Spiritual Fathers

In this episode, we dive into the journey of Tim Croll, a husband, father of three, and proud grandfather. Tim shares his evolution from a faith rooted in fear to a deeper understanding of God’s unconditional love. He reflects on the personal development lessons he’s learned from both entrepreneurial successes and failures, and the pivotal role mentorship has played in his life.

Tim also discusses his experience on Lego Masters, where he and his son Zach used their time on the show to model a supportive father-son relationship. As his family grows, with a new daughter-in-law on the way and another grandchild arriving soon, Tim cherishes the evolving dynamics and relationships. Tune in for insights on faith, family, mentorship, and personal growth.

You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in...

• Tim Croll, Using Lego Builds for personal and relationship development (00:00)
• Tim’s faith journey (2:00)
• Tim’s family life (11:15)
• Mentorship in Tim’s life (15:50)
• Tim shares his contact for anyone in need of mentorship (22:30)
• How taking an interest in his sons’ hobbies created new opportunities (23:38)
• Tim’s personal development lessons (30:44)
• How Tim encourages mentorship engagement (36:25)
• Best spiritual advice Tim has been given (42:20)

Tim’s Faith Journey

Tim’s faith journey began at a young age, shaped by a fear of hell and the belief that salvation depended on strict rule-following. Raised in a legalistic, performance-based environment, he internalized the idea that acceptance came from adhering to rules and achieving success. After pursuing a career in youth ministry and facing repeated setbacks, Tim transitioned into entrepreneurship, where he found success but also experienced burnout and failure.

A major turning point came when he hit rock bottom—physically and mentally exhausted—leading him to realize that God’s love is unconditional and not based on performance. This realization allowed him to embrace being loved for who he is, rather than what he does.

Tim emphasizes that growth in faith is a daily process. After spending decades forming beliefs about himself and God, transformation doesn’t happen overnight. He acknowledges that many people get frustrated with the slow pace of change, especially in a society that values instant results. He explains that setbacks are a natural part of the process, and returning to old patterns is common. However, growth in both relationships and faith takes time, and the journey is a continuous, unfolding process.

Tim’s Value of Mentorship

Tim places a high value on mentorship, recognizing it as essential to both his personal and professional growth. Raised to handle everything on his own, he initially struggled with asking for help. However, key mentors stepped in at pivotal moments throughout his life. In his 30s, Paul Beutel became a guiding force, helping Tim navigate personal and business challenges. Later, during a time when Tim and his family faced bankruptcy, Matt Guerin played a crucial role, helping Tim deal with legal issues and providing reassurance during a tough season.

When Tim moved to Philadelphia, he found two more influential mentors: Tony Grove, who had overcome significant personal struggles and helped Tim confront his own painful past, and Marvin Brubaker, who helped Tim process anger and resentment from a church conflict. Tim credits these relationships as life-saving and transformative, underscoring the importance of mentors who step in when needed, offering guidance through difficult times.

Tim shares a powerful moment when he was struggling deeply, feeling desperate and isolated. He had built up false beliefs and assumptions that no one would offer help. But in that moment, someone encouraged him to embrace humility and accept the support he so desperately needed.

Tim Uses His Lego Experience as a Spiritual Calling

Tim reflects on his time on Lego Masters as a blend of parental mentorship and spiritual calling. He and his wife, Melissa, prioritized being involved in their kids' hobbies, especially bonding with their son Zach over Lego building. Tim believes that strong relationships with children are built through shared experiences, which foster meaningful conversations.

Joining Lego Masters gave Tim and Zach the chance to showcase a positive father-son dynamic. Despite pressure from producers to create drama, Tim was determined to highlight their loving, supportive bond. He saw the opportunity as a way to model godly fatherhood and demonstrate the power of authentic relationships.

In his Lego workshops, Tim emphasizes hands-on, interactive learning rather than passive listening. By applying concepts like personal growth, communication, and conflict resolution, participants confront challenges, reflect on biblical lessons, and internalize valuable life skills. 

Resources & People Mentioned

• Doing Life with Adult Children
• LegoMasters

Connect with Tim Croll

• Tim Croll

Connect With Spiritual Fathers

• The Spiritual Fathers website
• SpiritualFathers(at)ManInTheMirror.com

Subscribe to SHOW NAME

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In this episode, we’re joined by Zach Garza, the Founder and Executive Director of You Can Mentor and the Co-Founder of Ten Thousand Fathers. Zach’s journey from being mentored to mentoring others is a powerful story of transformation, faith, and purpose. 

