion. The happiest people he knows are the ones working for a mission they believe in.

He praises Philmont staff for showing up for each other and no matter how seemingly opposite we may be - the common bond of Philmont puts us all on the same team.

Philmont Experience
Participant: 1987, 1988, 1989
Advisor: 2022

Ranger - 1992
Rayado Ranger - 1994
Training Ranger (i.e. Ranger Trainer) -1995
Rayado Trek Coordinator - 1996, 1997
ACD/Head Rock Cito - 1998

Notable Mentions
Chris Sawyer
Daryl Trusty
Rachel
Jim Catchmore
CJ Cadess
Chad Giles
Patrick Stanforth
Trish Daily Seifert
Don Hummell and Jim
Larry McLaughlin
Tobasco Donkeys 
Eric Voss
Greg Harper aka GS Harper
Julie Smith Vigil
Cynthia Newcome Trumper
Megan Tilison
PJ Parmer

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Music has the power to shift our attitude, enhance an experience, recall detailed memories, and more. Philmont music is a special breed; all of its own.  It’s not just the chords and lyrics, it’s the warm night breeze while overlooking the Tooth at Crater, or the impromptu staff after-show as crews hike off to their tents, headlamps bouncing, it’s the telling of our best or worst stories, its the wrangler sharing cowboy poetry, its the energy inside the stomp cabin, lanterns swinging, its rainy night porch performances, and hearing that one romantic tune that makes your Philmont fling unable to sleep at night.  Music is medicine, in the form of the present moment and a longing memory - all at once. 

Today’s guest, GS Harper, grew up surrounded by music. His own father was a singer songwriter, and GS aspired to follow in his footsteps, and did just that. Ironically, until the 2021 season, GS never actually applied for any of his Philmont jobs. For four summers in the 90s, he was a walk on.  He would simply show up, with guitar in hand, and they’d find him a spot.

In this episode GS discusses everything from the recording of the Tobasco Donkey’s Yarn Sessions album at his mothers place in Cimarron, to the old Inter-Mountain Relay tradition, getting lost hiking and accidentally doing super black death, ghosts at Cypher's, and more. GS met his wife at Philmont, and we discuss that magic - how there’s a certain type of person who returns to Philmont for seven or eight summers in a row. And since you are seldom in a situation like that, surrounded by those types of twin flames or mirrored souls - it’s no wonder we carry on together throughout life.

GS was recently on staff in 2021 as CD at Beaubien. We get to discuss his experience being back on staff after a 22 year hiatus. It was a great experience and GS would highly recommend it, in fact, he hopes it’s not his last summer on staff yet.

Today GS is a career singer-songwriter and guitarist.  He shares some of his favorite memories playing music all over the world.  He also shares the backstory of the well loved tune, August Day, which he wrote while on staff in 1995.  We close by recalling memories and GS says quote, “His Philmont experience has colored everything, and has informed every decision in his life since."

Philmont Experience
1987- ten day trek. Exp 802A
1988- ten day trek. Exp 629T

1991- Basecamp Activities
1992- PC Cyphers Mine
1995- PC Crate Lake
1996- PC Pueblano
2021- CD Beaubien

Notable Mentions
Brent Smith
Dean Tooley
Todd Conklin
Eric Voss
Tobasco Donkeys
Lee Hughes
Andy Garhart
Larry Mclaughlin
Cherry Bennet
Maureen Russell Harper
Doug Palmer
Jag Mclaughlin
Dave Bates
David and Dollie O’Neill
Kevin Magnus

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It’s no secret that we love Philmont and its people. Many of us work seven, eight, or nine summers or seasons in a row.  We even consider and some of us achieve - the dream of returning on staff full-time.  In November of 2021, Nancy Coleman Stickelman and her husband Kevin made that happen for their family as Kevin was offered the Director of Facilities position.

For Nancy, Scouting and Philmont have been a part of her life for quite some time. Today she resides on property with her family in the Upper Heck House, previously occupied by Bob and Rachel Ricklefs. She recalls her first experience on trek, during a backcountry rainstorm, basking in a moment of the world feeling limitless, with infinite possibilities to experience love and success.

Nancy worked seven summers in the backcountry, including in 2000 - she was CD at Fish Camp the first summer that it became interpretive, and in 2002 - she was first female CD at Cyphers Mine. In 2003 she worked alongside Doug Palmer and Deborah Blanche developing and deepening accurate roots for the interpretive program - collecting historical guidelines, first person characters, and music to reflect the correct era being portrayed.

