What can a Daoist priest teach Christians about silence? Shifu Michael Rinaldini spent years in Trappist and Carthusian monasteries, had a reconversion to Catholicism inside a Vedanta monastery, and followed Thomas Merton's footsteps room by room before finding his home on the Daoist path in his early 40s. Ordained in Beijing as a 22nd-generation Daoist priest, Michael joins Dave and Fr. John to explore Zuowang ("sitting and forgetting") meditation, Qigong, Daoist cosmology, and why he still sends his priest-students on retreat to Catholic monasteries. If you've ever said, "I'm spiritual but not religious," Michael has advice you won't expect. 

[00:00] Cold open: "There's no separation of anything. It's all one total unity."

[02:30] Meet Shifu Michael Rinaldini, Daoist priest, Qigong teacher, and Camaldolese oblate

[04:30] Michael's winding spiritual journey: The Razor's Edge in high school, Zen in college, a yoga path to India, and a reconversion to Catholicism, inside a Vedanta monastery

[09:00] Six years of monastery-hopping: Christ in the Desert, the Carthusians in Vermont, the Trappists in Georgia and always arriving "two or three years behind Thomas Merton"

[12:00] The realization that changed everything: "Maybe I really don't want to be a monastic monk. Maybe I just want to be on the spiritual path."

[13:30] How minor health problems led to Qigong, Chinese medicine and ordination as a 22nd-generation Daoist priest in Beijing in 2003

[16:00] Inside a Daoist retreat: Zuowang, the meditation of "sitting and forgetting," and purifying the heart-mind to uncover your innate nature (Xing)

[19:30] The path to Daoist priesthood: a nine-month novitiate, a 1,000-day training and why Michael tells his students to make solitary retreats at Catholic monasteries

[21:30] Qigong, Tai Chi, acupuncture, and meditation: one system with ancient shamanic roots, not separate disciplines

[25:00] Dave asks Michael to explain the Dao. Michael's answer: "Well, I really can't." (Stay with him, he gets there.)

[26:30] Non-duality, the unitive vision of Fr. Bruno Barnhart, and the apophatic common ground between East and West

[30:30] Offering incense at the Daoist temple in the morning, the Buddhist temple in the afternoon: how China blends traditions the West keeps separate

[34:45] "I'm not religious, but I'm spiritual," and Michael's advice to find the silence of the desert at your local monastery

[39:00] Getting started with Qigong and Tai Chi: why one skillful local teacher beats a pile of books and videos ("gong" literally means skill)

[43:30] Philosophical vs. religious Daoism and the scholar-practitioners who insist that reading the Tao Te Ching without practicing stillness is "just an intellectual thing"

[46:30] What it means to go into your own emptiness and how that squares with human dignity

[54:00] Daoist cosmology 101: pre-heaven and post-heaven, the Taiji, yin and yang, and the path of working your way back up to the One

[57:30] Two sides of Daoism: Michael's meditation-focused Dragon Gate lineage vs. the ritual-rich Celestial Masters tradition (yes, including exorcism)

[61:30] The one ritual Michael keeps: the ordination ceremony, robes, vows, incense, and blessings with the whisk

[64:30] "Go home and grow as a priest in the heart"; the advice that became a 600-page book

[65:30] Dave's closing reflections and a book recommendation for the Daoism-curious

Shifu Michael Rinaldini is the director of the Qigong & Daoist Training Center in Sebastopol, California. Ordained in China in 2003 as a 22nd-generation Daoist priest, he founded the American Dragon Gate Lineage in 2006 and offers advanced Qigong and Daoist training and certification internationally. A Camaldolese oblate whose spiritual roots span Catholic monasticism, Zen, and Vipassana, he has written seven practice journals, most recently A Taoist Practice Journal: Interreligious Dialogue, Taoism and Christianity, Extraordinary Vessels, and Taoist Cultivation (2023).

Connect with Michael:

"There's a very simple definition of non-duality. There's no separation of anything. It's all one total unity." — Shifu Michael Rinaldini

"Maybe I really don't want to be a monastic monk. Maybe I just want to be on the spiritual path." — Shifu Michael Rinaldini

"How can you go deep into these healing energies without the process of the silence and the stillness that is cultivated?" — Shifu Michael Rinaldini

"First find a good teacher, and then read the books." — Shifu Michael Rinaldini

"Go home and grow as a priest in the heart." — the charge Michael received at his ordination