From his own life-changing experiences with mentors like Bob and Steve Allen, to founding organizations that support kids without dads, Zach’s passion for mentorship shines through. He shares how vulnerability, presence, and authenticity can make anyone a great mentor and outlines practical ways to lead, connect, and empower others. 

If you’ve ever wondered how to make a lasting impact, Zach’s insights will inspire and equip you to step into a mentoring role.

You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in...

• Resources and relationships (00:00)
• Zach’s faith journey (2:00)
• How to be a mentor (12:45)
• Learn more about Zach Garza (17:29)
• Three things that make a great mentor (22:45)
• How a mentor can identify skills to teach (33:17)
• The best advice Zach has received (35:08)
• Books Zach recommends (36:33)

Zach’s Spiritual Mentorship Started as a Mentee

Zach shares his journey from seeking acceptance, love, and validation through negative behaviors to finding guidance and support from a professor named Bob. Initially reluctant, Zach was drawn to Bob because Bob took an interest in him and didn't try to fix him. Over time, Bob's consistent presence and love helped Zach trust him and eventually accept an invitation to a men's Bible study.

Bob's mentorship extended beyond academics, showing Zach the importance of genuine, non-judgmental support. Zach also encountered other mentors such as Steve Allen, who played fatherly roles, encouraging him and teaching him different aspects about Jesus and spiritual values. 

These ongoing mentorships helped Zach transform his life, break free from generational curses, and embrace a path of light and purpose. Zach credits these mentors for teaching him how to be a better man, husband, and father, leading to profound personal growth and generational blessings.

Zach’s Work as a Mentor

Zach started as a teacher and coach at a low-income school in Dallas. Recognizing the need for father figures among his students, many of whom lacked a dad at home, he began mentoring them outside of school through lunches, dinners, and basketball games.

In 2009, with support from his community, Zach started a non-profit called Forerunner Mentoring Program to mentor young men without dads at home. By 2014, they were mentoring around 30 kids, and Zach went full-time with the organization, which expanded to include after-school programs and support for single moms. By the time he handed it off to his successor in 2021, they were mentoring hundreds of families, had baptized over 85 kids, and had a budget of $1.2 million.

Seeing the need for similar programs in other communities, Zach founded You Can Mentor, a non-profit that provides resources and training for mentors and mentoring organizations. They offer video training series, books, podcasts, informational documents, conferences, cohorts, and a non-profit accelerator to help people make disciples, especially for kids without dads or those who have experienced trauma.

Zach has written several books and continues to provide resources and relationships as a mentor.

Three Things that Make a Great Mentor

Zach emphasizes that anyone can be a mentor if they're willing to be vulnerable, present, and genuine. You don't have to be an expert; just a few steps ahead and ready to share your journey. Be available and be authentic. 

Zach says the first point of being a good mentor is to lead like Jesus. Initiate the relationship and invite the other guy to follow you. Be willing to make the first call, initiate the text, or consistently be available and continue to reach out. Also, as a mentor, you should have a plan for improvement. Have a podcast or book, questions, or talking points to help the other person.

Second point: be faithful over fruitful. It’s not your job to change the person. You should focus on being faithful. He says your role is to show up, reach out, pray, and make the connection until God says not to. Your job is to plant seeds and let God work on the transformation.

The third point is to acknowledge identity + skills (in a safe environment) = the best chance of success. Zach reminds us, that God identifies us as a man of God, full of value we share that with the mentees. 

Then comes the skill. You need your mentees to be faithful, available, and teachable. For example, Zach teaches his guys how to set goals, how to connect with their wives, and how to respond to texts timely. Whatever skills they want, mentors need to have a plan to teach them, but it must be in a non-critical, nurturing environment to give the greatest chance of success. 

Resources & People Mentioned

• Raising Up Ten Thousand Fathers
• Forerunner Mentoring
• You Can Mentor
• You Can Mentor by Zachary Garza
• Tell Me About Your Father by Zachary Garza
• The Youth Mentoring Playbook by Zacary Garza and John Barnard

Connect with Zach Garza

• Zach(at)youcanmentor.com
• Connect on LinkedIn

Connect With Spiritual Fathers

• The Spiritual Fathers website
• SpiritualFathers(at)ManInTheMirror.com

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In this episode of Spiritual Fathers, Kent shares the inspiring journey behind his ministry, Manhood Journey, which began as an effort to engage fathers in discipleship within his church community. Drawing from his personal story and advice he received as a teen navigating his parents’ divorce, Kent emphasizes the transformative power of surrounding yourself with mentors who exemplify the life you aspire to build. 

He also offers profound insights into mentorship, outlining four common pitfalls to avoid while highlighting the importance of fostering independence and mutual growth. Kent’s advice extends beyond mentoring, encouraging listeners to build relationships with men who challenge and inspire them, creating a dynamic network for personal and spiritual development.