For Nancy, Philmont has always been about interacting with its people and developing those meaningful connections. Nancy is working to carve out a place for herself at the ranch, and she has enjoyed substitute teaching in the Cimarron Schools. She aims to replicate the welcoming nature of backcountry camps, by sharing food and conversation at her home or in the dining hall, amongst a crowded table. 

Philmont Experience:
1996 Regular Trek with my Explorer Post from Decatur, GA.

1997 HOD PC
1998 Fish Camp PC
1999 HOD CD
2000 Fish Camp CD (first year interp)
2001 French Henry CD
2002 Cypher’s Mine CD (first year women were at Cyphers)
2003 BCM
2002 Autumn Adventure Guide
2003 Autumn Adventure Guide, Interp Camps historical research
2013-2016 PSA Western Region Board Member
2023 PSA Mountain Region Board Member
2021- November Kevin became the Director of Facilities

Notable Mentions:
Andrea Nuccio Watson
Mark Anderson
Kevin Stickelman
Allison Vinson Defrees
Christine Krupa
Sam Sorken
Theresa Barns
Bill Spice
Sharon
Mark Anderson
Keith Galloway
Deborah Blanch
Dave Kissell
Jennifer Cummings
Derek Gotlieb
Bob & Rachel Ricklefs
Doug Palmer
Amy Long Hanks
Linda Anderson
RW Hampton
Dave Werhane
Eric Locklar
Donnie Lundsford
Joey Martinez
Fran Romero
Betty Pecheo
Jim and Louise Johnson
Barbara Garcia
Holly Demouth
Kevin Ferdinand

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Jackie’s Philmont participant story begins with a bang - in 2013 on day 2 as a Ranch Hand at Clark’s Fork she suffered a serious injury on horseback.  After a rough, year-long recovery, she was most upset by the fact that she wasn’t able to complete the Ranch Hands experience.  She finally returned in 2019 on staff at PTC. Jackie celebrates PTC as being a place to experience so many different opportunities from backcountry hikes and COPE to crafts and evening program. Even better, on PTC staff you witness participants from age six to age eighty, excel and enjoy these adventures.

Jackie lives by the philosophy that “Once you get too comfortable in a role or department, it’s time to seek out something new, and push yourself to grow.”  Jackie did just that in 2020, when she applied to work in the Philmont Conservation department.  Jackie feels privileged to have spent the height of covid at Miners Park with a group of 11 others, clearing forest. She went on to become trained as a Conservation Forestry Foreman, learning the extensive science, safety, and history that is involved in logging.

Lastly, Jackie discusses her post-covid experience as the Summer 2021 PTC Program Director.  With heavy crew loads and few returning staff, it was type-2 fun at the time, but she reflects on how rewarding it was to watch her staff grow that season.  In her ninth consecutive season at the ranch, Jackie was the Winter Basecamp Manager, where she hired all basecamp departments.  Today Jackie is a  Park Ranger at the US Army Corps of Engineers, in Abiquiu, NM.  

Jackie's father, Greg Rapport, runs a non-profit for children aging out of the foster care system: Age Out Angels.  Check it out! 

Philmont Experience:
2012 - Cavalcade participant
2013 - Ranch Hands participant

Staff:
Summer 2019: Program Counselor at the PTC
Fall 2019: Autumn PTC Staff
Winter 2020: Cons Forestry Work Crew Member (Season ended early because of COVID)
Summer 2020: Originally hired to be an OATC Foreman but came on staff as a Cons Forestry Work Crew Member (One of 11 Forestry staff hired, we were based out of Miners Park it was incredible)
Fall 2020: Conservation Forestry Foreman (Season ended early because of COVID, did some cool cutting in the Burn for forestry research)
Winter 2021: Conservation Forestry Foreman
Summer 2021: PTC Program Director
Autumn 2021: Autumn Basecamp Manager
Winter 2022: Winter Basecamp Manager

Notable Mentions
Mike Crockett
Keith Nelson
Bryan Stokes
Brad 
Ben
Chase Dormeyer
Will Campbell
Phillip Ferrier
Maddy Hauk
Brian Sibert
Slim Uribe Goertz

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Emily Megee joins the show to discuss her five summers on staff and three unique summers as a participant.  On Rayado, she came off the trail with a new vision of what it could mean to be a positive, impactful person in life.  And how impactful friendship is defined.  She encountered moments of clarity - where the world could be both big and terrible, and slow and beautiful all at once.  These moments and many more solidified her passion towards the person she is and the work she does today.