Kent Evans is the executive director and co-founder of Manhood Journey, a ministry that helps dads become disciple-makers. After 20 years in a career as a businessman, Kent embarked on the men’s ministry project, appearing on television, radio, podcasts, and Christian speaking events. He is also the author of four books. He is married and has five sons.

You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in...

• Kent Evans shares about his life and faith [1:45]
• What inspired Kent to start the Manhood Journey ministry [4:50]
• What are the four dangers of mentoring? [15:30]
• Best spiritual advice Kent ever received [34:00]
• Kent talks about his new book, Don't Bench Yourself. [38:30]
• Books Kent recommends [39:50]

How Kent became interested in men’s mentorship

Kent shares how his ministry, Manhood Journey, took root when a church staff member approached him with a challenge: create something to engage fathers in the church. This sparked a collaborative effort among a group of men, brainstorming ideas on a whiteboard to answer a key question: “How can we inspire dads to embrace discipleship?” 

Their solution was to develop guided Bible studies, encouraging fathers to lead small group studies with their sons. Over time, Manhood Journey has grown into a vital resource for Christian fathers, equipping them to disciple their children in the faith.

Kent’s passion for men’s mentorship, however, was shaped much earlier in his life. At 17, following his parents’ divorce, a counselor offered him transformative advice: simply knowing what you don’t want your family life to look like isn’t enough. Instead, Kent was encouraged to seek out men who embodied the qualities and successes he desired, using their lives as templates to build his own. This foundational idea became the cornerstone of his work, inspiring him to help other fathers create intentional and faithful legacies for their families.

4 Dangers of Mentoring

Kent highlights four key pitfalls that can undermine the effectiveness of mentorship. 

1. The first is the belief that a mentor must be “the answer man.” While it may be tempting to provide solutions, the best mentors ask thoughtful questions, encouraging their mentees to think critically and make their own decisions. This approach empowers mentees to develop independence and confidence in their problem-solving abilities.
2. The second mistake is dictating the mentee’s path. Instead of prescribing a specific course of action, mentors should help mentees develop a framework for evaluating options and understanding consequences. This equips them with the tools they need to navigate future challenges on their own.
3. The third danger lies in assuming that the mentor’s way of doing things is the only correct way. While principles are universal, the methods for achieving them can vary greatly between individuals. Flexibility and openness to different approaches are crucial for effective mentorship.
4. Finally, Kent warns against rigidly maintaining the mentor-mentee dynamic. A healthy mentorship requires humility and mutual respect, recognizing that each person has unique strengths and insights. By occasionally allowing the mentee to guide or teach, both parties can grow and foster a deeper, more collaborative relationship.

Advice for mentoring and beyond 

Kent suggests that you find interesting men to surround yourself with. Look to build relationships with men who have qualities and talents that you would enjoy learning about. Look for smart guys who may mentor you in skills or experiences you want to develop in your own life. And consider how you can encourage mentees to have agency in their lives. 

Listen to the whole episode for insight into the mentoring relationship and common pitfalls to avoid. 

Resources & People Mentioned

• Start Your Manhood Journey To Be A Better Father & Husband
• Don’t Bench Yourself: How to Stay in the Game Even When you want to Quit, by Kent Evans
• Pointman, by Steve Farrar
• Teaching to Change Lives, by Dr. Howard Hendricks

Connect with Kent Evans

• Kent Evans

Connect With Spiritual Fathers

• The Spiritual Fathers website
• SpiritualFathers(at)ManInTheMirror.com

How can the church community create relationships between the older dads, and those still raising young children? What is it that men in the church are seeking within fellowship?

Roger Bodenstab is the lead pastor at Crescent City Foursquare Church, the Church he grew up in, in North California. He is a men's advocate and nonprofit leader for the organization, Dad Tired.

Roger shares about his upbringing as the youngest of 10 siblings. He was raised without a dad because his father passed away shortly after he was born. At ten years old, he was hit by a car and because of his near-death experience, he sought to know Jesus and get baptized. He then developed a love for God’s word.

He met his wife on a mission trip and they had three biological daughters and later in life, four adopted children. It is through these experiences that he developed a passion for creating men’s mentorship for dads as spiritual fathers in the church.

You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in...

• Roger’s testimony on becoming Christian and getting into ministry [1:27]
• What is Crescent City, Foursquare Church, known for? [7:21]
• What it felt like for Roger to understand the need for a spiritual father [16:13]
• What Roger thinks the young men in church are looking for from a mentor [19:12]
• How Roger creates intergenerational mentorships in his church [23:44]
• Roger’s advice on how to make time for a mentor-relationship [27:29]
• Roger shares his journey of being vulnerable and authentic in church [31:00]
• The best and worst spiritual advice Roger has been given [36:50]
• Roger’s book recommendations about friendships [38:30] 

Recognizing the Need for Spiritual Mentorship

Growing up in the church, the only mentorship Roger had was from the Word of God. When Roger became a pastor, he prayerfully sought how to reach the community. The Lord kept putting adoption and community children’s connection in his heart. 

The experience of adopting young boys in diapers, after he raised daughters, led him to seek support from Dad Tired. The support he received from the men's ministry group, guided him to a leadership role with Dad Tired. 

Roger realized that Dad Tired was bringing solutions spiritual dads had for seeking connection. The support group allowed men to communicate the love they wanted to express for their families and their need for connection.

Overcoming Obstacles that Hinder Men’s Mentoships

Roger believes the younger generation of church-going men are looking for authentic people to be vulnerable with. They seek to form real connections with genuine people. They are seeking answers to life’s difficult questions.

However, even when a younger generation desires mentorship, the obstacle older dads feel is accepting their vulnerability and sharing what they have learned from their mistakes in life. Sometimes the older men question what they have to offer in a mentoring relationship. Or they feel they can't make time for it. Roger suggests that any man wanting this relationship should act in obedience to this role and trust that God will honor the calling.

Being Vulnerable as a Spiritual Father

Many men may feel a weight, a burden that they are not good enough to be a spiritual mentor. Roger calls on his own experience of feeling like it was hard to measure up to other Godly men. 

He reminds us that God called only one man to live perfectly, and Jesus already fulfilled that role. We human, spiritual fathers have made mistakes, and it is learning from those mistakes that qualifies us to be mentors. God redeems our mistakes, and young dads need to know that. 

Young dads benefit from knowing there is redemption in struggles. It can offer freedom, grace, and love to the older dads confiding in the relationship too. Roger reminds us that the vulnerability to confess, confide, and pray for one another allows for healing.

This mentorship allows for a connection greater than the men. It is a reminder that it is always about Jesus.

Resources & People Mentioned

• Made for Friendship by Drew Hunter
• Made for People by John Earley
• DadTired Facebook Group

Connect with Roger Bondenstab

• Roger(at)dadtired.com
• https://www.dadtired.com/
• Connect on LinkedIn

Connect With Spiritual Fathers

• The Spiritual Fathers website
• https://www.instagram.com/maninthemirrorministry/
• SpiritualFathers(at)ManInTheMirror.com

Audio Production and Show Notes by - PODCAST FAST TRACK

Have you experienced the transformative power of mentorship and spiritual fathering? In this conversation, Ryan Reeves opens up about his journey from a rebellious youth to an engaged spiritual mentor. 

He shares the challenges he faced in finding meaningful mentorship and how this lack of guidance in his personal life motivated him to demystify the mentorship process and encourage older men to share their life experiences authentically with the younger generation.

Authenticity plays a huge role in effective mentorship. This episode explains why younger men value hearing about genuine struggles—over the illusion of perfection—and the barriers older men often face in becoming spiritual fathers. 

With practical advice and heartfelt anecdotes, this episode offers a compelling look at how building authentic, relational connections can profoundly impact both mentors and mentees. Whether you're a seasoned mentor or someone seeking guidance, this episode is sure to inspire you. 

You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in...

• Ryan’s story about the challenges of finding a mentor [06:02]
• Demystifying relationships and building connections through shared activities [11:15]
• Why older men have concerns about spiritual mentorship [15:33]
• Move from passivity to actively pursuing mentorship relationships [18:11]
• Helping younger men grow despite barriers [22:46]
• Older generations should be open about mistakes [23:37]
• Prioritize connection over busyness for spiritual growth [30:15]
• Best spiritual advice Ryan has ever been given [32:09]
• Ryan’s book recommendations [34:01]

Embracing Authenticity in Mentorship

Ryan candidly shares his experiences with the lack of consistent spiritual mentoring during his formative years. He repeatedly looked for guidance but often found himself navigating these paths alone. Ryan’s quest for a mentor was about spiritual guidance and personal growth in areas like marriage and fatherhood. His struggles underscore a genuine need for reliable, authentic mentors who can guide younger men.

A recurring theme in our conversation is the importance of authenticity in mentorship. Ryan and I discuss why older men’s past mistakes make them uniquely equipped to mentor younger men. 

Authenticity is far more impactful than striving for an illusion of perfection. Some of the most significant barriers to becoming an effective mentor include not knowing many young men, time constraints, and feeling unqualified due to past mistakes. 