While living and working in the backcountry, Emily learned all necessary practical skills for life.  Philmont gave her the time and space to develop into her authentic self.  Her year as ACD at Head of Dean drove her to want to show up differently, and be a better leader.  As backcountry manager, she tackled the challenging balance of growing backcountry staff while supporting them.  The same concept that crews strive to follow - let the scouts lead, and the adults support.  Emily chats about successful leadership which she believes focuses on listening, outsourcing what you cannot alone solve, and forgetting not the bigger picture of why you are at the ranch.

Today Emily is an REI Store Manager in Woodbridge, VA.  She equates her role at REI to that of BCM, creating relationships with her team and discovering what inspires them.  Emily believes that if you show up for others, they’ll show up for you.  In 2018 she was selected and nominated by her peers to receive the REI Anderson Award, which recognizes team members whose contributions exemplify REI’s Core Values and support their Mission.

Final quote Emily shares: “Be patient toward all that is unsolved in your heart and try to love the questions themselves, like locked rooms and like books that are now written in a very foreign tongue. Do not now seek the answers, which cannot be given you because you would not be able to live them. And the point is, to live everything. Live the questions now. Perhaps you will then gradually, without noticing it, live along some distant day into the answer.” Rainer Maria Rilke

Philmont Experience:
2008 - Regular trek with venture crew
2009 - Rayado
2010 - ROCS

2011 - PC Carson Meadows
2012 - PC Dan Beard
2013 - ACD Head of Dean
2014 - CD Sawmill
2015 - BCM

Emily would like to encourage listeners to check out The Venture Out Project. They are a group that help get queer and transgender individuals outside.

Notable Mentions:
Allison King
Carrie Anderson
Lindsay Hickman Johnson
Allison Vinson Defrees
Briana Howland
Matt Hubbard
Jimmy Lowe
Jimmy Fritz
Sean and Lela Murphy
Lee Ferin
Zac Garmore
Austin St. George
Nichole Butler

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Doug worked seasonally at Philmont for 10 summers from 1987 to 1996.  He then went on to volunteer 17 years for the PSA as their Technology Manager from 2004 - 2021. In this episode Doug chats about ominous encounters at Urraca, the hard to sell program of Santa Claus in the 90s, bears, mullets and everything in-between.  We also chat about how Doug ended up mid-summer as the sole person working at and eventually gathering Urraca in 1992. 

Doug’s philosophy was always to make sure the scouts had the same quality experience as he did as a youth on trek.  He applauds Philmont staff for being the type of people who make crew experiences great, no matter the job. Doug met his wife at Philmont, and today they have four daughters who are all involved in Scouts and Girl Scouts alike. Thank you Doug for being on the show and having such a witty sense of self, and for dedicating so many years to the PSA, helping create streamlined processes for the website and more.

Philmont Experience
82 Regular Trek
84 Regular Trek
86 Regular Trek

87 PTC Food Service
88 PTC Food Service
89 Ranger
90 PTC South Tent City Mgr
91 PTC Services Mgr
92 CD Urraca
93 CD Santa Claus
94 CD Ponil
94 (fall) Asst Coordinator - Autumn Adventure
95 CD Cimarroncito
96 CD Beaubien

2004 - 2021 PSA Technology Mgr
2021 - Regular Trek - Advisor

Notable Mentions:
Julie Smith Vigil
Reggie Jayne
Doug Palmer
Dean Tooley
Dave Kenneke
Tek Man
Rachel & Bob Ricklefs
Rod & Patty Taylor
Colleen McLaughlin
Carrie Fasching
Megan Wicker
Eric Voss
Gene Schnell
Chris Bryant
Scott Tony
Rice Brewer
Michelle Allen
Randy Saunders
Dollie O’Neill
Shayla Felix
Wally Wolanin

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Administrative Champions, Customer Service Experts, and Culture of Excellence Creators. For 30-40 years Betty Pacheco and Fran Romero served in various roles, but spent most of their time working as Camping Registrar and Camping Secretary. These two ladies made sure that day in and day out the job was done, and done right. Fran and Betty grew up together, and met in grade school in Cimarron, They both began working for Philmont while still in High School. Fran worked with PTC children and Betty as a switchboard operator and commissary clerk. 