Ryan stresses that these barriers can be overcome by embracing authenticity and being open about one’s struggles and lessons learned. Sharing real-life experiences, including failures, builds relatability and trust, making the mentoring relationship more impactful.

Fostering Meaningful Connections

Men can often get stuck on the practical aspects of forming meaningful connections. Ryan suggests starting small and progressing naturally, similar to how you would build up your fitness through consistent, manageable efforts. Making connections with younger men based on common interests and actively engaging in relationships can hugely enhance the mentor-mentee dynamic. 

Older mentors can build deeper, more impactful relationships when they focus on listening and simply being available for conversations. This genuine engagement helps mentees feel seen and heard, which in itself can be incredibly empowering and supportive. 

The Best Spiritual Advice Ryan Was Ever Given

Listening rather than offering solutions is a key part of being a great mentor. Ryan illustrates this importance by sharing an instance where an associate pastor advised against the idea of excessive spiritual busyness, which often masks a lack of true relational connections. 

Ryan explains how this approach respects the Biblical principle of "one day in seven" for worship and rest, encouraging mentors to prioritize personal connection over overwhelming busyness. Being present and making time for meaningful interactions can have a more profound impact on spiritual growth than simply providing solutions or adding more tasks.

When you prioritize relationships over external factors, you grow into your spiritual fatherhood. What starts as a spiritual friendship can develop over time into a deeper, more meaningful connection. The essence of mentorship is embracing authenticity, fostering genuine connections, and supporting younger men through life’s myriad challenges.

Resources & People Mentioned

• Know How We Got Our Bible by Ryan Reeves
• The Story of Creeds and Confessions: Tracing the Development of the Christian Faith by Donald Fairbairn and Ryan Reeves
• The Spiritual Fathers Training Guidebook by Ryan Reeves
• The Bible: A Global History by Bruce Gordon 

Connect with Ryan Reeves

• Follow on YouTube 

Connect With Spiritual Fathers

• The Spiritual Fathers website
• SpiritualFathers(at)ManInTheMirror.com

Subscribe to SHOW NAME

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How can we educate and equip men with the mature Christian faith to engage and develop a spiritual life with younger men in today’s culture? Why are men’s ministries failing? How do we create mentorship between older and younger dads, in different seasons of their spiritual lives?

Since 2010, Todd has been leading a discipleship movement of men, first in Southlake, Texas and now in Atlanta, Georgia. As part of the Executive team at Victory Church in Atlanta, Todd oversees discipleship for all ministries across four campuses. 

In this conversation, Todd and I explore why churches struggle with their men’s ministries programs, how we can navigate the crisis young men are having with their role in the church, and what a mature Christian mentorship looks like. We also discuss advice on how to live out our spiritual fitness to help guide other men in the church to live out theirs.

You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in...

• Todd’s story about getting into a men’s ministry role [1:30]
• The spiritual crisis with young men in the church today [5:10]
• The millennials’ question: "Does the Christian lifestyle work?” [9:47]
• The healing journey a man needs to take for spiritual fitness [13:20]
• How to say “no” to and dominate temptations of the flesh [16:20]
• Todd’s advice for young dads raising a family [27:50]
• Barriers spiritual fathers run into while trying to mentor other men [32:10]
• Best spiritual advice Todd has been given [39:50]
• Todd’s book recommendations and his own book in the works [41:40]

The Struggle Churches have with men's ministry

When Todd was offered a job as a men's ministry leader, he had research to do. He discovered many churches were giving up on men’s ministry programs because men were not interested in the functions. He decided he wanted to find a way to get men involved in a leadership role in every area of the church. The missing discipleship of men spiritually leading men needed to be reintegrated back into the church.

The Crisis young men have in the church today

Today young men are asking, “Is it actually possible to finish the spiritual race?” and “Does it work?” Young men struggle when they do not see spiritually strong men as role models in the church today. 

Is the crisis young men are having due to the spiritual church leaders leading with lukewarm lives? We believe in the power of an older mentor investing in the life of a younger man. However, sometimes something is missing and creates a disconnect in our ability to impact the lives of the younger dads. Todd gives his advice on how the older generations can overcome this disconnect. 

Advice on improving Spiritual fitness

What does your spiritual fitness routine look like? Todd helps us understand how the act of overcoming the flesh daily requires work and intention not just to remove sin from our lives but to then fill the space left behind with the Word and Spirit of God. 

Todd offers mentorship advice for the young dads in a busy season of dependent family life, and advice for the seasoned dads struggling to make the reach to connect with these busy young dads. He reminds us not to be afraid to make connections and have fun with each other because being friends is the first step to being a mentor.