Then and today - the role of Philmont Camping Registrar and Camping Secretary perform essential, rigorous work. In these roles, Betty and Fran spent hours corresponding with adult leaders and coaching new advisors - from booking travel, logistics of early arrivals, account balances and more - Fran and Betty would field many calls, often from the same individuals with new and familiar questions.  After months of planning adult leaders and their crews would finally arrive at Philmont - trail bound.  From time to time, the leaders would ask to meet the familiar voices across the line, which was so rewarding and always welcomed by Betty and Fran.

The two discuss in length the incredible evolution the registration process has gone through during their time from 1990-2020.  From doing everything by pen and paper and snail mail to email, electronic payments, and online reservations. Betty and Fran saw their roles shift from tedious manual work to efficient and automated processes. They remained active in the ever-evolving systems by taking trips to the National Office to meet with the IT crew and helping the reservation phone bank company in Dubuque, Iowa - these women were on the front lines of change, helping the transition succeed seamlessly.

The main system that Philmont uses today first originated in 2004 and was created by former Philmont employee Bryan Hayek and his brother-in-law Jime Lopez. These two men designed a massive database, which initially saved Betty and Fran hours of manual input and typing. It then went on to include seasonal staff hiring, infirmary, and many more departments at Philmont today.  The phrase “Philmont Machine” is largely accomplished by folks in these roles, who are so dedicated to the Ranch and approach each task at hand with excellence.

Betty and Fran reflect on their years at the Camping Headquarters Office with heartfelt memories of making the work fun, laughing during daily breaks with chips and salsa, and how the days just flew by.  Towards the end of their tenure, Fran took a role at the Admin office across the road.  On that day, both girls cried.  During the two summers that Philmont closed program - in 2018 due to the Ute Park fire and the 2020 Covid pandemic - Betty and Fran were the ones calling crews, processing refunds, and scheduling future reservations. After those two challenging years, the girls decided it was time to make good on their pack, and retire together.   

Many thanks to everyone behind the scenes who work tirelessly to make Philmont a place of wilderness adventure that lasts a lifetime.

Betty Pacheco
Seasonal
1972 - Switchboard operator and commissary clerk
1973 - Accounting department clerk
Full-Time
1974-1987 - Accounting Department Clerk & Assistant bookkeeper
1988-1989 - Camping Secretary/Assistant Camping Registrar
1990-2020 - Camping Registrar

Fran Romero
Seasonal
1972 & 1973 - PTC small fry 
Full-Time
1989-1992 - PTC Secretary 
1992 - 2019 - Senior Secretary/Assistant Registrar
2019 - 2020 - Admin Assistant to General Manager

Notable Mentions:
Rachel Ricklefs 
Mark Anderson
Frank Reigleman
Amanda Martinez
Betty Brown
Bryan Hayek
Jime Lopez

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Married couple Matt Hubbard and Emily Bergman join the show.  With lots of laughs and answering questions in tandem, Emily and Matt share how their experience at Philmont, “laid the foundation for the rest of their lives.”  The couple jokes that Matt imported his Phil-fling, as Emily followed him to Philmont after the couple had met in college.  With a hodgepodge assortment of borrowed gear from friends and family, Emily’s first summer as a Ranger sparked something completely new within her.  As a Mountain Trek Rayado Ranger her second summer, she continued her passion for teaching youth to lead and truly experience the outdoors with empowerment and confidence.

Matt discusses his seven summer tenure through various lenses including his role as BCM and his intention to lead by injecting his authentic self into the role in order to make it better.  He did so via the Philmont adopted FISH philosophy of  "choose your attitude", "play", "make their day" and "be there".  Philmont was a stepping off point for Matt - teaching him how to go out into the world and do big things.  Big things that the couple have accomplished together, include hiking the Pacific Crest Trail and serving in the Peace Corps.

Emily shares how she developed a sense of community at Philmont that she had not expired prior.  She carried that notion of community with her in the Peace Corps, and helped facilitate and run an outdoor camp for teen girls in rural Jamaica. Matt shares a poetic description of savoring the little rituals of backcountry life such as prepping advisors coffee as the sun sets and a hard day's work is done. 