Todd tells us that, “It matters that we serve God. It matters that we run from sin. It matters that we trust God. It matters that we pray. It matters that we fast. It matters that we go after the things of God because there are people that come behind you, that need what you have.” 

Resources & People Mentioned

• Who Not How by Dan Sullivan and Dr. Benjamin Hardy
• Extreme Ownership: How U.S. Navy SEALs Lead and Win by Jokko Willink and Leif Babin

Connect with Todd McIntyre

• Email Todd at tmcintyre(at)victoryatl.com 
• Friend on Facebook
• Follow on Twitter

Connect With Spiritual Fathers

• The Spiritual Fathers website
• SpiritualFathers(at)ManInTheMirror.com

Audio Production and Show Notes by - PODCAST FAST TRACK

Why are rites of passage so important to young men? How can it help fathers and sons develop deeper connections? Tim Strickland is the Executive Director of “Christ in the Smokies,” a Rite of Passage retreat ministry for young men. In this conversation, Tim shares how he became passionate about the next generation, why rites of passage are important, and why he believes the older generation has to invest in the next generation. 

You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in...

• Learn more about Tim Strickland [1:08]
• Getting involved with the next generation [3:53] 
• The crisis that shaped Tim’s story [5:29] 
• Tim’s advice for struggling through a loss [8:38] 
• The beginning of Christ in the Smokies [10:48] 
• Targeting three different seasons of life [15:04] 
• Experiencing “The Passage to Manhood” [17:51] 
• Share your lifetime of wisdom with others [22:13] 
• Overcoming the three barriers men face [27:16] 
• Why rites of passage are important [34:58] 
• The lightning round [38:00] 

Building a passion for the next generation

After Tim and his wife Toni got married they started attending a Presbyterian church in Ft. Lauderdale. After they had their son, they started attending a “Homeplace” ministry at their church, geared toward helping young families learn how to raise their children in a Christian home. 

When they moved to Georgia, Tim got involved in his church’s middle school ministry, where he served for 19 years. His wife jokes that he’s the perfect fit for middle-schoolers and fits right in. 

The crisis that shaped Tim’s story

In 2016, Tim’s son was killed in a car accident. He was only 23. Tim would never wish the loss of a child on his worst enemy. Tim notes there were some days he just had to remind himself to keep breathing. He and his wife had to lean on their community. He doesn’t know what they would’ve done without them. 

They chose to run to God in their anger and hurt. Tim knew that 80% of marriages end after the loss of a child. He was determined he wouldn’t lose Toni, too. He’s thankful that they’ve pushed onward together and still make an impact on the world.

Tim points out that navigating grief is not a problem to solve, it’s a tension to manage. Men are great at stuffing things down and ignoring them. However, you have to process and deal with loss. He emphasizes that God can handle whatever you’re feeling. You just have to learn to have those difficult conversations with God. 

Christ in the Rockies

In 2014, Tim took his son on a Christ in the Rockies trip after reading “Raising a Modern-Day Knight.” It’s all about celebrating the milestones and “rites of passage” that move a young man along into adulthood. It was an amazing experience that resonated with him. It was about teaching boys what it meant to be a man. 

The year after his son passed away, he and Toni went on another trip. The organizer, Mike Haddorff, said, “Why won’t you do this in the Southeast?” After praying about it, Tim and Toni dove in. He is the mouthpiece and she is the brain behind the operations. They’ve now been doing it for seven years. 

Experiencing “The Passage to Manhood”

Dads want something for their sons that they didn’t get to experience. You show up to a retreat as father and son and you walk away from the week as two sons of the father along a faith journey. They have great life experiences while comparing and contrasting “big rock” ideas. 

Success in the ballfield, the bedroom, the boardroom, and the billfold are the things most men chase. It’s the way the world defines success. But there’s a different way of doing things. Everyone is in the sanctification process. Knowing what you’re shooting for as a young man is a huge deal.

The men who attend the “Christ in the Smokies” retreats get to meet a community of other men walking through the same experience. It allows you to connect with each other and shift from solving things as father/son to solving them as men walking alongside each other. 

Listen to hear Tim share why he believes you have to open your heart and be willing to impart your wisdom on the next generation. 

Resources & People Mentioned

• Raising a Modern-Day Knight by Robert Lewis
• Healing the Masculine Soul by Gordon Dalbey
• The Extraordinary Gift of Being Ordinary by Ronald Siegel 
• Birth, Not Behavior: A Fresh Look at the Prodigal Son by Mike Haddorff
• Five Things God Uses to Grow Your Faith by Andy Stanley

Connect with Tim Strickland

• Christ in the Smokies
• Chris in the Rockies

Connect With Spiritual Fathers

• The Spiritual Fathers website
• SpiritualFathers(at)ManInTheMirror.com

Audio Production and Show Notes by - PODCAST FAST TRACK

Rev. Chuck Stecker is the Executive Director and Founder of A Chosen Generation. He’s an ordained minister of the Gospel with the Evangelical Church Alliance and has earned a Doctorate of Ministry specializing in Christian Leadership. And he is passionate about making sure the encore generation realizes the impact they can still have. 