Today, Matt’s thirst for direct service and servant leadership has led him to his current role as a student in PA school.  Emily works for a non-profit called Project V.E.T.S  - healing the planet one animal at a time, while also pursuing her own entrepreneurial endeavors.  From pancakes and classic rock denim vest Phil-fiestas and getting lost while hiking Baldy to backcountry disc golf and hiking with honey to pep people up - Emily and Matt are admittedly not always prepared but they always approach bumps in the road with humility and humor. 

Lastly - as we are mid-way through the 2022 Philmont summer season, I thought it would be fun to note that one year ago today, Peter Bingen’s episode aired on the podcast.  For those of you who don’t know, Peter wrote the beloved song titled “I Don’t Mind.”  So if you’re feeling the ache and missing those magnetic pile of rocks, grab your headphones, tune out the rest of the world, step outside, and “find some ground lace up your boots start walkin'

Philmont Experience:
Matt Hubbard
2009 - PC Dan Beard
2010 - PC Miners Park
2011 - PC Miranda
2012 - CD Seally Canyon
2013 - CD Head of Dean
2014 - Backcountry Manager (BCM)
2015 - BCM

Emily Bergman
2013 - Ranger
2015 - Mountain Trek Rayado Ranger

Notable Mentions:
Karl and Melissa Hubbard
Lela Puckett
Helen Jent
Chris Sawyer
Dollie O'Neill
Ranger Blane
Tyler Livermore
Uncle - Bruce Wagner
Bryan Delany
Stephen Alexander
Jesse Coffman

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Lori first came to Philmont to visit a boyfriend, and ended up staying the rest of the summer to work.  With no intention to return the next year, she suddenly got the itch and found herself craving another Westward adventure.   Her first official summer on staff, she was a PTC group leader.  She recalls PTC being a great place for a non-scouter to start her Philmont career.  She also remembers her tight knit group of girlfriends who spent days off in the backcountry together learning the ins and outs of backpacking.

As a PC at Beaubien, she found herself across the meadow each morning, helping the wranglers prepare for tailrides.  She soon graduated from currying to saddling and became an honorary wranglers assistant.  The next summer, she returned as a wrangler, and eventually become the 4th female horsemen on South Cavalcade.

From shoeing and topping off, to horse drives and rodeo dances - Lori found herself amongst her own - a Ranch department family rooted in hard work, respect, and education.   As South Cav horseman in 1997 and 1998, Lori thrived as a leader and embraced the opportunity to build relationships with backcountry staff camps.  Lori met her husband at Philmont and says quote "There's just something about a guy in interps."  Today the Lori and her family remain active in Scouting and Philmont.

Removed from all other distractions, Philmont gave Lori the time and space to think about who she wanted to be as she went forward into life.   The hard work she encountered as a wrangler put into context other challenges in life - that with some grit and trusted friends, one could make it through hardships, and grow from them too. 

Philmont Experience
1993 – PTC East Tent City Asst. Manager (partial summer)
1994 – PTC Family Program
1995 – PC Beaubien
1996 – Wrangler
1997 – Horseman – South Cavalcade
1998 – Horseman – South Cavalcade
 
Non-Philmont Scouting Experience
2002 – 2005 – Exploring Executive / District Executive – Denver Area Council, BSA. Currently Chartered Organization Representative for T510 (Boy & Girl) and Crew 510 out of Naperville, IL

Notable Mentions:
Ali Wick Meeks
Forest McVicar
Cricket Lundsteen Quast
Jolene Clark Hardy
Tricia Daily Seifert
Jen Temple
Punita Hanspal
Rachel Ricklefs
Bob Ricklefs
Laurie Cochran
David Musolf aka Trigger
Travis Powell
Matt Todd
Stacey Greene
Jeremy Spivey
Shelly Kieft Phillips
1996 wrangler crew – Tara, Anna LaPointe, Kristy Gibson, Eva
Joe Lieck
Ben Vargas
Marilyn Vargas
Rod Taylor
Chris Swain
Chrystene Matthews Speed
Jake Anderson
Roger Smith – Cold Beer
David Repovich
Reggie Jayne
Eric Voss
Father Don Hummell
Larry McLaughlin aka Dirty Larry - The Philmont Documentary
Doug Fasching
Eric Locklar aka Lock
Sam Sorkin

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