In today’s conversation, Chuck shares why it’s time to “take the baton back” and embrace the mission that you still have left because it’s never too late to make an impact. 

You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in...

• Learn more about Chuck Stecker and his family [1:20]
• The letter my dad wrote me the day I graduated [5:04] 
• If You Passed Your Baton...Take It Back! [10:10] 
• The three barriers we have to overcome [17:50] 
• Reinvigorating the encore generation [27:00] 
• Cross-generational, Multi-generational, vs intergenerational [34:26]
• A lightning round with Chuck Stecker [41:40] 

If You Passed Your Baton...Take It Back!

Churches place much of their attention and emphasis on reaching the younger generation but not enough on the generation with the greatest availability. Chuck points out that we’ve confused the baton of engagement with the mantle of leadership. But when a runner passes a baton, they stop running. They immediately get off the track and stay out of the race. 

Passing the baton signifies that you’re done. But it’s not time to stop—it’s time to refire. Everything in your life has prepared you for this moment of greatness. Chuck isn’t wrong when he says, “This is your time of potential greatest ministry and impact in the kingdom that you’ve ever had.”

The three barriers we have to overcome

Men often tell us that they aren’t connected with a lot of younger men and if they are, they aren’t sure they’d want their input or wisdom. But the younger generation is hungry for older men to speak into their lives. Their hangup is that they don’t think they’re worthy enough. 

So how do you bridge the gap? You have to make yourself available to them. It can be as simple as telling them, “I’m always free for a cup of coffee.” Sometimes it’s just a quick conversation that turns into something more.

Another common roadblock is the thought that “You don’t have the time.” But the truth is, when someone says “I don’t have the time,” something prevents them from making the time. You make time for what you feel is important. It’s usually never a time issue. Instead, they likely feel unqualified or disqualified. 

Making mistakes doesn’t disqualify you from being a Spiritual Father. It can be one of the things that makes a younger man more likely to connect with you. Learning from your mistakes can help save them from making the same ones. 

Cross-generational, vs multi-generational, and inter-generational

What’s the difference between a cross-generational, multi-generational, and intergenerational approach? Why does it matter? 

• Cross-generational: This typically refers to marketing across cross-generational lines to maintain market share in the next generation. A company that doesn’t do this will lose business. 
• Multi-generational: A multi-generational approach is taking a center-stage focus (football, baseball, church, etc.). It’s about getting butts in the seat. The goal is to draw people from multiple generations. But sitting next to each other doesn’t build relationships. 
• Intergenerational: An intergenerational focus is about coming together to do life together so both entities grow together. It’s about bringing all generations together because they need each other. 

Being a Spiritual Father is about taking an intergenerational approach. We have to be engaged in the process and living what we’re telling other people. Are you ready to take back your baton? 

Resources & People Mentioned

• State of the Church
• In the Name of Jesus by Henri Nouwen
• The Other Half of Church by Jim Wilder
• Leadership as an Identity by Crawford Loritts

Connect with Chuck Stecker

• A Chosen Generation
• Connect on LinkedIn
• Friend on Facebook

Connect With Spiritual Fathers

• The Spiritual Fathers website
• SpiritualFathers(at)ManInTheMirror.com

 
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Jeremy Schurke is the Director of Mirror Labs. We launched the Spiritual Fathers initiative because of the research he’s done. In this episode of Spiritual Fathers, Jeremy touches on some of that research to drive home the point that we need more Spiritual Fathers. 

And it doesn’t have to be a difficult decision. All you need is experience, a willingness to be open and vulnerable, and a little bit of time. Learn the answer to “Why Spiritual Fathers?” in this great conversation. 

You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in...

The cultural conversation around the church

Jeremy became a Christian in college. After traveling and working with a college ministry, he moved to Haiti to open an orphanage. He toured colleges raising money and awareness for Haiti. He then helped a friend plant a church in the inner city of Jacksonville, FL. He worked on that project for six years, during which he went to seminary. 

Jeremy and his family moved back to Orlando in 2018. Jeremy’s learned that he prefers to be in the middle of the greatest need. It became obvious that the city he left in 2008 was much different. In 2008, there was a spiritual revival happening. He was part of the fastest-growing church in the Southeast US. But in 2018, it was a spiritual ghost town. 

There was a mass exodus from the church and no one had a good answer as to why. Something was off, and Jeremy wanted answers. That’s when he became involved in Mirror Labs. 

The launching of Mirror Labs

As he dove into research, Jeremy saw the struggles and challenges young men were facing. Man in the Mirror wanted to study and understand those challenges to find a way to best serve them. 

Jeremy got free reign to talk with anthropologists, sociologists, and social scientists. He launched focus groups while connecting with other organizations researching the church and Christian landscape. 

He learned something simple: The gospel is a timeless truth but the application must always be timely. Ultimately, if you don’t change the application, your message won’t pierce the culture. 

What surprised Jeremy the most? Research indicated that there was a mass exodus from the church that accelerated after Covid. The hypothesis was that young people were leaving the church because of cultural wars (LGBTQ, race, etc.). 

But it was more about relational emptiness. Young guys are struggling with loneliness. They weren’t building great relationships at the church—so why would they stay there? Even more glaring, many didn’t have an older man in their life as a mentor or guide, yet everyone surveyed wanted those relationships. 

The question became, how do they address this big need? Building a network of more Spiritual Fathers was one solution. 

Why become a Spiritual Father? 

Most young men don’t know where to find a spiritual father. They know plenty of older men but they’re not finding what they’re seeking. They want someone who isn’t resigned to life. They want someone still striving and engaged—someone they’d like to become. 

It isn’t about being rich and successful. Younger men want to learn from the guys who have gone through the valleys and come out on the other side. You’re the ones who have the perspective that young people want and need. 

The struggles and challenges are often more important than the successes and victories. We all learn more from our mistakes than our successes because we grow and learn from them. Secondly, young people struggle to trust someone who’s never made a mistake. They want to know that there's something more to keep walking in faith toward. 

Jeremy tackles other common questions about becoming a Spiritual Father—including why it’s so necessary, now more than ever—in this engaging conversation. 

Resources & People Mentioned

Connect with Jeremy Schurke

Connect With Spiritual Fathers

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John Woodall became a Christian when he was 14. He and his family were living a great life in London, England. John had planned to follow in his father’s footsteps and return to the States to attend business school. But after a deep conversation with his dad, John enrolled in a Bible college in Florida. 

He was so blown away by what he’d learned that he called his father and told him he wanted to stay another year. John knew he wanted to serve people. It put him on the path toward ministry where he’s been for the last 50 years. 

John is also my Spiritual Father. In this conversation, we dive into why John chose to invest his time into mentorship, how someone can get started being a mentor, and why our failures may be a more important testimony than our successes. 

You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in...

How John chooses who to mentor

You have to start somewhere simple: You have to like the person you mentor. John needs to enjoy spending time with them. Secondly, he points out that you can sense those men who are hungry to grow. John can see when they want to be conformed into the image of Christ. He doesn’t have time for men who aren’t interested in being a better man, husband, and father. 

If you want to become a mentor, pray without ceasing. Ask God of your desire to minister to another man. Scroll through your contacts and make a list. What younger men do you know? 

Where do you start?

There’s a deep, dark, and evil force in this world. God is light and love. The devil is full of hate and darkness. Don’t be unaware that the accuser—the voice of the butcher—will whisper, “You are not qualified.” 

Secondly, you don’t have to mentor from your successes. No one has it all figured out. You have to mentor from a place of experience. John firmly believes that some of your best mentoring lessons stem from your failures and your weaknesses. 

If a man is going to bond with you, they bond over mistakes, failures, and brokenness. It’s through brokenness most men find Jesus. You will mentor out of the power of God in you. 

When you mentor from your story, and what God has taught from you from your story, you have more than enough to be a spiritual father to another man. Younger men are open to being authentic and honest. They need a place and space to talk openly. 

Why mentorship is important

Attend a service, serve somewhere, get in a small group, and give toward kingdom work. That’s what every good church teaches its members that they must do. But something is missing. We didn’t realize our greatest spiritual growth from that model. 

For John and I, spiritual growth came from mentoring, discipleship, and counseling. It was the personal attention from someone more mature in their faith who could speak into our lives. 

The Bible says that the mission of God in every God’s life is to be confirmed to the image of Jesus. It’s the process of sanctification—becoming more and more like the image of Jesus. Being in close proximity to Godly men is important. You’re living your faith together. 

John wants to make sure that your most influential season of life can be in your 60s and 70s. You aren’t done yet. John is more free and excited about bearing fruit in his last decade of life than his first 70. 

Resources & People Mentioned

Connect with John Woodall

Connect With Spiritual Fathers

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